Menstrual Leave

Fuzzy Zack wrote:U.K. COMPANY TO INTRODUCE MENSTRUAL LEAVE 'PERIOD POLICY'

Periods are still something of a taboo subject, especially in the workplace, but a community and arts center in Bristol is set to become the first company in the U.K. to introduce menstrual leave, allowing women time off work during their monthly cycle.

http://europe.newsweek.com/menstrual-leave-uk-company-introduce-period-policy-432588?rm=eu

Good idea?

What about leave for men and itchy bullocks?

sassy wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

sassy wrote:

If men had to endure this each month, it would be compulsory.

Raggamuffin wrote:If a woman has bad symptoms they can ring in sick though Horatio. Otherwise, they can take painkillers or whatever.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:If a woman has bad symptoms they can ring in sick though Horatio. Otherwise, they can take painkillers or whatever.

My view is this.  If a smoker can take two daily fag breaks, amounting to say 20 mins per day 5 days a week, that's 400 minutes a month, nearly a day's work.   Why can't a woman who has to suffer menstrual cramps, take time off too? If she's also a smoker, she'll get double that time.  I think it should only be one day per month, as that's the worst day for most women.  Continually taking sick leave goes against you.

Sure they can take painkillers, most do.  But some women really do suffer.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:If a woman has bad symptoms they can ring in sick though Horatio. Otherwise, they can take painkillers or whatever.

My view is this.  If a smoker can take two daily fag breaks, amounting to say 20 mins per day 5 days a week, that's 400 minutes a month, nearly a day's work.   Why can't a woman who has to suffer menstrual cramps, take time off too? If she's also a smoker, she'll get double that time.  I think it should only be one day per month, as that's the worst day for most women.  Continually taking sick leave goes against you.

Sure they can take painkillers, most do.  But some women really do suffer.

Didge wrote:Policy

Wrong every level

They have decided a pain threshold which will then open up the door to countless other medical conditions, which would then open the door further widen to people claiming they simple cannot work.
The pain threshold is varied between people and this is just one of a number of pains endured by people who continue to work..

Notice I say endure because plenty of people work whilst suffering many forms of pain. Once you open this door, you give the green light for more to feel their level of pain is now too much and they should be given time off. Like anyone else, if the pain is unbearable to work, then you take a sick day

Didge wrote:Policy

Wrong every level

They have decided a pain threshold which will then open up the door to countless other medical conditions, which would then open the door further widen to people claiming they simple cannot work.
The pain threshold is varied between people and this is just one of a number of pains endured by people who continue to work..

Notice I say endure because plenty of people work whilst suffering many forms of pain. Once you open this door, you give the green light for more to feel their level of pain is now too much and they should be given time off. Like anyone else, if the pain is unbearable to work, then you take a sick day

sassy wrote:Don't think it says they HAVE to take time off, only that they can if they need to.  After all, at the moment if a woman phoned in sick every month she'd probably lose her job.  Some women flood so badly they can hardly move.

sassy wrote:Don't think it says they HAVE to take time off, only that they can if they need to.  After all, at the moment if a woman phoned in sick every month she'd probably lose her job.  Some women flood so badly they can hardly move.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:Policy

Wrong every level

They have decided a pain threshold which will then open up the door to countless other medical conditions, which would then open the door further widen to people claiming they simple cannot work.
The pain threshold is varied between people and this is just one of a number of pains endured by people who continue to work..

Notice I say endure because plenty of people work whilst suffering many forms of pain. Once you open this door, you give the green light for more to feel their level of pain is now too much and they should be given time off. Like anyone else, if the pain is unbearable to work, then you take a sick day

That's a good point.   But also, I think people take time off sick for fuck all.   I can't personally see it catching on, but it's up to the individual companies if they want to do that.   It may raise morale in some cases, just as offering wellbeing sessions to staff is something that is increasingly seen in the workplace and is proven to raise morale and ease stress.

sassy wrote:Don't think it says they HAVE to take time off, only that they can if they need to.  After all, at the moment if a woman phoned in sick every month she'd probably lose her job.  Some women flood so badly they can hardly move.

Raggamuffin wrote:

sassy wrote:Don't think it says they HAVE to take time off, only that they can if they need to.  After all, at the moment if a woman phoned in sick every month she'd probably lose her job.  Some women flood so badly they can hardly move.

They wouldn't lose their job if they could prove it was for that - it would be sexual discrimination.

I think that if a women does tend to suffer a lot, it's worth her having a word with her employer and letting them know, so they know she's not skiving. She could also ask for allowances to be made re deadlines or whatever if she knows when she's going to be suffering.  I don't see the need for a more formal rule.

You are off work for several short periods of time

Didge wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

That's a good point.   But also, I think people take time off sick for fuck all.   I can't personally see it catching on, but it's up to the individual companies if they want to do that.   It may raise morale in some cases, just as offering wellbeing sessions to staff is something that is increasingly seen in the workplace and is proven to raise morale and ease stress.

I understand your point but think it will create more problems even if its intent is for good.
Once others with regular pain conditions start to complain and rightly state discrimination, to something that is so varied on the level of pain people can cope with, then you are in for a world of trouble as a HR department.

sassy wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

They wouldn't lose their job if they could prove it was for that - it would be sexual discrimination.

I think that if a women does tend to suffer a lot, it's worth her having a word with her employer and letting them know, so they know she's not skiving. She could also ask for allowances to be made re deadlines or whatever if she knows when she's going to be suffering.  I don't see the need for a more formal rule.

I've known women who have lost their jobs because of it.

Plus:

You are off work for several short periods of time

If you are off sick for more than four short periods (four to seven days) in a year, your employer can contact Medical Services to look into the reasons you have given for missing work. Your employer contacts Medical Services through HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC).
Medical Services may want to contact your own GP to ask about your medical condition but they can only do so if you give them permission. If the Medical Services report says you have been off work without good reason, your employer may refuse to pay you sick pay. You can appeal against this decision if you think it is wrong.

HoratioTarr wrote:

sassy wrote:Don't think it says they HAVE to take time off, only that they can if they need to.  After all, at the moment if a woman phoned in sick every month she'd probably lose her job.  Some women flood so badly they can hardly move.

This is probably coming from a place where this happens a lot.   For something that you can't control and that happens every month like clockwork, it's fairer to offer this.

Didge wrote:Its never going to work, as it will discriminate against know other medical conditions, which people suffer regular and even ore frequently than women on their cycle. How can a company justify one condition whilst ignoring a mother load of other conditions?

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:


I understand your point but think it will create more problems even if its intent is for good.
Once others with regular pain conditions start to complain and rightly state discrimination, to something that is so varied on the level of pain people can cope with, then you are in for a world of trouble as a HR department.

Maybe, maybe not.   Or as you'd say, that's a moot point.  

We now have maternity leave for both men and women.   50 years ago that was considered unthinkable.  Now it's just part of a perk of the workplace.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:Its never going to work, as it will discriminate against know other medical conditions, which people suffer regular and even ore frequently than women on their cycle. How can a company justify one condition whilst ignoring a mother load of other conditions?

Perhaps they shouldn't.   Perhaps this will open the way for people in bad pain for short periods, to be able to work more comfortably and without the stress of thinking they may lose their job for too many sick days.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:Its never going to work, as it will discriminate against know other medical conditions, which people suffer regular and even ore frequently than women on their cycle. How can a company justify one condition whilst ignoring a mother load of other conditions?

Perhaps they shouldn't.   Perhaps this will open the way for people in bad pain for short periods, to be able to work more comfortably and without the stress of thinking they may lose their job for too many sick days.

Raggamuffin wrote:

sassy wrote:


I've known women who have lost their jobs because of it.

Plus:

You are off work for several short periods of time

If you are off sick for more than four short periods (four to seven days) in a year, your employer can contact Medical Services to look into the reasons you have given for missing work. Your employer contacts Medical Services through HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC).
Medical Services may want to contact your own GP to ask about your medical condition but they can only do so if you give them permission. If the Medical Services report says you have been off work without good reason, your employer may refuse to pay you sick pay. You can appeal against this decision if you think it is wrong.

That would be sexual discrimination though.

Of course employers want to know why someone is off sick a lot, but that's why I think they should be told about the situation.

Women who suffer that much should really try to get some help in case it's not normal.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

That would be sexual discrimination though.

Of course employers want to know why someone is off sick a lot, but that's why I think they should be told about the situation.

Women who suffer that much should really try to get some help in case it's not normal.

It's younger women who've never had children who seem to suffer the worst.   It's not the female's fault that men don't have a womb.  I'm sure if a man's prostate bled profusely and gave them pain each month, they too might have time off. 

We've come on in leaps and bounds in our employment environment.   This is how it should be.  Nobody should have live in fear of being too ill to work and losing their job.   I'd rather we had this kind of thing in place, than the draconian laws we had way back.   My mum got the sack  for being pregnant with me!

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:Policy
Wrong every level

They have decided a pain threshold which will then open up the door to countless other medical conditions, which would then open the door further widen to people claiming they simple cannot work.
The pain threshold is varied between people and this is just one of a number of pains endured by people who continue to work..

Notice I say endure because plenty of people work whilst suffering many forms of pain. Once you open this door, you give the green light for more to feel their level of pain is now too much and they should be given time off. Like anyone else, if the pain is unbearable to work, then you take a sick day

That's a good point.   But also, I think people take time off sick for fuck all.   I can't personally see it catching on, but it's up to the individual companies if they want to do that.   It may raise morale in some cases, just as offering wellbeing sessions to staff is something that is increasingly seen in the workplace and is proven to raise morale and ease stress.

sassy wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

It's younger women who've never had children who seem to suffer the worst.   It's not the female's fault that men don't have a womb.  I'm sure if a man's prostate bled profusely and gave them pain each month, they too might have time off. 

We've come on in leaps and bounds in our employment environment.   This is how it should be.  Nobody should have live in fear of being too ill to work and losing their job.   I'd rather we had this kind of thing in place, than the draconian laws we had way back.   My mum got the sack  for being pregnant with me!

Happened all the time.  People still get the sack for being sick.  They just say they are redundant, wait a short time, change the job everso slightly and hire someone else.

Raggamuffin wrote:Employees have the opportunity to let their employer know if they have an ongoing medical condition, or if the develop one whilst they're employed. I think this would come under the definition of a medical condition if it was bad enough. If all women got the automatic right to time off every month, they might take it just because they can.

aspca4ever wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

That's a good point.   But also, I think people take time off sick for fuck all.   I can't personally see it catching on, but it's up to the individual companies if they want to do that.   It may raise morale in some cases, just as offering wellbeing sessions to staff is something that is increasingly seen in the workplace and is proven to raise morale and ease stress.

What the #1 'Wrong On Every Level' seems oblivious to:
This is about a 'blood borne issue' --- not just some 'Oh, I've got a headache/back ache/I stubbed my toe' type of pain issue --- BLOOD is considered a BIO-Hazardous Contaminated Problem!!!  Why all emergency personnel wear GLOVES...

And all of the additional issues that both Horatio & Sassy have used for supporting the change in this POLICY...we have a 'Medical Leave' policy in the USA; granted not every company offers it - not every company even has paid sick days to use or lose - not every company will allow ANY ABSENTEEISM - PERIOD

I hired a young man that was a 'hemophiliac' {aka a bleeder}; he disclosed it on his employee packet and we discussed the proper protocol to handle the 'WHAT IFS' it should happen while he was on the job.  Since we provided X amount of sick leave days to accumulate {but they were to be used or lost at the end of the year or we'd buy them back as a bonus}...he had times where he had to leave ASAP from his job site ---
Humans have specific medical conditions that require specific methods to protect those that work around them and with the emergency staff that rushes in to care for them. BLOOD is one of those specific issues!  

It is a GOOD THING for companies that can afford to offer this!

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:Employees have the opportunity to let their employer know if they have an ongoing medical condition, or if the develop one whilst they're employed. I think this would come under the definition of a medical condition if it was bad enough. If all women got the automatic right to time off every month, they might take it just because they can.

The whole point of the exercise, by that company, is that they don't want to stigmatise women with claims of 'illness' for a natural bodily function.  Also, they are expected to make up the time at some point but it removes the need for sick leave that could be detrimental to their work record.

Raggamuffin wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

The whole point of the exercise, by that company, is that they don't want to stigmatise women with claims of 'illness' for a natural bodily function.  Also, they are expected to make up the time at some point but it removes the need for sick leave that could be detrimental to their work record.

It would be an illness though if it made them ill. Immune reactions to viruses are natural, but they can still make you ill.

I just think that some women would take the piss and have a day off for no reason.

Didge wrote:It may not be unique but its unfair to many other sufferers of regular pain from a multitude of conditions.. Time off should be based individually on the person.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

It would be an illness though if it made them ill. Immune reactions to viruses are natural, but they can still make you ill.

I just think that some women would take the piss and have a day off for no reason.

But they have to make the time up.   This is not time given to them.  They owe the time back to the company.

HoratioTarr wrote:Japan has had menstrual leave since 1947.  Nike has this in place.  As do other companies.  It's not unique to this case.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:It may not be unique but its unfair to many other sufferers of regular pain from a multitude of conditions.. Time off should be based individually on the person.

yes, it is unfair.  Which is why people in pain should have more leeway in the workplace and not be expected to plough on when they're in agony.

aspca4ever wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:Japan has had menstrual leave since 1947.  Nike has this in place.  As do other companies.  It's not unique to this case.

Not that 'YOU' Horatio, give a "F" what I think --- not part of that thread nor this one; but we all have a 'RIGHT TO OUR POV'...

Most of the Tech companies that started in the late 80's had a open book type of HR personnel handbook; designed and written FOR THE EMPLOYEE's --- quite the reverse to what the 'Normal Employee Handbooks' cover.

They allowed the employees to list their top 10 holidays/vacation peak periods/school vacations/how many Mental Health Days they'd like to have off during any one month; these Mental Health days could be used for a plethora of reasons:
Dr appointments/Dental appointments/sick kids at home days/etc., etc., etc.

Once all of this data was collected the rough draft was presented and voted on by the employees --- rather amazing isn't it that when you treat your staff like they have value they pay the company back many times over!
Google/Microsoft/Bing/Hewlett Packard(HP)/FB were all established around this proactive process. 

Quite different from the policies and employee handbooks I've had the displeasure in reading.

Didge wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

yes, it is unfair.  Which is why people in pain should have more leeway in the workplace and not be expected to plough on when they're in agony.

I am not denying that people who suffer pain or any form or condition that leaves them less able to work, should not have the support of the company through being fair to their situation, but again that should be based on each individual case. If their condition requires their work to be flexible based individually, then the company should help
Nobody has denied that

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:



I am not denying that people who suffer pain or any form or condition that leaves them less able to work, should not have the support of the company through being fair to their situation, but again that should be based on each individual case. If their condition requires their work to be flexible based individually, then the company should help
Nobody has denied that

I hope this kind of thing is offered soon to migraine sufferers, both men and women suffer from that, and it's debilitating.  I get them.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Didge wrote:It may not be unique but its unfair to many other sufferers of regular pain from a multitude of conditions.. Time off should be based individually on the person.

yes, it is unfair.  Which is why people in pain should have more leeway in the workplace and not be expected to plough on when they're in agony.