Is Obama determined to start WW3?

by Guest Thu Apr 24, 2014 10:37 am

First topic message reminder :

44 minutes ago

US President Barack Obama has accused Russia of flouting a deal on Ukraine.

Mr Obama told a news conference in Japan that Moscow had failed to halt actions by militants in the region and warned that the US could impose further sanctions against Russia.

A contingent of US troops has begun landing in Poland for military exercises amid concerns among Nato's eastern members about Russian intentions.

Moscow has said it will respond to any attack on its interests in Ukraine.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-27139190

That follows his pledge to the Japanese to support them regarding some disputed islands if China attack them, which isn't going down at all well with China!

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:57 am

Eilzel wrote:
smelly_bandit wrote:

you did imagine the annexation of the crimea

the Crimea VOTED in a democratic referendum for Reunification with russia

russia has not taken crimea by force

that will never be the case no matter how many times you say it is

grow up child and learn something about international politics because you have just made yourself look even more stupid than usual

annexation ::smthg:: ::smthg::

When will you learn to talk to people like a grown up; it's no wonder you get talked to like a piece of shit when you act like one

Yesterday you said I bored you; after I said the same of you- so piss off.

^Tess, Russian troops had entered Crimea before the referendum even took place; if foreign troops entered Northern Ireland, New Jersey, or even the Falklands you'd call it an invasion- that is exactly what Russia did in Crimea.

Crimea's always been Russian, except for a recent spell, which proved disastrous for them and why they wanted to return back to the fold. So Russia wasn't "foreign" and didn't invade - you can't invade your own country.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:03 am

Tesstacious wrote:
Eilzel wrote:

When will you learn to talk to people like a grown up; it's no wonder you get talked to like a piece of shit when you act like one

Yesterday you said I bored you; after I said the same of you- so piss off.

^Tess, Russian troops had entered Crimea before the referendum even took place; if foreign troops entered Northern Ireland, New Jersey, or even the Falklands you'd call it an invasion- that is exactly what Russia did in Crimea.

Crimea's always been Russian, except for a recent spell, which proved disastrous for them and why they wanted to return back to the fold. So Russia wasn't "foreign" and didn't invade - you can't invade your own country.

more importantly

you cant invade without the actual act of invading either

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 9:07 am

scrat wrote:
Cass wrote:Hmmm 1938.....Anschluss.......and that turned out so well.
A valid point Cass, Anschluss was the herding together of various ethnic Germans, the Sudeten Deutsch, the Donau Deutsch, and the Pomeranian Deutsch etc.

The Baltic States carry varying amounts of ethnic Russians as does Ukraine, Crimea was a gift to Ukraine that Russia has taken back because Ukraine is being undermined by European fascists and nationalistic elements that won't pay their gas bill and are thus favouring a better deal with Europe.

Apparently the Polish are giving plenty of coverage to US assets standing next to their specialist counter manoeuvre unit GROM.

The Danish and Dutch Air Force have been scrambled, and the Chinese are putting the squeeze on Barry because of Japan.

Interesting but potentially dangerous times.

Excellent post Scrat.

Can I congratulate Newsfix on having a thread of nearly two pages actually discussing the topic! So refreshing - no petty insults, except for Les saying the only people with any sense or intelligene are the ones agreeing with him, and Sassy's "LOL, Tess said..." as if I must be an idiot because I don't share the accepted view.

Ben, as for Obama not wanting to start WW3, maybe he doesn't, but the man's an idiot. Diplomacy, what diplomacy? He and Kerry have used insulting and deliberately provoking threats against the Russians, which isn't a clever move - so it's either sheer stupidity or, as I suggested, a deliberate ploy to cause war to deflect from the massive economic crash that's due in the States soon, with the debt ceiling and the demise of the Petro-dollar.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:14 am

WOW!

I just found some hot cross buns, at the back of my fridge!

Yummy! Razz

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:22 am

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by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:32 am

you're a bit unsure of your cooking skills, cooking chops in the oven is pretty much a foolproof way to ensure they're cooked through properly.
Ingredients

These timings work for lamb chops that weigh approximately 150g each and are 3cm thick.

To cook your lamb chops

• Preheat the oven to 180ºC/350ºF/gas 4
• Get the lamb chops out of the fridge so they can come up to room temperature before you start cooking
• Lay the chops on a baking tray, drizzle with olive oil and season with a pinch each of sea salt, black pepper and your favourite dried herb – thyme and oregano both work well
To cook your lamb chops

• Rub this seasoning into the meat
• Cook in the hot oven for around 20 minutes, turning halfway so they brown evenly, or until cooked to your liking

http://www.jamieshomecookingskills.com/recipe.php?title=how-to-cook-chops-in-the-oven

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:35 am

Reply with quote

Re: Canada: Human rights tribunal to probe ‘homophobic’ Catholic school

Post by victorisnotamused on Tue Apr 22, 2014 11:43 pm

veya_victaous wrote:

victorisnotamused wrote:

i have tried

wild boar
hare
venison
all the game bird
roo
rabbit
buffalo
had snake once..but a good while back
Never had grubs...
or croc...there aint no crocs on my permission....
not had llama though I'm not surprised it tasted lamb-ish

had venison (normally farmed here)
not had hare.

Croc is actually good, I think we should farm them more, texture of chicken with the taste of fish.

witchetty grubs... I would not recommend them, weird squishy nut like flavour (but they are an Aboriginal Speciality)

hare is a bit strong tasting for many folk, its a taste all on its own IMO. A marmite taste...you either love it of hate it.
hmmm...over here we get croc flavour a lot....just buy "certain brands" of chicken and you WILL taste the fish... affraid

as for bugs and grubs...well.....if I was desperate I suppose ....but voluntarily.....pass.....

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Re: Canada: Human rights tribunal to probe ‘homophobic’ Catholic school

Post by feelthelove on Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:30 pm
Tried all sorts of things as a child, family shot it, caught it, were given it we ate it. I dread to think affraid

Having said that give me enough wine and I'm pretty much up for trying anything as long as it doesn't contain the "V" word

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Re: Canada: Human rights tribunal to probe ‘homophobic’ Catholic school

Post by victorisnotamused on Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:35 pm

feelthelove wrote:Tried all sorts of things as a child, family shot it, caught it, were given it we ate it. I dread to think affraid

Having said that give me enough wine and I'm pretty much up for trying anything as long as it doesn't contain the "V" word

VINEGAR

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Re: Canada: Human rights tribunal to probe ‘homophobic’ Catholic school

Post by feelthelove on Wed Apr 23, 2014 6:42 pm

victorisnotamused wrote:

feelthelove wrote:Tried all sorts of things as a child, family shot it, caught it, were given it we ate it. I dread to think affraid

Having said that give me enough wine and I'm pretty much up for trying anything as long as it doesn't contain the "V" word

VINEGAR

Now that's just plain mean

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Re: Canada: Human rights tribunal to probe ‘homophobic’ Catholic school

Post by victorisnotamused on Wed Apr 23, 2014 8:42 pm
ner ner ner...

pickled onions
pickled eggs
pickled herring
pickled gherkins
pickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles picklespickles pickles
VINEGAR

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Razz

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:38 am

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:41 am

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t4140p50-canada-human-rights-tribunal-to-probe-homophobic-catholic-school

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:42 am

by Eilzel Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:44 am

WTF phil?

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:45 am

::happ:: ::happ:: ::happ::

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:45 am

Eilzel wrote:WTF phil?

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t4140p50-canada-human-rights-tribunal-to-probe-homophobic-catholic-school

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:46 am

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t4140p50-canada-human-rights-tribunal-to-probe-homophobic-catholic-school

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:46 am

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t4140p50-canada-human-rights-tribunal-to-probe-homophobic-catholic-school

by gerber Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:47 am

back to topic.......

Putin is playing the west beautifully, and I can envisage him sitting in a huge chair loving every minute of this.

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:51 am

gerber wrote:back to topic.......

Putin is playing the west beautifully, and I can envisage him sitting in a huge chair loving every minute of this.

A G plan chair of course.

by gerber Fri Apr 25, 2014 11:56 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
gerber wrote:back to topic.......

Putin is playing the west beautifully, and I can envisage him sitting in a huge chair loving every minute of this.

A G plan chair of course.

LOL

Re comment about Pussy galore and serious threads............

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:01 pm

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:06 pm

Tesstacious wrote:
scrat wrote:
A valid point Cass, Anschluss was the herding together of various ethnic Germans, the Sudeten Deutsch, the Donau Deutsch, and the Pomeranian Deutsch etc.

The Baltic States carry varying amounts of ethnic Russians as does Ukraine, Crimea was a gift to Ukraine that Russia has taken back because Ukraine is being undermined by European fascists and nationalistic elements that won't pay their gas bill and are thus favouring a better deal with Europe.

Apparently the Polish are giving plenty of coverage to US assets standing next to their specialist counter manoeuvre unit GROM.

The Danish and Dutch Air Force have been scrambled, and the Chinese are putting the squeeze on Barry because of Japan.

Interesting but potentially dangerous times.

Excellent post Scrat.

Can I congratulate Newsfix on having a thread of nearly two pages actually discussing the topic! So refreshing - no petty insults, except for Les saying the only people with any sense or intelligene are the ones agreeing with him, and Sassy's "LOL, Tess said..." as if I must be an idiot because I don't share the accepted view.

Ben, as for Obama not wanting to start WW3, maybe he doesn't, but the man's an idiot. Diplomacy, what diplomacy? He and Kerry have used insulting and deliberately provoking threats against the Russians, which isn't a clever move - so it's either sheer stupidity or, as I suggested, a deliberate ploy to cause war to deflect from the massive economic crash that's due in the States soon, with the debt ceiling and the demise of the Petro-dollar.

I'm afraid you took my post completely the wrong way Tess. I said:

LOL. (Had a full stop after it and was in relation to Scrat's post) Tess was saying the other day (as you were) that he has to take Ukraine because he can't have a NATO member on his borders, (as I had replied to you) but of course Poland is in NATO and is on the Ukraine borders, so where does it end? (Noting to Scrat that if Putin takes over Ukraine it won't end there)

None of which is derogatory to you or anyone else, so not quite sure what the problem with it was?

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:07 pm

::smthg:: ::smthg:: ::smthg::

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:08 pm

Catman wrote:

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:10 pm

Eilzel wrote:WTF phil?

You see? You've accused me of picking on him with others. I've not even posted on his thread or replied to him personally in any way. This is what he always does. Normally I'd say I give up and leave, but I'll be damned if I will this time. This Ukraine situation's escalating into something that'll affect us all and I'll persevere with it whether or not anyone wants to listen.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:12 pm

Phil, give it a rest will you, this is a potentially very serious situation that could end up affecting all of us, and we would like to discuss it seriously. Don't understand why you are doing it.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:12 pm

Sassy wrote:
Tesstacious wrote:

Excellent post Scrat.

Can I congratulate Newsfix on having a thread of nearly two pages actually discussing the topic! So refreshing - no petty insults, except for Les saying the only people with any sense or intelligene are the ones agreeing with him, and Sassy's "LOL, Tess said..." as if I must be an idiot because I don't share the accepted view.

Ben, as for Obama not wanting to start WW3, maybe he doesn't, but the man's an idiot. Diplomacy, what diplomacy? He and Kerry have used insulting and deliberately provoking threats against the Russians, which isn't a clever move - so it's either sheer stupidity or, as I suggested, a deliberate ploy to cause war to deflect from the massive economic crash that's due in the States soon, with the debt ceiling and the demise of the Petro-dollar.

I'm afraid you took my post completely the wrong way Tess. I said:

LOL. (Had a full stop after it and was in relation to Scrat's post) Tess was saying the other day (as you were) that he has to take Ukraine because he can't have a NATO member on his borders, (as I had replied to you) but of course Poland is in NATO and is on the Ukraine borders, so where does it end? (Noting to Scrat that if Putin takes over Ukraine it won't end there)

None of which is derogatory to you or anyone else, so not quite sure what the problem with it was?

Sorry then Sassy, read it the wrong way. I just wanted one thread to stay on topic for a change. Pax.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:13 pm

Tesstacious wrote:
Sassy wrote:

I'm afraid you took my post completely the wrong way Tess. I said:

LOL. (Had a full stop after it and was in relation to Scrat's post) Tess was saying the other day (as you were) that he has to take Ukraine because he can't have a NATO member on his borders, (as I had replied to you) but of course Poland is in NATO and is on the Ukraine borders, so where does it end? (Noting to Scrat that if Putin takes over Ukraine it won't end there)

None of which is derogatory to you or anyone else, so not quite sure what the problem with it was?
Sorry then Sassy, read it the wrong way. I just wanted one thread to stay on topic for a change. Pax.

No problem, happens easy enough when you are typing rather than talking.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:16 pm

Sassy wrote:Phil, give it a rest will you, this is a potentially very serious situation that could end up affecting all of us, and we would like to discuss it seriously. Don't understand why you are doing it.

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t4140p50-canada-human-rights-tribunal-to-probe-homophobic-catholic-school

Because that thread was being disrupted.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:17 pm

Catman wrote:
Sassy wrote:Phil, give it a rest will you, this is a potentially very serious situation that could end up affecting all of us, and we would like to discuss it seriously. Don't understand why you are doing it.

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t4140p50-canada-human-rights-tribunal-to-probe-homophobic-catholic-school

Because that thread was being disrupted.

OK, I get that, I have just looked. But is anyone disrupting it now? If not, please don't carry on. Pax all round?

by gerber Fri Apr 25, 2014 12:21 pm

In my normal out of the box thinking been having a surf today.

Putin is as someone put it playing chess whilst Obama is playing checkers.

He is even dividing Germany

" While almost half of Germans want Berlin to act as a bridge between the West and Russia, those in former Communist eastern parts are more sceptical about further sanctions, polls show.

With their misgivings articulated by left-wing politicians, including Gregor Gysi, a leading member of the Left party, who has accused Merkel of supporting "fascists" in Ukraine's government, some still harbour warmth towards Russia.

But it is not only easterners who are urging restraint.

Several former chancellors, including Gerhard Schroeder and Helmut Schmidt, both Social Democrats, and Helmut Kohl, from Merkel's conservative Christian Democrats, have questioned the West's treatment of Putin and Russia.

Differences are also mirrored in Merkel's cabinet.

http://uk.reuters.com/article/2014/04/25/uk-germany-russia-idUKBREA3O0F920140425

by Cass Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:29 pm

Tesstacious wrote:
Eilzel wrote:[quote="smelly_bandit"
you did imagine the annexation of the crimea
the Crimea VOTED in a democratic referendum for Reunification with russia
russia has not taken crimea by force
that will never be the case no matter how many times you say it is
grow up child and learn something about international politics because you have just made yourself look even more stupid than usual
annexation ::smthg:: ::smthg::
When will you learn to talk to people like a grown up; it's no wonder you get talked to like a piece of shit when you act like one
Yesterday you said I bored you; after I said the same of you- so piss off.
^Tess, Russian troops had entered Crimea before the referendum even took place; if foreign troops entered Northern Ireland, New Jersey, or even the Falklands you'd call it an invasion- that is exactly what Russia did in Crimea.

Crimea's always been Russian, except for a recent spell, which proved disastrous for them and why they wanted to return back to the fold. So Russia wasn't "foreign" and didn't invade - you can't invade your own country.[/quote]

Actually no it hasn't. Until 1783 it had been pretty much an independent Khanate and also at times being invaded ht others such as the Ottoman Empire. 1783-1917 was annexed by first Catherine the Great and was made a governorate. 1917 -1921 changed hands many times due to WW1 and the subsequent civil war. 1922 onwards annexed as part of the Russian SSR and after 1945 annexed into the USSR.

Poop I have to go yo work. Busy day so much time to be on.

End of day Putin overturned 1994 referendum. He is and always has been trying to put back together the USSR. He is not in this for Mother Russia but for the glory of himself. Remember old school Stalinist with terror tactics and trained by the KGB. Similar to GWB going after Sadaam to "finish" the job.

Laters all x

by Eilzel Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:51 pm

Tesstacious wrote:
scrat wrote:
A valid point Cass, Anschluss was the herding together of various ethnic Germans, the Sudeten Deutsch, the Donau Deutsch, and the Pomeranian Deutsch etc.

The Baltic States carry varying amounts of ethnic Russians as does Ukraine, Crimea was a gift to Ukraine that Russia has taken back because Ukraine is being undermined by European fascists and nationalistic elements that won't pay their gas bill and are thus favouring a better deal with Europe.

Apparently the Polish are giving plenty of coverage to US assets standing next to their specialist counter manoeuvre unit GROM.

The Danish and Dutch Air Force have been scrambled, and the Chinese are putting the squeeze on Barry because of Japan.

Interesting but potentially dangerous times.

Excellent post Scrat.

Can I congratulate Newsfix on having a thread of nearly two pages actually discussing the topic! So refreshing - no petty insults, except for Les saying the only people with any sense or intelligene are the ones agreeing with him, and Sassy's "LOL, Tess said..." as if I must be an idiot because I don't share the accepted view.

Ben, as for Obama not wanting to start WW3, maybe he doesn't, but the man's an idiot. Diplomacy, what diplomacy? He and Kerry have used insulting and deliberately provoking threats against the Russians, which isn't a clever move - so it's either sheer stupidity or, as I suggested, a deliberate ploy to cause war to deflect from the massive economic crash that's due in the States soon, with the debt ceiling and the demise of the Petro-dollar.

Oh piss off. I actually defended you the other day when phil was slagging you off!

In case you didn't notice smelly was being a bit of a knob with me, not that you cared to notice- because it's only ever one 'side' you choose to see. I appreciate calls to make the debate decent but I wont ignore people showing blatant double standards.

*Just to point exactly why I may have been a little shirty with my 'sense' comment- I came into this thread admittedly taking the contrary view and in a slightly jovial tone with my responses- and smelly comes in with 'twat'. You think that is ok? And care not to cite that in your little moan about 'insults', just me making a comment about sense...

As I said, I defended you in a reply to phil the other day; but clearly you aren't worth the effort with BS like this.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 4:58 pm

Cass wrote:
Tesstacious wrote:
When will you learn to talk to people like a grown up; it's no wonder you get talked to like a piece of shit when you act like one
Yesterday you said I bored you; after I said the same of you- so piss off.
^Tess, Russian troops had entered Crimea before the referendum even took place; if foreign troops entered Northern Ireland, New Jersey, or even the Falklands you'd call it an invasion- that is exactly what Russia did in Crimea.

Crimea's always been Russian, except for a recent spell, which proved disastrous for them and why they wanted to return back to the fold. So Russia wasn't "foreign" and didn't invade - you can't invade your own country.

Actually no it hasn't. Until 1783 it had been pretty much an independent Khanate and also at times being invaded ht others such as the Ottoman Empire. 1783-1917 was annexed by first Catherine the Great and was made a governorate. 1917 -1921 changed hands many times due to WW1 and the subsequent civil war. 1922 onwards annexed as part of the Russian SSR and after 1945 annexed into the USSR.

Poop I have to go yo work. Busy day so much time to be on.

End of day Putin overturned 1994 referendum. He is and always has been trying to put back together the USSR. He is not in this for Mother Russia but for the glory of himself. Remember old school Stalinist with terror tactics and trained by the KGB. Similar to GWB going after Sadaam to "finish" the job.

Laters all x[/quote]

Excellent factual post me Lady

x

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:04 pm

This is what I think:

There are faults on both sides. ::D::

by gerber Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:25 pm

At the start I was one of the protagonists arguing against Russia, but the more one reads and the more one listens I am changing my opinion.

It does seem as though the US and some of Europe are clamouring for action...........and has been said already maybe to hide the catastrophic economies. OB is a dangerous non leader.

Kerry is vieying for the Presidency nomination in the shadow of H Clinton. His aggressive attitude will do him no harm.

Leaders need wars to win elections they themselves seem to think.

Putin is just biding his time, waiting for Check mate.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:45 pm

gerber wrote:At the start I was one of the protagonists arguing against Russia, but the more one reads and the more one listens I am changing my opinion.

It does seem as though the US and some of Europe are clamouring for action...........and has been said already maybe to hide the catastrophic economies. OB is a dangerous non leader.

Kerry is vieying for the Presidency nomination in the shadow of H Clinton. His aggressive attitude will do him no harm.

Leaders need wars to win elections they themselves seem to think.

Putin is just biding his time, waiting for Check mate.

Sorry Gerber, but Russia is a bit hypocritical on that front with its views for the west not to get involved in Syria.

Putin is playing a very dangerous game, he knows he cannot compete with America, not financially, economically, over resources and military, all he has is a last gamble of Nukes, which I am sure America has contingency plans to strike that out of the equation too.

He is pushing his luck

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:48 pm

Didge wrote:
gerber wrote:At the start I was one of the protagonists arguing against Russia, but the more one reads and the more one listens I am changing my opinion.

It does seem as though the US and some of Europe are clamouring for action...........and has been said already maybe to hide the catastrophic economies. OB is a dangerous non leader.

Kerry is vieying for the Presidency nomination in the shadow of H Clinton. His aggressive attitude will do him no harm.

Leaders need wars to win elections they themselves seem to think.

Putin is just biding his time, waiting for Check mate.

Sorry Gerber, but Russia is a bit hypocritical on that front with its views for the west not to get involved in Syria.

Putin is playing a very dangerous game, he knows he cannot compete with America, not financially, economically, over resources and military, all he has is a last gamble of Nukes, which I am sure America has contingency plans to strike that out of the equation too.

He is pushing his luck

He is ruthless though Didge, and as mad as a snake.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:50 pm

Agreed Nems, but again, he knows his limitations, his forces cannot hope to match the US, especially technology wise, they are years behind the US

by gerber Fri Apr 25, 2014 5:52 pm

Nems wrote:
Didge wrote:

Sorry Gerber, but Russia is a bit hypocritical on that front with its views for the west not to get involved in Syria.

Putin is playing a very dangerous game, he knows he cannot compete with America, not financially, economically, over resources and military, all he has is a last gamble of Nukes, which I am sure America has contingency plans to strike that out of the equation too.

He is pushing his luck

He is ruthless though Didge, and as mad as a snake.

He is not having an election anytime soon.

Even Germany are divided over this with the good ex Chancellors unhappy with Merkel.

IMO he is sitting and waiting.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:47 pm

Didge wrote:
gerber wrote:At the start I was one of the protagonists arguing against Russia, but the more one reads and the more one listens I am changing my opinion.

It does seem as though the US and some of Europe are clamouring for action...........and has been said already maybe to hide the catastrophic economies. OB is a dangerous non leader.

Kerry is vieying for the Presidency nomination in the shadow of H Clinton. His aggressive attitude will do him no harm.

Leaders need wars to win elections they themselves seem to think.

Putin is just biding his time, waiting for Check mate.

Sorry Gerber, but Russia is a bit hypocritical on that front with its views for the west not to get involved in Syria.

Putin is playing a very dangerous game, he knows he cannot compete with America, not financially, economically, over resources and military, all he has is a last gamble of Nukes, which I am sure America has contingency plans to strike that out of the equation too.

He is pushing his luck

You're being serious right? I mean you're not just being sarcastic or something? Because if you're really serious you must be deluded. America has pathetically degenerated socially, politically, and economically such that it is the American leadership that will make it impossible for them to win in any kind of conflict against any kind of enemy, regardless of their material assets. If this was the America of at least 10 or 20 years ago, different matter. Now, America is fucked.

Also, remember too, that the US has to come to Russia (Ukraine), which requires a lot more money and projection.

Russia has all the 5th generation weapons from mobile rocket launchers (which US Generals have said would be a big problem), and the US does not have these. The F35 was discontinued, no F22 fighters seem to be taking to action. The new Russian fighters are more advanced than the F-15 and comparable to the F22.

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:54 pm

Tesstacious wrote:
Didge wrote:

Sorry Gerber, but Russia is a bit hypocritical on that front with its views for the west not to get involved in Syria.

Putin is playing a very dangerous game, he knows he cannot compete with America, not financially, economically, over resources and military, all he has is a last gamble of Nukes, which I am sure America has contingency plans to strike that out of the equation too.

He is pushing his luck

You're being serious right? I mean you're not just being sarcastic or something? Because if you're really serious you must be deluded. America has pathetically degenerated socially, politically, and economically such that it is the American leadership that will make it impossible for them to win in any kind of conflict against any kind of enemy, regardless of their material assets. If this was the America of at least 10 or 20 years ago, different matter. Now, America is fucked.

Also, remember too, that the US has to come to Russia (Ukraine), which requires a lot more money and projection.

Russia has all the 5th generation weapons from mobile rocket launchers (which US Generals have said would be a big problem), and the US does not have these. The F35 was discontinued, no F22 fighters seem to be taking to action. The new Russian fighters are more advanced than the F-15 and comparable to the F22.

Sorry Tess, you are talking nonsense, the American oil reserve dwarfs the Russians and they are even playing the idea to piss off Putin, that is how much they are that bothered about it and America is not fucked, you actually offer nothing to support your reasoning accept opinion.

American technology compared to the Russians is like a tank against the bow and arrow and no the new Russian fighters are crap compared to the new state of the art aircraft the yanks have, the F-15 is old and you are out of date on the technology, and weapons capabilities, where as most of Russians is obsolete.
The yanks could take out all the Russian system in one air and missle strike, they also have far advanced defense systems, so I suggest you read up further, not forgetting what the EU can also bring to the table

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 6:58 pm

Have a read Tess

http://theweek.com/article/index/257406/what-would-a-us-russia-war-look-like

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:09 pm

Didge wrote:Have a read Tess

http://theweek.com/article/index/257406/what-would-a-us-russia-war-look-like

Interesting read, but made from a western perspective. Russia's rocket technology far exceeds the US. I would add don't ever trust your perception of russian military, they read too much sun tzu and always strive to appear weaker than they are.

Finally, it's not all about weaponry. Don't forget the hold they have over Europe's gas supplies...

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 7:19 pm

Tesstacious wrote:
Didge wrote:Have a read Tess

http://theweek.com/article/index/257406/what-would-a-us-russia-war-look-like

Interesting read, but made from a western perspective. Russia's rocket technology far exceeds the US. I would add don't ever trust your perception of russian military, they read too much sun tzu and always strive to appear weaker than they are.

Finally, it's not all about weaponry. Don't forget the hold they have over Europe's gas supplies...

No it doesn't Tess on technology, the yanks are miles ahead and again this is just about America on its own, let alone Nato, Russian, would be disadvantaged against Nato and I am not bothered if you do not trust my perception, the one thing I know is the Americans have been in constant combat near enough the last 10 years.
America has a vast gas reserve now, have you heard of fracking?

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:13 pm

Didge wrote:
Tesstacious wrote:

Interesting read, but made from a western perspective. Russia's rocket technology far exceeds the US. I would add don't ever trust your perception of russian military, they read too much sun tzu and always strive to appear weaker than they are.

Finally, it's not all about weaponry. Don't forget the hold they have over Europe's gas supplies...

No it doesn't Tess on technology, the yanks are miles ahead and again this is just about America on its own, let alone Nato, Russian, would be disadvantaged against Nato and I am not bothered if you do not trust my perception, the one thing I know is the Americans have been in constant combat near enough the last 10 years.
America has a vast gas reserve now, have you heard of fracking?

People said the same thing about the Red Coats. Also said the same about the Space Race. Russia will lose because the US has all this technology. Well, look who failed the space race. The US failed. Now the US gets rides to the ISS from Russia. Or how NASA spent millions to make a pen that works in space. The Russians used a pencil. Both got the job done, one spent far too much, the other spent nothing.

Russian belief is....much better to have 100 modest fighter planes then 10 top of the line fighters. Considering a sophisticated weapon system on the jet is the difference. Dog fights are long gone with the technology to fire missiles long before each plane sees each other.

Russians are superior in missile technologies. In that respect, the US's expensive fighters could be splashed down by an advanced missile fired from a cold war era jet.

And what are you talking about American gas reserves and fracking? It's not their gas Putin can switch off is it, it's Europe's, Germany's. Haven't you been following the situation at all?

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:20 pm

You have got to be kidding me, the red coats?
The US won the space race, they reached the moon first, seriously, just because they have downgraded things does not mean they lost or have not the better technology. The few point on red coats shows you know little of the conflict either.

The fact is the Russian fights would be mostly knocked out on the first few days, this happened to them before, and it was only because the Germans did not have the range to keep their industry disrupted with bombing that they allowed Russia to rebuild and they did this only with help from the west, as up untill 1943, they were very reliant on weapons, tanks etc from the west and resources. Thus with the US and Nato, the Russians would be fucked

So numbers count for little against superior weapon technology Tess, seriously are you getting a mate from Godlikeproductions forum to give this bad info? They are not superior in missile technology, that is bull. I suggest you get this person to research better

So America is not able to export of which it is now doing again?

by Guest Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:24 pm

The two authors of the Foreign Affairs piece, Lieber and Press, went on to outline the real consequences of the current escalation of BMD in Europe (and as well against China in Japan):
“. . .[T]he sort of missile defenses that the United States might plausibly deploy would be valuable primarily in an offensive context, not a defensive one—as an adjunct to a US First Strike capability, not as a stand-alone shield. If the United States launched a nuclear attack against Russia (or China), the targeted country would be left with only a tiny surviving arsenal — if any at all. At that point, even a relatively modest or inefficient missile defense system might well be enough to protect against any retaliatory strikes.”
They concluded, “Today, for the first time in almost 50 years, the United States stands on the verge of attaining nuclear primacy. It will probably soon be possible for the United States to destroy the long-range nuclear arsenals of Russia or China with a first strike. This dramatic shift in the nuclear balance of power stems from a series of improvements in the United States' nuclear systems, the precipitous decline of Russia's arsenal, and the glacial pace of modernization of China's nuclear forces.”

http://rt.com/op-edge/us-missile-shield-russia-361/

by Cass Sat Apr 26, 2014 2:50 am

Good heavens.....my spelling and syntax! Bloody kindle! This is why I want an IPAD. Apologies to all.

Update- Russian warplanes violate Ukraine airspace. Vlad is certainly pushing the envelope. I don't think hes stupid enough to go nuclear but will go conventional - at least I am hoping. IMO he is playing a very dangerous game of chicken.

Race for the oil fields and natural gas is on. That and the rebuilding of the USSR.

by veya_victaous Sat Apr 26, 2014 2:58 am

Cass wrote:Good heavens.....my spelling and syntax! Bloody kindle! This is why I want an IPAD. Apologies to all.

Update- Russian warplanes violate Ukraine airspace. Vlad is certainly pushing the envelope. I don't think hes stupid enough to go nuclear but will go conventional - at least I am hoping. IMO he is playing a very dangerous game of chicken.

Race for the oil fields and natural gas is on. That and the rebuilding of the USSR.

I think Russia is far stronger than we appreciate, I'd say this is a long term, well thought out strategy and the west is woefully unprepared to counter it.
They aren't stupid they can see the west has been fucking around in the hornets nest that is the middle east, combined with the failure of the western banking system, the west has never been weaker. And China is happy for them to take it, so long as Russia returns the favor regarding Tibet and Taiwan Neutral

So maybe Obama will have to just let Ukraine fall confused

by Cass Sat Apr 26, 2014 3:07 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Cass wrote:Good heavens.....my spelling and syntax! Bloody kindle! This is why I want an IPAD. Apologies to all.
Update- Russian warplanes violate Ukraine airspace. Vlad is certainly pushing the envelope. I don't think hes stupid enough to go nuclear but will go conventional - at least I am hoping. IMO he is playing a very dangerous game of chicken.

Race for the oil fields and natural gas is on. That and the rebuilding of the USSR.

I think Russia is far stronger than we appreciate, I'd say this is a long term, well thought out strategy and the west is woefully unprepared to counter it.
They aren't stupid they can see the west has been fucking around in the hornets nest that is the middle east, combined with the failure of the western banking system, the west has never been weaker. And China is happy for them to take it, so long as Russia returns the favor regarding Tibet and Taiwan So maybe Obama will have to just let Ukraine fall

Agree with long term that has been his plan all along....as to being weak? Possibly but not likely - who knows what he has been doing....my guess is strengthening the armed forces, making back room deals with China just like you said - he ain't dumb that's for sure.

Problem is Obama is dammed if does something and dammed if he lets Ukraine go - but where do draw the line? Munich Crisis part two.

by Eilzel Sat Apr 26, 2014 8:39 am

Exactly Cass. So we let Ukraine fall; then Russia turns her attention to perhaps Moldova, or Russian minorities start making noises in any of the other many former Soviet states, do we just step back and allow an aggressive Russia to expand indefinitely?

I am surprised how little interest people have in defeding global order and the right to a nations sovereignty. We don't live in a bubble, allowing one aggressive power to move unchecked would bite us in the end.

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