The rise of the nationalistic far right across Europe.

Ominous similarites to the politics of the 1930's.
And they are aligning with Putin.
They are calling it the rise of the European Spring.
For the Jews, exchange Muslims.
Viktor Orbán calls for anti-immgration politicians to take over EU

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/jan/10/viktor-orban-calls-anti-migration-politics-take-over-eu-matteo-salvini?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Copy_to_clipboard

Since it is the case that nobody has ever been elected under any mandate of allowing mass immigration... but this has been happening against the will of the electorate who are supposed to be in charge of what politicians do, as is democracy, and being allowed to happen by politicians who are going completely against the will of their electorate... then it is no surprise that the people have stopped voting for those who do what they don't want, and have started voting for those who will do what they do want...

Tommy Monk wrote:

Since it is the case that nobody has ever been elected under any mandate of allowing mass immigration... but this has been happening against the will of the electorate who are supposed to be in charge of what politicians do, as is democracy, and being allowed to happen by politicians who are going completely against the will of their electorate... then it is no surprise that the people have stopped voting for those who do what they don't want, and have started voting for those who will do what they do want...

Do you have any reliable polling to back up your claims?

Maybe Andy will explain why it is that 70% of Labour MPs represent constituencies that voted to leave the EU, but majority of them are actively working against the will of their electorate being enacted, ie trying to stop the uk leaving the EU...!?


Does Andy support democracy... or dictatorship...!!!???


Does he think that all votes count...?


Or only those who share his views, are worthy as voters?


All in the name of 'equality' of course...!

Tommy Monk wrote:Maybe Andy will explain why it is that 70% of Labour MPs represent constituencies that voted to leave the EU, but majority of them are actively working against the will of their electorate being enacted, ie trying to stop the uk leaving the EU...!?
!

Well surely you do not want to see any Far right party come to power?

As then it certainly will not be democracy if any gain power in the EU.

Have you not learnt anything from history?

I have as much distain for the Far right, as I do the Far left

>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:

Since it is the case that nobody has ever been elected under any mandate of allowing mass immigration... but this has been happening against the will of the electorate who are supposed to be in charge of what politicians do, as is democracy, and being allowed to happen by politicians who are going completely against the will of their electorate... then it is no surprise that the people have stopped voting for those who do what they don't want, and have started voting for those who will do what they do want...

Do you have any reliable polling to back up your claims?

What???


Can you explain what it is exactly that you mean by "reliable polling"...!?


And in the mean time... maybe you can show me any political party that was elected under any mandate of allowing mass immigration...!?

Tommy Monk wrote:Maybe Andy will explain why it is that 70% of Labour MPs represent constituencies that voted to leave the EU, but majority of them are actively working against the will of their electorate being enacted, ie trying to stop the uk leaving the EU...!?


Does Andy support democracy... or dictatorship...!!!???


Does he think that all votes count...?


Or only those who share his views, are worthy as voters?


All in the name of 'equality' of course...!

You appear to have the wrong thread.
Thus one is about the the rise of the far right nationalists in eastern and southern Europe, not the British Labour party.
If you want to discuss the latter, start your own thread, don't deflect mine.

Note to the lefties.....

As you sow, so shall you reap

or
sow the wind, reap the whirlwind

Lord Foul wrote:Note to the lefties.....

As you sow, so shall you reap

or
sow the wind, reap the whirlwind

It works both ways.

"Demoncrap" Pelosi is back in charge of the House of Representatives, thanks almost solely to Trump.

Lord Foul wrote:Note to the lefties.....

As you sow, so shall you reap

or
sow the wind, reap the whirlwind

What does it have to do with "lefties",  pray tell...

Britain has had conservative gov'ts for many years, (Blair was certainly not "left wing", by any measure..);
Germany has a centre right government;
Most Euro' countries have either centrist or conservative governments;
Israel has a conservative/right wing government;
Most Middle East countries have right-wing theocracies, monarchies or dictatorships;
Russia now has a right-wing nationalistic 'oligarchy'..

The USA now has a far-right prez', after a succession of centre-right/"free market" administrations.

Where are all these "lefties" that you keep on whining about, then --  mostly in opposition, or working for charities, or the occasional "liberal" journo's, more likely..

There is big support for party's that are against the corrupt federal dictatorship that is the EU...!

Tommy Monk wrote:

There is big support for party's that are against the corrupt federal dictatorship that is the EU...!

You sound like a Russian. Are you sure you are not GRU? Cozy Bear? Fancy Bear?

Tommy Monk wrote:

There is big support for party's that are against the corrupt federal dictatorship that is the EU...!

So are you happy to sell your soul to back Far right xenophobic racist parties then?

You want to replace a dictatorship with an even worse Totalitarian Far right dictatorship?

But then in your warped world, you do not think Far right extremism and politics exist.

Which meansd you are in a constant state of denial

Why would anyone support something so hateful and vile?

Is it because they are simple controlled by their own fears and allow others to control them through these fears?

That would make them complete sheep

I mean Hitler only gained support due to the 1929 Wall street crash, as people bought his bullshit lies and hate. Is that really your argument?

How many ended up being murdered for that stupidity, voting for such a vile racist mass murderer? How many lost  also countless of their own families, due to supporting such a maniac that led to millions dying in a world war?

When are you going to learn?

Do you really think the answer to the problems in the EU is to sell yourself out to hate and fear?

As all you are doing is swapping one problem, for a far greater calamitous future problem. Which never ends up solving the same problems in the first place. You end up mutiplying and creating countless more problems. I mean if you really think that is the solution to problems today. Then you fail to see there is other avenues people can take. To actually look to solve these problems, but instead you want to make the same mistakes all over again. As you are not led by reason, but your emotions with fear.

I've said it before, here on NF  --

Tommy Monk has positioned himself so far over to the extreme right on the political spectrum, that he considers everyone to his left to be lefty/commie/Marxist/"liberals" --  and sees his fellow extremists as moderates and centrists..

How many times has Tommy gone so far as to claim that Hitler and Mussolini were "left-wing socialists"  ?

I support democracy, and the democratic will of the people being enacted by national governments...


If governments start doing things that are against the wishes of the people, then it is the politicians who are in the wrong, and the people will vote for change.


Being against the EU is not solely a left/right or far right thing, and neither is being against mass immigration.

Tommy Monk wrote:I support democracy, and the democratic will of the people being enacted by national governments...


If governments start doing things that are against the wishes of the people, then it is the politicians who are in the wrong, and the people will vote for change.


Being against the EU is not solely a left/right or far right thing, and neither is being against mass immigration.

How could the people vote for change when the Nazi's came to power?

Or  the Fascists in Italy?

Or when the Far right took power by force in Spain with Franco?

Or... when the corrupt EU dictatorship took over European countries...?

Tommy Monk wrote:Or... when the corrupt EU dictatorship took over European countries...?

You never answered my question?

What countries have the EU taken over?

Also the people have voted to leave the EU in this country

Any nation can leave the EU

Thus its not a dictatorship

The French said no... the Dutch said no... the Irish said no...


The UK said no...


None have left yet...

Tommy Monk wrote:

The French said no... the Dutch said no... the Irish said no...


The UK said no...


None have left yet...

The British have voted the only ones to do so and there is nothing stopping the other sfrom doing so

I see you again failed to answer my question as you always do

Hence little point continuing as always a one sided debate where you avoid everything

Cheers

But you think you have justified calling party's "far right" because they are against being in the EU...!?


Ok dodge...!

Tommy Monk wrote:But you think you have justified calling party's "far right" because they are against being in the EU...!?


Ok dodge...!

Cathy Newman alert

Never once have I made such a claim

Have i ever called Labour or the Tories Far right for wanting to leave the EU?

Nope

Hence there are many known reasons and policies, which you deny as to why a party is designated Far right

Which as you always deny, hence is pointless debating

Like I say enjoy talking to yourself

"...fifty-five percent of French voters, and sixty-two percent of Dutch voters, said "no."..."

Tommy Monk wrote:"...fifty-five percent of French voters, and sixty-two percent of Dutch voters, said "no."..."

In which referendum?

Didge... I've asked you to give the defining factors of what is "far right" before... and you couldn't do it...!


It seems yo me that it is just a lazy label given to any party that isn't part of the establishment...

Andy wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:"...fifty-five percent of French voters, and sixty-two percent of Dutch voters, said "no."..."

In which referendum?

I'm still waiting for you to answer my question on the May thread...

Andy wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:"...fifty-five percent of French voters, and sixty-two percent of Dutch voters, said "no."..."

In which referendum?

Yeah I was amused at that also

Tommy Monk wrote:Didge... I've asked you to give the defining factors of what is "far right" before... and you couldn't do it...!


It seems yo me that it is just a lazy label given to any party that isn't part of the establishment...

Actually I pointed them out to you countless times and in countless debates and each time you go into denial mode

Its not my fault you are so closeminded on this

Thor wrote:

Andy wrote:

In which referendum?

Yeah I was amused at that also

Looks like it's you and Andy who are in denial..

Tommy Monk wrote:

Thor wrote:

Yeah I was amused at that also

Looks like it's you and Andy who are in denial..

Where is the evidence of these referendums you claim with Dutch and French voters?

Thor wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:Didge... I've asked you to give the defining factors of what is "far right" before... and you couldn't do it...!


It seems yo me that it is just a lazy label given to any party that isn't part of the establishment...

Actually I pointed them out to you countless times and in countless debates and each time you go into denial mode

Its not my fault you are so closeminded on this

No... you tried a couple of wishy washy reasons that didn't stand up to scrutiny... then you ran away!

Thor wrote:

Tommy Monk wrote:


Looks like it's you and Andy who are in denial..

Where is the evidence of these referendums you claim with Dutch and French voters?

Wow!!!


You must be joking!!!???

Tommy Monk wrote:

Thor wrote:

Where is the evidence of these referendums you claim with Dutch and French voters?

Wow!!!


You must be joking!!!???

Nope, not joking, show me these referendums

So the only referndum was on a constitution of the EU, not on being a part of the EU

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Dutch_European_Constitution_referendum

Tommy telling porkies again

In fact there has been plenty of referendums it seems

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Referendums_related_to_the_European_Union#Treaty_of_Amsterdam,_1998

Plus also polls find the majoirty favour being in the EU

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_withdrawal_from_the_European_Union

The French said no and the Dutch said no... the Irish said no too...

Thor wrote:So the only referndum was on a constitution of the EU, not on being a part of the EU

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2005_Dutch_European_Constitution_referendum

Tommy telling porkies again

In fact there has been plenty of referendums it seems

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Referendums_related_to_the_European_Union#Treaty_of_Amsterdam,_1998

Plus also polls find the majoirty favour being in the EU

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_withdrawal_from_the_European_Union

Its there for everyone to see Tommy

Like I say, again you get caught out telling porkies

Thanks for playing

I'm not telling porkies you bell end!


They had referendums on the EU constitution and all said no!!!


FACT!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:

The French said no... the Dutch said no... the Irish said no...


The UK said no...


None have left yet...

As seen Tommy's claim was a lie

He now switches this after being exposed, to claim a vote on the constitution. When he clearly implied they voted to leave the EU

Gotcha

Where did I say any of those referendums were in/out referendums?

I thought everyone knew they were referendums on the EU constitution...!?

So... you are just being a weasel here didge... you got nothing on me... and I've clearly not been telling any sort of porkies...!

Tommy Monk wrote:Where did I say any of those referendums were in/out referendums?

I thought everyone knew they were referendums on the EU constitution...!?

So... you are just being a weasel here didge... you got nothing on me... and I've clearly not been telling any sort of porkies...!

ha ha ha bullshit alert

You stated that none of have left yet, ie the EU, after claiming they said no, ie again to the EU

Seriously, show some dignity for once and admit you screwed up confusing votes on the constitution?

Saying no to the EU constitution is a pretty big 2 fingers up the the EU itself...


Have any been given a referendum on EU membership since that...?


No... because they would probably vote to leave...

Also... they are all still part of the EU constitution that just got rebranded as the Lisbon treaty, but is essentially exactly the same thing...


Have any left the EU constitution since voting no to it...?

Tommy Monk wrote:Saying no to the EU constitution is a pretty big 2 fingers up the the EU itself...


Have any been given a referendum on EU membership since that...?


No... because they would probably vote to leave...

ha ha ha ha no its not, as why again does it show again the majority of Dutch want to be in the EU

I provided the links to polls and referendums on polls

Seriously mate, show some dignity and admit you screwed up

Anywa, will leave you to have the hump, as was very funny how you cocked that up

Enjoy

I've not screwed anything up... they all voted no to the constitution but we're then still bundled into it... None have left it yet... and that would mean leaving the EU...


You made the mistake of thinking I meant referendums were in/out... when I never did say that...!


So you are just twisting as usual...