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Post by Guest Wed Mar 31, 2021 12:08 pm

First topic message reminder :

The UK is no longer a country "where the system is deliberately rigged against ethnic minorities", a government-ordered review has said.

The Independent Commission on Race and Ethnic Disparities - which was appointed by Prime Minister Boris Johnson following last summer's Black Lives Matter protests - has published its 258-page report on inequality in Britain.

It said the UK "should be regarded as a model for other white-majority countries" although it cannot be considered "a post racial society".

https://news.sky.com/story/britain-no-longer-country-where-system-is-deliberately-rigged-against-ethnic-minorities-according-to-government-ordered-race-review-12261675
-----------------------------------------------
Thoughts


Last edited by Korben on Fri Apr 02, 2021 1:42 pm; edited 2 times in total

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Post by Guest Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:59 am

Maddog wrote:I doubt you're going to answer at this point.

Methinks you've had a good bit of Scottish ale. Can't blame you, it's some good stuff.
well with the risk of "virtue singling"
i don't drink ,haven't for 33 years since the day i passed my driving test. As Ricky Gervais says you can do one or the other you cant do both

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Post by eddie Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:15 am

Korben wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Korben wrote:
No thanks i'm great  But i am not sure the same cant be said of you and this inferiority complex you seem to be manifesting in response to differing views and beliefs

Do you have an inferiority complex?
MMMMmmmmmm  

Projection is a common defense mechanism that causes more harm than good. This is closely linked to transference, and the two can wreak havoc on an individual's mental health and interpersonal relationships.

so lie down and tell me when did these feelings start ?
How was your childhood ?
Do i need the "doll" ?


Earlier on, in another thread, I said you insult people.
This is what I meant.

Childish statements. You want to not mention dolls and “how was your childhood” - this is what I mean.

Not singling you out, just telling you this, is not how you should go about things. You’re better than this.

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Post by Guest Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:46 am

eddie wrote:
Korben wrote:
MMMMmmmmmm  

Projection is a common defense mechanism that causes more harm than good. This is closely linked to transference, and the two can wreak havoc on an individual's mental health and interpersonal relationships.

so lie down and tell me when did these feelings start ?
How was your childhood ?
Do i need the "doll" ?


Earlier on, in another thread, I said you insult people.
This is what I meant.

Childish statements. You want to not mention dolls and “how was your childhood” - this is what I mean.

Not singling you out, just telling you this, is not how you should go about things. You’re better than this.
I also said i don't start it which i didn't

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Post by Guest Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:58 am

And to be honest saying "Not singling you out" is in effect "singling me out"
same as the term "with all due respect "used in an argument to indicate that there is no respect and that in any case it is not due.

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Post by eddie Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:10 am

Korben wrote:And to be honest saying "Not singling you out" is in effect "singling me out"
same as the term "with all due respect "used in an argument to indicate that there is no respect and that in any case it is not due.

Firstly, “I didn’t start it” or to quote you directly, “I also said i don't start it which i didn't”, is a cop out.

“You joined in” then.
Does that make it better?

Secondly, when I say “I’m not singling you out” I mean, I think this about many, but I let you know that I don’t mean just you so that you know I’m not just meaning you and I have said this same thing to most on here.
Take a look.

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Post by Maddog Tue Apr 06, 2021 5:15 am

Someone got sand in their vagina and left..

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Post by Syl Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:15 pm

Maddog wrote:Someone got sand in their vagina and left..

It's a shame. I thought Korben was holding his own and enjoying the cut and thrust of the heated debates.

It just shows, we dont know what's going on with anyone really. I know Korben said he left once before because forums were getting to him, and I can understand they are not for everyone, they can get a bit rough sometimes.

I hope he reconsiders and comes back. x

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Post by Andy Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:44 pm

Its a knack this forum has of letting it's better posters leave at the expense of retaining the more argumentative and vitriolic ones.

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Post by gelico Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:01 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:Next they'll be calling him a 'coconut'... Brown on the outside, white on the inside...

I think that is an "Oreo Cookie"--brown on the outside, white on the inside.  Token blacks are often called that.


Token blacks??

interesting

what is a 'token black', quill?


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Post by Original Quill Tue Apr 06, 2021 3:34 pm

Maddog wrote:Government should be a referee. Not a participant.

Not since John Maynard Keynes.

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Post by Maddog Tue Apr 06, 2021 4:03 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:Someone got sand in their vagina and left..

It's a shame. I thought Korben was holding his own and enjoying the cut and thrust of the heated debates.

It just shows, we dont know what's going on with anyone really. I know Korben said he left once before because forums were getting to him, and I can understand they are not for everyone, they can get a bit rough sometimes.

I hope he reconsiders and comes back. x

He actually was a decent dude when he acted decent.

I could tell his posting style and syntaxe would change when he got riled up.

I think he thought he was slaying a dragon (me) and when he found out not all of the damsels weren't all that impressed he took his sword and left.

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Post by Maddog Tue Apr 06, 2021 4:04 pm

Andy wrote:Its a knack this forum has of letting it's  better posters leave at the expense of retaining the more argumentative  and vitriolic ones.

Rolling Eyes

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Post by Maddog Tue Apr 06, 2021 4:07 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:Government should be a referee. Not a participant.

Not since John Maynard Keynes.

I agree that he is responsible for much of the economic policy we see in the US and Europe.

Yellen is a Keynesian.

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Post by gelico Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:47 pm

gelico wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

I think that is an "Oreo Cookie"--brown on the outside, white on the inside.  Token blacks are often called that.


Token blacks??

interesting

what is a 'token black', quill?


quill?

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Post by Tommy Monk Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:27 am

Andy wrote:Its a knack this forum has of letting it's better posters leave at the expense of retaining the more argumentative and vitriolic ones.


Oh dear...



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Post by Original Quill Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:33 pm

gelico wrote:
gelico wrote:

Token blacks??

interesting

what is a 'token black', quill?

quill?

Tokenism is the practice of making only a perfunctory or symbolic effort to be inclusive to members of minority groups, especially by recruiting people from underrepresented groups in order to give the appearance of racial or sexual equality within a workforce. The effort of including a token employee to a workforce is usually intended to create the impression of social inclusiveness and diversity (racial, religious, sexual, etc.) in order to deflect accusations of discrimination. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokenism

Token Black, formerly known as Token Williams, is a male fourth grader at South Park Elementary and is voiced by Adrien Beard. His name is a play on words referring to the politically correct idea of the "token black guy" commonly featured on American television shows. https://southpark.fandom.com/wiki/Token_Black#:~:text=Token%20Black%2C%20formerly%20known%20as,featured%20on%20American%20television%20shows.

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Post by Maddog Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:39 pm

Original Quill wrote:
gelico wrote:

quill?

Tokenism is the practice of making only a perfunctory or symbolic effort to be inclusive to members of minority groups, especially by recruiting people from underrepresented groups in order to give the appearance of racial or sexual equality within a workforce. The effort of including a token employee to a workforce is usually intended to create the impression of social inclusiveness and diversity (racial, religious, sexual, etc.) in order to deflect accusations of discrimination.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokenism

Token Black, formerly known as Token Williams, is a male fourth grader at South Park Elementary and is voiced by Adrien Beard. His name is a play on words referring to the politically correct idea of the "token black guy" commonly featured on American television shows.  https://southpark.fandom.com/wiki/Token_Black#:~:text=Token%20Black%2C%20formerly%20known%20as,featured%20on%20American%20television%20shows.

Token blacks are not Oreos or coconuts. Those terms come from a black person acting white, in the estimation of some peers. Token blacks are put there by white people to show they are inclusive.

Two different animals. I doubt you know any black folks so I can understand your confusion.

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Post by Original Quill Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:50 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Not since John Maynard Keynes.

I agree that he is responsible for much of the economic policy we see in the US and Europe.

Yellen is a Keynesian.

Keynesian economics is not a movement with which one can associate, or disassociate. It's a fact, or a series of factual conclusions.

Keynesian economics (sometimes called Keynesianism, named after the economist John Maynard Keynes) are the various macroeconomic theories and models of how aggregate demand (total spending in the economy) strongly influences economic output and inflation. [Keynesians point out the fact that] aggregate demand does not necessarily equal the productive capacity of the economy. Instead, it is influenced by a host of factors – sometimes behaving erratically – affecting production, employment, and inflation.

Keynesian economists generally argue that aggregate demand is volatile and unstable and that, consequently, a market economy often experiences inefficient macroeconomic outcomes – a recession, when demand is low, and inflation, when demand is high. Further, they argue that these economic fluctuations can be mitigated by economic policy responses coordinated between government and central bank. In particular, fiscal policy actions (taken by the government) and monetary policy actions (taken by the central bank), can help stabilize economic output, inflation, and unemployment over the business cycle. Keynesian economists generally advocate a market economy – predominantly private sector, but with an active role for government intervention during recessions and depressions. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keynesian_economics

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Post by Maddog Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:04 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

I agree that he is responsible for much of the economic policy we see in the US and Europe.

Yellen is a Keynesian.  

Keynesian economics is not a movement with which one can associate, or disassociate.  It's a fact, or a series of factual conclusions.

Keynesian economics (sometimes called Keynesianism, named after the economist John Maynard Keynes) are the various macroeconomic theories and models of how aggregate demand (total spending in the economy) strongly influences economic output and inflation. [Keynesians point out the fact that] aggregate demand does not necessarily equal the productive capacity of the economy. Instead, it is influenced by a host of factors – sometimes behaving erratically – affecting production, employment, and inflation.

Keynesian economists generally argue that aggregate demand is volatile and unstable and that, consequently, a market economy often experiences inefficient macroeconomic outcomes – a recession, when demand is low, and inflation, when demand is high. Further, they argue that these economic fluctuations can be mitigated by economic policy responses coordinated between government and central bank. In particular, fiscal policy actions (taken by the government) and monetary policy actions (taken by the central bank), can help stabilize economic output, inflation, and unemployment over the business cycle. Keynesian economists generally advocate a market economy – predominantly private sector, but with an active role for government intervention during recessions and depressions.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Keynesian_economics

There are different schools of economics Doc.

Here's an entertaining comparison of two of them.



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Post by Original Quill Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:16 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Tokenism is the practice of making only a perfunctory or symbolic effort to be inclusive to members of minority groups, especially by recruiting people from underrepresented groups in order to give the appearance of racial or sexual equality within a workforce. The effort of including a token employee to a workforce is usually intended to create the impression of social inclusiveness and diversity (racial, religious, sexual, etc.) in order to deflect accusations of discrimination.  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tokenism

Token Black, formerly known as Token Williams, is a male fourth grader at South Park Elementary and is voiced by Adrien Beard. His name is a play on words referring to the politically correct idea of the "token black guy" commonly featured on American television shows.  https://southpark.fandom.com/wiki/Token_Black#:~:text=Token%20Black%2C%20formerly%20known%20as,featured%20on%20American%20television%20shows.

Token blacks are not Oreos or coconuts. Those terms come from a black person acting white, in the estimation of some peers. Token blacks are put there by white people to show they are inclusive.  

Two different animals. I doubt you know any black folks so I can understand your confusion.  

What is the difference? Oreo, or coconut, are simply slang words for the result of tokenism. I don't agree that it depends on the color of the speaker. All you are pointing out is that a white-man creation (racism) begets the meaning common to both terms.

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Post by Maddog Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:23 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Token blacks are not Oreos or coconuts. Those terms come from a black person acting white, in the estimation of some peers. Token blacks are put there by white people to show they are inclusive.  

Two different animals. I doubt you know any black folks so I can understand your confusion.  

What is the difference?  Oreo, or coconut, are simply slang words for the result of tokenism.  I don't agree that it depends on the color of the speaker.  All you are pointing out is that a white-man creation (racism) begets the meaning common to both terms.

Oreo and coconut mean the same. But that's not Tokenism. One term is about how some white people treat blacks (people like you TBH). The other refers to how blacks think about other blacks. Much like the phrase "house negro'.

You're an old white man living in a very white area. I don't expect you to know much about minorities except what you see on TV.

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Post by Original Quill Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:01 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

What is the difference? Oreo, or coconut, are simply slang words for the result of tokenism. I don't agree that it depends on the color of the speaker. All you are pointing out is that a white-man creation (racism) begets the meaning common to both terms.

Oreo and coconut mean the same. But that's not Tokenism. One term is about how some white people treat blacks (people like you TBH). The other refers to how blacks think about other blacks. Much like the phrase "house negro'.

You're an old white man living in a very white area. I don't expect you to know much about minorities except what you see on TV.

Look at you...arguing definitions again. A return to “noofy”. How useless!

Duh...they are white devises. Of course, whites understand. Both oreo and tokenism deal with deception and race (or otherism): to appear to be inclusive when you’re only pretending. A token black is an oreo cookie: white on the inside, black on the outside. It couldn’t be simpler.

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"What's yours is mine, and what's mine is mine." ― Old Republican proverb.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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Post by Maddog Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:32 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Oreo and coconut  mean the same. But that's not Tokenism.  One term is about how some white people treat blacks (people like you TBH). The other refers to how blacks think about other blacks. Much like the phrase "house negro'.

You're an old white man living in a very white area. I don't expect you to know much about minorities except what you see on TV.

Look at you...arguing definitions again.  A return to “noofy”.  How useless!

Duh...they are white devises.  Of course, whites understand.  Both oreo and tokenism deal with deception and race (or otherism): to appear to be inclusive when you’re only pretending.  A token black is an oreo cookie: white on the inside, black on the outside.  It couldn’t be simpler.

You're wrong again. Blacks give Blacks the name of oreo, coconut or house negro.

Whites create the token Blacks.

You need to get out of your white enclave more..

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Post by Original Quill Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:50 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Look at you...arguing definitions again.  A return to “noofy”.  How useless!

Duh...they are white devises.  Of course, whites understand.  Both oreo and tokenism deal with deception and race (or otherism): to appear to be inclusive when you’re only pretending.  A token black is an oreo cookie: white on the inside, black on the outside.  It couldn’t be simpler.

You're wrong again. Blacks give Blacks the name of oreo, coconut or house negro.

Whites create the token Blacks.

You need to get out of your white enclave more..

...and there is no difference. Jesus, you are thick.

It's all the same...racist deception.

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Post by Maddog Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:54 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

You're wrong again. Blacks give Blacks the name of oreo, coconut or house negro.

Whites create the token Blacks.

You need to get out of your white enclave more..

...and there is no difference.  Jesus, you are thick.

It's all the same...racist deception.

Of course there is a difference. A black guy could be a token black, while not being a coconut. Being a coconut is based on his actions and the perception of other blacks.

Remember Fresh Prince? Will or Carlton could have been a token black on a school project to lend diversity.

However Will could never be considered a coconut, but Carlton would be.

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pa·ter·nal·ism

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Post by Syl Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:05 pm

I always thought the TOKEN black man, white man, woman, etc....meant that just one person was chosen to represent that group so the organisation (or whatever) could not be accused of racism, sexism, etc.

Terms like Coconut are derogatory ways of describing a black person who tries to act white.

I'm sure there are equally scathing words for white people acting black too....though dont know any off heart.

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Post by Maddog Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:09 pm

Syl wrote:I always thought the TOKEN black man, white man, woman, etc....meant that just one person was chosen to represent that group so the organisation (or whatever) could not be accused of racism, sexism, etc.

Terms like Coconut are derogatory ways of describing a black person who tries to act white.

I'm sure there are equally scathing words for white people acting black too....though dont know any off heart.

You are correct.

BTW, a white person that acts black is called a wigger, at least that's what my nephew was called when he thought he was going to be the next Eminem.

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pa·ter·nal·ism

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Post by Syl Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:11 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:I always thought the TOKEN black man, white man, woman, etc....meant that just one person was chosen to represent that group so the organisation (or whatever) could not be accused of racism, sexism, etc.

Terms like Coconut are derogatory ways of describing a black person who tries to act white.

I'm sure there are equally scathing words for white people acting black too....though dont know any off heart.

You are correct.

BTW, a white person that acts black is called a wigger, at least that's what my nephew was called when he thought he was going to be the next Eminem.  

Yeah, Eminem is the perfect example of a 'wigger'. Laughing

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Post by Maddog Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:14 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:

You are correct.

BTW, a white person that acts black is called a wigger, at least that's what my nephew was called when he thought he was going to be the next Eminem.  

Yeah, Eminem is the perfect example of a 'wigger'. Laughing

So was my nephew. The dude was actually pretty good at rapping.

Now he has a house, wife and 4 kids.

He even spent more time fighting the law then his crazy uncle.


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Post by Syl Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:06 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:

Yeah, Eminem is the perfect example of a 'wigger'. Laughing

So was my nephew. The dude was actually pretty good at rapping.

Now he has a house, wife and 4 kids.

He even spent more time fighting the law then his crazy uncle.


Yesterday's rapper is today's crooner...time marches on. Cool

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