Nearly 100,000 of Britain's poorest children go hungry after parents' benefits are cut

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Nearly 100,000 of the poorest children in the UK went hungry last year because their parents’ benefits were stopped or cut, according to a report by a coalition of churches.

A total of more than a million benefit sanctions were imposed last year - sometimes simply because people were late for an appointment at the Jobcentre - although more than 120,000 of those decisions were overturned on appeal.

Researchers found that more than 100 people with severe mental health problems a day were sanctioned.

The report said: “We are disturbed that a benefit system intended to provide for the needy and vulnerable is used as a means of coercion and compliance.

“The penalties often do not appear reasonable or proportionate to the ‘failure’ that has occurred.

“If a similar system operated in a workplace, where pay was removed for a month for being late for a meeting or not achieving a target, we might reasonably expect action to be taken against the employer.”

Niall Cooper, of Church Action on Poverty, which helped write the report, added: “If you commit a crime, no court is allowed to make you go hungry as a punishment.

“But if you’re late for an appointment at the Jobcentre they can remove all your income and leave you unable to feed you or your family for weeks.”

The report was published as a former Jobcentre worked told Channel 4’s Dispatches programme, to be broadcast on Monday, that he had to “hammer” welfare claimants because of Government targets. Alan Davies, who works in Leicester, said: “They weren’t willing to look at them as human beings.”

http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/health-and-families/health-news/nearly-100000-of-britains-poorest-children-go-hungry-after-parents-benefits-are-cut-10079056.html

While HSBC advises the super rich on how to avoid paying taxes and Wanker's bonuses keep on being given even when the bank is handed money. Get the bastards on, roll on May.

I watched the programme on Channel4 this evening and some of what is going om is absolutely shocking. It's just bloody vindictive and typical of this rotten to the core Tory led coalition and that clown Iain Dunkin Donut. 4,000 disabled and vulnerable people a month dumped and sanctioned for the most ridiculous reasons you can imagine to save a pittance in comparison to what the banksters are getting away with and uncollected tax.

Dispatches, watched it too, how the hell people are not beating down the doors and dragging this Government out I don't know.

eddie wrote:

risingsun wrote:How many benefits claimants have to kill themselves before something is done?

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/feb/10/benefits-sanctions-malcolm-burge-suicides

I just read that after googling. It's awful.

So we are back to my question then; how do we tell the genuine from the fakes? The genuine from the workshy?

And why are there not enough jobs, do you think?

YOU DONT.....te reality is that the work shy and fakes are a small proportion of the whole

and the bigger reality is that the benefits bill...less pensions AND less "working benefits" (such as tax credits and a sizeable chunk of housing benefit)
Is a miniscule proportion of GDP

It follows then that in order to have an EFFECTIVE and HUMANE benefits system you ACCEPT that there will be, inevitably, a proportion of "parasitism" upon that system...

You CANNOT eliminate all fraud and sponging ....It is demonstrably impossible....


what these consevative leaches have realised is that they have in the poor and unfortunate, the sick and jobless and ideal "bogey man" upon whom to place the ABSOLUTE blame for the financial mess we are in....thus hiding (because the public are as a group stupid) the REAL fact that the true spongers and fraudsters sre the rich and the nega rich.

I DONT care HOW much the rich have paid in tax, the reality is they they have NOT in proportion paid anywhere NEAR their due amount...

tye concept of the politicians bogey man is now well established....

it generally consists of a group that is marginalised, and likely not ot have much of an effect on voting figures, then lies are spread, then false and utterly terrible "figures" are magiced up to support this, then the demonisation begins.....

we see it regularly from both sides...labour are just as bad ...just different targets

why do they do this ....


to keep YOUR eyes off the ball....

while you are all making ohh's and Ahh's and well bugger me's over things like the terrible cost to the nation of perhaps 2 or 3 that have been put in over expensive accomodation

or even more cynically, being led by the nose by an always compliant media, with such juicy and salacious "news" about JS's brother

these boyo's are ripping your pennies right out from under you.
along with freedoms (and if you think cons are bad wait till labour gets "fiddling"......remember ,,,B'Liar got into power on the back of Dunblane)
along with permitted corporate poisoning (fracking)

and yet "the public" are more concerned with a 30 year old sex pest case...where the PERP is DEAD ffs.


It really IS a case of the public gets what it deserves......


THERE IS A BETTER WAY

+1000000000
to darkness

Agreed!

darknessss wrote:

eddie wrote:

I just read that after googling. It's awful.

So we are back to my question then; how do we tell the genuine from the fakes? The genuine from the workshy?

And why are there not enough jobs, do you think?

YOU DONT.....te reality is that the work shy and fakes are a small proportion of the whole
and the bigger reality is that the benefits bill...less pensions AND less "working benefits" (such as tax credits and a sizeable chunk of housing benefit)
Is a miniscule proportion of GDP
It follows then that in order to have an EFFECTIVE and HUMANE benefits system you ACCEPT that there will be, inevitably, a proportion of "parasitism" upon that system...
You CANNOT eliminate all fraud and sponging ....It is demonstrably impossible....
what these consevative leaches have realised is that they have in the poor and unfortunate, the sick and jobless and ideal "bogey man" upon whom to place the ABSOLUTE blame for the financial mess we are in....thus hiding (because the public are as a group stupid) the REAL fact that the true spongers and fraudsters sre the rich and the nega rich.
I DONT care HOW much the rich have paid in tax, the reality is they they have NOT in proportion paid anywhere NEAR their due amount...
tye concept of the politicians bogey man is now well established....
it generally consists of a group that is marginalised, and likely not ot have much of an effect on voting figures, then lies are spread, then false and utterly terrible "figures" are magiced up to support this, then the demonisation begins.....
we see it regularly from both sides...labour are just as bad ...just different targets
why do they do this ....
to keep YOUR eyes off the ball....
while you are all making ohh's and Ahh's and well bugger me's over things like the terrible cost to the nation of perhaps 2 or 3 that have been put in over expensive accomodation
or even more cynically, being led by the nose by an always compliant media, with such juicy and salacious "news" about JS's brother
these boyo's are ripping your pennies right out from under you.
along with freedoms (and if you think cons are bad wait till labour gets "fiddling"......remember ,,,B'Liar got into power on the back of Dunblane)
along with permitted corporate poisoning (fracking)
and yet "the public" are more concerned with a 30 year old sex pest case...where the PERP is DEAD ffs.
It really IS a case of the public gets what it deserves......
THERE IS A BETTER WAY

That ius complete and utter babble because today many people are work shy and take no prode in their work at all as they once did with the view they came home and felt proud of what they achieved.
This is the problem of socialists where they have not the first clue and fail to see it is this shy work ethic that is the problem and has been a growing problem as much now as a society demands everything on a plate and all based around an elitist view of being born onto a land.
What you do is encourage such a poor work ethic to make those who work of less meaning than those out of work where we excuse those who have failed when given the chance of an education and then to suplimentthem with money on a plate because you are so wet to see they have in many cases created their own problems and again you wish to pander them.
It provides all the wrong reasons to provide meaning anbd purpous to life where you are pandering to those who are nothing short of selfish and believe the world owes them a favour. The fact that we do help people with benefits who are out of work did become a huge problem when they were better off out of work than in employment and we saw the affects of this under Labour and now when it is being addressed which pissed off many of those working you wish to again go back to this madness. Nope people are sick of people like yourself pandering to people who are getting benefits for being out of work which is should be to help them get back into work and not a long term solution.
It is an increasing problem in the west where people are not grateful for the education they have received or the jobs they have been given. They expect the b est and then moan at not getting the job they wanted, they do not give 100% and often abuse their employment with sick days when they are not even sick. At every turn you are encouraging a poor belief and ethic into our society which panders and nbot solves a problem

Didge the day dreamer

There were So many "Work shy no pride in their work" people in England that they could be rounded up to populate a new colony... a.k.a Australia

there have always been Drunks and layabout there is less now than ever the difference is we feed them and don't just let them starve like would have happened in the 'good old days'

And despite all that a few people (not on the Dole) get more in tax breaks than the dole bludgers get in payments AND they are the ones that have ruined the UK economy with their Selfish Greed.

veya_victaous wrote:Didge the day dreamer

There were So many "Work shy no pride in their work" people in England that they could be rounded up  to populate a new colony... a.k.a Australia

there have always been Drunks and layabout there is less now than ever the difference is we feed them and don't just let them starve like would have happened in the 'good old days'

And despite all that a few people (not on  the Dole) get more in tax breaks than the dole bludgers get in payments AND they are the ones that have ruined the UK economy with their Selfish Greed.

You have no conception of Britain and its people, in fact you are down right racist about them.
You have thus no idea on the matter, I suggest you do like I said and seek medical help and stop wasting my time with drivel.

except that vey has hit the nail on the head....

it is you, brasidas, that hasnt a clue, just recycling the hatred of the poor thats spews from tory HQ and then having the NERVE to dress it up as compassion and care...

I'll tell you ONE truth my father taught me......

never be afraid of hard work if needed BUT beware of it.....
those who say hard work never killed anyone CLEARLY never did any.....

Its about time YOU evolved away fron the victorian "christian work ethic" a "con" invented by the mill owners to exploit the working class underlings.....

It is NO LONGER fit for purpose....

the GOVT and employers are quick to point out that "the worker drones" should embrace changes in working practices and yet REFUSE to do likewise, and attempt to poison society against its most vulnerable members...


IF ONLY labour would get its head out of its arse, stop listening to and abjectly surrendering to mentally deficient
iidiotic minority groups and GET ON WITH GOVERNING instead of "fiddling to look good", and looking for the nest headline sound bite....

then they would have my support...

and I would abandon even considering voting for the cons....


as it is I am looking after MY interests First.....

90% of what the cons do is sickening

90% of what Lab do is moronicity......

ye gods what a choice........

You are wrong because you wish to excuse people Victor and that is the problem with people like yourself where today you think people should not help themselves. This is nothing to do with Victorian ethos that is utter absurd, its about wanting to earn and look after yourself and having self respect of which you seem to lack. One of the best rewards you can find in life is being able to be proud of the work you do and that you can look after yourself and your family. Again in my family which did not have much money at all, my father believed it was his duty to provide for his family and not the state. He would have felt ashamed that he could not provide for them if he could not work, hence why he always worked and said to me he would have cleaned the shit out of toilets with his bare hands if he had to, so he could provide for his family. The whole work shy ethos is what is wrong with many today where they demand everything on a plate and blame others for their situiation. You start by learning to help yourself and you take the help offered to you not as something that is seen as rightful but to be thankful for.
It is such a poor attitude that you have and others that is what is wrong in society today, where there is no self belief anymore, where more people are stressed because they see work as nothing more than a means to an end in the majority. You no doubt do not see the link because you think everyone should do as little as possible which many tend to do to get by in life. Life is a challenge it is also hard and nothing is ever free. You only benefit from the kindness of others which I am more than happy to help people but not when they demand it. Each and everyone of us has the opportunity to excell in life and we take paths right or wrong in our life, but to take the poor view you do is to make people believe they need have no respect for themselves and that they should be reliant on others, when if you teach this nobody can learn how to be truely independent. You thus seelk to smother people and wrap them up in cotton wool, that does not allolw any one to blossom or grow.

I will add to my last point the thing that disgusts me the most is where people who need work will not take work because they think certain work is beneath them. That is selfish beyond belief and utterly wrong oon every level but no doubt you would support such negative beliefs Victor. It is weak willed people that is making society so soft they cannot do anything for themselves. What you promote has no bases to bring any meaning to a persons life accept to look for others all the time and not help themselves. It is people with such poor attitudes like yourself that make society as bad as it is today! One that has little gratitude and yet demands everything on a plate.

well didge...

I wouldnt get out of bed for less than £25 per hour PLUS staff benefits....like health plan, pension contributions and redundancy protection insurance etc in my "profession (electronics engineer with management experience)

as it is thats irelevant, because i am semi retired and now work from home as you know....

so income from working is less important (since i also have pensions now comming in) my "business" is merely a (very) well paying hobby

Brasidas wrote:I will add to my last point the thing that disgusts me the most is where people who need work will not take work because they think certain work is beneath them. That is selfish beyond belief and utterly wrong oon every level but no doubt you would support such negative beliefs Victor. It is weak willed people that is making society so soft they cannot do anything for themselves. What you promote has no bases to bring any meaning to a persons life accept to look for others all the time and not help themselves. It is people with such poor attitudes like yourself that make society as bad as it is today! One that has little gratitude and yet demands everything on a plate.

CUE the faux compassion

darknessss wrote:well didge...

I wouldnt get out of bed for less than £25 per hour PLUS staff benefits....like health plan, pension contributions and redundancy protection insurance etc in my "profession (electronics engineer with management experience)

as it is thats irelevant, because i am semi retired and now work from home as you know....

so income from working is less important (since i also have pensions now comming in) my "business" is merely a (very) well paying hobby

Says it all really. You remind of a wonderful girl I dated in my teens of her father who was an oil rig designer/engineer of something similar, I forget and refused to do any job which was many which he felt was beneath him. I thought he was very selfish and brought unnecessary hardship to his family when he was offered jobs and of which they wewre good money. Sometiomes you put the needs of others, your own family before your own stubborn pride. I remeber my father bringing him down about 20 pegs, making him feel ashamed for putting his own selfish pride above his family. It worked because he went out and took on a job after that.
I am very happy you have done well for yourself Victor but the belief that some work is beneath you is nothing short of elitism again. A view you are too good to work alongside others of lesser skills, which is also very snobbish if you ask me.

Again glad life has worked out for you and on that I am truly happy for you.

darknessss wrote:

Brasidas wrote:I will add to my last point the thing that disgusts me the most is where people who need work will not take work because they think certain work is beneath them. That is selfish beyond belief and utterly wrong oon every level but no doubt you would support such negative beliefs Victor. It is weak willed people that is making society so soft they cannot do anything for themselves. What you promote has no bases to bring any meaning to a persons life accept to look for others all the time and not help themselves. It is people with such poor attitudes like yourself that make society as bad as it is today! One that has little gratitude and yet demands everything on a plate.

CUE the faux compassion

Maybe your life has little meaning and is artifical Victor, who knows.

Brasidas wrote:

darknessss wrote:well didge...

I wouldnt get out of bed for less than £25 per hour PLUS staff benefits....like health plan, pension contributions and redundancy protection insurance etc in my "profession (electronics engineer with management experience)

as it is thats irelevant, because i am semi retired and now work from home as you know....

so income from working is less important (since i also have pensions now comming in) my "business" is merely a (very) well paying hobby

Says it all really. You remind of a wonderful girl I dated in my teens of her father who was an oil rig designer/engineer of something similar, I forget and refused to do any job which was many which he felt was beneath him. I thought he was very selfish and brought unnecessary hardship to his family when he was offered jobs and of which they wewre good money. Sometiomes you put the needs of others, your own family before your own stubborn pride. I remeber my father bringing him down about 20 pegs, making him feel ashamed for putting his own selfish pride above his family. It worked because he went out and took on a job after that.
I am very happy you have done well for yourself Victor but the belief that some work is beneath you is nothing short of elitism again. A view you are too good to work alongside others of lesser skills, which is also very snobbish if you ask me.

Again glad life has worked out for you and on that I am truly happy for you.

you see again didge...you show the utter contempt you have for people....

see we are TOLD....that there is a "jobs market" (which smacks of slavery but still)

now if indeed it IS a market than it is rigged...(and thus should be illegal and made to comply with marketing regulations)

however if that IS the case ....then I am selling my skills.....to the highest bidder....

I am the "Harrods" of electronics engineers....NOT the "tesco" or "Lidl"

IF for some reson I HAD to work for £7 per hour....

Then you ...as an employer would get £7 worth per hour

i.e NO initiative

Do EXACTLY as told...and no more

NO enthusiasm

and certainly no "problem solving"
Or freebies...like my languages etc.......

arrive on the dot...
leave on the dot....


yah pays peanuts...yah gets a monkey....perhaps a highly over qualified monkey... but a monkey non the less.....

darknessss wrote:

Brasidas wrote:

Says it all really. You remind of a wonderful girl I dated in my teens of her father who was an oil rig designer/engineer of something similar, I forget and refused to do any job which was many which he felt was beneath him. I thought he was very selfish and brought unnecessary hardship to his family when he was offered jobs and of which they wewre good money. Sometiomes you put the needs of others, your own family before your own stubborn pride. I remeber my father bringing him down about 20 pegs, making him feel ashamed for putting his own selfish pride above his family. It worked because he went out and took on a job after that.
I am very happy you have done well for yourself Victor but the belief that some work is beneath you is nothing short of elitism again. A view you are too good to work alongside others of lesser skills, which is also very snobbish if you ask me.

Again glad life has worked out for you and on that I am truly happy for you.

you see again didge...you show the utter contempt you have for people....
see we are TOLD....that there is a "jobs market"  (which smacks of slavery but still)
now if indeed it IS a market than it is rigged...(and thus should be illegal and made to comply with marketing regulations)
however if that IS the case ....then I am selling my skills.....to the highest bidder....
I am the "Harrods" of electronics engineers....NOT the "tesco" or "Lidl"
IF for some reson I HAD to work for £7 per hour....
Then you ...as an employer would get £7 worth per hour
i.e NO initiative
Do EXACTLY as told...and no more
NO enthusiasm
and certainly no "problem solving"
Or freebies...like my languages etc.......
arrive on the dot...
leave on the dot....
yah pays peanuts...yah gets a monkey....perhaps a highly over qualified monkey... but a monkey non the less.....

Main points from above.

Negative again.
Elitism
Selfish
Dspondant
Stubborn pride


Any other person would take any roile whilst actively looking to get back into a postion which suited their skills.
You though would remain despondant and selfish again in the belief you deserve better based on your skills and that you should reamain idle whilst waiting for something to come up.
Again what a poor work ethos which has no pride in going out and earning your own money, even if it is less that what you have been accustomed to. That means you make some cut backs if you have to earn less but remian postive that you will get back into a poston you once had before or something as good. Many employers would rightly view your view as someone who was not employable because they have such a negative attitude as you do here. Nothing is beneath you and if you think some work is beneath you then that is where you are going wrong.

no didge...in your grovelling twisted hatered of anything remotely decent soiety wise you are blind to the most important fact......
eliteism....

so you dont think you should have pride in your achievements....unless that be robbing the country of billions by tax fraud?

whats selfish about not being taken for an idiot....



yep nothing is beneath me....but you (the employer) get exactly what you pay for


yah pays peanuts...yah gets a monkey...

pay me £7 per hour to sweep the floor...than that is what I will do....do NOT exapect me to start mending stuff (even though I am qualified to do so)
do NOT expect me to help you translate that latest order from germany

(now if you want to talk money and make me an offer ...I could be tempted to fix that coffee machine...for the right money of course........)

in fact do NOT expect anything more than what you pay me to do......

who said I wouldnt be looking elsewhere...?
you recon I'd want to stay on that pittance?

Brasidas wrote:

darknessss wrote:well didge...

I wouldnt get out of bed for less than £25 per hour PLUS staff benefits....like health plan, pension contributions and redundancy protection insurance etc in my "profession (electronics engineer with management experience)

as it is thats irelevant, because i am semi retired and now work from home as you know....

so income from working is less important (since i also have pensions now comming in) my "business" is merely a (very) well paying hobby

Says it all really. You remind of a wonderful girl I dated in my teens of her father who was an oil rig designer/engineer of something similar, I forget and refused to do any job which was many which he felt was beneath him. I thought he was very selfish and brought unnecessary hardship to his family when he was offered jobs and of which they wewre good money. Sometiomes you put the needs of others, your own family before your own stubborn pride. I remeber my father bringing him down about 20 pegs, making him feel ashamed for putting his own selfish pride above his family. It worked because he went out and took on a job after that.
I am very happy you have done well for yourself Victor but the belief that some work is beneath you is nothing short of elitism again. A view you are too good to work alongside others of lesser skills, which is also very snobbish if you ask me.

Again glad life has worked out for you and on that I am truly happy for you.

When my other half gave up his business due to having a bad back, he went and did the london knowledge - we had some savings but didn't want to break into them too much.

I took on about seven cleaning jobs.
At 34 I was cleaning toilets and ironing people's clothes.

Why did I do it?
Because we needed the money! It put food on our table and helped my OH concentrate on his studying. It fed and clothed my son.

Would I do it all again?? You bet I would!
I'm not too up,my own arse to clean a toilet if we need the money!!!

I don't understand how people can ever say that??!

eddie wrote:

Brasidas wrote:

Says it all really. You remind of a wonderful girl I dated in my teens of her father who was an oil rig designer/engineer of something similar, I forget and refused to do any job which was many which he felt was beneath him. I thought he was very selfish and brought unnecessary hardship to his family when he was offered jobs and of which they wewre good money. Sometiomes you put the needs of others, your own family before your own stubborn pride. I remeber my father bringing him down about 20 pegs, making him feel ashamed for putting his own selfish pride above his family. It worked because he went out and took on a job after that.
I am very happy you have done well for yourself Victor but the belief that some work is beneath you is nothing short of elitism again. A view you are too good to work alongside others of lesser skills, which is also very snobbish if you ask me.

Again glad life has worked out for you and on that I am truly happy for you.

When my other half gave up his business due to having a bad back, he went and did the london knowledge - we had some savings but didn't want to break into them too much.

I took on about seven cleaning jobs.
At 34 I was cleaning toilets and ironing people's clothes.

Why did I do it?
Because we needed the money! It put food on our table and helped my OH concentrate on his studying. It fed and clothed my son.

Would I do it all again?? You bet I would!
I'm not too up,my own arse to clean a toilet if we need the money!!!

I don't understand how people can ever say that??!

like didge you miss the point

pay me bog cleaner rates...then you get a bog cleaner...nothing more....

darknessss wrote:

eddie wrote:

When my other half gave up his business due to having a bad back, he went and did the london knowledge - we had some savings but didn't want to break into them too much.

I took on about seven cleaning jobs.
At 34 I was cleaning toilets and ironing people's clothes.

Why did I do it?
Because we needed the money! It put food on our table and helped my OH concentrate on his studying. It fed and clothed my son.

Would I do it all again?? You bet I would!
I'm not too up,my own arse to clean a toilet if we need the money!!!

I don't understand how people can ever say that??!

like didge you miss the point

pay me bog cleaner rates...then you get a bog cleaner...nothing more....

Good I only want a bog cleaner, that was all that was specified on the job.
If you do more, then that is up to you and chances are you might get promoted to the urinals next.
Sorry could not resist

Lets face some facts here

1) we are all prostitues on lifes street corner...we sell ourselves to the highest bidder
2) some few are daft enought to be exploited. That is to say, they would do anything any employer asked them to for tuppence an hour, all the while licking his boots...(what pride? or more accurately self respect?)
thinking here using hard earned hard learned skills whilst being paid minimum wage.....
3) the reality is that faux pride like brasidas expects does nothing but make the fat cat tax dodgers richer at everyones expense...

now in talking about ME here i have said I wouldnt get out of bed for less than£25/hour...thats to do my "trained work"

if I HAD to as said i would even work at £7 but then you get a £7 bog cleaner or floor sweeper....

NOT a potential bog cleaner /fall back electronics engineer for when it gets busy.....
you want THOSE skills.....yah pays for em.....

Brasidas wrote:

darknessss wrote:

like didge you miss the point

pay me bog cleaner rates...then you get a bog cleaner...nothing more....

Good I only want a bog cleaner, that was all that was specified on the job.
If you do more, then that is up to you and chances are you might get promoted to the urinals next.
Sorry could not resist

yeah...but we all know promises of promotion are lies....

darknessss wrote:Lets face some facts here

1) we are all prostitues on lifes street corner...we sell ourselves to the highest bidder
2) some few are daft enought to be exploited. That is to say, they would do anything any employer asked them to for tuppence an hour, all the while licking his boots...(what pride? or more accurately self respect?)
thinking here using hard earned hard learned skills whilst being paid minimum wage.....
3) the reality is that faux pride like brasidas expects does nothing but make the fat cat tax dodgers richer at everyones expense...

now in talking about ME here i have said I wouldnt get out of bed for less than£25/hour...thats to do my "trained work"

if I HAD to as said i would even work at £7  but then you get a £7 bog cleaner or floor sweeper....

NOT a potential bog cleaner /fall back electronics engineer for when it gets busy.....
you want THOSE skills.....yah pays for em.....

I could rip this apart again but it would be me repeating as you have just repeated yourselkf your views again Victor

Endless circle.

Some people go out to work not even for the money but because they love their work and I think I can be 75% sure Cass is one of these people.
My mother even at her age tends to end up doing everyone elses garden as well as her own because she loves garderening and she will not accept any money for this. So your views are very much based around greed of money itself it seems now, where it should be a balance of enough money to live comfortably on and a job you really enjoy.
Look at Ben also, am sure he will tell you he loves his work also very much.

Some people work because they like their job, or being busy or are lonely - as in the case of volunteer workers.

Brasidas wrote:

darknessss wrote:Lets face some facts here

1) we are all prostitues on lifes street corner...we sell ourselves to the highest bidder
2) some few are daft enought to be exploited. That is to say, they would do anything any employer asked them to for tuppence an hour, all the while licking his boots...(what pride? or more accurately self respect?)
thinking here using hard earned hard learned skills whilst being paid minimum wage.....
3) the reality is that faux pride like brasidas expects does nothing but make the fat cat tax dodgers richer at everyones expense...

now in talking about ME here i have said I wouldnt get out of bed for less than£25/hour...thats to do my "trained work"

if I HAD to as said i would even work at £7  but then you get a £7 bog cleaner or floor sweeper....

NOT a potential bog cleaner /fall back electronics engineer for when it gets busy.....
you want THOSE skills.....yah pays for em.....

I could rip this apart again but it would be me repeating as you have just repeated yourselkf your views again Victor

Endless circle.

Some people go out to work not even for the money but because they love their work and I think I can be 75% sure Cass is one of these people.


I'm absolutely sure Cass LOVED cleaning bogs out...."wow"

My mother even at her age tends to end up doing everyone elses garden as well as her own because she loves garderening and she will not accept any money for this. So your views are very much based around greed of money itself it seems now, where it should be a balance of enough money to live comfortably on and a job you really enjoy.
Look at Ben also, am sure he will tell you he loves his work also very much.

I enjoyed My work.....but it was STILL only done..."for the money" I only turned up as a Wage slave, sure the guys i worked with were great...we had a laugh....the work was at times...uhmmmmm...challenging...and not only technically.... but never boring and at times positively delightfull....like trips to Vienna, where I was treated to some real OLD fashioned teutonic hospitality (good job ballroom dancing is one of my social skills and good german (even if a little limited) one of my language skills, not to mention knowing HOW to be a "good teuton"   )......

BUT ...did I miss it when I left...do I miss it now...NO



"I owe, I owe, thats why to work I go"

darknessss wrote:

Brasidas wrote:

I could rip this apart again but it would be me repeating as you have just repeated yourselkf your views again Victor

Endless circle.

Some people go out to work not even for the money but because they love their work and I think I can be 75% sure Cass is one of these people.


I'm absolutely sure Cass LOVED cleaning bogs out...."wow"

My mother even at her age tends to end up doing everyone elses garden as well as her own because she loves garderening and she will not accept any money for this. So your views are very much based around greed of money itself it seems now, where it should be a balance of enough money to live comfortably on and a job you really enjoy.
Look at Ben also, am sure he will tell you he loves his work also very much.

I enjoyed My work.....but it was STILL only done..."for the money" I only turned up as a Wage slave, sure the guys i worked with were great...we had a laugh....the work was at times...uhmmmmm...challenging...and not only technically.... but never boring and at times positively delightfull....like trips to Vienna, where I was treated to some real OLD fashioned teutonic hospitality (good job ballroom dancing is one of my social skills and good german (even if a little limited) one of my language skills, not to mention knowing HOW to be a "good teuton"   )......

BUT ...did I miss it when I left...do I miss it now...NO



"I owe, I owe, thats why to work I go"

Sounds very interesting to me Victor and each to their own I guess and why we are different, which is no bad thing.
I look forward to the challenges in my work
I get a buss out of it.

eddie wrote:Some people work because they like their job, or being busy or are lonely - as in the case of volunteer workers.

volunteer working is different cass...as you say thats done for many reasons....

and OK if you like your job you may well be happy with a lesser wage.......but even then there are limits....

and there are plenty the other way too...times I have heard...I love the money but hate the job.......

Anyway Victor as always its been interesting locking horns, which we both enjoy, even though I know we do actually agree on more than we let on.





Have a good evening mate

darknessss wrote:

eddie wrote:Some people work because they like their job, or being busy or are lonely - as in the case of volunteer workers.

volunteer working is different cass...as you say thats done for many reasons....

and OK if you like your job you may well be happy with a lesser wage.......but even then there are limits....

and there are plenty the other way too...times I have heard...I love the money but hate the job.......

Cass?

That is Eddie dude.

lol night mate

darknessss wrote:

eddie wrote:Some people work because they like their job, or being busy or are lonely - as in the case of volunteer workers.

volunteer working is different cass...as you say thats done for many reasons....

and OK if you like your job you may well be happy with a lesser wage.......but even then there are limits....

and there are plenty the other way too...times I have heard...I love the money but hate the job.......

Firstly im edds

Secondly, I think that's why some people get so angry about people on benefits; they're jealous that they can't just leave their jobs and live on small money.....

I'm telling you! Some people (not on forums necessarily) are so het up about benefits I actually think they're just green with envy that those people choose not to work.....

Brasidas wrote:

darknessss wrote:

I enjoyed My work.....but it was STILL only done..."for the money" I only turned up as a Wage slave, sure the guys i worked with were great...we had a laugh....the work was at times...uhmmmmm...challenging...and not only technically.... but never boring and at times positively delightfull....like trips to Vienna, where I was treated to some real OLD fashioned teutonic hospitality (good job ballroom dancing is one of my social skills and good german (even if a little limited) one of my language skills, not to mention knowing HOW to be a "good teuton"   )......

BUT ...did I miss it when I left...do I miss it now...NO



"I owe, I owe, thats why to work I go"

Sounds very interesting to me Victor and each to their own I guess and why we are different, which is no bad thing.
I look forward to the challenges in my work
I get a buss out of it.

so did I...I never knew from one day to the next what disaster some goon had wreaked on one of our systems we had insytalled in warehouses around europe.....
or which irate and (generally foul tempered) warehouse manager I was going to have to subdue (and I choose that word carefully, 99% of the time the fault was due to their goons...not our gear but that didnt stop the reaching the point of incipient self combustion...indeed at times I began to wonder if it was actually POSSIBLE for a human to self combust due to self righteous indignation?????????. I swear that one or two came close)

twas an interesting job...sorta 60% electronics engineer and 40% diplomat

eddie wrote:

darknessss wrote:
volunteer working is different cass...as you say thats done for many reasons....

and OK if you like your job you may well be happy with a lesser wage.......but even then there are limits....

and there are plenty the other way too...times I have heard...I love the money but hate the job.......

Firstly im edds

Secondly, I think that's why some people get so angry about people on  benefits; they're jealous that they can't just leave their jobs and live on small money.....

I'm telling you! Some people (not on forums necessarily) are so het up about benefits I actually think they're just green with envy that those people choose  not to work.....

thing is edds (sorry BTW), I dont see what the uproar is about...other than being a tory smokescreen to keep the dumbo public occupied whilst they rob the coffers....

the benefits bill...if you remove pensions and working benefits..... is miniscule in comparison to the GDP of the country.....

AND...it was Thatcher the milk snatcher that started it all anyway to hide the massive and unprecedented unemployment figures she caused.....

Yeah agree about Thatcher.
I blame her for the housing crisis - selling off council homes!

I couldnt condone the "celebrations" at her death...to me there is something wrong with those who did, it could only bring grief to her family, which is wrong...but at the same time I have little respect for her or at least for the policies she endorsed and used....

darknessss wrote:I couldnt condone the "celebrations" at her death...to me there is something wrong with those who did, it could only bring grief to her family, which is wrong...but at the same time I have little respect for her or at least for the policies she endorsed and used....

Yes the celebrations were insensitive and in poor taste.
She made bad decsions in some people's eyes but she wasn't a monster.

darknessss wrote:

eddie wrote:

darknessss wrote:
volunteer working is different cass...as you say thats done for many reasons....

and OK if you like your job you may well be happy with a lesser wage.......but even then there are limits....

and there are plenty the other way too...times I have heard...I love the money but hate the job.......

Firstly im edds

Secondly, I think that's why some people get so angry about people on  benefits; they're jealous that they can't just leave their jobs and live on small money.....

I'm telling you! Some people (not on forums necessarily) are so het up about benefits I actually think they're just green with envy that those people choose  not to work.....

thing is edds (sorry BTW), I dont see what the uproar is about...other than being a tory smokescreen to keep the dumbo public occupied whilst they rob the coffers....

the benefits bill...if you remove pensions and working benefits..... is miniscule in comparison to the GDP of the country.....

AND...it was Thatcher the milk snatcher that started it all anyway to hide the massive and unprecedented unemployment figures she caused.....

THIS IS SO TRUE
not just in the UK here too, they are making mountains out of mole hills while shovelling more from the masses into the pile for the few.

We have top 1 % with more than 70% of the rest combined. they are not paying anywhere near the rate of tax relative to their income any one getting themselves "above average" ends up often paying more in real dollars since they don't get the tax breaks and write-off's. And that's not even taking into account all the illegal tax dodging like the Recent scandals have revealed.

darknessss wrote:

Brasidas wrote:

Sounds very interesting to me Victor and each to their own I guess and why we are different, which is no bad thing.
I look forward to the challenges in my work
I get a buss out of it.

so did I...I never knew from one day to the next what disaster some goon had wreaked on one of our systems we had insytalled in warehouses around europe.....
or which irate and (generally foul tempered) warehouse manager I was going to have to subdue (and I choose that word carefully, 99% of the time the fault was due to their goons...not our gear but that didnt stop the reaching the point of incipient self combustion...indeed at times I began to wonder if it was actually POSSIBLE for a human to self combust due to self righteous indignation?????????. I swear that one or two came close)

twas an interesting job...sorta 60% electronics engineer and 40% diplomat

I can relate to that on many factors Victor but I am sure as it does for me bring a very good feeling being able to resolve proplems, to the point you know you have done good by doing this.