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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:41 am

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Mon Jan 04, 2021 6:36 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

So let's just give everyone 50K and make sure.

Bad mistakes require drastic remedial measures.  That's one of the downsides of a president not knowing what s/he is doing.  Republicans have chosen this ideological devotion to one psychotic individual, and he has chosen to follow the theology of his cult rather than real science.

You, yourself, have said you are devotee to this religion.  You have said you follow Libertarianism, the philosophy that 'political leaders do nothing, and the divine hand will take care of all'.  So Trump, despite dire warnings, did nothing, adopting a sub-philosophy of doing nothing, and relying on herd immunity, and thereby committed the genocide of (so far) over a third of a million citizens (speaking only of the US).



Now we are living out the nightmare.  People must wear masks, cannot go out, cannot go to work lest they risk dying, and as a result the economy suffers, and we lose $$-trillions.

$2,000/per citizen pales in comparison to the $$-trillions that Trump and the Republicans have already cost us.  We are at the point that there is nothing else to be done.  The question is: can we afford not to?

So why not 50K?

_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:04 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Bad mistakes require drastic remedial measures.  That's one of the downsides of a president not knowing what s/he is doing.  Republicans have chosen this ideological devotion to one psychotic individual, and he has chosen to follow the theology of his cult rather than real science.

You, yourself, have said you are devotee to this religion.  You have said you follow Libertarianism, the philosophy that 'political leaders do nothing, and the divine hand will take care of all'.  So Trump, despite dire warnings, did nothing, adopting a sub-philosophy of doing nothing, and relying on herd immunity, and thereby committed the genocide of (so far) over a third of a million citizens (speaking only of the US).



Now we are living out the nightmare.  People must wear masks, cannot go out, cannot go to work lest they risk dying, and as a result the economy suffers, and we lose $$-trillions.

$2,000/per citizen pales in comparison to the $$-trillions that Trump and the Republicans have already cost us.  We are at the point that there is nothing else to be done.  The question is: can we afford not to?

So why not 50K?

Entirely conceivable. It depends on the loss to the worldwide economy that the Republican blunders will cost:

The Guardian wrote:The International Monetary Fund has scaled back its estimate of the hit to the global economy from Covid-19 this year but warned that the final bill for the pandemic would total $28-trillion (£21.5-trillion) in lost output.

Gita Gopinath, the IMF’s economic counsellor, described coronavirus as the worst crisis since the Great Depression, and said the pandemic would leave deep and enduring scars caused by job losses, weaker investment and children being deprived of education.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/oct/13/imf-covid-cost-world-economic-outlook

The assistance to individuals today to bridge the economic gap may be large today, but may end up being negligible compared to the cost of another Great Depression.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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Post by Maddog Tue Jan 05, 2021 12:16 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

So why not 50K?

Entirely conceivable.  It depends on the loss to the worldwide economy that the Republican blunders will cost:

The Guardian wrote:The International Monetary Fund has scaled back its estimate of the hit to the global economy from Covid-19 this year but warned that the final bill for the pandemic would total $28-trillion (£21.5-trillion) in lost output.

Gita Gopinath, the IMF’s economic counsellor, described coronavirus as the worst crisis since the Great Depression, and said the pandemic would leave deep and enduring scars caused by job losses, weaker investment and children being deprived of education.

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/oct/13/imf-covid-cost-world-economic-outlook

The assistance to individuals today to bridge the economic gap may be large today, but may end up being negligible compared to the cost of another Great Depression.

Let's try again.

Why not 50K?

_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue Jan 05, 2021 3:33 am

I didn't say 'No'. Wink

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

Original Quill
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Post by Maddog Tue May 17, 2022 5:55 am

Remember printing all of that money for this bullshit?

How are things now that people are spending thousands more a year for the same items?

Nobody from either party was worried about the long term problems.

Just playing fucking Santa Claus.


_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
Maddog
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue May 17, 2022 4:31 pm

It was money well-spent. Better to put food on the American table, than build a wall on the southern border, urged by Republicans. How much was that to cost?

Texas Tribune wrote:Within a year of the initial award, the value of the two contracts had more than tripled, to over $3 billion, even though the length of the fence the companies were building had only grown by 62%, to 135 miles.

****
The cost of supplemental agreements and change orders alone — at least $2.9 billion — represents about a quarter of all the money awarded and more than what Congress originally appropriated for wall construction in each of the last three years.

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/10/27/border-wall-texas-cost-rising-trump/

Or, a tax-cut for the already rich:

The Balance wrote:In 2017, President Donald Trump signed the 2017 Tax Cut and Jobs Act (TCJA) into law. Proponents of the law promised that it would add $1.8 trillion in new revenue. That would more than pay for the $1.5 trillion cost of the tax cuts themselves, according to an analysis by the U.S. Department of Treasury.

[however...]

... analyses have also shown...the overall effects have largely benefited corporations and wealthy Americans more than middle-class and low-wage workers. The corporate tax cuts, in particular, failed to translate to the promised wage and economic growth.

https://www.thebalance.com/cost-of-trump-tax-cuts-4586645

So much for tightening-the-belt.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

Original Quill
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Posts : 37540
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Post by Maddog Tue May 17, 2022 5:16 pm

Original Quill wrote:It was money well-spent.  Better to put food on the American table, than build a wall on the southern border, urged by Republicans.  How much was that to cost?

Texas Tribune wrote:Within a year of the initial award, the value of the two contracts had more than tripled, to over $3 billion, even though the length of the fence the companies were building had only grown by 62%, to 135 miles.

****
The cost of supplemental agreements and change orders alone — at least $2.9 billion — represents about a quarter of all the money awarded and more than what Congress originally appropriated for wall construction in each of the last three years.

https://www.texastribune.org/2020/10/27/border-wall-texas-cost-rising-trump/

Or, a tax-cut for the already rich:

The Balance wrote:In 2017, President Donald Trump signed the 2017 Tax Cut and Jobs Act (TCJA) into law. Proponents of the law promised that it would add $1.8 trillion in new revenue. That would more than pay for the $1.5 trillion cost of the tax cuts themselves, according to an analysis by the U.S. Department of Treasury.

[however...]

... analyses have also shown...the overall effects have largely benefited corporations and wealthy Americans more than middle-class and low-wage workers. The corporate tax cuts, in particular, failed to translate to the promised wage and economic growth.

https://www.thebalance.com/cost-of-trump-tax-cuts-4586645

So much for tightening-the-belt.


Well, Quill thinks record inflation is helpful.

No surprise there..

_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
Maddog
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue May 17, 2022 9:14 pm

Well, I certainly don't think tax-cuts for the rich and a useless wall are a substitute for inflation.

The current inflation has nothing to do with monetary policy, and everything to do with a singularly overwhelming devastation to both our health, and our healthy economy.  If you eliminate producers from the process of production, values of existing product are going to soar.  What part of that do you not understand?

That is the condition in which Covid has left us.  My comment is that it has also done some permanent damage to the structure of our production machinery.  Real and vital industries - like child care - have sustained losses from which we will never recover, without government assistance.

Compare this part of our economy to a worn-out footbridge, important to trade, that is suspended over a deep ravine and is held together by threads.  Nonetheless, people still depend on it on a daily basis.  Then along comes a humongous storm and knocks the bridge out!  Do we modernize the bridge, or just find another route?  If we don't replace it, it will set the economy back by leaps and bounds.

You either recognize the dilemma, and fix it, or you bang on about government spending...and suffer the loss permanently.  I think you recognize yourself in that picture.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

Original Quill
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue May 17, 2022 11:10 pm

Original Quill wrote:Well, I certainly don't think tax-cuts for the rich and a useless wall are a substitute for inflation.

The current inflation has nothing to do with monetary policy, and everything to do with a singularly overwhelming devastation to both our health, and our healthy economy.  If you eliminate producers from the process of production, values of existing product are going to soar.  What part of that do you not understand?

That is the condition in which Covid has left us.  My comment is that it has also done some permanent damage to the structure of our production machinery.  Real and vital industries - like child care - have sustained losses from which we will never recover, without government assistance.

Compare this part of our economy to a worn-out footbridge, important to trade, that is suspended over a deep ravine and is held together by threads.  Nonetheless, people still depend on it on a daily basis.  Then along comes a humongous storm and knocks the bridge out!  Do we modernize the bridge, or just find another route?  If we don't replace it, it will set the economy back by leaps and bounds.

You either recognize the dilemma, and fix it, or you bang on about government spending...and suffer the loss permanently.  I think you recognize yourself in that picture.


This is why you need to read what economists are saying..

_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
Maddog
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Wed May 18, 2022 5:18 pm

Maddog wrote:This is why you need to read what economists are saying..

Are you suggesting that you are plugged-in??  You haven't had an original thought throughout this exchange - it's all, he said/she said/they said, whatever 'easy language' passages you can find in someone else's writings.  You're entire underlying thesis is based upon the similarity (but not quite) of your defunct philosophy, to Republican reactionism.

Conservatives had already run the economy into the ground in 2009, and we were facing the second Great Depression. We had to bail you out then. When Trump came along we warned you again - and the nation - that he was not prepared for this.  But noooo...you loved the memes and white-supremacy so much that you elected him president.  Almost immediately, he disassembled the Pandemic Response Team as too wasteful, and then proceeded to build a border wall to nowhere.  Republicans dithered and twiddled their thumbs, while a virus was taking over.

Now, we are dealing with the aftermath - and your excuses for a miserable, ill-considered delay/neglect.  Monetary Policy indeed!  We can see a deflection when one is being played.  A camel can come up with better dung than that!

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

Original Quill
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Posts : 37540
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Thu May 19, 2022 5:08 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:This is why you need to read what economists are saying..

Are you suggesting that you are plugged-in??  You haven't had an original thought throughout this exchange - it's all, he said/she said/they said, whatever 'easy language' passages you can find in someone else's writings.  You're entire underlying thesis is based upon the similarity (but not quite) of your defunct philosophy, to Republican reactionism.

Conservatives had already run the economy into the ground in 2009, and we were facing the second Great Depression.  We had to bail you out then.  When Trump came along we warned you again - and the nation - that he was not prepared for this.  But noooo...you loved the memes and white-supremacy so much that you elected him president.  Almost immediately, he disassembled the Pandemic Response Team as too wasteful, and then proceeded to build a border wall to nowhere.  Republicans dithered and twiddled their thumbs, while a virus was taking over.

Now, we are dealing with the aftermath - and your excuses for a miserable, ill-considered delay/neglect.  Monetary Policy indeed!  We can see a deflection when one is being played.  A camel can come up with better dung than that!

I'm saying you should inform yourself.

I doubt that's going to happen..

You're too full of yourself to listen to experts in any field.

_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
Maddog
The newsfix Queen

Posts : 12526
Join date : 2017-09-23
Location : Texas

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Thu May 19, 2022 7:48 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Are you suggesting that you are plugged-in??  You haven't had an original thought throughout this exchange - it's all, he said/she said/they said, whatever 'easy language' passages you can find in someone else's writings.  You're entire underlying thesis is based upon the similarity (but not quite) of your defunct philosophy, to Republican reactionism.

Conservatives had already run the economy into the ground in 2009, and we were facing the second Great Depression.  We had to bail you out then.  When Trump came along we warned you again - and the nation - that he was not prepared for this.  But noooo...you loved the memes and white-supremacy so much that you elected him president.  Almost immediately, he disassembled the Pandemic Response Team as too wasteful, and then proceeded to build a border wall to nowhere.  Republicans dithered and twiddled their thumbs, while a virus was taking over.

Now, we are dealing with the aftermath - and your excuses for a miserable, ill-considered delay/neglect.  Monetary Policy indeed!  We can see a deflection when one is being played.  A camel can come up with better dung than that!

I'm saying you should inform yourself.  

I doubt that's going to happen..

You're too full of yourself to listen to experts in any field.

And you're too full of sheit to understand. You're competitive, but you haven't got the brains that god gave a little green apple. You don't have original thinking, consequently you just ride along on other peoples' ideas.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Fri May 20, 2022 12:55 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

I'm saying you should inform yourself.  

I doubt that's going to happen..

You're too full of yourself to listen to experts in any field.

And you're too full of sheit to understand.  You're competitive, but you haven't got the brains that god gave a little green apple.  You don't have original thinking, consequently you just ride along on other peoples' ideas.

Rolling Eyes

_________________
pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
Maddog
Maddog
The newsfix Queen

Posts : 12526
Join date : 2017-09-23
Location : Texas

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   - Page 2 Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Fri May 20, 2022 9:17 pm

Twisted Evil

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

Original Quill
Forum Detective ????‍♀️

Posts : 37540
Join date : 2013-12-19
Age : 57
Location : Northern California

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