Christian parents take their son, six, out of Church of England primary school and plan to sue because a male classmate is allowed to wear a dress

A Christian couple who took their son out of a Church of England primary because a boy in his class was allowed to wear a dress are planning to sue the school. Nigel Rowe, 44, and his wife Sally, 42, said their child had come home 'confused as to why and how a boy was now a girl' after his classmate wore female uniform. The boy also turned up to their son's royal-themed birthday party in April wearing a blue velvet dress - rather than coming dressed as a knight like other children. The couple - who play an active part in school life - say they have a good relationship with the six-year-old's parents.

But they are now set to take the Diocese of Portsmouth to court arguing that it has not respected their rights to raise their children with biblical values. Mr Rowe, who lives on the Isle of Wight, told The Sunday Times: 'We believe it is wrong to encourage very young children to embrace transgenderism. Boys are boys and girls are girls.

'Gender dysphoria is something we as Christians need to address with love and compassion, but not in the sphere of a primary school environment.'

The Rowes' son will now be schooled at home along with his older brother who they took out of the same school last year after a boy in his class started wearing female clothing.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4869682/Christian-parents-sue-school-boy-wearing-dress.html#ixzz4sHwMrsa6
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Good on them!!!



All parents should do the same!!!



Then maybe the PC dipshits in charge will start to realise that the tail does not wag the dog...

Personally, i think if a young boy wants to wear a dress, his parents should disuade him not encourage him.

But the parents who have taken their own child out of school because another boy in the class is wearing a dress are totally over reacting.
They should have simply explained to their child that the boy hadnt changed into a girl, he was still a boy who was wearing a dress.

No... the situation shouldn't arise in the first place... not through 'dissuasion'... but by enforcement...!



The tail does not wag the dog!

I do know if my own son had wanted to wear a dress i wouldnt have allowed it.
Kids want to please, if they do pick out something totally unsuitable its not hard to encourage them to wear something more appropriate.

Are you suggesting that this kid may have been trying to please his parents by them encouraging kid to wear dress...?


Maybe a big part of problem is parents who maybe wanted a girl but got a boy, and vica versa, have inflicted this confusion onto child by trying to bring them up in a way that is opposite to their natural biological sex identity...?

Tommy Monk wrote:Are you suggesting that this kid may have been trying to please his parents by them encouraging kid to wear dress...?


Maybe a big part of problem is parents who maybe wanted a girl but got a boy, and vica versa, have inflicted this confusion onto child by trying to bring them up in a way that is opposite to their natural biological sex identity...?

No i didnt mean that Tommy. I mean if a child picks out something ridiculous to wear, the parent can easilly persuade him to wear something more suitable.
Basically kids want to please, so compliment him on his choice of outfit....the one you have suggested, and he will be happy.

If a parent lets the kid wear to school whatever he chooses, be it a dress, a fairy outfit,, or a kermit the frog get up... they are not imo parenting properly.

Yes I see perfectly what youre saying... I was saying that maybe this kids parents were actually encouraging the kid to wear dress... and the kid maybe just wanted to please the parent...

If parents dislike a school's ethos or rules then they are free to take their child elsewhere or home.

I'd much rather have my child attend a school that is welcoming to all children, than sitting in judgement on them.

A boy goes to School wearing a Girls dress, Kids are cruel, guess what will happen?

nicko wrote:A boy goes to School wearing a Girls dress,     Kids are cruel,   guess what will happen?

the parents of the kid in pants cry and threaten to sue, it says so in the OP

And this is why we need gender neutral clothes, and to get rid of the dumb ideas around dresses are for girls etc

Dumb fucks like these parents that want to sue because their child came home confused by a boy in a dress, they should be investigated for child abuse since they obviously can't raise their son if 'being confused' is enough to make them go off their tree.

Religious fucktards can all be shipped to Syria if they want to live under a theocracy.

No Veya, the other kids will bully him and "take the piss" !

Somehow, I reckon that confused kid's parents will have a hard time putting together a viable lawsuit...

What, exactly, do they think they're going to sue the school for  ???            

Okay. Whilst I do not share the religious aspect concern of the parents. I certainly do if their children are confused. Of which is fundamentally the fault of the school. (If what they parents claim is true) The second aspect is whether this is just a boy feeling comfortable in girls and boys clothes. Or if he suffers from Gender dysphoria. Or whether this is being engineered by that child's parents in what clothes they are buying the child.. To confuse children at this age of their gender identities is inherently wrong and is creating more problems than its sets out to resolve.

Whilst there is no doubt some children suffer from Gender dysphoria, its not generally diagnosed in young children. Where they should receive all the support they need. I think some parents are taking the view their children suffer the condition, mistaking that a boy may want to wear a dress or where a girl is a Tomboy. It does not mean they do suffer with Gender dysphoria and thus parents can make the problem far worse.

I also believe enforcing gender neutral clothing within children. Is not helping this situation, but leading the confusion of more children over their gender identity. Which without gender neutral clothing. Many children would not have become confused and this confusion may not have arisen. Especially as there has been a mass increase of children referred for Gender dysphoria. Thus whilst gender neutral clothes is essentially important for the future. Its really in its infancy and confusing children on this. Will  only confuse them on their biological gender.

Here is a link to show the rise in referrals.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/news/11519603/Rise-in-child-transgender-referrals.html

So I certainly do not back the religious aspect of their argument, but I would also pull my child out of school, if this has as seen led to confusion within my own children and that the school had done nothing to tackle this. I mean this boy is one day coming to school in boys clothes and then others in dresses. Now he may not even suffer with Gender dysphoria and may simple like wearing many forms off dress. Many kids like to dress up, but many grow out of this.

Hence Syl has a point if parents are encouraging this, even more so when that child goes to school. Children of this age simple cannot understand all this and it will lead to much confusion. Whilst in the future it will be good if clothes are gender neutral. That is not the case now and would take years for that to normalize. So to me, many are in the wrong here. The school, the parents who's child dresses in both boy and girl clothes to school and the Christian parents for invoking religious crap and suing.

The child's best interest is most important here. Not the confusion of other children and this is not certainly the age group for children to really come to grips with gender identity politics or have a proper understanding of Gender dysphoria.

Parents encouraging a male child to wear a dress is wrong. But if it's the child's choice the so what? Let them.

Don't pander to bullies by stopping them based on what other kids will say.

One boy wearing a dress will not confuse anyone, since every other boy will be dressed in boys clothes.

In my school there was one boy who wore very gothy clothes, including black nail polish and the like. No one followed suit, kids often don't want to stand out or seem different. If one does, by wearing a dress, don't bloody risk damaging their confidence by slamming them with it being 'wrong' based on arbitrary gender standards...

The parents taking their kid out are being drama queens. Pure and simple.

Eilzel wrote:Parents encouraging a male child to wear a dress is wrong. But if it's the child's choice the so what? Let them.

Don't pander to bullies by stopping them based on what other kids will say.

One boy wearing a dress will not confuse anyone, since every other boy will be dressed in boys clothes.

In my school there was one boy who wore very gothy clothes, including black nail polish and the like. No one followed suit, kids often don't want to stand out or seem different. If one does, by wearing a dress, don't bloody risk damaging their confidence by slamming them with it being 'wrong' based on arbitrary gender standards...

The parents taking their kid out are being drama queens. Pure and simple.

But it is other children being confused and this is not one isolated incident.

We are not talking about teens, who some dress up as goths but 6 year old children as Goths?

Behave

To invoke a claim of bullying is pure leftist trash talk.

Its not about the boy wearing continued dresses, its the fact one day he wears clothes associated with boys and other days dresses. To say this does not confuse children of 6, when it most bloody well does, is short sighted ignorance. As you are giving no care due or consideration to the fact his child was confused.

The fact is there is gender differences and to engineer a view, we are gender neutral is enforcing a concept and not something biological.

I'm not saying we should enforce or even encourage gender neutrality. I'm saying if a boy wants to wear a dress on Monday and shirt and pants on Tuesday then let him.

Eilzel wrote:I'm not saying we should enforce or even encourage gender neutrality. I'm saying if a boy wants to wear a dress on Monday and shirt and pants on Tuesday then let him.

But is it him doing so, or parents encouraging such a view, simple as the boy may like dolls

You see you never question, how and why a situation has happened. The very fact more and more children are being refereed for Gender dysphoria at such a young age. Where it cannot be properly diagnosed. Proves more than anything that confusion is setting into the mindset of children. To ignore the fact the other child is confused to say effectively tough to that child. Is setting something up unequal. The school is not dealing with the issue of confusion, and making it worse. When it should be helping children to understand.

We are not at a time where clothes are gender neutral for children to understand and a school should not be a testing ground for this. Until we have developed ways to help ensure children are not left confused over gender.

What you are doing is effectively saying is that the confused child is of no importance here.

That is wrong on every level

That is not what I'm saying at all, and you know it.

Again, I repeat, I do not think parents should encourage boys wearing dresses.

However, when it comes to 'the school' as you say, what exactly should they say to the boy that wouldn't amount to saying, 'boys wearing dresses is wrong'?

PS: did you really give me a red for stating my opinion?

Eilzel wrote:That is not what I'm saying at all, and you know it.

Again, I repeat, I do not think parents should encourage boys wearing dresses.

However, when it comes to 'the school' as you say, what exactly should they say to the boy that wouldn't amount to saying, 'boys wearing dresses is wrong'?

PS: did you really give me a red for stating my opinion?

Yes i did, give you a red and happy to admit with your poor invoked claim on bullying.

As to the school, I made no view on the school saying the boy could not wear dresses, but helping the confusion of the other children. If children are getting confused over this and the parents are adding to this changing the gender clothes of that child on a daily bases. Don't you think those parents are being irresponsible? Clearly this is just a fad for the boy, as he is happy to wear either standard gender clothes. So again we see a school pandering to one pupil, not concerned of the consequences of doing so.

I was talking about other students bullying a boy in a dress you idiot...

And how is the school pandering? They just don't have some archaic rule sayimg "boys are not allowed to wear dresses", which I presume you think they should have.

Eilzel wrote:I was talking about other students bullying a boy in a dress you idiot...

And how is the school pandering? They just don't have some archaic rule sayimg "boys are not allowed to wear dresses", which I presume you think they should have.

What bullying here?

So you came out with leftist trash talk, as the article never came out with any view on bullying and you do not like criticism of being rightful given a red and you call me stupid. lol

So its you been the regressive leftist here.

Then you add more stupidity, failing to see my points, like the pathetic snowflake that you are.

Again I never have stated once for the school to ban boys in dresses.

This is clearly a fad, as the boy wears dresses and boy clothes.

Thus the parents are being irresponsible, as this is confusing other children..

Parents buy the clothes for their children and as seen this is creating far more problems. Maybe they have done this unconsciously, but its irresponsible, due to the age where children simple do not understand.

You have not once given thought to the confused 6 year old child year or offered any solutions. Or that the school has a responsibility to help prevent any confusion over gender.

Lets concentrate for a minute on the parents in the OP, the ones who are attempting to sue the school.

Their concern should be what their own children wear to school surely.

If their children are confused that the other lad is wearing a dress,(and that's understandable in young children) they should simply explain to them that that's up to the boy and his parents what he is allowed to wear, not to laugh at him, and not to worry about it.

One parent cant dictate to others how to dress their children, ultimately if the school allows it, that is that.
The Christian parents have the right to change the school if they feel this is TOO distressing for their own kids, but handled carefully, why should it be?

Didge, if you read the whole bloody thread, you'd see the subject of bullying had come up. I was addressing that. Which anyone but an idiot would have realised.

Syl wrote:Lets concentrate for a minute on the parents in the OP, the ones who are attempting to sue the school.

Their concern should be what their own children wear to school surely.

If their children are confused that the other lad is wearing a dress,(and that's understandable in young children) they should simply explain to them that that's up to the boy and his parents what he is allowed to wear, not to laugh at him, and not to worry about it.

One parent cant dictate to others how to dress their children, ultimately if the school allows it, that is that.
The Christian parents have the right to change the school if they feel this is TOO distressing for their own kids, but handled carefully, why should it be?

Fully agree, very simple solution.

Tommy Monk wrote:Yes I see perfectly what youre saying... I was saying that maybe this kids parents were actually encouraging the kid to wear dress... and the kid maybe just wanted to please the parent...

There was a thread a while ago where a tradesman told a little lad he shouldn't be dressing as a pink fairy.....His mother went to the papers...like they so often do.
This mother had a box of dressing up clothes for the young boy, mostly filled with girly things that his sister used to use. She said she often encouraged him to wear the fairy outfits because he liked them.

Well he would would'nt he if she gushed with praise everytime he donned the fairy wings.

Syl wrote:Lets concentrate for a minute on the parents in the OP, the ones who are attempting to sue the school.

Their concern should be what their own children wear to school surely.

If their children are confused that the other lad is wearing a dress,(and that's understandable in young children) they should simply explain to them that that's up to the boy and his parents what he is allowed to wear, not to laugh at him, and not to worry about it.

One parent cant dictate to others how to dress their children, ultimately if the school allows it, that is that.
The Christian parents have the right to change the school if they feel this is TOO distressing for their own kids, but handled carefully, why should it be?

I am against them suing and their religious beliefs on this.

The reality though Syl, is that more and more children of that age are becoming confused around gender based clothing. When most parents buy and dress their children in gender based clothing for their children. To say you can simple explain this way, simple is not the case when it comes to 6 year olds. They are not an age of understanding on this. Sadly leftists want to enforce a warped view on biological genders. Which they do not think are different, when they are. They do this, from a position of good. As they wish to eradicate inequality, but you will never do it that way. As we are all different no matter male or female. You ensure that people are treated equally under the law, within schools and the work place.

The reality is most male clothing is essentially gender neutral anyway, where as many female manufactured clothing is not. It takes a big leap of faith to think it does. When for decades more women have come to wear men's clothing, but we have not seen the same with men wearing women specific clothing. Mainly as such clothes are manufactured around femininity of the female body. Hence why its unlikely you will see full gender neutral clothing.

As I said in my first post I believe all involved here are in the wrong.

Eilzel wrote:Didge, if you read the whole bloody thread, you'd see the subject of bullying had come up. I was addressing that. Which anyone but an idiot would have realised.

Oh pipe down you poor little snowflake, only nicko mentioned it

Nobody else did and you are just now deflecting away from my points

Either put up or go and have a sulk

It came up, amd that is what I was responding to with that point. Next time I'll spell it out more clearly so that the easily confused among us don't misunderstand things.

(To spell that out btw, I'm referring to you).

Snowflake eh, original, love your little buzzwords, don't you

Eilzel wrote:It came up, amd that is what I was responding to with that point. Next time I'll spell it out more clearly so that the easily confused among us don't misunderstand things.

(To spell that out btw, I'm referring to you).

Snowflake eh, original, love your little buzzwords, don't you

Ah more deflection from the poor little snowflake

Are you going to tackle my points around the confusion of children or are you going to continue to stamp your feet?

You see how you lefties stick to one point in the hope you can avoid the rest.

My views are very clear on bullying

So anything else?

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:Lets concentrate for a minute on the parents in the OP, the ones who are attempting to sue the school.

Their concern should be what their own children wear to school surely.

If their children are confused that the other lad is wearing a dress,(and that's understandable in young children) they should simply explain to them that that's up to the boy and his parents what he is allowed to wear, not to laugh at him, and not to worry about it.

One parent cant dictate to others how to dress their children, ultimately if the school allows it, that is that.
The Christian parents have the right to change the school if they feel this is TOO distressing for their own kids, but handled carefully, why should it be?

I am against them suing and their religious beliefs on this.

The reality though Syl, is that more and more children of that age are becoming confused around gender based clothing. When most parents buy and dress their children in gender based clothing for their children. To say you can simple explain this way, simple is not the case when it comes to 6 year olds. They are not an age of understanding on this. Sadly leftists want to enforce a warped view on biological genders. Which they do not think are different, when they are. They do this, from a position of good. As they wish to eradicate inequality, but you will never do it that way. As we are all different no matter male or female. You ensure that people are treated equally under the law, within schools and the work place.

The reality is most male clothing is essentially gender neutral anyway, where as many female manufactured clothing is not. It takes a big leap of faith to think it does. When for decades more women have come to wear men's clothing, but we have not seen the same with men wearing women specific clothing. Mainly as such clothes are manufactured around femininity of the female body. Hence why its unlikely you will see full gender neutral clothing.

As I said in my first post I believe all involved here are in the wrong.

I think in the vast majority of cases where children are confused is because of the adults around them constantly banging on about 'gender neutrality'...had anyone heard of that term a few years ago?

I am not denying that there is a very small % of young children that are confused, but surely dressing in clothes for the opposite sex at such a young age will confuse them even more, they will after all be the odd one out, because apart from the tree hugging pc craving minority, most people still surely believe that human beings are either male or female....not a weird mix of both.

When the time comes that a child is old enough to know that he/she is in the opposite gender to who they feel they are, specialist help is then required and should obviously be forthcoming.

There are unisex clothes out there for girls and boys that don't have to be drastic....I just think encouraging a child to stand out in totally inappropriate clothes would confuse an already confused young child even more.

When they are older they can dress how they want, I LOVE Eddie Izzard.

What points, didge?

You say the parents are being irresponsible- on what evidence?

The boy wears boys and girls clothes- he isn't confused. If the parents tell him he can't wear dresses that only instills the view that boys wearing dresses is wrong. We know where that can lead.

You claims seeing a boy wearing a dress confuses other children, yet Syl just made it very clear that the way to approach that is so so simple.

So what points?

And if you want civil debate I suggest next time you read properly as to avoid coming to stupid conclusions about what people are saying.

Eilzel wrote:What points, didge?

You say the parents are being irresponsible- on what evidence?

The boy wears boys and girls clothes- he isn't confused. If the parents tell him he can't wear dresses that only instills the view that boys wearing dresses is wrong. We know where that can lead.

You claims seeing a boy wearing a dress confuses other children, yet Syl just made it very clear that the way to approach that is so so simple.

So what points?

And if you want civil debate I suggest next time you read properly as to avoid coming to stupid conclusions about what people are saying.

I believe the parents in the OP are creating a problem for their own children that need not exist.
If they teach a child to be accepting from an early age, and explain that people are all different, that should solve their problems without much bother.

Syl wrote:

Thorin wrote:

I am against them suing and their religious beliefs on this.

The reality though Syl, is that more and more children of that age are becoming confused around gender based clothing. When most parents buy and dress their children in gender based clothing for their children. To say you can simple explain this way, simple is not the case when it comes to 6 year olds. They are not an age of understanding on this. Sadly leftists want to enforce a warped view on biological genders. Which they do not think are different, when they are. They do this, from a position of good. As they wish to eradicate inequality, but you will never do it that way. As we are all different no matter male or female. You ensure that people are treated equally under the law, within schools and the work place.

The reality is most male clothing is essentially gender neutral anyway, where as many female manufactured clothing is not. It takes a big leap of faith to think it does. When for decades more women have come to wear men's clothing, but we have not seen the same with men wearing women specific clothing. Mainly as such clothes are manufactured around femininity of the female body. Hence why its unlikely you will see full gender neutral clothing.

As I said in my first post I believe all involved here are in the wrong.

I think in the vast majority of cases where children are confused is because of the adults around them constantly banging on about 'gender neutrality'...had anyone heard of that term a few years ago?

Thorin wrote:On that I agree and its completely confusing children, even more so as they have not developed yet to an age of understand. More so before puberty

I am not denying that there is a very small % of young children that are confused, but surely dressing in clothes for the opposite sex at such a young age will confuse them even more, they will after all be the odd one out, because apart from the tree hugging pc craving minority, most people still surely believe that human beings are either male or female....not a weird mix of both.

Thorin wrote:There is only two biological genders. Others have been created by PC people. Again out of a belief to do good and yet it can create far more problems. If people want to identify their gender a certain way. That is up to them, but they should not demand that others do so. I mean what next, people changing their social construct racial classifications from Black to white daily?

So I agree dressing at such a young age in clothes specifically manufactured for different genders, different to their own gender is not responsible. As I say its not so much of a problem for girls as many boy clothes are gender neutral

When the time comes that a child is old enough to know that he/she is in the opposite gender to who they feel they are, specialist help is then required and should obviously be forthcoming.

Thorin wrote:But sadly more and more younger children are being refereed for gender dysphoria and we have to take into account if such dressing children a certain way, is creating more and more problems with this. Confusing children on their gender identity and if parents are playing an active part in this. There is no doubt that when children reach puberty, their bodies do not match their mindset gender. They should receive all the specialist help required, so agree

There are unisex clothes out there for girls and boys that don't have to be drastic....I just think encouraging a child to stand out in totally inappropriate clothes would confuse an already confused young child even more.

When they are older they can dress how they want, I LOVE Eddie Izzard.  

I completely agree and why parents need to be responsible

Eilzel wrote:What points, didge?

You say the parents are being irresponsible- on what evidence?

The boy wears boys and girls clothes- he isn't confused. If the parents tell him he can't wear dresses that only instills the view that boys wearing dresses is wrong. We know where that can lead.

You claims seeing a boy wearing a dress confuses other children, yet Syl just made it very clear that the way to approach that is so so simple.

So what points?

And if you want civil debate I suggest next time you read properly as to avoid coming to stupid conclusions about what people are saying.

1) The evidence that other children are becoming confused over genders. How many more times does this need to be spelled out to you and you continue to ignore this?

2) The parent is the one buying and thus encouraging the wearing of dresses when they should have discouraged that child from doing so in the first place. As seen, where more and more children are getting confused, do you think they are being responsible or irresponsible? We are not at a time where countless boys or men where dresses are we? Where we are unlikely to ever be with especially men.

3) Who is to say that child is not confused or goes onto be confused. You see you take a view point that this is not the case or could be the case.

4) Dont tell me what to do you patronizing wally, if you dont like my views then sod off. You claim civil by calling me an idiot. What a hypocritical tosser. Practice what you preach.

This story is on the mid day news....off to see what they say.

Thorin wrote:

Eilzel wrote:What points, didge?

You say the parents are being irresponsible- on what evidence?

The boy wears boys and girls clothes- he isn't confused. If the parents tell him he can't wear dresses that only instills the view that boys wearing dresses is wrong. We know where that can lead.

You claims seeing a boy wearing a dress confuses other children, yet Syl just made it very clear that the way to approach that is so so simple.

So what points?

And if you want civil debate I suggest next time you read properly as to avoid coming to stupid conclusions about what people are saying.

1) The evidence that other children are becoming confused over genders. How many more times does this need to be spelled out to you and you continue to ignore this?

2) The parent is the one buying and thus encouraging the wearing of dresses when they should have discouraged that child from doing so in the first place. As seen, where more and more children are getting confused, do you think they are being responsible or irresponsible? We are not at a time where countless boys or men where dresses are we? Where we are unlikely to ever be with especially men.

3) Who is to say that child is not confused or goes onto be confused. You see you take a view point that this is not the case or could be the case.

4) Dont tell me what to do you patronizing wally, if you dont like my views then sod off. You claim civil by calling me an idiot. What a hypocritical tosser. Practice what you preach.

Well then you see the problem don't you. You are basicslly justifying your own inability to read properly.

And you need to be clear about something here. If a child asks for a dress do you expect parents to say no? What reason should they give? You keep insisting parents are forcing or encouraging this, but what in situations where they aren't?

You are basically ignoring children who may actually be trans in the future, and who would be detrimentally affected by parents telling them they can't wear certain clothes because no reason...

Syl wrote:

Eilzel wrote:What points, didge?

You say the parents are being irresponsible- on what evidence?

The boy wears boys and girls clothes- he isn't confused. If the parents tell him he can't wear dresses that only instills the view that boys wearing dresses is wrong. We know where that can lead.

You claims seeing a boy wearing a dress confuses other children, yet Syl just made it very clear that the way to approach that is so so simple.

So what points?

And if you want civil debate I suggest next time you read properly as to avoid coming to stupid conclusions about what people are saying.

I believe the parents in the OP are creating a problem for their own children that need not exist.
If they teach a child to be accepting from an early age, and explain that people are all different, that should solve their problems without much bother.

Completely agree.

Syl wrote:

Eilzel wrote:What points, didge?

You say the parents are being irresponsible- on what evidence?

The boy wears boys and girls clothes- he isn't confused. If the parents tell him he can't wear dresses that only instills the view that boys wearing dresses is wrong. We know where that can lead.

You claims seeing a boy wearing a dress confuses other children, yet Syl just made it very clear that the way to approach that is so so simple.

So what points?

And if you want civil debate I suggest next time you read properly as to avoid coming to stupid conclusions about what people are saying.

I believe the parents in the OP are creating a problem for their own children that need not exist.
If they teach a child to be accepting from an early age, and explain that people are all different, that should solve their problems without much bother.

I agree that parents should be accepting of other children, but this is about the confusion of a child on gender itself. Again a child of that age is already struggling to understand gender. To then have as seen they are more confused by another child how they change their dress. Is clearly confusing. That child is not seeing male parents walk around in dresses and its unlikely the father of the child wearing dresses, is wearing dresses either. Hence the mass confusion for the other child. This is how confusion sets in. Now unless a mass of men start wearing dresses, which is unlikely, then of course a child is going to be confused. So its not about accepting, but about how solve the confusion, when that child does not see men in dresses as a norm. Again people need to take into the account the age of the children here.

Eilzel wrote:Parents encouraging a male child to wear a dress is wrong. But if it's the child's choice the so what? Let them.

Don't pander to bullies by stopping them based on what other kids will say.

One boy wearing a dress will not confuse anyone, since every other boy will be dressed in boys clothes.

In my school there was one boy who wore very gothy clothes, including black nail polish and the like. No one followed suit, kids often don't want to stand out or seem different. If one does, by wearing a dress, don't bloody risk damaging their confidence by slamming them with it being 'wrong' based on arbitrary gender standards...

The parents taking their kid out are being drama queens. Pure and simple.

agree with les, i did a much longer post but somehow lost it again

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:

I believe the parents in the OP are creating a problem for their own children that need not exist.
If they teach a child to be accepting from an early age, and explain that people are all different, that should solve their problems without much bother.

I agree that parents should be accepting of other children, but this is about the confusion of a child on gender itself. Again a child of that age is already struggling to understand gender. To then have as seen they are more confused by another child how they change their dress. Is clearly confusing. That child is not seeing male parents walk around in dresses and its unlikely the father of the child wearing dresses, is wearing dresses either. Hence the mass confusion for the other child. This is how confusion sets in. Now unless a mass of men start wearing dresses, which is unlikely, then of course a child is going to be confused. So its not about accepting, but about how solve the confusion, when that child does not see men in dresses as a norm. Again people need to take into the account the age of the children here.

didge the majority of kids aged 6 dont even think about gender. It just isn't in their minds


i don't like jack, he's mean
i'm so glad i've got a new lunch box, i cant wait to show bobby
i need new trainers
did mum get my lunch ready
i wonder if we can eat outside today
i want to take something for show and tell


as a rule it wouldn't be,,,,am i happy with my gender?

Eilzel wrote:

Thorin wrote:

1) The evidence that other children are becoming confused over genders. How many more times does this need to be spelled out to you and you continue to ignore this?

2) The parent is the one buying and thus encouraging the wearing of dresses when they should have discouraged that child from doing so in the first place. As seen, where more and more children are getting confused, do you think they are being responsible or irresponsible? We are not at a time where countless boys or men where dresses are we? Where we are unlikely to ever be with especially men.

3) Who is to say that child is not confused or goes onto be confused. You see you take a view point that this is not the case or could be the case.

4) Dont tell me what to do you patronizing wally, if you dont like my views then sod off. You claim civil by calling me an idiot. What a hypocritical tosser. Practice what you preach.

Well then you see the problem don't you. You are basicslly justifying your own inability to read properly.

And you need to be clear about something here. If a child asks for a dress do you expect parents to say no? What reason should they give? You keep insisting parents are forcing or encouraging this, but what in situations where they aren't?

You are basically ignoring children who may actually be trans in the future, and who would be detrimentally affected by parents telling them they can't wear certain clothes because no reason...

I expect the parents to be responsible. So are you saying that parents must buy everything their child wants?
They give reasons daily to children on why they are not going to buy them something which even includes other clothes. Many kids want superhero clothes, but their parents do not always buy it for them. So your view they should buy everything a child wants is mollycoddling them and that that child becomes utterly spoilt.

As to what i would say, I would say when you are older, you can buy what ever you want to dress in.

Wow your last sentence shows pure ignorance. So medically its very difficult to diagnose gender dysphoria in children of such an age. Where Doctors discourage doing so, mainly as for many children who do wear both sex clothes, or play with gender based toys, they tend to grow out of this. Hence only a few by the time they reach puberty, come to know whether they feel a different gender inside. So they come to this understanding much later, not at the age of 6. So saying they would be effective, when told they can chose what to buy and wear when older, would not effect them and many children have grown up in their gender clothes to then become trans people. So that really was about the most lame argument you have made. What you are saying is that parents must assume they are Trans, when no child of that age could mentally say that they are. No doctor would say so either. Thus they must pander to the demands of children.

gelico wrote:

Thorin wrote:

I agree that parents should be accepting of other children, but this is about the confusion of a child on gender itself. Again a child of that age is already struggling to understand gender. To then have as seen they are more confused by another child how they change their dress. Is clearly confusing. That child is not seeing male parents walk around in dresses and its unlikely the father of the child wearing dresses, is wearing dresses either. Hence the mass confusion for the other child. This is how confusion sets in. Now unless a mass of men start wearing dresses, which is unlikely, then of course a child is going to be confused. So its not about accepting, but about how solve the confusion, when that child does not see men in dresses as a norm. Again people need to take into the account the age of the children here.

didge the majority of kids aged 6 dont even think about gender.  It just isn't in their minds


i don't like jack, he's mean
i'm so glad i've got a new lunch box, i cant wait to show bobby
i need new trainers
did mum get my lunch ready
i wonder if we can eat outside today
i want to take something for show and tell


as a rule it wouldn't be,,,,am i happy with my gender?

The majority do not, but the point is some do gelico

Like I say, if kids see no male parents walking around in dresses or other boys and yet a boy is wearing the same clothes as some girls. Its at times going to cause confusion

I have no idea if you are happy with yours, and you cannot argue off yourself compared to another child who is.

Thorin wrote:

gelico wrote:


didge the majority of kids aged 6 dont even think about gender.  It just isn't in their minds


i don't like jack, he's mean
i'm so glad i've got a new lunch box, i cant wait to show bobby
i need new trainers
did mum get my lunch ready
i wonder if we can eat outside today
i want to take something for show and tell


as a rule it wouldn't be,,,,am i happy with my gender?

The majority do not, but the point is some do gelico

Like I say, if kids see no male parents walking around in dresses or other boys and yet a boy is wearing the same clothes as some girls. Its at times going to cause confusion


i agree with you but isn't it easily remedied? so a kid comes home from school 'confused' and says ''hey, there's this boy in my class called Josh but he came in wearing a dress, I don't understand,,,why would he do that? why is josh dressing like a girl?'' so i would say to child ''ok, well it sounds like Josh is a little confused as to whether he's actually happy being a boy or not,,,,,,some people are like that,,,,,it may sound a bit strange and funny but please try to understand and dont pick on Josh for it ok?''.

Hopefully that would be enough and this christian couple could have said that couldn't they? their kid being confused about another kid wearing a dress is hardly the worst thing that can happen to them. There was no mention of them being upset or traumatised over it. It doesn't affect their own ability to learn so what's the problem?

I am no idea if you are happy with yours, and you cannot argue off yourself compared to another child who is

no idea what that last sentence is meant to mean

personally I think its time "people" (and especially those people who think they have some sort of moral high ground and can demand how others parent, you know the ones ...the mouthy "super mums") learned

a) you dont actually know f**k all
b) to mind their OWN business
c) learn to bring their OWN kids up "minding their own business"

raising children ISNT a "pack occupation" and how mrs "A" does it is bugger all to do with Mrs "B"

gelico wrote:

Eilzel wrote:Parents encouraging a male child to wear a dress is wrong. But if it's the child's choice the so what? Let them.

Don't pander to bullies by stopping them based on what other kids will say.

One boy wearing a dress will not confuse anyone, since every other boy will be dressed in boys clothes.

In my school there was one boy who wore very gothy clothes, including black nail polish and the like. No one followed suit, kids often don't want to stand out or seem different. If one does, by wearing a dress, don't bloody risk damaging their confidence by slamming them with it being 'wrong' based on arbitrary gender standards...

The parents taking their kid out are being drama queens. Pure and simple.

agree with les, i did a much longer post but somehow lost it again  

I'll just assume it was brilliant

^didge, I know a kid isn't trans at 6, the problem is your reason would already implant the idea there is something wrong in them wearing a dress.

gelico wrote:

i agree with you but isn't it easily remedied?  so a kid comes home from school 'confused' and says ''hey, there's this boy in my class called Josh but he came in wearing a dress, I don't understand,,,why would he do that?  why is josh dressing like a girl?''  so i would say  to child  ''ok, well it sounds like Josh is a little confused as to whether he's actually happy being a boy or not,,,,,,some people are like that,,,,,it may sound a bit strange and funny but please try to understand and dont pick on Josh for it ok?''.

Thorin wrote: Hang on you just before said kids don't think about gender. To now in your explanation, say that Josh is a little confused over his gender. Which may well not even be the case, and that he simple is happy to wear both sets of clothes, where many just grow out of this. So it could very well be he is confused or he is not. So you could then create a wrong reason to your child as to what the situation is. To me, the best way would be to find out first from the other childs parents and have my own ask questions to the other child to learn and understand why they do. You can then both come to a better understanding. As I say its not clear cut with each child. Its still maybe difficult for a child to still understand.

Hopefully that would be enough and this christian couple could have said that couldn't they?  their kid being confused about another kid wearing a dress is hardly the worst thing that can happen to them.  There was no mention of them being upset or traumatised over it.  It doesn't affect their own ability to learn so what's the problem?

no idea what that last sentence is meant to mean

The couple already know the other parents as well. Which the story does not give the other parents view on this, which is a shame, as we only have one side.

I have just been reading from actually Pink news and the boy was saying he is a now a girl, hence the confusion. Now again I do not agree with the parents religious aspect, but the parents of the other child seem to be encouraging transgender at too young an age. Where this may well be a fad of which he/she could grow out of. Again this is only going by the views of said Christian parents.

In the video, Nigel Rowe claimed that a six-year-old child who was in the same class as his son often came to school presenting as both female and male.
“A child aged six would sometimes come to school as a girl or sometimes come to school as a boy.
“Our concerns were raised when our son came back home from school saying he was confused as to why and how a boy was now a girl.”
He added that they felt it was “wrong” to promote trans identities.
“We believe it is wrong to encourage very young children to embrace transgenderism.
“Boys are boys and girls are girls. Gender dysphoria is something we as Christians need to address with love and compassion, but not in the sphere of a primary school environment.”
Sally Rowe claimed to have a good relationship with the parents of the trans child but said that she became increasingly confused about the child after they turned up to a “royal” fancy dress party in a blue velvet dress.

http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/09/10/parents-threaten-lawsuit-against-church-of-england-school-over-trans-student/

Lord Foul wrote:personally I think its time "people" (and especially those people who think they have some sort of moral high ground and can demand how others parent, you know the ones ...the mouthy "super mums") learned

a) you dont actually know f**k all
b) to mind their OWN business
c) learn to bring their OWN kids up "minding their own business"

raising children ISNT a "pack occupation" and how mrs "A" does it is bugger all to do with Mrs "B"

So you would have no objection to a parent bring their child to school in a Nazi T-shirt?

Again this is about the confusion of the other child, which people seem to be struggling to understand here.

Eilzel wrote:

gelico wrote:


agree with les, i did a much longer post but somehow lost it again  

I'll just assume it was brilliant

^didge, I know a kid isn't trans at 6, the problem is your reason would already implant the idea there is something wrong in them wearing a dress.

Where did I ever say its wrong to wear a dress? I clearly said this will confuse some children, due to the simple fact they will not see other boys or men in dress.

I never have, and the fact is this is about the confusion of other children

I have said parents should be responsible about what they buy until a child is of an age they can properly chose for themselves, namely around puberty. Which you seem to fail to grasp.

So if you know a kids isnt  trans at 6, you would then be part in agreement with the Christian parents on that aspect?