Wil you carry on wearing a mask and social distancing?

It's thought that Boris is to announce today that in 2 weeks time ALL mandatory laws re wearing face coverings in public places, social distancing rules, crowd number control etc will be relaxed.

So, will you throw away your mask completely, rub shoulders on public transport, once more mingle into crowds with gay abandon, or will you still be cautious when out and about in public?

Much as I dislike wearing the mask now, I think I will still carry one with me for when I am on public transport (hardly ever) or in a busy shop (often)

I'll keep my distance as much as I can, use hand sanitizer, I carry my own, and have a mask handy.

Having received the vaccine, I am immune from either getting the virus, or passing it on. It's no longer a threat.

On June 15th, California went off safety protocols. Now, only facilities like public transit (which are subject to federal standards) require mask wearing.

I still carry a mask, as you never know when you are going to be in one of those facilities (eg, a federal courthouse).

Original Quill wrote:Having received the vaccine, I am immune from either getting the virus, or passing it on.  It's no longer a threat.

On June 15th, California went off safety protocols.  Now, only facilities like public transit (which are subject to federal standards) require mask wearing.

I still carry a mask, as you never know when you are going to be in one of those facilities (eg, a federal courthouse).

Having the vaccine available has changed the way this bloody plague has controlled our lives for 16 months, but there  are people who have been double vaccined and still caught covid and been very ill, as have some people who have had the virus and seem to think they are invincible...they are not.

Mayor of Greater Manchester Andy Burnham has just made a good point on the local news.

He doesn't think withdrawing the law about wearing masks on transport is a good idea just yet.

For people who have no choice but to use public transport, especially when they are packed out, people who may have shielded or have existing medical conditions that may make them more vulnerable, discarding the wearing of masks and practising social distancing  wont seem like freedom to them.

Vaccinated people are still catching and transmitting the virus. I don't think anyone in the US has been vaccinated, caught the virus and died.

I stopped wearing masks on Easter

SONOMA COUNTY, Calif. -- At least 39 fully vaccinated people in Northern California's Sonoma County have come down with coronavirus over the course of the last two and a half months, according to county officials. However, doctors are cautioning against that headline, saying the efficacy rates actually appear to be very strong, and this is not a surprise.

"That is exactly what we expected and in fact it's probably better than expected," says Dr. Peter Chin-Hong of University of California San Francisco.

Original Quill wrote:

Syl wrote:Having the vaccine available has changed the way this bloody plague has controlled our lives for 16 months, but there  are people who have been double vaccined and still caught covid and been very ill, as have some people who have had the virus and seem to think they are invincible...they are not.

With all due respect, Syl...we don't have that problem.  Once vaccinated, a person is free of the virus and its effects.  The problem we have is the small sub-set of our country who, for reasons of their own – usually some sort of voodoo - are unwilling to get vaccinated.

Fortunately, they segregate themselves geographically.  They are south of the Missouri and Ohio Rivers, for the most part, and I consider that another country.  They bought into Trump’s political strategy of disavowal (of the virus), and with Trump gone they inherit the dregs of that belief.  Trump was playing a denial strategy, as suited his failed campaign message, but now having bought into it, these people are imprisoned by their own ideology.

We do have an element of our population that is still vulnerable: the 12 and under group.  But testing of our existing vaccines will probably soon result in protection of them as well.

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/even-if-youre-vaccinated-the-delta-variant-can-still-impact-you

Syl wrote:

Original Quill wrote:
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With all due respect, Syl...we don't have that problem.  Once vaccinated, a person is free of the virus and its effects.  The problem we have is the small sub-set of our country who, for reasons of their own – usually some sort of voodoo - are unwilling to get vaccinated.

Fortunately, they segregate themselves geographically.  They are south of the Missouri and Ohio Rivers, for the most part, and I consider that another country.  They bought into Trump’s political strategy of disavowal (of the virus), and with Trump gone they inherit the dregs of that belief.  Trump was playing a denial strategy, as suited his failed campaign message, but now having bought into it, these people are imprisoned by their own ideology.

We do have an element of our population that is still vulnerable: the 12 and under group.  But testing of our existing vaccines will probably soon result in protection of them as well.
[/size]

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/even-if-youre-vaccinated-the-delta-variant-can-still-impact-you

Dr Quill, medicine man.

Maddog wrote:

Syl wrote:


https://www.healthline.com/health-news/even-if-youre-vaccinated-the-delta-variant-can-still-impact-you

Dr Quill, medicine man.  

No vaccine is 100% foolproof, Quill should know that.

Your link is old news, Syl. Last week the CDC came out with findings that the two most popular vaccines (one of which I've taken) are fully effective against the Delta variant.

That is not to say that something else might not come along and sicken everyone, but so might the sun go super-nova. Every day there is a risk of something. Nonetheless, we're as prepared as we can be.

Original Quill wrote:Your link is old news, Syl.  Last week the CDC came out with findings that the two most popular vaccines (one of which I've taken) are fully effective against the Delta variant.

That is not to say that something else might not come along and sicken everyone, but so might the sun go super-nova.  Every day there is a risk of something.  Nonetheless, we're as prepared as we can be.

SONOMA COUNTY, Calif. -- At least 39 fully vaccinated people in Northern California's Sonoma County have come down with coronavirus over the course of the last two and a half months, according to county officials. However, doctors are cautioning against that headline, saying the efficacy rates actually appear to be very strong, and this is not a surprise.

"That is exactly what we expected and in fact it's probably better than expected," says Dr. Peter Chin-Hong of University of California San Francisco.

Syl wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Dr Quill, medicine man.  

No vaccine is 100% foolproof, Quill should know that.

He should know a lot of things. But making shit up is so much more fun.

Original Quill wrote:Your link is old news, Syl.  Last week the CDC came out with findings that the two most popular vaccines (one of which I've taken) are fully effective against the Delta variant.

That is not to say that something else might not come along and sicken everyone, but so might the sun go super-nova.  Every day there is a risk of something.  Nonetheless, we're as prepared as we can be.

Heres a 3 day old report then.....

"Once a distant threat, the Delta variant of the coronavirus first identified in India has reached every corner of the United States — and it promises to live up to its name.

"A study based on real-world data from the U.K. found that two doses of the Pfizer vaccine were 88% effective at preventing COVID-19 as a result of an infection with the Delta variant. That's just a notch down from the 95% efficacy it demonstrated in clinical trials against earlier, less transmissible strains."


https://news.yahoo.com/effective-covid-19-vaccines-against-152740353.html

Maddog wrote:

Syl wrote:



No vaccine is 100% foolproof, Quill should know that.

He should know a lot of things. But making shit up is so much more fun.  

So, since there is a change of subject, I assume my point is unrefuted. We, in the US, have produced at least three vaccines that work. That's all that can be asked.

No one is saying the vaccines don't work, they are brilliant.
Between 80 and 90% (depending on age and circumstance) success rate in catching and spreading corona, plus drastically lessening the severity and almost certainly the death of anyone who has been vaccinated and then catches it, makes this vaccination programme a real success story.

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:

He should know a lot of things. But making shit up is so much more fun.  

So, since there is a change of subject, I assume my point is unrefuted.  We, in the US, have produced at least three vaccines that work.  That's all that can be asked.

They work most of the time.

It's the best that science can do.

Original Quill wrote:It's the best that science can do.

Quite, and it's done brilliantly to find a vaccination to control this virus in so short a time. Without it God knows how many millions more would have died globally.
I was just pointing out that no vaccination is infallible, including this one. People who are fully vaccinated can still catch and spread the virus.
The good news in they are far less likely to catch or spread it, and if they are unlucky enough to catch it, they are far less likely to be seriously ill.

It's estimated here that a third wave is likely as from next week when most restrictions are lifted.

"Covid cases could surge to 200,000 a day, a leading scientist has warned, after the prime minister announced a plan to scrap masks and social distancing as soon as 19 July.

Boris Johnson said that while the country was still “very far from the end” of the pandemic, it was now or never to lift controls by taking advantage of the vaccine roll-out and the upcoming “natural firebreak” offered by the school holidays and good weather."


https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/coronavirus-news-live-daily-cases-could-hit-200-000-as-javid-admits-infections-will-soar-after-rules-axed/ar-AALOEZS?ocid=msedgntp

All the older and more vulnerable groups have been double vaccinated, majority of other adults have also been double vaccinated... Younger people and children don't get ill or even get symptoms so no worries there either...


Plus you have to remember that over half the population have already had the virus anyway... So it is running out of people to infect...


We need some common sense and to get all these restrictions scrapped and to get back to normal!!!


We still have too many people hiding away at home and who are involved in the media and in govt and other decision making and decision influencing positions who are obsessed with fear mongering and doom and gloom panic and worry who are constantly talking us into this perpetual state of lockdown madness!

Syl wrote:

Original Quill wrote:It's the best that science can do.

Quite, and it's done brilliantly to find a vaccination to control this virus in so short a time. Without it God knows how many millions more would have died globally.
I was just pointing out that no vaccination is infallible, including this one. People who are fully vaccinated can still catch and spread the virus.
The good news in they are far less likely to catch or spread it, and if they are unlucky enough to catch it, they are far less likely to be seriously ill.

It's estimated here that a third wave is likely as from next week when most restrictions are lifted.

"Covid cases could surge to 200,000 a day, a leading scientist has warned, after the prime minister announced a plan to scrap masks and social distancing as soon as 19 July.

Boris Johnson said that while the country was still “very far from the end” of the pandemic, it was now or never to lift controls by taking advantage of the vaccine roll-out and the upcoming “natural firebreak” offered by the school holidays and good weather."


https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/coronavirus-news-live-daily-cases-could-hit-200-000-as-javid-admits-infections-will-soar-after-rules-axed/ar-AALOEZS?ocid=msedgntp

We didn't have a third wave and we dropped restrictions months ago. With far lower rates of vaccination.

Of course the experts said we would have a third wave.

It's really time to get back to normal life which always has an element of risk.

As of July 4th, according to the CDC, over 172 million, or 67%, of adult Americans have gotten at least one dose of vaccination. About 156 million, or about 47%, have received both doses.

Of the 33% remaining, apparently 73% have cause against ever getting the vaccination. The US is currently averaging less than 300,000 first doses daily, according to figures published by the CDC. Polls suggest many unvaccinated Americans were too busy to get the shots or felt they did not need them.

The largest gap in vaccinations remains among younger Americans: less than half of those between 18 and 24 years old have gotten at least one dose of the vaccine, according to the CDC's findings. Around 26% of adults under 40 surveyed by the CDC who did not plan to get vaccinated said they were concerned about catching Covid-19.

Maddog wrote:

Syl wrote:

Quite, and it's done brilliantly to find a vaccination to control this virus in so short a time. Without it God knows how many millions more would have died globally.
I was just pointing out that no vaccination is infallible, including this one. People who are fully vaccinated can still catch and spread the virus.
The good news in they are far less likely to catch or spread it, and if they are unlucky enough to catch it, they are far less likely to be seriously ill.

It's estimated here that a third wave is likely as from next week when most restrictions are lifted.

"Covid cases could surge to 200,000 a day, a leading scientist has warned, after the prime minister announced a plan to scrap masks and social distancing as soon as 19 July.

Boris Johnson said that while the country was still “very far from the end” of the pandemic, it was now or never to lift controls by taking advantage of the vaccine roll-out and the upcoming “natural firebreak” offered by the school holidays and good weather."


https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/coronavirus-news-live-daily-cases-could-hit-200-000-as-javid-admits-infections-will-soar-after-rules-axed/ar-AALOEZS?ocid=msedgntp

We didn't have a third wave and we dropped restrictions months ago. With far lower rates of vaccination.

Of course the experts said we would have a third wave.  

It's really time to get back to normal life which always has an element of risk.

Well hopefully we wont have a third wave, though the experts have predicted we probably will.
Hospital admission rates and sadly deaths are expected to rise, so it's a gamble, but one worth taking.
If it's left later, summer will be almost over, and relaxing everything as the flu season is about to start wouldn't be such a good idea.

My life is more or less back to normal, we have been for a short holiday, we go out to eat and drink again (thank God) and I see my friends and family again.

I will however continue to carry a mask and wear it when I feel crowded inside.

Latest news re Covid Passports, it seems more likely they will be required.
I wish the government would definitely announce it one way or the other.

Fully vaccinated adults will no longer be required to isolate after returning from Amber list countries....so that's a start.


"Reports indicate the Government is drawing up plans to make it mandatory for people to prove they are fully vaccinated or have tested negative the day before before entering venues. Vaccine passports could be implemented later in the year, with venues forced to comply."In autumn vaccine passports could become an important tool that will allow us to keep things open," a Downing Street source told the Times.

The comment follows reports that unvaccinated young people are believed to be behind the surge in Covid cases.

Reports show that 332,900 people contracted the virus last week - rivalling case numbers recorded in mid-October.

Cases among those aged 16-24 were more than ten times higher than those over 70."





https://www.msn.com/en-gb/health/medical/boris-johnson-set-to-announce-mandatory-covid-passports-for-pubs-claims-no10-source/ar-AALYVzz?ocid=msedgntp

Social distancing is normal for me - always has been as far as I am able in various situations.
My personal space would be is about 20 feet in every direction if I could.

A covid passport. Jeez. Whatever next.

I'm going to remain reasonably cautious, especially since now I'm working in a shop.

We have a Perspex screen and I keep the door open as much as possible, to keep the air circulating. I don't get arsey with people who come in without a mask, but if I have to come out from behind the screen to help a customer, I put my mask on. I sanitize my hands about four or five times per shift, so that's at least once every two hours.

I had my first vaccination two weeks ago, so I should have a reasonable immunity (I did get a very mild immune response, so I know that it worked). I don't think I'll go back to the old way of living until new Covid cases are miniscule and deaths are rare.

Syl wrote:

Well hopefully we wont have a third wave, though the experts have predicted we probably will.
Hospital admission rates and sadly deaths are expected to rise, so it's a gamble, but one  worth taking.
If it's left later, summer will be almost over, and relaxing everything as the flu season is about to start wouldn't be such a good idea.

My life is more or less back to normal, we have been for a short holiday, we go out to eat and drink again (thank God) and I see my friends and family again.

I will however continue to carry a mask and wear it when I feel crowded inside.

It's not the people with common sense who get it wrong but the morons who crowd into closed public spaces and think they're not going to catch it, and don't care if they spread it around.

Syl wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Dr Quill, medicine man.  

No vaccine is 100% foolproof, Quill should know that.

One in 70-million, or whatever it is, is a negligible concern. It was reported last night on MSNBC, in the US 99% of those vaccinated have remained untouched by the virus.

Original Quill wrote:

Syl wrote:



No vaccine is 100% foolproof, Quill should know that.

One in 70-million, or whatever it is, is a negligible concern.  It was reported last night on MSNBC, in the US 99% of those vaccinated have remained untouched by the virus.

The figures vary such a lot, possibly because it's early days and not enough research has been done, especially taking different ages into consideration.
Our chief medical advisor Patrick Vallance went on TV yesterday and said 60% of people presently in hospital in the UK with Covid had been double jabbed.
He later corrected himself and said he meant it was 60% of UNvaccinated people in hospital with covid....which according to him means 40% of people presently ill enough to be in hospital with the coronavirus, HAVE been vaccinated.

Very confusing.

Syl wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

One in 70-million, or whatever it is, is a negligible concern.  It was reported last night on MSNBC, in the US 99% of those vaccinated have remained untouched by the virus.

The figures vary such a lot, possibly because it's early days and not enough research has been done, especially taking different ages into consideration.
Our chief medical advisor Patrick Vallance went on TV yesterday and said 60% of people presently in hospital in the UK with Covid had been double jabbed.
He later corrected himself and said he meant it was 60% of UNvaccinated people in hospital with covid....which according to him means 40% of people presently ill enough to be in hospital with the coronavirus, HAVE been vaccinated.

Very confusing.

One in 70 million?

Check out my thread about the Texas congresspersons.

Two days since the so called FREEDOM day began here.

People are rebelling....I have seen more masks being worn than I ever did when they were mandatory.

Syl wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

One in 70-million, or whatever it is, is a negligible concern.  It was reported last night on MSNBC, in the US 99% of those vaccinated have remained untouched by the virus.

The figures vary such a lot, possibly because it's early days and not enough research has been done, especially taking different ages into consideration.
Our chief medical advisor Patrick Vallance went on TV yesterday and said 60% of people presently in hospital in the UK with Covid had been double jabbed.
He later corrected himself and said he meant it was 60% of UNvaccinated people in hospital with covid....which according to him means 40% of people presently ill enough to be in hospital with the coronavirus, HAVE been vaccinated.

Very confusing.

I think your Chief Medical Advisor is the one who is confused. Mixing vaccinated statistics with diametrically opposite, unvaccinated statistics is like saying day is night, or it's snowing in the Sahara Desert. There is a discipline called Public Health, apart from medical departments, that keeps track of these things.

I hope your man has a doctorate in public health as well as an MD degree. Otherwise, when it comes to statistics, you'd better follow our guys.

He is well respected and has been involved in the Downing st updates since the pandemic began.

No doubt he made a blunder yesterday....but the fact remains if 60% of people in hospital with covid presently  in the UK  are unvaccinated, 40% must have been vaccinated.

When they had the jabs, or whether they had recieved one or both jabs is not known.


https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-vallance-corrects-mistake-to-say-60-of-people-being-admitted-to-hospital-with-coronavirus-are-unvaccinated-12359317

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Vallance

Original Quill wrote:

Syl wrote:

The figures vary such a lot, possibly because it's early days and not enough research has been done, especially taking different ages into consideration.
Our chief medical advisor Patrick Vallance went on TV yesterday and said 60% of people presently in hospital in the UK with Covid had been double jabbed.
He later corrected himself and said he meant it was 60% of UNvaccinated people in hospital with covid....which according to him means 40% of people presently ill enough to be in hospital with the coronavirus, HAVE been vaccinated.

Very confusing.

I think your Chief Medical Advisor is the one who is confused.  Mixing vaccinated statistics with diametrically opposite, unvaccinated statistics is like saying day is night, or it's snowing in the Sahara Desert.  There is a discipline called Public Health, apart from medical departments, that keeps track of these things.

I hope your man has a doctorate in public health as well as an MD degree.  Otherwise, when it comes to statistics, you'd better follow our guys.

I think you’re somewhat wide of the mark when you question Witty’s qualifications. He is a former consultant and physician at both the University College of London Hospital and the Hospital for tropical diseases, Professor of Physic at Gresham College (that chair has existed for almost five and a half centuries - about the time when your doctors were reading entrails, rattling bones and sacrificing God knows what to a totem pole!) and worked as a physician and researcher into tropical diseases in Africa and Asia was well as the U.K.

Add to that Fellowships of the Royal College of Physicians, Faculty of Public Health and the Academy of Medical Sciences and I think we can say that he’s as well qualified as any of “your guys” in his field.

His biggest problem is that his job involves leading a number of different government departments covering public health and infectious diseases and he has to provide up to the minute updates - live on camera - on the current situation in most of them. He’s sometimes accompanied by a senior colleague - and frequently has our, er, somewhat unorthodox and utterly unpredictable Prime Minister breathing down his neck - so he may well be excused dropping the occasional goolie.

My main complaint about his performance is that he will insist on delivering every diatribe almost in a monotone (auto cues can be a bugger to use sometimes - I know) and, worst of all, he constantly has the facial expression of an undertaker who has just learned of the invention of the immortality pill.

Sorry, I cited the wrong bloke in the above post….I saw the title Chief Medical Adviser (or advisor if you prefer) in Quill’s post to which I was replying,and assumed the discussion was about Chris Witty, who is the current U.K. Chief Medical Adviser.

Valance who is (named in Syl’s link to Wiki) isn’t Chief Medical Adviser though…..he’s Chief Scientific Adviser.

Fred Moletrousers wrote:Sorry, I cited the wrong bloke in the above post….I saw the title Chief Medical Adviser (or advisor if you prefer) in Quill’s post to which I was replying,and assumed the discussion was about Chris Witty, who is the current U.K. Chief Medical Adviser.

Valance who is (named in Syl’s link to Wiki) isn’t Chief Medical Adviser though…..he’s Chief Scientific Adviser.

Yes sorry for any confusion....I meant to write Scientific, not sure why my fingers typed Medical.

HoratioTarr wrote:

I saw her piece on the news...brilliant point. The pandemic is now a pandemic among those who are unvaccinated. It's like telling a person dying of lung cancer...stop smoking! That ship has already sailed.

Los Angeles County, the largest county in the US, has gone back to mandating masks. Given the fight is over there with the unvaccinated, I question the wisdom of going back to universal mask-wearing.

The message it sends is that the vaccines don't work, so don't bother getting vaccinated; seek other protections. If we convince people that the vaccines don't protect, they'll follow Republican's advice and inject Clorox into veins.

Things are not going so well  here again.
The  number of people being infected with Covid is as high now as is it was when the pandemic started.
Hospital admissions are creeping up again, as are deaths.