Stitching-up claimants is all part of the job, says Jobcentre insider

First topic message reminder :

Last week Iain Duncan Smith met a whistle-blower who has worked for his Department for Work and Pensions for more than 20 years.

Giving the Secretary of State a dossier of evidence, the former Jobcentre Plus adviser told him of a “brutal and bullying” culture of “setting claimants up to fail”.

“The pressure to sanction customers was constant,” he said. “It led to people being stitched-up on a daily basis.”

The man wishes to be anonymous but gave his details to IDS, DWP minister Esther McVey and Neil Couling, Head of Jobcentre Plus, who also attended the meeting.

“We were constantly told ‘agitate the customer’ and that ‘any engagement with the customer is an opportunity to ­sanction’,” he told them.

Labour MP Debbie Abrahams, the member of the DWP Select Committee who set up the meeting, has renewed her call for an inquiry into inappropriate sanctioning.

“I am deeply concerned that sanctions are being used to create the illusion the Government is bringing down unemployment,” she said.

Sanctions pre-date the Coalition as a way of ensuring benefit claimants, who include the jobless and sick and disabled people on Employment Support Allowance, attend appointments and apply for jobs. But under the Tory-led Government, they have soared – to 897,690 a year from the most recent data.


http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/stitching-up-claimants-part-job-says-3537051


from May last year...but no better if not worse Now....


and you wonder why I consider those who work for this shameful organisation to be entirely without honour...

In fact come the revolution i would put them against the brick wall first...

IDS and his troupe of performing monkeys are merely self seeking low lifes

these people are traitors to their own.......

Raggamuffin wrote:

Irn Bru wrote:I never thought I would see the day when people would be suggesting that for people who have been thrown out of work through no fault of their own that they should be scouring the streets to pick up other people's rubbish as a means to get what they need or wear other people's old clothes that they pick up at jumble sales to at least look presentable and dignified. There is no dignity in that and they will be classed as scroungers and their children ridiculed as benefit junkies just for their parents being out of work.

We're better than that surely. Britain is one of the richest countries in the world and yet people come out with this nonsense whilst surrounded by banksters, fraudsters, tax avoiders and off-shore money stashers who don't pay their way and yet hardly any of them have been prosecuted yet benefit sanctions for a lot less than that are imposed on people daily for the reasons stated in the OP.

Get a grip FGS.

Victor has posted the figures for for what unemplyment benefit and jobseekers allowances cost the welfare state and it's tiny in relation to the overall welfare budget

I simply can't understand your aversion to jumbles sales or the recycling of goods that others no longer need or use. Charity shops are booming, so clearly a lot of people do like second hand goods. People buy far too much new stuff anyway, and then get paranoid about it in case it gets damaged.

Like !!second hand goods ? what about have no choice!! and  Charity shops are booming What does that tell you raggs
living of others throw always .................yes what a great country to live in !!
some of you guys think its should be more like the 1800 than 2015  but as awlays its a case of "I`m all right jack" screw you  



first line of the song pretty much sums up the attitude of some of you guys

And charity shops used to be to help foreign country's and the really destitute in this country not the  middle class and unemployed more than foreign country's
and food banks .....FFS in the uk in 2015 and you guys think that`s ok
your all fucking mad

Stop being a snob KD!

Tommy Monk wrote:Stop being a snob KD!

He is not being a snob but countering your points so why deflect and actually counter back.
Me myself see nothing wrong with buying second hand clothes we all do it to something we like, whether it be cars or anything. To argue off second hand clothes as if to be some travesty then we then need to clarify anything second hand as on par with poverty and wrong. Its trying to say something one used is now worthless when many people feel a million dollars even wearing or being sat in something second hand.

Debate the points as I just did, Korben has you tied easily up in knots, because he is intelligent and knows how to debate.

No, he is showing typical snobbish attitude of The champagne socialist... and being a hypocrite.

Tommy Monk wrote:No, he is showing typical snobbish attitude of The champagne socialist... and being a hypocrite.

Then point score to Korben, his argument wins over yours.
That is why I respect Korben vastly more than yourself.
I know Korben means well and actually is not a hypocrite and does wish to do well and have no utter doubt he gives freely to help others vastly more than you.
Again I disagree with his views here and offer mine on second hand me downs, but I would never fault him on the reasoning behind his view. One to help others. It is born from doing good or wanting to do good.

You sadly see only the negative in people.

Tommy Monk wrote:No, he is showing typical snobbish attitude of The champagne socialist... and being a hypocrite.

its a pity that i don`t broadcast my personal life over the internet Tommy because if i did you would realise how stupid and inaccurate that comment is

for one i have never drunk champagne in my life, I by my clothes from asda i haven`t been on a holiday nor has my family in 27 years ,i dont drink i have never bought designer gear ever i have spent most of life now looking after my daughter i am not well of by any stretch of the imagination and struggle from week to week but i don`t complain about it especially to people who look down on people like me and treat us like scum i learned that lesson on sky

but i served my country my parents served there country my grandparents served there country

what have you done for your country nothing except complain about the less fortunate i suspect

but what i am is well educated and resourceful and we manage and people like you would rather treat people like me and the worse of than me as some sort of scum on your shoe

Cuchulain wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:No, he is showing typical snobbish attitude of The champagne socialist... and being a hypocrite.

Then point score to Korben, his argument wins over yours.
That is why I respect Korben vastly more than yourself.
I know Korben means well and actually is not a hypocrite and does wish to do well and have no utter doubt he gives freely to help others vastly more than you.
Again I disagree with his views here and offer mine on second hand me downs, but I would never fault him on the reasoning behind his view. One to help others. It is born from doing good or wanting to do good.

You sadly see only the negative in people.

Thanks for that its appreciated and your correct i have put my self in situations to help others at a cost to me when i could ill afford it and been called stupid for doing so but thats me
And to be clear to the likes of tommy i have no problem with second hand stuff other than relying on it as a way of life that`s not what my parents fought a war for

and the truth is



THERE IS A BETTER WAY

victorismyhero wrote:and the truth is



THERE IS A BETTER WAY

Is there?
How is it this better way still does not make people feel proud of the work they do?
That some have no incentive?

Cuchulain wrote:

victorismyhero wrote:and the truth is



THERE IS A BETTER WAY

Is there?
How is it this better way still does not make people feel proud of the work they do?
That some have no incentive?

ermm...didge........

I havnt yet said what the better way is.......

take fifty lashes for jumping to conclusions

victorismyhero wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:

Is there?
How is it this better way still does not make people feel proud of the work they do?
That some have no incentive?

ermm...didge........

I havnt yet said what the better way is.......

take fifty lashes for jumping to conclusions

50 lashes applied sir.
Though argument fail without substance to a better way.

Shall catch up tomorrow victor, as this is interesting.

Night mate

Tory minister says £90,000 salary left him "counting the pennies"

Tobias Ellwood wrote to the MPs pay watchdog to plead for a wage increase for honourable members

A Tory minister has sparked outrage after saying his £90,000 salary left him "counting the pennies."

Bournemouth MP Tobias Ellwood pleaded with the MPs pay watchdog to give honourable members a wage hike, saying he would be earning far more if he'd stayed in the armed forces.

In a letter to the Independent Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA), he said: "I know I speak for the silent majority (who are not millionaires) to say this increase is well overdue.

"I never expected to be watching the pennies at my age and yet this is what I now have to do."

He went on to explain that Army Colonels earn £69,000 a year, and get a £1,000 increase every year.

Ellwood served in the British Army's Royal Green Jackets from 1991, before leaving in 1996 with the rank of Captain.

He was elected as an MP in 2005, and was made a Foreign Office minister in July 2014 - a role that comes with a salary of £89,435

MPs were awarded a wage hike from £67,060 to £74,000.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tory-minister-says-90000-salary-6085266



For a bit of perspective.

So I think we have to wait for sassy to stop spamming before we can debate again then?

victorismyhero wrote:and the truth is



THERE IS A BETTER WAY

There certainly is, and having seen your better way before, I agree with most of it.

People like me KD...!?


I support the use of second hand stuff, not only for the principle of recycling and putting good stuff to use but also because people like to buy it And it generates work for people and money for charity.



You appear to presume that people like me have some sort of snobbish attitude towards others for using charity shops or grabbing second hand stuff but in reality it is people like me who commend it while you seem to be running it down and running down those who use this stuff and outlets.



Your idea of 'me' and 'people like me' is based on what exactly!?

Other than a poor stereotype generated by your wild imagination!!!



Only a leftie can hear someone voice support for charity shops and second hand pass ons and twist it as a way of enabling others to look down their noses at the poorer people in society!


Unbelievable!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:People like me KD...!?


I support the use of second hand stuff, not only for the principle of recycling and putting good stuff to use but also because people like to buy it And it generates work for people and money for charity.



You appear to presume that people like me have some sort of snobbish attitude towards others for using charity shops or grabbing second hand stuff but in reality it is people like me who commend it while you seem to be running it down and running down those who use this stuff and outlets.



Your idea of 'me' and 'people like me' is based on what exactly!?

Other than a poor stereotype generated by your wild imagination!!!



Only a leftie can hear someone voice support for charity shops and second hand pass ons and twist it as a way of enabling others to look down their noses at the poorer people in society!


Unbelievable!!!

your presumption of me  The champagne socialist..  as usuall Tommy you like to dish out your presumption of others and in this case me
then wine like a 3 years old when you get the same treatment yes you are Unbelievable

people who live in glass houses best not throw bricks

ps
just to give you a hand

champagne socialist
nounBritishderogatory
noun: champagne socialist; plural noun: champagne socialists

a person who espouses socialist ideals while enjoying a wealthy and luxurious lifestyle.

Well it did seem to me that you were being a bit snobbish about second hand stuff and cheap stuff in charity shops...


The term 'champagne socialist' doesn't necessarily mean you were a champagne drinker you know...!?



But it's clear that you have this ingrained 'us and them' mentality, and A belief that I am well on the side of 'them'...


Just wondering why you think this...!?


And what exactly constitutes being classed as part of The 'them' group...?

Tommy Monk wrote:Well it did seem to me that you were being a bit snobbish about second hand stuff and cheap stuff in charity shops...


The term 'champagne socialist' doesn't necessarily mean you were a champagne drinker you know...!?



But it's clear that you have this ingrained 'us and them' mentality, and A belief that I am well on the side of 'them'...


Just wondering why you think this...!?


And what exactly constitutes being classed as part of The 'them' group...?

so arguing with a dictionary again Tommy all ways right
i know what it means the comment about not drinking champagne was
sarcastic
sɑːˈkastɪk/
adjective
adjective: sarcastic

marked by or given to using irony in order to mock or convey contempt.



and the only person with a ingrained 'us and them' mentality is you be it blacks ,LGBT ,unemployed and your constant terms like "you lefty`s" ,"every thing is labour fault" on almost every topic
its very obvious to everybody you are the one who has the 'us and them' mentality

try a bigger stone the glass in my glass house is very tough and your not even scratching it

Actually it is leftie ideology that tries to tell us we are all the same while also pointing out differences by constantly going on about 'celebrating diversity' and praising others cultures eat, and on top of that... giving special treatment to some based purely on differences...



Very confused thinking, completely contradictory and hypocritical.



And I haven't even started on the constant promotion of a class divide... which is mainly from middle class lefties and their inner guilt and self loathing from having nice well paid middle class jobs and who have become exactly the type of person they were taught to hate by other leftie culture at university...

Tommy Monk wrote:Actually it is leftie ideology that tries to tell us we are all the same while also pointing out differences by constantly going on about 'celebrating diversity' and praising others cultures eat, and on top of that... giving special treatment to some based purely on differences...



Very confused thinking, completely contradictory and hypocritical.



And I haven't even started on the constant promotion of a class divide... which is mainly from middle class lefties and their inner guilt and self loathing from having nice well paid middle class jobs and who have become exactly the type of person they were taught to hate by other leftie culture at university...

Very confused thinking, completely contradictory and hypocritical.


indeed its all on your part i am afraid Tommy your whole post is rife with the "them" and us mentality but your to blind to see it or obstinate to admit it
because your stuck in the same old groove you seem to have all ways been in

unfortunately people like you are  the problem not the solution
see i don`t hate anybody whether they have loads of money or not what i hate is the injustices the "i`m all right screw everybody for as much as you can mentality " the lack of compassion

and not sure what you mean by inner guilt ? guilt for what

and we are all the same just some are more "same " than others

Standin' in line marking time
Waiting for the welfare dime
'Cause they can't buy a job
The man in the silk suit hurries by
As he catches the poor old lady's eyes
Just for fun he says, 'Get a job'

That's just the way it is
Some things'll never change
That's just the way it is
Ha, but don't you believe them

Said, 'Hey little boy you can't go
Where the others go
Cause you don't look like they do'
Said, 'Hey, old man how can you stand
To think that way
Did you really think about it
Before you made the rules?'
He said, 'Son

That's just the way it is
Some things'll never change
That's just the way it is'
Ha, but don't you believe them

Ooo, yeah (instrumental)

(That's just the way it is)
(That's just the way it is)

Well, they passed a law in '64
To give those who ain't got, a little more
But it only goes so far
'Cause the law don't change another's mind
When all it sees at the hiring time
Is the line on the color bar
But who knows

That's just the way it is
Some things'll never change (right)
That's just the way it is
That's just they way it is, it is, when you're waiting.

i have highlighted my view of you

korban dallas wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:Actually it is leftie ideology that tries to tell us we are all the same while also pointing out differences by constantly going on about 'celebrating diversity' and praising others cultures eat, and on top of that... giving special treatment to some based purely on differences...



Very confused thinking, completely contradictory and hypocritical.



And I haven't even started on the constant promotion of a class divide... which is mainly from middle class lefties and their inner guilt and self loathing from having nice well paid middle class jobs and who have become exactly the type of person they were taught to hate by other leftie culture at university...

Very confused thinking, completely contradictory and hypocritical.

I Just said that as a critique of you and Your thinking...


indeed its all on your part i am afraid Tommy your whole post is rife with the "them" and us mentality but your to blind to see it or obstinate to admit it
because your stuck in the same old groove you seem to have all ways been in

I was just pointing out the twisted and contradictory nature of typical leftie thinking and asking why...?

unfortunately people like you are  the problem

again you say it's people like me who are the problem... when in reality it is people like you who are the problem, twisting the truth, constantly moaning on the back of false arguments and logic, And spouting endless bitterness towards anyone else who dares to work hard and get themselves into a position of earning enough money to treat themselves to a few luxuries etc...

What makes you think that those who work hard every day should be no better off financially than those who sit at home all day doing fuck all...!?

I'm sure everyone would love to sit around at home all day and get enough free money to enjoy a luxury life style... but you fail to see that most who do go to work every day have a far from luxury life style and five days a week of bollocks to pay for a life of financial struggle!!!



not the solution

what is the solution KD...!?

Everyone give a few more quid to KD...???




see i don`t hate anybody whether they have loads of money or not what i hate is the injustices the "i`m all right screw everybody for as much as you can mentality " the lack of compassion

where is this injustice...!?

From what I can see it is allowing those who choose not to work to be able to enjoy the same standard of living as those who slave away every week doing the work!!!



and not sure what you mean by inner guilt ? guilt for what

and we are all the same just some are more "same " than others

We are all 'equal' But some are more 'equal' than others...

Definition of socialism!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
Very confused thinking, completely contradictory and hypocritical.

I Just said that as a critique of you and Your thinking...

Yet its more of a mirror of you ...funny that that`s called transference


indeed its all on your part i am afraid Tommy your whole post is rife with the "them" and us mentality but your to blind to see it or obstinate to admit it
because your stuck in the same old groove you seem to have all ways been in

I was just pointing out the twisted and contradictory nature of typical leftie thinking and asking why...?

while ignoring your own twisted thinking and trying to justify it and telling people its all there fault  transference  again

unfortunately people like you are  the problem

again you say it's people like me who are the problem... when in reality it is people like you who are the problem, twisting the truth, constantly moaning on the back of false arguments and logic, And spouting endless bitterness towards anyone else who dares to work hard and get themselves into a position of earning enough money to treat themselves to a few luxuries etc...


transference again because i am not bitter nor do i hate people because of there skin colour or sexual preferences and i have no problem with people who work hard asyou seem to think i don`t  or that`s the implication i get from your comments
i certainly suspect i work and have worked  harder than you ever have

What makes you think that those who work hard every day should be no better off financially than those who sit at home all day doing fuck all...!?

you seem to think everybody on benefit is there by choice yet that isn`t even close to the truth sure they may be some but far less than you imagine or seem to think there is  but they are the minority most people want to work but you constantly tar everybody with the same brush  

I'm sure everyone would love to sit around at home all day and get enough free money to enjoy a luxury life style... but you fail to see that most who do go to work every day have a far from luxury life style and five days a week of bollocks to pay for a life of financial struggle!!!

yes people who go to work every day and still struggle and now we have a government that`s making that worse by removing tax credits and sanctioning people for all sorts of barmmy reasons to meet government targets
yet its partly the  government that has cut the jobs available by privatising industry's who`s only concern is more and more profit

take  BSkyB  for a example Full-Year Profit Up 9% To £1.33bn. why because they closed the support services after 11:00 and moved the majority of those jobs to india.

where they pay £3 a hours instead of a living wage that`s less jobs for the people who live in this country and yet you blame thous unemployed  instead of the profit driven company's who have people getting huge bonuses for screwing the people in this country  

Or  thatcher who built power stations that could only run on Chinese coal and in doing so destroyed the biggest employer in this country at one time  the mining industry
that pushed  even more people in to poverty and debt while you fly the flag and put the blame on them and you wonder why people get so disillusioned one step forward 3 steps back

yet mp`s get pay rises while nurses and firemen and all manner of public sector worker are shafted and now they are trying to remove the rights of workers to protest against it while bankers get obscene bonus for what ? sitting on there ass all day thinking of ways to literally steal money



not the solution

what is the solution KD...!?
investment and dare i say it back to nationalisation

Take BT who will report a pre-tax profit of £2.5bn, is that money invested back no its not in any meaning full way instead they ask for government subsidy's to upgrade the communication network that tey own and they get it

these company's and company's like who find ways of avoiding due tax they are the true scroungers  but the sums of money are so big you can`t see it or simply don`t care
Amazon
Starbucks
Facebook
Google
Apple
eBay
to name the big ones well over 5 billion unpaid tax just 1% of that would likely cover the welfare bill in its entirety and allow investment and actually create jobs

yet people like you prefer to demonise the little people

oil industry huge tax breaks $93 Billion in Profits
the steel industry when it was finally making a profit ..privatised

i could look up hundreds of examples and i haven`t even mentioned the armed forces
infrastructure investment  roads, rail

Transport Secretary Patrick McLoughlin says rising costs and missed targets make the £38.5bn plan untenable.

while we give India support worth about £200m they even have a bloody space program and India plans $137bn rail investment that i guess we are paying for instead of our own


Everyone give a few more quid to KD...???

EH !! as i said i manage with what i have i don`t ask for charity especially from the likes of you who use that charity as a stick to demean people an called them scum and scroungers  so you can feel morally superior




see i don`t hate anybody whether they have loads of money or not what i hate is the injustices the "i`m all right screw everybody for as much as you can mentality " the lack of compassion

where is this injustice...!?

the fact you don`t see it shows you don`t care and have the "i am all right jack "attitude i mentioned

From what I can see it is allowing those who choose not to work to be able to enjoy the same standard of living as those who slave away every week doing the work!!!

yes if you can`t afford a place to live live on the streets ,if you can`t afford food go to a food bank , if you cant afford warm clothes go to a charity shop

In 1942, the Liberal politician William Beveridge, who the government set the task of discovering what kind of Britain people wanted to see after the war, declared that there were five "giants on the road to reconstruction":

   poverty
   disease
   ignorance
   squalor
   idleness

To defeat these giants, he proposed setting up a welfare state with social security, a national health service, free education, council housing and full employment.

In the years after the war, the Labour government tried to make this vision come true.

and assholes like you want to go back to this .....yea over my fucking dead body pall



and not sure what you mean by inner guilt ? guilt for what

and we are all the same just some are more "same " than others

We are all 'equal' But some are more 'equal' than others...

Definition of socialism!!!

socialism yea you say that like i care you call me a socialist well guilty as charged and i am proud of that fact
i do care about the less fortunate i don`t think people should be written of as worthless scroungers that`s what it was like in the 1800 and before with the landed gentry giving there merger scraps to the masses while they take all the real benefit of there labours
and you don`t even understand the word you keep banding about as some sort of insult or bad thing

socialist
A socialist economy is based on the principle of production for use, to directly satisfy economic demand and human needs, and objects are valued by their use-value, as opposed to the principle of production for profit and accumulation of capital or wealth

honestly get a fucking dictionary and look up the meaning of words before you shout your mouth of

ps
We are all 'equal' But some are more 'equal' than others...

Definition of socialism!!!


No you idiot that`s the definition of capitalism jeeze

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I simply can't understand your aversion to jumbles sales or the recycling of goods that others no longer need or use. Charity shops are booming, so clearly a lot of people do like second hand goods. People buy far too much new stuff anyway, and then get paranoid about it in case it gets damaged.

Like !!second hand goods ? what about have no choice!! and  Charity shops are booming What does that tell you raggs
living of others throw always .................yes what a great country to live in !!
some of you guys think its should be more like the 1800 than 2015  but as awlays its a case of "I`m all right jack" screw you  



first line of the song pretty much sums up the attitude of some of you guys

Are you for real? So if I go to a charity shop and buy something, you'll say that I'm a poor repressed soul who's been treated badly by the Government?

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
Like !!second hand goods ? what about have no choice!! and  Charity shops are booming What does that tell you raggs
living of others throw always .................yes what a great country to live in !!
some of you guys think its should be more like the 1800 than 2015  but as awlays its a case of "I`m all right jack" screw you  



first line of the song pretty much sums up the attitude of some of you guys

Are you for real? So if I go to a charity shop and buy something, you'll say that I'm a poor repressed soul who's been treated badly by the Government?

its all ways about you isn`t it raggs FFS   you really must go out of your way to feel abused and picked on

no that`s not what i am saying and you bloody well know that as the second part made clear
what about have no choice!!


i assume you have a choice

Tommy Monk wrote:People like me KD...!?


I support the use of second hand stuff, not only for the principle of recycling and putting good stuff to use but also because people like to buy it And it generates work for people and money for charity.



You appear to presume that people like me have some sort of snobbish attitude towards others for using charity shops or grabbing second hand stuff but in reality it is people like me who commend it while you seem to be running it down and running down those who use this stuff and outlets.



Your idea of 'me' and 'people like me' is based on what exactly!?

Other than a poor stereotype generated by your wild imagination!!!



Only a leftie can hear someone voice support for charity shops and second hand pass ons and twist it as a way of enabling others to look down their noses at the poorer people in society!


Unbelievable!!!

Korban and Bru certainly appear to think that it's demeaning to buy things from charity shops. I find their attitude astonishing - in fact, I think they must be jesting.

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Are you for real? So if I go to a charity shop and buy something, you'll say that I'm a poor repressed soul who's been treated badly by the Government?

its all ways about you isn`t it raggs FFS   you really must go out of your way to feel abused and picked on

no that`s not what i am saying and you bloody well know that as the second part made clear
what about have no choice!!


i assume you have a choice

No Korban - it's you who thinks it's demeaning for me to buy things from charity shops - I don't think it is, and I don't feel sorry for myself when I do so.

So someone wants to buy a book and they can't afford the price of a new one, so they buy one second hand. There's nothing wrong with that.

You seem to think that the fact charity shops are booming is a bad thing. It may well be a bad thing for other shops, but it's certainly not bad for the people who use them, or the people they help. What on earth is the matter with you? Do you really think that it's demeaning to buy things second hand?

Raggamuffin wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:People like me KD...!?


I support the use of second hand stuff, not only for the principle of recycling and putting good stuff to use but also because people like to buy it And it generates work for people and money for charity.



You appear to presume that people like me have some sort of snobbish attitude towards others for using charity shops or grabbing second hand stuff but in reality it is people like me who commend it while you seem to be running it down and running down those who use this stuff and outlets.



Your idea of 'me' and 'people like me' is based on what exactly!?

Other than a poor stereotype generated by your wild imagination!!!



Only a leftie can hear someone voice support for charity shops and second hand pass ons and twist it as a way of enabling others to look down their noses at the poorer people in society!


Unbelievable!!!

Korban and Bru certainly appear to think that it's demeaning to buy things from charity shops. I find their attitude astonishing - in fact, I think they must be jesting.

did you allways have the lastest and newest stuff when you where growing up i guess your kids where never bullied for wearing second hand clothes

i suspect you never had to rely on charity for the basics in life have you so i guess you have no concept how that can affect you or your self worth
it one thing buying the odd item but when you have to rely on it for your entire closet its a different thing all together

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Korban and Bru certainly appear to think that it's demeaning to buy things from charity shops. I find their attitude astonishing - in fact, I think they must be jesting.

did you allways have the lastest and newest stuff when you where growing up i guess your kids where never bullied for wearing second hand clothes

i suspect you never had to rely on charity for the basics in life have you so i guess you have no concept how that can affect you or your self worth
it one thing buying the odd item but when you have to rely on it for your entire closet its a different thing all together

When I was a kid, I loved jumble sales. I had clothes which had been passed on. Did I feel sorry for myself? Of course not. I simply can't understand your attitude. Do you seriously think that way?

I have been mocked on other forums for saying that I use charity shops, but I always thought that the people who did it weren't being serious. Now I think that perhaps they were!

Is this a leftie thing? That people should buy new things and look down on second hand stuff?

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
its all ways about you isn`t it raggs FFS   you really must go out of your way to feel abused and picked on

no that`s not what i am saying and you bloody well know that as the second part made clear
what about have no choice!!


i assume you have a choice

No Korban - it's you who thinks it's demeaning for me to buy things from charity shops - I don't think it is, and I don't feel sorry for myself when I do so.

So someone wants to buy a book and they can't afford the price of a new one, so they buy one second hand. There's nothing wrong with that.

You seem to think that the fact charity shops are booming is a bad thing. It may well be a bad thing for other shops, but it's certainly not bad for the people who use them, or the people they help. What on earth is the matter with you? Do you really think that it's demeaning to buy things second hand?

i love it when you tell me what i think
And books are not the same as clothes, furniture is not the same as clothes and yes it can be demeaning for a lot of people  
i have never done it my self, furniture yes ,electrical items yes as well ,but clothes no i have never and would never
is that snobbish perhaps but i have no idea who has been in them

my friend bought a sleeping bag from a second hand shop washed it and everything still got an infection from it

so no i would not buy second hand clothes if i did not know where it came from

Raggamuffin wrote:I have been mocked on other forums for saying that I use charity shops, but I always thought that the people who did it weren't being serious. Now I think that perhaps they were!

Is this a leftie thing? That people should buy new things and look down on second hand stuff?

I
you have been mocked on other forums

i rest my case

thanks

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

No Korban - it's you who thinks it's demeaning for me to buy things from charity shops - I don't think it is, and I don't feel sorry for myself when I do so.

So someone wants to buy a book and they can't afford the price of a new one, so they buy one second hand. There's nothing wrong with that.

You seem to think that the fact charity shops are booming is a bad thing. It may well be a bad thing for other shops, but it's certainly not bad for the people who use them, or the people they help. What on earth is the matter with you? Do you really think that it's demeaning to buy things second hand?

i love it when you tell me what i think and books are not the same as clothes furniture is not the same as clothes and yes it can be demeaning for a lot of people  
i have never done it my self furniture yes electrical items yes as well but clothes no i have never and would never
is that snobbish perhaps but i have no idea ad who has been in them

my friend bought a sleeping bag from a second hand shop washed it and everything still got an infection from it

so no i would not buy second hand clothes if i did not know where it came from  

Clothes - same thing. Should I feel demeaned if I buy clothes from a charity shop? You have never bought second hand clothes, or had any clothes given to you?

I'm absolutely astonished at what you're saying.

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:I have been mocked on other forums for saying that I use charity shops, but I always thought that the people who did it weren't being serious. Now I think that perhaps they were!

Is this a leftie thing? That people should buy new things and look down on second hand stuff?

I
you  have been mocked on other forums

i rest my case

thanks

So you think that people are right to mock those who have bought second hand clothes?

You really are a frightful snob - who knew?

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
i love it when you tell me what i think and books are not the same as clothes furniture is not the same as clothes and yes it can be demeaning for a lot of people  
i have never done it my self furniture yes electrical items yes as well but clothes no i have never and would never
is that snobbish perhaps but i have no idea ad who has been in them

my friend bought a sleeping bag from a second hand shop washed it and everything still got an infection from it

so no i would not buy second hand clothes if i did not know where it came from  

Clothes - same thing. Should I feel demeaned if I buy clothes from a charity shop? You have never bought second hand clothes, or had any clothes given to you?

I'm absolutely astonished at what you're saying.

nope never bought second hand clothes but given to me yes but i knew where they came from that`s the difference

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
I
you  have been mocked on other forums

i rest my case

thanks

So you think that people are right to mock those who have bought second hand clothes?

You really are a frightful snob - who knew?

your a bit dense this morning
no i don`t think its ok to mock people for any reason except rank stupidity and i would never do it
but that`s me i am not everybody else

i wear my clothes till they are raggs (no pun intended )

funny story
couple of years ago i went to asda quite late on a Friday night wearing my dossing about clothes
as i walked in a young guy early 20s bit drunk to be fair made comments about what i was wearing and how he could afford to dress in better clothes and told me to get a job  (his friend apologised for him which appreciated ) he didn`t see the car i got out of worth about 45 grand but that did not stop the assumption i was some kind of scrounger who could not afford decent clothes and i see that kind of attitude a lot

my wifes older sister (cant stand her ) bit of a mentally lacking person buys all her clothes from charity shops and for her and her kids who where continually bullied at school because of it
i would love to live in your place all full of non judgemental people unfortunately i live in the real world

korban dallas wrote:my wifes older sister (cant stand her ) bit of a mentally lacking person buys all her clothes from charity shops and for her and her kids who where continually bullied at school because of it
i would love to live in your place all full of non judgemental people unfortunately i live in the real world

I think it's you who must live in some weird place Korban. Maybe the people doing the bullying are lefties who think that everyone should buy everything new.

I never encountered this is real life - in any place, and I have moved around a fair bit in my life. I wouldn't dream of mocking anyone who bought clothes from a charity stuff - just the opposite in fact.

If it's really an issue for those kids, how would anyone know their clothes came from charity shops unless they told them?

This has opened up a whole new can of worms on here, and I'd be interested to see what others say. I get the feeling that you're a bit insecure re money and self-image.

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

So you think that people are right to mock those who have bought second hand clothes?

You really are a frightful snob - who knew?

your a bit dense this morning
no i don`t think its ok to mock people for any reason except rank stupidity and i would never do it
but that`s me i am not everybody else

i wear my clothes till they are raggs (no pun intended )

funny story
couple of years ago i went to asda quite late on a Friday night wearing my dossing about clothes
as i walked in a young guy early 20s bit drunk to be fair made comments about what i was wearing and how he could afford to dress in better clothes and told me to get a job  (his friend apologised for him which appreciated ) he didn`t see the car i got out of worth about 45 grand but that did not stop the assumption i was some kind of scrounger who could not afford decent clothes and i see that kind of attitude a lot

Why would you care what some drunk says?

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
did you allways have the lastest and newest stuff when you where growing up i guess your kids where never bullied for wearing second hand clothes

i suspect you never had to rely on charity for the basics in life have you so i guess you have no concept how that can affect you or your self worth
it one thing buying the odd item but when you have to rely on it for your entire closet its a different thing all together

When I was a kid, I loved jumble sales. I had clothes which had been passed on. Did I feel sorry for myself? Of course not. I simply can't understand your attitude. Do you seriously think that way?

thats because you have missed my point completely in your rush to feel mocked and abused
some thing you have a habit if doing

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:
your a bit dense this morning
no i don`t think its ok to mock people for any reason except rank stupidity and i would never do it
but that`s me i am not everybody else

i wear my clothes till they are raggs (no pun intended )

funny story
couple of years ago i went to asda quite late on a Friday night wearing my dossing about clothes
as i walked in a young guy early 20s bit drunk to be fair made comments about what i was wearing and how he could afford to dress in better clothes and told me to get a job  (his friend apologised for him which appreciated ) he didn`t see the car i got out of worth about 45 grand but that did not stop the assumption i was some kind of scrounger who could not afford decent clothes and i see that kind of attitude a lot

Why would you care what some drunk says?  

offs i don`t it did take me aback for a split second
but that wasn`t the point of the story was it

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:


When I was a kid, I loved jumble sales. I had clothes which had been passed on. Did I feel sorry for myself? Of course not. I simply can't understand your attitude. Do you seriously think that way?

thats because you have missed my point completely in your rush to feel mocked and abused
some thing you have a habit if doing  

No, you have misunderstood. I don't feel mocked and abused - it's you who thinks I should feel that way simply because I get clothes from charity shops.

This car which was worth 45 grand - was it your car? I'm sure you said that you "struggle" with money.

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Why would you care what some drunk says?  

offs  i don`t  it did take me aback for a split second
but that wasn`t the point of the story was it

I think it was exactly the point of that particular story.

I'd be interested to know about these other people who allegedly go around mocking others for buying clothes from charity shops.

I have to go now though - work to do and all that.

I think there's an attitude problem here rather than anything else.

Raggamuffin wrote:

korban dallas wrote:my wifes older sister (cant stand her ) bit of a mentally lacking person buys all her clothes from charity shops and for her and her kids who where continually bullied at school because of it
i would love to live in your place all full of non judgemental people unfortunately i live in the real world

I think it's you who must live in some weird place Korban. Maybe the people doing the bullying are lefties who think that everyone should buy everything new.

I never encountered this is real life - in any place, and I have moved around a fair bit in my life. I wouldn't dream of mocking anyone who bought clothes from a charity stuff - just the opposite in fact.

If it's really an issue for those kids, how would anyone know their clothes came from charity shops unless they told them?

This has opened up a whole new can of worms on here, and I'd be interested to see what others say. I get the feeling that you're a bit insecure re money and self-image.

i have the feeling your a bit dense and do i strike you as insecure ? really ?
and never encounter that kind of attitude that i do find hard to believe especially if you have kids they are the worst for it
it certainly happened in my school and is one of the reasons for school uniforms so that kids where not picked on because they did not have the latest shoes ,trainers ,tops ect ...where do you live nirvana ? or are you just blind to the things happening around you ?

korban dallas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I think it's you who must live in some weird place Korban. Maybe the people doing the bullying are lefties who think that everyone should buy everything new.

I never encountered this is real life - in any place, and I have moved around a fair bit in my life. I wouldn't dream of mocking anyone who bought clothes from a charity stuff - just the opposite in fact.

If it's really an issue for those kids, how would anyone know their clothes came from charity shops unless they told them?

This has opened up a whole new can of worms on here, and I'd be interested to see what others say. I get the feeling that you're a bit insecure re money and self-image.

i have the feeling your a bit dense and do i strike you as insecure ? really ?
and never encounter that kind of attitude that i do find hard to believe  especially if you have kids they are the worst for it
it certainly happened in my school and is one of the reasons for school uniforms so that kids where not picked on because they did not have the latest shoes ,trainers ,tops ect ...where do you live nirvana ? or are you just blind to the things happening around you ?

I'll speak to you later about your rude post, and your absurd attitude.

Bye for now!

Raggamuffin wrote:This car which was worth 45 grand - was it your car? I'm sure you said that you "struggle" with money.

VW carravelle executive and no its a motablity car