Border force are being trained to turn back migrant boats.

First topic message reminder :

A record 13,500 migrants have crossed the Channel in small boats this year, including at least 1,000 this week.
The UK has just paid a further 55 million to France, to fund another clampdown on small boat crossings from France to England....obviously it doesn't seem to have helped.




Priti Patel is set to anger France by moving ahead with plans to forcibly redirect migrant boats back across the Channel, despite warnings about the impact such a tactic would have on Anglo-French relations.

The home secretary is said to have ordered officials to rewrite maritime laws to allow Border Force to turn boats around before they reach England.

It follows a G7 interior minister's meeting on Wednesday when Ms Patel told her French counterpart that the UK public "expect to see results" from French efforts to prevent ongoing migrant crossings.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58495948?at_medium=RSS&at_campaign=KARANGA


https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/boris-johnson-news-live-patel-plan-to-return-migrant-boats-to-france-not-going-to-work-senior-tory-admits/ar-AAOfsSi?ocid=msedgntp

"The home secretary Priti Patel is said to have ordered officials to rewrite maritime laws to allow Border Force to turn boats around before they reach England."

Syl wrote:"The home secretary Priti Patel is said to have ordered officials to rewrite maritime laws to allow Border Force to turn boats around before they reach England."

I know. The mistakes always come from the right, where they think more in authoritarian terms and see ill-considered, shorter-term solutions.

Original Quill wrote:

Syl wrote:"The home secretary Priti Patel is said to have ordered officials to rewrite maritime laws to allow Border Force to turn boats around before they reach England."

I know.  The mistakes always come from the right, where they think more in authoritarian terms and see ill-considered, shorter-term solutions.

Illegal immigrants sailing in from France has gotten out of control.
Paying the French over 150 million pounds to control their own borders isn't working.
A solution has to be found...escorting boats back from whence they came is one solution.

Syl wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

I know.  The mistakes always come from the right, where they think more in authoritarian terms and see ill-considered, shorter-term solutions.

Illegal immigrants sailing in from France has gotten out of control.
Paying the French over 150 million pounds to control their own borders isn't working.
A solution has to be found...escorting boats back  from whence they came is one solution.

That's why I suggest it may be cheaper to house them in England, and speed up the process.

France isn't having a very good time at the moment then, getting it in the neck for not stopping illegals, going to have the illegals back perhaps, now the cancelling of the Australian submarine contract and being left out of AUUKUS.

I don't think the submarine contract cancellation plays into this picture.  The shift to US technology is because of "changing strategic conditions in the region", according to Prime Minister Scott Morrison. I don't know what that means, as he wasn't clear.  

Morrison said U.S. nuclear submarine technology wasn’t available to Australia in 2016 when it entered a 56 billion Australian dollar ($43 billion) deal with France to build 12 of the world's largest conventional diesel-electric submarines. Nuclear submarines can go on seemingly forever, whereas diesel-electric's are limited. But, these are not nuclear weapons; only nuclear powered.

The United States has previously only shared the technology with Britain.  

https://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2021-09-15/australia-buys-us-nuclear-subs-due-to-changed-security-needs

Original Quill wrote:

Syl wrote:

Illegal immigrants sailing in from France has gotten out of control.
Paying the French over 150 million pounds to control their own borders isn't working.
A solution has to be found...escorting boats back  from whence they came is one solution.

That's why I suggest it may be cheaper to house them in England, and speed up the process.

No... The EU should take responsibility for them because it is the EU open borders/free movement system that allows them to travel unchallenged across to the northern beaches of France.

Tommy Monk wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

That's why I suggest it may be cheaper to house them in England, and speed up the process.

No... The EU should take responsibility for them because it is the EU open borders/free movement system that allows them to travel unchallenged across to the northern beaches of France.

Why? No one is responsible...the crises that drives these people to our shores are just the way it is. So, it boils down to the cheapest way to do things. If it's cheaper to house them in England, why keep on needling France? Why wouldn't you just do what is least expensive?

Why don't they just stay in the first safe country they get to?


Instead of traveling across numerous safe countries and then trying to get a dinghy to cross into England?


It's because they are not refugees seeking safety... They are illegal immigrants pursuing their own selfish fincial enrichment.


So fuk them!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:Why don't they just stay in the first safe country they get to?

Instead of traveling across numerous safe countries and then trying to get a dinghy to cross into England?

Because it isn't safe. They probably have relatives in England, or maybe they have heard about it's humane treatment of refugees. Maybe it's the same reason I like the UK.

Tommy Monk wrote:It's because they are not refugees seeking safety... They are illegal immigrants pursuing their own selfish fincial enrichment.

So fuk them!!!

That's sociopathic.

It isn't safe...!!!???


In numerous safe countries which are popular holiday destinations for a multitude of countries citizens from all over the world...!!!???


It doesn't matter a shit if they can claim to have a friend or family relative here in UK... They are supposed to be seeking a place of safety... Not having a holiday with friends/family ..


But what they have heard about is how they can turn up with a sob story and immediately be given a room in a 4/5star hotel and money to spend every week, and then be given an apartment/house to live in, all expenses paid for a few years, and highly unlikely to ever get removed from the UK in the future!!!


Fuk them!!!


The tide is turning!!!


The people of the UK have had enough!!!


And if the govt won't do anything about it, then we will vote for a govt who will!!!


Enough is enough!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:It isn't safe...!!!???

In numerous safe countries which are popular holiday destinations for a multitude of countries citizens from all over the world...!!!???

Haiti isn't safe.  Mexico, Guatemala and Honduras are no longer safe.  Many African and eastern countries are no longer safe.  These are third world countries, not always secure.  And when they are not, people run away...seeking safety for themselves and their families.

Tommy Monk wrote:It doesn't matter a shit if they can claim to have a friend or family relative here in UK... They are supposed to be seeking a place of safety... Not having a holiday with friends/family ..

A holiday???  They are seeking a safety net, and you accuse them as being on holiday???  They are seeking a connection...someone who speaks the language...they are strangers in a strange land, and they are seeking some semblance of security.

Tommy Monk wrote:But what they have heard about is how they can turn up with a sob story and immediately be given a room in a 4/5star hotel and money to spend every week, and then be given an apartment/house to live in, all expenses paid for a few years, and highly unlikely to ever get removed from the UK in the future!!!

Heard?  Did you hear that?  What they are seeking is their own home, and to be left alone.  They can't get that, so they are leaving in misery and fear, not knowing if they will live or die, not knowing what to expect.

Now, it's up to you tom, but a little human kindness and generosity from those who have, to those in need, might be in order.

Tommy Monk wrote:Fuk them!!!

The tide is turning!!!

The people of the UK have had enough!!!

And if the govt won't do anything about it, then we will vote for a govt who will!!!

Enough is enough!!!

Ke-rist...humanity is not in your blood.    Let's hope that you and your family are never in need.  You might meet one of your own kind:

I don't think the answer is to run away and try to muscle into another country which then could become unsettled and may have civil unrest and there you are again - run away again?.
Countries that are unsafe need their governments to get a grip even if that means outside help.
Countries need to be brought up to a level where there is trade and employment and civil security, the developed world need to help with this directly instead of taking in more and more economic immigrants and doling out international aid in money for corrupt officials to pocket.
Most people would much rather live in their own country and culture why should we sit back and watch them flee everything they know and love then complain about them arriving on our shores when what they need is a reasonable economy. Mind you the majority of the people have to want to change things, not enough Afghanis seem to want change enough. Religion has a lot to answer for.

Would that we could achieve that. In the meantime, they need help and humanity says we give it to them...

Bullshit quill!!!


Everybody knows these lot are economic migrants.


And it's idiots like you who are allowing them to come and stay and this just encourages more and ever increasingly more to follow... And making our own country worse and worse.

Tommy Monk wrote:Bullshit quill!!!

Everybody knows these lot are economic migrants.

And it's idiots like you who are allowing them to come and stay and this just encourages more and ever increasingly more to follow... And making our own country worse and worse.

Horseshit. You're puffin' out your ass, as usual. You're the prissy lil prince, sittin' in his ivory throne, sayin' get those dirty lil people out of my petunia garden!!

We are each dealt our ass, and the line we can draw around it. Everything else is luck. Englishman?! Bullshit. You don't share your luck, it gets taken from you. In the end of ends, might is right...

The facts speak for themselves.


You don't like the truth.

Tommy Monk wrote:The facts speak for themselves.

You don't like the truth.

Haha...that's my line.  The truth is, they are coming and you can't do anything about it! France is doing precisely what Mexico is doing in the Americas - if they want to pass through, let 'em.

Both international treaties and national laws determine what states can do at sea, said Dr Felicity Attard, a lecturer in international maritime law at the University of Malta.

Under the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, a country has the right to act in its waters when faced with an "inbound vessels carrying migrants which are intending to commit a contravention of the coastal state's immigration laws," she said.

But any action must also "take into account humanitarian considerations, for example, the need to protect the rights of asylum-seekers," which are protected by the European Convention on Human Rights, she added.

Any force used to return migrant boats to France "may only be used as a last resort, if necessary, proportionate and justified to achieve a legitimate aim," she said.

Ultimately though, Dr Attard believes that "given the safety issues both to the migrants on board and to international shipping, should it wish, France would be entitled to intervene".

However, the duty to "render assistance and protect life at sea remains paramount throughout," she added.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-53650537

So, they are saying we have a right to intervene and we can return them to France.


Good!

Tommy Monk wrote:So, they are saying we have a right to intervene and we can return them to France.

Good!

What rights do you think you have over French territory?  They kicked Henry II's boys out of Anjou and Normandy during King John's reign.

We have the right to repel and return illegal invaders...


Your above copy and paste post says exactly that.

Tommy Monk wrote:We have the right to repel and return illegal invaders...

Your above copy and paste post says exactly that.

But not to French territory.  Why don't you do what the US does with these Haitians who are gathering in and around Del Rio, Texas: airlift them back to their country of origin - unless, of course, they ask for political asylum.

It would be a lot more humane than turning them back into the cold, dark, abyss of nothingness - for which you will eventually be blamed if anything goes wrong.  Would it be so hard for the great British Empire to show a little global responsibility?

It's interesting that you describe France and the wider EU as a 'cold, dark, abyss of nothingness'...

Tommy Monk wrote:It's interesting that you describe France and the wider EU as a 'cold, dark, abyss of nothingness'...

Actually, that would be eastern Europe.  Romania, Bulgaria, Moldovia...and Belarus...it gets worse the further east you go.  Anywhere, that's to the east!  

But there's more to it than location.  It's political conditions, drug gangs, in addition to physical ruin. Eastern Europe is government by gangs, or organized crime, sex trafficking, and it verges on worse than 3d-world status...with dictators murdering dignitaries to eliminate political rivals, or shut up reporters, etc. Ethnic gangs recruiting teenagers for criminal enterprises.  There's no end to the misery that brings these innocent people to our abundant shores.

Those people are protecting their children...and you blame them?

99% of them are fighting age men.


Belarus and Moldova are not in the EU.


They are coming from France, which last time I checked is a safe country.


And they have traveled through numerous other safe EU countries to get to France.


They are the EU responsibility because firstly they are in the EU, and it is EU open borders that allows them to move around the EU freely to get to France, they are unchallenged because of the EU open borders.

Tommy Monk wrote:99% of them are fighting age men.

I don't think so.  Have you any proof?

Tommy Monk wrote:Belarus and Moldova are not in the EU.

They are eastern European, aren't they?

Tommy Monk wrote:They are coming from France, which last time I checked is a safe country.

And they have traveled through numerous other safe EU countries to get to France.

They are the EU responsibility because firstly they are in the EU, and it is EU open borders that allows them to move around the EU freely to get to France, they are unchallenged because of the EU open borders.

Open borders...among EU members.  We have open borders among our States, too; but not to enter the US.  They are refugees that have entered the EU merely to cross to Britain.  So it would seem that their target is the UK, and once they leave EU shores, it's your problem.  Your argument is a better one for the EU, than for England.

You have a problem.  You attract refugees.