Nicola Sturgeon Calls For 'Double Lock' To Prevent Scotland EU Referendum Exit

SNP leader Nicola Sturgeon has used her first major economic speech since the General Election to call for a 'double lock' on a British exit from the EU. Speaking at Midlothian FC's stadium in Edinburgh on Tuesday, the MSP reiterated her vow to fight for Scotland's continued membership, and piled pressure on the Prime Minister not to force EU-withdrawal on any nation who's electorate reject seperatism in the upcoming EU referendum. "We will propose a double majority, meaning that exit from the European Union is only possible if all four nations of the UK agree to it - something which would ensure that Scotland couldn't be forced out of the EU against our will," she said.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/05/26/sturgeon-referendum-speech-double-lock_n_7441376.html?utm_hp_ref=uk



I have to admit, even as much as I have never had time for Nicola Sturgeon, but this is exceedingly clever.
If Cameron fails to agree to this, she then has the ammunition to force about another referendum on Scottish independence. They could easily argue, because they want to stay in, (Scottish polls show favour to stay in the EU). If any voted in the majority to to stay in the EU within Scotland, they would then view, are being denied self determination as a people, which would enforce a new referendum. As she is using this as the carrot on a stick, knowing full well Cameron will not agree, to whip up a public frenzy in Scotland to demand they have another referendum on independence. Its very clever and one that leaves Cameron in a difficult position, where he would have to agree or face another Scottish referendum. As they will most certainly play off if Cameron denied this "double lock", taking to the streets demanding a new referendum.

He is facing his very own Kobayashi Maru, as if he agrees, and then Scotland as a nation vote to stay in, then the whole UK would have to stay in the EU based on the "double lock". If he does not agree, then Scotland will get another referendum and he will be the PM that served in term where Scotland gained independence, as there is no doubt in my mind, they would vote for independence next time.

Belatucadros wrote:SNP leader Nicola Sturgeon has used her first major economic speech since the General Election to call for a 'double lock' on a British exit from the EU. Speaking at Midlothian FC's stadium in Edinburgh on Tuesday, the MSP reiterated her vow to fight for Scotland's continued membership, and piled pressure on the Prime Minister not to force EU-withdrawal on any nation who's electorate reject seperatism in the upcoming EU referendum. "We will propose a double majority, meaning that exit from the European Union is only possible if all four nations of the UK agree to it - something which would ensure that Scotland couldn't be forced out of the EU against our will," she said.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/05/26/sturgeon-referendum-speech-double-lock_n_7441376.html?utm_hp_ref=uk



I have to admit, even as much as I have never had time for Nicola Sturgeon, but this is exceedingly clever.
If Cameron fails to agree to this, she then has the ammunition to force about another referendum on Scottish independence. They could easily argue, because they want to stay in, (Scottish polls show favour to stay in the EU). If any voted in the majority to to stay in the EU within Scotland, they would then view, are being denied self determination as a people, which would enforce a new referendum. As she is using this as the carrot on a stick, knowing full well Cameron will not agree, to whip up a public frenzy in Scotland to demand they have another referendum on independence. Its very clever and one that leaves Cameron in a difficult position, where he would have to agree or face another Scottish referendum. As they will most certainly play off if Cameron denied this "double lock", taking to the streets demanding a new referendum.

He is facing his very own Kobayashi Maru, as if he agrees, and then Scotland as a nation vote to stay in, then the whole UK would have to stay in the EU based on the "double lock". If he does not agree, then Scotland will get another referendum and he will be the PM that served in term where Scotland gained independence, as there is no doubt in my mind, they would vote for independence next time.

Nice .....yes she is not a stupid women because this affects Scotland ,Ireland and Wales diferantly england should not be able to rail road the rest of the uk in to a decision they don`t agree with

korban dallas wrote:

Belatucadros wrote:SNP leader Nicola Sturgeon has used her first major economic speech since the General Election to call for a 'double lock' on a British exit from the EU. Speaking at Midlothian FC's stadium in Edinburgh on Tuesday, the MSP reiterated her vow to fight for Scotland's continued membership, and piled pressure on the Prime Minister not to force EU-withdrawal on any nation who's electorate reject seperatism in the upcoming EU referendum. "We will propose a double majority, meaning that exit from the European Union is only possible if all four nations of the UK agree to it - something which would ensure that Scotland couldn't be forced out of the EU against our will," she said.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/05/26/sturgeon-referendum-speech-double-lock_n_7441376.html?utm_hp_ref=uk



I have to admit, even as much as I have never had time for Nicola Sturgeon, but this is exceedingly clever.
If Cameron fails to agree to this, she then has the ammunition to force about another referendum on Scottish independence. They could easily argue, because they want to stay in, (Scottish polls show favour to stay in the EU). If any voted in the majority to to stay in the EU within Scotland, they would then view, are being denied self determination as a people, which would enforce a new referendum. As she is using this as the carrot on a stick, knowing full well Cameron will not agree, to whip up a public frenzy in Scotland to demand they have another referendum on independence. Its very clever and one that leaves Cameron in a difficult position, where he would have to agree or face another Scottish referendum. As they will most certainly play off if Cameron denied this "double lock", taking to the streets demanding a new referendum.

He is facing his very own Kobayashi Maru, as if he agrees, and then Scotland as a nation vote to stay in, then the whole UK would have to stay in the EU based on the "double lock". If he does not agree, then Scotland will get another referendum and he will be the PM that served in term where Scotland gained independence, as there is no doubt in my mind, they would vote for independence next time.

Nice .....yes she is not a stupid women because this affects Scotland ,Ireland and Wales diferantly england should not be able to rail road the rest of the uk in to a decision they don`t agree with

Hi Korben

I thought it was very apt and as you know, I prefer the Tories. I say prefer as there is no real party I support. My view is for them all to work together, but this I have to admit was a brilliant coup on her part.

Well maybe she should let the people decide...!?


It is not up to her!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:Well maybe she should let the people decide...!?


It is not up to her!!!

Clearly the point is above you Tommy Blooper.
She "is" requesting that the people of her nation be able to decide.
I mean did you not argue off this very fact in regards to people of the EU being denied the vote, that it matters only to the people of this country? Is she not actually arguing the very same thing as you, as it matters too for the Scottish as a country also?

korban dallas wrote:

Belatucadros wrote:SNP leader Nicola Sturgeon has used her first major economic speech since the General Election to call for a 'double lock' on a British exit from the EU. Speaking at Midlothian FC's stadium in Edinburgh on Tuesday, the MSP reiterated her vow to fight for Scotland's continued membership, and piled pressure on the Prime Minister not to force EU-withdrawal on any nation who's electorate reject seperatism in the upcoming EU referendum. "We will propose a double majority, meaning that exit from the European Union is only possible if all four nations of the UK agree to it - something which would ensure that Scotland couldn't be forced out of the EU against our will," she said.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/05/26/sturgeon-referendum-speech-double-lock_n_7441376.html?utm_hp_ref=uk



I have to admit, even as much as I have never had time for Nicola Sturgeon, but this is exceedingly clever.
If Cameron fails to agree to this, she then has the ammunition to force about another referendum on Scottish independence. They could easily argue, because they want to stay in, (Scottish polls show favour to stay in the EU). If any voted in the majority to to stay in the EU within Scotland, they would then view, are being denied self determination as a people, which would enforce a new referendum. As she is using this as the carrot on a stick, knowing full well Cameron will not agree, to whip up a public frenzy in Scotland to demand they have another referendum on independence. Its very clever and one that leaves Cameron in a difficult position, where he would have to agree or face another Scottish referendum. As they will most certainly play off if Cameron denied this "double lock", taking to the streets demanding a new referendum.

He is facing his very own Kobayashi Maru, as if he agrees, and then Scotland as a nation vote to stay in, then the whole UK would have to stay in the EU based on the "double lock". If he does not agree, then Scotland will get another referendum and he will be the PM that served in term where Scotland gained independence, as there is no doubt in my mind, they would vote for independence next time.

Nice .....yes she is not a stupid women because this affects Scotland ,Ireland and Wales diferantly england should not be able to rail road the rest of the uk in to a decision they don`t agree with

There might be a majority in Scotland, Wales, and NI, and a minority in England.

She is arguing to override the democratic will of the country...



It is A UK decision.

Tommy Monk wrote:She is arguing to override the democratic will of the country...



It is A UK decision.

Is she?
To her Scotland should be independent, so is she going against the will of the country?
If they held a referendum now, the will of the people of Scotland, the country would be very much behind her .
By you saying it is a UK decision provides her exactly with the ammunition she needs to hold another referendum, because to the Scottish, it is very much a Scottish decision to them.

Belatucadros wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:Well maybe she should let the people decide...!?


It is not up to her!!!

Clearly the point is above you Tommy Blooper.
She "is" requesting that the people of her nation be able to decide.
I mean did you not argue off this very fact in regards to people of the EU being denied the vote, that it matters only to the people of this country? Is she not actually arguing the very same thing as you, as it matters too for the Scottish as a country also?

exactly

Scotland has voted to remain part of the UK.


Now the UK will get a long awaited chance to have a say over EU membership.


Let the people decide... not wee jimmy crankee...

Tommy Monk wrote:Scotland has voted to remain part of the UK.
Now the UK will get a long awaited chance to have a say over EU membership.
Let the people decide... not wee jimmy crankee...

Yes lets see what happens Tommy and lets see how this now pans out.

Tommy Monk wrote:Scotland has voted to remain part of the UK.


Now the UK will get a long awaited chance to have a say over EU membership.


Let the people decide... not wee jimmy crankee...

English votes for English issues was Cameron`s stance
but this is not just a English issue is it
This affects each country in the "uk" differentially and the governing party in Scotland and i suspect the majority of scots want to stay in the EU or don`t they get a say ,or have there wishes superseded by what the English want ?

And i kind of think raggs is right England will not vote for leaving the EU anyway, and in the unlikely event they vote to leave
you can expect the break up of the "uk" very shortly there after

If you ever needed proof that salmon And Sturgon Are really working for the EU then here it is!!!



We can trade with Europe, be friendly neighbours with Europe without being run by Europe.



It is A strange position that the Scottish national party is screaming out for independence and total control over Scotland but at the same time want to hand all control over Scottish laws, rules, regulations and borders to the EU...



What does that tell you...!?



Especially when you remember that the EU has a plan to break up the UK so as to make it easier for them to control us all!!!



It's not difficult to see what's going on...



You can't have independence and total control over your country while handing all control over laws, rules, regulations and borders to the EU...



It is blatantly obvious that Sturgon is just another EU stooge!!!

korban dallas wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:Scotland has voted to remain part of the UK.


Now the UK will get a long awaited chance to have a say over EU membership.


Let the people decide... not wee jimmy crankee...

English votes for English issues was Cameron`s stance
but this is not just a English issue is it
This affects each country in the "uk" differentially and the governing party in Scotland and i suspect  the majority of scots  want to stay in the EU or don`t they get a say ,or have there wishes superseded by what the English want ?

And i kind of think raggs is right England will not vote for leaving the EU anyway, and in the unlikely event they vote to leave
you can expect the break up of the "uk" very shortly there after

I don't think there will be a vote to leave tbh. A lot of people complain about Europe, but I don't think they'll be brave enough to vote to leave it.

That really shows how utterly scared you are Tommy Blooper of the double lock becoming a reality, as you know it would mean the UK would end up staying in. Anyway this is way beyond the EU, as she is using this as a means to force another Scottish referendum, as she believes that Cameron would never commit to such a notion, he will argue as you are doing now. Which will provide her with the means to call for another referendum. She using the very same argument for a referendum, that Cameron is using himself. In regards to the people of a nation deciding their fate of being in the EU, she is applying the same reasoning for the Scottish people deciding their own fate whether to stay in.

Hence why I hate to admit how very clever this really is of her, as she is forcing his hand, that no matter which way he decides the Scottish would end up staying in the EU either as an independent nation or as being still part of the UK. The double lock clause if enacted would ensure Scotland being able to enforce a veto to the the rest of the UK leaving the EU. Even if the rest of the UK voted in the majority to leave. The Scots are the most pro-EU at of all the nations.

Now that is what I call clever, she is ensuring Scotland stay in the EU, but to me, her real intention is to gain independence off the back of this, as she is forcing Cameron's hand to say no through fear of a revolt from within the Tories themselves who would never agree to such a demand.


On that note, night everyone.

seems like the jocks want their cake and eat it, it is time to give them thier options, if we don't vote on scottish issues they should not vote on english issues.
England needs out of the eu...
if scotland want in to the eu let them negotiate their own way in...
tell the ginger minger what we really think of her...

The EU puppets will do anything to stay in the EU.

Tommy Monk wrote:The EU puppets will do anything to stay in the EU.

it's worth a fortune to them...

Once again tommy it seems you don't like democracy when it appears to go against what you want. There is nothing undemocratic about ensuring a massive issue such as EU membership is agreed upon by all member nations of the United Kingdom unanimously. And it is a clever move by the SNP politically, since it will as didge says result in either another Independence vote OR a cripple the chance of an EU exit completely.

Les... this whole charade is entirely designed to scupper democracy and preserve the EU dictatorships illegal grasp over our national sovereignty.



How can a majority UK vote to regain our national sovereignty and powers from the EU be denied by 5% of the national electorate in Scotland not liking it!!!???


The tail does not wag the dog!!!



Scotland is less than 10% of the UK... and although SNP are popular there... only about a third of Scottish people actually voted for them!!!


And huge numbers of them would want out of the EU anyway!!!



Sturgon is working for the EU and against true Scottish independece.



Scotland has bigger clout world wide as a part of a UK that is free from EU than it would ever have as part of a UK that is in the EU, and a Scotland that is independent from the UK and signed up to the EU on its own ain't worth shit!!!



If the UK decides escape the illegal EU dictatorship and restore our democracy then Scotland will benefit equally from this.


Why would Scotland then decide to give away complete control of the country to the EU dictatorship...!?




Please explain to me how people can have democracy, control over their country, laws, rules, regulations, borders etc... AS WELL AS having all of these things controlled by the EU dictatorship...!!!???




I know you lefties have developed a sort of 'quantum thinking' where two opposite views can coexist as reality at the same time in the vacuum of your tiny minds... but... in the real world... please explain how these two opposite realities can exist...!!!???

Eilzel wrote:Once again tommy it seems you don't like democracy when it appears to go against what you want. There is nothing undemocratic about ensuring a massive issue such as EU membership is agreed upon by all member nations of the United Kingdom unanimously. And it is a clever move by the SNP politically, since it will as didge says result in either another Independence vote OR a cripple the chance of an EU exit completely.

Morning Eilzel

He really cannot grasp how clever this is and why he is shitting bricks over this is because of how clever it is and is applying democracy correctly to back the notion of providing the Scots with the right to choose for their future. She is using the same argument Tommy makes about a nation having the right to decide their future, which Tommy is now contradicting himself over and tying himself up in knots over.
Is funny to watch and shows how scared shitless he is of this reality. Like I said this is being done more to force the issue of another referendum, because there is no way the Tories would agree to this.
It does show the hypocrisy though around of the right to vote for self determination and she has played on this brilliantly.

You reasons Scotland should stay in the UK are the same reasons the UK should stay in the EU tommy.

And there is nothing democratic about dragging a member nation of the UK out of a massive continental union against the will of most of that nation.

You are displaying dramatic double standards tommy

So why doesn't NS wait to see what happens in the EU referendum, and then if she doesn't like the result, she can push for another Scottish referendum?

Raggamuffin wrote:So why doesn't NS wait to see what happens in the EU referendum, and then if she doesn't like the result, she can push for another Scottish referendum?

Because she wants an independent Scotland

The chances of getting a majority in all four nations is very slim, so if Cameron agrees, it's bound to fail. I think it will fail anyway, whether a majority in each nation is required or not, but Sturgeon isn't so sure.

This is a political move, all designed to encourage voters in Scotland to push for another referendum if Cameron refuses to give in to her demand. If eventually the population vote to stay in Europe, she will have no excuse for another referendum.

In what way would an independent Scotland be bad for England, or, would it be?

nicko wrote:In what way would an independent Scotland be bad for England,  or, would it be?

I don't know Nicko, but Cameron is determined to hold on to Scotland.

Nicola Sturgeon is taking a gamble. She's equally determined that Scotland should be independent but she needs a large majority of people in Scotland on her side. So far, the people in Scotland have said they want to be part of the UK, but with her aggressive leadership that could change and more people could back her. On the other hand, more might go against her and say she doesn't speak for them.

She needs some good reasons why there should be another referendum, and she can't say - well I didn't like the last result so I want another bite at the cherry - she needs to play a longer game.

nicko wrote:In what way would an independent Scotland be bad for England,  or, would it be?

I do not think it would be bad thing, in fact for the left it would be nightmare, as such loss of support for Labour would be wiped out as it was this election with the SNP winning so many seats there. With Scotland gone, Labour has lost a huge chunk of support and would struggle to overturn a Tory majority.