Five grounded girls are from same London school as 3 'Jihadi brides'

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Judge reveals that five teenagers barred from travelling abroad were pupils at Bethnal Green Academy in Bethnal Green, east London.

Five teenage girls barred from travelling abroad by a judge after showing an interest in going to Syria are pupils at the same London school as three girls already thought to have fled there to join the Islamic State, the High Court has been told.

In mid-February police raised concerns following the disappearance of Kadiza Sultana, 16, Shamima Begum, 15, and Amira Abase, 15, from their homes in east London.

On March 20 Mr Justice Hayden barred five girls - three 16 and two 15 - from leaving the jurisdiction of England and Wales following a hearing in the Family Division of the High Court in London.

The judge had made an order saying the five girls could not be identified.

But on Friday he said it could be revealed that all eight teenagers were pupils at Bethnal Green Academy in Bethnal Green, east London.

He made a ruling allowing the school to be named at a follow-up hearing in the Family Division of the High Court in London - after an application from the Press Association news agency, which argued that revealing the link to the school would be in the public interest.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/11499833/Five-grounded-girls-are-from-same-London-school-as-3-Jihadi-brides.html

Should not this school be investigated being as they have failed to protect these girls from extremism?

Raggamuffin wrote:

Brasidas wrote:


Well that is very short sighted, when the girls were very vocal on twitter, to the point you are now claiming others do not view twitter or they would not have been as open as they were on the social media?
Please that is so naive Zack.
The school had 5 girls with these beliefs and you are claiming the school was not aware or at least the pupils. Of which the later shows the school is failing to provide a view for pupils to come forward, which is another failing

One pupil at least has said that he never heard anyone talking about joining ISIS at the school.

One out of 1400 and again that is taking the view they are telling the truth of course Rags.
Again girls who are very open on their views on twitter where many other pupils would also be on twitter, would certainly be aware of these views.

Schools do monitor social media activity - in the school, and it seems that Bethnal Green Academy does that. They can't help what happens outside of school though. It seems to me that a lot of this trouble does stem from social media, and also the reporting of these events from the Middle East. Should we then have a ban on reporting or a ban on anyone under the age of 50 or so using the internet?

Brasidas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

One pupil at least has said that he never heard anyone talking about joining ISIS at the school.

One out of 1400 and again that is taking the view they are telling the truth of course Rags.
Again girls who are very open on their views on twitter where many other pupils would also be on twitter, would certainly be aware of these views.

I'm sure most of the pupils have been asked if they knew anything, and as far as I know, none of them have said they did.

So then, if girls want to go off and support terrorists in the Middle East, why are people so keen to stop them?

Brasidas wrote:

Fuzzy Zack wrote:

So you're now suggesting that schools should monitor their students social media activity? Lol!

Btw: the school follow the an anti extremism policy and procedures in place. Look it up. Ofsted also gave the school an outstanding rating, suggesting they follow regulations.

1) Never claimed any such thing, where again many people follow twitter hence why to claim their views were not known is basically being in denial. Seriously girls that opinionated and not afraid to speak out on these views on the social media are not going to shy away anywhere else from doing so.

2) Great the school has been incorrectly awarded for its measures, which they need to look into further the methods used on prevention, because clearly the school has failed, being as again 5 girls have attempted to join ISIS. Now you can ignore this major fact, but it is a huge failing for if just one did, but 5 proves their methods at preventing need rethinking.

1) in that case, their accounts (assuming they were not private) were open to MI5 too. But you are wrong about your assumption that girls would be this vocal in front of everybody. Including their family. You are making assumptions not based on any fact.

2) the fact that the 5 girls were in such proximity (in one school) shows that this is not a widespread problem. 5 girls out of how many? Pfft! I would be more worried if the 5 girls were from different schools. The fact they were in such proximity indicates how covert they were.

Stop blaming the school. They followed regulations. You may as well blame Ofsted if extremists were that vocal in this school.

Raggamuffin wrote:Schools do monitor social media activity - in the school, and it seems that Bethnal Green Academy does that. They can't help what happens outside of school though. It seems to me that a lot of this trouble does stem from social media, and also the reporting of these events from the Middle East. Should we then have a ban on reporting or a ban on anyone under the age of 50 or so using the internet?

I agree social media is a major factor also and this needs to be looked at.
My view here though is that the parents, the Police and the school bare some responsibility here, which has been my point throughout and the clear fact that there is measures at the school, needs addressing because it failed to prevent 5 girls from heading out to join ISIS.
One thing we need to do more than anything is classify Wahhabism as an extremist ideology.

Re these girls who have been prevented from leaving this country, has anyone asked them why they wanted to go? Has anyone told them what happens out there? Have they expressed any opinion as to the beheading of British people and the murders out there?

I think they should be asked these questions instead of being treated as poor little victims.

Yes, let's blame the school, Ofsted, MI5, MI6, GCHQ, their parents and The WI.

Make you feel any better?

Brasidas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:Schools do monitor social media activity - in the school, and it seems that Bethnal Green Academy does that. They can't help what happens outside of school though. It seems to me that a lot of this trouble does stem from social media, and also the reporting of these events from the Middle East. Should we then have a ban on reporting or a ban on anyone under the age of 50 or so using the internet?

I agree social media is a major factor also and this needs to be looked at.
My view here though is that the parents, the Police and the school bare some responsibility here, which has been my point throughout and the clear fact that there is measures at the school, needs addressing because it failed to prevent 5 girls from heading out to join ISIS.
One thing we need to do more than anything is classify Wahhabism as an extremist ideology.

I agree about the parents and the police. It remains to be seen if the parents are as unaware as they claim to be, particularly one of them. The police apologised and said that the girls were victims, thereby enabling this kind of thing and encouraging it IMO.

I also think that any school which does know about such activities, or encourages it in any way should be closed down. However, I think it's a bit unfair to blame the school for not preventing this if they knew nothing about it. Teachers cannot be nursemaids or the guardians of morals - they have enough to do just teaching their subjects and keeping some kind of control in the classroom.

Have people worked out how to prevent every pimple on their body? Or does some puss always rise to the surface, now and again?

Fuzzy Zack wrote:

Brasidas wrote:


1) Never claimed any such thing, where again many people follow twitter hence why to claim their views were not known is basically being in denial. Seriously girls that opinionated and not afraid to speak out on these views on the social media are not going to shy away anywhere else from doing so.

2) Great the school has been incorrectly awarded for its measures, which they need to look into further the methods used on prevention, because clearly the school has failed, being as again 5 girls have attempted to join ISIS. Now you can ignore this major fact, but it is a huge failing for if just one did, but 5 proves their methods at preventing need rethinking.

1) in that case, their accounts (assuming they were not private) were open to MI5 too. But you are wrong about your assumption that girls would be this vocal in front of everybody. Including their family.  You are making assumptions not based on any fact.

2) the fact that the 5 girls were in such proximity (in one school) shows that this is not a widespread problem. 5 girls out of how many? Pfft! I would be more worried if the 5 girls were from different schools. The fact they were in such proximity indicates how covert they were.

Stop blaming the school.  They followed regulations. You may as well blame Ofsted if extremists were that vocal in this school.

1) The Police were viewing the accounts and hence why the Police failed here also, which I have already spoken of in this thread. If they are vocal on Twitter means they are not afraid of people knowing their views. The Police could see for themselves the views of these girls, which means they were not even trying to hide their views from anyone. So again you are being very naive here Zack and again one thing I know is when people hold extreme views they most certainly are very vocal in defending ideological beliefs, maybe not to the extent of murders, but they would be of the ideology they follow. Even if they used a pseudo name on twitter are you claiming other friends at school would not now this name or follow views on twitter? Hence clearly other pupils certainly would have been aware of their views and why the school then fails at teaching children to come forward.

3) 5 Girls out of how many Muslim girls should be the starting point to view this on, as it could then be very big and even more so why 5 came from the same school would also need looking further into to see if and where the connections are. So they were not covert at all because the Police were very much aware of their views. I will rightly blame the school because their measures failed to prevent 5 girls from attempting to join ISIS. That is a fact, which you need to start recognizing.

So, is the man at the rally the same man who was complaining to the police about his daughter going missing?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3013703/Father-jihadi-bride-schoolgirl-attended-2012-Islamist-rally-attended-Lee-Rigby-s-killer-led-preacher-Anjem-Choudary.html

Raggamuffin wrote:So, is the man at the rally the same man who was complaining to the police about his daughter going missing?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3013703/Father-jihadi-bride-schoolgirl-attended-2012-Islamist-rally-attended-Lee-Rigby-s-killer-led-preacher-Anjem-Choudary.html

Well why does that not surprise me.
He has no justification to moan at the Police, as I am of no doubt he was instrumental in indoctrinating his daughter with his extremist views.

Brasidas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:So, is the man at the rally the same man who was complaining to the police about his daughter going missing?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3013703/Father-jihadi-bride-schoolgirl-attended-2012-Islamist-rally-attended-Lee-Rigby-s-killer-led-preacher-Anjem-Choudary.html

Well why does that not surprise me.
He has no justification to moan at the Police, as I am of no doubt he was instrumental in indoctrinating his daughter with his extremist views.

Well this is what I've been saying. The police actually apologised to a man who attends this kind of rally. He certainly seems to have pulled the wool over their eyes, so are there not grounds for them to investigate him and the other parents too?

Raggamuffin wrote:

Brasidas wrote:


Well why does that not surprise me.
He has no justification to moan at the Police, as I am of no doubt he was instrumental in indoctrinating his daughter with his extremist views.

Well this is what I've been saying. The police actually apologised to a man who attends this kind of rally. He certainly seems to have pulled the wool over their eyes, so are there not grounds for them to investigate him and the other parents too?

That is a valid point on investigating the parents, as much as the school should be investigate, as it is vital to learn of how and why people are drawn to such an ideology. It is vital to learn the lessons from each and every case, where the system is failing to protect children from extremist ideology. All avenues should be exhausted so we can learn how best to tackle the problem going for the future

If the authorities want to stop this radicalisation, they don't need to look much further than the man who is behind a lot of these rallies, and yet they never arrest him, and he's even given airtime on the TV. Anyone who attends one of his rallies or associates with him is clearly not in a position to lecture anyone else or demand apologies from the police, and they were silly to pander to the girl's father IMO.

Brasidas wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Well this is what I've been saying. The police actually apologised to a man who attends this kind of rally. He certainly seems to have pulled the wool over their eyes, so are there not grounds for them to investigate him and the other parents too?

That is a valid point on investigating the parents, as much as the school should be investigate, as it is vital to learn of how and why people are drawn to such an ideology. It is vital to learn the lessons from each and every case, where the system is failing to protect children from extremist ideology. All avenues should be exhausted so we can learn how best to tackle the problem going for the future

We know why they're drawn to such ideology already - it's not rocket science.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Brasidas wrote:


That is a valid point on investigating the parents, as much as the school should be investigate, as it is vital to learn of how and why people are drawn to such an ideology. It is vital to learn the lessons from each and every case, where the system is failing to protect children from extremist ideology. All avenues should be exhausted so we can learn how best to tackle the problem going for the future

We know why they're drawn to such ideology already - it's not rocket science.

Indeed and why we need more voices within the Muslim community and religious leaders to combat this growing problem in this country. Some already are which is very good to see, but what is needed is a large unified voice from the Muslim community itself to counter the extremist views.

Right have to pop out again, see you and Zack later

The police are already pussyfooting around and saying they will examine the footage to see if any laws were broken. Of course they will find that the man did not break the law, and their apology will stand. Why the hell they can't just retract the apology and point the finger straight at the girl's father is a mystery.

By the look of that rally, it should have been broken up at the time.

It all reminds me of the way they stood there and let trouble makers abuse British soldiers in Luton - which led to the formation of the EDL.