Fred Phelps, Westboro Baptist Church Founder, Is Dead (Updated)

First topic message reminder :

Fred Phelps, the founder of the highly controversial Westboro Baptist Church, which is known for protesting high-profile funerals with signs that read "God Hates Fags," is said to be dying at a hospice center in Kansas.

The news comes via Nate Phelps, one of Fred's estranged children, who wrote this in a Facebook post Saturday night.

I've learned that my father, Fred Phelps, Sr., pastor of the "God Hates Fags" Westboro Baptist Church, was ex-communicated from the "church" back in August of 2013. He is now on the edge of death at Midland Hospice house in Topeka, Kansas.
I'm not sure how I feel about this. Terribly ironic that his devotion to his god ends this way. Destroyed by the monster he made.

I feel sad for all the hurt he's caused so many. I feel sad for those who will lose the grandfather and father they loved. And I'm bitterly angry that my family is blocking the family members who left from seeing him, and saying their good-byes.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/03/16/fred-phelps-dying-death-westboro-baptist_n_4974584.html?utm_hp_ref=mostpopular

PRAISE ALLAH!

VOD(original) wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:

VOD(original) wrote:in maltese the word God is Alla ,(catholics/christians) in arabic it is allah , but allah the god of islam is not the God of the bible , the reason being is that islam reject Jesus as the son of God so they are not the same god .

I would agree with that, to any outside observer they are obviously distinct religions -- however, it is a tenet of the Islamic faith that their God is not only the real one, but also the same one worshiped by Christians and Jews.

It makes no difference to me to be honest I know what i believe the muslims know what they believe nothing will change that will it , is it worth arguing over a word .

god Allah god Alla god Jehovah words its what they mean to the individual .

Exactly, somebody in ancient Athens who worshiped Zeus might have referred to Zeus as "God," we wouldn't be debating over his or her use of the word.

Ben_Reilly wrote:

VOD(original) wrote:

It makes no difference to me to be honest I know what i believe the muslims know what they believe nothing will change that will it , is it worth arguing over a word .

god Allah god Alla god Jehovah words its what they mean to the individual .

Exactly, somebody in ancient Athens who worshiped Zeus might have referred to Zeus as "God," we wouldn't be debating over his or her use of the word.

yes and thats the linguistics you are trying to contort

a person may have referred to either Zeus or Zeus AS god but not Zeus MEANING god

which is what you are attempting to say is the case with ALLAH

smelly_bandit wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:

VOD(original) wrote:

It makes no difference to me to be honest I know what i believe the muslims know what they believe nothing will change that will it , is it worth arguing over a word .

god Allah god Alla god Jehovah words its what they mean to the individual .

Exactly, somebody in ancient Athens who worshiped Zeus might have referred to Zeus as "God," we wouldn't be debating over his or her use of the word.

yes and thats the linguistics you are trying to contort

a person may have referred to either Zeus or Zeus AS god but not Zeus MEANING god

which is what you are attempting to say is the case with ALLAH  

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/allah.html

Since you won't read that:

But for more than five hundred years before Muhammad, the vast majority of Jews and Christians in Arabia called God by the name Allah. How, then, can we say that Allah is an invalid name for God? If it is, to whom have these Jews and Christians been praying?

I keep posting it, he keeps ignoring it, it's so inconvenient to have other christians telling you you are wrong and Allah is God in Arabic, for christians as well as muslims.

Sassy wrote:I keep posting it, he keeps ignoring it, it's so inconvenient to have other christians telling you you are wrong and Allah is God in Arabic, for christians as well as muslims.

its Alla in Maltese sass Arabic origin , just wonder if a spelling / name / word needs to make a difference to be honest as long as people know what it means to them

VOD(original) wrote:

Sassy wrote:I keep posting it, he keeps ignoring it, it's so inconvenient to have other christians telling you you are wrong and Allah is God in Arabic, for christians as well as muslims.

its Alla in Maltese sass Arabic origin , just wonder if a spelling / name / word needs to make a difference to be honest as long as people know what it means to them

I think that is exactly the point we are trying to make, and surely if you believe in an omnipotent god, there can only be one? Having two would mean that neither was omnipotent!

Sassy wrote:No, it's because you are English, as I presume you are, and you read the bible that calls God, God.   But if you read a book that called God, Allah, you would call him Allah.    Not that I believe there is such a thing anyway.

Doesn't that prove then, that it's all in a name???

eddie wrote:

Sassy wrote:No, it's because you are English, as I presume you are, and you read the bible that calls God, God.   But if you read a book that called God, Allah, you would call him Allah.    Not that I believe there is such a thing anyway.

Doesn't that prove then, that it's all in a name???

Precisely; that link I put above goes more into the issue between Muslims and Christians over the name. I'm sure some of the early groups that called themselves Christian but had differing beliefs about Jesus (all but one of which ended up being labeled heretical) encountered the same friction.

eddie wrote:

Sassy wrote:No, it's because you are English, as I presume you are, and you read the bible that calls God, God.   But if you read a book that called God, Allah, you would call him Allah.    Not that I believe there is such a thing anyway.

Doesn't that prove then, that it's all in a name???

Eds the point most people here are trying to make is that Allah isn't only a name; but a word that means God. If that wasn't the case why do Arab Christians and many other use the word 'Allah' instead of 'God' when talking about the exact same thing?

Ben_Reilly wrote:

smelly_bandit wrote:

yes and thats the linguistics you are trying to contort

a person may have referred to either Zeus or Zeus AS god but not Zeus MEANING god

which is what you are attempting to say is the case with ALLAH  

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/allah.html

ILAH means god in Arabic

ALLAH is the name of ILAH

The replacement of Allah with ILAH is a deliberate deception and contortion if linguistics

You can keep ignoring the facts as much as you want

I genuinely don't care, because you're quite a stupid person Ben and I don't expect better from you

Muhhamads fathers name was Abdullah you spastic

Abdullah means slave of ALLAH

Muhhamads father Abdullah was a Pagan and polytheist who worshipped a god called ALLAH

Do you know what a pagan and polytheist are, you ignoramus??

PMSL never seen such a bunch of idiots in my life

Eilzel wrote:

eddie wrote:


Doesn't that prove then, that it's all in a name???

Eds the point most people here are trying to make is that Allah isn't only a name; but a word that means God. If that wasn't the case why do Arab Christians and many other use the word 'Allah' instead of 'God' when talking about the exact same thing?

You're perverting the question

The question should be why if Allah is the word for god in Arabic do ENGLISH SPEAKING Muslims refer to god as Allah

Do you call your car by the German word for car??

No you call it the English word for car - car because you're English speaking you twat

And the word is ILAH not Allah

Allan's beard you are thick as fuck

Abdullah means Servant of God

Sassy wrote:Abdullah means Servant of God

Not possible since muhhamads father was a polytheist and believed in multiple GODS not a singular GOD.

The qur'an makes a clear distinction between god and Allah

The shahada itself also states that there is no GOD but ALLAH

Next bullshit reply??

Maybe it can come with some evidence of me supporting breivik instead of a conversation I'm having about the halal method of killing

Lying whorebag

I still don't understand that screengrab.

I wish some of the chaps here would stop calling women "whores".

Raggamuffin wrote:I still don't understand that screengrab.

I wish some of the chaps here would stop calling women "whores".

Sassy isn't a woman

She is a brute

A lying brute at that

Bless you Smelly, coming from you thats a compliment.

Sassy wrote:Bless you Smelly, coming from you thats a compliment.

You consider being called a liar a compliment??

Ok at least now we have an agreement - you're a liar

Any insult from you is a compliment, because I'd be really worried if you liked me  ::D:: 

Sassy wrote:Any insult from you is a compliment, because I'd be really worried if you liked me  ::D:: 

It's not an insult

I've seen what you look like and you sure as shit ain't no Cinderella. The ugly sister maybe

smelly_bandit wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:I still don't understand that screengrab.

I wish some of the chaps here would stop calling women "whores".

Sassy isn't a woman

She is a brute

A lying brute at that

It is against the rules to use insults based on gender though. I remember Ben saying so.

Actually Smelly, at 68 I think I look bloody good.

Sassy wrote:Actually Smelly, at 68 I think I look bloody good.

Yes, you do actually. Nice smile.  ::D:: 

Thanks lol. I'm afraid I don't get intimidated by fuckwits like Smelly lol

Smelly has a lots of 'facts'. Facts that are only facts to Smelly. I can make shit up, too. It would be as pointless as his manufactured shit. LOL

Jehovah, YHWH, Elochai, Eloi, he has many names but im sure Father didnt know that

groomsy wrote:Jehovah, YHWH, Elochai, Eloi, he has many names but im sure Father didnt know that

My husband is very knowledgeable about the bible .

bahhhhhhhhhh

Raggamuffin wrote:I still don't understand that screengrab.

I wish some of the chaps here would stop calling women "whores".

Me too, but Smelly's the only one who's done it that I've seen, and the only reason that I've refrained from stepping in is that it's all directed at Sassy -- and she has an unfair advantage when it comes to a battle of wits or maturity with him ...

Yeah, his use of the slur "whore" is despicable and speaks to his mindset. It shows that he can't address the comment, he can't control his emotions, and he thinks he can bother Sassy with his playground-worthy name-calling. And I'm given to believe he's an older "gentleman," which is a great life-lesson if you think about it.

But every time I crack down on someone for using a slur like that, I've had a half-dozen members jump on me and accuse me of acting like I'm some sort of all-powerful dictator (you know, of a news forum that doesn't even show up on Alexa) -- it's the basic "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.

As far as the screengrab goes, it shows that smelly does indeed care more about how livestock is slaughtered than about the children Anders Breivik killed.

He doesn't care about them because in his warped mind, they were too tolerant of Muslims and thus deserved to die. He showed that he is more concerned with a cow or a sheep than with a human child who might be raised to think that Muslims are tolerable.

smelly_bandit wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:

http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/allah.html

ILAH  means god in Arabic

ALLAH is the name of ILAH

The replacement of Allah with ILAH is a deliberate deception and contortion if linguistics

You can keep ignoring the facts as much as you want

I genuinely don't care, because you're quite a stupid person Ben and I don't expect better from you

Muhhamads fathers name was Abdullah you spastic

Abdullah means slave of ALLAH

Muhhamads father Abdullah was a Pagan and polytheist who worshipped a god called ALLAH

Do you know what a pagan and polytheist are, you ignoramus??

PMSL never seen such a bunch of idiots in my life

Actually you are the one where stupidity has reached new levels of idiocy.


Abraham followed the deity El Shaddai, which means "God almighty" which was borrowed form the Canaanite religions of deities, thus rendering your faith based off a Pagan deity and polytheist religion. Let alone this changed to Yahweh (The deity tells Moses he is now known by a new name), again a corruption and translation of the Hebrew YHWH. I suppose next you will tell me that the early Hebrews did not see Yahweh as having a consort deity in Asherah

DOH


I mean what an absurd argument, you claim to worship a character called Jesus, except he was not called Jesus, because that is just a Greek Translation of is real name Yeshua and you argue over the translation for the name of a God to people called Allah, when you call your own deity something he was never called, Jesus. So basically by your absurd logic all people who follow Jesus are not following Jesus, because he was never actually called Jesus, but Yeshua.

DOH


It does not get any dafter than that and shows why you are an utter simpleton

smelly_bandit wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

Eds the point most people here are trying to make is that Allah isn't only a name; but a word that means God. If that wasn't the case why do Arab Christians and many other use the word 'Allah' instead of 'God' when talking about the exact same thing?

You're perverting the question

The question should be why if Allah is the word for god in Arabic do ENGLISH SPEAKING Muslims refer to god as Allah

Do you call your car by the German word for car??

No you call it the English word for car - car because you're English speaking you twat

And the word is ILAH not Allah

Allan's beard you are thick as fuck

Yes you are thick as fuck as you call your deity Jesus, when he was called Yeshua, so you do not even use the the English translation of Yesuha, which is Joshua, you actually use the English translation of the Greek word Iesous, which is the Greek translation of Yeshua, it does not get any more daft an argument from you using your own daft logic here, when you refer to your deity as Jesus then, making you a right plonker

groomsy wrote:bahhhhhhhhhh

humbug   

God's son
Isaiah 9:6
For to us a child is born, to us a son is given, and the government will be on his shoulders. And he will be called Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God, Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Question: "What are the different names and titles of Jesus Christ?"

Answer: There are some 200 names and titles of Christ found in the Bible. Following are some of the more prominent ones, organized in three sections relating to names that reflect the nature of Christ, His position in the tri-unity of God, and His work on earth on our behalf.

The Nature of Christ
Chief Cornerstone: (Ephesians 2:20) – Jesus is the cornerstone of the building which is His church. He cements together Jew and Gentile, male and female—all saints from all ages and places into one structure built on faith in Him which is shared by all.

Firstborn over all creation: (Colossians 1:15) – Not the first thing God created, as some incorrectly claim, because verse 16 says all things were created through and for Christ. Rather, the meaning is that Christ occupies the rank and pre-eminence of the first-born over all things, that He sustains the most exalted rank in the universe; He is pre-eminent above all others; He is at the head of all things.

Head of the Church: (Ephesians 1:22; 4:15; 5:23) – Jesus Christ, not a king or a pope, is the only supreme, sovereign ruler of the Church—those for whom He died and who have placed their faith in Him alone for salvation.

Holy One: (Acts 3:14; Psalm 16:10) – Christ is holy, both in his divine and human nature, and the fountain of holiness to His people. By His death, we are made holy and pure before God.

Judge: (Acts 10:42; 2 Timothy 4: – The Lord Jesus was appointed by God to judge the world and to dispense the rewards of eternity.

King of kings and Lord of lords: (1 Timothy 6:15; Revelation 19:16) – Jesus has dominion over all authority on the earth, over all kings and rulers, and none can prevent Him from accomplishing His purposes. He directs them as He pleases.

Light of the World: (John 8:12) – Jesus came into a world darkened by sin and shed the light of life and truth through His work and His words. Those who trust in Him have their eyes opened by Him and walk in the light.

Prince of peace: (Isaiah 9:6) – Jesus came not to bring peace to the world as in the absence of war, but peace between God and man who were separated by sin. He died to reconcile sinners to a holy God.

Son of God: (Luke 1:35; John 1:49) – Jesus is the “only begotten of the Father” (John 1:14). Used 42 times in the New Testament, “Son of God” affirms the deity of Christ.

Son of man: (John 5:27) – Used as a contrast to “Son of God” this phrase affirms the humanity of Christ which exists alongside His divinity.

Word: (John 1:1; 1 John 5:7- – The Word is the second Person of the triune God, who said it and it was done, who spoke all things out of nothing in the first creation, who was in the beginning with God the Father, and was God, and by whom all things were created.

Word of God: (Revelation 19:12-13) – This is the name given to Christ that is unknown to all but Himself. It denotes the mystery of His divine person.

Word of Life: (1 John 1:1) – Jesus not only spoke words that lead to eternal life, but according to this verse He is the very words of life, referring to the eternal life of joy and fulfillment which He provides.

His position in the trinity
Alpha and Omega: (Revelation 1:8; 22:13) – Jesus declared Himself to be the beginning and end of all things, a reference to no one but the true God. This statement of eternality could apply only to God.

Emmanuel: (Isaiah 9:6; Matthew 1:23) – Literally “God with us.” Both Isaiah and Matthew affirm that the Christ who would be born in Bethlehem would be God Himself who came to earth in the form of a man to live among His people.

I Am: (John 8:58, with Exodus 3:14) – When Jesus ascribed to Himself this title, the Jews tried to stone Him for blasphemy. They understood that He was declaring Himself to be the eternal God, the unchanging Jehovah of the Old Testament.

Lord of All: (Acts 10:36) – Jesus is the sovereign ruler over the whole world and all things in it, of all the nations of the world, and particularly of the people of God's choosing, Gentiles as well as Jews.

True God: (1 John 5:20) – This is a direct assertion that Jesus, being the true God, is not only divine, but is the Divine. Since the Bible teaches there is only one God, this can only be describing His nature as part of the triune God.

His Work on earth
Author and Perfecter of our Faith: (Hebrews 12:2) – Salvation is accomplished through the faith that is the gift of God (Ephesians 2:8-9) and Jesus is the founder of our faith and the finisher of it as well. From first to last, He is the source and sustainer of the faith that saves us.

Bread of Life: (John 6:35; 6:48) – Just as bread sustains life in the physical sense, Jesus is the Bread that gives and sustains eternal life. God provided manna in the wilderness to feed His people and He provided Jesus to give us eternal life through His body, broken for us.

Bridegroom: (Matthew 9:15) – The picture of Christ as the Bridegroom and the Church as His Bride reveals the special relationship we have with Him. We are bound to each other in a covenant of grace that cannot be broken.

Deliverer: (Romans 11:26) – Just as the Israelites needed God to deliver them from bondage to Egypt, so Christ is our Deliverer from the bondage of sin.

Good Shepherd: (John 10:11,14) – In Bible times, a good shepherd was willing to risk his own life to protect his sheep from predators. Jesus laid down His life for His sheep, and He cares for and nurtures and feeds us.

High Priest: (Hebrews 2:17) – The Jewish high priest entered the Temple once a year to make atonement for the sins of the people. The Lord Jesus performed that function for His people once for all at the cross.

Lamb of God: (John 1:29) – God’s Law called for the sacrifice of a spotless, unblemished Lamb as an atonement for sin. Jesus became that Lamb led meekly to the slaughter, showing His patience in His sufferings and His readiness to die for His own.

Mediator: (1 Timothy 2:5) – A mediator is one who goes between two parties to reconcile them. Christ is the one and only Mediator who reconciles men and God. Praying to Mary or the saints is idolatry because it bypasses this most important role of Christ and ascribes the role of Mediator to another.

Rock: (1 Corinthians 10:4) – As life-giving water flowed from the rock Moses struck in the wilderness, Jesus is the Rock from which flow the living waters of eternal life. He is the Rock upon whom we build our spiritual houses, so that no storm can shake them.

Resurrection and Life: (John 11:25) – Embodied within Jesus is the means to resurrect sinners to eternal life, just as He was resurrected from the grave. Our sin is buried with Him and we are resurrected to walk in newness of life.

Savior: (Matthew 1:21; Luke 2:11) – He saves His people by dying to redeem them, by giving the Holy Spirit to renew them by His power, by enabling them to overcome their spiritual enemies, by sustaining them in trials and in death, and by raising them up at the last day.

True Vine: (John 15:1) – The True Vine supplies all that the branches (believers) need to produce the fruit of the Spirit— the living water of salvation and nourishment from the Word.

Way, Truth, Life: (John 14:6) – Jesus is the only path to God, the only Truth in a world of lies, and the only true source of eternal life. He embodies all three in both a temporal and an eternal sense.

Another translation fuck up in translations, Christ is the English translation of Christós which means anointed one, not God and is a translation of the Hebrew word for Messiah, Māšîaḥ, again this is title given to Jesus and "Son of God" in ancient times meant no more than a righteous Servant and Chosen one of the Jewish deity.


Jews do not believe in a son of their deity, as it would render and make their belief in one deity flawed and wrong and again poor translation because son of god means servant of God of which many  characters in the bible are refereed to as the son of God. Also Jews do not see Jesus as the messiah and do not see a messiah as a God


Again some Christians make things up as they go along

Ben_Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:I still don't understand that screengrab.

I wish some of the chaps here would stop calling women "whores".

Me too, but Smelly's the only one who's done it that I've seen, and the only reason that I've refrained from stepping in is that it's all directed at Sassy -- and she has an unfair advantage when it comes to a battle of wits or maturity with him ...

Yeah, his use of the slur "whore" is despicable and speaks to his mindset. It shows that he can't address the comment, he can't control his emotions, and he thinks he can bother Sassy with his playground-worthy name-calling. And I'm given to believe he's an older "gentleman," which is a great life-lesson if you think about it.

But every time I crack down on someone for using a slur like that, I've had a half-dozen members jump on me and accuse me of acting like I'm some sort of all-powerful dictator (you know, of a news forum that doesn't even show up on Alexa) -- it's the basic "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.

Actually, Lone Wolf called me a whore yesterday.

WHILE his puerile association here with that Trolling devils'whore "BagsOfStuffins" demonstrates both his poor judgement and his general bad tastes..

Ben_Reilly wrote:As far as the screengrab goes, it shows that smelly does indeed care more about how livestock is slaughtered than about the children Anders Breivik killed.

He doesn't care about them because in his warped mind, they were too tolerant of Muslims and thus deserved to die. He showed that he is more concerned with a cow or a sheep than with a human child who might be raised to think that Muslims are tolerable.

Maybe he just loves animals.

The grab is incomplete and it's not in any kind of context.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:

Me too, but Smelly's the only one who's done it that I've seen, and the only reason that I've refrained from stepping in is that it's all directed at Sassy -- and she has an unfair advantage when it comes to a battle of wits or maturity with him ...

Yeah, his use of the slur "whore" is despicable and speaks to his mindset. It shows that he can't address the comment, he can't control his emotions, and he thinks he can bother Sassy with his playground-worthy name-calling. And I'm given to believe he's an older "gentleman," which is a great life-lesson if you think about it.

But every time I crack down on someone for using a slur like that, I've had a half-dozen members jump on me and accuse me of acting like I'm some sort of all-powerful dictator (you know, of a news forum that doesn't even show up on Alexa) -- it's the basic "damned if you do, damned if you don't" scenario.

Actually, Lone Wolf called me a whore yesterday.

WHILE his puerile association here with that Trolling devils'whore "BagsOfStuffins" demonstrates both his poor judgement and his general bad tastes..

Then he was wrong to do so, such words are derogatory, when the word itself is an insult to all women.

It does not make him a troll though and many here are happy to hurl abuse at people, thus if one is wrong then all are wrong who do so, thus you either condemn all or none, hence why I am wrong when I do so

Jewish interpretation, who is Isaiah 9:6-7 speaking about?

According to Judaism, the answer is in the names chosen. The name 'Hezekiah' which in Hebrew is 'Chizkiyah' comes from the words 'chazak' and 'Ya.' 'Chazak' means 'strong' or 'mighty' and 'Ya' is the shortened name for Gd used as a suffix. Many might recognize the Ya' in the word, 'halleluyah' which means,'praise Gd.' Judaism believes that Isaiah 9:6-7 refers to Hezekiah, who reigned for almost 30 years. The name Hezekiah, Chizkiyah, is the same name in meaning, as one finds in the verses from Isaiah 9:6-7, a 'Mighty Gd.'


The fact is Jesus never ruled, thus he never had any Government on his shoulders and Prince of Peace?


Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household. [Matthew 10:34-36]

Ben_Reilly wrote:As far as the screengrab goes, it shows that smelly does indeed care more about how livestock is slaughtered than about the children Anders Breivik killed.

He doesn't care about them because in his warped mind, they were too tolerant of Muslims and thus deserved to die. He showed that he is more concerned with a cow or a sheep than with a human child who might be raised to think that Muslims are tolerable.

Pathetic

   

I WONDER if Smelly' and Fuzzy are a couple more of Fred Phelps's many 'estranged' children !


 

Eilzel wrote:

eddie wrote:


Doesn't that prove then, that it's all in a name???

Eds the point most people here are trying to make is that Allah isn't only a name; but a word that means God. If that wasn't the case why do Arab Christians and many other use the word 'Allah' instead of 'God' when talking about the exact same thing?

Exactly Mr E. As sassy, Didge, you, me and others have explained on page 2   

allah is still not the God of the bible , allah has no son God of the bible has a son , but we can go around in circles all day with this .

Ben_Reilly wrote:

What is this about!

Why is it here?
  

VOD(original) wrote:allah is still not the God of the bible , allah has no son God of the bible has a son , but we can go around in circles all day with this .

You are arguing semantics FGS. Regardless of whether your gods are or are not the same, the word for god in many languages IS ALLAH- why is so difficult to understand????????????????????

Eilzel wrote:

VOD(original) wrote:allah is still not the God of the bible , allah has no son God of the bible has a son , but we can go around in circles all day with this .

You are arguing semantics FGS. Regardless of whether your gods are or are not the same, the word for god in many languages IS ALLAH- why is so difficult to understand????????????????????

VOD: some of the earliest Christians referred to God as "The Unknown Father", in deference to his ineffability. If you and persons of Muslim faith both worship an omnipotent deity, how can you not be worshipping the same One?

Lola Olson writes for PinkNews on the Westboro Baptist Church, and argues that the attention given to the announcement that its leader Fred Phelps is on his death bed, should instead be focussed on LGBT inequalities.

There were a lot of things that separated me from most American children in middle school. Not only did I know way more about the internet and could type faster than most did, but I had a gay mother and was bullied myself for my inability to fit gender norms and the assumptions that created around my own sexuality. With that combination, it’s not surprising I was well aware of the Westboro Baptist Church, or the “God Hates Fags” people as I called them, from a young age.

The first time I visited their site, sparked by the news that they would be protesting Matthew Shephard’s funeral, I almost laughed. It was ridiculous, everything that they blamed us for. Thanks to both the silence around LGBTQ history in my life, schools, and the whitewashing of that history by the gay community, I wasn’t aware of people like Sylvia Rivera who was still alive to fight for our rights at the time, but I was aware of Matthew Shepherd and, having a mother who liked to go out now and then, it made me terrified for her and terrified for myself. The part the WBC had to play in that was minimal. They were caricatures. Ridiculous and I knew they posed me little to no harm unless I was directly in their line of fire.

Contrast that to the teachers and students who sat silent while I was relentlessly teased including my fifth grade teacher who rolled her eyes at me whenever I expressed distressed that my name had been written several times on the bathroom wall. Contrast that to the Congressmen who brought charts and diagrams to prove why my mother raising me was like giving a child molester access to children, why she didn’t deserve basic human rights because of who she loved. Contrast that to the temp agency that claimed my mother tested positive for PCP after a great first day at her new job – that is until her boss saw the rainbow sticker on her car. Contrast that to my own father who threatened repeatedly to take me away from my mother, take her into court, and win me from her on the grounds that she was gay and the courts in the 90s in the US South that would have gladly let him win.

But things are different now, yeah? It gets better? The WBC learned long ago that picking on gay people and picketing their funerals didn’t get them any closer to fame and it was only when they began picking on soldiers, the worst of patriotic taboos in the US, that people started actually caring. I don’t recall any “Freedom Riders” coming to Matthew and Judy Shephard’s aid, but now there are people lined up around the block to cheer about Fred Phelps’ death. As if the WBC had any power whatsoever over my real life. The truth is, I’m not mad at them. And I’m sick of their publicity and the way it allows people to pat themselves on the back for being pro-gay.

The same people who think Fred Phelps is horrible were the same people who told me they would vote for Bush despite his constant gunning for a marriage amendment because they “just didn’t believe in that”, with regards to my family. The same people who want to raise a glass are the same people who sat silent while I was bullied and did nothing. The same people who want to picket his funeral don’t seem that outraged by the growing amounts of homeless LGBTQ youth. Fred Phelps’ almost-death receives international media attention while the deaths of trans women of color across the globe go unnoticed. Everyone wants to party at his funeral but no one wants to do anything to keep us alive.

I’m not attempting to downplay the damage that the WBC has had on people’s lives, especially now that they’ve expanded their repertoire outside of LGBTQ people to anyone who will get them the most media attention for picketing. But it frustrates me that people continue to pretend as if the WBC are the most bigoted, as if there aren’t people in power who believe the exact same things they do but are more dangerous because they don’t advertise it. There are people with the same beliefs with far more institutional power than that church could ever hope for. Or worse, there are thousands of people with a poisonous apathy, who would gladly talk about how much they hate Fred Phelps but don’t give recent news about two murdered lesbians the time of day.

I don’t want to debate about whether we should have compassion for him. I don’t want to make plans to picket his funeral. I just want people to stop caring about the near death of a bigot and instead start caring about the lives of the people they supposedly support. Take the money you would spend on a pint drinking to Fred Phelps or on the picket parties or whatever people plan on organising, and give it instead to organisations that attempt to tackle the severe issues of homelessness and addiction among LGBTQ youth. If you’re in the UK, the Stonewall Housing project is a good one and if you’re in the US, The Sylvia Rivera Law Project is another.

Normally I do not support the “ignore bullies and they’ll go away” approach because I know full well that it doesn’t work. But bullies have power. The WBC has only the power of distracting us from the real people who hate “fags” among us. In the case of this one individual who gains more more by making us look the other way, I want to focus on strengthening our crumbling bridge instead of looking at the the troll that lives under it.

Lola Olson works in marketing and volunteers for Gendered Intelligence, runs an LGBTQ youth group, and identifies as non-binary.

As with all comment, this does not necessarily reflect the views of PinkNews.


http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2014/03/19/comment-fred-phelps-wbc/

 

VOD really should say "MY BIble" whenever she makes her statements like those above ~ as her versions/interpretations are quite often at odds with the three different versions I have around here somewhere...

Check out the online Bible quoting sites, and you will find over thirty "mainstream" versions of the Bible, and well over a hundred varieties and spinoffs from them. Then there's the fact that the first English Bible didn't appear until the 15th Century, so unless you are good at ancient Latin..

WITHIN the Catholic church (which is still >60% of the world's 2 billion+ Christians, by the way..), I have heard the terms Allah, Jehovah, Father, I AM, Creator as well for versions of God's name, used at various times over the years.  

AND, as always ~ I couldn't give a stuff what the small handful of Catholic haters and anti-Catholics on here may think..


AS FOR the smelly_bum_bandit and his always-worthless opinions ~ he still remains one of the most stupid, ignorant and troublemaking little maggots hiding under those slimy garden gnomes down the back of Drinky's garden...   

Lone Wolf wrote: 

VOD really should say "MY BIble" whenever she makes her statements like those above ~ as her versions/interpretations are quite often at odds with the three different versions I have around here somewhere...

Check out the online Bible quoting sites, and you will find over thirty "mainstream" versions of the Bible, and well over a hundred varieties and spinoffs from them. Then there's the fact that the first English Bible didn't appear until the 15th Century, so unless you are good at ancient Latin..  

WITHIN the Catholic church (which is still >60% of the world's 2 billion+ Christians, by the way..), I have heard the terms Allah, Jehovah, Father, I AM, Creator as well for versions of God's name, used at various times over the years.    

AND, as always ~ I couldn't give a stuff what the small handful of Catholic haters and anti-Catholics on here may think..


AS FOR the smelly_bum_bandit and his always-worthless opinions ~ he still remains one of the most stupid, ignorant and troublemaking little maggots hiding under those slimy garden gnomes down the back of Drinky's garden...      

    

Way to go Bee!

  

Lone Wolf wrote: 

VOD really should say "MY BIble" whenever she makes her statements like those above ~ as her versions/interpretations are quite often at odds with the three different versions I have around here somewhere...

Check out the online Bible quoting sites, and you will find over thirty "mainstream" versions of the Bible, and well over a hundred varieties and spinoffs from them. Then there's the fact that the first English Bible didn't appear until the 15th Century, so unless you are good at ancient Latin..  

WITHIN the Catholic church (which is still >60% of the world's 2 billion+ Christians, by the way..), I have heard the terms Allah, Jehovah, Father, I AM, Creator as well for versions of God's name, used at various times over the years.    

AND, as always ~ I couldn't give a stuff what the small handful of Catholic haters and anti-Catholics on here may think..


AS FOR the smelly_bum_bandit and his always-worthless opinions ~ he still remains one of the most stupid, ignorant and troublemaking little maggots hiding under those slimy garden gnomes down the back of Drinky's garden...      

Uncial script is used in the Oldest bibles,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_uncial_codices

Only the Sinai, Vaticanus, Ephraemi Rescriptus and Alexandrinus Codex, plus Coptic and Peshitta bibles existed before Emperor Constantine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Constantine_the_Great_and_Christianity