How much does a single person need to live on after housing costs are paid?

First topic message reminder :

All over the place I keep hearing that government cuts are leaving people starving and unable to manage - but the one thing nobody who makes these statements will tell me is how much they think the government should be paying people.

So you have a single unemployed person who is able to work. How much money do they need to survive after housing costs such as rent/mortgage have been covered. I would also like to know how you think this figure should be worked out.

sphinx wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:
OK - JSA or incapacity benefit or whatever it's called these days? I think JSA is less isn't it?

JSA is £71 and odd pence
ESA starts at £99 and odd pence but may be more depending on how sick or disabled a person is.

JSA/ESA is the same rate @ £71.70 for over 25's but I think ESA goes up to the higher rate you mention for those on longer term sick, (and then they may also qualify for other incapacity related benefits too).

JSA RATES 2013
Single (under 25) £56.80
Single (25 or over) £71.70
Couples (both aged 18 or over) £112.55
Lone parent (18 or over) £71.70
Lone parent (under 18) £56.80

https://www.gov.uk/jobseekers-allowance/what-youll-get



This is just the 'spendable' cash given weekly (paid fortnightly).

Other rent and council tax is also paid for through housing benefit and council tax benefit which is separate claim, although some may have to pay a little bit towards their council tax per year (5-10% of total yearly CT bill), and some living in housing association properties may also have a liability for service charges (maybe £5 per week).



Gas and electricity is about £10-15 per week for single person in one bed flat.

People are expected to have telephone and internet @ £5-10 per week.

Travelling - back and forth to job centre, shops, interviews, job searching etc - Weekly bus pass @ £15 per week.



Whatever is left has to cover food, toiletries (soap, shampoo, razor blades, washing powder, cleaning products, bin bags, other household equipment etc), clothes, shoes.


Not a lot of money left to go round on these basic essentials, but do-able for a short time if necessary.


But if normally working and have other overheads, loans, cards, HP, car, insurance etc, and then suddenly find yourself out of work and claiming JSA, there is no way of paying these things, resulting in immediate default and credit rating quickly fucked up for the long term.

Tommy Monk wrote:

sphinx wrote:
JSA is £71 and odd pence
ESA starts at £99 and odd pence but may be more depending on how sick or disabled a person is.

JSA/ESA is the same rate @ £71.70 for over 25's but I think ESA goes up to the higher rate you mention for those on longer term sick, (and then they may also qualify for other incapacity related benefits too).

JSA RATES 2013
Single (under 25) £56.80
Single (25 or over) £71.70
Couples (both aged 18 or over) £112.55
Lone parent (18 or over) £71.70
Lone parent (under 18) £56.80

https://www.gov.uk/jobseekers-allowance/what-youll-get



This is just the 'spendable' cash given weekly (paid fortnightly).

Other rent and council tax is also paid for through housing benefit and council tax benefit which is separate claim, although some may have to pay a little bit towards their council tax per year (5-10% of total yearly CT bill), and some living in housing association properties may also have a liability for service charges (maybe £5 per week).



Gas and electricity is about £10-15 per week for single person in one bed flat.

People are expected to have telephone and internet @ £5-10 per week.

Travelling - back and forth to job centre, shops, interviews, job searching etc - Weekly bus pass @ £15 per week.



Whatever is left has to cover food, toiletries (soap, shampoo, razor blades, washing powder, cleaning products, bin bags, other household equipment etc), clothes, shoes.


Not a lot of money left to go round on these basic essentials, but do-able for a short time if necessary.


But if normally working and have other overheads, loans, cards, HP, car, insurance etc, and then suddenly find yourself out of work and claiming JSA, there is no way of paying these things, resulting in immediate default and credit rating quickly fucked up for the long term.

It's best not to have loans IMO, and it's best to save up whilst one is working so that these things can be paid for for a while. A person who loses their job is likely to get contribution-based JSA so savings won't affect it for a while.

Or have some sort of insurance - long term sick etc.

That's the kind of thing workers need to fork out for.

I remember a few years back all the people saying they'd had £30,000 loans completely wiped out or halved by the lenders.

Somebody has to pay, I assure you, and it will be those who are sensible, frugal whatever you call it.

BigAndy9 wrote:Or have some sort of insurance - long term sick etc.

That's the kind of thing workers need to fork out for.

I remember a few years back all the people saying they'd had £30,000 loans completely wiped out or halved by the lenders.

Somebody has to pay, I assure you, and it will be those who are sensible, frugal whatever you call it.

They would have to suspend the insurance for a while.

Raggamuffin wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:Or have some sort of insurance - long term sick etc.

That's the kind of thing workers need to fork out for.

I remember a few years back all the people saying they'd had £30,000 loans completely wiped out or halved by the lenders.

Somebody has to pay, I assure you, and it will be those who are sensible, frugal whatever you call it.

They would have to suspend the insurance for a while.

Insurance for what?

What you talking about, Willis?

BigAndy9 wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

They would have to suspend the insurance for a while.

Insurance for what?

What you talking about, Willis?

The insurance you just mentioned.

Oh I see. They wouldn't get the benefit from long-term sickness insurance if they lost their job unless it was through ill health.

Actually, I do know someone who had such insurance, and she had to be off sick for ages, so it was very useful for her.

Perhaps its because it has all be said before and we are sick to death of repeating ourselves.

Sassy wrote:Perhaps its because it has all be said before and we are sick to death of repeating ourselves.

What is because of that?

Sassy wrote:Perhaps its because it has all be said before and we are sick to death of repeating ourselves.

Exactly Sass!

  

they need a whip across their backs while they turn big rocks into little ones and no more than three meals a day until they get off their lazy asses and get a job

skivvying whore dogs

smelly_bandit wrote:they need a whip across their backs while they turn big rocks into little ones and no more than three meals a day until they get off their lazy asses and get a job

skivvying whore dogs

As many meals as that? That's very generous.   

It is best not to have loans, cards, HP etc, but most do when working.
Many working people cannot afford to purchase necessary things when needed without these arrangements.
Also many cannot afford to save as they are living the pay as you go lifestyle, working and paying it all out as they go.
We all pay tax and NI when working towards the system that will hopefully help us get through for the difficult times when we aren't when and if needed.
Peoples personal loans and cards, debts should be frozen when not working and then start paying off again when back in.
Most are still liable for all debts plus interest and other charges, bailiffs and court fees etc regardless.
I was merely highlighting the bad credit angle that can adversely affect people in their future.
But don't let this detract from the OP and the money people on JSA have to survive on.
After paying out listed costs from the £71.70 per week, there is not a lot left to live on.
I am not suggesting that it should be any different.
People not working who could and should be, cannot be allowed to be getting generous handouts of money, otherwise where is the incentive to work at all?
However, the flat rate JSA does not take into account regional differences in commodity or travelling costs or other individual specific requirements, For example, somebody living in a rural area may be faced with a limited supply of and more expensive food cost bill as well as less available and more expensive public transport but still get the same. Also, given that most peoples standard outlay for costs (gas elec water bus pass toiletries household stuff phone internet etc) would be much the same, that leaves the amount left for food being much the same too. But are everyone's food and nutritional requirements the same too?
An average build 6ft 3in bloke would eat (and need to eat) considerably more than a 5ft 3in bloke of lesser build, and again probably more than a woman of the same height and build.
With maybe only the same £20 a week left for food each per week, where is the fairness in that???

Tommy Monk wrote:Many working people cannot afford to purchase necessary things when needed without these arrangements.
Also many cannot afford to save as they are living the pay as you go lifestyle, working and paying it all out as they go.
We all pay tax and NI when working towards the system that will hopefully help us get through for the difficult times when we aren't when and if needed.
Peoples personal loans and cards, debts should be frozen when not working and then start paying off again when back in.

I think that's a great idea

Obviously there would need to timeframes set as it would be impractical longer term.  Perhaps six months to a year to allow time to get back on your feet.  Of course it would be the lenders footing the bill but at least they'd have the possibility of the debt being repaid.

Many people can't afford to save and live from month to month, especially now as the downturn in the economy has continued for a considerable period