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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:41 am

US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Bs10
US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Bs110
US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Bs210

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:43 am

US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Bs310



They think the American voters are stupid.

They are correct. The American voters are stupid, and will line up in 2 years and vote for many of the people that supported this bullshit, because that's what stupid people do. They do the same thing over and over and expect different results.

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:44 am

Oh wait, there's more. The Dems and Reps joined forces and fucked us over good.

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:46 am

Well, the 5,593 page behemoth has finally been released to the public, as well as to the curious legislators who are supposed to vote on it. Just printing this monstrosity was a nearly fatal task: The file containing it was so unwieldy that it kept crashing Congress's computers.

The main thrust of the bill is to provide $600 per person to people below a certain income threshold and to expand the Paycheck Protection Program for various businesses. But that's not all—not by a long shot.

For instance, the bill also instructs the Smithsonian Institution to create two new identity-based museums: one for women, and one for Latinos. (The legislation refrains from using the phrase "Latinx.") The bill also takes a position on the reincarnation of the Dalai Lama, expressing that in the view of the U.S. government, "the wishes of the 14th Dalai Lama, including any written instructions, should play a key role in the selection, education, and veneration of a future Dalai Lama." The bill includes a provision prohibiting any federal funds from being used by the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now (ACORN), an activist group that no longer exists in the United States. It attempts to normalize U.S. foreign relations with Sudan, criminalizes illegal streaming, and creates a plan for building a Theodore Roosevelt presidential library in North Dakota.

https://reason.com/2020/12/21/new-covid-19-relief-bill-museum-dalai-lama-amash-aoc/?fbclid=IwAR2LS2uGTrsYuGOUHmS3sVig970kjNJz_gzsKe-FbaGEg2a2qJsrsYlu730

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:48 am

https://twitter.com/AOC/status/1341083488594882561?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1341083488594882561%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Freason.com%2F2020%2F12%2F21%2Fnew-covid-19-relief-bill-museum-dalai-lama-amash-aoc%2F

Even AOC would like the chance to read a 6000 page bill before she votes on it.

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 1:49 am

https://twitter.com/justinamash/status/1341096266428784644?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1341096266428784644%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Freason.com%2F2020%2F12%2F21%2Fnew-covid-19-relief-bill-museum-dalai-lama-amash-aoc%2F

And Amash.

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:03 am

Maddog wrote:They are correct. The American voters are stupid, and will line up in 2 years and vote for many of the people that supported this bullshit, because that's what stupid people do. They do the same thing over and over and expect different results.

What is wrong with the Bill? It is a much-needed relief measure, designed to overcome a catastrophic emergency that befalls our nation.

If you want me to go further, it is recovery from action taken by Republicans to commit genocide, in a misguided effort to achieve herd immunity from Covid-19. Talk about social thinking. This is what you get with careless anti-government freaks who stand back and let catastrophes ravage our land. Government is supposed to exist to protect citizens, not sacrifice them. Only capitalists would tolerate dead people, because they don’t give a shit about anyone but themselves.

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“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:25 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:They are correct. The American voters are stupid, and will line up in 2 years and vote for many of the people that supported this bullshit, because that's what stupid people do. They do the same thing over and over and expect different results.

What is wrong with the Bill?  It is a much-needed relief measure, designed to overcome a catastrophic emergency that befalls our nation.

If you want me to go further, it is recovery from action taken by Republicans to commit genocide, in a misguided effort to achieve herd immunity from Covid-19.  Talk about social thinking.  This is what you get with careless anti-government freaks who stand back and let catastrophes ravage our land.  Government is supposed to exist to protect citizens, not sacrifice them.  Only capitalists would tolerate dead people, because they don’t give a shit about anyone but themselves.

Go back and look where much of the 2.5 trillion that was voted on today is going.

Don't comment on posts that you haven't read.

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:29 pm

Maddog wrote:Go back and look where much of the 2.5 trillion that was voted on today is going.

We all know very well where the money is going.  The concern is not where it is going, but where it should have gone...and so much more.  This is an exercise in lost and late...Republicans, not paying attention, doing the only thing they can do: throw money at it!

Republicans were either too stupid or too cowardly to do what should have been done...lock down the place and take physical measures to contain the spread…from the top down.  The virus doesn't care; it says, you want to be stupid (?), there will be more for me.  And sure enough, the Republicans were too cowardly to lock down the place, and too stupid to figure it out.

So, the inevitable happened...the place became a hotbed for the covid-19 virus.  Democrats in the House reacted as they should have: don't let the bio-crisis become an economic crisis…get relief out there!  But Moscow Mitch, Republican leader of the Senate, refused to introduce the bill in the upper chamber, choosing to dither and delay until things got so bad that they could not be denied.  So, now we've got the pandemic, and the second Great Depression…all at once.

Once again, we see that, while Democrats seek practical solutions, Republicans seek selfish interests.  If the Japanese had just bombed Pearl Harbor again, we'd know how to handle it.  But, because the enemy is elusive, and "scientific" (ie, requires some thinking) Republicans are at a complete loss.

Next time Americans have to vote, keep this lesson in mind.


Last edited by Original Quill on Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:33 pm; edited 1 time in total

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“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:32 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:Go back and look where much of the 2.5 trillion that was voted on today is going.

We all know very well where the money is going.  The concern is not where it is going, but where it should have gone...and so much more.  This is Republicans, doing the only thing they can do: throw money at it!

Republicans were either too stupid or too cowardly to do what should have been done...lock down the place and take physical measures to contain the spread…from the top down.  The virus doesn't care; it says, you want to be stupid (?), there will be more for me.  And sure enough, the Republicans were too cowardly to lock down the place, and too stupid to figure it out.

So, the inevitable happened...the place became a hotbed for the covid-19 virus.  Democrats in the House reacted as they should have: don't let the bio-crisis become an economic crisis…get relief out there!  But Moscow Mitch, Republican leader of the Senate, refused to introduce the bill in the upper chamber, choosing to dither and delay until things got so bad that they could not be denied.  So, now we've got the pandemic, and the second Great Depression…all at once.

Once again, we see that, while Democrats seek practical solutions, Republicans seek selfish interests.  If the Japanese had just bombed Pearl Harbor again, we'd know how to handle it.  But, because the enemy is elusive, and "scientific" (ie, requires some thinking) Republicans are at a complete loss.

Next time Americans have to vote, keep this lesson in mind.

How much more should the Sudan received?

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Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:55 pm

What about Venezuela. Yesterday, congress appropriated 33 million for democracy projects there.

Too much or too little?

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Post by Original Quill Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:04 pm

Maddog wrote:What about Venezuela. Yesterday, congress appropriated 33 million for democracy projects there.

Too much or too little?

Not the same thing. Congress approved the more than $2 trillion legislation in votes that coupled the pandemic relief bill with the general spending bill.

Congressional leaders attached the $900 billion pandemic aid to a $1.4 trillion measure to fund the entire government through Sept. 30:

Politico wrote:The bipartisan, bicameral year-end package also includes a dozen annual appropriations bills that, if passed, would ward off a government funding fight at the onset of the Biden administration.

As the pandemic relief bill comes at year end, Congress just piggy-backed it on the general appropriations bill. You are cherry-picking items of the general operating budget, and attributing them to the pandemic relief bill because they are paired together. That's a bit dishonest in my opinion.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:09 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:What about Venezuela. Yesterday, congress appropriated 33 million for democracy projects there.

Too much or too little?

Not the same thing.  Congress approved the more than $2 trillion legislation in votes that coupled the pandemic relief bill with the general spending bill.

Congressional leaders attached the $900 billion pandemic aid to a $1.4 trillion measure to fund the entire government through Sept. 30:

Politico wrote:The bipartisan, bicameral year-end package also includes a dozen annual appropriations bills that, if passed, would ward off a government funding fight at the onset of the Biden administration.

As the pandemic relief bill comes at year end, Congress just piggy-backed it on the general appropriations bill.  You are cherry-picking items of the general operating budget, and attributing them to the pandemic relief bill because they are paired together.  That's a bit dishonest in my opinion.

I know how it works. It was one vote that will be funded by more debt on US citizens.

It was irresponsible as fuck and both parties supported it.

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Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:12 pm

Democratic Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez of New York described the voting process on the new legislation that contained the COVID-19 relief funding as "hostage-taking" after lawmakers were given only a few hours to read 5,593 pages of text.


When she gets it, it's plain as fucking day.

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Post by Maddog Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:13 pm

I’ve spent ten years warning about the erosion of representative democracy resulting from increasingly centralized power, but even I didn’t imagine a Congress that would be handed a 5,593-page bill at 1:46 p.m., vote on it at 7:35 p.m., and then brag about the good job they did.

They passed 5,593 pages they didn’t read. America, stop letting this happen. Don’t vote for anyone who voted for this. It’s not okay. Representative government is important. Too many people have come to accept oligarchy. This doesn’t end well.




Of course Justin always gets it.

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:28 pm

Maddog wrote:I know how it works. It was one vote that will be funded by more debt on US citizens.

It was irresponsible as fuck and both parties supported it.

So, stop the chicanery. Stop identifying the appropriated items on the general budget, with the pandemic relief bill. They are apples and oranges.

This sort of duplicity is very Republican. It is typical of the kind of perfidy they do. They do this to avoid the reality that they do not serve the interests of the disenfranchised voter. Tory/Republicans represent special interests; only Labour/Liberal/Democrats represent the general interests of all.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:59 pm

Maddog wrote:I’ve spent ten years warning about the erosion of representative democracy resulting from increasingly centralized power, but even I didn’t imagine a Congress that would be handed a 5,593-page bill at 1:46 p.m., vote on it at 7:35 p.m., and then brag about the good job they did.

What, exactly, do you think "representative democracy" is? Is it, as Hobbes believed, a rubber stamp authorizing a permanent king or emperor? Is it a group of distant actors, that return to the voters every 4 - 6 years to receive an accounting? Or is it to be a carbon copy of the voter’s mind, in which case why don’t the voters show up and express themselves? See, Pitkin, Hanna, The Concept of Representation (1972).

As the issues become more complex, and as the nation grows in scope in size, it takes pages of consideration. Fifty-six hundred pages is nothing. On general appropriations, the representatives have months and years to learn and prepare. On special matters, such as the Covid pandemic, they have an obligation to dig in and find out what needs the people have.

There is no erosion of “representative democracy”. It’s just that some folks are too busy lining their own nests to oversee the peoples’ business. They live by distractions—like OMG, the job is too great, let’s just cut back on everything!!—and concentrate on accumulating for themselves.

We just need a better sort of representative in government...not Tories or Republicans.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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Post by Maddog Wed Dec 23, 2020 12:28 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:I know how it works. It was one vote that will be funded by more debt on US citizens.

It was irresponsible as fuck and both parties supported it.

So, stop the chicanery.  Stop identifying the appropriated items on the general budget, with the pandemic relief bill.  They are apples and oranges.

This sort of duplicity is very Republican.  It is typical of the kind of perfidy they do.  They do this to avoid the reality that they do not serve the interests of the disenfranchised voter.  Tory/Republicans represent special interests; only Labour/Liberal/Democrats represent the general interests of all.

Were they all part of one package?

A simple yes or no will suffice. I have no need for paragraphs of bullshit.

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Post by Maddog Wed Dec 23, 2020 12:30 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:I’ve spent ten years warning about the erosion of representative democracy resulting from increasingly centralized power, but even I didn’t imagine a Congress that would be handed a 5,593-page bill at 1:46 p.m., vote on it at 7:35 p.m., and then brag about the good job they did.

What, exactly, do you think "representative democracy" is?  Is it, as Hobbes believed, a rubber stamp authorizing a permanent king or emperor?  Is it a group of distant actors, that return to the voters every 4 - 6 years to receive an accounting?  Or is it to be a carbon copy of the voter’s mind, in which case why don’t the voters show up and express themselves?  See, Pitkin, Hanna, The Concept of Representation (1972).

As the issues become more complex, and as the nation grows in scope in size, it takes pages of consideration.  Fifty-six hundred pages is nothing.  On general appropriations, the representatives have months and years to learn and prepare.  On special matters, such as the Covid pandemic, they have an obligation to dig in and find out what needs the people have.

There is no erosion of “representative democracy”.  It’s just that some folks are too busy lining their own nests to oversee the peoples’ business.  They live by distractions—like OMG, the job is too great, let’s just cut back on everything!!—and concentrate on accumulating for themselves.

We just need a better sort of representative in government...not Tories or Republicans.

Why did AOC call it hostage taking?

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Post by Original Quill Wed Dec 23, 2020 4:10 am

Maddog wrote:A simple yes or no will suffice. I have no need for paragraphs of bullshit.

Can't handle complex subjects, eh?  Let's start here: 1 + 1=2; 2 + 2=4; etc.  Use your fingers if you have any difficulty.   Rolling Eyes

Maddog wrote:Why did AOC call it hostage taking?

I would speculate she wanted a bigger $$ package in the bill.  The package they voted on was one-half the one last Spring.  It sounds as if she was expressing her disfavor.  Bernie Sanders didn't like it, either.  None of the lefty legislators did...they wanted a duplicate of the last bill. It was a compromise.

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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Post by Maddog Wed Dec 23, 2020 2:42 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:A simple yes or no will suffice. I have no need for paragraphs of bullshit.

Can't handle complex subjects, eh?  Let's start here: 1 + 1=2; 2 + 2=4; etc.  Use your fingers if you have any difficulty.   Rolling Eyes

Maddog wrote:Why did AOC call it hostage taking?

I would speculate she wanted a bigger $$ package in the bill.  The package they voted on was one-half the one last Spring.  It sounds as if she was expressing her disfavor.  Bernie Sanders didn't like it, either.  None of the lefty legislators did...they wanted a duplicate of the last bill.  It was a compromise.

She explains why she called it that. I even posted fucking links.

Per as usual you are too busy blabbering to take the time to inform yourself.

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Post by Original Quill Wed Dec 23, 2020 3:43 pm

Maddog wrote:Per as usual you are too busy blabbering to take the time to inform yourself.

It's not about me, farm boy.  Pay attention.

Have you heard the news overnight that Trump will not sign the bill into law?  He claims to want to see the direct payment to people increased from $600 to $2,000.

However, watch what he does, not what he says.  There is no line-item veto.  Right now, by holding up the entire bill nothing gets done.  Not only the relief bill, but the entire government shuts down.  He can say he's doing it for benevolent reasons, but in actual fact he is terminating everything.

A boy after your own heart, bucko…put more in the rich guy’s pockets while bullshitting the people into believing you're "representing" them.

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"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

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Post by Maddog Wed Dec 23, 2020 7:16 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:Per as usual you are too busy blabbering to take the time to inform yourself.

It's not about me, farm boy.  Pay attention.

Have you heard the news overnight that Trump will not sign the bill into law?  He claims to want to see the direct payment to people increased from $600 to $2,000.

However, watch what he does, not what he says.  There is no line-item veto.  Right now, by holding up the entire bill nothing gets done.  Not only the relief bill, but the entire government shuts down.  He can say he's doing it for benevolent reasons, but in actual fact he is terminating everything.

A boy after your own heart, bucko…put more in the rich guy’s pockets while bullshitting the people into believing you're "representing" them.

Yup. He wants more money. Like AOC.

Weird.

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Post by Original Quill Wed Dec 23, 2020 7:44 pm

Maddog wrote:Yup. He wants more money. Like AOC.  

Weird.  

Not weird at all…it’s elementary.  It's not more money he wants.  He wants to stop the flow of funds in and through the government of the USA.

He’s using “more money for relief" as a diversion…all the more perfect because it puts him in a liberal bed.  The only way now to fund the government is for the Senate to override his veto by a two-thirds majority, which they won't do.  He's punting the entire US government over to Biden and Moscow Mitch.

He’s getting back at America for voting him out of office.  Putin is proud of his protégé.

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"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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Post by Maddog Wed Dec 23, 2020 8:03 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:Yup. He wants more money. Like AOC.  

Weird.  

Not weird at all…it’s elementary.  It's not more money he wants.  He wants to stop the flow of funds in and through the government of the USA.  He’s using “more money for relief" as a diversion…all the more perfect because it puts him in a liberal bed.  The only way now to fund the government is for the Senate to override his veto by a two-thirds majority, which they won't do.  He's punting the entire US government over to Biden and Moscow Mitch.

He’s getting back at America for voting him out of office.  Putin is proud of his protégé.

The problem isn't the Senate. They voted 92-6 in favor.

The House was much closer.

"Glad to see the President is willing to support our legislation,” Ocasio-Cortez said in a tweet on Tuesday evening. “We can pass $2k checks this week if the Senate GOP agrees to stand down.”


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Post by Original Quill Wed Dec 23, 2020 9:05 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Not weird at all…it’s elementary.  It's not more money he wants.  He wants to stop the flow of funds in and through the government of the USA.  He’s using “more money for relief" as a diversion…all the more perfect because it puts him in a liberal bed.  The only way now to fund the government is for the Senate to override his veto by a two-thirds majority, which they won't do.  He's punting the entire US government over to Biden and Moscow Mitch.

He’s getting back at America for voting him out of office.  Putin is proud of his protégé.

The problem isn't the Senate. They voted 92-6 in favor.  

The House was much closer.  

"Glad to see the President is willing to support our legislation,” Ocasio-Cortez said in a tweet on Tuesday evening. “We can pass $2k checks this week if the Senate GOP agrees to stand down.”

But the Senate will not vote to increase to $2,000, which Trump says he wants. It's setting up an impasse.

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"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

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Post by Maddog Wed Dec 23, 2020 9:19 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

The problem isn't the Senate. They voted 92-6 in favor.  

The House was much closer.  

"Glad to see the President is willing to support our legislation,” Ocasio-Cortez said in a tweet on Tuesday evening. “We can pass $2k checks this week if the Senate GOP agrees to stand down.”

But the Senate will not vote to increase to $2,000, which Trump says he wants.  It's setting up an impasse.

We are talking about over riding the veto of the original bill, not voting on a new one.

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Post by Original Quill Wed Dec 23, 2020 10:18 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

But the Senate will not vote to increase to $2,000, which Trump says he wants.  It's setting up an impasse.

We are talking about over riding the veto of the original bill, not voting on a new one.  

Yeah but, it was 92-6 when the Senate Republicans thought Trump was going along with the bill.  Now, it's calling for Republicans to say fook-off to Trump by overriding his veto.

So, he's left them between a rock and a hard place: either go along with Trump, fook Moscow Mitch, and vote in a $2,000 allowance; or, override the veto and thumb noses at Trump.

Can't wait to see those tweets.  Twisted Evil

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Post by Maddog Thu Dec 24, 2020 12:32 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

We are talking about over riding the veto of the original bill, not voting on a new one.  

Yeah but, it was 92-6 when the Senate Republicans thought Trump was going along with the bill.  Now, it's calling for Republicans to say fook-off to Trump by overriding his veto.

So, he's left them between a rock and a hard place: either go along with Trump, fook Moscow Mitch, and vote in a $2,000 allowance; or, override the veto and thumb noses at Trump.

Can't wait to see those tweets.  Twisted Evil

The Republicans in the Senate are not too worried about the orange fool anymore. He's a nobody at this point. It's the Dems who could bolt hoping for bigger checks. Remember, the Dems and Trump are on the same page here. Birds of a feather eh?

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Post by Original Quill Thu Dec 24, 2020 3:36 am

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Yeah but, it was 92-6 when the Senate Republicans thought Trump was going along with the bill.  Now, it's calling for Republicans to say fook-off to Trump by overriding his veto.

So, he's left them between a rock and a hard place: either go along with Trump, fook Moscow Mitch, and vote in a $2,000 allowance; or, override the veto and thumb noses at Trump.

Can't wait to see those tweets.  Twisted Evil

The Republicans in the Senate are not too worried about the orange fool anymore.  He's a nobody at this point.  It's the Dems who could bolt hoping for bigger checks.  Remember, the Dems and Trump are on the same page here.  Birds of a feather eh?

Republicans are scared shitless of Trump, afraid he'll primary them with his RW cult.  He’s a leading figure in the Republican Party, and he still has power as he is still the president.  Trump is pissed because Moscow Mitch called the election for Biden, and Trump wants to pretend he won a bit longer.  He is retaliating by showing their word is useless.

Trump is playing the Republicans on the budget.  He even sat in on negotiations via Steve Mnuchin, Secretary of Treasury, and he (Mnuchin) agreed to the final settlement.  Now, Trump pulls the rug out from under the Republicans by saying he won’t sign the bill.  What they resisted so strongly from Democrats, Trump want’s more than three times as much.  To the public, Republicans cannot get their act together.  This impasse makes Republicans look like they cannot be trusted.

We’ll see.  If Trump shuts down the government, it’s all on the him and the Senate Republicans because of the dissention between them.  So, it’s no sweat off the Democratic ass.  This is between Republicans and Republicans, and it is only making them look worse than before, when they merely mishandled the pandemic.

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Post by Maddog Thu Dec 24, 2020 4:53 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

The Republicans in the Senate are not too worried about the orange fool anymore.  He's a nobody at this point.  It's the Dems who could bolt hoping for bigger checks.  Remember, the Dems and Trump are on the same page here.  Birds of a feather eh?

Republicans are scared shitless of Trump, afraid he'll primary them with his RW cult.  He’s a leading figure in the Republican Party, and he still has power as he is still the president.  Trump is pissed because Moscow Mitch called the election for Biden, and Trump wants to pretend he won a bit longer.  He is retaliating by showing their word is useless.

Trump is playing the Republicans on the budget.  He even sat in on negotiations via Steve Mnuchin, Secretary of Treasury, and he (Mnuchin) agreed to the final settlement.  Now, Trump pulls the rug out from under the Republicans by saying he won’t sign the bill.  What they resisted so strongly from Democrats, Trump want’s more than three times as much.  To the public, Republicans cannot get their act together.  This impasse makes Republicans look like they cannot be trusted.

We’ll see.  If Trump shuts down the government, it’s all on the him and the Senate Republicans because of the dissention between them.  So, it’s no sweat off the Democratic ass.  This is between Republicans and Republicans, and it is only making them look worse than before, when they merely mishandled the pandemic.

Here's a little Newsflash. Trump lost.

Let's see how many Dems join the Pelosi-Trump alliance on this bill.

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Post by Original Quill Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:49 pm

Maddog wrote:Let's see how many Dems join the Pelosi-Trump alliance on this bill.

You miss the point.  There is no alliance.  The question is not to the Democrats at all...they are doing exactly as promised: pulling for their side, seizing opportunities as they come along. But no one is in league with Trump...except Republicans.

The maneuver is designed to show the world how fooked-up the Republicans are.  Trump is embarrassing Republicans, as retaliation for not backing his attempt to overthrow the election.  

Trump is revealing to the world: Republicans take one step forward, but two steps backward.  They zing and they zang.  They are flip-floppers...can't make up their minds.  They haven't got their act together.

Democrats are on-lookers just like the rest of the world.  Basketball

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Post by Maddog Thu Dec 24, 2020 6:55 pm

It appears the Dem-Trump alliance was just shot down by the Republicans.

Crazy old world.


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Post by Original Quill Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:40 pm

Maddog wrote:It appears the Dem-Trump alliance was just shot down by the Republicans.

Crazy old world.

Ho-hum. Sleep

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Post by eddie Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:20 pm

Didn’t Trump try to make this $2000? Good on him.

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Post by Ben Reilly Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:37 pm

He did, and that's one of the few things I've ever agreed with him. He also created a situation where he forced Republican Senators to vote against him, possibly ending their careers.

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Post by eddie Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:53 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:He did, and that's one of the few things I've ever agreed with him. He also created a situation where he forced Republican Senators to vote against him, possibly ending their careers.

Better late than never, I guess. Rolling Eyes

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Post by Ben Reilly Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:20 pm

It's amazing how much power a president who lost re-election still holds over his party, and it's because Trump is still so loved by the majority of rank and file Republican voters.

But yeah -- these senators found their backbone not over Trump's dismal coronavirus response or hundreds of other issues, but over giving the average American $1400.

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Post by eddie Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:27 pm

Still, whatever, good for him. He did try to do a good thing, let’s all remember that.

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Post by Ben Reilly Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:30 pm

eddie wrote:Still, whatever, good for him. He did try to do a good thing, let’s all remember that.

It would be fantastic if EVERYONE no matter their beliefs could remember that nobody is completely evil or good.

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Post by eddie Sat Jan 02, 2021 10:38 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
eddie wrote:Still, whatever, good for him. He did try to do a good thing, let’s all remember that.

It would be fantastic if EVERYONE no matter their beliefs could remember that nobody is completely evil or good.

Preaching to the choir Benjy Razz

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Post by Maddog Sun Jan 03, 2021 3:26 am

The whole thing was a clusterfuck. From the billions given to other countries, the last minute dump of a 6000 page document with only hours to review and vote on it, to the theatrics of Trump, Pelosi and McConnell.

Its embarrassing.

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Post by Tommy Monk Sun Jan 03, 2021 11:37 am

eddie wrote:Didn’t Trump try to make this $2000? Good on him.


Yes, he did... Although that is not widely mentioned when the anti trump media talk about him not signing the package...



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Post by Original Quill Sun Jan 03, 2021 4:34 pm

Oh for the days of Obama, and rational thought in government.

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Post by Maddog Sun Jan 03, 2021 5:44 pm

eddie wrote:Didn’t Trump try to make this $2000? Good on him.

Why not 10k per person? Or 100k?


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Post by Original Quill Sun Jan 03, 2021 6:47 pm

The amount is relative to need. We could have avoided it all if Republicans had not abdicated responsibility for needed precautions and priorities in manufacture.

It all goes back to Trump's elimination of the Pandemic Response Team.

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Post by Maddog Sun Jan 03, 2021 7:18 pm

Original Quill wrote:The amount is relative to need.  We could have avoided it all if Republicans had not abdicated responsibility for needed precautions and priorities in manufacture.

It all goes back to Trump's elimination of the Pandemic Response Team.

Too late. People don't need more than 2K? Does everyone getting the 2K really need it?

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Sun Jan 03, 2021 9:16 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:The amount is relative to need.  We could have avoided it all if Republicans had not abdicated responsibility for needed precautions and priorities in manufacture.

It all goes back to Trump's elimination of the Pandemic Response Team.

Too late.  People don't need more than 2K? Does everyone getting the 2K really need it?

Who knows? It depends on the damage that has been done by Republicans.

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“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Maddog Mon Jan 04, 2021 12:11 am

Original Quill wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Too late.  People don't need more than 2K? Does everyone getting the 2K really need it?

Who knows?  It depends on the damage that has been done by Republicans.

So let's just give everyone 50K and make sure.

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pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".   Empty Re: US Congress passes stimulus bill giving every American $600 and these little "extras".

Post by Original Quill Mon Jan 04, 2021 5:07 pm

Maddog wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Who knows? It depends on the damage that has been done by Republicans.

So let's just give everyone 50K and make sure.

Bad mistakes require drastic remedial measures. That's one of the downsides of a president not knowing what s/he is doing. Republicans have chosen this ideological devotion to one psychotic individual, and he has chosen to follow the theology of his cult rather than real science.

You, yourself, have said you are devotee to this religion. You have said you follow Libertarianism, the philosophy that 'political leaders do nothing, and the divine hand will take care of all'. So Trump, despite dire warnings, did nothing, adopting a sub-philosophy of doing nothing, and relying on herd immunity, and thereby committed the genocide of (so far) over a third of a million citizens (speaking only of the US).



Now we are living out the nightmare. People must wear masks, cannot go out, cannot go to work lest they risk dying, and as a result the economy suffers, and we lose $$-trillions.

$2,000/per citizen pales in comparison to the $$-trillions that Trump and the Republicans have already cost us. We are at the point that there is nothing else to be done. The question is: can we afford not to?

_________________
“Little thieves are hanged, but great thieves are praised.” — Old Russian proverb, offered by Vladimir Putin to Donald Trump, Helsinki, July, 2018.

"One Nation, under Guns, with License and Liberty to Kill." ― New pledge.

"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

“That's libertarians for you — anarchists who want police protection from their slaves.” ― Kim Stanley Robinson, Green Mars (1993).

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