Transgender activists accused of attempting to shut down debate

Ben Cottonpickin' Reilly wrote:I'll say this for the right - they have some of the best underhanded tactics for shaping public opinion.

The left should really learn this latest trick. Here's how it goes, as I see it:

1) Say whatever you want.

2) Get attacked for it.

3) Accuse those attacking you of "shutting down the debate;" you can also accuse them of being anti-free speech.

It's funny (and unfair) because the attacks ARE debate and free speech, just like the initial claims are, but somehow this gambit turns criticism into censorship.

nicko wrote:Gender this, gender that,  There's only two, 1 male, 1 female !

eddie wrote:I’ve always believed that some people feel they are “born in the wrong bodies” but I do also think that there’s a small minority of teens who may be following this new ‘trend’....there seems to be an awful lost of silly young girls, for instance, on Facebook and other social media sites, who thinks it’s hip to be Bi.


Take the issue seriously, absolutely, but let’s not just give young people operations willy-nilly.

Pardon the pun.

gelico wrote:

Ben Cottonpickin' Reilly wrote:I'll say this for the right - they have some of the best underhanded tactics for shaping public opinion.

The left should really learn this latest trick. Here's how it goes, as I see it:

1) Say whatever you want.

2) Get attacked for it.

3) Accuse those attacking you of "shutting down the debate;" you can also accuse them of being anti-free speech.

It's funny (and unfair) because the attacks ARE debate and free speech, just like the initial claims are, but somehow this gambit turns criticism into censorship.

James Caspian, a psychotherapist who specialises in working with transgender people, said: “What’s so incredible is that if anyone says anything critical about transgender [issues], this lobby come out and just attack the people who are saying it rather than taking on board what they are saying and discussing it.”



why is it so unfair to have concerns and to want to be cautious about giving life changing operations  ''willy nilly''

the request is for discussion and debate on the issue

Ben Cottonpickin' Reilly wrote:

gelico wrote:




James Caspian, a psychotherapist who specialises in working with transgender people, said: “What’s so incredible is that if anyone says anything critical about transgender [issues], this lobby come out and just attack the people who are saying it rather than taking on board what they are saying and discussing it.”



why is it so unfair to have concerns and to want to be cautious about giving life changing operations  ''willy nilly''

the request is for discussion and debate on the issue

How many people do you think decide just on a whim, just to be cool, to have their genitalia mutilated, their appearance altered and to go on hormones for the rest of their lives?

Most people wouldn't get a tattoo on a whim, let alone change their gender.

To say, "Now let's hold on" is basically to mock the vast majority of people who want gender reassignment, by pretending that they haven't really thought it through, and to question their decision simply because we can't imagine ever doing it.

Sex education resources often use videos, pictures, and diagrams as a way to convey important information, though these images and videos have historically failed to reflect or provide information about same-sex and queer relationships. In fact, the GLSEN 2015 National School Climate Survey shows that only about 5 percent of LGBTQ students saw LGBTQ representation in health class.

These guides also often unnecessarily gender body parts as being “male parts” and “female parts” and refer to “sex with women” or “sex with men,” excluding those who identify as nonbinary. Many individuals don’t see body parts as having a gender — people have a gender.

And as a result, the notion that a penis is exclusively a male body part and a vulva is exclusively a female body part is inaccurate. By using the word “parts” to talk about genitals and using medical terms for anatomy without attaching a gender to it, we become much more able to effectively discuss safe sex in a way that’s clear and inclusive.

For the purposes of this guide, we’ve chosen to include alternative words for readers to use for their genitals. For example, some trans men choose to use the words “front hole” or “internal genital” instead of “vagina.” Alternatively, some trans women may say “strapless” or “girl dick” for penis. This usage is meant for one-on-one communication with trusted persons, such as your doctor or partner, not for broad discussion.

https://www.healthline.com/health/lgbtqia-safe-sex-guide#why-we-need-it

The severe lack of understanding surrounding the topic - and its reversal counterpart - became particularly prevalent last week, when a proposed study to explore why transsexual people may want to “detransition” was reportedly shut down by Bath Spa University so as “not to offend people.”

“The fundamental reason given was that it might cause criticism of the research on social media and criticism of the research would be criticism of the university and they also added it was better not to offend people,” James Caspian, the psychotherapist behind the proposed research, told BBC Radio 4.

He confessed to being “astonished” at the university’s decision.

https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gender-reversal-surgery-demand-rise-assignment-men-women-trans-a7980416.html

Didge wrote:

Ben Cottonpickin' Reilly wrote:

gelico wrote:




James Caspian, a psychotherapist who specialises in working with transgender people, said: “What’s so incredible is that if anyone says anything critical about transgender [issues], this lobby come out and just attack the people who are saying it rather than taking on board what they are saying and discussing it.”



why is it so unfair to have concerns and to want to be cautious about giving life changing operations  ''willy nilly''

the request is for discussion and debate on the issue

How many people do you think decide just on a whim, just to be cool, to have their genitalia mutilated, their appearance altered and to go on hormones for the rest of their lives?

Most people wouldn't get a tattoo on a whim, let alone change their gender.

To say, "Now let's hold on" is basically to mock the vast majority of people who want gender reassignment, by pretending that they haven't really thought it through, and to question their decision simply because we can't imagine ever doing it.

And how many people harm themselves for attention?

So your view is absurd, as is this for some down to attention seeking when some have come to regret such alterating surgery?

To say its right to question and researh further to understand why there has been a significant increase is just basic common sense. Where some may have instead a mental health condition. Where they should have all the help they can  get

That has fuck all to do with right wing

Ben Cottonpickin' Reilly wrote:

Didge wrote:

And how many people harm themselves for attention?

So your view is absurd, as is this for some down to attention seeking when some have come to regret such alterating surgery?

To say its right to question and researh further to understand why there has been a significant increase is just basic common sense. Where some may have instead a mental health condition. Where they should have all the help they can  get

That has fuck all to do with right wing

How many harm themselves for attention? Not very many, in comparison to the general population.

And harming themselves for attention generally means cutting themselves in ways that heal within a couple of days. Not having a surgeon redesign their genitals.

Sorry, the entire premise of this argument triggers my bullshit detector; the vast majority of people don't undergo major surgery for shits and giggles.

Didge wrote:No one could accuse psychotherapist James Caspian of being a bigot or prejudiced against transgender people. His LGBT — that's lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender — credentials are impeccable.

For this slight, measured, gay man is not only a trustee of the transgender charity The Beaumont Trust, but he has dedicated more than a decade of his life to counselling hundreds of patients who wish to change their gender.

He publishes academic papers on the subject, contributes to books and addresses some of the finest minds in the health professions at conferences around the world — and has done extensive work training fellow psychotherapists on transgender awareness.

If there was ever an expert in this field, James, 58, is it. But lately James has had a gutful of the increasingly frustrating politics surrounding the trans lobby, after a study he wanted to carry out into transgender people was blocked by Bath Spa University for being 'politically incorrect'.

The nature of his research? To ask questions about the increasing numbers of people who were changing gender and subsequently regretting it. 'I'm not anti-trans. I've helped hundreds of people while they were transitioning, but when I started to do preliminary research I was taken aback by what I discovered,' he says.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4979498/James-Caspian-attacked-transgender-children-comments.html

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2017/sep/25/bath-spa-university-transgender-gender-reassignment-reversal-research

nicko wrote:Gender this, gender that,  There's only two, 1 male, 1 female !

Ben Cottonpickin' Reilly wrote:

gelico wrote:




James Caspian, a psychotherapist who specialises in working with transgender people, said: “What’s so incredible is that if anyone says anything critical about transgender [issues], this lobby come out and just attack the people who are saying it rather than taking on board what they are saying and discussing it.”



why is it so unfair to have concerns and to want to be cautious about giving life changing operations  ''willy nilly''

the request is for discussion and debate on the issue

How many people do you think decide just on a whim, just to be cool, to have their genitalia mutilated, their appearance altered and to go on hormones for the rest of their lives?

Most people wouldn't get a tattoo on a whim, let alone change their gender.

To say, "Now let's hold on" is basically to mock the vast majority of people who want gender reassignment, by pretending that they haven't really thought it through, and to question their decision simply because we can't imagine ever doing it.

Tommy Monk wrote:Quote Ben...

"...Most people wouldn't get a tattoo on a whim..."


Loads do... and then want them removed at cost to tax payers on the NHS...!!!