Germany train axe attack: Afghan teenage refugee shouting 'Allahu Akbar' goes on bloody rampage hacking

First topic message reminder :

An axe-man who stormed a passenger train and hacked at terrified passengers while shouting "Allahu Akbar" has been identified as a 17-year-old Afghan who entered Germany as a lone refugee.

eddie wrote:Rags, I think living in the US where there are these big groups of Christians that demonstrate over everything "evil" - gays, abortion, single parents, the colour red, - the Americans see a lot of radicals, all of the time.
We don't have that over here. I think that's why you will get the American posters of this forum talking about Christians so much, perhaps?

I'm not responsible for what Christians in the US do, and I'm not going to sit here whilst Ben and his cronies insult Christians and Christianity generally. Ben knows I'm from the UK where we clearly don't have such problems, and if he can't make allowances for that, I'm not going to make allowances for his bigotry against Christians.

veya_victaous wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

It didn't explain why he was talking about Christians in a thread about a Muslim. He wouldn't talk about Muslims in a derogatory manner in a thread about Christians.

cause same they're the Same!!!!

Yes, You Abrahamist like to seperate into your little cults but to someone outside of Abrahmaism you are all the same. Jew, Christian, Muslim all identical you all have a dumb factually incorrect book that preaches intolerance and hatred and the same bullshit fairytale abotu a magic sky giant that controls everything.

NOT JUST the three Abrahamic religions, either...
ALL of the major religions have their obvious faults :

HINDUS killing each other, and producing rapist gang cultures.
Hindu fundi's killing Muslim and Christian minorities out in remote areas.
Hindus and Sikhs fighting one another.

Buddhists killing Muslims in around Myanmar, Thailand and Malaysia border areas..
Taoists and Confuciusts often involved in warfare across Asian history..


AND THEN there's those spin-off cults from Christianity that are no longer Christian themselves -- like the Mormons or the "Westbro Baptists"..
OR those "Christian soldiers" roaming across central Africa, that have no genuine links to any Christian denomination.

NO single religion has a monopoly on such crass stupidities...

That's pretty much what was said back there; religions are interchangeable.

eddie wrote:That's pretty much what was said back there; religions are interchangeable.

No they're not. Those who follow different religions have different beliefs, otherwise they'd all be the same religion. Atheists are perfectly capable of being violent and of killing people you know. The way some people bang on about religion on here, you'd think that wasn't the case. Do the atheists on here identify with other atheists who commit violent crimes? You can bet that they don't.

Raggamuffin wrote:

eddie wrote:That's pretty much what was said back there; religions are interchangeable.

No they're not. Those who follow different religions have different beliefs, otherwise they'd all be the same religion. Atheists are perfectly capable of being violent and of killing people you know. The way some people bang on about religion on here, you'd think that wasn't the case. Do the atheists on here identify with other atheists who commit violent crimes? You can bet that they don't.

Thought this might interest you http://www.newsfixboard.com/t17120-about-that-atheist-who-killed-3-young-Muslims-in-north-carolina#325600

WHICH "atheists" would that be then, Raggs  ???

I'M not an atheist..
Victor and sassy aren't atheists..
Stardesk declared a few weeks back that he's not an atheist, either.

Some on here who are possibly atheist, or maybe agnostic, or even some whacky extremist religion, simply choose not to make their personal choices public;  so we will never know..

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

WHICH "athiests" would that be then, Raggs  ???

I'M not an athiest..
Victor and sassy aren't athiests..
Stardesk declared a few weeks back that he's not an athiests.

Some on here who are possibly athiest, or maybe agnostic, simply choose not to make their personal choices public;  so we will never know..

A lot of people say they're not atheists, but they are. They call themselves "spiritual" instead - something that several people on here have mentioned.

Raggamuffin wrote:

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

WHICH "athiests" would that be then, Raggs  ???

I'M not an athiest..
Victor and sassy aren't athiests..
Stardesk declared a few weeks back that he's not an athiests.

Some on here who are possibly athiest, or maybe agnostic, simply choose not to make their personal choices public;  so we will never know..

A lot of people say they're not atheists, but they are. They call themselves "spiritual" instead - something that several people on here have mentioned.

Being Atheist means not believing in God. Most people who are spiritual do acknowledge a higher energy that equates to 'God'. I don't know anyone who is spiritual who doesn't believe in God.

Raggamuffin wrote:

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

WHICH "athiests" would that be then, Raggs  ???

I'M not an athiest..
Victor and sassy aren't athiests..
Stardesk declared a few weeks back that he's not an athiests.

Some on here who are possibly athiest, or maybe agnostic, simply choose not to make their personal choices public;  so we will never know..

A lot of people say they're not atheists, but they are. They call themselves "spiritual" instead - something that several people on here have mentioned.

an example of christian extremism ..... if you dont beleive in MY idea of god you are an atheist.....pfffft.....

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

A lot of people say they're not atheists, but they are. They call themselves "spiritual" instead - something that several people on here have mentioned.

Being Atheist means not believing in God.    Most people who are spiritual do acknowledge a higher energy that equates to 'God'.   I don't know anyone who is spiritual who doesn't believe in God.

A higher energy? They usually bang on about "nature" a lot. Tree huggers ...

Raggamuffin wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

Being Atheist means not believing in God.    Most people who are spiritual do acknowledge a higher energy that equates to 'God'.   I don't know anyone who is spiritual who doesn't believe in God.

A higher energy? They usually bang on about "nature" a lot. Tree huggers ...

The problem is everyone has a different perception of God. And they all seem to think their 'God' is the bestest God.

I dont believe in religion - that is, I don't go to church or read the bible nor do I think God will punish and smite etc - but I do believe in a "God" of sorts...a higher power or something, call it what you will.

I'd say if you believe in something that fits the description of a god, or something that you define as having god-like powers, then you're not an atheist.

Examples might be sentient nature, a "life force" that creates living things, or even a god with limits on its power, or an evil or indifferent god.

So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

Well, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Christian god can be kind of an asshole ...

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

I think it's more of the religion thing people don't like. I'm not keen on it myself. Religion, for me, has too many rules and regulations and guilt trips for me to want to follow it. But that doesn't mean I don't respect another's belief in it. Each to their own.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

cause same they're the Same!!!!

Yes, You Abrahamist like to seperate into your little cults but to someone outside of Abrahmaism you are all the same. Jew, Christian, Muslim all identical you all have a dumb factually incorrect book that preaches intolerance and hatred and the same bullshit fairytale abotu a magic sky giant that controls everything.

NOT JUST the three Abrahamic religions, either...
ALL of the major religions have their obvious faults :

HINDUS killing each other, and producing rapist gang cultures.
Hindu fundi's killing Muslim and Christian minorities out in remote areas.
Hindus and Sikhs fighting one another.

Buddhists killing Muslims in around Myanmar, Thailand and Malaysia border areas..
Taoists and Confuciusts often involved in warfare across Asian history..


AND THEN there's those spin-off cults from Christianity that are no longer Christian themselves -- like the Mormons or the "Westbro Baptists"..
OR those "Christian soldiers" roaming across central Africa, that have no genuine links to any Christian denomination.

NO single religion has a monopoly on such crass stupidities...

Well make new threads about each different incident then and we can look at them all individually.


This thread has a specific incident as the topic...


People should stick to this instead of deflecting and derailing...



And... in reply to wolfie's post... it is exactly because you and others try to lump all religions in together, like you just have, as if they are all the same and equally hostile and violent as each other etc, when in reality they are not, that different threads are needed for different incidents so we can actually see what's what!



Sikhs are not the aggressors... they face hostility from hindhus and Muslims.


Muslims are also the main cause of problems with others elsewhere too!!!

Ben Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

Well, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Christian god can be kind of an asshole ...

Not as much of an asshole as you.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

I think it's more of the religion thing people don't like.   I'm not keen on it myself.    Religion, for me, has too many rules and regulations and guilt trips for me to want to follow it.   But that doesn't mean I don't respect another's belief in it. Each to their own.

They don't even like people having Christian faith - bunch of leftie bigots.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

Well, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Christian god can be kind of an asshole ...

It's more the way people interpret the word of God, or Allah, or Buddah etc etc?

My two cents worth is it's obvious that some people here often have digs at Christianity....and equally obvious they will defend other religions.
I don't see Muslims being attacked for their faith, and neither should they be, just as no one else should either.
It's also noticeable that certain threads about terrorism often turn into a bash Christianity thread.

eddie wrote:I dont believe in religion - that is, I don't go to church or read the bible nor do I think God will punish and smite etc - but I do believe in a "God" of sorts...a higher power or something, call it what you will.

That's my way of thinking too....I believe in something, I'm just not sure what it is.

Syl wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

Well, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Christian god can be kind of an asshole ...

It's more the way people interpret the word of God, or Allah, or Buddah etc etc?

My two cents worth is it's obvious that some people here often have digs at Christianity....and equally obvious they will defend other religions.
I don't see Muslims being attacked for their faith, and neither should they be, just as no one else should either.
It's also noticeable that certain threads about terrorism often turn into a bash Christianity thread.

Thank you Syl. It is transparently obvious that's what happens here. It's not the two Muslims having a go at Christianity either - just to be clear about that.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Syl wrote:

It's more the way people interpret the word of God, or Allah, or Buddah etc etc?

My two cents worth is it's obvious that some people here often have digs at Christianity....and equally obvious they will defend other religions.
I don't see Muslims being attacked for their faith, and neither should they be, just as no one else should either.
It's also noticeable that certain threads about terrorism often turn into a bash Christianity thread.

Thank you Syl. It is transparently obvious that's what happens here. It's not the two Muslims having a go at Christianity either - just to be clear about that.

I didn't even know Sexy Mama was Muslim till the other day when she mentioned something about ramadan, didn't know and don't care, she is just a nice poster from what I have seen of her.
Someones faith is neither here nor there on a forum.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

Well, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Christian god can be kind of an asshole ...

You've just compounded her post with this tosseresque statement. Also, it's highly insulting for those who do believe in God, and are Christian. Would you say the Islamic God is an arsehole, or Mohammad is a twat?

bens mistake was a lack of inclusivity


reality says he should have said

"the abrahamic god can be kind of an asshole"

and I would add....along with a number of others....

His mistake is saying something doesn't exist but then saying it does...

I don't think people should bash anyone's religion and I want to be clear about that.

Lord Foul wrote:bens mistake was a lack of inclusivity


reality says he should have said

"the abrahamic god can be kind of an asshole"

and I would add....along with a number of others....

It's not God. It's man's perception of God that's the problem.

Syl wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:So if there are loads of people on here with faith in some kind of god, why is there so much anti-Christian sentiment and so much talk of a "sky fairy" or "walking on clouds" or whatever? It's a bit hypocritical really.

Well, I don't know if you noticed this, but the Christian god can be kind of an asshole ...

It's more the way people interpret the word of God, or Allah, or Buddah etc etc?

My two cents worth is it's obvious that some people here often have digs at Christianity....and equally obvious they will defend other religions.
I don't see Muslims being attacked for their faith, and neither should they be, just as no one else should either.
It's also noticeable that certain threads about terrorism often turn into a bash Christianity thread.

LOL
you dont see Fuzzy and SM getting attack then you obviously don't read the bloody threads

Even You, in your post above
Allah is Literally Just Arabic for God, and BOTH are talking about Jehova the SAME god
so why write the Abrahmaic god twice?

Maybe it is the IGNORANCE of some that is actually the problem anyone trying to say Islam IS any different the Christanity Is obviously ignorant of the history and never read the books, cause they are clearly the SAME religion talking about the same god, the same list of commandments, the same prophets, just one is some 600 years later. they are Just sects of the same religion "Abrahamism".

So no, it is not Chraitan Bashing to Include ALL Abrahmaist ALL people that Follow this Luduricus Sky giant Jehove fairytale in the same boat. Because if you are not Abrahmaist they are all the same. (the fact one sect think one prophet is a literal son and one a metaphorical son Makse no difference to Ideaology)

What People are actually Taking issue with is Christian BULLSHITTING and suggesting the Secular Idealogy is theirs!!! Secualrist have had to fight Christian tooth and nail for centuries, Literally getting burned at the stake when christian held power. So when the sexist racist cult tries to suggest the freedoms it fought wars against is part of it's idealoglogy then YES secularist have a right to Get pissed off at the Ignorant !!!

Is BEN A Muslim? Closet or otherwise?

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:

It's more the way people interpret the word of God, or Allah, or Buddah etc etc?

My two cents worth is it's obvious that some people here often have digs at Christianity....and equally obvious they will defend other religions.
I don't see Muslims being attacked for their faith, and neither should they be, just as no one else should either.
It's also noticeable that certain threads about terrorism often turn into a bash Christianity thread.

LOL
you dont see Fuzzy and SM getting attack then you obviously don't read the bloody threads

Even You, in your post above
Allah is Literally Just Arabic for God, and BOTH are talking about Jehova the SAME god
so why write the Abrahmaic god twice?

Maybe it is the IGNORANCE of some that is actually the problem anyone trying to say Islam IS any different the Christanity Is obviously ignorant of the history and never read the books, cause they are clearly the SAME religion talking about the same god, the same list of commandments, the same prophets, just one is some 600 years later. they are Just sects of the same religion "Abrahamism".

So no, it is not Chraitan Bashing to Include ALL Abrahmaist ALL people that Follow this Luduricus Sky giant Jehove fairytale in the same boat. Because if you are not Abrahmaist they are all the same. (the fact one sect think one prophet is a literal son and one a metaphorical son Makse no difference to Ideaology)

What People are actually Taking issue with is Christian BULLSHITTING and suggesting the Secular Idealogy is theirs!!! Secualrist have had to fight Christian tooth and nail for centuries, Literally getting burned at the stake when christian held power. So when the sexist racist cult tries to suggest the freedoms it fought wars against is part of it's idealoglogy then YES secularist have a right to Get pissed off at the Ignorant !!!

Yes I do read the 'bloody threads'...the ones that interest me anyway.

Since I joined here I have seen a lot more derogatory remarks aimed at Rags and her faith than I have seen against anyone else....so maybe you don't read as much as me.

Thanks for the lessons on religion and it's history....but I could not care less.
I prefer to live in the here and now rather than seize every opportunity to preach about how very bad so and so was centuries ago.

Well said

Thank you.

Let’s go through the many misconceptions being made here throughout this thread.
First of all, you cannot claim something is the same God, if you do not believe that God exists.
What you can say is that the same myths have been constantly recycled and adapted through history, based on a number of mythical deities. The Jews do not believe Jesus is God made flesh, Christians do not believe Allah is the same God as Jesus made flesh. As Muslims believe that Allah deceived Christians by allowing Christians to believe Jesus died on the cross and actually hail Allah as the greatest of deceivers. Would in fact place him in comparability to what Christians already call the  character with the same title of greatest deceiver, that being the devil. Of course these are all myths, and it is in this context we should be looking at these mythical claims.

You can go all the way back to the ancient Sumerians, to find the very first origins of the Abrahamic beliefs, through the deities Enlil and Enki.  Enlil represents the vengeful aspects of the Old Testament and Enki, the aspects that saves and looks after humanity. In fact what you find that the symbol for Enki, is that of the double helix serpent and it is he that gifts humanity with wisdom. Though we see this later changed in the bible to see him replaced as the God who looks out and cares for humans to be portrayed as Satan. This is a good example of how myths have been recycled. We see the Egyptian worship of the Aten also recycled in Judaism. We see Christianity form from a mixture of Mithraism, which is in itself recycled from Zoroastrian. Mixtures of Osiris and Judaism. Islam though recycles back to a more vengeful  type of deity found in Judaism, but they are essentially the same myths being recycled and adapted. I mean we have all seen the pictures of this deity as an old man with a beard? Where did that come from, the ancient Greeks and Romans, which is nothing more than  the recycle of the deities Zeus and Jupiter image.

What is blatantly clear is that there are all ideologies and people claiming nobody should be critical or ridicule such ideologies are fundamentally backing Blasphemy. Created to criminalize any criticism of such beliefs. No ideology is beyond criticism and ridicule. If you think they are, then you are then also of the belief that Nazism, racism, homophobia, to name just a few ideologies should also be protected from criticism and ridicule. People seem to think people like Muhhamad, Moses and Jesus should also be protected from such ridicule, why? They are supposed historical characters who at least two endorsed slavery and the executions of peoples. Jesus is believed to come back at the head of a army and commit mass genocide. Now when you look at other historical characters, does anyone say they should not be ridiculed for the deeds they committed in life?

No, but place a mythical belief around their lives and people think they should be protected from any such criticism. To those people, I say, tough.  As all you do is then deny free speech and allow such poor beliefs to be protected against any rightful and just criticisms. People should be protected from discrimination, not myths or ideologies. I mean look at how bad religious people are that the very aspect of people reasoning that the belief is based on some abhorrent beliefs, allows people to get upset. Well children get upset when they find out Santa Claus. Was just a historical character and does not visit your home on Christmas Eve delivering presents. You know what? They get over this very quickly. Yet adults get so upset over being told their god does not exist, they will literal in some cases murder people over being told their God does not exist. Showing the problem is religious people. Showing the stupidity of literal religious belief, more so how in some countries people are punished for this of even cannot leave their faith on pain of death. To even claim as I say that I should not be critical of say the Jewish or Christian deity, when its claimed they wiped out the first born of Egypt, innocent children. Just so this deity could prove he was God and the Pharaoh would then release the Israelites. Is barbaric, being as its claimed this deity could do anything and could have simply freed them without any child sacrifices. Again if you think I should not show the greatest distain for such barbarity, you can again tough.  As its absurd when people who state I should not be critical, are allowing countless people to continue to venerate something so barbaric and again defending Blasphemy. On top of that by default, each and every religion insults the other by their very nature of its belief system, when it claims the other is wrong. If you think it does not, then you are misguided, as Islam claims Jesus did not die on the cross and is not the God made flesh. This is Blasphemy to a Christian, showing the absurdity of religious literal belief itself.

As to those claiming they just believe in a deity and the problem is perception, then I say tough to your beliefs. Or to the claim you are not religious, as religion by definition is the belief in a supernatural being creator God. That makes you religious; you just may not have as much dogma you believe in as other religions. As this comes from an arrogance that somehow humans are special and that some deity either is so weak that it does nothing and allows countless to suffer. Or this deity is all powerful and simply does not care to intervene. It can only be one or the other.  The reality is if a God does exist and is all powerful, the reality is we are more than likely alongside all other forms of life, nothing more than lab rats. Something so intelligence is not going to be swayed or moved by emotions, as that is a human trait and even found in other animals. We are more likely nothing more than an experiment on seeing if life takes hold through the creation of an explosion, the big bang. As why do people think this deity simple cares or is emotive enough to care to create you and then offer you some fantastical after life? Only arrogance that deems we are in some way special creates this. You do not even have to believe in a deity to believe in spirituality. If life does exist after death, its likely it has zero to do with anything creator and we simply are the players of a game, which like any computer game has glitches which allow players after they die in the game to sometimes recall previous game plays where they had died. If people put far more into this life than being in a perpetual state of fear over what may happen, then they might learn to love and embrace the very real life that we know exists.
People should start enjoying this.

Lastly to the points which are defending terrorism and murder based off the events 150 years ago, is nothing short of bollocks. By doing so and claiming a wrong done, is then allowing others to make the same daft claim. Where with Islamic aggressive colonialism, then justifies the Crusades based off wrongs done to Christianity. Its this same argument which would then justify Hitlers invasion of Poland based off Germany being the aggressor in WW1 and have consequences for its action. Then Hitler could go off claimed wrongs, based off Germany losing, but I do not even need to use the same poor methodology to show how absurd that is. I can show that countless non-Muslims countries that were colonized, by the Europeans, have not seen any levels of terrorism against the west based off these past wrongs. I mean where is all the terrorism from the Vietmanese against the US, based on such a conflict> Where is all the German terrorism, based off the very real crimes against humanity suffered by the civilian population in the last years of the war? Where is the terrorism from the Japanese? The Black South Africans? The Nambians, who suffered genocide under Imperial Germany? You see the false charge made is done with one aspct in mind, to deflect awy from the real cause Islamic, Transgression,  Jihad and Martyrdom. The very same people will not claim there was no religious aspect to the Crusades, they will definitely state there was, but when it comes to islam, you get to see some of the worst double standards and unfounded claims made on history which simply have no validity.
The best thing I read that describes religion is this.

“Religion is a like a disease of the human mind. It’s like rabies. You get bitten and suddenly there’s this great foaming of the mouth, all sense and reason thrown to the wind. There’s a lot of shouting and then you bite someone else in all the madness and it gets passed on down the line across generations and national boundaries. Forget Aids, this stuff kills millions.”

Syl wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:

It's more the way people interpret the word of God, or Allah, or Buddah etc etc?

My two cents worth is it's obvious that some people here often have digs at Christianity....and equally obvious they will defend other religions.
I don't see Muslims being attacked for their faith, and neither should they be, just as no one else should either.
It's also noticeable that certain threads about terrorism often turn into a bash Christianity thread.

LOL
you dont see Fuzzy and SM getting attack then you obviously don't read the bloody threads

Even You, in your post above
Allah is Literally Just Arabic for God, and BOTH are talking about Jehova the SAME god
so why write the Abrahmaic god twice?

Maybe it is the IGNORANCE of some that is actually the problem anyone trying to say Islam IS any different the Christanity Is obviously ignorant of the history and never read the books, cause they are clearly the SAME religion talking about the same god, the same list of commandments, the same prophets, just one is some 600 years later. they are Just sects of the same religion "Abrahamism".

So no, it is not Chraitan Bashing to Include ALL Abrahmaist ALL people that Follow this Luduricus Sky giant Jehove fairytale in the same boat. Because if you are not Abrahmaist they are all the same. (the fact one sect think one prophet is a literal son and one a metaphorical son Makse no difference to Ideaology)

What People are actually Taking issue with is Christian BULLSHITTING and suggesting the Secular Idealogy is theirs!!! Secualrist have had to fight Christian tooth and nail for centuries, Literally getting burned at the stake when christian held power. So when the sexist racist cult tries to suggest the freedoms it fought wars against is part of it's idealoglogy then YES secularist have a right to Get pissed off at the Ignorant !!!

Yes I do read the 'bloody threads'...the ones that interest me anyway.

Since I joined here I have seen a lot more derogatory remarks aimed at Rags and her faith than I have seen against anyone else....so maybe you don't read as much as me.

Thanks for the lessons on religion and it's history....but I could not care less.
I prefer to live in the here and now rather than seize every opportunity to preach about how very bad so and so was centuries ago.  

You dont believe in the here and now you live in the Old fanstasy land why Christian are different than Muslims
you said "God or God or Buddha" Literally Your Origianls Statement is nonsense born in ignroance.

Your opinon is irrelvant since it is not based in facts or reality but Dumb ass propoganda.
EDUCATION is the key to just about everything INCLUDING fixing the Fools that currently inhabit the UK causeing So much Racial Hatred through their Arrogant ignorance.

Never tell me again I dont know that England is Shit house
I dont care, i dont have to care like you think you dont have to care.
Which is Why you, one of the relatively ok brits, is STILL an Ignorant raicst causing hatred towards the West and the Uk through an absoultle intorelable level of ignorance and arrogance.

And Dont say you are not a hillshepherd, YOU HAVE literally just given the exact thought process of a hillshepherd "you think your tiny little hill is the world and the here and now is explained but the miniscule bit you want to see."

SO STOP COMPLAINING WHEN SOMEONE MAKES A VAILD OBSERVATION  SUPPORTED BY YOUR OWN ASSERTIONS

Didge wrote:Let’s go through the many misconceptions being made here throughout this thread.
First of all, you cannot claim something is the same God, if you do not believe that God exists.
What you can say is that the same myths have been constantly recycled and adapted through history, based on a number of mythical deities. The Jews do not believe Jesus is God made flesh, Christians do not believe Allah is the same God as Jesus made flesh. As Muslims believe that Allah deceived Christians by allowing Christians to believe Jesus died on the cross and actually hail Allah as the greatest of deceivers. Would in fact place him in comparability to what Christians already call the  character with the same title of greatest deceiver, that being the devil. Of course these are all myths, and it is in this context we should be looking at these mythical claims.

You can go all the way back to the ancient Sumerians, to find the very first origins of the Abrahamic beliefs, through the deities Enlil and Enki.  Enlil represents the vengeful aspects of the Old Testament and Enki, the aspects that saves and looks after humanity. In fact what you find that the symbol for Enki, is that of the double helix serpent and it is he that gifts humanity with wisdom. Though we see this later changed in the bible to see him replaced as the God who looks out and cares for humans to be portrayed as Satan. This is a good example of how myths have been recycled. We see the Egyptian worship of the Aten also recycled in Judaism. We see Christianity form from a mixture of Mithraism, which is in itself recycled from Zoroastrian. Mixtures of Osiris and Judaism. Islam though recycles back to a more vengeful  type of deity found in Judaism, but they are essentially the same myths being recycled and adapted. I mean we have all seen the pictures of this deity as an old man with a beard? Where did that come from, the ancient Greeks and Romans, which is nothing more than  the recycle of the deities Zeus and Jupiter image.

What is blatantly clear is that there are all ideologies and people claiming nobody should be critical or ridicule such ideologies are fundamentally backing Blasphemy. Created to criminalize any criticism of such beliefs. No ideology is beyond criticism and ridicule. If you think they are, then you are then also of the belief that Nazism, racism, homophobia, to name just a few ideologies should also be protected from criticism and ridicule. People seem to think people like Muhhamad, Moses and Jesus should also be protected from such ridicule, why? They are supposed historical characters who at least two endorsed slavery and the executions of peoples. Jesus is believed to come back at the head of a army and commit mass genocide. Now when you look at other historical characters, does anyone say they should not be ridiculed for the deeds they committed in life?

No, but place a mythical belief around their lives and people think they should be protected from any such criticism. To those people, I say, tough.  As all you do is then deny free speech and allow such poor beliefs to be protected against any rightful and just criticisms. People should be protected from discrimination, not myths or ideologies. I mean look at how bad religious people are that the very aspect of people reasoning that the belief is based on some abhorrent beliefs, allows people to get upset. Well children get upset when they find out Santa Claus. Was just a historical character and does not visit your home on Christmas Eve delivering presents. You know what? They get over this very quickly. Yet adults get so upset over being told their god does not exist, they will literal in some cases murder people over being told their God does not exist. Showing the problem is religious people. Showing the stupidity of literal religious belief, more so how in some countries people are punished for this of even cannot leave their faith on pain of death. To even claim as I say that I should not be critical of say the Jewish or Christian deity, when its claimed they wiped out the first born of Egypt, innocent children. Just so this deity could prove he was God and the Pharaoh would then release the Israelites. Is barbaric, being as its claimed this deity could do anything and could have simply freed them without any child sacrifices. Again if you think I should not show the greatest distain for such barbarity, you can again tough.  As its absurd when people who state I should not be critical, are allowing countless people to continue to venerate something so barbaric and again defending Blasphemy. On top of that by default, each and every religion insults the other by their very nature of its belief system, when it claims the other is wrong. If you think it does not, then you are misguided, as Islam claims Jesus did not die on the cross and is not the God made flesh. This is Blasphemy to a Christian, showing the absurdity of religious literal belief itself.

As to those claiming they just believe in a deity and the problem is perception, then I say tough to your beliefs. Or to the claim you are not religious, as religion by definition is the belief in a supernatural being creator God. That makes you religious; you just may not have as much dogma you believe in as other religions. As this comes from an arrogance that somehow humans are special and that some deity either is so weak that it does nothing and allows countless to suffer. Or this deity is all powerful and simply does not care to intervene. It can only be one or the other.  The reality is if a God does exist and is all powerful, the reality is we are more than likely alongside all other forms of life, nothing more than lab rats. Something so intelligence is not going to be swayed or moved by emotions, as that is a human trait and even found in other animals. We are more likely nothing more than an experiment on seeing if life takes hold through the creation of an explosion, the big bang. As why do people think this deity simple cares or is emotive enough to care to create you and then offer you some fantastical after life? Only arrogance that deems we are in some way special creates this. You do not even have to believe in a deity to believe in spirituality. If life does exist after death, its likely it has zero to do with anything creator and we simply are the players of a game, which like any computer game has glitches which allow players after they die in the game to sometimes recall previous game plays where they had died. If people put far more into this life than being in a perpetual state of fear over what may happen, then they might learn to love and embrace the very real life that we know exists.
People should start enjoying this.

Lastly to the points which are defending terrorism and murder based off the events 150 years ago, is nothing short of bollocks. By doing so and claiming a wrong done, is then allowing others to make the same daft claim. Where with Islamic aggressive colonialism, then justifies the Crusades based off wrongs done to Christianity. Its this same argument which would then justify Hitlers invasion of Poland based off Germany being the aggressor in WW1 and have consequences for its action. Then Hitler could go off claimed wrongs, based off Germany losing, but I do not even need to use the same poor methodology to show how absurd that is. I can show that countless non-Muslims countries that were colonized, by the Europeans, have not seen any levels of terrorism against the west based off these past wrongs. I mean where is all the terrorism from the Vietmanese against the US, based on such a conflict> Where is all the German terrorism, based off the very real crimes against humanity suffered by the civilian population in the last years of the war? Where is the terrorism from the Japanese? The Black South Africans? The Nambians, who suffered genocide under Imperial Germany? You see the false charge made is done with one aspct in mind, to deflect awy from the real cause Islamic, Transgression,  Jihad and Martyrdom. The very same people will not claim there was no religious aspect to the Crusades, they will definitely state there was, but when it comes to islam, you get to see some of the worst double standards and unfounded claims made on history which simply have no validity.
The best thing I read that describes religion is this.

“Religion is a like a disease of the human mind. It’s like rabies. You get bitten and suddenly there’s this great foaming of the mouth, all sense and reason thrown to the wind. There’s a lot of shouting and then you bite someone else in all the madness and it gets passed on down the line across generations and national boundaries. Forget Aids, this stuff kills millions.”

which is why you are an invaild voice, You Beleive in no gods or the possiblity of no gods

I have said before that, "If Jehova exists he is clearly the God of Lies and Deciet."
As an Agnostic Polythiest that still fits.

AND THERE IS NO GOOD, only perspectives so that voids the rest of your propoganda riddden post.
Because Yes In the Nazis opinon it did justify it, in the Christians opinon in did justify it, in the jihadis opinon is does justify it what they do now and in the new neo-nazis opinon that justifies the mistreatment of Mulism
IF You think it justifies it or not is irrelevent because it is goign to happen, Justification is simply not part of the equation.

Logical analysis is:
WHAT is occuring, WHY is it occuring and HOW can we stop it.

so No one with a brain is even thinking Jusitification, we are disucssion the reasons WHY.
and the HOW, which in part is to Stop the Hypocrites Ignorant and Racists in the West making things worse with their intolerable xenophobic propoganda.

So you say my point is invalid based on an opinion not reason.

Again the simple point holds, they are myths, where is the evidence they exist?

There is none, so to argue off 3 religions formed one after the other has to be based on myths, as neither believer believes the other to be true and in essecence you are claiming by default Muslims are right then over the others based on your flawed reasoning.


I see you failed to answer the rest of my points, so why as usual am I not surprised.

Let me know when you want to answer them, I am not going to go around in circles with you. You offer no reasson but do this:



Your methodology would place Islamic imperialism as at fault for all the worlds problems today, that is what you fail to grasp failing to fundementally understand Islamism itself. You failed to address the problems of transgression, jihad and martydom, which Islamists all invoke when committing to terrorism. Again why is it we do not see terrorism from countless non-Muslim countries that were colonised by the Europeans, who suffered far worse than any Muslim country with the exampls I have already shown you. Also on that why have we not see countless Christian terrorism in the middle east based off the genocide of the Armeanians, the ethnic cleansing over the last few centuries and last few decades of persecution, murder and now again genoicide? You see your methodology is flawed. That is why claims to western help of which it has been help to arab nations, to claim justifies terrorism, makes you a terrorist apologist. Where half a million are dead due to a civil war between a tyrant, Islamists, ISIS and the few non-Militant syrians, does not create Muslims in droves drawn to the conflict angered at the mass murder by Muslims themselves. But people drawn instead to believe its okay to rape and keep little girls as sex slaves and murder people not only in the Middle east but worl over, whether Muslim or not. Hate and Islamic doctrine draws people and places off a fear formed around a lie that states the west is out to destroy Islam. Next you will be telling me religion had nothing to do with the crusades. You claim some isolated incidents or torture or wrongful killings by allied forces, or collaterol damage are more outrageous than hundreds of thousands of deaths by Islamists themselves and even the fact we do not see any such reprecussions happen even from the likes of the Vietmanese, who suffered more than many in the 20th century from US war crimes.

Your argument was over as soon as you began to write, one because you simple are clouded by emotions when you debate, as you see constantly through the lends of hate and negativity and fail to understand a single point in history. As seen yout arguments would squarley place the blame all the way back to Islamic imperialism using the methodology of past wrongs, which Islamic imperialism was unprovoked and aggressive, when two Empires were at their weakest from frighting each other. The Byzantines and Sasanian Empire.

If you fail to address all my points from the first post and this one, dont expect any further replies on this, as I will not waste my time further when you constantly avoid 95% of my points

Goodnight

not flawed at all it is the exact same reasoning we use to determine that the Odessey Follows the Illiad, Talks about the previous charaters and events in past tense.

And yours is clouded by hate and non acceptance of you own tribes faults.

there is no logical division between ISIS mindset and Major's or any Ethno-Nationalistic group.
You keep going back to a book, the BOOK isn't doing it.
OR If it is a book Which book is Major reading?

which is also Why Justification is not relevant.

which is why every ascept of your post is Wrong
you just seek to blame but not solve.
thus you are the same as them.
You choose to make Enemies rather than seek progress.

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:

Yes I do read the 'bloody threads'...the ones that interest me anyway.

Since I joined here I have seen a lot more derogatory remarks aimed at Rags and her faith than I have seen against anyone else....so maybe you don't read as much as me.

Thanks for the lessons on religion and it's history....but I could not care less.
I prefer to live in the here and now rather than seize every opportunity to preach about how very bad so and so was centuries ago.  

You dont believe in the here and now you live in the Old fanstasy land why Christian are different than Muslims
you said "God or God or Buddha" Literally Your Origianls Statement is nonsense born in ignroance.

Your opinon is irrelvant since it is not based in facts or reality but Dumb ass propoganda.
EDUCATION is the key to just about everything INCLUDING fixing the Fools that currently inhabit the UK causeing So much Racial Hatred through their Arrogant ignorance.

Never tell me again I dont know that England is Shit house
I dont care, i dont have to care like you think you dont have to care.
Which is Why you, one of the relatively ok brits, is STILL an Ignorant raicst causing hatred towards the West and the Uk through an absoultle intorelable level of ignorance and arrogance.

And Dont say you are not a hillshepherd, YOU HAVE literally just given the exact thought process of a hillshepherd "you think your tiny little hill is the world and the here and now is explained but the miniscule bit you want to see."

SO STOP COMPLAINING WHEN SOMEONE MAKES A VAILD OBSERVATION  SUPPORTED BY YOUR OWN ASSERTIONS

England is great. You're just jealous because you're not English and never will be.

England is a shit house? your full of it, you'v never been here, you'r just an ignorant racist Aussie. Your safe behind your Pc so you can make insulting remarks without fear of getting a "knuckle sandwich".

Big mouth coward is what you are, a real example of a keyboard warrior.
I wouldn't piss on you if you were on fire, what an example of an neutral moderator.

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:

Yes I do read the 'bloody threads'...the ones that interest me anyway.

Since I joined here I have seen a lot more derogatory remarks aimed at Rags and her faith than I have seen against anyone else....so maybe you don't read as much as me.

Thanks for the lessons on religion and it's history....but I could not care less.
I prefer to live in the here and now rather than seize every opportunity to preach about how very bad so and so was centuries ago.  

You dont believe in the here and now you live in the Old fanstasy land why Christian are different than Muslims
you said "God or God or Buddha" Literally Your Origianls Statement is nonsense born in ignroance.

Your opinon is irrelvant since it is not based in facts or reality but Dumb ass propoganda.
EDUCATION is the key to just about everything INCLUDING fixing the Fools that currently inhabit the UK causeing So much Racial Hatred through their Arrogant ignorance.

Never tell me again I dont know that England is Shit house
I dont care, i dont have to care like you think you dont have to care.
Which is Why you, one of the relatively ok brits, is STILL an Ignorant raicst causing hatred towards the West and the Uk through an absoultle intorelable level of ignorance and arrogance.

And Dont say you are not a hillshepherd, YOU HAVE literally just given the exact thought process of a hillshepherd "you think your tiny little hill is the world and the here and now is explained but the miniscule bit you want to see."

SO STOP COMPLAINING WHEN SOMEONE MAKES A VAILD OBSERVATION  SUPPORTED BY YOUR OWN ASSERTIONS

You talk about 'dumb ass propaganda'...then continuously male sweeping statements about England and the English when it's obvious you are blinded by some sort of intense dislike and discrimination against both.
Had you ever actually been to England and lived amongst us you might be in a position to judge, as it is you just believe everything you read and hear third hand......plus you imagine the small % of Brits who post here speak for everyone.

They don't, we are all individuals, some good some bad some nice some not so, just like Australians, Americans and anyone else you care to mention.

In the above post you call me an ignorant racist....that's exactly how you come across everytime you generalise about a country and it's inhabitants you know sweet sod all about.

he's just an ignorant sheep shagger

Out where veya lives... a sheep tied to a lamp post is called a leisure centre!