Cost of Britain's asylum system DOUBLES in five years to £1billion, new figures reveal

by Tommy Monk Wed Dec 16, 2020 1:28 pm

The increase is being driven by a surge in the number of asylum seekers in the country as well as changes to the way they are housed.

The number receiving their living costs from the taxpayer has increased by 40 per cent since 2015, according to the Home Office data quietly published last week.

Some 56,570 asylum seekers and their dependants were receiving living allowances at the end of June, with the majority also receiving free accommodation, compared with just over 40,000 in 2015.

A record number are still getting taxpayer-funded assistance even though their claims for refugee status have been thrown out.

Despite exhausting their appeal routes, and failing to persuade the courts that they are genuine refugees, they get taxpayer cash because they are destitute and cannot be removed from the UK.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8683503/Cost-Britains-asylum-DOUBLES-five-years-1billion-new-figures-reveal.html

Overwhelming vast majority are economic migrants and have arrived here after traveling through numerous safe countries!

And how many are jihadists planning to do us harm some time in the future?

Those from Africa should be returned to the African Union to resettle somewhere in Africa and those from the middle East should be returned to the Arab League to resettle somewhere there.

The more we allow them to come here and stay, the more will try to come here and stay.

This cannot carry on!

by Original Quill Wed Dec 16, 2020 4:00 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:And how many are jihadists planning to do us harm some time in the future?

Very few, if any, I would say. By the very act of running away from trouble they are seeking to avoid harm, not gravitating toward it.

And there is little justification, other than your personal bias, for segregating Africans and Middle Easterners. Why not Norwegians?

by Tommy Monk Wed Dec 16, 2020 6:35 pm

We don't have any Norwegians arriving here claiming asylum after they have travelled through other safe countries on route here...

by Tommy Monk Wed Dec 16, 2020 8:58 pm

Those from Africa should be returned to the African Union to resettle somewhere in Africa and those from the middle East should be returned to the Arab League to resettle somewhere there.

Surely there are places in the vast continent of Africa and the numerous safe oil rich countries where they can be given safe places to live...!?

Isnt it the case that they are claiming to be wanting a safe place to live...!?

Or are they just mis-using the asylum rules to bullshit their way into getting a chance to live here in the UK...!?

by Original Quill Wed Dec 16, 2020 9:19 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Those from Africa should be returned to the African Union to resettle somewhere in Africa and those from the middle East should be returned to the Arab League to resettle somewhere there.

Surely there are places in the vast continent of Africa and the numerous safe oil rich countries where they can be given safe places to live...!?

Isnt it the case that they are claiming to be wanting a safe place to live...!?

Or are they just mis-using the asylum rules to bullshit their way into getting a chance to live here in the UK...!?

I don't think so.

To be honest, they should live anywhere they want. I think those who hold your opinion of divisiveness are petutating the disunity from which they are escaping (disagreement -> disunity -> civil war). All they want is a peaceful community in which to raise their families.

What lacks any real, valid basis is your type of racial nationalism.

by Maddog Wed Dec 16, 2020 10:07 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:Those from Africa should be returned to the African Union to resettle somewhere in Africa and those from the middle East should be returned to the Arab League to resettle somewhere there.

Surely there are places in the vast continent of Africa and the numerous safe oil rich countries where they can be given safe places to live...!?

Isnt it the case that they are claiming to be wanting a safe place to live...!?

Or are they just mis-using the asylum rules to bullshit their way into getting a chance to live here in the UK...!?

I don't think so.

To be honest, they should live anywhere they want. I think those who hold your opinion of divisiveness are petutating the disunity from which they are escaping (disagreement -> disunity -> civil war). All they want is a peaceful community in which to raise their families.

What lacks any real, valid basis is your type of racial nationalism.

Maybe he's Eastern European?

by Tommy Monk Thu Dec 17, 2020 12:41 am

Plenty of safe places for them to live in countries near to their place of origin.

And that is where they should be going to.

by Original Quill Thu Dec 17, 2020 3:45 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Plenty of safe places for them to live in countries near to their place of origin.

And that is where they should be going to.

The safe place that comes to mind is the UK. Why look elsewhere?

by Tommy Monk Thu Dec 17, 2020 5:44 pm

Don't be a fool quill.

by Original Quill Thu Dec 17, 2020 6:10 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Don't be a fool quill.

You don't like living in Britian? I think it's one of the most attractive places on earth. Wink

by Victorismyhero Sat Dec 26, 2020 6:19 pm

so they should settle wherever they like....

can tommy come and live in your town.....AT YOUR EXPENSE.......

by Original Quill Sat Dec 26, 2020 8:26 pm

Victorismyhero wrote:so they should settle wherever they like....

can tommy come and live in your town.....AT YOUR EXPENSE.......

Pretty much. There's no NHS, yet. But at 60, Social Security and Medicare kick in and he can always find Section 8 housing. Education is free, and hot lunches for the kids, so at least that's one meal a day for them. They are messing with food stamps, but with the virus, there are plenty of food banks. Start with the Salvation Army.

by Maddog Sun Dec 27, 2020 2:51 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Victorismyhero wrote:so they should settle wherever they like....

can tommy come and live in your town.....AT YOUR EXPENSE.......

Pretty much. There's no NHS, yet. But at 60, Social Security and Medicare kick in and he can always find Section 8 housing. Education is free, and hot lunches for the kids, so at least that's one meal a day for them. They are messing with food stamps, but with the virus, there are plenty of food banks. Start with the Salvation Army.

Actually he cant, and you know better.

Tommy would have more issues than Ben did in the UK because he doesn't have an American wife.

Government services like food stamps are available to refugees but not immigrants. Tommy could never get classified as a refugee.

He could live with these folks that are so prevalent in your shithole city.

Cost of Britain's asylum system DOUBLES in five years to £1billion, new figures reveal 20201210

by Ben Reilly Mon Dec 28, 2020 9:45 am

I've had conversations with white people from England who tell me, with a straight face, that they're just fed up with all the immigration -- as though they're not speaking to an immigrant.

It leads me to believe there are only certain types of immigration they're fed up with.

by Syl Mon Dec 28, 2020 12:39 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:I've had conversations with white people from England who tell me, with a straight face, that they're just fed up with all the immigration -- as though they're not speaking to an immigrant.

It leads me to believe there are only certain types of immigration they're fed up with.

Only white people?

My next door neighbours are Indian, they were heartily sick of the immigration system too.

As are millions of various shade of Brit, who saw the EU open door policy as damaging to this countries workforce.
When British jobs are advertised in other EU countries and filled before they are advertised in the home country....surely anyone can see why people who are out of work because a foreign labour force are prepared to work for far less money (they can afford to because they have far less overheads) object to immigrants flooding in and taking the jobs.

Obviously this peaked a few years ago, especially in the building and catering trades, but people have long memories, which is probably why, when the chance came, the majority of the country voted out ....which has finally, after years, has now happened. cheers

Incidentally Ben, we had this conversation years ago, and I did point out back then that the open door the UK provided to EU residents was one reason why the authorities here drastically limited immigration from none EU countries, which obviously included the US....of whatever colour.

by Tommy Monk Mon Dec 28, 2020 2:35 pm

https://www.reuters.com/article/britain-immigration-survey-idINDEEA0603G20140107

by Maddog Mon Dec 28, 2020 3:58 pm

I have found that many immigrants, of any color or race, have issues with a wide open immigration policy. I think they feel they earned the right to immigrate, and resent others that just waltz in and believe staying is in a new country is some form of a human right.

by Syl Mon Dec 28, 2020 4:49 pm

Maddog wrote:I have found that many immigrants, of any color or race, have issues with a wide open immigration policy. I think they feel they earned the right to immigrate, and resent others that just waltz in and believe staying is in a new country is some form of a human right.

We often see immigrants here on TV moaning about immigration. Razz

But....if people have come here, settled, maybe for two or three generations, worked hard and prospered, (my neighbours are doctors and business owners) I can understand they feel loyal to the country they have dedicated their lives to, paid their taxes, bought their homes in etc etc.

by Maddog Mon Dec 28, 2020 4:56 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:I have found that many immigrants, of any color or race, have issues with a wide open immigration policy. I think they feel they earned the right to immigrate, and resent others that just waltz in and believe staying is in a new country is some form of a human right.

We often see immigrants here on TV moaning about immigration.

But....if people have come here, settled, maybe for two or three generations, worked hard and prospered, (my neighbours are doctors and business owners) I can understand they feel loyal to the country they have dedicated their lives to, paid their taxes, bought their homes in etc etc.

We don't call those folks immigrants. Only people that move here or their children. Except for Native Americans were all kind of immigrants here.

I'm talking about folks born in other countries. They had to jump through hoops (like Ben) and often resent people that use loopholes to avoid those hoops.

by Syl Mon Dec 28, 2020 5:01 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:

We often see immigrants here on TV moaning about immigration.

But....if people have come here, settled, maybe for two or three generations, worked hard and prospered, (my neighbours are doctors and business owners) I can understand they feel loyal to the country they have dedicated their lives to, paid their taxes, bought their homes in etc etc.

We don't call those folks immigrants. Only people that move here or their children. Except for Native Americans were all kind of immigrants here.

I'm talking about folks born in other countries. They had to jump through hoops (like Ben) and often resent people that use loopholes to avoid those hoops.

Well it would be pretty annoying if you were waiting in line and doing everything by the book and others were fiddling their way in the country by foul means. Cost of Britain's asylum system DOUBLES in five years to £1billion, new figures reveal 2396444674

Cost of Britain's asylum system DOUBLES in five years to £1billion, new figures reveal 2396444674

by Ben Reilly Mon Dec 28, 2020 5:59 pm

I wouldn't wish my struggle to immigrate to the UK on anyone.

And actually, the reason I got my visa is Section 8.

by Maddog Mon Dec 28, 2020 6:42 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:I wouldn't wish my struggle to immigrate to the UK on anyone.

And actually, the reason I got my visa is Section 8.

Do you think you should have been able to simply move there and live there, if you weren't married to a UK citizen?

Should anyone? Or should there be a valid reason, like work, marriage to a resident or being a refugee escaping an oppressive regime?

by Ben Reilly Tue Dec 29, 2020 10:07 am

Do you think that governments have a natural right to tell people where they can and cannot live or travel?

by Ben Reilly Tue Dec 29, 2020 10:09 am

I meant Article 8, not Section 8,btw

by Syl Tue Dec 29, 2020 11:51 am

Ben Reilly wrote:Do you think that governments have a natural right to tell people where they can and cannot live or travel?

I think countries have the right to admit or not who they want.

We are an island.....what may seem like a pot of waiting gold at the end of the rainbow for some.....results in shortage of all NHS services, housing, jobs, schools, education, etc, etc for the people who live on that island.

Do we want more terrorism here? more people who want to dictate who or what we worship? women to be thrown back into the dark ages because they are inferior to men? the colour of our skin or the way we dress to dictate how others can treat us?

Exaggeration...yep, but open up borders to whoever, whatever and from wherever people want to enter unhindered from, and the second paragraph could become the reality of the future.....the first paragraph is already a reality for millions on this little old island of ours. Wink

by Maddog Tue Dec 29, 2020 3:33 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:Do you think that governments have a natural right to tell people where they can and cannot live or travel?

I dont know. Travel is different than living and using community funds. I'm a pretty open border kind of guy until benefits are thrown into the mix.

Does Tommy have a natural right to sleep on your couch? Do you have a natural right to refuse him?

I think most countries have decided that they have borders and there will be criteria for crossing them and becoming residents and or citizens.

by Original Quill Tue Dec 29, 2020 5:48 pm

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:Do you think that governments have a natural right to tell people where they can and cannot live or travel?

I dont know. Travel is different than living and using community funds. I'm a pretty open border kind of guy until benefits are thrown into the mix.

Don't communities have a right to determine how community funds are used? Or, do you have other plans for use of those funds?

by Maddog Tue Dec 29, 2020 6:00 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

I dont know. Travel is different than living and using community funds. I'm a pretty open border kind of guy until benefits are thrown into the mix.

Don't communities have a right to determine how community funds are used? Or, do you have other plans for use of those funds?

Sure they do. But it's not some of sort of natural right as to how to use them.

I can't speak for the majority on what they want to do, only myself. I'm typically a minority on these things.

by Original Quill Tue Dec 29, 2020 6:29 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Don't communities have a right to determine how community funds are used? Or, do you have other plans for use of those funds?

Sure they do. But it's not some of sort of natural right as to how to use them.

If it's not a "natural right", what sort of right is it? Natural right is a right you are born with, as a function of the State of Nature. It's another way of saying all people are created equal, and no one has (or should have) a right s/he wasn't born with.

Once you have a community, the amalgam of all rights become community rights. The community, as a collection of individuals, has that same right to use the collective funds just as each individual would.

Any other kind of right is derivative...i.e., a constitutional right derives from a constitution; or a legal right derives from some law; or an economic right derives from a system of economics. Derivative rights depend upon the system adopted, by acquiescence of all concerned.

by Maddog Wed Dec 30, 2020 12:07 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Sure they do. But it's not some of sort of natural right as to how to use them.

If it's not a "natural right", what sort of right is it? Natural right is a right you are born with, as a function of the State of Nature. It's another way of saying all people are created equal, and no one has (or should have) a right s/he wasn't born with.

Once you have a community, the amalgam of all rights become community rights. The community, as a collection of individuals, has that same right to use the collective funds just as each individual would.

Any other kind of right is derivative...i.e., a constitutional right derives from a constitution; or a legal right derives from some law; or an economic right derives from a system of economics. Derivative rights depend upon the system adopted, by acquiescence of all concerned.

More like a majority of the masses.

by Tommy Monk Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:40 pm

Here in UK we have tens of thousands of British people sleeping rough on the streets and in shop doorways... While we have tens of thousands of foreigners who have entered this country illegally being put up in hotels and given other flats/housing at taxpayers expense because they said the magic word 'asylum' on arrival, and gave authorities some bullshit sob story...

by Original Quill Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:27 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

If it's not a "natural right", what sort of right is it? Natural right is a right you are born with, as a function of the State of Nature. It's another way of saying all people are created equal, and no one has (or should have) a right s/he wasn't born with.

Once you have a community, the amalgam of all rights become community rights. The community, as a collection of individuals, has that same right to use the collective funds just as each individual would.

Any other kind of right is derivative...i.e., a constitutional right derives from a constitution; or a legal right derives from some law; or an economic right derives from a system of economics. Derivative rights depend upon the system adopted, by acquiescence of all concerned.

More like a majority of the masses.

And why are you against "majority of the masses"?

by Original Quill Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:33 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Here in UK we have tens of thousands of British people sleeping rough on the streets and in shop doorways... While we have tens of thousands of foreigners who have entered this country illegally being put up in hotels and given other flats/housing at taxpayers expense because they said the magic word 'asylum' on arrival, and gave authorities some bullshit sob story...

Are you saying the foreigners are smarter than British people, and can work the system better? If so, I want them running our shops and factories.

Maybe you ought to be for a swap? Wink

by Maddog Wed Dec 30, 2020 11:50 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

More like a majority of the masses.

And why are you against "majority of the masses"?

Because I'm usually in the minority.

And a majority of the masses can take away a Natural Right.

The masses can take something immoral and make it legal.

Remember Europeans trading Africans for cheap guns and other products?

by Syl Thu Dec 31, 2020 12:22 am

Tommy Monk wrote:

Here in UK we have tens of thousands of British people sleeping rough on the streets and in shop doorways... While we have tens of thousands of foreigners who have entered this country illegally being put up in hotels and given other flats/housing at taxpayers expense because they said the magic word 'asylum' on arrival, and gave authorities some bullshit sob story...

December 2019 it was estimated 280,000 were homeless in the UK, many sleeping rough.

There are an increasing number of foodbanks, 2,000 last year, a 19% increase from 2018, many more have opened this year.

Many families who need help from foodbanks work for a living but still cant earn enough to provide enough money for food.

by Tommy Monk Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:00 am

Original Quill wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:Here in UK we have tens of thousands of British people sleeping rough on the streets and in shop doorways... While we have tens of thousands of foreigners who have entered this country illegally being put up in hotels and given other flats/housing at taxpayers expense because they said the magic word 'asylum' on arrival, and gave authorities some bullshit sob story...

Are you saying the foreigners are smarter than British people, and can work the system better? If so, I want them running our shops and factories.

Maybe you ought to be for a swap?

Far too many are abusing a system that is also skewed in their favour.

by Syl Thu Dec 31, 2020 12:57 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:Here in UK we have tens of thousands of British people sleeping rough on the streets and in shop doorways... While we have tens of thousands of foreigners who have entered this country illegally being put up in hotels and given other flats/housing at taxpayers expense because they said the magic word 'asylum' on arrival, and gave authorities some bullshit sob story...

Are you saying the foreigners are smarter than British people, and can work the system better? If so, I want them running our shops and factories.

Maybe you ought to be for a swap?

A fair % of people living on the streets are ex military, who fought for the country and either through circumstance, PTS or other possible mental and physical health problems, can no longer fit back into a society who seems to wash their hands of them.

Do we want to swap them for potentially dangerous dishonest cheats who are here under false pretences?

Mail your answer to dickheads1arus.com Wink

by Original Quill Thu Dec 31, 2020 4:59 pm

Syl wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Are you saying the foreigners are smarter than British people, and can work the system better? If so, I want them running our shops and factories.

Maybe you ought to be for a swap?

A fair % of people living on the streets are ex military, who fought for the country and either through circumstance, PTS or other possible mental and physical health problems, can no longer fit back into a society who seems to wash their hands of them.

Do we want to swap them for potentially dangerous dishonest cheats who are here under false pretences?

Mail your answer to dickheads1arus.com

I'm for taking care of anyone in genuine need. But then I am a liberal, and liberals are problem solvers, not money-grubbers.

It's really not an 'either/or' situation. A modern country like the UK should be able to care for all who are in serious need. If ex-military people need help, then help them. If immigrants are in serious need, then help them. When you're out of resources, shut the doors.

by Syl Thu Dec 31, 2020 5:15 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Syl wrote:

A fair % of people living on the streets are ex military, who fought for the country and either through circumstance, PTS or other possible mental and physical health problems, can no longer fit back into a society who seems to wash their hands of them.

Do we want to swap them for potentially dangerous dishonest cheats who are here under false pretences?

Mail your answer to dickheads1arus.com

I'm for taking care of anyone in genuine need. But then I am a liberal, and liberals are problem solvers, not money-grubbers.

It's really not an 'either/or' situation. A modern country like the UK should be able to care for all who are in serious need. If ex-military people need help, then help them. If immigrants are in serious need, then help them. When you're out of resources, shut the doors.

No matter where your politics lie, politicians spend the peoples money not their own.
And when people who were bred and born here, or have immigrated and made a decent life for themselves and their families, then find bit by bit their finances are stretched beyond limit, they can't get a house or a job, nor a Dr's appointment or a bed in hospital for a much needed op, I guess you could say that for millions of people ...they are out of resources.

by Vintage Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:04 pm

The bottom line is the population of the world is too big for everyone to have a fair share of resources and live a comfortable life.
Its not like I could just up and move to Australia, New Zealand, Canada or even the US now that I am retiring age, as I don't have money to keep myself and I am too old now to be of any use, I could pick a house in any of these countries and move in and say I'll do your housework/make myself useful, if you let me live here as one of the family and you take care of me, why should I go to any of these places and not paid a penny in yet expect healthcare if or when something goes wrong....
When everything is free everywhere, maybe unlimited access to other countries will be ok.

by Syl Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:21 pm

Wealth will never be distributed evenly.
A small % of people hold a large % of the worlds finances.
No matter how rich a country may seem, many people will be without whilst others prosper.

If anyone has a solution to that problem I'm sure we would love to hear it.

by Original Quill Thu Dec 31, 2020 6:59 pm

Syl wrote:Wealth will never be distributed evenly.
A small % of people hold a large % of the worlds finances.
No matter how rich a country may seem, many people will be without whilst others prosper.

If anyone has a solution to that problem I'm sure we would love to hear it.

Yep. That's the real problem. As long as institutions and politicians keep favoring the rich and privileged, there will always be resources. Just gotta find em.

by Ben Reilly Sun Jan 10, 2021 11:21 am

Tommy Monk wrote:

Here in UK we have tens of thousands of British people sleeping rough on the streets and in shop doorways... While we have tens of thousands of foreigners who have entered this country illegally being put up in hotels and given other flats/housing at taxpayers expense because they said the magic word 'asylum' on arrival, and gave authorities some bullshit sob story...

You think I could have gotten away with that?

by Ben Reilly Sun Jan 10, 2021 11:29 am

Also, I never said I have the right to take benefits without working.

To clarify my question: Does a government, or any other entity or person, have any natural right to tell me that I must not take another step - that I must not cross an imaginary line - when I have no track record of wrongdoing?

I'm not talking about walking into someone's house and declaring it my home, by the way. I'm only talking about taking up an empty space the size of myself, in buildings in which I am explicitly or implicitly welcome.

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