39 dead in Essex.

Surprised no one has mentioned it already.
But I guess they were immigrants, probably of swarthy complexion and were in Britain illegally.
Still a tragedy that they suffocated/froze to death crammed into a pitch black, freezing, airless coffin.
Some on here will be deeply upset.
Others will be "meh".

https://mol.im/a/7605019


Essex lorry deaths: Lorry driver, 25, arrested over 39 ‘mass murder victims’ had only just collected trailer at docks

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10174799/bodies-found-essex-lorry-grays-pictured/

This is just awful. Does anyone know if they were, in fact, refugees?

100% yes, Eds. Hidden in a refrigerated container, shipped from Zeebrugge to Purfleet, although God knows where they were loaded. I expect they died pretty quickly . The freezer was on, and there was no fresh air. They would have frozen , then suffocated. In pitch darkness. Horrible death.

Fucking hell, I can't imagine how terrifying that must have been.

Andy wrote:100% yes, Eds. Hidden in a refrigerated container, shipped from Zeebrugge to Purfleet, although God knows where they were loaded. I expect they died pretty quickly . The freezer was on, and there was no fresh air. They would have frozen , then suffocated. In pitch darkness. Horrible death.

How fucking horrible that people feel that desperate that they’d risk their lives and die like that, Andy! I may feel, at times, that this country is overcrowded but I can’t imagine ever denying people the right to refugee status. The problem is, no one sees these people as “people”. And that pisses me off.

God, what a horrible death these people suffered. My heart feels heavy just thinking about it.

The insane thing is, Ben, if it had been a terrorist murder of 39 people ANYWHERE in mainland Europe, this would be hedline news on every media and news outlet across Europe, and on every forum  
It now sits below Dorklyn Beckham's tart and below Katie Price's new tatoo in terms of newsworthiness on some of the more repugnant rw press sites such as the Express and The Fail .
And I was correct in my assessment here, the posters I expected not to post......didn't post.

I'm sad that these people have lost their lives in such a terrible way and that their families may never know for sure what has happened to their loved ones but just taking in more people to a crowded or not island isn't going to address the problems that made these people take such a terrible risk in the first place. The change in circumstances in other countries have to be changed by the population of that country we can't impose our rules and ideas on them we can only support their efforts.
Innocent people being killed deliberately by someone with a political or ideological reason is not really the same as someone taking a chance on surviving a perilous journey that is taken advantage of by unscrupulous
criminals, it may be some people have no choice at all to make that journey, that's not everyone though not even the majority/
Is that what you wanted to hear?

If they has been shot it would have been bigger news. Sometimes it's not who dies, but how they die.

This seems to happen about once every couple years here in Texas. Except they basically get cooked to death.

erm forgive me if i'm wrong but.......arent ALL freezer containers supposed to be fitted with both alarms AND internal door releases???????? I'm sure H&S requirements demand that is the case.

sad that its happened

and to pile misery on tragedy, that driver has been arrested.....If what has been said is true and he only collected the trailer from the port then the system stinks...you do realise that he will now have a mark on his record that will be visible to anyone doing the advanced DBS check.....

whilst not a criminal record EVERY run in with police IS recorded and stored on the national crime computer, and you dont suppose its easy to get it erased do you??? and even if they say its been erased....you really think they do?

No. You are wrong. 100%.
I KNOW.
Just asked your boss , Eddie. She knows I am correct.

This.


Essex lorry deaths – 39 migrants ‘had no chance of survival’ in -25C airtight trailer as driver is held for mass murder

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10174799/essex-lorry-bodies-driver-news/

As I said. I have expertise in this matter. Far more than Vic.

Maddog wrote:If they has been shot it would have been bigger news. Sometimes it's not who dies, but how they die.  

This seems to happen about once every couple years here in Texas. Except they basically get cooked to death.  

The equivalent down here has been "boat people" being ferried in by people smugglers using decrepit and leaky boats, with hundreds (or even thousands) of drownings over the decades...

Starting with Vietnamese, Cambodian and Laotian war refugees from the 1970s,  through to the 1990s;  and with a resurgence since the early 2000s with "economic refugees" from the Middle East and N. Africa..  These days, most are stopped beforehand, around Indonesia, Thailand, Phillipines, Malaysia --  with any stopped in Aussie territorial waters being housed in offshore detention centres.

Generally speaking, though, people being "smuggled" into countries are only a small proportion of the total numbers of "illegal immigrants" --  with around 90--95% flying in on tourist/student/temp. worker visas,  and simply overstaying their welcome..

Andy wrote:The insane thing is, Ben, if it had been a terrorist murder of 39 people ANYWHERE in mainland Europe, this would be hedline news on every media and news outlet across Europe, and on every forum  
It now sits below Dorklyn Beckham's tart and below Katie Price's new tatoo in terms of newsworthiness on some of the more repugnant rw press sites such as the Express and The Fail .
And I was correct in my assessment here, the posters I expected not to post......didn't post.

On, stop spewing out such infantile bollocks about the so-called "right wing media" you insufferable moron.

I can't speak for the news media in rest of Europe, but in the UK it has been "hedline (sic) news" in the print editions of every national newspaper other than the Daily Star, which I believe publishes earlier than the rest but still carried a front page panel referring to its coverage inside, and the Financial Times which has a specific news interest.

Nor can I can't speak for the Daily Worker or The Beano...they are obviously more your preference than mine.

So far as this country's leading and most influential tabloid the Daily Mail is concerned, its online edition broke the news on its internet site at roughly the same time as the BBC online newsflash...probably within five minutes of the Essex Police official statement.

I would have thought it obvious to the most limited intelligence that a printed newspaper could not possibly carry even God's announcement of the second coming of Christ - until it was actually printed and circulated.

We will never be able to stop the conflicts that are the principle cause of tragedies such as this, but it is pretty obvious to me that far, far more resources have to be put into locating, prosecuting and severely punishing the vile trafficking gangs who are profiting from human misery and desperation in this way.

And by severe I mean mandatory life sentences of at least 30 years with no chance of parole.

Andy wrote:No. You are wrong. 100%.
I KNOW.
Just asked your boss , Eddie. She knows I am correct.

This.


Essex lorry deaths – 39 migrants ‘had no chance of survival’ in -25C airtight trailer as driver is held for mass murder

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10174799/essex-lorry-bodies-driver-news/

As I said. I have expertise in this matter. Far more than Vic.

Then I bow to your superior knowledge....

perhaps these big containers are exempt from alarms and safety doors....THAT would not surprise me in the least....I was going on the basis of whats needed for fridge and freezer lorries that do "domestic deliveries" i.e supermarkets and home delivery.

if they arent perhaps they should be thus fittet if possible

It's down to money, I'm afraid. The technology is available, but at a cost. And nobody expects a reefer box filled with cooled Apple's or frozen food to be crammed with humans.
They are often pumped clear of air to preserve the food goods.

All of the people in OP are said to be Chinese nationals.

Andy wrote:Surprised no one has mentioned it already.
But I guess they were immigrants, probably of swarthy complexion and were in Britain illegally.
Still a tragedy that they suffocated/froze to death crammed into a pitch black, freezing, airless coffin.
Some on here will be deeply upset.
Others will be "meh".

https://mol.im/a/7605019


Essex lorry deaths: Lorry driver, 25, arrested over 39 ‘mass murder victims’ had only just collected trailer at docks

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10174799/bodies-found-essex-lorry-grays-pictured/

Hi Andy. x
Awful tragedy.  I remember a worse one which happened nearly 20 years ago  - it's been flagged up by some news sites.


One way of reducing tragedies like this is to heavily publicise these horror stories in the hometowns of these unfortunate migrants. Then others would be less likely to give their life savings to heartless scammers who will deceive them and then abandon them to fate.

Of course exhaustive efforts should also be made to trace the scammers, to face justice.

These will have been homeless and poverty striken Chinese villagers.
I doubt they even know what the internet is.
And what they are allowed to see is heavily restricted and censored.

Poor buggers. They were on a quest for 'a better life and a good job in a faraway land'  and paid their money trustingly. Travelling fares, agents fees, plus backhanders to assorted crooks to facilitate their illegal journey.  

If they were poor illiterate people with no internet, then their govts MUST find a way to educate villagers about scammers.

Andy and Jules... you don't know anything about any of these Chinese nationals... so you cannot claim that they are all homeless and poverty stricken villagers... as well as trying to claim that they had plenty of money to pay others to smuggle them into the UK!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:

Andy and Jules... you don't know anything about any of these Chinese nationals... so you cannot claim that they are all homeless and poverty stricken villagers... as well as trying to claim that they had plenty of money to pay others to smuggle them into the UK!!!

Yeah Tommy, they were fleeing their country because they were rich

You talk bollocks most of the time. This time it is utter bollocks. The fee was their life savings added to their entire worldly goods.
IEddie will confirm I have plenty of knowledge and expertise in this matter.

Jules wrote:Poor buggers. They were on a quest for 'a better life and a good job in a faraway land'  and paid their money trustingly. Travelling fares, agents fees, plus backhanders to assorted crooks to facilitate their illegal journey.  

If they were poor illiterate people with no internet, then their govts MUST find a way to educate villagers about scammers.

The People's Republic of China educate its citizens about anything other than complete and unquestioning obedience to and acceptance of the supremacy of the Central Politbureau of the Communist Party of China? You must be joking!

Otherwise I agree with you.

Andy wrote:You talk bollocks most of the time. This time it is utter bollocks. The fee was their life savings added to their entire worldly goods.
IEddie will confirm I have plenty of knowledge and expertise in this matter.

I do confirm that, from what you have told me Andy.

The going rate is around €5000 per person , payable in advance to the agent, invariably through a middle man so no direct evidence of involvement.
People trafficking is a huge business.

Andy wrote:You talk bollocks most of the time. This time it is utter bollocks. The fee was their life savings added to their entire worldly goods.
IEddie will confirm I have plenty of knowledge and expertise in this matter.

You said they are all homeless poverty stricken villagers... but you then also claimed they all have thousands of £££s to pay others to smuggle them across numerous countries and borders and into the UK...


Where we already have plenty of homeless and poverty stricken people of our own...!

Tommy Monk wrote:

Andy wrote:You talk bollocks most of the time. This time it is utter bollocks. The fee was their life savings added to their entire worldly goods.
IEddie will confirm I have plenty of knowledge and expertise in this matter.

You said they are all homeless poverty stricken villagers... but you then also claimed they all have thousands of £££s to pay others to smuggle them across numerous countries and borders and into the UK...


Where we already have plenty of homeless and poverty stricken people of our own...!

Ever heard of the phrase "by hook or by crook?" People scrape up money however they can, probably resorting to theft, prostitution or both in many cases.

A lot of people can come up with 5K quid if they get creative and they're desperate enough. And that sum certainly doesn't make them rich.

But that amount of money certainly makes them much richer than many people here in the UK...


It is simply wrong to claim that any of these dead Chinese nationals were homeless and poverty stricken villagers, while also trying to claim that they each had thousands of £££ to pay others to smuggle them into the UK across numerous countries and borders...!


And for them to get here for what...?


To be illegal immigrants with no legitimate claim of being granted asylum, not allowed to work, then facing deportation...!?


The fact of the matter is... none of you have any idea who exactly any of these people are/were... or any idea about any of their individual backgrounds... or any idea about any of their motives for trying to enter the UK illegally...!


Which it seems that some here must be reminded of the fact that anyone attempting to enter the UK illegally is breaking the law and should therefore only be considered as being a criminal!

So you’re glad these “criminals” are dead then?

Tommy Monk wrote:



And for them to get here for what...?


To be illegal immigrants with no legitimate claim of being granted asylum, not allowed to work, then facing deportation...!?


The fact of the matter is... none of you have any idea who exactly any of these people are/were... or any idea about any of their individual backgrounds... or any idea about any of their motives for trying to enter the UK illegally...!


Which it seems that some here must be reminded of the fact that anyone attempting to enter the UK illegally is breaking the law and should therefore only be considered as being a criminal!

or sent off to gather cockles on Morecambe Bay, maybe

that's why the traffickers are evil. they don't give a shit about other humans, nor their fate, it's all about the money

i agree with vic, banged up 30 years, no parole, any monies confiscated

Tommy Monk wrote:

But that amount of money certainly makes them much richer than many people here in the UK...


It is simply wrong to claim that any of these dead Chinese nationals were homeless and poverty stricken villagers, while also trying to claim that they each had thousands of £££ to pay others to smuggle them into the UK across numerous countries and borders...!


And for them to get here for what...?


To be illegal immigrants with no legitimate claim of being granted asylum, not allowed to work, then facing deportation...!?


The fact of the matter is... none of you have any idea who exactly any of these people are/were... or any idea about any of their individual backgrounds... or any idea about any of their motives for trying to enter the UK illegally...!


Which it seems that some here must be reminded of the fact that anyone attempting to enter the UK illegally is breaking the law and should therefore only be considered as being a criminal!

I agree that they may not have been poor or uneducated. They may just being trying to flee oppression.

But they do have a right to at least ask for asylum. I have no idea how the Brits treat asylum seekers from China. We seem to be pretty open to letting them stay.

Reports today that at least some of the dead are from Vietnam...a couple paid £30,000 for their adult daughter to get into UK... purely for economic reasons so she might be able to earn more money here...

Tommy Monk wrote:

Reports today that at least some of the dead are from Vietnam...a couple paid £30,000 for their adult daughter to get into UK... purely for economic reasons so she might be able to earn more money here...

If you are sneaking out of an oppressive left wing society, is it ever really.just for economic reasons?

Her reasons were purely selfish economic reasons..

She should have stayed where she was and enjoyed life there...

Tommy prepping for a street party he is going to throw to celebrate the deaths of 39 illegals and potential benefit claimants. ( they wouldn't have received benefits, btw).

Dont be a bell end Andy... we cant have half the worlds population thinking they can ignore our border controls and immigration rules, and thinking they can just blag their way in regardless... and we dont need idiots like you trying to justify any of them trying either!!!


We have plenty of Chinese and vietnamese people here in uk already... who arrive through proper legal immigration system rules... and we will be letting more in the same way...

People should apply the proper way, if they want to come in to our country... and if they dont qualify or are refused... then they should not be trying to get smuggled in!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:Her reasons were purely selfish economic reasons..

She should have stayed where she was and enjoyed life there...

Would you enjoy life under an authoritarian regime like Vietnam?

Plenty of people go there on holiday...


You seem to think it's like north korea...!

Pastor Hoang Van Pa told ICC that 33 Hmong Christians in Phá Lóm village, Tam Hợp commune, Nghệ An province were told by government officials to renounce Jesus or face consequences. The officers reportedly brought an image of Buddha and demanded the Christians worship him.

Four believers were arrested and beaten while others were harassed and raided throughout the months of November and December.

Tommy Monk wrote:
Plenty of people go there on holiday...


You seem to think it's like north korea...!

People go to Cuba too. Spending a week someplace as a tourist is far different than being a citizen.

These were illegal immigrants trying to get to UK fir their own selfish economic reasons for personal financial gain.

Tommy Monk wrote:
These were illegal immigrants trying to get to UK fir their own selfish economic reasons for personal financial gain.

Leaving communism is selfish?

It's simply an economic decision?

Trying to get smuggled illegally into the UK for their own economic financial gain is definitely selfish... and criminal...!

10 grand in their own country would buy a lot of freedom !

Tommy Monk wrote:
These were illegal immigrants trying to get to UK fir their own selfish economic reasons for personal financial gain.

Yeah...and nobody in England, or in fact the whole world, wants personal financial gain.

eddie wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:
These were illegal immigrants trying to get to UK fir their own selfish economic reasons for personal financial gain.

Yeah...and nobody in England, or in fact the whole world, wants personal financial gain.

So you admit these were illegal immigrants and therefore criminals who were breaking the law to gain unlawful entry to the UK for their own economic/financial benefit...!?


I'm glad you agree with me...!

Tommy Monk wrote:

eddie wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:
These were illegal immigrants trying to get to UK fir their own selfish economic reasons for personal financial gain.

Yeah...and nobody in England, or in fact the whole world, wants personal financial gain.

So you admit these were illegal immigrants and therefore criminals who were breaking the law to gain unlawful entry to the UK for their own economic/financial benefit...!?


I'm glad you agree with me...!

And I’m glad you feel vindicated Tommy, in your view that these people somehow deserved to die.
Well done.

eddie wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:


So you admit these were illegal immigrants and therefore criminals who were breaking the law to gain unlawful entry to the UK for their own economic/financial benefit...!?


I'm glad you agree with me...!

And I’m glad you feel vindicated Tommy, in your view that these people somehow deserved to die.
Well done.

You're out of order Eddie!


Show where I said any of these people deserved to die...!!!???


Or... apologise for making such a nasty and unfounded accusation against me...!!!???

The very fact you seem to go to extreme lengths to prove that these people didn’t need to be here because they “had money” makes me think that.

You sound unemotional and rather glad.