EU in or out forum Poll

[Guest]

First topic message reminder :

EU in or out

[eddie]

Can I just say that perhaps it's a generational thing too?
Those of us that remember what it was like to NOT be in the EU and remember how we were lied to about it, are possibly realising that we are better off out of it.

It seems to be people in their early thirties and younger, who wish to stay in.

that will be down to 40 years of indoctrination by schools on the EU.
I can remember in the 70's being told numerous times at school how great being in the EEC would be and that food would cost so much less and we would get cheap watches and other goods because of the common market.

no where in the leaflet sent out by wilsons government is the word federal mentioned.
Of course you woudl be too young to remember, but have a read

http://www.harvard-digital.co.uk/euro/pamphlet.htm

page 5 is of particular interest because it has pretty much dont the opposite of that


and read page 11&12 and see if we were sold a pup

Yep. A good point on the school,thing - indoctrination at its best

[Tommy Monk]

I wonder if we leave....what do we trade with?
What hasn't been closed down has been sold off.

Trade will continue much the same... we buy much more off eu than they buy off us and they need us to keep buying...


All we ever wanted was to trade and that happens despite the eu... not because of it.


We never voted to give away control of our country our borders our laws making powers and we must leave to get it back.

[Syl]

I wonder if we leave....what do we trade with?
What hasn't been closed down has been sold off.

Trade will continue much the same... we buy much more off eu than they buy off us and they need us to keep buying...


All we ever wanted was to trade and that happens despite the eu... not because of it.


We never voted to give away control of our country our borders our laws making powers and we must leave to get it back.

We buy a lot but much of what we sold doesn't exist anymore. A lot of our industry has gone.

If the UK was a company, what would we sell?

[Tommy Monk]

We sell plenty of goods and services to the EU but would be trading much more with the rest of world if we were not prevented from doing so by eu rules.


I'm only talking about trade with eu because it is played by the remain lot as a reason to stay but trade will continue once outside the EU so irrelevant as a reason for staying in

Its much more about regaining control over our country and borders and laws... then we could be in charge of our own agriculture and fisheries policy etc and much much more!!!

[Syl]

We sell plenty of goods and services to the EU but would be trading much more with the rest of world if we were not prevented from doing so by eu rules.


I'm only talking about trade with eu because it is played by the remain lot as a reason to stay but trade will continue once outside the EU so irrelevant as a reason for staying in

Its much more about regaining control over our country and borders and laws... then we could be in charge of our own agriculture and fisheries policy etc and much much more!!!

I get that.....and I think that's what a lot of people will be basing their vote on.

[HoratioTarr]

We sell plenty of goods and services to the EU but would be trading much more with the rest of world if we were not prevented from doing so by eu rules.


I'm only talking about trade with eu because it is played by the remain lot as a reason to stay but trade will continue once outside the EU so irrelevant as a reason for staying in

Its much more about regaining control over our country and borders and laws... then we could be in charge of our own agriculture and fisheries policy etc and much much more!!!

I should think one of the biggest trades we have is with China.   I don't see what all the fuss is about with leaving.  I'm not sure what the major benefits are of staying in, other than to line the pockets of certain elites.

[Eilzel]

China and the US have strongly recommended we stay in the EU. But Nigel Farage amd Boris Johnson know better eh?

Tommy, your reply to my post is exactly why I don't take you seriously.

Eds, I hope everyone who wants to leave the EU thinks it is rigged, and doesn't vote as a result. Honestly if you think everything is predetermined by men backstage why even bother voting?

Anyone thinking this is clean cut isn't paying attention. I really hope Andy and raggs are right but doubt it will be the case.

Recently a case went to court which actually demonstrates (potentially) a reason I support the EU:

Under the Tory government, conditions for getting a spousal visa in the UK for non-EU residents were changed. If you marry a non-EU resident you (not them) must earn a minimum of ) £18,000 a year for them to meet the requirements to live with you in the UK.

Apparently half of UK citizens do not meet this requirement. So couples are seperated due to an arbitrary Tory set pay wall. This is now being challenged in the supreme court.

Against a vile Tory government the EU has and may again prove to be a check on harmful xenophobic laws.

[Irn Bru]

Saturday, June 11: England v Russia (20:00, Stade Velodrome, Marseille)

Thursday, June 16: England v Wales (14:00, Stade Bollaert-Delelis, Lens)

Monday, June 20: Slovakia v England (20:00, Stade Geoffroy Guichard, St Etienne)

Three days after the last match agains Slovakia and if England have had a bummer of a decision from a ref it could well be out of the Euro's and out of the EU as well.

I think 'call me Dave' planned it this way.

[Fuzzy Zack]

I'm for out and have been for years.

The only thing that came close to changing my mind was that Scotland will leave the UK, if the UK leave the EU.

Frankly I think the Scots need the UK more than they need the EU. Scotland isn't a viable state on its own.

EU is heading towards a superstate and if the UK wants to maintain its sovereignty, then out is the only way.

[Andy]

I remain undecided.
A problem I have with leaving rests with the preservation of workers rights.
The tory party have tried everything in their means to destroy them but have been held in check thanks to EU regulations.
One only has to look at the tories leading the Brexit campaign Gove Boris IDS and the odious Nigel to understand they have no thought for workers rights, h&s,working time regulations,welfare pay etc.
What is really needed is someone to step up to the msrk and PROPERLY renegotiate to stay in. Scrap the £55 million/day membership fee, properly undertake full border checks and have veto over ludicrous EU regulations.
Actually threaten to leave.
We are better off in than out, but not at all costs.

[Raggamuffin]

It all makes me feel a bit sad really. If we vote to leave, it's like busting up with a bunch of mates, and if we vote to stay in, nothing will change - and there are problems with the EU IMO.

If it was a more casual arrangement I think I'd be more in favour of it - you know, countries with things in common sticking together and helping each other out. It all seems a bit much now though. Why does it take so much money to run it, and what are all these MEPs actually doing? Then there's the issue of some countries trying to boss others around. We've seen that re the refugee crisis.

It's a bit like Eurovision. That used to be a nice cosy little competition between friends, and now it's just a huge political thing with countries voting tactically and judging each other on how PC they're being. It also had to be split up because it became so long.

If we leave, there's a danger that we might become even more embroiled with the US, and I think that discussions on here have shown that we don't have as much in common with the Americans as we thought we did.

[Tommy Monk]

China and the US have strongly recommended we stay in the EU. But Nigel Farage amd Boris Johnson know better eh?

Tommy, your reply to my post is exactly why I don't take you seriously.

Eds, I hope everyone who wants to leave the EU thinks it is rigged, and doesn't vote as a result. Honestly if you think everything is predetermined by men backstage why even bother voting?

Anyone thinking this is clean cut isn't paying attention. I really hope Andy and raggs are right but doubt it will be the case.

Recently a case went to court which actually demonstrates (potentially) a reason I support the EU:

Under the Tory government, conditions for getting a spousal visa in the UK for non-EU residents were changed. If you marry a non-EU resident you (not them) must earn a minimum of ) £18,000 a year for them to meet the requirements to live with you in the UK.

Apparently half of UK citizens do not meet this requirement. So couples are seperated due to an arbitrary Tory set pay wall. This is now being challenged in the supreme court.

Against a vile Tory government the EU has and may again prove to be a check on harmful xenophobic laws.

China and USA care about their own national interest... not ours!!!


And it is sensible to expect people to be able to earn enough to support any foreign spouce they are thinking of marrying and bringing into country... rather than expecting the rest of uk to pay for their upkeep in benefits! !!

[Tommy Monk]

I remain undecided.
A problem I have with leaving rests with the preservation of workers rights.
The tory party have tried everything in their means to destroy them but have been held in check thanks to EU regulations.
One only has to look at the tories leading the Brexit campaign Gove Boris IDS and the odious Nigel to understand they have no thought for workers rights, h&s,working time regulations,welfare pay etc.
What is really needed is someone to step up to the msrk and PROPERLY renegotiate to stay in. Scrap the £55 million/day membership fee, properly undertake full border checks and have veto over ludicrous EU regulations.
Actually threaten to leave.
We are better off in than out, but not at all costs.

We have supposedly been in the heart of Europe for nearly 4 decades now... in the driving seat and key decision makers etc... and look at the mess were in that he have handed away almost every aspect of control over our county and borders and laws making powers!

And the very thin gruel that Cameron has begged for has been watered down so much and then only a vague promise of ever giving it to us!


How the fuck are we better off in this shambolic situation!?

[Guest]

I remain undecided.
A problem I have with leaving rests with the preservation of workers rights.
The tory party have tried everything in their means to destroy them but have been held in check thanks to EU regulations.
One only has to look at the tories leading the Brexit campaign Gove Boris IDS and the odious Nigel to understand they have no thought for workers rights, h&s,working time regulations,welfare pay etc.
What is really needed is someone to step up to the msrk and PROPERLY renegotiate to stay in. Scrap the £55 million/day membership fee, properly undertake full border checks and have veto over ludicrous EU regulations.
Actually threaten to leave.
We are better off in than out, but not at all costs.

We have supposedly been in the heart of Europe for nearly 4 decades now... in the driving seat and key decision makers etc... and look at the mess were in that he have handed away almost every aspect of control over our county and borders and laws making powers!

And the very gain gruel that Cameron has begged for has been watered down so much and then only a vague promise of ever giving it to us!


How the fuck are we better off in this shambolic situation!?

WE are better off economically in every single aspect

The only reason you wrongly perceive we are not is based on such Nazi racist views you hold, where you wish to ostracize many people because you are nothing more than an idiot

Its because of the EU and the partnerships we have gained from them that has made this small country economically strong and quite frankly, if you do not like this, then piss off and leave the country you idiot

You an extremist scum, lets face it Tommy, you would be better placed living in Saudi, whos views are more in tune with the hate you hold

[Victorismyhero]

since the BIG corporations effectively run the E.U. it is clear that SME's are NOT better off in than out.
90% of the regulations the EU has applied, across a whole range of items from electronics to toys has been designed by big business, so as to be a cheap and minor item to them but a crippling burden to the typical SME and almost a certain death sentence to the "one man band" type business....
The EU is the worst anti small business organisation going

NONE of its grants or assistance is available for businesses with under a certain turnover (and that figure is quite a large sum)
the cost of compliance is in real terms exactly the same for big and small businesses

(for instance ..it costs me the same (total) as it does a big business to keep the necessary records...however the big business makes 1 million items for that cost...
a small business will perhaps make 10, making the costs proportionately 100,000 times greater

same for product testing

etc etc etc)

So NO the EU is NOT the friend of the SME.....and the SME is NOT better in than out

moreover NONE of the people in a position to do anything are going to.....they are bought and owned by big business which sees a chance to detroy ALL opposition and competition....

[Guest]

since the BIG corporations effectively run the E.U. it is clear that SME's are NOT better off in than out.
90% of the regulations the EU has applied, across a whole range of items from electronics to toys has been designed by big business, so as to be a cheap and minor item to them but a crippling burden to the typical SME and almost a certain death sentence to the "one man band" type business....
The EU is the worst anti small business organisation going

NONE of its grants or assistance is available for businesses with under a certain turnover (and that figure is quite a large sum)
the cost of compliance is in real terms exactly the same for big and small businesses

(for instance ..it costs me the same (total) as it does a big business to keep the necessary records...however the big business makes 1 million items for that cost...
a small business will perhaps make 10, making the costs proportionately 100,000 times greater

same for product testing

etc etc etc)

So NO the EU is NOT the friend of the SME.....and the SME is NOT better in than out

moreover NONE of the people in a position to do anything are going to.....they are bought and owned by big business which sees a chance to detroy ALL opposition and competition....

Bullshit on every level

http://ec.europa.eu/small-business/index_en.htm

[Tommy Monk]

We have supposedly been in the heart of Europe for nearly 4 decades now... in the driving seat and key decision makers etc... and look at the mess were in that he have handed away almost every aspect of control over our county and borders and laws making powers!

And the very gain gruel that Cameron has begged for has been watered down so much and then only a vague promise of ever giving it to us!


How the fuck are we better off in this shambolic situation!?

WE are better off economically in every single aspect

The only reason you wrongly perceive we are not is based on such Nazi racist views you hold, where you wish to ostracize many people because you are nothing more than an idiot

Its because of the EU and the partnerships we have gained from them that has made this small country economically strong and quite frankly, if you do not like this, then piss off and leave the country you idiot

You an extremist scum, lets face it Tommy, you would be better placed living in Saudi, whos views are more in tune with the hate you hold

I can't believe someone actually have you a green for that ranting pile of waffling nonsense Dodge! !!


I voice support for us to be out of the fascist dictatorship that is the EU, and you claim that I AM the fascist and need to live in the fascist dictatorship that is Saudi Arabia... !?




I'm voicing support for us and our democracy!!!


The EU is the anti democratic dictatorship!!!

[Guest]

WE are better off economically in every single aspect

The only reason you wrongly perceive we are not is based on such Nazi racist views you hold, where you wish to ostracize many people because you are nothing more than an idiot

Its because of the EU and the partnerships we have gained from them that has made this small country economically strong and quite frankly, if you do not like this, then piss off and leave the country you idiot

You an extremist scum, lets face it Tommy, you would be better placed living in Saudi, whos views are more in tune with the hate you hold

I can't believe someone actually have you a green for that ranting pile of waffling nonsense Dodge! !!


I voice support for us to be out of the fascist dictatorship that is the EU,  and you claim that I AM the fascist and need to live in the fascist dictatorship that is Saudi Arabia... !?




I'm voicing support for us and our democracy!!!


The EU is the anti democratic dictatorship!!!

Are you upset because I made you look the insignificant twat that you are?

The only thing fascist here is you 

So again fuck off to Saudi you vile nazi racist scumbag

You are anti democracy and you are a homophobe, a racist, a xenophobe and most of all a complete hateful twat

[Syl]

Seems the old spliffs are not working their magic again....I have never seen a more continuously uptight aggressive poster than Didge.
He was advising me to partake a few nights ago to make me more laid back.

[Guest]

Seems the old spliffs are not working their magic again....I have never seen a more continuously  uptight aggressive poster than Didge.
He was advising me to partake a few nights ago to make me more laid back.

Well considering I do not smoke splifs, but once did, it shows what an inane idiotic gerbil that you are dear

If you do not like my views, then tough shit you insignificant piece of dogshit  

[Andy]

I find orgasms calm me down.
But mostly sleep afterrwards.

[Syl]

Seems the old spliffs are not working their magic again....I have never seen a more continuously  uptight aggressive poster than Didge.
He was advising me to partake a few nights ago to make me more laid back.

Well considering I do not smoke splifs, but once did, it shows what an inane idiotic gerbil that you are dear

If you do not like my views, then tough shit you insignificant piece of dogshit  

Self projecting again I see.

[Guest]

Well considering I do not smoke splifs, but once did, it shows what an inane idiotic gerbil that you are dear

If you do not like my views, then tough shit you insignificant piece of dogshit  

Self projecting again I see.

No just that I saw a picture of you  

[Victorismyhero]

bullshit yourself didge


none of those available in that lot are of ANY use to the small one man band.....(unless he/she has the money to at least match the loan provided)...there is NOTHING for the guy who doesnt want his business in hock.

and...thats actually NOT the biggest problem from the EU....

the BIGGEST problem is excessive and burdensome regulation

particularly things like the REACH regualtions

and the electronics regulations  the EMC reg (although there are sometimes ways round those.... )

where the costs are vastly greater per item for a small business than they are for a big one...

THAT is a real killer....

suppose i want to make a particular toy...

now the wood needs to be tested for certain chemicals (which is as can be shown, nonsense since fresh (virgin woood) NEVER has these chemicals in in concentrations even approaching the limits set...even if grown in contaminated soil)

but hey ho the bods in brussels decide its GOT to be tested for

so I buy 5 sheets of plywood  now becasue I CANNOT guarantee (nor will any supplier thus guarantee) that they are from the same batch ...

I have to have every sheet tested (about £70 - £100 per sheet)

a BIG manufacturer buys a boat load...the factory WILL guarantee its all one batch...so that big user only pays for one test...OR whats worse, becasue he's buying a boat load the manufacturer will have the test done for him and certify it ....

even IF i could get em all guaranteed from one batch and PROOF thereof...I would still be paying £100 to have a test done...

so say 5 toys from me will cost me not only the cost of the ply but £20 more each for that testing (which doesnt NEED to be done anyhow...)

the americans have similar regs...BUT...their rules say that if virgin timber is used ...there is NO NEED to do these tests...since virgin timber (and engineered timber (plywood) made from virgin timber) does not contain the chemicals of concern in suficient ammounts .

[Guest]

lol so much for being on ignore

Its bullshit you worthless piece of scum

Nobody gives a shit about you work issues, that is your problem not one born by the majority of the rest of us

Frankly I could not give one shit about your issues as they are again born from ignorance and hate.

I suggest also if you do not like things here, then fuck off

Again the EU as easily proven is good for small business, your selective view shows again why your views reek of desperation

[Victorismyhero]

didge....




I wont bother replying to your shit anymore...

everyone else who posts on here knows exactly what your opinions are worth (hint somewhat less than zero)
everyone by now knows you know fk all about anything (but claim to know anything about everything
everyone knows how you twist facts

and everyone knows that your ego is bigger than your ability

try acting your age instead of your shoe size....

have you actually made ONE post in the last few days that wasnt personal, insulting and just plain nasty?

(except to ben and or quill, who we notice you are now sucking up to)

I wont keep you on ignore...(since i just took you off.....) but I think I will just pretend you dont exist....

that way I can laugh at your dumb ass replies

you have got to the stage of "being amusing" in a sad sort of way....

[Tommy Monk]

More angry ranting from dodgy Didge!


Most amusing!!!

[Guest]

didge....




I wont bother replying to your shit anymore...

everyone else who posts on here knows exactly what your opinions are worth (hint somewhat less than zero)
everyone by now knows you know fk all about anything (but claim to know anything about everything
everyone knows how you twist facts

and everyone knows that your ego is bigger than your ability

try acting your age instead of your shoe size....

have you actually made ONE post in the last few days that wasnt personal, insulting and just plain nasty?

(except to ben and or quill, who we notice you are now sucking up to)

I wont keep you on ignore...(since i just took you off.....) but I think I will just pretend you dont exist....

that way I can laugh at your dumb ass replies

you have got to the stage of "being amusing" in a sad sort of way....

Contradiction you did just reply you ignorant numpty

You can do as you please, as I say your views are born from pig ignorant hate you have and everytime you post shit like that I will be sure to show you up every single time

You clearly thing to greatly of your own importance to think I going to lose any sleep over you not wanting to debate me

I truly think you are a low life scumbag

IF you do not like me views to you, then stop being such an ignorant idiot

Its that simple

We?

So you admit to have multi Id's now or rudely think you are speaking for others?

[Victorismyhero]

didge....

[eddie]

What's wrong with you today didge? All I've seen is you attacking everyone in a really nasty way - not defending yourself, as I haven't seen anyone attack you first - but just being outright horrid?!!

[Guest]

What's wrong with you today didge? All I've seen is you attacking everyone in a really nasty way - not defending yourself, as I haven't seen anyone attack you first - but just being outright horrid?!!

So what

If you do not like it, tough shit

[Guest]

Of course you forget Stardesk was attacked today, or were you wearing blinkers on that thread you posted on and that everyday he is attacked by Rags and you say fuck all Eddie

It shows what an incompetent mod that you are Eddie

[eddie]

What's wrong with you today didge? All I've seen is you attacking everyone in a really nasty way - not defending yourself, as I haven't seen anyone attack you first - but just being outright horrid?!!

So what

If you do not like it, tough shit

No. I don't like it. I don't suppose anyone does. Even you.

[Guest]

So what

If you do not like it, tough shit

No. I don't like it. I don't suppose anyone does. Even you.

Tough shit, when you start actually saying this to others when they are nasty, then I will listen to you

Until then, get stuffed

[eddie]

I do say it to others if it's unprovoked and I see it, and that's not as an "admin" it's as a human.

Sometimes I can't believe you're the same person who posts all those inspirational and poetic threads that are wonderful to read.

[Guest]

I do say it to others if it's unprovoked and I see it, and that's not as an "admin" it's as a human.

Sometimes I can't believe you're the same person who posts all those inspirational and poetic threads that are wonderful to read.

No you do not Eddie,

You defend some idiots on here that is for sure, namely if they hold idiotic conspiracy views like you

[eddie]

I do say it to others if it's unprovoked and I see it, and that's not as an "admin" it's as a human.

Sometimes I can't believe you're the same person who posts all those inspirational and poetic threads that are wonderful to read.

No you do not Eddie,

You defend some idiots on here that is for sure, namely if they hold idiotic conspiracy views like you

Okay. I can see this is going nowhere fast.

[Raggamuffin]

Saturday, June 11: England v Russia (20:00, Stade Velodrome, Marseille)

Thursday, June 16: England v Wales (14:00, Stade Bollaert-Delelis, Lens)

Monday, June 20: Slovakia v England (20:00, Stade Geoffroy Guichard, St Etienne)

Three days after the last match agains Slovakia and if England have had a bummer of a decision from a ref it could well be out of the Euro's and out of the EU as well.

I think 'call me Dave' planned it this way.

Yes - it could all hinge on a bad decision by a ref.

[Tommy Monk]

that will be down to 40 years of indoctrination by schools on the EU.
I can remember in the 70's being told numerous times at school how great being in the EEC would be and that food would cost so much less and we would get cheap watches and other goods because of the common market.

no where in the leaflet sent out by wilsons government is the word federal mentioned.
Of course you woudl be too young to remember, but have a read

http://www.harvard-digital.co.uk/euro/pamphlet.htm

page 5 is of particular interest because it has pretty much dont the opposite of that


and read page 11&12 and see if we were sold a pup

Yep. A good point on the school,thing - indoctrination at its best

"Pages 11 & 12]

WILL PARLIAMENT
LOSE ITS POWER?

Another anxiety expressed about Britain's membership of the Common Market is that Parliament could lose its supremacy, and we would have to obey laws passed by unelected 'faceless bureaucrats' sitting in their headquarters in Brussels..."




Which is exactly what has happened!!!



If people were told that this would be the result of voting 'in' they would have overwhelmingly voted NO!!!


If people were told that uk would have open door borders to 550 million people... they would have voted NO!!!


If people were told that this open door was also for foreign criminals and we had no right to refuse them entry or to stay as long as they liked... they would have voted NO!!!



This is what is happening now... and if we vote to stay in than this will mean more of the same!


We have to vote out of eu to stop the madness!!!


Then we can still trade and we can still allow immigration... BUT ON OUR TERMS THAT ARE IN OUR INTERESTS!!!


WE GET CONTROL OF OUR COUNTRY BACK AND OUR BORDERS... WE GET CONTROL OF OUR LAWS AND RULES AND REGULATIONS TO BE AGAIN MADE THROUGH OUR NATIONAL PARLIAMENT BY OUR DIRECTLY ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES!!!


AS IS HOW IT SHOULD ALREADY BE!!!


WE NEVER VOTED TO GIVE ANY OF THIS AWAY IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!


BUT NOW WE HAVE THE CHANCE TO VOTE TO GET IT BACK!!!



VOTE OUT OF THE EU DICTATORSHIP, BACK TO US BEING IN CHARGE OF OUR OWN COUNTRY,  AND END THE EU MADNESS!!!

[Tommy Monk]

Bump

[Guest]

Voted in Tommy, but TTP is my main objection, so when it comes to the real vote I'll have to see where we are at that.  So far, nobody on this thread seems to have mentioned it, and it's huge for the NHS, not that there is going to be much left of the NHS at this rate.

[eddie]

I'm undecided
I'd like to see a debate on TV for the for and against

[Raggamuffin]

What is TTP?

[Guest]

Sorry, should have said TTIP:


The Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership (TTIP) is a proposed trade agreement between the European Union and the United States, with the aim of promoting trade and multilateral economic growth.^[1] The American government considers the TTIP a companion agreement to the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP).^[2] The agreement is under ongoing negotiations and its main three broad areas are: market access; specific regulation; and broader rules and principles and modes of co-operation.^[3][4] The negotiations were planned to be finalized by the end of 2014, but will not be finished until 2019 or 2020, according to economist Hosuk Lee-Makiyama.^[5]

The content of the agreement as well as the reports on TTIP negotiations are classified from the public,^[6] but after a proposed draft was leaked in March 2014,^[7] the European Commission launched a public consultation on a limited set of clauses and in January 2015 published parts of an overview;^[8] and subsequently increased security over its secrecy.^[6]

The European Commission says that the TTIP would boost the EU's economy by €120 billion, the US economy by €90 billion and the rest of the world by €100 billion.^[9] According to Foreign Affairs, TTIP aims to "liberalise one-third of global trade", which they argue would create millions of new paid jobs.^[10] However, a Guardian article by Dean Baker of the US thinktank Center for Economic and Policy Research^[11][12][13] argued that the economic benefits per household are mediocre,^[14] and according to a European Parliament report, impacts on labour conditions range from job gains to job losses, depending on economic model and assumptions used for predictions.^[15]
The controversial^[16][17] agreement has been criticized and opposed by unions, charities, NGOs and environmentalists, particularly in Europe,^[18][19] with The Independent describing the range of negative impacts as "reducing the regulatory barriers to trade for big business, things like food safety law, environmental legislation, banking regulations and the sovereign powers of individual nations",^[20] or more critically as an "assault on European and US societies by transnational corporations".^[20] An EU direct democracy mechanism, the European Citizens' Initiative, which enables EU citizens to call directly on the European Commission to propose a legal act,^[21] acquired over 3.2 million signatures against TTIP and CETA within a year.[2

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transatlantic_Trade_and_Investment_Partnership



People are campaigning to get the NHS excluded from it.   Basically, if, as is happening at the moment, the Government contracts out parts of the NHS to companies, under the TTIP we would not be able to get them back even if they were failing and costing the NHS enormous sums.


Here is a piece from the Independent that might give you cause for concern:

What is TTIP? And six reasons why the answer should scare you

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/what-is-ttip-and-six-reasons-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

[Raggamuffin]

Thanks Sassy. I'll look into that later.

[Guest]

Really interesting and quite scary!    And very secret, I wonder why

[Tommy Monk]

We don't want ttip either... another reason to vote to get out of eu!!!


Basically ttip will allow foreign companies to bid for all our public sector jobs and if we don't give it to them they could sue our govt for loss of earnings!


Is it any surprise some big businesses want us to stay in eu...!?


For their own interests... not ours!!!




This is a must read funny article...


And true as well...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3459490/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-offers-American-perspective-upcoming-EU-referendum.html

[Tommy Monk]

Voted in Tommy, but TTP is my main objection, so when it comes to the real vote I'll have to see where we are at that.  So far, nobody on this thread seems to have mentioned it, and it's huge for the NHS, not that there is going to be much left of the NHS at this rate.

Going by what was being offered back in 75, I may well have voted in too... but that was totally different to what the EU has morphed into now!!!


The EU has grabbed more and more power since then and now controls every aspect of our country, laws, rules, regulations, borders etc... something that was promised back in 75 that wouldn't be happening. .. plus every time another treaty has been signed giving away more, we have been told it didn't mean anything and no powers were being given away etc... all lies! !!


We never voted for any of this or gave permission for any of it!!!


We don't want it... so let's vote out to get our country back!!

[nicko]

It all comes down to we were conned, we joined under the impression that it was about just trade between countries.That's what most people believed.

[Tommy Monk]

Anyone read this. ..?


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-3459490/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-offers-American-perspective-upcoming-EU-referendum.html

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