Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison?

by Guest Wed Jan 29, 2014 4:49 pm

First topic message reminder :

Even if many politicians are convinced by the ethical and economic case for closing women’s prisons, many feel they need to appear “tough on crime” to a public that demands punishment and retribution.

Gemma learned a lot from prison. On her first day in HMP Styal, eight years ago, she learned how to take heroin and crack cocaine. “I didn’t tell the girls I hadn’t done them before – I just wanted to fit in,” she tells me when we meet at Brighton Oasis Project, a charity for women with drug or alcohol addictions. By her second jail sentence, at HMP Bronzefield in Surrey in early 2013, she’d been taught how to “load up” with drug-filled condoms before her court date and how to avoid being “decrotched”: “when someone watches the cell door and they use a spoon to take the drugs out from inside of you”.

Gemma says she didn’t know before prison that if you slit your wrists the blood can spurt so high it hits the ceiling – but self-harm was so common at Bronzefield that a deep-clean team was often called in to mop up the bloodstains, and the staff carried knives to cut ligatures from inmates’ necks. One woman repeatedly tried to hang herself but the guards “didn’t do anything to stop it. They just put her on meds and kept on cutting her down.”

According to a study published in the Lancet in December, a quarter of female prisoners self-harm, and 102 female inmates self-harmed more than 100 times in one year. Self-harm is more common among women in prison than men: women make up 5 per cent of the UK’s prison population but account for 28 per cent of self-harm cases.

http://www.newstatesman.com/2014/01/choking-death

Plenty more to read ad also very interesting, but is that the right way forward, what do others think?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:51 pm

Sassy wrote:
BigAndy9 wrote:

For studying - pretty much everything on the internet is in books at your local library.

At the library, and other centres, will be PC's for public use.

Oh dear, someone else who is years behind in education.

Suggest you read the thread. Homework is set online, it is handed on by online methods and the study modules are online.

No he is bang on the money, you can use facilities to do this work if it is for older children, as again it is online, you can go online at the library

Are you saying you cannot go online in the library or the school itself?

://?roflmao?/:

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:52 pm

Also, my children have had letters put in their bags a couple of times now (I've said this on other forums) informing parents that if they are on benefits or have an immigration order (something) against them they can get money for "computer equipment" from the council.

The other one was telling them if the parent wanted their children to do any leisure activities the council had money for them - any leisure activities they wanted to do!

This was around 2008 - 2011ish.

There was a p.s. at the bottom which was something along the lines of "if you work and pay taxes, thanks for your money, but you can pay twice"!

Ok, the last bit is a lie.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 1:57 pm

I think actually going to the library with your child a few times when they're around 7 - 9 will help them so much - show them around - teach them how to make use of it before they go to secondary school.

Trust me, you do not need a PC, but an old one can be bought for around £100.

by nicko Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:12 pm

there is another thing that pisses me off.my Grandson came home from school last week with a letter asking for, GET THIS £286 for a trip to France. how do think a single mom can get that amount.they are allways asking for money through the year for trips and such.the odd £10 or so i'll pay,but that amount to be found by April25th is not on.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:15 pm

nicko wrote:there is another thing that pisses me off.my Grandson came home from school last week with a letter asking for, GET THIS £286 for a trip to France. how do think a single mom can get that amount.they are allways asking for money through the year for trips and such.the odd £10 or so i'll pay,but that amount to be found by April25th is not on.

Well surely it is optional - they don't have to go nicko.

Those trips have gone on since I was a lad, I just didn't go. If I remember rightly, I didn't even bother handing letters like that to my mum.

by nicko Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:26 pm

no andy, he don't have to go ,but the teacher has been extoling the benefits of travelling to a different country and seeing how they live,[I'd not have picked france but there you are]so all the kids are very excited. I have often wondered if they get enough pupils do the teachers go free or is it charged to the education dept? any one know?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 2:32 pm

nicko wrote:no andy, he don't have to go ,but the teacher has been extoling the benefits of travelling to a different country and seeing how they live,[I'd not have picked france but there you are]so all the kids are very excited. I have often wondered if they get enough pupils do the teachers go free or is it charged to the education dept? any one know?

The teacher goes free, with expenses, overtime, time off in lieu etc.

It is often added to the childrens' price.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:32 pm

My god, no wonder our educational standards are slipping against world standards when you have people with such antiquated views. My kids were virtually brought up in libraries, as was I, but the world has moved on, and we need to move on with it, or carry on failing.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:45 pm

So and people can still not learn from Libraries or even now self teach?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:49 pm

Not when their homework is set on online modules and has to be done through the internet and sent by email, no.

Oh, and you do realise that because funding for libraries was cut, many have shut and those that are open don't have much money for new educational books?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:51 pm

Yes they can, they can go to the library and go online or at the school!

So a person can now not go to the library, log on and check his Google email account

On what planet, Neptune?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:53 pm

PhilDidge wrote:Yes they can, they can go to the library and go online or at the school!

So a person can now not go to the library, log on and check his Google email account

On what planet, Neptune?

Libraries are shutting because of the cuts, our library only has one computer and you are only allowed to use it for half an hour at a time. And THE WORK has to be done on an on-line module, it is only sent to the school by email, so logging onto your email would be a bit useless.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 5:56 pm

Sassy wrote:
PhilDidge wrote:Yes they can, they can go to the library and go online or at the school!

So a person can now not go to the library, log on and check his Google email account

On what planet, Neptune?

Libraries are shutting because of the cuts, our library only has one computer and you are only allowed to use it for half an hour at a time. And THE WORK has to be done on an on-line module, it is only sent to the school by email, so logging onto your email would be a bit useless.

Boom, move the goal post alert.

What about schools sassy?

Why is it that this is not national policy but the policies of some schools.

Even then as stated, if you know your child is going to one of these schools and by a year level you need a PC, you have ample time to save, you have years

Going to have my dinner, bye

by nicko Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:00 pm

I may be wrong,but didn't the government provide free pc's for certain children about 2yrs ago?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:06 pm

No, thats what they would like you to think.

http://www.lovemoney.com/news/cars-computers-and-sport/computers/15947/getonlinehome-government-scheme-helps-you-buy-a-new-computer-for-49

You still have to pay for a refurbished one and you still have to pay for the broadband connection, and Didge would say it was a waste of money.

My grandaughter has now left college, but she had a college bus she had to get, took her hour and half there and hour and a half back and there was only one college bus to our town, and no normal bus to catch, so she couldn't stay in college to use their computers, and that was the same for all the students there.

In any case, this is about a tv licence, and Didge says poor people should sell their tv's, even though, if the children have a computer, even for educational purposes, because it can receive tv now, you have to have a tv licence.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:13 pm

Again knowing your child is going to school and may need one, are you saying people cannot save for this years in advance being the fact you take the responsibility to have children and provide for their needs?

Yes it is about a TV licence which is a luxury and not a necessity

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:17 pm

Computer coding push for primary pupils in England

22 January 2014 Last updated at 19:56 GMT

From September, every child in England will have to learn computer coding.

Education Secretary Michael Gove has called it the language of the future, but are there enough trained teachers to do the job?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-25851739

'Master' computing teachers recruited to train others

A network of 400 "master" computer science teachers is being recruited to deliver a new computer science curriculum in schools across England.

These specialist teachers will train teachers in other schools and provide resources for teachers to use in class.

Funded by government, the scheme is run by the British Computer Society.

The new computer science curriculum, which replaces the current information and communications technology (ICT) curriculum, starts this September

The aim is to give pupils the right skills for the jobs of the future

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-25842199

Do keep yourself up to date Didge.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:22 pm

Push?

Do you understand the word push?

Again you failed to answer sassy, if you are going to have children and know these are needed in some schools, then you would have to save knowing you would need things to raise your child, again which you neglect. You neglect also that I never once said PC's were not needed in schools either

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:26 pm

Nicko, the scheme you were thinking of would have been a free computer for every child, which Labour were about to implement before the election:

http://www.itpro.co.uk/607392/computer-for-every-child-programme-kicks-off

Didge is out of date, out of touch and living in the past with the education programme in our schools.

Libraries only have a limited number of PCs available and there is always a queue to get on one in our libraries..

No way can any child keep up to speed with Gove's programme with just the lessons at school. They need to do homework as well. They'd be disadvantaged without a shadow of doubt

And they would still have to have a tv licence.

He really is coming across as being an out-of-date, behind the times, regressionist.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:31 pm

I am not out of date because I use PC's myself and would teach these skills, but that is if able to afford to do so which I can. I have never said once nobody should learn computers skills, that is where you clutch at straws, but you can have computers at school to teach this and as stated if it is to be a part, then parents should save well in advance.

by nicko Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:39 pm

thank you sassy, didge ,you say save for a few years,you have no idea of the pressure on a single mom with 3 kids.you save a few pounds and then one needs a pair of shoes,another needs new clothes,one of em comes in with trousers ripped playing football ect,ect.single moms with kids have little chance of saving money.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:43 pm

Prison isn't a tea-party for men either.
I don't see why women should be excluded from it.

A criminal is a criminal regardless of their sex.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:46 pm

but that doesnt matter to 1888 didge....he would still send em to the work house.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:50 pm

nicko wrote:thank you sassy, didge ,you say save for a few years,you have no idea of the pressure on a single mom with 3 kids.you save a few pounds and then one needs a pair of shoes,another needs new clothes,one of em comes in with trousers ripped playing football ect,ect.single moms with kids have little chance of saving money.

How did she become a single mom?

Is that now mine and your fault?

No, I was raised in a very poor background and we went without many things because my parents knew it was their sole responsibility to raise ud.

Now it is very hard for single parents and applaud those whose raise their children under difficult circumstances and I also know that they have huge pressure just as any parents do whether single or not, but my parents saved what little they had to spare and we never went without

Do you understand that and today as seen people place more belief in things that take as a necessity like a TV, when they should be using the money for the future if a PC is needed, how difficult is that to understand Nicko?

That means even though it is hard as a parent they must make the right choices for their children, one being not seeing as seen here a view that something is a necessity like a TV when it is not

Right really have to go, have a good evening Nicko

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:52 pm

grumpy old git wrote:but that doesnt matter to 1888 didge....he would still send em to the work house.

Incorrect and all it seems you have to offer is the intellect of a 3 year old to the debate here.

That view is not my view, never has been and no where have I advocated any such absurd thing, which just proves you really are more interested in posting about me than the debate

Happy with that, it shows your views have little worth

:D

Byee

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:54 pm

PhilDidge wrote:
nicko wrote:thank you sassy, didge ,you say save for a few years,you have no idea of the pressure on a single mom with 3 kids.you save a few pounds and then one needs a pair of shoes,another needs new clothes,one of em comes in with trousers ripped playing football ect,ect.single moms with kids have little chance of saving money.

How did she become a single mom?

Is that now mine and your fault?

No, I was raised in a very poor background and we went without many things because my parents knew it was their sole responsibility to raise ud.

cue the violins...hows the cardboard box under the railway tunnel these days??

Now it is very hard for single parents and applaud those whose raise their children under difficult circumstances and I also know that they have huge pressure just as any parents do whether single or not, but my parents saved what little they had to spare and we never went without

sounds from your nasty attitude that you went without a great deal, and resent it mightily...after all who BUT some one resenting their past, would hold the view that "it was good enough for me, so it can be good enough for you as well. Any rational person would do every thing they can to help folks avoid the "old thing"

Do you understand that and today as seen people place more belief in things that take as a necessity like a TV, when they should be using the money for the future if a PC is needed, how difficult is that to understand Nicko?

That means even though it is hard as a parent they must make the right choices for their children, one being not seeing as seen here a view that something is a necessity like a TV when it is not

Right really have to go, have a good evening Nicko

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:59 pm

So all Victor could post again was about me, so easy again, nothing to counter my point but yet again more absurd assumptions.

Let me know when you have something of worth when I am back late or tomorrow, it gets so tiresome just watching you struggle so much

:D

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 7:29 pm

Well seeing as we are on the subject of PC's then I might as well describe what the prisoners of HMP Holloway have at their disposal. Please bear in mind that not all the women in prison have been convicted of a crime; some are on remand awaiting trial, some are at trial, some are convicted but awaiting reports before sentencing, some are sentenced.

Each morning and afternoon women can attend "Education" where a variety of subjects are on offer. After an initial assessment of needs a time-table is drawn up for each woman. This may have subjects like English, Maths, Computing, needlework, Domestic Science, Music, Drama, Dance and Art. There is a fully equipped kitchen classroom, a comprehensive computer suite, library, pottery room etc.

All tools and potentially dangerous items are shadow boarded and must be accounted for before any of the women are allowed to leave at lunch or dinner time. Knives have been known to go missing resulting in a lock-down of the whole prison whilst searches take place.

Moving on to the accommodation or cells, Holloway has two types of cells; single and dorm. Here is a photo showing a dorm at Holloway:

Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison? - Page 3 Fvjl

Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison? - Page 3 Fvjl

Normally housing 5 women who are not a risk to others. Five metal beds bolted to the floor, bedside lockers, a table, chairs, television, sink and wc. Here's another view of a dorm cell:

Each occupant has one rock hard pillow and pillow case, one sheet and one blanket...normally a sort of light green colour. Each prisoner is provided with a toothbrush, soap, plastic plate, knife, fork, spoon and mug....usually grey or light blue in colour. Laundry days happen once a week for each wing.

When I was there we had 1 first night in custody wing
1 healthcare detox wing
1 post detox wing
1 healthcare mental health wing
1 young offenders wing
6-7 normal wings
1 lifer wing
1 mother & baby wing
1 segregation wing

More to follow.......

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:44 pm

Doesn't really matter what the conditions are like Keith, no-one should go to jail for not paying for a tv licence, man or woman. It is disproportionate.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 8:49 pm

Warren Moon wrote:Well seeing as we are on the subject of PC's then I might as well describe what the prisoners of HMP Holloway have at their disposal. Please bear in mind that not all the women in prison have been convicted of a crime; some are on remand awaiting trial, some are at trial, some are convicted but awaiting reports before sentencing, some are sentenced.

Each morning and afternoon women can attend "Education" where a variety of subjects are on offer. After an initial assessment of needs a time-table is drawn up for each woman. This may have subjects like English, Maths, Computing, needlework, Domestic Science, Music, Drama, Dance and Art. There is a fully equipped kitchen classroom, a comprehensive computer suite, library, pottery room etc.

All tools and potentially dangerous items are shadow boarded and must be accounted for before any of the women are allowed to leave at lunch or dinner time. Knives have been known to go missing resulting in a lock-down of the whole prison whilst searches take place.

Moving on to the accommodation or cells, Holloway has two types of cells; single and dorm. Here is a photo showing a dorm at Holloway:

Normally housing 5 women who are not a risk to others. Five metal beds bolted to the floor, bedside lockers, a table, chairs, television, sink and wc. Here's another view of a dorm cell:

Each occupant has one rock hard pillow and pillow case, one sheet and one blanket...normally a sort of light green colour. Each prisoner is provided with a toothbrush, soap, plastic plate, knife, fork, spoon and mug....usually grey or light blue in colour. Laundry days happen once a week for each wing.

When I was there we had 1 first night in custody wing
1 healthcare detox wing
1 post detox wing
1 healthcare mental health wing
1 young offenders wing
6-7 normal wings
1 lifer wing
1 mother & baby wing
1 segregation wing

More to follow.......

Hiya Keith
Were education courses and so on available to all prisoners irrespective of the length of sentence?
Also is it still the same in 2014?

by nicko Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:23 pm

by the way bbc is awash with money they hand it out to employee's as if it were monopoly money they waste millions,yet would see a poor mom in jail for £145 50.by the way didge I pay for my daughters licence,i wont see my grandkids have the piss taken out of them by their friends.and they learn about nature and other important things by watching the tele.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:25 pm

nicko wrote: by the way bbc is awash with money they hand it out to employee's as if it were monopoly money they waste millions,yet would see a poor mom in jail for £145 50.by the way didge I pay for my daughters licence,i wont see my grandkids have the piss taken out of them by their friends.and they learn about nature and other important things by watching the tele.

Absolutely agree Nicko, they don't have to watch rubbish, there are some good informative programmes, and programmes that stretch their imaginations. Even Doctor Who is like playing space games.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:31 pm

So Warren - apologies if you've answered this already - but presumably you do think custodial sentences are approriate in some circumstances for female convicts?

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:12 pm

Sorry Nems, been helping daught revise.

Common sense was used and those women with 3 moths of less (I think) would not attend education. I have no idea what it is now though. One course run by resettlement was the BICS cleaning course which was recognized by employers.

When I was an officer on A4 wing, this lady used to be my wing cleaner - Gina Moffatt who was serving time for drug importation.

Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison? - Page 3 Ou8p

Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison? - Page 3 Ou8p

A4 wing then was a convicted wing with a high percentage of high risk prisoners. She sat loads of courses and progressed to outside day college. When she left she was funded to setup her own florist business.

Many of the women were not perturbed by prison at all, they were accustomed to it and saw it as an occupational hazzard. Then we had our lifers in for murder etc.

by Guest Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:58 pm

Warren Moon wrote:Sorry Nems, been helping daught revise.

Common sense was used and those women with 3 moths of less (I think) would not attend education. I have no idea what it is now though. One course run by resettlement was the BICS cleaning course which was recognized by employers.

When I was an officer on A4 wing, this lady used to be my wing cleaner - Gina Moffatt who was serving time for drug importation.

A4 wing then was a convicted wing with a high percentage of high risk prisoners. She sat loads of courses and progressed to outside day college. When she left she was funded to setup her own florist business.

Many of the women were not perturbed by prison at all, they were accustomed to it and saw it as an occupational hazzard. Then we had our lifers in for murder etc.

Aww what she revising for?

Did you have women you thought should not be in prison?

Min you what Cat prisons have you worked at?
Are Cat A women held all together?

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:17 am

Female prisoners are either uncategorized or Cat A (includes E list). The Cat A cells in Holloway are on A5 which is the lifer unit.

In answer to your question about thinking that some women should not be in prison....

No. Although some women on remand were clearly innocent at times.

Our E list (Escape attempt) prisoners had to wear one of these to stand out from the other women and also had to be accompanied when moving about the prison and when on exercise.

Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison? - Page 3 2qts

Choking to death: should we stop sending women to prison? - Page 3 2qts

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:20 am

So what about all those with mental health issues Keith, and there are many, or who have been abused etc?

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:24 am

Many prisoners have mental health problems. 72% of male and 70% of female sentenced prisoners suffer from two or more mental health disorders. 20% of prisoners have four of the five major mental health disorders.10% of men and 30% of women have had a previous psychiatric admission before they come into prison.Neurotic and personality disorders are particularly prevalent - 40% of male and 63% of female sentenced prisoners have a neurotic disorder, over three times the level in the general population. 62% of male and 57% of female sentenced prisoners have a personality disorder.

- According to Michael Spurr, NOMS Chief Operating Officer, at any one time 10% of the prison population has ‘serious mental health problems’.

- Women in prison are twice as likely to have an eating disorder as women in the general population.

http://www.prisonreformtrust.org.uk/ProjectsResearch/Mentalhealth

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:32 am

So, given those stats...perhaps we should build a few new "looney bins"

It was a favourite threat to us as kids......"you carry on like that and you'll end up in the looney bin"

considering the world today...i recon I did anyway.......

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:35 am

grumpy old git wrote:So, given those stats...perhaps we should build a few new "looney bins"

It was a favourite threat to us as kids......"you carry on like that and you'll end up in the looney bin"

considering the world today...i recon I did anyway.......

I do seriously think that if we had better mental health services, we would have less prisoners. I'm surprised anyone is sane these days, the pressures we live under and the distance from a life connected to nature and the earth. BTW, have been in touch with the local Pagan society.

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:38 am

Sassy wrote:
grumpy old git wrote:So, given those stats...perhaps we should build a few new "looney bins"

It was a favourite threat to us as kids......"you carry on like that and you'll end up in the looney bin"

considering the world today...i recon I did anyway.......

I do seriously think that if we had better mental health services, we would have less prisoners. I'm surprised anyone is sane these days, the pressures we live under and the distance from a life connected to nature and the earth. BTW, have been in touch with the local Pagan society.

Good for you...

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 12:45 am

It just makes sense.

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 1:57 am

Some of our prisoners located on the mental health wing were dangerous to such an extent that they were a 3 or more officer unlock. Meaning that there had to be at least 3 officers who were up to date with their control and restraint training before the cell door could be unlocked.

We had women who were schizophrenic, bi-polar and various personality disorders including Cluster B type (Borderline, Narcissistic and antisocial aka psychopathic).

All officers worked hand in hand with the nurses who were present on each level. Self harming was common place, its amazing what can be used to cut oneself. This took place throughout the prison with the exception of the mother & baby unit.

We had women who were in wheelchairs, had false legs and an age range from 18 (YO) to 83. Before you say aahhhh.... this 83 year old was serving life for her part in an honor killing where her daughter's head was cut off. She was almost bed ridden and refused to show any remorse. Although a lifer she lived on my first wing, A4 and not the lifer unit one floor above.

by Beekeeper Fri Jan 31, 2014 4:29 am

LAST TIME I looked they weren't sending enough women to prison !!!

TOO MANY female criminals are getting off on probation or community service, even being let off to walk free when they are as guilty as sin !!

AS THERE seems to be a shortage of Womens' Prisons in many Western countries, then now would seem to be the right time to be building more such accommodation ~ NOT to be thinking of closing the existing ones down ! Idea

by Guest Fri Jan 31, 2014 6:07 am

nicko wrote: by the way bbc is awash with money they hand it out to employee's as if it were monopoly money they waste millions,yet would see a poor mom in jail for £145 50.by the way didge I pay for my daughters licence,i wont see my grandkids have the piss taken out of them by their friends.and they learn about nature and other important things by watching the tele.

Why are you trying to play the guilt trip on me, you have decided to help your daughter which is what most families do. Again I do not make the rules Nicko or have even said I agree with some of them. The reality is your daughter is struggling of which I admire you helping but your argument is absurd, so are you going to buy your grand children next an Ipad, a laptop, a playstation 4, a xbox, a mobile etc, when they may get the piss taken out of them by some children who have them? Where do you draw the line, after you nuy a horse? Not everyone can afford to get their children everything they wish to have. Yes we are talking about the extreme case of a TV here but again you miss the point, so what you are saying is a parent due to the current silly laws on a licence would pay to have something who could end up in jail to save their children from piss take would not be the sensible thing to do because the bigger picture has created an even worse case scenario for the children, losing their parent. You can learn as many things from a book. So our heart is in the right place in wanting to do the right thing, of which again I applaud, but again what is happening also is there are plenty of people out there buying material objects they do not need when they are financially struggling, placing themselves in further financial difficulty.

Again I am all for families having a moral obligation to helping out other members, but what you have to look at is have you resolved the problem of the bullying?
No, they are still disadvantaged children and those bullying will use other means to tease and try to hurt them, all you have done is solved the problem of them not being able to watch TV, which again is good that you step into help with that.

by Sponsored content