One lefty thread after another

[Clarkson]

First topic message reminder :

The cut and paste Queen and the "I don't support Labour" disingenuous Jock who clearly works for them for nothing reprint Guardian news pieces and Labour propaganda adnauseum.

Eeee! its just like Speakfree.


Havent seen any rebuttals on RW posts just thread after thread of Labour news.


You goons couldn't debate to save your lives.

Adios I'll leave you to kill off another forum.

[veya_victaous]

@phil or any Uk poster
is it true your checkout people don't put stuff in the bag when you pay?
The French don't which I think is retarded
It might sound irrelevant but it might change my opinion, you see we are quite left wing here but most people work hard and recognise that we put our taxes into a communal basket and only as much can come out as goes in. There are enough Australians (probably because 25% are born overseas) that are grateful enough to be here that we are fine with paying towards it knowing that we are generating prosperity but by its nature it is not very even in it distribution. Plus maybe the Aboriginals, we all sort of accept we should pay to bring them up to speed since we have taken their land so that we know part of the social security we pay is sort of 'rent' to the traditional owners. I don't know but I am wondering how different the UK attitude is.


I normally support the French but Jesus.. "I cant put it in a bag, we had a revolution, it's like slavery" get off your arse and do some work.  ::sexbnan: 

Don't think that's the problem Veya, it's just not something we have ever done, and to be honest the set up in supermarkets etc means that assistants don't get a chance to help.   I don't think anyone would actually object to doing it.

It sort of is, you're too slow to take up innovation and stuck in an old world mindset. Traditions are nice and all but they are often frivolous. For example getting the counter staff to be able to do it is a simple as installing a bag rack (you load a bunch of bags on the end when you pull one off it opens the next one and holds it open, thus bagging the goods is no more effort than putting on the counter) they are so common here my brother took them for granted and commented what a huge difference they make, the whole counter process is faster. it was just one of dozens of little things that bring inefficiency to your economy.

But from what you say it is possibly more about investment than a cultural thing. (our super markets 'remodel' every 5-10 years most recent change was self service scanners so you can swipe your own goods and just pay with a card)

My point, which I haven't made clear, is that there are more ways to improve the economy than just cutting social security. If the gov't needs more money it could always create the condition in which it could earn more by growing the economy thus getting more taxes. Supporting investment in efficiency is a way to do that. Also over time it must cost a lot more to fix roads the old fashion way, why haven't your gov't invested in the quite good modern road building/repairing equipment out of the USA? There does need to be spending to make savings. these are just things noticed by a traveller, I'm sure if you delved into the details of the way your gov't spends to maintain infrastructure you could find lots more.

[Beekeeper]

I am still waiting for the left to explain why so many people are irresponsible with their money and how they expect everyone else to pay for their stupidity?

    YOU mean the righteous Tories who are the ones who cause the GFCs, recessions and depressions, then bail out their own cousins and children at the taxpayers expenses; AND they go off and fight foreign wars with billions $/£/€ in taxpayers money ~ and THEN they do just what PhilDidge and Drinky both do, and attempt to lay the blame off on their mythical "lefty" foes !  

The left play off guilt constantly and fail to see the bigger picture, they fail to see how many people, have had to endure hardship because of the recession left by a left wing Government incapable of managing its finances, which is odd as the same people are trying to excuse this as well as others not being able to manage their finances because they refuse to accept that people place their material wealth over what is more important.

THAT'S what the Tories are actually doing, isn't it ! Not the "left" ~ the "recession" was caused by Tory financiers playing around with other people's money, a.k.a. the "GFC"; as for the Blair government itself they were always rated internationally as a "conservative" political group (they were never a "left wing" nor "liberal" government..) !  

That is the reality of the left, blame and guilt!

  

YET ANOTHER load of lying Tory-apologist rubbish talk == the Tories create the messes, rip off the taxpayers, bail out their idiot financiers, break their countries ~ and THEN they make up these nonsensical "blame and guilt" fairytales to salve their self-inflicted financial wounds. ALL so typical of their denialist conservative mindsets.  

[Original Quill]

I am still waiting for the left to explain why so many people are irresponsible with their money and how they expect everyone else to pay for their stupidity?

    YOU mean the righteous Tories who are the ones who cause the GFCs, recessions and depressions, then bail out their own cousins and children at the taxpayers expenses; AND they go off and fight foreign wars with billions $/£/€ in taxpayers money ~ and THEN they do just what PhilDidge and Drinky both do, and attempt to lay the blame off on their mythical "lefty" foes !  

The left play off guilt constantly and fail to see the bigger picture, they fail to see how many people, have had to endure hardship because of the recession left by a left wing Government incapable of managing its finances, which is odd as the same people are trying to excuse this as well as others not being able to manage their finances because they refuse to accept that people place their material wealth over what is more important.

THAT'S what the Tories are actually doing, isn't it ! Not the "left" ~ the "recession" was caused by Tory financiers playing around with other people's money, a.k.a. the "GFC"; as for the Blair government itself they were always rated internationally as a "conservative" political group (they were never a "left wing" nor "liberal" government..) !   

That is the reality of the left, blame and guilt!

  

YET ANOTHER load of lying Tory-apologist rubbish talk == the Tories create the messes, rip off the taxpayers, bail out their idiot financiers, break their countries ~ and THEN they make up these nonsensical "blame and guilt" fairytales to salve their self-inflicted financial wounds. ALL so typical of their denialist conservative mindsets.  

I couldn't have said it better.  Didge, I thought you had some brains.  How could you work yourself into this position?  For god's sake man, you went to school.  Was it to no avail? Have you never taken a course in Keynesian economics?

Psh... I'm disappointed in you.

[Guest]

I am still waiting for the left to explain why so many people are irresponsible with their money and how they expect everyone else to pay for their stupidity?

    YOU mean the righteous Tories who are the ones who cause the GFCs, recessions and depressions, then bail out their own cousins and children at the taxpayers expenses; AND they go off and fight foreign wars with billions $/£/€ in taxpayers money ~ and THEN they do just what PhilDidge and Drinky both do, and attempt to lay the blame off on their mythical "lefty" foes !  

The left play off guilt constantly and fail to see the bigger picture, they fail to see how many people, have had to endure hardship because of the recession left by a left wing Government incapable of managing its finances, which is odd as the same people are trying to excuse this as well as others not being able to manage their finances because they refuse to accept that people place their material wealth over what is more important.

THAT'S what the Tories are actually doing, isn't it ! Not the "left" ~ the "recession" was caused by Tory financiers playing around with other people's money, a.k.a. the "GFC"; as for the Blair government itself they were always rated internationally as a "conservative" political group (they were never a "left wing" nor "liberal" government..) !   

That is the reality of the left, blame and guilt!

  

YET ANOTHER load of lying Tory-apologist rubbish talk == the Tories create the messes, rip off the taxpayers, bail out their idiot financiers, break their countries ~ and THEN they make up these nonsensical "blame and guilt" fairytales to salve their self-inflicted financial wounds. ALL so typical of their denialist conservative mindsets.  

Never laughed so much in all my life failing to answer my points again a typical view held by the left ignore the real problems that create many problems and do as they always do use blame and guilt, thank you for proving my point Bee

[Guest]

  

YET ANOTHER load of lying Tory-apologist rubbish talk == the Tories create the messes, rip off the taxpayers, bail out their idiot financiers, break their countries ~ and THEN they make up these nonsensical "blame and guilt" fairytales to salve their self-inflicted financial wounds. ALL so typical of their denialist conservative mindsets.  

I couldn't have said it better.  Didge, I thought you had some brains.  How could you work yourself into this position?  For god's sake man, you went to school.  Was it to no avail?  Have you never taken a course in Keynesian economics?

Psh... I'm disappointed in you.

Actually he proved my point aptly what the left do Quill, here try again:


I am still waiting for the left to explain why so many people are irresponsible with their money and how they expect everyone else to pay for their stupidity?

 

The left play off guilt constantly and fail to see the bigger picture, they fail to see how many people, have had to endure hardship because of the recession left by a left wing Government incapable of managing its finances, which is odd as the same people are trying to excuse this as well as others not being able to manage their finances because they refuse to accept that people place their material wealth over what is more important.

[Guest]

Your perception of the Aboriginals of bringing up to speed, why? Your perception plus the fact they had simple lives that has been corrupted and ruined by modern technology has in anyway a view that your way of life is better, is it? The reality is they only took what was needed and no more than was needed, yes they may have even over hunted at times in the past but have learnt from this. So maybe you need to be brought up to speed with their way of life and in fact it is you yourself that is lacking in enlightenment as they are.

No I Actually think the ones that live in areas where we haven't disrupted them would be better off left alone, but the UN keeps telling us we have too bring medicine and housing to them, but any structure is against their culture so... we are sort of at a loss what to do.  ::dunno::  But there are far more than just the desert aboriginals, there are plenty that can no longer live their traditional life style because we have built cities or farms or mines on their land. It is these ones that we need to bring up to speed  if they are going to survive in the modern world which has been thrust upon them. (no they cant just move with the others they are actually different people, but they all get called aboriginal) It really isn't about better but there isn't the animals and plants around for them to live a hunter gather life style in the city, they need to eat so they will need money. we give it too them, as well as education or anything that will give them employment opportunities. most people knowledgeable about the situation agree it will take generations and that is just looking at the ones we have displaced.
And it is not enlightenment but practicality, I would seriously consider the aboriginal lifestyle (the weather is good enough here, the food grows all year round) if it was at all feasible in the modern over populated world.    

Again what right do you have to say who should be like you Veya?
You are thus enforcing what you think onto people who will disagree with you in that their form of life is worse than yours based upon you own perceptions of what is it that is called being civilized.
Why do you need money when you can live off the land, it is those so called people who claim civilization that have made their lifestyle difficult by how they have changed the dynamics of the continent for them.
So you have failed to point out why your way of life is better in any way.

[Original Quill]

I couldn't have said it better.  Didge, I thought you had some brains.  How could you work yourself into this position?  For god's sake man, you went to school.  Was it to no avail?  Have you never taken a course in Keynesian economics?

Psh... I'm disappointed in you.

Actually he proved my point aptly what the left do Quill, here try again:


I am still waiting for the left to explain why so many people are irresponsible with their money and how they expect everyone else to pay for their stupidity?

 

The left play off guilt constantly and fail to see the bigger picture, they fail to see how many people, have had to endure hardship because of the recession left by a left wing Government incapable of managing its finances, which is odd as the same people are trying to excuse this as well as others not being able to manage their finances because they refuse to accept that people place their material wealth over what is more important.

Silly nonsense, didge. You have unfounded, dubious allegations, not legitimate questions. You don't get to leap from silly allegations to questions. You know better.

Particularly appalling when you have contrary evidence right before you. The present economic situation is the direct result of worldwide market plays by RW manipulators in Cornhill and Wall Street, bolstered by RW politicians who respond to money rather than public weal.

[Guest]

Actually he proved my point aptly what the left do Quill, here try again:


I am still waiting for the left to explain why so many people are irresponsible with their money and how they expect everyone else to pay for their stupidity?

 

The left play off guilt constantly and fail to see the bigger picture, they fail to see how many people, have had to endure hardship because of the recession left by a left wing Government incapable of managing its finances, which is odd as the same people are trying to excuse this as well as others not being able to manage their finances because they refuse to accept that people place their material wealth over what is more important.

Silly nonsense, didge.  You have unfounded, dubious allegations, not legitimate questions.  You don't get to leap from silly allegations to questions.  You know better.

Particularly appalling when you have contrary evidence right before you.  The present economic situation is the direct result of worldwide market plays by RW manipulators in Cornhill and Wall Street, bolstered by RW politicians who respond to money rather than public weal.

Sorry Quill but you are badly ignoring a growing problem with many people in the west how they live beyond their means and again you cannot even refute this you just say this is not the case when the reality is many people get themselves into debt. The reality is some people again on low incomes manage very well and yet place others in similar situations and they are in debt and the Government is blamed, sorry that is bollocks, as in most cases it will be down to individuals who cannot manage their money, this is what the left never are able to explain.
I am all for better money management help for people but if you ignore this problem it is like burying your head in the sand and getting to the root cause of the problem. You have fine examples of posters on here that are on low incomes and mange their money well and I coming from a poor background learnt the value of money and how to manage this because my parents did not live beyond their means. The reality is this is the case who ever is in charge and you are in fact excusing people being irresponsible with their money and trying as stated to use this as a tool to have a go at the present Coalition, that is poor to say the least.

Top understand a problem you get to the root cause and credit has allowed some people to live beyond their means, because some people are just very irresponsible with money and place material wealth over what is necessary!

[Guest]

  

YET ANOTHER load of lying Tory-apologist rubbish talk == the Tories create the messes, rip off the taxpayers, bail out their idiot financiers, break their countries ~ and THEN they make up these nonsensical "blame and guilt" fairytales to salve their self-inflicted financial wounds. ALL so typical of their denialist conservative mindsets.  

I couldn't have said it better.  Didge, I thought you had some brains.  How could you work yourself into this position?  For god's sake man, you went to school.  Was it to no avail?  Have you never taken a course in Keynesian economics?

Psh... I'm disappointed in you.

It appears that you have just learned about Keynes in school - you seem very excited about him.

No need for any country to ever be in trouble again if it's so widely acknowledged that Keynes solved all economic problems 60-odd years ago...

[Lurker]

I've never understood how facts and truth are considered "left wing."

[Original Quill]

I couldn't have said it better.  Didge, I thought you had some brains.  How could you work yourself into this position?  For god's sake man, you went to school.  Was it to no avail?  Have you never taken a course in Keynesian economics?

Psh... I'm disappointed in you.

It appears that you have just learned about Keynes in school -  you seem very excited about him.

No need for any country to ever be in trouble again if it's so widely acknowledged that Keynes solved all economic problems 60-odd years ago...

And you didn't learn anything of the sort in school, did you?  The one thing that Keynes couldn't solve is ignorance and obstinance.  As long as we have RW politicians and meddlers touting their amateur market theories in policy, we will never advance to any kind of success.  

Take austerity.  What backward-looking ass thought that one up(?): the way to crank up the economy is to shut 'er down for a few months.  It's like a mechanic saying, park it and set the brake...she'll fix herself.

[Guest]

It appears that you have just learned about Keynes in school -  you seem very excited about him.

No need for any country to ever be in trouble again if it's so widely acknowledged that Keynes solved all economic problems 60-odd years ago...

And you didn't learn anything of the sort in school, did you?  The one thing that Keynes couldn't solve is ignorance and obstinance.  As long as we have RW politicians and meddlers touting their amateur market theories in policy, we will never advance to any kind of success.  

Take austerity.  What backward-look ass thought that one up(?): the way to crank up the economy is to shut 'er down for a few months.  It's like a mechanic saying, park it and set the brake...she'll fix herself.

Yes, all them RW leaders in Europe who have chosen austerity...

lol

[Guest]

So our economy is recognized as growing far better than the rest of the EU who had different policies and this proves that austerity has failed?

Which bit of fast growth is showing an economy that is not indeed cracked up?

[Original Quill]

All Keynes ever said is that government is a player in the economy--a big player.  The ignorant ones want to sit that player down.  Suppose we decided to sit down other players.  No investors.  No labour.  No entrepreneurship.   Park 'er and she'll fix herself.

I understand why RW'ers hate educated minds.  They fuss around with their ignorance too much.  If you guys want to go off on an island somewhere, and become naked, scared primates without protection, go ahead.  Get out of our way.

[Guest]

All Keynes ever said is that government is a player in the economy--a big player.  The ignorant ones want to sit that player down.  Suppose we decided to sit down other players.  No investors.  No labour.  No entrepreneurship.   Park 'er and she'll fix herself.

I understand why RW'ers hate educated minds.  They fuss around with their ignorance too much.  If you guys want to go off on an island somewhere, and become naked, scared primates without protection, go ahead.  Get out of our way.

I do not hate educated minds, again yet another poor stereotype Quill and having an educated mind does not always means people make the right decisions either.
You also do not need to have an education to be a genius, take Srinivasa Ramanujan for example.

[Guest]

So our economy is recognized as growing far better than the rest of the EU who had different policies and this proves that austerity has failed?

Which bit of fast growth is showing an economy that is not indeed cracked up?

Oh, many have chosen austerity - too late though.

[Guest]

I am just puzzled as to how the hell our economy is stuck and austerity is not working when we show relatively huge growth compared to others. I mean isnt France applying Keynesian economics and heading for disaster at a rate of knots.

[Guest]

Just read this about it:

.in the 1930s, it was only the USA that attempted to fight the post-1929 economic contraction with Keynesian stimulus policies and only the USA suffered a Great Depression. In England, the contraction stopped in 1932, France never saw double-digit unemployment, and the Japanese economy was actually enjoying significant growth.(1) This time, Europe, China, and Japan all followed the US lead and applied their own stimulus plans in 2009, which we are already seeing is now in the process of backfiring on everyone


http://conservapedia.com/Keynesian_economics

[Guest]

I am just puzzled as to how the hell our economy is stuck and austerity is not working when we show relatively huge growth compared to others.  I mean isnt France applying Keynesian economics and heading for disaster at a rate of knots.

Its not working Sphinx, because the few jobs that are being created are worthless jobs, requiring massive funding from the govt, low paid, part time, agency work, zero hours stuff....

I had an argument with drinky about state owned busines, esp core utilities (water/power etc) and renationalising them, and about subsidising our industry (not withstanding that the EU would get mardy) However he promptly got on his high horse about subsidised industry...and yet...THIS IS EXACTLY what is being done on a massive scale....not just a few mega important ones but the WHOLE of britains industry and even the sevices sector is DEPENDANT upon the biggest subsidy EVER.

As tax payers we subsidise industry on a massive scale but in a way that leaves it unaccountable, that allows the top end to rob the bottom end blind, screw the tax payer and pay them selves obscene levels of pay, whilst the people who actually CARRY the company (you know, the guy pushing paper, the mechanic fixing things etc) are left on the verge of destitution, and in fear of the bosses.

The name of that massive and expensive subsidy......TAX CREDITS.

[Guest]

All Keynes ever said is that government is a player in the economy--a big player.  The ignorant ones want to sit that player down.  Suppose we decided to sit down other players.  No investors.  No labour.  No entrepreneurship.   Park 'er and she'll fix herself.

I understand why RW'ers hate educated minds.  They fuss around with their ignorance too much.  If you guys want to go off on an island somewhere, and become naked, scared primates without protection, go ahead.  Get out of our way.

I do not hate educated minds, again yet another poor stereotype Quill and having an educated mind does not always means people make the right decisions either.
You also do not need to have an education to be a genius, take Srinivasa Ramanujan for example.  

Its growing faster now, because it was lower and needs to catch up.  The UK has had the slowest recovery from recession on record and needs to manage what has already been achieved in the US, Germany and Canada – to return national output to its level before the recession of 2008-09.

The growth is built on housing, the housing growth is built on sand, the main features of it being the huge rise in house prices in London and Birmingham, in London most of the property is being bought by rich elite from abroad.   The other thing that it is being built on is people spending their savings.   True growth comes from a growth in income, and that isn't happening.   In fact, Mark Carney had to pull mortgage lending back because of worries about a new housing bubble.

We need the right sort of growth, which means rising business investment and rising exports. The "wrong sort" of growth would be what happened previously,  consumers using their homes as cashpoints and running down savings to fund spending.   To tell which is happening, the trade figures will have to be watched carefully.

[Guest]

I do not hate educated minds, again yet another poor stereotype Quill and having an educated mind does not always means people make the right decisions either.
You also do not need to have an education to be a genius, take Srinivasa Ramanujan for example.  

Its growing faster now, because it was lower and needs to catch up.  The UK has had the slowest recovery from recession on record and needs to manage what has already been achieved in the US, Germany and Canada – to return national output to its level before the recession of 2008-09.

The growth is built on housing, the housing growth is built on sand, the main features of it being the huge rise in house prices in London and Birmingham, in London most of the property is being bought by rich elite from abroad.   The other thing that it is being built on is people spending their savings.   True growth comes from a growth in income, and that isn't happening.   In fact, Mark Carney had to pull mortgage lending back because of worries about a new housing bubble.

We need the right sort of growth, which means rising business investment and rising exports. The "wrong sort" of growth would be what happened previously,  consumers using their homes as cashpoints and running down savings to fund spending.   To tell which is happening, the trade figures will have to be watched carefully.

Slowest over time, but now the fastest growing to date because the dividends have payed off Sassy from taking a hard decision which as seen has worked, there is nothing you can say otherwise to deny this with the UK set to have the strongest economy in the EU in the next couple of decades!

[Guest]

Watch the trade figures, if they don't go up, its built on false premises and not sustainable.

[Guest]

The think tank Centre for Economics and Business Research (CEBR) predicts the UK economy will outstrip France and Germany within two decades even if Britain stays in the EU.


Seems the experts do not agree with you sassy!

[Guest]

as said...watch the trade figures, there are many indicators of economic growth, not all are the whole truth

[Guest]

Oh yes they do Didge:


   08 January 2014

UK construction industry optimistic of growth in 2014, but experts warn of "unsustainable" recovery

http://www.pinsentmasons.com/en/media/dco-news/january-2014/08-january-2014/uk-construction-industry-optimistic-of-growth-in-2014-but-experts-warn-of-unsustainable-recovery/

[veya_victaous]

No I Actually think the ones that live in areas where we haven't disrupted them would be better off left alone, but the UN keeps telling us we have too bring medicine and housing to them, but any structure is against their culture so... we are sort of at a loss what to do.  ::dunno::  But there are far more than just the desert aboriginals, there are plenty that can no longer live their traditional life style because we have built cities or farms or mines on their land. It is these ones that we need to bring up to speed  if they are going to survive in the modern world which has been thrust upon them. (no they cant just move with the others they are actually different people, but they all get called aboriginal) It really isn't about better but there isn't the animals and plants around for them to live a hunter gather life style in the city, they need to eat so they will need money. we give it too them, as well as education or anything that will give them employment opportunities. most people knowledgeable about the situation agree it will take generations and that is just looking at the ones we have displaced.
And it is not enlightenment but practicality, I would seriously consider the aboriginal lifestyle (the weather is good enough here, the food grows all year round) if it was at all feasible in the modern over populated world.    

Again what right do you have to say who should be like you Veya?
You are thus enforcing what you think onto people who will disagree with you in that their form of life is worse than yours based upon you own perceptions of what is it that is called being civilized.
Why do you need money when you can live off the land, it is those so called people who claim civilization that have made their lifestyle difficult by how they have changed the dynamics of the continent for them.
So you have failed to point out why your way of life is better in any way.  

You seem to be under the misperception that living off the land is possible still. it is not, there is concrete here now. How will Kurri Tribe live off the land, are they are going go hunting in the Botanical Gardens? their entire tribal area is now the Sydney CBD and inner city. What About the Toongal all their land is now an industrial zone and surburbia. the Burramatta people, well their land is now Parramatta the CBD of western Sydney, the river they fished in has been polluted (the past decade has seen it imporved but still not like it was). OR did you think Aboriginals were Just the Minority that live in the dessert? yes they are the famous ones around Uluru that still live lives similar to tradional lifestyles, but the 3 tribes I just mentioned lost their land 7 or 8 generations ago, we are doing what we can to help them preserve their languages and traditions..... but again if they want to eat they will need money.....  Because the Queen Victoria Said so  
::dedhrs::

The RIGHT I have is to not let My Countrymen Starve. I dont want to see them living in near poverty, addicted to drugs and alcohol with no chance to improve the life for themsleves or their families so we try and 'bring them up to speed' (and then when they are in the same blessed postion as me, they can help others)

[Irn Bru]

Again what right do you have to say who should be like you Veya?
You are thus enforcing what you think onto people who will disagree with you in that their form of life is worse than yours based upon you own perceptions of what is it that is called being civilized.
Why do you need money when you can live off the land, it is those so called people who claim civilization that have made their lifestyle difficult by how they have changed the dynamics of the continent for them.
So you have failed to point out why your way of life is better in any way.  

You seem to be under the misperception that living off the land is possible still. it is not, there is concrete here now. How will Kurri Tribe live off the land, are they are going go hunting in the Botanical Gardens? their entire tribal area is now the Sydney CBD and inner city. What About the Toongal all their land is now an industrial zone and surburbia. the Burramatta people, well their land is now Parramatta the CBD of western Sydney, the river they fished in has been polluted (the past decade has seen it imporved but still not like it was). OR did you think Aboriginals were Just the Minority that live in the dessert? yes they are the famous ones around Uluru that still live lives similar to tradional lifestyles, but the 3 tribes I just mentioned lost their land 7 or 8 generations ago, we are doing what we can to help them preserve their languages and traditions..... but again if they want to eat they will need money.....  Because the Queen Victoria Said so  
::dedhrs::

The RIGHT I have is to not let My Countrymen Starve. I dont want to see them living in near poverty, addicted to drugs and alcohol with no chance to improve the life for themsleves or their families so we try and 'bring them up to speed' (and then when they are in the same blessed postion as me, they can help others)

You know Veya. That is exactly how it should be in a modern world and it's something we should all subscribe to. These are good words you have written and you put it very well.

[Guest]

Again what right do you have to say who should be like you Veya?
You are thus enforcing what you think onto people who will disagree with you in that their form of life is worse than yours based upon you own perceptions of what is it that is called being civilized.
Why do you need money when you can live off the land, it is those so called people who claim civilization that have made their lifestyle difficult by how they have changed the dynamics of the continent for them.
So you have failed to point out why your way of life is better in any way.  

You seem to be under the misperception that living off the land is possible still. it is not,
Sorry Veya that is nonsense as people do still live off the land, it is only what you call civilisation which has tried to stop those still wishing to do so
there is concrete here now. How will Kurri Tribe live off the land, are they are going go hunting in the Botanical Gardens? their entire tribal area is now the Sydney CBD and inner city.
Yes you have destroyed their ability to do so, give yourself back on the back for that for selfishness not thinking of how others live. that does not mean they cannot move to other areas.

What About the Toongal all their land is now an industrial zone and surburbia. the Burramatta people, well their land is now Parramatta the CBD of western Sydney, the river they fished in has been polluted (the past decade has seen it imporved but still not like it was). OR did you think Aboriginals were Just the Minority that live in the dessert? yes they are the famous ones around Uluru that still live lives similar to tradional lifestyles, but the 3 tribes I just mentioned lost their land 7 or 8 generations ago, we are doing what we can to help them preserve their languages and traditions..... but again if they want to eat they will need money.....  Because the Queen Victoria Said so  
::dedhrs::

Sorry most of the above is selective arguments about individual groups who have had and been deiened their status of living by greedy people such as yourself blindly thinking your way of life is somewhat better, where they can live and survive if a disater happened tomorrow yet many of the Australian people could not

The RIGHT I have is to not let My Countrymen Starve. I dont want to see them living in near poverty, addicted to drugs and alcohol with no chance to improve the life for themsleves or their families so we try and 'bring them up to speed' (and then when they are in the same blessed postion as me, they can help others)

Yes but you also made it a problem to allow them to starve in the first place for destroying their habitation in the first place, do you not even see that. Why do they need to be brought up to your way of life, again of which you have not shown it is in anyway a better way of life

[Guest]

You seem to be under the misperception that living off the land is possible still. it is not, there is concrete here now. How will Kurri Tribe live off the land, are they are going go hunting in the Botanical Gardens? their entire tribal area is now the Sydney CBD and inner city. What About the Toongal all their land is now an industrial zone and surburbia. the Burramatta people, well their land is now Parramatta the CBD of western Sydney, the river they fished in has been polluted (the past decade has seen it imporved but still not like it was). OR did you think Aboriginals were Just the Minority that live in the dessert? yes they are the famous ones around Uluru that still live lives similar to tradional lifestyles, but the 3 tribes I just mentioned lost their land 7 or 8 generations ago, we are doing what we can to help them preserve their languages and traditions..... but again if they want to eat they will need money.....  Because the Queen Victoria Said so  
::dedhrs::

The RIGHT I have is to not let My Countrymen Starve. I dont want to see them living in near poverty, addicted to drugs and alcohol with no chance to improve the life for themsleves or their families so we try and 'bring them up to speed' (and then when they are in the same blessed postion as me, they can help others)

You know Veya. That is exactly how it should be in a modern world and it's something we should all subscribe to. These are good words you have written and you put it very well.

Actually is was very poor to say the least as he is enforcing a way of life onto people when it is not needed, his view he does not want them starving taking drugs etc were all introduced by his so called civilization, which as seen is not as civilized as he thinks

[Guest]

Oh yes they do Didge:


   08 January 2014

UK construction industry optimistic of growth in 2014, but experts warn of "unsustainable" recovery

http://www.pinsentmasons.com/en/media/dco-news/january-2014/08-january-2014/uk-construction-industry-optimistic-of-growth-in-2014-but-experts-warn-of-unsustainable-recovery/

 ://?roflmao?/: 


One company, that is not many experts sassy.

[veya_victaous]

@Phil
Umm Move to over Areas? So they should invade another tribe?
  
By that logic Romanians should be fine moving to the UK, because that is exactly the same thing, If anything the Difference between the Aboriginal Nations is Greater than the difference between European ones. They don't even all have the same gods and there is more difference between their languages, they never had an equivalent of the Roman empire that unified culture over large parts of the continent.

And It wasn't Me, it wasn't Most Australians here today as many have come later as further immigrants, (25% of the current population was born in a different country) On My fathers side I am First Generation Australian and as you can imagine, if a quarter of the population comes from overseas more than another quarter is their children and grand children.

Those tribes all had their land taken by Queen Victoria Literally, then she sold and parcelled sections of it off, there is still a huge park in Parramatta that is Crown land. (no, it doesn't have kangaroos or enough to support people anymore) SO I am just trying to Clean up the English's mess.  :/pwn://:  It wasn't like the America's they weren't all killed they are still here often living in the same areas.

And they Don't want to move (trust me a lot of the RW here would like to force them to as they have some VERY expensive land in Sydney, that was given back to them in the 1960's before the housing boom)
Most Aboriginals don't live like the ones in the Desert, a Kurri would be no more a home in the desert than I would. You Actually don't realise how racist your statement is, The Desert living Aboriginals are and were always a minority. The Aboriginals aren't stupid obviously they used to prefer to inhabit the same land that English Settlers thought was good so took in the name of the Crown.

Do I need to put up the Map again? there were 200 Aboriginal nations Most lived on the Coast where Non-aboriginals live, now they live along side us in our communities, you seem to think they live outside, away, out of sight. They Go to our schools they use the same trains and buses, drive on the same roads, watch the same TV. They really are no different from me in the way they are trying to live now, they just find it harder to cope with the pressures of modern life.

[Guest]

@Phil
Umm Move to over Areas? So they should invade another tribe?
  
By that logic Romanians should be fine moving to the UK, because that is exactly the same thing, If anything the Difference between the Aboriginal Nations is Greater than the difference between European ones. They don't even all have the same gods and there is more difference between their languages, they never had an equivalent of the Roman empire that unified culture over large parts of the continent.
Why should not Romanians move here, I see no issue with that. You seem to be under some delusion that people have some selfish right to deny people living on parts of the earth landmass, that is daft beyond belief and why humans like yourself are in need of evolving. WTF has mythical deities got to do with any of my points on how you the so called civilized one has denied people their ability to live their lives, because of your own selfish needs? 

And It wasn't Me, it wasn't Most Australians here today as many have come later as further immigrants, (25% of the current population was born in a different country) On My fathers side I am First Generation Australian and as you can imagine, if a quarter of the population comes from overseas more than another quarter is their children and grand children.
I have no problem with people moving to Australia, what many did was not respect those already living there and either exterminated some or pushed them off their lands, mainly due to greed for themselves. So again you mistake my views, I am all for sharing lands, but that is the point sharing, not taking from people who already had rights to lands

Those tribes all had their land taken by Queen Victoria Literally, then she sold and parcelled sections of it off, there is still a huge park in Parramatta that is Crown land. (no, it doesn't have kangaroos or enough to support people anymore) SO I am just trying to Clean up the English's mess.  :/pwn://:  It wasn't like the America's they weren't all killed they are still here often living in the same areas.
What has England got to do with today's problems, nobody is alive who made those decisions from the past so that point is utterly absurd to say the least and you are excusing events from the past for what you are still doing today, again daft beyond belief . You are cleaning up nothing you are still enforcing a way of life onto people who may not want such a way of life, who are you to say how others should live? Considering the new asylum policies you have there you are a long way off knowing compassion and humanity

And they Don't want to move (trust me a lot of the RW here would like to force them to as they have some VERY expensive land in Sydney, that was given back to them in the 1960's before the housing boom)
It is both left and right that are taking away their lifestyle and mainly again to force unto them a lifestyle not of their choosing, they got along very well for 50,000 years before the Europeans came along 

Most Aboriginals don't live like the ones in the Desert, a Ku
rri would be no more a home in the desert than I would. You Actually don't realise how racist your statement is, The Desert living Aboriginals are and were always a minority. The Aboriginals aren't stupid obviously they used to prefer to inhabit the same land that English Settlers thought was good so took in the name of the Crown.
Yes but some want to live this way and you have no right to impose what you think is right when as seen for 50,000 years they were quite content living the way they were Veya. You are not nor anyone the right to enforce how thousands of year old practices which do hot make any difference to your life should be changed    

Do I need to put up the Map again? there were 200 Aboriginal nations Most lived on the Coast where Non-aboriginals live, now they live along side us in our communities, you seem to think they live outside, away, out of sight. They Go to our schools they use the same trains and buses, drive on the same roads, watch the same TV. They really are no different from me in the way they are trying to live now, they just find it harder to cope with the pressures of modern life.

I never said they all live outside and you are changing the goal posts to your first view points which is what you claimed in stating to what you think is being civilized, i think you need to understand the concept of civilized because it is not how you perceive, to be civilized you have to respect the rights and views of people you share the land with and you sadly do not do this

[Guest]

There is one group who didn't want to bring the poor "up to speed" - they wanted to keep the poor out of work, wanted to keep giving them their drugs.

Now we have a government who want to get them back in to work - in to the same blessed positions as me, so they themselves, can help others.

That's been the hope of IDS all along - everybody knows that. You may not have realised it, but you pretty much just recited IDS's dream, veya.

[Guest]

Watch the trade figures, if they don't go up, its built on false premises and not sustainable.

October 2013

Date: 12 December 2013

Coverage: United Kingdom
Theme: Business & Energy


The value of UK trade increased for both EU imports and exports, with imports rising by £0.7 billion, and exports by £0.2 billion against September 2013 totals. Compared to October 2012, imports rose by £1.3 billion and exports fell by £0.2 billion. Imports are now at their highest value on record.

There is an increase of 7.2 per cent in the trade gap (i.e. the difference between UK imports from, and exports to the EU) when compared to September 2013. This difference is now £7.2 billion. This is the largest trade gap on record.

https://www.uktradeinfo.com/statistics/euoverseastrade/Pages/EuOTS.aspx

[Guest]

Recovery 'built on housing bubble and consumer debt'
Britain's rapid growth is built on a housing bubble, showing the economy remains "fundamentally flawed", IPPR warns

Britain's recovery may not be sustainable because it is built on mounting household debt, a leading think tank has warned.

Growth is being driven by a housing bubble, fuelled by the House to Buy cheap mortgage scheme, which is encouraging families to borrow and spend more, economists fear.

The recession was worsened because of a “massive build up” of household debt before 2008, and that is due to rise again to 160 per cent of income by 2018. It means the rapid growth could prove “unsustainable and bittersweet,” according to the Institute for Public Policy Research.

Britain is now on course to grow at almost 2 per cent this year, the fastest rate since 2007. Unemployment is also falling more rapidly than expected and stands at 7.4 per cent.

But despite Mr Osborne’s hopes of rebalancing the economy towards manufacturing and exports, much of the growth has been driven by higher consumer spending. Britain’s current account deficit has deteriorated significantly in recent months to the highest level since 1989, as consumption continues to outstrip foreign exports.



“We should be alarmed that growth is being driven by exactly the same mix of factors that contributed to the depth of the last recession,” said Tony Dolphin, senior economist at IPPR.

"The Government has introduced Help to Buy which generates more debt, rather than focusing its efforts on boosting investment spending in the manufacturing sector.

"While there are external factors that have held back exports, the Government has in a sense run out of ideas for the economy and gone for the easy option of boosting the housing market."

“As a short-term measure to boost growth while it continues to cut public spending, it might be politically expedient for the government to adopt this approach. However, it is not a sustainable strategy for the British economy. George Osborne was right when he said that we can no longer rely on ever-higher levels of debt for growth.

"It is an indictment of the failure of his attempts to boost business investment spending that, rather than encouraging a rebalancing of the economy, he now has to resort to policies that will increase its imbalances.”

Mr Dolphin said the nature the recovery suggested there is a “fundamental flaw” in Britain’s economic model. The country has run a current account deficit for thirty years, suggesting it is “living beyond its means”.

The dominance of the City is leading firms to focus on boosting quarterly profits in order to avoid takeovers - at the expense of investment in industry, Mr Dolphin said.

“For the economy as a whole, this is disastrous. A low rate of investment means a less productive economy, lower living standards and a lack of competitiveness,” he said.

"Strong growth in the short-term does not mean that structural weaknesses in the UK economy that became more evident during the 'Great Recession' have been eliminated. Unless we move to adopt a new economic model, the recovery will prove unsustainable and bittersweet for those who do not benefit from it before it is extinguished."

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/10539945/Recovery-built-on-housing-bubble-and-consumer-debt.html

[Guest]

Yes we can all post articles of views sassy but again wait and see what happens, you will be sadly disappointed I guess.

Can you ever right anything for yourself?

[Guest]

Yes we can all post articles of views sassy but again wait and see what happens, you will be sadly disappointed I guess.

Can you ever right anything for yourself?

Phil, it's write anything for yourself.

[Guest]

Yes we can all post articles of views sassy but again wait and see what happens, you will be sadly disappointed I guess.

Can you ever right anything for yourself?

Didge, I am more than capable of not only posting my own opinion, but posting it in correct english. However, in order to show the miserable state of the trade figures, the official trade figure site needs to be quoted, or the numbers are irrelevant. You also tried to make out that the only people that were saying the recovery was unsustainable was the company I quoted previously. Therefore, you needed quotes from someone else to show you that was not the case. Now, having been shown that evidence, if the sentence above is all you can come up with, after myself and Grumpy had already said that only way to find out was to keep an eye on the trade figures, I can't say as I am terribly impressed.

[Guest]

No all you ever do sassy is post a whole article as if people are incapable of openinga link, it is not only insulting it shows you place more faith in what others say than your own views. Such links should only be there to support your view, yet you place them as if they are your own argument.

I could care less about grammar I am not being marked on this and my life is neither dependant on it either only someone desperate to gain anything on another poster would point this out. The reality is you cannot think for yourself and use others arguments, sad really

[Guest]

Yes we can all post articles of views sassy but again wait and see what happens, you will be sadly disappointed I guess.

Can you ever right anything for yourself?

Phil, it's write anything for yourself.

Andy, I am not bothered if I have made a grammar error, you knew what I meant so why are you being such a twat?

[Guest]

yoy alll poost like yoy fwckwin pizzed....tbats

[Irn Bru]

You know Veya. That is exactly how it should be in a modern world and it's something we should all subscribe to. These are good words you have written and you put it very well.

Actually is was very poor to say the least as he is enforcing a way of life onto people when it is not needed, his view he does not want them starving taking drugs etc were all introduced by his so called civilization, which as seen is not as civilized as he thinks  

I take it that you are referring to the whole of Veya's post and not the part I highlighted because I really can't believe that anyone would have difficulty subscribing to that.

Anyway, I'll leave you to slug out the rest with Veya who actually lives in Australia and who may have a better understanding of what like if like there.

[Guest]

Actually is was very poor to say the least as he is enforcing a way of life onto people when it is not needed, his view he does not want them starving taking drugs etc were all introduced by his so called civilization, which as seen is not as civilized as he thinks  

I take it that you are referring to the whole of Veya's post and not the part I highlighted because I really can't believe that anyone would have difficulty subscribing to that.

Anyway, I'll leave you to slug out the rest with Veya who actually lives in Australia and who may have a better understanding of what like if like there.

The point you highighted was a very poor stereotype as if they all are like this, something I thought you would actually understand.

Yes I agree he is much closer to the issue, but he misses the point of those wanting to live their ancients ways, wanting to deny them this. I am not saying people need to step in when people are in danger, so you really missed the boat and my point on this one, as many have been living this way of life for thousands of years, they are not all drunks, hooked on drugs etc

[Irn Bru]

I take it that you are referring to the whole of Veya's post and not the part I highlighted because I really can't believe that anyone would have difficulty subscribing to that.

Anyway, I'll leave you to slug out the rest with Veya who actually lives in Australia and who may have a better understanding of what like if like there.

The point you highighted was a very poor stereotype as if they all are like this, something I thought you would actually understand.

Yes I agree he is much closer to the issue, but he misses the point of those wanting to live their ancients ways, wanting to deny them this. I am not saying people need to step in when people are in danger, so you really missed the boat and my point on this one, as many have been living this way of life for thousands of years, they are not all drunks, hooked on drugs etc

The point I highlighted was something I believe people should aspire to and if you can't bring yourself to subscribe to that then I'm afraid it doesn't say much for what kind of society you think we should be trying to achieve for all mankind. That is so sad.

I didn't miss any point and I was just suggesting that as Veya lives in Australia he/she may have a better understanding of what life is like there. And just to remind you, that's similar to the advice you were dishing out to others who were giving you their opinion on life here in the UK

okay dokay

[Guest]

The point you highighted was a very poor stereotype as if they all are like this, something I thought you would actually understand.

Yes I agree he is much closer to the issue, but he misses the point of those wanting to live their ancients ways, wanting to deny them this. I am not saying people need to step in when people are in danger, so you really missed the boat and my point on this one, as many have been living this way of life for thousands of years, they are not all drunks, hooked on drugs etc

The point I highlighted was something I believe people should aspire to and if you can't bring yourself to subscribe to that then I'm afraid it doesn't say much for what kind of society you think we should be trying to achieve for all mankind. That is so sad.

I didn't miss any point and I was just suggesting that as Veya lives in Australia he/she may have a better understanding of what life is like there. And just to remind you, that's similar to the advice you were dishing out to others who were giving you their opinion on life here in the UK

okay dokay

Which I agreed that he does live in the situation did I not Irn?

He may have a better understanding but my points still stand on people who have been living a way of life for thousands of years

[Irn Bru]

The point I highlighted was something I believe people should aspire to and if you can't bring yourself to subscribe to that then I'm afraid it doesn't say much for what kind of society you think we should be trying to achieve for all mankind. That is so sad.

I didn't miss any point and I was just suggesting that as Veya lives in Australia he/she may have a better understanding of what life is like there. And just to remind you, that's similar to the advice you were dishing out to others who were giving you their opinion on life here in the UK

okay dokay

Which I agreed that he does live in the situation did I not Irn?

He may have a better understanding but my points still stand on people who have been living a way of life for thousands of years

You did admit that Didge but at the same time you are telling him that he misses the point. However, like I said earlier I'll leave you to slug it out with him.

[Clarkson]

Sassy I agree the current policies are not sustainable. Osborne has cut nearly deeply enough. The state both Nationalyl and locally are bleeding us dry. You probably support that because you are a recipient of others money but just for a moment pretend you are not and actually want to keep some of your hard earned cash and actually choose what to spend it on.

This coalition has done very very very little to roll back the superstate. Taxes are generally far to high for individuals and indeed there is little incentive to keep shops open as business rates are appallingly high particularly in Labour run councils.

Strangely your prescription is to bloat the state even more remove even more of peoples net disposable so the Comrades can better determine how to waste it.

That's great if you want starvation in North Korea but not so good in the free world.

[Guest]

Sassy I agree the current policies are not sustainable. Osborne has cut nearly deeply enough. The state both Nationalyl and locally are bleeding us dry. You probably support that because you are a recipient of others money but just for a moment pretend you are not and actually want to keep some of your hard earned cash and actually choose what to spend it on.

This coalition has done very very very little to roll back the superstate. Taxes are generally far to high for individuals and indeed there is little incentive to keep shops open as business rates are appallingly high particularly in Labour run councils.

Strangely your prescription is to bloat the state even more remove even more of peoples net disposable so the Comrades can better determine how to waste it.

That's great if you want starvation in North Korea but not so good in the free world.

Now that's really funny. You can't bloat the state anymore? And yet on another thread you want to employ people on the roads. Funnily enough, that means they will be paid by the state. Or did you want them to work on the roads for their benefits and become virtual slaves.

[veya_victaous]

@Phil
Umm Move to over Areas? So they should invade another tribe?

By that logic Romanians should be fine moving to the UK, because that is exactly the same thing, If anything the Difference between the Aboriginal Nations is Greater than the difference between European ones. They don't even all have the same gods and there is more difference between their languages, they never had an equivalent of the Roman empire that unified culture over large parts of the continent.
Why should not Romanians move here, I see no issue with that. You seem to be under some delusion that people have some selfish right to deny people living on parts of the earth landmass, that is daft beyond belief and why humans like yourself are in need of evolving. WTF has mythical deities got to do with any of my points on how you the so called civilized one has denied people their ability to live their lives, because of your own selfish needs?
OK so let me see you defend their right to move to the UK against Andy, next time he post something that suggests otherwise. It doesn't change the Fact they Don’t want to. You really have no idea, a modern Aboriginal in the City is just like everyone else they are Not Some magic Bush Fairy they can make Food appear out of nowhere. And Mythical deities are the basis of a lot of cultures You have the MAJOR misconception that Aboriginals all get along, they are different people.

And It wasn't Me, it wasn't Most Australians here today as many have come later as further immigrants, (25% of the current population was born in a different country) On My fathers side I am First Generation Australian and as you can imagine, if a quarter of the population comes from overseas more than another quarter is their children and grand children.
I have no problem with people moving to Australia, what many did was not respect those already living there and either exterminated some or pushed them off their lands, mainly due to greed for themselves. So again you mistake my views, I am all for sharing lands, but that is the point sharing, not taking from people who already had rights to lands Land that were taken 200 years ago, everyone but English(UK) has only been allowed to come for the past 50 years. The Only place they were exterminated was Tasmania an Island off the mainland and that was long before anyone but the British were allowed to come here.

Those tribes all had their land taken by Queen Victoria Literally, then she sold and parcelled sections of it off, there is still a huge park in Parramatta that is Crown land. (no, it doesn't have kangaroos or enough to support people anymore) SO I am just trying to Clean up the English's mess. :/pwn://: It wasn't like the America's they weren't all killed they are still here often living in the same areas.
What has England got to do with today's problems, nobody is alive who made those decisions from the past so that point is utterly absurd to say the least and you are excusing events from the past for what you are still doing today, again daft beyond belief . You are cleaning up nothing you are still enforcing a way of life onto people who may not want such a way of life, who are you to say how others should live? Considering the new asylum policies you have there you are a long way off knowing compassion and humanity All todays issues regarding aboriginals extend from the Past. You really think they still dress in animal skins and eat witchetty grubs don't you? They Wear Nike and Eat McDonalds. Also "for what you are still doing today, again daft beyond belief" you mean give them land Back? give them $300plus a week? Free Education Including University? Free Health? What Do you think we are still doing today?

And they Don't want to move (trust me a lot of the RW here would like to force them to as they have some VERY expensive land in Sydney, that was given back to them in the 1960's before the housing boom)
It is both left and right that are taking away their lifestyle and mainly again to force unto them a lifestyle not of their choosing, they got along very well for 50,000 years before the Europeans came along
Umm NO the LEFT wing has Fought to Give them BACK land, you did know that they have been given back parts of the land? No one is still taking it away that all stopped 100 years ago (again when it was Just the British here) Like I said it is the RW currently that would like to force them to SWAP the very expensive land in Sydney for some much less expensive land down the coast.
And YES they did do fine for 50,000 years but the ones Living along side us for the past 200years would like the latest Smartphone. You seriously have no fucking clue. So Guy in the desert whose tribe meet white people for the first time 50 years ago is more than welcome to live the traditional lifestyle no one is stopping him his land is untouched, (again it is the UN and Documentary makers that keep trying to Force them to Change) But the ones (the Majority) that live just like anyone else in modern western society want all the mod cons like everyone else.


Most Aboriginals don't live like the ones in the Desert, a Kurri would be no more a home in the desert than I would. You Actually don't realise how racist your statement is, The Desert living Aboriginals are and were always a minority. The Aboriginals aren't stupid obviously they used to prefer to inhabit the same land that English Settlers thought was good so took in the name of the Crown.
Yes but some want to live this way and you have no right to impose what you think is right when as seen for 50,000 years they were quite content living the way they were Veya. You are not nor anyone the right to enforce how thousands of year old practices which do hot make any difference to your life should be changed
Umm As Said Originally I and MOST Australians Believe we should leave the Desert Tribes that have not been interfered with alone. BUT the UN, because of dumb racists like yourself, Keep telling us to get them in Houses, They are nomadic they don’t want to live in houses, So Why do the UN keep telling us we need to give them houses? And What is this 'some'? NO KURRI want to live that way they are not the same as they guy in the Desert they have nothing in Common, WTF do you not understand. There is NOT 1 group of people there are 200 different Peoples, they all live differently. Kurris are coastal Fishermen and as great as the are at finding food in a coastal environment they have as much hope as me in the Desert. Again Aboriginals are People not magic Bush Fairies.

Do I need to put up the Map again? there were 200 Aboriginal nations Most lived on the Coast where Non-aboriginals live, now they live along side us in our communities, you seem to think they live outside, away, out of sight. They Go to our schools they use the same trains and buses, drive on the same roads, watch the same TV. They really are no different from me in the way they are trying to live now, they just find it harder to cope with the pressures of modern life.

I never said they all live outside and you are changing the goal posts to your first view points which is what you claimed in stating to what you think is being civilized, i think you need to understand the concept of civilized because it is not how you perceive, to be civilized you have to respect the rights and views of people you share the land with and you sadly do not do this

No 'Civilized' is Technology and Cultural institutions when talking from and Anthropological view. And No you have to Understand it is not 200 years ago when the English First Arrived the Tribes that have been living with us for 200 years want to live like us. It is not possible to live a traditional life style because there is now 25 times more people here (and more like 10,000 times the amount of people in the Sydney Basin).
You talk again like Aboriginals are Magic Bush Fairies that can make food appear out of nowhere. All Of Australia only supports 1 to 2 million people living the Aboriginal life style just like in Europe Agriculture is a Major factor in supporting more people to support the amount of people that live here now we need to plant things and raise animals, not just rely on whatever we can find.

[Guest]

The cut and paste Queen and the "I don't support Labour" disingenuous Jock who clearly works for them for nothing reprint Guardian news pieces and Labour propaganda adnauseum.

Eeee! its just like Speakfree.


Havent seen any rebuttals on RW posts just thread after thread of Labour news.


You goons couldn't debate to save your lives.

Adios I'll leave you to kill off another forum.

...Aw,it's just not going well for you love is it?, why did you come here if this was such a hardcore Labour forum?,moor Drinky, greeting again,you be much better back at a flop where you mean something to them, a fellow RW basher of the unemployed, disabled and low paid.

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