Compulsary covid jabs for care workers...or face the sack.

First topic message reminder :

Good, and it's about time.


"Covid vaccinations are to become mandatory for care home staff under plans to be announced by ministers, as they consider extending the move to all NHS staff.

The controversial measure sets up a likely battle with staff in both services and could lead to the government being sued under European human rights law or equalities legislation for breaching the freedom of people who work in caring roles to decide what they put into their bodies.

The Guardian understands that ministers will confirm they are pushing ahead with compulsory vaccination for most of the 1.5 million people working in social care in England, despite employer and staff organisations in the sector warning that it could backfire if workers quit rather than get immunised. Under the plans those working with adults will have 16 weeks to get vaccinated or face losing their jobs.

The government is also keen to make it mandatory for the 1.38 million people who are directly employed by the NHS in England to get vaccinated against Covid-19 and winter flu – proposals that have already been criticised by groups representing doctors, nurses and other staff.






https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/15/covid-jabs-to-become-mandatory-for-care-home-staff-in-england

You can't generalize from specifics. So let's put it into context: In this country there have been 606,000 who died from Covid-19. There have been 300 who have been found with myocarditis, after a Covid vaccination...and still they have uncovered no mechanism of action or causation for the myocarditis.

So you have 2020/1 chances. I'll take those odds.

Original Quill wrote:You can't generalize from specifics.  So let's put it into context: In this country there have been 606,000 who died from Covid-19.  There have been 300 who have been found with myocarditis, after a Covid vaccination...and still they have uncovered no mechanism of action or causation for the myocarditis.

So you have 2020/1 chances.  I'll take those odds.

but how many died compared to previous years? that;s the important thing

our government insisted all these thousands and thousands of people died of covid trying to make it sound like there were 130k EXTRA people died than would normally. that was a flat out lie. as stated there barely a ripple in the over all stats. just because they died with covid in their system(after suffering a long illness) its been recorded as a covid death.

the fact that the common people are still controlled yet the G7 crew, the Fifa VIPs, the Ascot crowd etc have no problem mixing and socialising doesnt seem to have woken any one up either

the fact that peoplle have been brainwashed into believing that a vaccine that they have admitted

doesn't stop you catching or transmitting covid,
hasn;t even completed trials,
has already caused multiple injuries and deaths

is somehow preferable than the risk of catching a virus which you have a 99.9% chance of surviving anyway.

it blows my mind tbh

just how easily and successfully people are manipulated and brainwashed and controlled

and so quickly too

An advisory group for the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention say there is a 'likely link' between rare cases of heart inflammation in adolescents and young adults and the Pfizer/BioNTech and Moderna COVID-19 vaccines.

In a presentation released on Wednesday, the COVID-19 Vaccine Safety Technical (VaST) Work Group discussed nearly 500 reports of the heart inflammation, known as myocarditis, in vaccinated males between ages 16 and 24.

The group of doctors said he risk of myocarditis or pericarditis following vaccination with the mRNA-based shots in adolescents and young adults is notably higher after the second dose and in males


https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-9718091/CDC-advisory-group-says-likely-link-COVID-19-vaccines-rare-heart-inflammation.html?ito=social-twitter_dailymailus

https://dailyexpose.co.uk/2021/06/22/evidence-the-covid-19-vaccines-are-killing-children/

Facts and figures, questions answered  from todays live Downing street coronavirus update.

https://youtu.be/hhUF6eBIsLg

The open letter explains better than i can


https://rumble.com/viy0vt-an-open-letter-to-nadhim-zahawi-uk-vaccine-minister-from-the-people.html

gelico wrote:

Original Quill wrote:You can't generalize from specifics.  So let's put it into context: In this country there have been 606,000 who died from Covid-19.  There have been 300 who have been found with myocarditis, after a Covid vaccination...and still they have uncovered no mechanism of action or causation for the myocarditis.

So you have 2020/1 chances.  I'll take those odds.

but how many died compared to previous years?  that;s the important thing

our government insisted all these thousands and thousands of people died of covid trying to make it sound like there were 130k EXTRA people died than would normally.  that was a flat out lie.  as stated there barely a ripple in the over all stats.  just because they died with covid in their system(after suffering a long illness) its been recorded as a covid death.

the fact that the common people are still controlled yet the G7 crew, the Fifa VIPs, the Ascot crowd etc have no problem mixing and socialising doesnt seem to have woken any one up either

the fact that peoplle have been brainwashed into believing that a vaccine that they have admitted

doesn't stop you catching or transmitting covid,
hasn;t even completed trials,
has already caused multiple injuries and deaths

is somehow preferable than the risk of catching a virus which you have a 99.9% chance of surviving anyway.

it blows my mind tbh

just how easily and successfully people are manipulated and brainwashed and controlled

and so quickly too

"Last year was the deadliest in a century, with almost as many fatalities documented in absolute terms in England and Wales in 2020 as at the height of the flu pandemic in 1918".



https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/jan/12/2020-was-deadliest-year-in-a-century-in-england-and-wales-says-ons

Sorry Gels, but it seems that many of the links you are posting are not coming from reliable or honest sources

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitChute


https://www.chillfiltr.com/exposing-daily-expose-a-beginner-course-in-spotting-dishonest-media

Syl wrote:Facts and figures, questions answered  from todays live Downing street coronavirus update.

https://youtu.be/hhUF6eBIsLg

syl, i haven't watched all this as yet, i'm only in about 15 minutes.

so far i'm horrified by this but (unlike you) i'm prepared to fully commit to actually absorbing posts you put up

i'll get back to you on it but so far i'm fucking furious,,,,who knows, once i've finished it, i might yet change my mind

gelico wrote:

Syl wrote:Facts and figures, questions answered  from todays live Downing street coronavirus update.

https://youtu.be/hhUF6eBIsLg

syl, i haven't watched all this as yet, i'm only in about 15 minutes.

so far i'm horrified by this but (unlike you) i'm prepared to fully commit to actually absorbing posts you put up

i'll get back to you on it but so far i'm fucking furious,,,,who knows, once i've finished it, i  might yet change my mind

OK.

I have watched parts of your links today, not all, I honestly dont have so many spare hours in the day.
I have done a bit of research on two of the sites you have linked quite a few times to....BITCHUTE and DAILY EXPOSE.
They are not reliable sites, read up on them yourself.

gelico wrote:

Vintage wrote:That's ok you believe what you want to believe. I know people who have died from complications of getting the virus  - not always old people and some who are still suffering the effects of having the virus,  both personally and through work. I know people who have had the vaccine and had no effects, me included, and I know people who have had temporary effects but I haven't come across anyone with long term effects or have died from the vaccine, at least not in my part of the country.

i'm looking at stats, facts and listening to expert scientists, doctors, viral specialists, immunologists, (those ones that have not been allowed much air time for obvious reasons)

of course you won't hear about those dying of the vaccine.  the information is only starting to emerge and is being kept as quiet as possible

We have though, weren't blood clots linked to vaccines and people who died of them, among other things. I said I don't know of anyone around here who has died through complications of a vaccine. I do know people who have died from complications of having covid and those who have recovered but still have problems connected with covid.

gelico wrote:but how many died compared to previous years? that;s the important thing

Fewer died…as the 1 in 2020 statistic are only those who came down with myocarditis, compared to Covid deaths. That is the given threat…take it as it is.

Myocarditis is a condition, not an inevitable death. It is the weakening of the heart muscle. A severe case myocarditis can weaken the heart, which can lead to heart failure, and death, but only in extreme cases. You are comparing actual deaths to mere conditions. The point of vaccination is: the chances of merely getting the heart condition are astronomically less than the chance of dying from Covid-19.

What happened in previous years is irrelevant as Covid wasn't even a threat prior to the last quarter of 2019 (at best). The proposition is: either 2020 die from Covid, or 300 merely get a condition of myocarditis. And, once again, no one has yet spelled out the mechanism of causation between the vaccination and myocarditis, so all you have are very weak associations.

And that’s why I’m still on the fence.

MOST people will not die from the flu yet people still go and have the vaccine? That blows my mind!
It’s pure scaremongering simple as that.

Now I know the flu isn’t the same as covid but MOST people don’t die from that either. Surely, if we keep wearing masks for a few more months then the virus will simply die out.

Vaccination (for most disease) is for the benefit of society more than the individual, except in cases of vulnerable people.

People can say they're very unlikely to die from Covid, and that's true. But they can still spread it to others, some of whom might be in those vulnerable groups, who shouldn't be made to live like prisoners simply because other people would rather not get vaccinated.

Also, any given area has a limited number of doctors, nurses, hospital beds, ambulances, etc. If you can prevent people from getting sick by vaccinating them, that's a safeguard against the healthcare system becoming overwhelmed and not having enough resources to go around.

That's my two pence, anyway

eddie wrote:And that’s why I’m still on the fence.

MOST people will not die from the flu yet people still go and have the vaccine? That blows my mind!
It’s pure scaremongering simple as that.

Now I know the flu isn’t the same as covid but MOST people don’t die from that either. Surely, if we keep wearing masks for a few more months then the virus will simply die out.

Haha...after they bombed Pearl Harbor in 1941, a guy in Vermont looked down at his arms, legs and torso, then twisted around and checked out his ass.  He finally said:  "Nup, didn't hurt me...guess I won't enlist."

Original Quill wrote:

eddie wrote:And that’s why I’m still on the fence.

MOST people will not die from the flu yet people still go and have the vaccine? That blows my mind!
It’s pure scaremongering simple as that.

Now I know the flu isn’t the same as covid but MOST people don’t die from that either. Surely, if we keep wearing masks for a few more months then the virus will simply die out.

Haha...after they bombed Pearl Harbor in 1941, a guy in Vermont looked down at his arms, legs and torso, then twisted around and checked out his ass.  He finally said:  "Nup, didn't hurt me...guess I won't enlist."  

I hear everyone’s views on this and I can’t disagree but I can still say with absolute certainty that forcing people to vaccinate is just not on.

And where will it end? Covid now....and then two years later something else....and then two years later something else.....?

"The government has passed the Health and Social Care Act 2008 (Regulated Activities) (Amendment) (Coronavirus) Regulations 2021 (Covid Regulations) obliging care homes to ensure (almost) all workers are vaccinated against Covid-19. The Covid Regulations, which only apply to England, come in to force on 11 November 2021."


Good...about time too.


https://www.gasolicitors.com/blog/mandatory-vaccinations-working-care-sector-august-2021-update/

eddie wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Haha...after they bombed Pearl Harbor in 1941, a guy in Vermont looked down at his arms, legs and torso, then twisted around and checked out his ass.  He finally said:  "Nup, didn't hurt me...guess I won't enlist."  

I hear everyone’s views on this and I can’t disagree but I can still say with absolute certainty that forcing people to vaccinate is just not on.

And where will it end? Covid now....and then two years later something else....and then two years later something else.....?

As long as humans are a social animal, they put each jeopardy by carrying a virus. There's a moral obligation not to harm others.

If it comes down to a choice between forcing people to get vaccinated and letting a disease periodically pick people off, scare the rest of us into our houses, shut down businesses and generally disrupt life ... I choose forced vaccination.

Hell, plenty of other vaccines are already forced upon us, and for good reason. It's why people don't die of polio anymore.

Ben Reilly wrote:If it comes down to a choice between forcing people to get vaccinated and letting a disease periodically pick people off, scare the rest of us into our houses, shut down businesses and generally disrupt life ... I choose forced vaccination.

Hell, plenty of other vaccines are already forced upon us, and for good reason. It's why people don't die of polio anymore.

I might be wrong but I don’t know of any other vaccines that are “forced upon us”.

eddie wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:If it comes down to a choice between forcing people to get vaccinated and letting a disease periodically pick people off, scare the rest of us into our houses, shut down businesses and generally disrupt life ... I choose forced vaccination.

Hell, plenty of other vaccines are already forced upon us, and for good reason. It's why people don't die of polio anymore.

I might be wrong but I don’t know of any other vaccines that are “forced upon us”.

Childhood immunizations like measles, mumps, rubella and polio.

Ben Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:If it comes down to a choice between forcing people to get vaccinated and letting a disease periodically pick people off, scare the rest of us into our houses, shut down businesses and generally disrupt life ... I choose forced vaccination.

Hell, plenty of other vaccines are already forced upon us, and for good reason. It's why people don't die of polio anymore.

I might be wrong but I don’t know of any other vaccines that are “forced upon us”.

Childhood immunizations like measles, mumps, rubella and polio.

In the Uk you don’t have to have them. You can say no.

Although there is no federal law, all 50 states mandate vaccination as a condition of entry into school, although exceptions vary from state to state.

In addition to mandating vaccination against childhood diseases like polio, diphtheria, and measles, three states — Rhode Island, Virginia, and the District of Columbia — also have passed laws requiring school-aged children to get vaccinated against the HPV virus, which can cause cervical cancer as well as certain head and neck cancers.

Also, all states allow vaccination exemptions for medical reasons, and almost all states (except California, Mississippi, and West Virginia) grant religious or philosophical exemptions for people who have sincerely held beliefs that prohibit immunizations,” according to a report from the NCSL.

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/should-childhood-vaccines-become-mandatory-in-the-us#Vaccine-exemptions-in-the-U.S.-vary-by-state

Quill wrote:

Also, all states allow vaccination exemptions for medical reasons, and almost all states (except California, Mississippi, and West Virginia) grant religious or philosophical exemptions for people who have sincerely held beliefs that prohibit immunizations,” according to a report from the NCSL.”


Then that’s the loophole people will or may use, against a Covid vaccine.

I wonder whether Covid is the first-ever deadly disease that people actively resisted getting vaccinated against -- I can't remember any other disease that could potentially kill you where large groups of people said they'd rather risk death than get vaccinated.

Ben Reilly wrote:I wonder whether Covid is the first-ever deadly disease that people actively resisted getting vaccinated against -- I can't remember any other disease that could potentially kill you where large groups of people said they'd rather risk death than get vaccinated.

Perhaps or perhaps not, who knows for sure?
In any case it only kills vulnerable people. Most of us aren’t vulnerable. That much we do know.

Ben Reilly wrote:I wonder whether Covid is the first-ever deadly disease that people actively resisted getting vaccinated against -- I can't remember any other disease that could potentially kill you where large groups of people said they'd rather risk death than get vaccinated.

There are plenty of anti vaxers out there, but no where near the number we see with Covid.

It's odd no doubt. I know several people who won't get the shot, but I'm pretty sure they have had other vaccines. Of course they were probably vaccinated as a child and didn't have a choice.

Then there are folks like me who have never had a flu shot because I figured it wouldn't kill me. I guess a lot of folks look at covid like the flu, which is silly.

eddie wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:I wonder whether Covid is the first-ever deadly disease that people actively resisted getting vaccinated against -- I can't remember any other disease that could potentially kill you where large groups of people said they'd rather risk death than get vaccinated.

Perhaps or perhaps not, who knows for sure?
In any case it only kills vulnerable people. Most of us aren’t vulnerable. That much we do know.

It has killed many young people who led healthy lifestyles and literally had no idea they might have an underlying susceptibility to covid ... until they got it and died, but in many cases, not before they were able to express their regret to the loved ones they left behind, at least.

And of course, every time covid infects a new person, it gets another several hundred thousand chances to mutate into something deadlier.

The vaccine has killed people but we won’t go on about that because they’re few and far between, they’re not the norm...just like the very few “not vulnerable” people who died from covid.
But never mind that similarity....move along.

My last post, because I repeat my original and common sense sentiment:

I am not comfortable in a world where I am forced to do something I don’t want to do.

eddie wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:If it comes down to a choice between forcing people to get vaccinated and letting a disease periodically pick people off, scare the rest of us into our houses, shut down businesses and generally disrupt life ... I choose forced vaccination.

Hell, plenty of other vaccines are already forced upon us, and for good reason. It's why people don't die of polio anymore.

I might be wrong but I don’t know of any other vaccines that are “forced upon us”.

There are certain countries you cant enter unless you have had certain vaccinations.
Covid19 has been added to that list recently for some countries.

Syl wrote:

eddie wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:If it comes down to a choice between forcing people to get vaccinated and letting a disease periodically pick people off, scare the rest of us into our houses, shut down businesses and generally disrupt life ... I choose forced vaccination.

Hell, plenty of other vaccines are already forced upon us, and for good reason. It's why people don't die of polio anymore.

I might be wrong but I don’t know of any other vaccines that are “forced upon us”.

There are certain countries you cant enter unless you have had certain vaccinations.
Covid19  has been added to that list recently for some countries.

Well that’s still not being “forced” is it? You can choose not to go.

I would think the world is full of things we have to do although we don't want to, even in our 'free' societies - mainly for the common good, otherwise there'd be chaos.
As for people who have no wish to be vaccinated that's fine but don't gripe about restrictions put on you for the sake of the majority .

In the UK, you're forced to jump through many hoops to own a gun, because that's deemed to be in the interest of public safety.

In Texas you can buy a gun without a criminal background check because people don't want to be forced to undergo a criminal background check and potentially be denied a gun.

Texas has far more shooting deaths than the UK.

eddie wrote:

Syl wrote:

There are certain countries you cant enter unless you have had certain vaccinations.
Covid19  has been added to that list recently for some countries.

Well that’s still not being “forced” is it? You can choose not to go.

I know, I was just saying.

I will tell you what i dont understand about people who are adamant they wont have the Covid vaccine, they dont think twice about getting their children vaccinated against all the standard childhood diseases.
Double standards.

Syl wrote:

eddie wrote:

Syl wrote:

There are certain countries you cant enter unless you have had certain vaccinations.
Covid19  has been added to that list recently for some countries.

Well that’s still not being “forced” is it? You can choose not to go.

I know, I was just saying.

I will tell you what i dont understand about people who are adamant they wont have the Covid vaccine, they dont think twice about getting their children vaccinated against all the standard childhood diseases.
Double standards.

Nor do they refrain from eating food packed full of sugar and fat and perservatives, or smoking cigarettes and drinking alcohol, or God knows what else. For the majority of people against getting vaccines, I think that most of the things they say to defend their choice are just masking the real reason they won't get vaccinated.

It's a bit like how people who hate environmentalism and green energy suddenly became so concerned about how many birds are killed by wind turbines. You know that they don't really care about the birds -- if they did, they'd be able to show other circumstances in which they stood up and said Bird Lives Matter, but they can't, because Bird Lives Matter is just something they plucked off the internet to try to justify their position.

Or perhaps it’s just some people don’t feel they need it?

Let’s turn your statement on its head;
Those same people who abuse their bodies with smoking and sugar still wish to be immunised against something that’s less likely to kill them than smoking or sugar.

Go figure.

What is the real reason they wont get vaccinated?

I know a few personally, they have various reasons, the most stupid one is they wont be TOLD what to do.
Some have read the conspiracy theories online and believe them.
Someone else has said they dont believe in vaccinations, yet their kids have had everyone of the recommended ones and the parent didn't think twice..

eddie wrote:Or perhaps it’s just some people don’t feel they need it?

Let’s turn your statement on its head;
Those same people who abuse their bodies with smoking and sugar still wish to be immunised against something that’s less likely to kill them than smoking or sugar.

Go figure.

Maybe they don't need it, there are other people though that need the protection of others being vaccinated, were is their community conscience?
Look at Mary Mallon who refused to stop working as a cook and managed to infect 53 people with typhoid three of whom died, I think she was only stopped by legal intervention.

When mandatory vaccinations come in on Nov 11th for care workers who work in care homes, I hope it will become the norm for other places of work to insist on people being double jabbed too.

No one can insist a person be vaccinated, but they should have the right to choose whether they work for them or not.

And if anyone doesn't agree with that and feels it's taking away their human right to work without hassle....one of the most frequent reasons given for not being immunised is that only the vulnerable are dying of Covid (not true but still) so does that mean the vulnerable are limited to work in safely in places where all the people have been double jabbed?

eddie wrote:Or perhaps it’s just some people don’t feel they need it?

Let’s turn your statement on its head;
Those same people who abuse their bodies with smoking and sugar still wish to be immunised against something that’s less likely to kill them than smoking or sugar.

Go figure.

Isn't the point, they are abusing their own bodies, eating sugar isn't killing anyone else but themselves, smoking is now banned in public places so others dont have to inhale the fumes.

eddie wrote:Or perhaps it’s just some people don’t feel they need it?

But it's not being done for them, anyway.  Some people need immunization, but the real reason it's a community mandate is it's a community infection.  If you don't get the shots for your own wellness; you still must get them because you are a carrier.

The it's my right argument doesn't deal with the communal aspect of the disease.  If you take a gun and fire it into a crowd, you can't simply say "I was just firing my gun...it's my right".  You'll be charged for what you do to the other people.  Personal rights deal with your person.  The minute you are affecting other people, it's no longer personal.

All of law is based upon the welfare of the community.  It's elementary.

Original Quill wrote:

eddie wrote:Or perhaps it’s just some people don’t feel they need it?

But it's not being done for them, anyway.  Some people need immunization, but the real reason it's a community mandate is it's a community infection.  If you don't get the shots for your own wellness; you still must get them because you are a carrier.

The it's my right argument doesn't deal with the communal aspect of the disease.  If you take a gun and fire it into a crowd, you can't simply say "I was just firing my gun...it's my right".  You'll be charged for what you do to the other people.  Personal rights deal with your person.  The minute you are affecting other people, it's no longer personal.

All of law is based upon the welfare of the community.  It's elementary.

You don't have a right to fire a gun. Your comparison would be like if a knowingly infected person went out and mixed with the public. That's different than refusing to be vaccinated.

At that point, one can make the argument that they are knowingly and actively putting people in harms way.

Firing a gun analogy doesn't really work, but I get Quills point.

If you have any infectious illness, say flu, and you carry on working and travelling in public, you are risking other people catching your infection.
I caught the norovirus January of last year, I have never been so ill in my life, someone was out and about spreading it.

The coronavirus is even more infectious because 2 out of 3 people dont have symptoms, so they are unaware they are infecting others.

Syl wrote:Firing a gun analogy doesn't really work, but I get Quills point.

If you have any infectious illness, say flu, and you carry on working and travelling in public, you are risking other people catching your infection.
I caught the norovirus January of last year, I have never been so ill in my life, someone was out and about spreading it.

The coronavirus is even more infectious because 2 out of 3 people dont have symptoms, so they are unaware they are infecting others.

Yeah, going out infected is different than refusing a shot that will decrease the odds of you getting infected.

Maddog wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

But it's not being done for them, anyway. Some people need immunization, but the real reason it's a community mandate is it's a community infection. If you don't get the shots for your own wellness; you still must get them because you are a carrier.

The it's my right argument doesn't deal with the communal aspect of the disease. If you take a gun and fire it into a crowd, you can't simply say "I was just firing my gun...it's my right". You'll be charged for what you do to the other people. Personal rights deal with your person. The minute you are affecting other people, it's no longer personal.

All of law is based upon the welfare of the community. It's elementary.

You don't have a right to fire a gun. Your comparison would be like if a knowingly infected person went out and mixed with the public. That's different than refusing to be vaccinated.

At that point, one can make the argument that they are knowingly and actively putting people in harms way.

You don't have a right to fire a gun, and you don't have a right to go out and infect other people. You're right on those points.

Where you, and others go wrong is on the word "knowingly". We know, here and now, that the gun analogy is correct for this pandemic. No one can seriously argue that they don't know that they are infecting and killing other people. To refuse to be vaccinated is to pull the trigger on the pandemic for many, many other people. It's a crime!

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:

You don't have a right to fire a gun. Your comparison would be like if a knowingly infected person went out and mixed with the public. That's different than refusing to be vaccinated.

At that point, one can make the argument that they are knowingly and actively putting people in harms way.

You don't have a right to fire a gun, and you don't have a right to go out and infect other people.  You're right on those points.

Where you, and others go wrong is on the word "knowingly".  We know, here and now, that the gun analogy is correct for this pandemic.  No one can seriously argue that they don't know that they are infecting and killing other people.  To refuse to be vaccinated is to pull the trigger on the pandemic for many, many other people.  It's a crime!

OK counselor.

Syl wrote:Firing a gun analogy doesn't really work, but I get Quills point.

If you have any infectious illness, say flu, and you carry on working and travelling in public, you are risking other people catching your infection.
I caught the norovirus January of last year, I have never been so ill in my life, someone was out and about spreading it.

The coronavirus is even more infectious because 2 out of 3 people dont have symptoms, so they are unaware they are infecting others.

You are wrong. This isn't any infectious illness. This is a pandemic that has killed, in the US, nearly three/quarters of a million people. That's a demonstrated fact.

To go out without being vaccinated is precisely to pull the trigger on a crowd of that many people.

Original Quill wrote:

Syl wrote:Firing a gun analogy doesn't really work, but I get Quills point.

If you have any infectious illness, say flu, and you carry on working and travelling in public, you are risking other people catching your infection.
I caught the norovirus January of last year, I have never been so ill in my life, someone was out and about spreading it.

The coronavirus is even more infectious because 2 out of 3 people dont have symptoms, so they are unaware they are infecting others.

You are wrong.  This isn't any infectious illness.  This is a pandemic that has killed, in the US, nearly three/quarters of a million people.  That's a demonstrated fact.

To go out without being vaccinated is precisely to pull the trigger on a crowd of that many people.

One big difference, it's illegal to fire a gun into a crowd of people, it's not illegal to walk around unvaccinated
We both agree it's selfish and potentially dangerous for others, but it's still not the same as deliberately trying to kill someone..