White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility

by eddie Sun May 17, 2015 10:16 am

I'm not going to post the whole article here (I find that long c&ps are tedious)but I will take the parts, that to me, are relevant:

Robin DiAngelo was right out of college when she started thinking about it. She'd landed a job leading workshops on racism. And she met a man who became very angry, and pounded on a table. He said white people are the target of discrimination, white people can’t even find jobs anymore.

DiAngelo looked around the office and she saw nothing but white people, all of them with jobs.

"It was unnerving," she says now. "It was like, 'This is not rooted in any racial reality that is happening, in this room, in this workplace, or in this man’s life.' And yet, these feelings are real. His rage is real. How do we do that?"

Meaning: How do white people see themselves as the victims of racism, when the world around them shows something totally different?

DiAngelo worked for years doing racism workshops, wondering this. Eventually, she developed a theory.

"I started thinking about how fragile our sensibilities are when it comes to race," she says

But that doesn’t stop us from forming opinions, many of them strongly held. And one of the biggest ones is about what racism means, and who is racist.

"The number one most effective adaptation of racism over time," DiAngelo says, "is the good/bad binary, this idea that a racist is a bad person and a good person is not racist. And so it’s about individuals who are either good or bad or who either do or don’t engage."

One of the side effects is that many white people come to believe that if they just don’t talk about or think about race, then they are not racist.

"Racism comes out of our pores as white people. It's the way that we are."
Then, if someone comes along and talks about racism the way DiAngelo does – that racism is a system of oppression. That anyone can be prejudiced, but in America, only white people are racist. And, actually, all white people are racist because, as DiAngelo says:

"Racism comes out of our pores as white people. It's the way that we are."

Almost any defensiveness that you get from a white person trying to talk about racism is rooted in that good/bad binary," DiAngelo says. "They hear you saying, 'You are a bad person.'"

The flip side, DiAngelo says if you think of yourself as one of the “good” white people, you think you’ve got it down. You see the latest person caught on camera using the "n-word," that’s what racism is to you. Whatever you’re doing isn’t racist.

And so you don’t think about the whiteness of your neighborhood, your school system or your office.....

http://stateofopportunity.michiganradio.org/post/why-all-white-people-are-racist-cant-handle-being-called-racist-theory-white-fragility

A very interesting article actually, but for me, this is the crux of what I am always saying:

Almost any defensiveness that you get from a white person trying to talk about racism is rooted in that good/bad binary," DiAngelo says. "They hear you saying, 'You are a bad person.'"

The flip side, DiAngelo says if you think of yourself as one of the “good” white people, you think you’ve got it down. You see the latest person caught on camera using the "n-word," that’s what racism is to you. Whatever you’re doing isn’t racist.

And so you don’t think about the whiteness of your neighborhood, your school system"

by Guest Sun May 17, 2015 10:46 am

Some good and bad points on this article, which makes many assumptions itself and claims but does so on a collective view point.
I do not see it as a good or bad thing but plain ignorance where people are racially prejudiced, because biologically races do not exist. Humans are all one race and racism is an invention formed from ignorance and prejudice. You would then have levels of this prejudice built within society which certainly happens. I came from an area of a high level of Afro Caribbean and Irish and experienced plenty of racism growing up, including to myself. To then in my teens off an event becoming racist for a short time myself. So I have experienced both sides of racism.

The article is clearly based of an American experience though to a certain degree it could be applied here. Again there is levels of prejudice in regards to racism, to the worst level that we saw in the genocide of the Jews, Slavs etc. I think the article is short sighted for one very major important factor. It only centers on racism, where you generally find someone racist they share other prejudiced views, much of which are learnt. You see this common factor with those who tend to use prejudiced and guilt by association arguments. Some interesting work she is doing but to me needs looking at the issue from all forms of prejudice. It is true that mane will look at racism in a good or bad concept, which will happen because some of the worst forms of racism, we them leading to death through the worst form of hate.

I would need to read her book as is interesting, some points are very good as just as others are very subjective.

by Guest Sun May 17, 2015 2:22 pm

That's almost saying only whites can be racist.
All people can be racist.

by Guest Sun May 17, 2015 5:00 pm

another self hating whitey, whitey bashing......

by Raggamuffin Sun May 17, 2015 5:07 pm

Racism workshop? Whatever next? Laughing

by Guest Sun May 17, 2015 10:26 pm

any person is capable of racism but it is not always actually racism, as I have said before if someone seems to be getting better treatment people will dislike them for it, it is not racist as the race is not the issue the treatment is.
Is every case of argument or trouble between black and whites about colour, of course it isn't and just because someone shout the infamous n word still not necesarily as we say what hurts the most when arguing or fighting, if someone shouted shut up you fat cow is the fattism or are you venting your anger and hoping what you say will have impact.

It seems we have more trouble with people whom percieve racism every where rather than actual racism.

by The Devil, You Know Sun May 17, 2015 11:11 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:Some good and bad points on this article, which makes many assumptions itself and claims but does so on a collective view point.
I do not see it as a good or bad thing but plain ignorance where people are racially prejudiced, because biologically races do not exist. Humans are all one race and racism is an invention formed from ignorance and prejudice. You would then have levels of this prejudice built within society which certainly happens. I came from an area of a high level of Afro Caribbean and Irish and experienced plenty of racism growing up, including to myself. To then in my teens off an event becoming racist for a short time myself. So I have experienced both sides of racism.

The article is clearly based of an American experience though to a certain degree it could be applied here. Again there is levels of prejudice in regards to racism, to the worst level that we saw in the genocide of the Jews, Slavs etc. I think the article is short sighted for one very major important factor. It only centers on racism, where you generally find someone racist they share other prejudiced views, much of which are learnt. You see this common factor with those who tend to use prejudiced and guilt by association arguments. Some interesting work she is doing but to me needs looking at the issue from all forms of prejudice. It is true that mane will look at racism in a good or bad concept, which will happen because some of the worst forms of racism, we them leading to death through the worst form of hate.

I would need to read her book as is interesting, some points are very good as just as others are very subjective.

yes you endlessly tell us we are all one race, but that is just semantics on your part. I presume you understand what people mean when they talk about racism though don't you. Or do you automatically ignore what they say because we are all one race? Anyone can be racist, it does not matter what colour, creed or religion you are. No particular group is more or less racist than any other group.
any one who says groupx cant be racist is at best an utter fool and at worst and apologist for hatred.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 3:44 am

The Devil, You Know wrote:
Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:Some good and bad points on this article, which makes many assumptions itself and claims but does so on a collective view point.
I do not see it as a good or bad thing but plain ignorance where people are racially prejudiced, because biologically races do not exist. Humans are all one race and racism is an invention formed from ignorance and prejudice. You would then have levels of this prejudice built within society which certainly happens. I came from an area of a high level of Afro Caribbean and Irish and experienced plenty of racism growing up, including to myself. To then in my teens off an event becoming racist for a short time myself. So I have experienced both sides of racism.

The article is clearly based of an American experience though to a certain degree it could be applied here. Again there is levels of prejudice in regards to racism, to the worst level that we saw in the genocide of the Jews, Slavs etc. I think the article is short sighted for one very major important factor. It only centers on racism, where you generally find someone racist they share other prejudiced views, much of which are learnt. You see this common factor with those who tend to use prejudiced and guilt by association arguments. Some interesting work she is doing but to me needs looking at the issue from all forms of prejudice. It is true that mane will look at racism in a good or bad concept, which will happen because some of the worst forms of racism, we them leading to death through the worst form of hate.

I would need to read her book as is interesting, some points are very good as just as others are very subjective.
yes you endlessly tell us we are all one race, but that is just semantics on your part. I presume you understand what people mean when they talk about racism though don't you. Or do you automatically ignore what they say because we are all one race? Anyone can be racist, it does not matter what colour, creed or religion you are. No particular group is more or less racist than any other group.
any one who says groupx cant be racist is at best an utter fool and at worst and apologist for hatred.

Oh dear, someone again who fails to understand some basic concepts.
Racism is an invented concept, so of course people can and are racist.
What is being pointed out is there is no scientific evidence for racists to use in their arguments.

Does that help clarify your ignorance on the matter...
Anyone can be racist, the problem is it is those classified as white that seem to hold the monopoly on the matter. So yes what we class as whites have been far racist than any other group and you still see how in western societies of this discrimination. Yes we see racism in reverse of this like in Zimbabwe

So its best that you understand and study a situation before making a fool of yourself as you have done here. It normally is a person brought up in what is called a white culture who is blind to the truth, such as yourself
How long did the group classified as black have to wait for equal rights in the west?
Do they really have equal rights in the west?
Do native American Indians have self determination in the US and South America?
Who invented the pseudo scientific racism?

by Original Quill Mon May 18, 2015 5:04 am

I sympathize. From about 1820 on--perhaps even before (see Jefferson's contribution to the Declaration of Independence)--the United States broke into two camps. or kinds of states: Massachusetts was the leader of the 'free' states; South Carolina would be the leader of the slave states. Britain had outlawed slavery in 1833.

The division took the form of political parties. Then it took on a moral life. Then came the Civil War, and the vanquishing of the Confederacy was tantamount to telling southerners that God wasn't on their side.

Most of American love of violence and distrust of government ("the Union") came from this era. The pro-slavery southerners withdrew into their shells, only to come out in times like this: when a Black president is elected. The Republican Party's Southern Strategy gave new life to the vanquished southerners, and reawakened the legitimacy of racism.

But the stigma of God turning his back on the pro-slavery group has never left. To call someone a racist is to bestow a great shame upon someone. This is what DiAngelo is calling the "good/bad binary". So, as Lee Atwater taught, we 'do' racism mostly under the table. We complain about welfare moms, or talk of crime in the streets, only we don't mean the streets of Beverly Hills. And we totally miss the racism in our neighborhoods and schools...the so-called benign racism.

But it is still is intentional. I never would have believed it until I saw what happened when a black president was elected. American racists came unglued. They sure as hell surfaced in a hurry. Republicans refused to participate in a government run by blacks. They have shut down the government twice. They started a virtual lie-factory, coming out of Congress. Obama was a Muslim. Obama wasn't born in the US. The IRS. Benghazi. Fast and furious. Yep, Republicans knew god-damned good and well what they were doing all along.

We also do exactly what we see here. We invent racism against whites, something for which there is no reality, nor a history. That's the equalizer that, tho fictional, salves the conscience of the white.

Of course, to call a white a racist is a great affront. Not only does it deny all of the white man's defenses, but it goes back to the days when it was a great moral struggle...and all the condemnation that implies.

by Ben Reilly Mon May 18, 2015 5:44 am

Yeah, I don't understand how some people can't see that there's a lot more to racism than calling someone a racial slur, which of course anybody can do.

I'd ask them -- if you happened to have been born black in the U.S., would you rather a) have to live in a system which is still largely tipped against you because of the color of your skin or b) have some white person call you a name?

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:21 am

Original Quill wrote:We also do exactly what we see here. We invent racism against whites, something for which there is no reality, nor a history. That's the equalizer that, tho fictional, salves the conscience of the white.

Which shows how out of touch with reality you are.
Again you ignore the blatant racism found in what was former Rhodesia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Racism_in_Africa

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janissaries

by veya_victaous Mon May 18, 2015 6:29 am

it is true that there is real racism against whites too.. historically (pre 1500's) Europeans were the main slave race.

there is no doubt that in the USA whites have dominated and there is institutional racism against the Blacks and Natives..

and the USA seems more obsessed with the good bad binary than most it is one of the defining traits of their culture to idolize themselves as good guys and demonize the others as evil devils.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:34 am

veya_victaous wrote:it is true that there is real racism against whites too.. historically (pre 1500's) Europeans were the main slave race.

there is no doubt that in the USA whites have dominated and there is institutional racism against the Blacks and Natives..

and the USA seems more obsessed with the good bad binary than most it is one of the defining traits of their culture to idolize themselves as good guys and demonize the others as evil devils.

Fair and accurate reality of the situation of racism

by veya_victaous Mon May 18, 2015 6:55 am

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:it is true that there is real racism against whites too.. historically (pre 1500's) Europeans were the main slave race.

there is no doubt that in the USA whites have dominated and there is institutional racism against the Blacks and Natives..

and the USA seems more obsessed with the good bad binary than most it is one of the defining traits of their culture to idolize themselves as good guys and demonize the others as evil devils.

Fair and accurate reality of the situation of racism

I think people are making current US racism that is legitimately the worst in the west currently out as the only racism dynamic, but it isn't and Racism is still a big issue in places like Japan, India and much of the middle east.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Bonus Funny
White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility CjenHEg

White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility CjenHEg

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 3:13 pm

All people are racist but it is only ever whites who get accused of it and blamed for it!!!

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 3:17 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:All people are racist but it is only ever whites who get accused of it and blamed for it!!!

Really? We know you certainly are.

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 3:23 pm

And We know you are too!

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 3:24 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:And We know you are too!

Tommy finally admits he is racist

cheers

How long has it taken?

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 3:47 pm

I treat everyone the same regardless of race dodge, while people like you treat people differently because of their race...

Some are more equal than others...

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 3:55 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:All people are racist but it is only ever whites who get accused of it and blamed for it!!!

Maybe I should clarify, I mean people of all races can be racist... not all people of all races are racist...

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 3:55 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:I treat everyone the same regardless of race dodge, while people like you treat people differently because of their race...

Some are more equal than others...

White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility 403162_10150613644143465_129446698464_11144620_448774237_n

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 4:14 pm

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 4:26 pm

eddie wrote:I'm not going to post the whole article here (I find that long c&ps are tedious)but I will take the parts, that to me, are relevant:

Robin DiAngelo was right out of college when she started thinking about it. She'd landed a job leading workshops on racism. And she met a man who became very angry, and pounded on a table. He said white people are the target of discrimination, white people can’t even find jobs anymore.

DiAngelo looked around the office and she saw nothing but white people, all of them with jobs.

"It was unnerving," she says now. "It was like, 'This is not rooted in any racial reality that is happening, in this room, in this workplace, or in this man’s life.' And yet, these feelings are real. His rage is real. How do we do that?"

Meaning: How do white people see themselves as the victims of racism, when the world around them shows something totally different?

DiAngelo worked for years doing racism workshops, wondering this. Eventually, she developed a theory.

"I started thinking about how fragile our sensibilities are when it comes to race," she says

But that doesn’t stop us from forming opinions, many of them strongly held. And one of the biggest ones is about what racism means, and who is racist.

"The number one most effective adaptation of racism over time," DiAngelo says, "is the good/bad binary, this idea that a racist is a bad person and a good person is not racist. And so it’s about individuals who are either good or bad or who either do or don’t engage."

One of the side effects is that many white people come to believe that if they just don’t talk about or think about race, then they are not racist.

"Racism comes out of our pores as white people. It's the way that we are."
Then, if someone comes along and talks about racism the way DiAngelo does – that racism is a system of oppression. That anyone can be prejudiced, but in America, only white people are racist. And, actually, all white people are racist because, as DiAngelo says:

"Racism comes out of our pores as white people. It's the way that we are."

Almost any defensiveness that you get from a white person trying to talk about racism is rooted in that good/bad binary," DiAngelo says. "They hear you saying, 'You are a bad person.'"

The flip side, DiAngelo says if you think of yourself as one of the “good” white people, you think you’ve got it down. You see the latest person caught on camera using the "n-word," that’s what racism is to you. Whatever you’re doing isn’t racist.

And so you don’t think about the whiteness of your neighborhood, your school system or your office.....

http://stateofopportunity.michiganradio.org/post/why-all-white-people-are-racist-cant-handle-being-called-racist-theory-white-fragility

A very interesting article actually, but for me, this is the crux of what I am always saying:

Almost any defensiveness that you get from a white person trying to talk about racism is rooted in that good/bad binary," DiAngelo says. "They hear you saying, 'You are a bad person.'"

The flip side, DiAngelo says if you think of yourself as one of the “good” white people, you think you’ve got it down. You see the latest person caught on camera using the "n-word," that’s what racism is to you. Whatever you’re doing isn’t racist.

And so you don’t think about the whiteness of your neighborhood, your school system"

I think this kind of nonsense is best left to the Americans. I certainly don't want that way of thinking to be the norm in the UK. It's divisive, it's stupid, and it causes more problems that it solves.

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 5:22 pm

Bang on rags!!!

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 5:24 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Bang on rags!!!

Thank you Tommy. White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility 2385359624

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 5:29 pm

You are most welcome!

Laughing

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 5:58 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
eddie wrote:I'm not going to post the whole article here (I find that long c&ps are tedious)but I will take the parts, that to me, are relevant:

Robin DiAngelo was right out of college when she started thinking about it. She'd landed a job leading workshops on racism. And she met a man who became very angry, and pounded on a table. He said white people are the target of discrimination, white people can’t even find jobs anymore.

DiAngelo looked around the office and she saw nothing but white people, all of them with jobs.

"It was unnerving," she says now. "It was like, 'This is not rooted in any racial reality that is happening, in this room, in this workplace, or in this man’s life.' And yet, these feelings are real. His rage is real. How do we do that?"

Meaning: How do white people see themselves as the victims of racism, when the world around them shows something totally different?

DiAngelo worked for years doing racism workshops, wondering this. Eventually, she developed a theory.

"I started thinking about how fragile our sensibilities are when it comes to race," she says

But that doesn’t stop us from forming opinions, many of them strongly held. And one of the biggest ones is about what racism means, and who is racist.

"The number one most effective adaptation of racism over time," DiAngelo says, "is the good/bad binary, this idea that a racist is a bad person and a good person is not racist. And so it’s about individuals who are either good or bad or who either do or don’t engage."

One of the side effects is that many white people come to believe that if they just don’t talk about or think about race, then they are not racist.

"Racism comes out of our pores as white people. It's the way that we are."
Then, if someone comes along and talks about racism the way DiAngelo does – that racism is a system of oppression. That anyone can be prejudiced, but in America, only white people are racist. And, actually, all white people are racist because, as DiAngelo says:

"Racism comes out of our pores as white people. It's the way that we are."

Almost any defensiveness that you get from a white person trying to talk about racism is rooted in that good/bad binary," DiAngelo says. "They hear you saying, 'You are a bad person.'"

The flip side, DiAngelo says if you think of yourself as one of the “good” white people, you think you’ve got it down. You see the latest person caught on camera using the "n-word," that’s what racism is to you. Whatever you’re doing isn’t racist.

And so you don’t think about the whiteness of your neighborhood, your school system or your office.....

http://stateofopportunity.michiganradio.org/post/why-all-white-people-are-racist-cant-handle-being-called-racist-theory-white-fragility

A very interesting article actually, but for me, this is the crux of what I am always saying:

Almost any defensiveness that you get from a white person trying to talk about racism is rooted in that good/bad binary," DiAngelo says. "They hear you saying, 'You are a bad person.'"

The flip side, DiAngelo says if you think of yourself as one of the “good” white people, you think you’ve got it down. You see the latest person caught on camera using the "n-word," that’s what racism is to you. Whatever you’re doing isn’t racist.

And so you don’t think about the whiteness of your neighborhood, your school system"

I think this kind of nonsense is best left to the Americans. I certainly don't want that way of thinking to be the norm in the UK. It's divisive, it's stupid, and it causes more problems that it solves.

Or the fact is like the article says, you are brushing real problems under the carpet.
So you are saying that shying away from problems, creates more problems, it certainly does, because the original problems have never been solved.

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 6:01 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

I think this kind of nonsense is best left to the Americans. I certainly don't want that way of thinking to be the norm in the UK. It's divisive, it's stupid, and it causes more problems that it solves.

Or the fact is like the article says, you are brushing real problems under the carpet.
So you are saying that shying away from problems, creates more problems, it certainly does, because the original problems have never been solved.

I don't think it is a problem in the UK, but it might become one if everyone starts getting obsessed with race, like the Americans.

by Tommy Monk Mon May 18, 2015 6:02 pm

Like the problem of Paki Muslim gangs raping and abusing white British children...

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:02 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:

Or the fact is like the article says, you are brushing real problems under the carpet.
So you are saying that shying away from problems, creates more problems, it certainly does, because the original problems have never been solved.

I don't think it is a problem in the UK, but it might become one if everyone starts getting obsessed with race, like the Americans.

There you go, you do not recognise that it still is a problem in the UK, which is a problem within itself. As how do you account for all the hate crimes that are racially motivated? It may not be as bad as the US, it is none the less still a major problem. Not only this but you also have the clear evidence of bias against minorities racially!

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 6:06 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

I don't think it is a problem in the UK, but it might become one if everyone starts getting obsessed with race, like the Americans.

There you go, you do not recognise that it still is a problem in the UK, which is a problem within itself. As how do you account for all the hate crimes that are racially motivated? It may not be as bad as the US, it is none the less still a major problem. Not only this but you also have the clear evidence of bias against minorities racially!

I'm not going round and round in circles with you. I don't like all this "privilege" nonsense, and if anyone tells me that I must be racist because I'm white, I'll tell them to eff off.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:08 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:

There you go, you do not recognise that it still is a problem in the UK, which is a problem within itself. As how do you account for all the hate crimes that are racially motivated? It may not be as bad as the US, it is none the less still a major problem. Not only this but you also have the clear evidence of bias against minorities racially!

I'm not going round and round in circles with you. I don't like all this "privilege" nonsense, and if anyone tells me that I must be racist because I'm white, I'll tell them to eff off.

That is because you fail to understand how you are privileged.
Again you just showed why it is a problem within itself that you do not still see the problems of racism and how it will continue to be a major problem, until racism ceases to exist. Hence it is so important to speak openly about the problem

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 6:12 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

I'm not going round and round in circles with you. I don't like all this "privilege" nonsense, and if anyone tells me that I must be racist because I'm white, I'll tell them to eff off.

That is because you fail to understand how you are privileged.
Again you just showed why it is a problem within itself that you do not still see the problems of racism and how it will continue to be a major problem, until racism ceases to exist. Hence it is so important to speak openly about the problem

I don't have a problem within myself. You go and tell everyone that you're privileged and racist because you're white if you want to, but I have better things to do.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:15 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:

That is because you fail to understand how you are privileged.
Again you just showed why it is a problem within itself that you do not still see the problems of racism and how it will continue to be a major problem, until racism ceases to exist. Hence it is so important to speak openly about the problem

I don't have a problem within myself. You go and tell everyone that you're privileged and racist because you're white if you want to, but I have better things to do.

Never stated any of that, which shows you invent things. You certainly are privileged though being born into this society.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:17 pm

she obviously didnt study the uk

where being white automatically labels you as racist unless

you agree to be pushed to the bottom of the list for

jobs (positive discrimination)

housing (foreigners have more rights than a native)

medical care (especially maternity wards)

benefits

and finally the right to speak out against any and all of the above

however the left have so abused the "racist" slur that it has lost all sensible meaning here

consider that happenings in places like Rotherham happened BECAUSE of "inverted racism"

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:22 pm

ok here is racism in this country a black man and a white man with exactly the same credentials go for a job who gets it???

sexism, a man and a woman go for exactly the same job with the same credentials who gets the job??

sexiam again cameron pledges to have one third women in his cabinet, surely we would be all served by him picking the best person for the job...

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:24 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:ok here is racism in this country a black man and a white man with exactly the same credentials go for a job who gets it???
White majority of the time

sexism, a man and a woman go for exactly the same job with the same credentials who gets the job??
Man majority of the time

sexiam again cameron pledges to have one third women in his cabinet, surely we would be all served by him picking the best person for the job...

It should be the best person for the Job, but there is countless evidence this does not happen, and that there is discrimination on selection of jobs

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:26 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:ok here is racism in this country a black man and a white man with exactly the same credentials go for a job who gets it???

sexism, a man and a woman go for exactly the same job with the same credentials who gets the job??

sexiam again cameron pledges to have one third women in his cabinet, surely we would be all served by him picking the best person for the job...

you know what the sick thing about your first question is HF???

it is that the answer depends on whether or not the company has filled its "quota"

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:27 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
heavenlyfatheragain wrote:ok here is racism in this country a black man and a white man with exactly the same credentials go for a job who gets it???
White majority of the time

sexism, a man and a woman go for exactly the same job with the same credentials who gets the job??
Man majority of the time

sexiam again cameron pledges to have one third women in his cabinet, surely we would be all served by him picking the best person for the job...

It should be the best person for the Job, but there is countless evidence this does not happen, and that there is discrimination on selection of jobs

that is bull if the black man and the white man had identical credentials it would go to the black man in fear of ending in court, the same for the woman...

it should be the best person for the job that is why cameron is sexist and that's why the police say they need more of a certain minority it is wrong...

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:27 pm

darknessss wrote:
heavenlyfatheragain wrote:ok here is racism in this country a black man and a white man with exactly the same credentials go for a job who gets it???

sexism, a man and a woman go for exactly the same job with the same credentials who gets the job??

sexiam again cameron pledges to have one third women in his cabinet, surely we would be all served by him picking the best person for the job...

you know what the sick thing about your first question is HF???

it is that the answer depends on whether or not the company has filled its "quota"

Or the real fact that blacks are often discriminated against.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:29 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:

It should be the best person for the Job, but there is countless evidence this does not happen, and that there is discrimination on selection of jobs
that is bull if the black man and the white man had identical credentials it would go to the black man in fear of ending in court, the same for the woman...

it should be the best person for the job that is why cameron is sexist and that's why the police say they need more of a certain minority it is wrong...

Its not bull at all.

It shows how far out of touch you are with reality on this matter.
No employer should discriminate, except many do and it is often discrimination against women and minorities

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:31 pm

darknessss wrote:
heavenlyfatheragain wrote:ok here is racism in this country a black man and a white man with exactly the same credentials go for a job who gets it???

sexism, a man and a woman go for exactly the same job with the same credentials who gets the job??

sexiam again cameron pledges to have one third women in his cabinet, surely we would be all served by him picking the best person for the job...

you know what the sick thing about your first question is HF???

it is that the answer depends on whether or not the company has filled its "quota"

I know, if that isn't racism or sexism what is, if we are truly race or sex unconscious there should be know need for quotas we would just employ the best candidate and nothing more would be said..

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:33 pm

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
darknessss wrote:

you know what the sick thing about your first question is HF???

it is that the answer depends on whether or not the company has filled its "quota"
I know, if that isn't racism or sexism what is, if we are truly race or sex unconscious there should be know need for quotas we would just employ the best candidate and nothing more would be said..

But sadly it is because of racism and sexism that such quotas do exist within some employers, the very point you miss. If there was not racism or sexism, they would not exist.
That is the telling part for you

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:40 pm

one small company that I worked for was too small to fall under the need for quotas

(less than 50 employees?????)

but had one chap in the assembly line who was

a)black
b) profoundly deaf

(he also happened to be a first rate assembler)

HIS favourite joke was that he held 3 positions at once

he was an assembly worker
AND he was

a)the nominal "black man"
b)the nominal "disabled worker"

needless to say he was also something of a dry witted comedian too....

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:41 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
heavenlyfatheragain wrote:
I know, if that isn't racism or sexism what is, if we are truly race or sex unconscious there should be know need for quotas we would just employ the best candidate and nothing more would be said..

But sadly it is because of racism and sexism that such quotas do exist within some employers, the very point you miss. If there was not racism or sexism, they would not exist.
That is the telling part for you

I disagree most of it is caused by middle aged white men and their perception of racism nd sexism..

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:42 pm

Needless to say ALL the assembly line operatives were discriminated against by us "engineers"

"They" considered us "cone heads"

"We" considered them "board monkeys"

White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility 3489511464

White people are racist, but can't handle being called racist: the theory of white fragility 3489511464

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:42 pm

darknessss wrote:one small company that I worked for was too small to fall under the need for quotas

(less than 50 employees?????)

but had one chap in the assembly line who was

a)black
b) profoundly deaf

(he also happened to be a first rate assembler)

HIS favourite joke was that he held 3 positions at once

he was an assembly worker
AND he was

a)the nominal "black man"
b)the nominal "disabled worker"

needless to say he was also something of a dry witted comedian too....

You still miss the point Victor, as to why such quotas exist.
People should be given the job on their ability, but because people have been wrongly passed over because of race and their sex, is why they were created.
You look to cast blame at those trying to correct a fault and not on those who have created the problem in the first place

by Raggamuffin Mon May 18, 2015 6:44 pm

We have laws to prevent discrimination - we don't need quotas as well.

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:44 pm

Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:
darknessss wrote:one small company that I worked for was too small to fall under the need for quotas

(less than 50 employees?????)

but had one chap in the assembly line who was

a)black
b) profoundly deaf

(he also happened to be a first rate assembler)

HIS favourite joke was that he held 3 positions at once

he was an assembly worker
AND he was

a)the nominal "black man"
b)the nominal "disabled worker"

needless to say he was also something of a dry witted comedian too....

You still miss the point Victor, as to why such quotas exist.
People should be given the job on their ability, but because people have been wrongly passed over because of race and their sex, is why they were created.
You look to cast blame at those trying to correct a fault and not on those who have created the problem in the first place

to a great degree yes, because they are bloody stupid

by Guest Mon May 18, 2015 6:46 pm

darknessss wrote:
Lucifer Angel of Light wrote:

You still miss the point Victor, as to why such quotas exist.
People should be given the job on their ability, but because people have been wrongly passed over because of race and their sex, is why they were created.
You look to cast blame at those trying to correct a fault and not on those who have created the problem in the first place

to a great degree yes, because they are bloody stupid

As seen you do not blame those that created the problem in the first place.
So you are ore at odds with people trying to stop discrimination, than those who are discriminating.
That makes very little sense to me, as the latter would not have happened without he former.
Cause and effect.

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