iPhones wouldn't be much more expensive if made in America - but America couldn't do it

by Ben Reilly Sun Sep 23, 2018 6:57 pm

Trump lashed out at Apple recently after the company said the White House’s proposed $200 billion tariffs on Chinese goods would hurt its business. Trump tweeted: “Make your products in the United States instead of China. Start building new plants now.”

It’s tempting to write off Trump here as just tweeting populist rhetoric, but he actually does hit on something interesting — should Apple be making more of the iPhone and other products in the US?

If Apple managed to bring manufacturing jobs to the United States, analysts say that assembling the iPhone here wouldn’t actually make it much more expensive. As Konstantin Kakaes wrote in the MIT Technology Review in 2016, putting together the iPhone in the US from parts made abroad would only cost about $30 to $40 more per phone, a modest increase for a device with a 64 percent profit margin. Even if every part was made in the US, an iPhone would cost about $100 more, Kakaes concluded, assuming raw materials were still purchased on global markets.

The issue is not so much cost of putting an iPhone together, or even the cost per part on paper. The issue is skill, scale, expertise, and infrastructure — all of which require money, time and long-term investment. Unlike other manufacturing jobs that have migrated from the United States, Apple wouldn’t be bringing them “back” so much as starting from scratch.

https://www.vox.com/technology/2018/9/13/17851052/apple-iphone-price-china-trump-us-trade

We see how corporate greed has transformed America over about 40 years from a country with a thriving middle class to a place where we can no longer even do the jobs that they took away and gave to Pacific Rim wage slaves.

by Lurker Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:46 pm

Republican greed philosophy destroyed American manufacturing.

by Ben Reilly Mon Oct 01, 2018 8:53 pm

Lurker wrote:Republican greed philosophy destroyed American manufacturing.

Basically, the GOP has become the political arm of the corporate aristocracy. I can't see how people don't understand this.

They may love the Republican leadership for the crazy racist, sexist, homophobic shit they say, but they need to keep their eye on the ball.

Same with conservative political parties over the world - they represent the rich, not the poor white man who's the victim of "reverse racism" and wishes it was still okay to rape women and call gay people "faggots."

by 'Wolfie Tue Oct 02, 2018 3:12 am

*THE Ben Reilly* wrote:
Trump lashed out at Apple recently after the company said the White House’s proposed $200 billion tariffs on Chinese goods would hurt its business. Trump tweeted: “Make your products in the United States instead of China. Start building new plants now.”

It’s tempting to write off Trump here as just tweeting populist rhetoric, but he actually does hit on something interesting — should Apple be making more of the iPhone and other products in the US?

If Apple managed to bring manufacturing jobs to the United States, analysts say that assembling the iPhone here wouldn’t actually make it much more expensive. As Konstantin Kakaes wrote in the MIT Technology Review in 2016, putting together the iPhone in the US from parts made abroad would only cost about $30 to $40 more per phone, a modest increase for a device with a 64 percent profit margin. Even if every part was made in the US, an iPhone would cost about $100 more, Kakaes concluded, assuming raw materials were still purchased on global markets.

The issue is not so much cost of putting an iPhone together, or even the cost per part on paper. The issue is skill, scale, expertise, and infrastructure — all of which require money, time and long-term investment. Unlike other manufacturing jobs that have migrated from the United States, Apple wouldn’t be bringing them “back” so much as starting from scratch.

https://www.vox.com/technology/2018/9/13/17851052/apple-iphone-price-china-trump-us-trade

We see how corporate greed has transformed America over about 40 years from a country with a thriving middle class to a place where we can no longer even do the jobs that they took away and gave to Pacific Rim wage slaves.

"Pacific Rim wage slaves"...

Which part of the "Pacific Rim" would that be, then..

Australia and New Zealand ? Japan, S. Korea and Singapore ? Hawaii ? California, Oregon and Washington ?

tongue

A big part of the USA's problem in finding 'skilled' and qualified trade labour is that you don't have the government-subsidised apprenticeship and training programmes in place that a lot of other advanced/industrial countries do..

Not enough "trade colleges", while many training courses are either from private providers or "in-house" corporate schemes, means that it would take industry sectors in the USA a lot longer to "train up" or poach or import skilled tradesmen to replace those that corporate America has discarded over the past fifty years -- while many countries have their 4 year (gov't subsidised..) apprenticeships, and another 3 or 4 years to get a bit of industry experience, those US wannabe tradies are still trying to work out how to finance their next trade certificate courses.

The proverbial "horse bolted" during the 1980s, when Reaganomics effectively crippled America's manufacturing base; and big business cut way down on their traineeships..

Basketball

by Original Quill Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:27 pm

*THE Ben Reilly* wrote:
Lurker wrote:Republican greed philosophy destroyed American manufacturing.

Basically, the GOP has become the political arm of the corporate aristocracy. I can't see how people don't understand this.

They may love the Republican leadership for the crazy racist, sexist, homophobic shit they say, but they need to keep their eye on the ball.

Same with conservative political parties over the world - they represent the rich, not the poor white man who's the victim of "reverse racism" and wishes it was still okay to rape women and call gay people "faggots."

The corporate aristocracy doesn't want to invest in modern, productive tooling, any more than they want to invest in labor and wages. Less expense = more personal profit.

Of course they let state-side infrastructure rot...as long as Chinese and Vietnamese workers will do it for less, they bring the factories to them.

This is simply a by-product of the capitalist system. The worker is just a tool and an expense, like any component of manufacturing. Only when profit is not the incentive (ie, socialism) will the human element again become significant, if not paramount.

Meanwhile, Republicans dance around issues like tariffs and quotas like they are the answer; they are but bubbles in the balloon, push them back and another one appears on the opposite side.

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:29 pm

*THE Ben Reilly* wrote:
Trump lashed out at Apple recently after the company said the White House’s proposed $200 billion tariffs on Chinese goods would hurt its business. Trump tweeted: “Make your products in the United States instead of China. Start building new plants now.”

It’s tempting to write off Trump here as just tweeting populist rhetoric, but he actually does hit on something interesting — should Apple be making more of the iPhone and other products in the US?

If Apple managed to bring manufacturing jobs to the United States, analysts say that assembling the iPhone here wouldn’t actually make it much more expensive. As Konstantin Kakaes wrote in the MIT Technology Review in 2016, putting together the iPhone in the US from parts made abroad would only cost about $30 to $40 more per phone, a modest increase for a device with a 64 percent profit margin. Even if every part was made in the US, an iPhone would cost about $100 more, Kakaes concluded, assuming raw materials were still purchased on global markets.

The issue is not so much cost of putting an iPhone together, or even the cost per part on paper. The issue is skill, scale, expertise, and infrastructure — all of which require money, time and long-term investment. Unlike other manufacturing jobs that have migrated from the United States, Apple wouldn’t be bringing them “back” so much as starting from scratch.

https://www.vox.com/technology/2018/9/13/17851052/apple-iphone-price-china-trump-us-trade

We see how corporate greed has transformed America over about 40 years from a country with a thriving middle class to a place where we can no longer even do the jobs that they took away and gave to Pacific Rim wage slaves.

Vox?

iPhones wouldn't be much more expensive if made in America - but America couldn't do it 3489511464

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:36 pm

So why is not any of the left supporting Trumps view here to have this made in the US and provide countless jobs for Americans

Lets see how many different excuses will be produced by the lefties here.

Apple could easily bring work forces from abroad to the US to help train staff in the US. This happens all the time when companies merge and facilities merge into another country.

So all this scare mongering is quite frankly nothing but horseshit, because Apple wants to continue to use slave labour

All I have seen is bemoaning here and yet why are they not supporting Trump's view?

Laughing

by 'Wolfie Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:50 pm

Didge wrote:So why is not any of the left supporting Trumps view here to have this made in the US and provide countless jobs for Americans

Lets see how many different excuses will be produced by the lefties here.

Apple could easily bring work forces from abroad to the US to help train staff in the US. This happens all the time when companies merge and facilities merge into another country.

So all this scare mongering is quite frankly nothing but horseshit, because Apple wants to continue to use slave labour

All I have seen is bemoaning here and yet why are they supporting Trump's view?

More total and idiotic deflections from faithful ol' Dodger, once againg kissing his corporate masters' arses...

Totally ignoring the government assistance, help in training, and even slackening of some restrictive regulations, to help those companies in those countries (India, China, Vietnam, Taiwan, South Korea, Thailand..) that have picked up the "off shoring" of business from "mature" industrial countries such as the USA, Britain, Australia, Germany, France, even Japan..

If Trump and his cronies were serious about attracting manufacturing back onto American shores, they would be setting pro-active policies to train up workers, and make it easier for companies to build more at home (Apple still manufactures some products in the USA, as do several other big corporations -- despite Dodge's mindless blatherings above there..).

But istead, all we see from the Dumpster is useless tariffs, empty promises and infantile threats of "trade wars".

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:54 pm

So I count that as 3 very pathetic excuses, showing again Wolf has no idea about coporate companies and skilled workers. How they are often brought over to start up factories and buisnesses. Again I think Trump is an idiot, but why are the left not supporting him here?

Its very obvious, just way and see folks Laughing

How do you think this is done with cars wolf?

Like I say, keep count folks, the bullshit excuses will keep rolling in

As a phased process over a couple of years could bring production to the US

Nobody said it had to happen over night and surely those middle class champange socialists are not going to mind paying more for these phones?

Laughing

by Original Quill Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:55 pm

Didge wrote:So why is not any of the left supporting Trumps view here to have this made in the US and provide countless jobs for Americans

Read, you dolt. Three of us have been addressing that very point.

Uhh...cerebral processing is not your thing, is it?

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:56 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:So why is not any of the left supporting Trumps view here to have this made in the US and provide countless jobs for Americans

Read, you dolt. Three of us have been addressing that very point.

Uhh...cerebral processing is not your thing, is it?

So you are supporting Trump then?

Look fake lawyer, I am going to really prove how very two faced you lefties truely are and really going to enjoy myself in the process

So where have you supported Trump here?

by Original Quill Tue Oct 02, 2018 4:59 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Read, you dolt. Three of us have been addressing that very point.

Uhh...cerebral processing is not your thing, is it?

So you are supporting Trump then?

Look fake lawyer, I am going to really prove how very two faced you lefties truely are and really going to enjoy myself in the process

So where have you supported Trump here?

Gad, he is a hopeless worm.

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:01 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Didge wrote:

So you are supporting Trump then?

Look fake lawyer, I am going to really prove how very two faced you lefties truely are and really going to enjoy myself in the process

So where have you supported Trump here?

Gad, he is a hopeless worm.

Ha ha ha, you cannot make it up, how funny this is.

The lefties are caught in vortex, they cannot pull themselves out of.

As Trump is supporting something they would want

Priceless

Cool

by 'Wolfie Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:05 pm

The poor wee Dodger is truly demented these days...

The patheic little know-nothing has obviously not read a single word of what Ben, Quill, veya or I have written across these subjects..

How can he ever hpoe to attack, embarass or "prove" anything against any of us, when he clearly doesn't even understand the basics to start with ?

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:06 pm

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

The poor wee Dodger is truly demented these days...

The patheic little know-nothing has obviously not read a single word of what Ben, Quill, veya or I have written across these subjects..

How can he ever hpoe to attack, embarass or "prove" anything against any of us, when he clearly doesn't even understand the basics to start with ?

So that is excuse number 4 now

The classic one, using me

Like I said, this will be great to watch

Laughing

by 'Wolfie Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:11 pm

Didge wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Gad, he is a hopeless worm.

Ha ha ha, you cannot make it up, how funny this is.

The lefties are caught in vortex, they cannot pull themselves out of.

As Trump is supporting something they would want

Priceless

Listen up, you stupid fuckbrain corporatist suck-up...

Trump isn't supporting anything, you hopeless lying piece of shit..

All he is doing is threatening tariffs and trade wars -- yet he hasn't done one single thing to lift worker training, encourage companies to keep on those workers, or to encourage companies not to "off-shore" their production to begin with.

Like you, Dodge, he is big on rhetoric, but lacking on the action side of things..

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:14 pm

So that is now 5 excuses and now accusing me of unfounded claims, with even more Wolfy Potty time ha ha.

Trump called for the company to move the industry here and again the left should be in support of that

As seen, all we are seeing is excuses and the little boy running off with his potty mouth

Priceless

This is why the left on here collectivelly are prime time entertainment to take the piss out of

Laughing

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:24 pm

Have fun people, may pop back later

Laughing

by nicko Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:36 pm

wolfie, would you use that language face to face with some one? I don't think you would. In my opinion your a fucking coward who'd run a mile if challenged ! Any one who shoots their mouth off like yourself does it because in real life you wouldn't say "boo to a Goose", in reality your all "mouth and no trousers" and we all know it !

by Original Quill Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:43 pm

nicko wrote:wolfie, would you use that language face to face with some one? I don't think you would. In my opinion your a fucking coward who'd run a mile if challenged ! Any one who shoots their mouth off like yourself does it because in real life you wouldn't say "boo to a Goose", in reality your all "mouth and no trousers" and we all know it !

Better to shoot off one's mouth, than one's gun...

by Guest Tue Oct 02, 2018 5:50 pm

Since when did Nicko serve with the US forces?

He never did and again you have to sink to new levels and the admin continue to allow you to make the worst accusations on Nicko

When you Quill, who have never faced combat and have no idea what those who served went through. Have the balls to make such a view on Nicko

That simple makes you the worst kind of coward in my books

All big with words, when you would shit a brick at the first sign of trouble

I have seen your kind many times in life and are all mouth

How you can sit there and feel smug posting pictures like that to Nicko, when he saw the Viet Conq actually murder people and was there to protect villages

Shows you are so utterly ignorant its beyond belief

I bet every singe American Vet, seeing you post that, would punch you in the mouth and you would deserve it

Pathetic online fake lawyer

by nicko Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:24 pm

That Picture could be the result of the VC "educating" the locals not to help the American and Aussie forces . Quill,I went into a village where the VC had believed they were helping the Americans. Briefly, the headman had been tied to a Tree and forced to watch, while his Daughter and his Wife were Raped, and his Daughter had her Stomach cut open and her unborn baby taken out and pinned to her body by a Bayonet. I saw the body of a young American soldier tied to a tree , he'd been SKINNED Alive ! After that and other things I saw my Squad and myself never took another VC prisoner. You know nothing about War so shut your stupid gob you ignorant man.

by eddie Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:17 pm

*THE Ben Reilly* wrote:
Trump lashed out at Apple recently after the company said the White House’s proposed $200 billion tariffs on Chinese goods would hurt its business. Trump tweeted: “Make your products in the United States instead of China. Start building new plants now.”

It’s tempting to write off Trump here as just tweeting populist rhetoric, but he actually does hit on something interesting — should Apple be making more of the iPhone and other products in the US?

If Apple managed to bring manufacturing jobs to the United States, analysts say that assembling the iPhone here wouldn’t actually make it much more expensive. As Konstantin Kakaes wrote in the MIT Technology Review in 2016, putting together the iPhone in the US from parts made abroad would only cost about $30 to $40 more per phone, a modest increase for a device with a 64 percent profit margin. Even if every part was made in the US, an iPhone would cost about $100 more, Kakaes concluded, assuming raw materials were still purchased on global markets.

The issue is not so much cost of putting an iPhone together, or even the cost per part on paper. The issue is skill, scale, expertise, and infrastructure — all of which require money, time and long-term investment. Unlike other manufacturing jobs that have migrated from the United States, Apple wouldn’t be bringing them “back” so much as starting from scratch.

https://www.vox.com/technology/2018/9/13/17851052/apple-iphone-price-china-trump-us-trade

We see how corporate greed has transformed America over about 40 years from a country with a thriving middle class to a place where we can no longer even do the jobs that they took away and gave to Pacific Rim wage slaves.

Why are you posting about apples? Apples suck. Everyone knows that! They get in your teeth and then there’s the whole core situation and don’t get me started on the pips.

It all a stupid thread. Fruitless, really.

by Ben Reilly Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:19 pm

eddie wrote:
*THE Ben Reilly* wrote:
Trump lashed out at Apple recently after the company said the White House’s proposed $200 billion tariffs on Chinese goods would hurt its business. Trump tweeted: “Make your products in the United States instead of China. Start building new plants now.”

It’s tempting to write off Trump here as just tweeting populist rhetoric, but he actually does hit on something interesting — should Apple be making more of the iPhone and other products in the US?

If Apple managed to bring manufacturing jobs to the United States, analysts say that assembling the iPhone here wouldn’t actually make it much more expensive. As Konstantin Kakaes wrote in the MIT Technology Review in 2016, putting together the iPhone in the US from parts made abroad would only cost about $30 to $40 more per phone, a modest increase for a device with a 64 percent profit margin. Even if every part was made in the US, an iPhone would cost about $100 more, Kakaes concluded, assuming raw materials were still purchased on global markets.

The issue is not so much cost of putting an iPhone together, or even the cost per part on paper. The issue is skill, scale, expertise, and infrastructure — all of which require money, time and long-term investment. Unlike other manufacturing jobs that have migrated from the United States, Apple wouldn’t be bringing them “back” so much as starting from scratch.

https://www.vox.com/technology/2018/9/13/17851052/apple-iphone-price-china-trump-us-trade

We see how corporate greed has transformed America over about 40 years from a country with a thriving middle class to a place where we can no longer even do the jobs that they took away and gave to Pacific Rim wage slaves.

Why are you posting about apples? Apples suck. Everyone knows that! They get in your teeth and then there’s the whole core situation and don’t get me started on the pips.

It all a stupid thread. Fruitless, really.

Plus everyone knows only the Chinese can make iPhones because only they have the really small fingers that can fit in there. Rolling Eyes

by veya_victaous Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:08 am

Didge wrote:So that is now 5 excuses and now accusing me of unfounded claims, with even more Wolfy Potty time ha ha.

Trump called for the company to move the industry here and again the left should be in support of that

As seen, all we are seeing is excuses and the little boy running off with his potty mouth

Priceless

This is why the left on here collectivelly are prime time entertainment to take the piss out of

this post shows why there is no point even attempting to debate the 'Right' they are not actually standing for anything just Against whatever the left says
there is no though or logic behind their arguments, just spew bullshit and pretend equality means treating the regurgitation of uneducated swill the same as well-articulated factually based positions.

WHY on earth should the Left support that?
Because Dingus Dumbass can't accept that the LEFT Support International Trade that benefits the General population. it's only Corporate hacks on the Right that want to see Trade that Benefits the Corpocracy only ... Trumps Policy is Just stupidity, the sort of Dumb shit a Brexiter would believe that has ZERO chance of success in reality.

by 'Wolfie Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:08 am

Didge really is "fucked in the head.." these days...

Empty and meaningless abuse against me, Quill, veya and Ben..

Keeps on claiming he's going to "embarrass" all the "left" leaning contributors on here.

Yet the self-delusional weasel-mouthed corporate-arse-licling little muppet has to yet land even one blow against any of us..

And still he keeps on crowing about some self-declared victory on here ??? Only in his imagination..

by 'Wolfie Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:18 am

nicko wrote:
wolfie, would you use that language face to face with some one? I don't think you would. In my opinion your a fucking coward who'd run a mile if challenged ! Any one who shoots their mouth off like yourself does it because in real life you wouldn't say "boo to a Goose", in reality your all "mouth and no trousers" and we all know it !

Fuck off nicko, you lying two-faced piece of shit...

You lived in Oz long enough to know quite well how Australians will quite often talk down here -- especially when opposing a know-nothing piece of garbage like Didge..

You know quite well that you wouldn't even be spouting your lying crap about me (or Quill or veya, either..), if you weren't simply standing up for those couple of Poms who share your insular and self-centred brand of politics.

At least I have addressed the actual subject of this thread -- something that both you and Didge have yet to do !!!

by nicko Wed Oct 03, 2018 6:59 am

by nicko Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:02 am

PS, think I touched a nerve there Wolfie?

by Guest Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:27 am

nicko wrote:PS, think I touched a nerve there Wolfie?

Ha ha, indeed, the gobby one simple cannot take it

Like i say, he is all mouth mate Laughing

by Guest Wed Oct 03, 2018 7:28 am

As I said, you would see many excuses made on here

It shows how tribal people have become and they have no idea how to compremise

They have become an us and them attitude on everything

by 'Wolfie Wed Oct 03, 2018 9:34 am

Didge wrote:
nicko wrote:PS, think I touched a nerve there Wolfie?

Ha ha, indeed, the gobby one simple cannot take it

Like i say, he is all mouth mate

So says chief Tory snowflake Dodge...

Keeps on piling bullshit lies on lies on here..

Never achieved anything worthwhile in his whole miserable life, so attempts to make up for his total emptiness by spouting his lies against me, veya, Quill, eddie, Ben, Jules and anyone else who crosses his idiotic sense of entitlement, and claims of "intellectual superiority".

You're the last pathetic little maggot that should be calling me "all mouth", when you obviously don't know the first thing about me..

You would give SmellyBum' and NoIndependentThoughts a run for their money when it comes to being the most mouthy twats on NewsFix...

*********************************************

And still, after all his empty insults..

Vacuous twat Dodge still can't actually point to any real world "excuses" from his accursed "lefty" opponents on here.

Just more of the usual on-going lying bullshit from him and his fellow right-wing chums..

by Guest Wed Oct 03, 2018 9:41 am

Oh look more potty mouth time and more excuses

So I count that as 9 very pathetic excuses, showing again Wolf has no idea about coporate companies and skilled workers. How they are often brought over to start up factories and buisnesses. Again I think Trump is an idiot, but why are the left not supporting him here?

Its very obvious, just way and see folks Laughing

How do you think this is done with cars wolf?

Like I say, keep count folks, the bullshit excuses will keep rolling in

As a phased process over a couple of years could bring production to the US

Nobody said it had to happen over night and surely those middle class champange socialists are not going to mind paying more for these phones?

by 'Wolfie Wed Oct 03, 2018 3:02 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Didge wrote:
So that is now 5 excuses and now accusing me of unfounded claims, with even more Wolfy Potty time ha ha.

Trump called for the company to move the industry here and again the left should be in support of that

As seen, all we are seeing is excuses and the little boy running off with his potty mouth

Priceless

This is why the left on here collectivelly are prime time entertainment to take the piss out of

this post shows why there is no point even attempting to debate the 'Right' they are not actually standing for anything just Against whatever the left says
there is no though or logic behind their arguments, just spew bullshit and pretend equality means treating the regurgitation of uneducated swill the same as well-articulated factually based positions.

WHY on earth should the Left support that?
Because Dingus Dumbass can't accept that the LEFT Support International Trade that benefits the General population. it's only Corporate hacks on the Right that want to see Trade that Benefits the Corpocracy only ... Trumps Policy is Just stupidity, the sort of Dumb shit a Brexiter would believe that has ZERO chance of success in reality.

Too true, that...

Doddery ol' Dingus Dumbass Diddery Dodger simply has to keep on proving just what an ignorant fool he is..

Totally ignoring the one simple fact that the Dumpster's administration has not done a single thing to encourage any of those corporations to keep their manufacturing on home soil.

To use one of nicko's favourite sayings : "all talk, no pants !"

by nicko Wed Oct 03, 2018 4:08 pm

Actually wolfie, it's "all mouth no trousers", as you should know !

by Original Quill Wed Oct 03, 2018 4:56 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Didge wrote:So that is now 5 excuses and now accusing me of unfounded claims, with even more Wolfy Potty time ha ha.

Trump called for the company to move the industry here and again the left should be in support of that

As seen, all we are seeing is excuses and the little boy running off with his potty mouth

Priceless

This is why the left on here collectivelly are prime time entertainment to take the piss out of

this post shows why there is no point even attempting to debate the 'Right' they are not actually standing for anything just Against whatever the left says
there is no though or logic behind their arguments, just spew bullshit and pretend equality means treating the regurgitation of uneducated swill the same as well-articulated factually based positions.

WHY on earth should the Left support that?
Because Dingus Dumbass can't accept that the LEFT Support International Trade that benefits the General population. it's only Corporate hacks on the Right that want to see Trade that Benefits the Corpocracy only ... Trumps Policy is Just stupidity, the sort of Dumb shit a Brexiter would believe that has ZERO chance of success in reality.

You certainly hit the nail on the head...for all of conservatism. F.A. Hayek, the Nobel Prize winning RW economist, wrote in his essay Why I am Not a Conservative:

FA Hayek wrote:Let me now state what seems to me the decisive objection to any conservatism which deserves to be called such. It is that by its very nature it cannot offer an alternative to the direction in which we are moving. It may succeed by its resistance to current tendencies in slowing down undesirable developments, but, since it does not indicate another direction, it cannot prevent their continuance. It has, for this reason, invariably been the fate of conservatism to be dragged along a path not of its own choosing.
https://object.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/articles/hayek-why-i-am-not-conservative.pdf

Unlike socialism or liberalism, conservatism is whatever was. It is driven neither by theory, nor by intelligent design, but by the leavings of history.

Because conservatism stands for nothing, it is easily corruptible. Indeed, whatever "anomalies" (Kuhn, Thomas, The Structure of Scientific Revolutions) one finds fault with in any era, one finds the conservatives at the heart of the evil. Conservatives were at the heart of trusts and monopolies--the evils of capitalism--at the turn of the nineteenth century, just as they are at the heart of White Nationalism as witnessed in Charlottesville. Conservatives stand for what was the status quo, and since what was the status quo is changing precisely because of its evils, conservatives inevitably stand for those evils. This is why it's hard to like conservatives personally.

Right on...veya and FA Hayek.

by 'Wolfie Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:26 pm

Dodgie Doddery Didge the Delusional and Demented 'Dingus Dumbass' Dolt...

Says it all, really..

by Guest Wed Oct 03, 2018 5:58 pm

So still more excuses

When is anyone going to admit that Trump has a view here similar to you middle class champange socialists?

Laughing

by veya_victaous Thu Oct 04, 2018 1:59 am

Didge wrote:So still more excuses

When is anyone going to admit that Trump has a view here similar to you middle class champange socialists?

HOW?

in idiotic Simplicity there may seem similarities but beyond 'jobs for middle class' there is nothing in Common

the Sort of Idiocy you display by even Suggesting they are the same is the Problem with democracy.
too many fools hear a Demagogue go "we are going to Achieve X" and you like X so you cheer and cheer like a mindless drone, which is what the Demagogue wants because anyone that Keeps listening and ask 'How?' is meet unequivocally with the reality that the demagogue has NO FUCKING IDEA how to achieve X and in fact are implementing policies that will in no way achieve X but they will achieve some other unstated goal normally to the detriment of the Idiots still Cheering Rolling Eyes

by Guest Thu Oct 04, 2018 2:32 am

Lol so more potty mouth from the other immature aussie and still more excuses

This really shows how tribal the left truly are

They cannot even admit to having a similar view as Trump

Its priceless

by 'Wolfie Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:22 am

Didge wrote:Lol so more potty mouth from the other immature aussie and still more excuses

This really shows how tribal the left truly are

They cannot even admit to having a similar view as Trump

Its priceless

No excuses or deflections from here, you pathetic lying piece of crap...

The only "priceless" thing on here is your utter stupidity -- your very arrogance in showing how you have no interest in actually addressing the relevant points brought up by Quill, veya and myself..

All that you have been doing all along is shooting the messengers, while ignoring their messages.

And then you prove just how sadly delusional you are by claiming some kind of non-existent victory over your much smarter opponents on here..

Veya calling you a "dingus dumbass" is being too kind -- as in reality, you're much more stupid and clueless than a mere "dumbass"...

by veya_victaous Thu Oct 04, 2018 4:48 am

Didge wrote:Lol so more potty mouth from the other immature aussie and still more excuses

This really shows how tribal the left truly are

They cannot even admit to having a similar view as Trump

Its priceless

whats Priceless is You still pretending there is anything to debate OR that You ever made a Valid point

IF you think that what Trump said he will do will make Middle class Jobs in America than You are Far dumber than Anyone on here has suggested so far.

Stop Wasting Our Time with your brainless prattle trying pretend you can debate with the educated by repeating what they said in the negative. That's not debate and it's not thinking. You've been shown up in this thread for the thoughtless parrot you are.

by Guest Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:22 am

lol so more excuses

Actually Veya, I have shown you all up, for being the most tribal hypocritical hateful lefties I have ever come across

The reality is Trump does have some very socialist view points, but because your hate is so much, you cannot see that this is a reality

I knew how you and others would react and you proved me right so wonderfully

This is why you are not rational and emotionally driven on views

by 'Wolfie Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:11 am

Didge wrote:lol so more excuses

Actually Veya, I have shown you all up, for being the most tribal hypocritical hateful lefties I have ever come across

The reality is Trump does have some very socialist view points, but because your hate is so much, you cannot see that this is a reality

I knew how you and others would react and you proved me right so wonderfully

This is why you are not rational and emotionally driven on views

Piss off Dodge, you total moron...

Nobody on here has made any kind of "excuses" or "apologies"..

While you are the one and only twat on here deflecting from the main subject -- you just keep on piling your lies upon lies, not once addressing the simple facts, that Trump hasn't proposed one action to facilitate his promises, and all that you have done is to repeat his empty bullshit, over and over.

If you believe that you can somehow claim some kind of victory with your total stupidity, you really have lost the plot.

by Guest Thu Oct 04, 2018 9:15 am

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Didge wrote:lol so more excuses

Actually Veya, I have shown you all up, for being the most tribal hypocritical hateful lefties I have ever come across

The reality is Trump does have some very socialist view points, but because your hate is so much, you cannot see that this is a reality

I knew how you and others would react and you proved me right so wonderfully

This is why you are not rational and emotionally driven on views

Piss off Dodge, you total moron...

So more to add to the list

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Do fuck off, you lying and supercilious little turd...

Despite me commenting on the actual subject of every single thread that I've posted within this week, your arrogant outright bullshit shows how you totally ignore just what others are writing..

So, please fuck off and die, you worthless and vacuous white trash racist and fascist scumbag.

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25238-incredible-moment-fearless-eight-year-old-girl-tackles-gunmen-as-they-rob-her-parents-in-the-philippines#479592

Here is a list of Wolfs abuse that admin chooses to deliberately ignore and even funnier he now wants me to die and is being racist

This is the kind of person that we have on this forum

So here they are what Wolf has said over the last couple of days

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Dodgie Doddery Didge the Delusional and Demented 'Dingus Dumbass' Dolt...
Says it all, really..

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25207-iphones-wouldn-t-be-much-more-expensive-if-made-in-america-but-america-couldn-t-do-it#479498

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Oh, do bugger off you fuck-brained moron...

I have been commenting on her article all along, you sniveling little weasel-mouthed turd..

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25247-california-the-not-so-golden-state#479477

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Only since you joined the fray, DodderyTwat...

Sod off, you malignant snowflake..

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25238-incredible-moment-fearless-eight-year-old-girl-tackles-gunmen-as-they-rob-her-parents-in-the-philippines#479455

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Fuck off nicko, you lying two-faced piece of shit...

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25207-iphones-wouldn-t-be-much-more-expensive-if-made-in-america-but-america-couldn-t-do-it#479440

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Listen up, you stupid fuckbrain corporatist suck-up...

Trump isn't supporting anything, you hopeless lying piece of shit..

.

http://www.newsfixboard.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Fuck off, Dodge, you pathetic weaseling little Quisling...

Having watched a couple of of that brainless clowns bullshit video rants in the past, he is nothing but a stupid apologist for other equally braindead and delusional far-right-wing fuckups, providing them with more vacuous and meaningless ammunition to throw at their opponents...

No wonder, then, that you so readily lap up his wrong-headed and hatemongering drivel..

His idiotic and lying rambles are right up your alley, doddery one.

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25194p150-attempted-rapist-to-be-appointed-to-supreme-court#479255

by nicko Thu Oct 04, 2018 12:00 pm

Anger Management courses are free !

by Original Quill Tue Oct 09, 2018 7:42 pm

nicko wrote:Anger Management courses are free !

Didge wrote:Actually Veya, I have shown you all up, for being the most tribal hypocritical hateful lefties I have ever come across

Narcissist management classes are not free, but well worth the price. Laughing

by 'Wolfie Wed Oct 10, 2018 10:48 am

Didge wrote:
WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Piss off Dodge, you total moron...

So more to add to the list

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Do fuck off, you lying and supercilious little turd...

Despite me commenting on the actual subject of every single thread that I've posted within this week, your arrogant outright bullshit shows how you totally ignore just what others are writing..

So, please fuck off and die, you worthless and vacuous white trash racist and fascist scumbag.
http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25238-incredible-moment-fearless-eight-year-old-girl-tackles-gunmen-as-they-rob-her-parents-in-the-philippines#479592

Here is a list of Wolfs abuse that admin chooses to deliberately ignore and even funnier he now wants me to die and is being racist

This is the kind of person that we have on this forum

So here they are what Wolf has said over the last couple of days

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Dodgie Doddery Didge the Delusional and Demented 'Dingus Dumbass' Dolt...
Says it all, really..

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25207-iphones-wouldn-t-be-much-more-expensive-if-made-in-america-but-america-couldn-t-do-it#479498

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Oh, do bugger off you fuck-brained moron...

I have been commenting on her article all along, you sniveling little weasel-mouthed turd..

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25247-california-the-not-so-golden-state#479477

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Only since you joined the fray, DodderyTwat...

Sod off, you malignant snowflake..

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25238-incredible-moment-fearless-eight-year-old-girl-tackles-gunmen-as-they-rob-her-parents-in-the-philippines#479455

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Fuck off nicko, you lying two-faced piece of shit...

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25207-iphones-wouldn-t-be-much-more-expensive-if-made-in-america-but-america-couldn-t-do-it#479440

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:
Listen up, you stupid fuckbrain corporatist suck-up...

Trump isn't supporting anything, you hopeless lying piece of shit..

.

http://www.newsfixboard.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Fuck off, Dodge, you pathetic weaseling little Quisling...

Having watched a couple of of that brainless clowns bullshit video rants in the past, he is nothing but a stupid apologist for other equally braindead and delusional far-right-wing fuckups, providing them with more vacuous and meaningless ammunition to throw at their opponents...

No wonder, then, that you so readily lap up his wrong-headed and hatemongering drivel..

His idiotic and lying rambles are right up your alley, doddery one.

http://www.newsfixboard.com/t25194p150-attempted-rapist-to-be-appointed-to-supreme-court#479255

"The Collective Wisdom of Chairman Wolfie"

You should blow those quotes up to poster size, Dodge, and then frame them..

And hang it up on your kitchen wall to remind you of those 'few home truths' every morning...

Razz

by nicko Wed Oct 10, 2018 12:40 pm

He's one of "the Founding Fathers " so his mates will stick by him, obvious isn't it ?

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