How much does a single person need to live on after housing costs are paid?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:52 pm

All over the place I keep hearing that government cuts are leaving people starving and unable to manage - but the one thing nobody who makes these statements will tell me is how much they think the government should be paying people.

So you have a single unemployed person who is able to work. How much money do they need to survive after housing costs such as rent/mortgage have been covered. I would also like to know how you think this figure should be worked out.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:55 pm

sphinx wrote:All over the place I keep hearing that government cuts are leaving people starving and unable to manage - but the one thing nobody who makes these statements will tell me is how much they think the government should be paying people.

So you have a single unemployed person who is able to work. How much money do they need to survive after housing costs such as rent/mortgage have been covered. I would also like to know how you think this figure should be worked out.

thats a very good question... Smile

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:02 pm

The cost of utilities probably depends on whether they live on their own or not. It used to be that single people on the dole usually shared with others, but people on benefits seem to think they're entitled to a flat or house all to themselves these days.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:05 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:The cost of utilities probably depends on whether they live on their own or not. It used to be that single people on the dole usually shared with others, but people on benefits seem to think they're entitled to a flat or house all to themselves these days.

it is a valid point if you were working and couldn't afford to run the house you would have to give it up, but we cannot let people starve while they find work or can we?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:09 pm

Yeah so how about some figures - or proposals for working figures out.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:12 pm

sphinx wrote:Yeah so how about some figures - or proposals for working figures out.

its very difficult, i suppose it would have to vary from place to place round the country too..

below minimum wage, workers should be better off..

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:13 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:The cost of utilities probably depends on whether they live on their own or not. It used to be that single people on the dole usually shared with others, but people on benefits seem to think they're entitled to a flat or house all to themselves these days.

It's all some single people can get to live it's either a flat or the streets .

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:15 pm

heavenly father wrote:
sphinx wrote:Yeah so how about some figures - or proposals for working figures out.

its very difficult, i suppose it would have to vary from place to place round the country too..

below minimum wage, workers should be better off..

Minimum wage is a red herring because housing costs are already taken care of.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:15 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:The cost of utilities probably depends on whether they live on their own or not. It used to be that single people on the dole usually shared with others, but people on benefits seem to think they're entitled to a flat or house all to themselves these days.

It's all some single people can get to live it's either a flat or the streets .

So you are claiming there is no form of accommodation between no home at all and an entire self contained property?

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:16 pm

sphinx wrote:Yeah so how about some figures - or proposals for working figures out.

I'm hoping that someone else will come up with some actual figures. Laughing

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:17 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:The cost of utilities probably depends on whether they live on their own or not. It used to be that single people on the dole usually shared with others, but people on benefits seem to think they're entitled to a flat or house all to themselves these days.

It's all some single people can get to live it's either a flat or the streets .

In other threads, some people have said that it's nearly impossible to get a one-bedroom place.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:17 pm

sphinx wrote:
heavenly father wrote:

its very difficult, i suppose it would have to vary from place to place round the country too..

below minimum wage, workers should be better off..

Minimum wage is a red herring because housing costs are already taken care of.

not if you give them a living wage and then they pay everything out as if working..

it might even teach some better money handling..

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:17 pm

I did say to you sphinx in another thread that some jobs require you to have a car a push bike isn't an option, so on your expenditure you said a single person would have around 20-25 quid a week for other things after food and utilities, you said home insurance wasn't necessary, but if the flat is mortgaged then insurance (bricks & mortar) is required by the mortgage company , so thats another £ 3-4 a week , then car insurance £10 a week depending how long the single person has held a licence .

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:18 pm

heavenly father wrote:
sphinx wrote:Yeah so how about some figures - or proposals for working figures out.

its very difficult, i suppose it would have to vary from place to place round the country too..

below minimum wage, workers should be better off..

It wouldn't really vary as the housing costs are the main thing which would differ, and they're not included in this.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:18 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:Yeah so how about some figures - or proposals for working figures out.

I'm hoping that someone else will come up with some actual figures.

It is why I asked the question - some will say people on benefits are starving, others will say people on benefits get too much but actual figures and how they are worked out are never provided.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:19 pm

Are we talking about people on JSA or whatever, rather than people in jobs?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:19 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Maine coon lover wrote:

It's all some single people can get to live it's either a flat or the streets .

In other threads, some people have said that it's nearly impossible to get a one-bedroom place.

No they say it is nearly impossible to get a one bedroom council or housing association place.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:20 pm

heavenly father wrote:
sphinx wrote:

Minimum wage is a red herring because housing costs are already taken care of.

not if you give them a living wage and then they pay everything out as if working..

it might even teach some better money handling..

The government is not responsible for wages.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:20 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

In other threads, some people have said that it's nearly impossible to get a one-bedroom place.

No they say it is nearly impossible to get a one bedroom council or housing association place.

I suggested they could get a private rental, and they said the same thing.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:22 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:I did say to you sphinx in another thread that some jobs require you to have a car a push bike isn't an option, so on your expenditure you said a single person would have around 20-25 quid a week for other things after food and utilities, you said home insurance wasn't necessary, but if the flat is mortgaged then insurance (bricks & mortar) is required by the mortgage company , so thats another £ 3-4 a week , then car insurance £10 a week depending how long the single person has held a licence .

The only jobs that require you to have a car are either self employed or include expenses. They are exceedingly rare.

It is far more common for jobs to require a driving licence - having a driving licence is not the same as having a car.

I am talking about how much the government should provide people unable to work.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:24 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:Are we talking about people on JSA or whatever, rather than people in jobs?

Yes sorry I did not make that clear - I am talking about how much the government should be required to pay people who are unemployed but able to work.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:24 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

No they say it is nearly impossible to get a one bedroom council or housing association place.

I suggested they could get a private rental, and they said the same thing.

not many private landlords will let single unemployed rent their properties .

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:24 pm

sphinx wrote:
Maine coon lover wrote:I did say to you sphinx in another thread that some jobs require you to have a car a push bike isn't an option, so on your expenditure you said a single person would have around 20-25 quid a week for other things after food and utilities, you said home insurance wasn't necessary, but if the flat is mortgaged then insurance (bricks & mortar) is required by the mortgage company , so thats another £ 3-4 a week , then car insurance £10 a week depending how long the single person has held a licence .

The only jobs that require you to have a car are either self employed or include expenses. They are exceedingly rare.

It is far more common for jobs to require a driving licence - having a driving licence is not the same as having a car.

I am talking about how much the government should provide people unable to work.

not at all if you have to commute more than a few miles a car is pretty essential...

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:26 pm

also most councils do not give full council tax benefit now unless you have a child under 5, so nearly all those on benefits have to pay £8 a month council tax so that's another £2 out of the money left over a wekk

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:26 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

No they say it is nearly impossible to get a one bedroom council or housing association place.

I suggested they could get a private rental, and they said the same thing.

They may be talking about private rents within benefit limits - but even there I suspect there is a large element of "within benefit limits in a place I would actually want to live.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:27 pm

sphinx wrote:
Maine coon lover wrote:I did say to you sphinx in another thread that some jobs require you to have a car a push bike isn't an option, so on your expenditure you said a single person would have around 20-25 quid a week for other things after food and utilities, you said home insurance wasn't necessary, but if the flat is mortgaged then insurance (bricks & mortar) is required by the mortgage company , so thats another £ 3-4 a week , then car insurance £10 a week depending how long the single person has held a licence .

The only jobs that require you to have a car are either self employed or include expenses. They are exceedingly rare.

It is far more common for jobs to require a driving licence - having a driving licence is not the same as having a car.

I am talking about how much the government should provide people unable to work.

no they do not , a lot of jobs are delivery jobs such as home shopping deliveries which require your own car .

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:28 pm

Yeah we have lots of people saying how much things cost and why this that and the other are impossible it is getting away from the question.
How much money should the government be expected to pay a single person able to work after their housing costs are covered.

Give me a figure of what you want the government to pay and why.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:29 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:Are we talking about people on JSA or whatever, rather than people in jobs?

Yes sorry I did not make that clear - I am talking about how much the government should be required to pay people who are unemployed but able to work.

OK - JSA or incapacity benefit or whatever it's called these days? I think JSA is less isn't it?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:30 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:
sphinx wrote:

The only jobs that require you to have a car are either self employed or include expenses. They are exceedingly rare.

It is far more common for jobs to require a driving licence - having a driving licence is not the same as having a car.

I am talking about how much the government should provide people unable to work.

no they do not , a lot of jobs are delivery jobs such as home shopping deliveries which require your own car .

They are self employed (although you may need to look at the small print)

But anyway are you saying the government should pay enough in benefits to allow the single unemployed person to run a car?

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:30 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

I suggested they could get a private rental, and they said the same thing.

not many private landlords will let single unemployed rent their properties .

In that case, where do the single unemployed people live?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:31 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

Yes sorry I did not make that clear - I am talking about how much the government should be required to pay people who are unemployed but able to work.

OK - JSA or incapacity benefit or whatever it's called these days? I think JSA is less isn't it?

JSA is £71 and odd pence

ESA starts at £99 and odd pence but may be more depending on how sick or disabled a person is.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:31 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

I suggested they could get a private rental, and they said the same thing.

They may be talking about private rents within benefit limits - but even there I suspect there is a large element of "within benefit limits in a place I would actually want to live.

All I'm saying is that it might be cheaper re utilities to share with others. Of course, they could just heat one or two rooms.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:32 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

OK - JSA or incapacity benefit or whatever it's called these days? I think JSA is less isn't it?

JSA is £71 and odd pence

ESA starts at £99 and odd pence but may be more depending on how sick or disabled a person is.

Perhaps we could stick to JSA for now then.

What do you reckon a single person needs to spend on food?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:33 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

OK - JSA or incapacity benefit or whatever it's called these days? I think JSA is less isn't it?

JSA is £71 and odd pence

ESA starts at £99 and odd pence but may be more depending on how sick or disabled a person is.

wow if we shot all the disabled and unemployed the country would be very wealthy over night.. Shocked

joking...

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:34 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

They may be talking about private rents within benefit limits - but even there I suspect there is a large element of "within benefit limits in a place I would actually want to live.

All I'm saying is that it might be cheaper re utilities to share with others. Of course, they could just heat one or two rooms.

Of course it is cheaper to share. Or reduce heating.

So how much money should be provided?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:35 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

JSA is £71 and odd pence

ESA starts at £99 and odd pence but may be more depending on how sick or disabled a person is.

Perhaps we could stick to JSA for now then.

What do you reckon a single person needs to spend on food?

That is what I am asking

How much is needed for food? What else should be covered? How much will this be? How much will it be in total?

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:35 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

All I'm saying is that it might be cheaper re utilities to share with others. Of course, they could just heat one or two rooms.

Of course it is cheaper to share. Or reduce heating.

So how much money should be provided?

Everyone seems reluctant to come up with some figures, so I'll start.

How about £20 per week for food?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:37 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

Of course it is cheaper to share. Or reduce heating.

So how much money should be provided?

Everyone seems reluctant to come up with some figures, so I'll start.

How about £20 per week for food?

I am comfortable with that - unfortunately as of yet we do not have anyone on the thread from the "government cuts are killing people brigade" - and I want to hear from them how much they think the government should be paying.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:41 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Everyone seems reluctant to come up with some figures, so I'll start.

How about £20 per week for food?

I am comfortable with that - unfortunately as of yet we do not have anyone on the thread from the "government cuts are killing people brigade" - and I want to hear from them how much they think the government should be paying.

even if it is causing them hardship they will survive but they shouldn't have to survive people should have a good standard of living .

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:44 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Everyone seems reluctant to come up with some figures, so I'll start.

How about £20 per week for food?

I am comfortable with that - unfortunately as of yet we do not have anyone on the thread from the "government cuts are killing people brigade" - and I want to hear from them how much they think the government should be paying.

Re utilities, I'm just guessing but I'm going to say £25 per week?

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:46 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:
sphinx wrote:

I am comfortable with that - unfortunately as of yet we do not have anyone on the thread from the "government cuts are killing people brigade" - and I want to hear from them how much they think the government should be paying.

even if it is causing them hardship they will survive but they shouldn't have to survive people should have a good standard of living .

Well that's why people go to work - to earn money to have a good standard of living. If they don't go to work, they can't expect luxuries unless they are financially independent.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:47 pm

Maine coon lover wrote:
sphinx wrote:

I am comfortable with that - unfortunately as of yet we do not have anyone on the thread from the "government cuts are killing people brigade" - and I want to hear from them how much they think the government should be paying.

even if it is causing them hardship they will survive but they shouldn't have to survive people should have a good standard of living .

What standard of living should government money provide? And how much in figures does that mean for each person?

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:49 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

I am comfortable with that - unfortunately as of yet we do not have anyone on the thread from the "government cuts are killing people brigade" - and I want to hear from them how much they think the government should be paying.

Re utilities, I'm just guessing but I'm going to say £25 per week?

If I tell you I have a 3 bed semi with 4 people living in it and that total utilities including central heating for the whole house comes out at £30 a week averaged over summer and winter would that help?

by gerber Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:49 pm

1 Chicken roasted on Sunday, trimmed and cold cuts Monday, stocked Tuesday............. Chicken and mushroom pie, Risotto Wednesday, homemade Minestrone soup Thursday......

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:50 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Re utilities, I'm just guessing but I'm going to say £25 per week?

If I tell you I have a 3 bed semi with 4 people living in it and that total utilities including central heating for the whole house comes out at £30 a week averaged over summer and winter would that help?

Indeed it does. About £15 a week then?

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:59 pm

Well nobody has disagreed yet. Razz

So they have a roof over their head, food, warmth, and water, and they've spent £35 so far.

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:00 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
sphinx wrote:

If I tell you I have a 3 bed semi with 4 people living in it and that total utilities including central heating for the whole house comes out at £30 a week averaged over summer and winter would that help?

Indeed it does. About £15 a week then?

LOL I thought I was the one asking. You do have to take variances into account - my house got new windows last summer and its made a big difference to heating bills. There are a lot of attic bedsits out there - which are badly insulated, single glazed and only have electric for heating.

There is also the question of what level of comfort for what hours - if a person is supposed to be on JSA is it reasonable to expect them to be out of the home for working hours even if it is to look for work?

Incidentally I do not have the answers - that is why I am asking others. I am rather more interested in getting some of the people saying the government cuts are unacceptable to tell us what they think people should get because I want to understand their thinking more.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 7:03 pm

sphinx wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Indeed it does. About £15 a week then?

LOL I thought I was the one asking. You do have to take variances into account - my house got new windows last summer and its made a big difference to heating bills. There are a lot of attic bedsits out there - which are badly insulated, single glazed and only have electric for heating.

There is also the question of what level of comfort for what hours - if a person is supposed to be on JSA is it reasonable to expect them to be out of the home for working hours even if it is to look for work?

Incidentally I do not have the answers - that is why I am asking others. I am rather more interested in getting some of the people saying the government cuts are unacceptable to tell us what they think people should get because I want to understand their thinking more.

Yes, there's the issue of what they do all day and whether they have to be at home or not. They could of course do voluntary work which would take them out of the house or bedsit or whatever.

by Raggamuffin Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:25 pm

Well I don't know - I thought some people would leap into this thread to contradict the figures, but nothing so far. ::dunno::

by Guest Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:25 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:Well I don't know - I thought some people would leap into this thread to contradict the figures, but nothing so far. ::dunno::

I think the problem is that it's all so arbitrary, it must change from place to place in the country as some places are so much more expensive to live in, it has to be enough money to live on but not enough that finding a job isn't necessary or wanted. Smile

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