Big Rip will end the universe, scientists claim

First topic message reminder :

A group of scientists claim to have evidence supporting the Big Rip theory, explaining how the universe will end – in 22 billion years.
Researchers at Vanderbilt University in Nashville, Tennessee, have discovered a new mathematical formulation that supports the Big Rip theory - that as the universe expands, it will eventually be ripped apart. “The idea of the Big Rip is that eventually even the constituents of matter would start separating from each other. You’d be seeing all the atoms being ripped apart ... it’s fair to say that it’s a dramatic scenario,” Dr Marcelo Disconzi told the Guardian.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/science/science-news/11715091/Big-Rip-will-end-the-universe-scientists-claim.html

Are you saying that a black hole is really just a sort of galactic equivalent of a low pressure weather event here on earth...!?

victorismyhero wrote:

Vintage wrote:Ok thanks for the replies but does it mean that there are vast areas of nothing around black holes at least on occassions until space is pulled or drifts into the area of the black hole with planets, debris or light etc. Space can be warped - at least in theory so it must have the potential to be sucked in itself not just objects in the space, rather like a table cloth through a curtain ring. So if there were enough black holes could the expansion of the big bang be slowed or even stopped by them in a sort of stale mate of energy?

I dont thiunk blak holes wuld have that much effect for 2 reasons

firstly black holes tend to be planetary or stellar in size, (as opposed to galaxy sized) so the gravitational force they exert is small in comparison to the galaxy they exist within. This size is apparantly limited too, if they get above a certain size they.....well no one is quite sure of anything except that they appear above a certain size to evaporate...yeah OK...I know......

Secondly IF they were able to exert sufficient force to stop the universe expanding, they most likely already would have done

the question here is whether the RATE of expansion is steady or has it increased/decreased??

I thought the general consenus was for speeding up.

Vintage wrote:

victorismyhero wrote:

I dont thiunk blak holes wuld have that much effect for 2 reasons

firstly black holes tend to be planetary or stellar in size, (as opposed to galaxy sized) so the gravitational force they exert is small in comparison to the galaxy they exist within. This size is apparantly limited too, if they get above a certain size they.....well no one is quite sure of anything except that they appear above a certain size to evaporate...yeah OK...I know......

Secondly IF they were able to exert sufficient force to stop the universe expanding, they most likely already would have done

the question here is whether the RATE of expansion is steady or has it increased/decreased??

I thought the general consenus was for speeding up.

In which case your answer is there...no they dont have a significant effect.

Vintage wrote:

victorismyhero wrote:

I dont thiunk blak holes wuld have that much effect for 2 reasons

firstly black holes tend to be planetary or stellar in size, (as opposed to galaxy sized) so the gravitational force they exert is small in comparison to the galaxy they exist within. This size is apparantly limited too, if they get above a certain size they.....well no one is quite sure of anything except that they appear above a certain size to evaporate...yeah OK...I know......

Secondly IF they were able to exert sufficient force to stop the universe expanding, they most likely already would have done

the question here is whether the RATE of expansion is steady or has it increased/decreased??

I thought the general consenus was for speeding up.

what people fail to i think to take in to account is that a "black hole" isn`t actually a "hole" as such it exists and exerts it`s force in every direction
A real world analogy would be how a spherical barrel would if taken to the very bottom of the ocean collapses in every direction (till its structure ruptures at its weakest point) ,or in reverse how a weather balloon expands the higher it gets in the atmosphere as the pressure decreases

Do you 'know' that for sure...?


Or is it just guesswork...!?

what i know for sure is that you don`t even have the basic understanding of gravity to make a debate about it with you meaningful or fruitful

unlike you Tommy i am open to many ideas and not unable to admit when i may have gotten something wrong or misunderstood

that is imperative with any debate on the subject and something you just don`t posses

however remember that the representation of objects on the fabric of space is presented in 2D because it makes it easier to visualise however they are not 2D object

question

this is how we visualise a black hole



what do you think it looks like from the other side

or from the left or right or any other direction

remember all that glowing stuff is not the actual "hole" its the stuff orbiting it

tommy's understanding of "black holes" is limited to bordellos in nigeria

victorismyhero wrote:tommy's  understanding of "black holes" is limited to bordellos in nigeria

Or the one between his ears

hear`s something that will blow your mind Tommy
the closer you get to the centre of the earth the less gravity they is but you weigh more

work that one out

And the more i think about it ,and it might surprise you to know i have thought about it for many many years

A black hole can`t be a "hole" at all, it doesn`t make any sense

what is a hole  it`s a an opening or perforation in a material

we call a dug space in the ground a hole but its not
its a deep depression or a well because it has a bottom

a black hole is actually a gravity "well" a term often used for "black holes"  created by a super dense object

A hole lets things out as well as in

the only thing that comes out of them is hawking radiation (as far as we know)

so we must assume that if its a hole the pressure on the other side is less than the pressure in our universe  (could explain the missing dark matter i guess )

but space is a vacuum so if they was anything on the other side of the "hole " would that not rush in to take the place of the vacuum

you could theorise that on the other side of it if it was a "hole"was another vacuum but that doesn`t make sense ether   because they would be an equilibrium and they would be no pull to stop light or matter escaping
because you can see trough a hole in ether direction    

A hole tends to expand and get bigger as things rush out of it, this does not seem to be the case ,also the matter that does descend in to a hole, does not stop on the other side of the hole it expands in  to what ever is on the other side

i wish i knew a theoretical physicist  because there a a lot of questions i would ask

now you can believe this or not but about 5 years ago scientists discovered a "black hole" at the centre of our galaxy
this new news came as a great surprise to me, because i have always assumed everybody knew that anyway but
Stephen Hawking says there are no black holes so what is it ?

my head hurts

We don't really 'know'... what we think we know is all theory and speculation!