Some questions about Brexit, and what I think about it

by Ben Reilly Sun Jun 26, 2016 7:01 pm

First topic message reminder :

I'd welcome answers from anyone. I'm just (like many other people, around the world and in the UK) trying to better understand why this happened.

1) Why did British people feel the UK had to leave the EU? Please be as specific as possible about how EU membership created more harm than benefit for the UK.

2) What laws were imposed upon the UK, against the will of the British, by the EU?

3) For Brexit supporters -- if you could choose the top priorities for post-EU Britain, what would they be?

My position is that I support democracy, self-determination and freedom of expression. However, just like individuals, people acting in groups don't always make the wisest decisions. My country elected Bush for president in 2004. The hope for democracy is not that it will be perfect in the short term, but self-correcting in the long term.

I conclude that Brexit was unwise not because I am opposed to democracy, freedom, self-determination or free expression, or because I hate the British and want to see them under Europe's thumb, but because of the economic consequences of the decision. The devaluation of the pound, the hits to global stocks and the lowered credit rating issued by Moody's show that my concern is not unfounded.

Economic experts have said there's a chance that Brexit could kick off another global recession, and listening to the opinions of people who know what they're talking about does not make me a negative or selfish person.

Finally, the reason democracy exists in the first place is because people don't always agree. If you value democracy, therefore, you must accept the fact that people are allowed to disagree with you.

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 3:45 pm

The lies came from the Remainians and all those who sold us down the eu river over the last few decades...

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 3:47 pm

£350 million a week into the NHS???

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 3:51 pm

Nobody ever said that...

What was said was that the eu budget is £350 million a week...

We can get back control over that money.

And we can use some of it to put into funding the NHS.

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:16 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:

Nobody ever said that...

What was said was that the eu budget is £350 million a week...

We can get back control over that money.

And we can use some of it to put into funding the NHS.

They emblazoned it on buses, imbecile!

by Guest Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:21 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:Nobody ever said that...
What was said was that the eu budget is £350 million a week...
We can get back control over that money.
And we can use some of it to put into funding the NHS.
They emblazoned it on buses, imbecile!

Oh, don't just hate that selective fake handicap - "I didn't see it so it can't have existed", ploy!
Some questions about Brexit, and what I think about it - Page 3 Blind-man

Some questions about Brexit, and what I think about it - Page 3 Blind-man

But the image was put up on a topic here Suspect

by HoratioTarr Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:34 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:

Nobody ever said that...

What was said was that the eu budget is £350 million a week...

We can get back control over that money.

And we can use some of it to put into funding the NHS.

The biggest payers are the Dutch: every one them sends almost four times as much than us to Brussels. No wonder they want their own referendum.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/eureferendum/12176663/EU-Facts-how-much-does-Britain-pay-to-the-EU-budget.html

by HoratioTarr Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:41 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:

Nobody ever said that...

What was said was that the eu budget is £350 million a week...

We can get back control over that money.

And we can use some of it to put into funding the NHS.

They emblazoned it on buses, imbecile!

Just one bus, that's all.

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:50 pm

And the money was widely discussed... nobody ever claimed that leaving the eu would mean spending the whole eu budget of £350 million a week on the NHS.

In fact the Remainian camp were adamant that we never even had a eu budget of £350 million a week...

The argument was clear yhat we would be taking back control of the £350 million a week and taking back control over our laws rules and regulatory making powers, as well as our fisheries and agriculture policies and our borders...

We don't need anyone else to have any control over any of these just you do a bit of trade.

by Raggamuffin Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:50 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:

Nobody ever said that...

What was said was that the eu budget is £350 million a week...

We can get back control over that money.

And we can use some of it to put into funding the NHS.

They emblazoned it on buses, imbecile!

Who did? Nigel Farage is not in a position to promise how public money is spent, and everyone knew that. Nobody promised anything, they said - let's spend the money on the NHS instead.

by Raggamuffin Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:52 pm

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:53 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:

Oh, surely NOBODY could read that and get the impression that the EU payment was going straight to the NHS. I mean, come on -- it's as clear as can be!

You people are the spawn of Satan, I swear.

by Raggamuffin Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:54 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Oh, surely NOBODY could read that and get the impression that the EU payment was going straight to the NHS. I mean, come on -- it's as clear as can be!

You people are the spawn of Satan, I swear.

Exactly! Nobody would read that and assume that the money would go to the NHS. It's you who's claiming it was a promise of some kind.

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:57 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Oh, surely NOBODY could read that and get the impression that the EU payment was going straight to the NHS. I mean, come on -- it's as clear as can be!

You people are the spawn of Satan, I swear.

Exactly! Nobody would read that and assume that the money would go to the NHS. It's you who's claiming it was a promise of some kind.

Let you in on a little secret? It's not just me, darlin'. Evil or Very Mad

by Raggamuffin Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:58 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Exactly! Nobody would read that and assume that the money would go to the NHS. It's you who's claiming it was a promise of some kind.

Let you in on a little secret? It's not just me, darlin'.

So you would have taken that as a promise of some kind?

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:00 pm

The money was widely discussed...

We have a gross contribution to the EU of £350 million every week...

Some of that money comes back but controled by the eu as to how it is spent... a small bit comes back as a rebate... the rest disappears into the eu and we never see it again...

Nigel Farages bus said " let's take back control of our country" and "we'll be better off by £34million a day if we do"...

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:39 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Exactly! Nobody would read that and assume that the money would go to the NHS. It's you who's claiming it was a promise of some kind.

Let you in on a little secret? It's not just me, darlin'.

So you would have taken that as a promise of some kind?

The implication is clear, stop playing games.

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:43 pm

The money was widely discussed...

And nobody ever said £350 million a day extra would be going into the NHS!!!

People voted out to take back control of the money and take back control of our country.

Stop clutching at straws ..

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:53 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:The money was widely discussed...

And nobody ever said £350 million a day extra would be going into the NHS!!!

People voted out to take back control of the money and take back control of our country.

Stop clutching at straws ..

Well no, they said that much a week, not a day. Even ol' Niggle had to admit it was a mistake for Leave to claim it, you might have seen that on TV.

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:57 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:The money was widely discussed...

We have a gross contribution to the EU of £350 million every week...

Some of that money comes back but controled by the eu as to how it is spent... a small bit comes back as a rebate... the rest disappears into the eu and we never see it again...

Nigel Farages bus said " let's take back control of our country" and "we'll be better off by £34million a day if we do"...

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 5:59 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:The money was widely discussed...

We have a gross contribution to the EU of £350 million every week...

Some of that money comes back but controled by the eu as to how it is spent... a small bit comes back as a rebate... the rest disappears into the eu and we never see it again...

Nigel Farages bus said " let's take back control of our country" and "we'll be better off by £34million a day if we do"...

Now you're just sticking your fingers in your ears and going "Nanananananana"

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:01 pm

I am telling you what happened... you just don't want to hear it...

Stop clutching at straws.

And dry your eyes mate...

by eddie Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:04 pm

by Raggamuffin Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:04 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

So you would have taken that as a promise of some kind?

The implication is clear, stop playing games.

It's you who's playing games. Come off it - the message is clear. It's saying that not paying the EU would free up the money for other things - there's no way it's saying that it's a promise to put it into the NHS.

by Raggamuffin Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:05 pm

I didn't even see that bus anyway, or anything about it, so it didn't sway me.

by Ben Reilly Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:28 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:I am telling you what happened... you just don't want to hear it...

Stop clutching at straws.

And dry your eyes mate...

No tears here -- I don't cry when people lie to me, I just deliver a verbal ass-whooping, like I did to you.

by eddie Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:29 pm

eddie wrote:

This bus?

by nicko Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:30 pm

A verbal ass whooping? is that what you call it?

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 6:54 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:I am telling you what happened... you just don't want to hear it...

Stop clutching at straws.

And dry your eyes mate...

No tears here -- I don't cry when people lie to me, I just deliver a verbal ass-whooping, like I did to you.

I don't lie.

by eddie Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:08 pm

Well fuck the bus then Some questions about Brexit, and what I think about it - Page 3 3201073460

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:13 pm

What about the bus eddie?

by eddie Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:14 pm

Never mind Rolling Eyes

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:18 pm

No... come on...?

What about the bus?

by eddie Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:24 pm

You and Ben were discussing Farage's bus and the slogan.
I found the bus I thought you were talking about ^^^^^

No mention of money?

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:26 pm

He was talking about the leave bus... with boris and the labour mp on it...

I mentioned Farage bus too...

by Tommy Monk Tue Jun 28, 2016 7:35 pm

Nigel Farages bus said " let's take back control of our country" and he said "we'll be better off by £34million a day if we do"...

The £350 million a week is the UK budget for the eu... about half of that goes into the eu and we never see it again...

Of the rest... we get a small amount back in a rebate... and the rest comes back to the UK but under the control of eu on where and how it is spent here...

This was made abundantly clear by all the leave camp and others on the leave side...

by Syl Tue Jun 28, 2016 8:20 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
Syl wrote:

AND you wear treggings.

Just an observation...we have voted out, the majority of Great Britain agreed, so.......
There will be many difficulties cos it's unchartered territory ,and there does seem to have been less planning by the government on where we start this new journey than would have been sensible.

But tearing each other apart, seeing the very worse aspect of our society being given free reign, will be the MAIN thing that makes our exit fail imho.

Also, does anyone really believe that all this terrible violence by a minority against immigrants and ethnic people wouldn't have happened if we'd voted to Remain? Of course it would. That's the nature of these idiots.

It could have been worse if we had remained....a frustrated racist is no doubt as bad as a smug one. Twisted Evil

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