Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home

by Guest Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:53 am

First topic message reminder :

Two teenage girls have been found guilty of murdering a 39-year-old woman in her own home. The pair, who cannot be named for legal reasons, were convicted of the murder of alcoholic Angela Wrightson by a jury at Leeds Crown Court. The teenagers were aged 13 and 14 when they killed Wrightson in December 2014.

Wrightson was found dead in her blood-spattered living room in Hartlepool, County Durham, with more than 100 injuries.

Both girls were in tears after the verdicts and were led from the dock immediately.

The seven-week trial heard that the girls used a variety of weapons, including a coffee table and a computer printer, to carry out the “sustained and brutal” attack over a prolonged period.

Wrightson was found naked from the waist down and grit and shards of glass had been scattered over her, jurors heard.

The teenagers beat Wrightson to death over a period of several hours, before phoning police and asking for a lift home. While being transported in the police van they took a selfie, the jury heard.

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/teenage-girls-found-guilty-of-angela-wrightson-murder_uk_5703c639e4b069ef5c00df92?utm_hp_ref=uk

Hope the Judge hits them with the longest sentence possible

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:07 pm

Syl wrote:I don't believe anyone is born evil.
Had these girls had a decent home life I doubt they would have gone on to kill anyone.
Child killers are very rare (and 13 and 14 year olds are children) the children that have killed in recent times have all been (as far as I know) from disturbed backgrounds.

The parents have to take some of the blame.

No matter how heinous the crime they have commited still need all the help they can get.

The youngest girl had a decent home life apparently, but she was uncontrollable so her parents had to get help, and she was fostered at the time. The oldest girl had a worse home life.

I just think that people forget about the victim, who also had a tough life as a child, and had problems of her own, but didn't spend nine hours torturing anyone and beating them to death.

by Guest Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:08 pm

Tommy stated >>> The high crime rates you showed are hardly 'opinion' now are they...!?

And the rest is irrelevant waffle as far as the case in question is concerned...

But I don't think any 2 murderers like these two girls would be given anything other than proper prison custody anywhere... regardless of race...

Trying to be 'COY' or blatantly 'OBTUSE' does not serve you well, dear Tommy!

And if the "rest is irrelevant waffle" - basically means: a.) you didn't bother to read it or b.) you couldn't comprehend the written words! tongue

"regardless of race"...twisting the topic from the stats & data right around to "regardless of race" when it's clearly not a part of that case in the least is just another low bar method of moving the goal posts when you've got ZERO to supply for a rejoinder! DONE, you bore me...yet again! Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 1191311443

Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 1191311443

by Syl Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:13 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Syl wrote:I don't believe anyone is born evil.
Had these girls had a decent home life I doubt they would have gone on to kill anyone.
Child killers are very rare (and 13 and 14 year olds are children) the children that have killed in recent times have all been (as far as I know) from disturbed backgrounds.

The parents have to take some of the blame.

No matter how heinous the crime they have commited still need all the help they can get.

The youngest girl had a decent home life apparently, but she was uncontrollable so her parents had to get help, and she was fostered at the time. The oldest girl had a worse home life.

I just think that people forget about the victim, who also had a tough life as a child, and had problems of her own, but didn't spend nine hours torturing anyone and beating them to death.

I don't think wanting to help these two (for the sake of society if not for their sake) diminishes the pity anyone would feel for their victim or the victims family though.

I also wonder if the two girls had not met each other whether either of them would have acted so despicably.
They obviously egged each other on.
A bit like Thompson and Venables....and even adult killers like Hindley and Brady....deadly duos who may not have acted in the way they did without each other.

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:18 pm

Syl wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

The youngest girl had a decent home life apparently, but she was uncontrollable so her parents had to get help, and she was fostered at the time. The oldest girl had a worse home life.

I just think that people forget about the victim, who also had a tough life as a child, and had problems of her own, but didn't spend nine hours torturing anyone and beating them to death.

I don't think wanting to help these two (for the sake of society if not for their sake) diminishes the pity anyone would feel for their victim or the victims family though.

I also wonder if the two girls had not met each other whether either of them would have acted so despicably.
They obviously egged each other on.
A bit like Thompson and Venables....and even adult killers like Hindley and Brady....deadly duos who may not have acted in the way they did without each other.

It shouldn't just be pity should it? It should be a desire for justice and to see these girls punished properly IMO.

People who knew both girls said they were OK on their own, but awful when they were together. I think the sister of the oldest girl tried to keep the other one away from her.

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:20 pm

I just think if it had been a relative of mine who was killed in such an awful way, I'd want to slap anyone who said that the girls needed "help", especially if they expressed any sympathy for me. I'd tell them I didn't need their sympathy if they felt so sorry for the murderers.

by Syl Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:37 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:I just think if it had been a relative of mine who was killed in such an awful way, I'd want to slap anyone who said that the girls needed "help", especially if they expressed any sympathy for me. I'd tell them I didn't need their sympathy if they felt so sorry for the murderers.

Well yes, I don't think a relative could accept that the girls deserve to be helped , that's human nature.

But what is the alternative? The girls will serve their time, they will be continuously assessed and then more than likely released.
If they haven't had help and kindness God knows what they will be capable of?
It's in societies interest to try to rehabilitate them so they can fit back into society without harming anyone else.

Maybe they cant be helped, but maybe they can, and surely it's better to try.

by Guest Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:39 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:I just think if it had been a relative of mine who was killed in such an awful way, I'd want to slap anyone who said that the girls needed "help", especially if they expressed any sympathy for me. I'd tell them I didn't need their sympathy if they felt so sorry for the murderers.

Well...hopefully, you'd have a genuine/ sincere group of friends that would never say such a heinous thing to you---and as this is a group of adults just kicking around our thoughts about this crime

There isn't any thing we can do to change what DID HAPPEN, but give our thoughts & feelings for the two cretin/dope heads that will be free at some point in our life time Rolling Eyes

We aren't collectively blaming the VICTIM...nothing we say or do will change the heinous event.

by Ben Reilly Fri Apr 08, 2016 8:58 pm

eddie wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:
eddie wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:That's why we have prisons eddie...!!!

Well yes I know Tommy! That's why I'm not getting what vic is getting at.

So what did you mean when you said they should be given a chance and given help etc...?

Counselling and help, whilst they're serving their time, to find out what made them do it.

Or are people just simply born evil?

That's a general question btw, not just directed at you

Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 Render_definition

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:01 pm

4EVER2 wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:I just think if it had been a relative of mine who was killed in such an awful way, I'd want to slap anyone who said that the girls needed "help", especially if they expressed any sympathy for me. I'd tell them I didn't need their sympathy if they felt so sorry for the murderers.
Well...hopefully, you'd have a genuine/ sincere group of friends that would never say such a heinous thing to you---and as this is a group of adults just kicking around our thoughts about this crime There isn't any thing we can do to change what DID HAPPEN, but give our thoughts & feelings for the two cretin/dope heads that will be free at some point in our life time

We aren't collectively blaming the VICTIM...nothing we say or do will change the heinous event.

I'm not suggesting that anyone is blaming the victim, but all this stuff about how the girls need help makes them sound like they're the victims. They'll be on licence when they're released, and if they step out of line just once, they'll be back in prison. I don't think anyone needs to make sure they're "happy" and have a "nice life" when they come out.

by eddie Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:01 pm

Are you calling me a psychopath?

by Raggamuffin Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:07 pm

I think these girls are sociopaths rather than psychopaths.

by Tommy Monk Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:18 pm

4EVER2 wrote:
Tommy stated >>> The high crime rates you showed are hardly 'opinion' now are they...!?

And the rest is irrelevant waffle as far as the case in question is concerned...

But I don't think any 2 murderers like these two girls would be given anything other than proper prison custody anywhere... regardless of race...

Trying to be 'COY' or blatantly 'OBTUSE' does not serve you well, dear Tommy!

And if the "rest is irrelevant waffle" - basically means: a.) you didn't bother to read it or b.) you couldn't comprehend the written words!

"regardless of race"...twisting the topic from the stats & data right around to "regardless of race" when it's clearly not a part of that case in the least is just another low bar method of moving the goal posts when you've got ZERO to supply for a rejoinder! DONE, you bore me...yet again!

Not coy or obtuse... just astute...

And did read it as well as understand it... hence my comment as to it being irrelevant...

And the attempt to introduce some irrelevant race aspect was also yours... and... irrelevant...!

by Tommy Monk Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:22 pm

Syl wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

The youngest girl had a decent home life apparently, but she was uncontrollable so her parents had to get help, and she was fostered at the time. The oldest girl had a worse home life.

I just think that people forget about the victim, who also had a tough life as a child, and had problems of her own, but didn't spend nine hours torturing anyone and beating them to death.

I don't think wanting to help these two (for the sake of society if not for their sake) diminishes the pity anyone would feel for their victim or the victims family though.

I also wonder if the two girls had not met each other whether either of them would have acted so despicably.
They obviously egged each other on.
A bit like Thompson and Venables....and even adult killers like Hindley and Brady....deadly duos who may not have acted in the way they did without each other.

Help them...?

How...?

Won't they be getting plenty of 'help' in prison...?

Or by 'help' do you mean not going to prison...?

by 'Wolfie Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:46 am

MAYBE the best form of "therapy" for those ttwo would be a frontap lobotomy ?

JUST wondering...

by Syl Sat Apr 09, 2016 5:29 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
Syl wrote:

I don't think wanting to help these two (for the sake of society if not for their sake) diminishes the pity anyone would feel for their victim or the victims family though.

I also wonder if the two girls had not met each other whether either of them would have acted so despicably.
They obviously egged each other on.
A bit like Thompson and Venables....and even adult killers like Hindley and Brady....deadly duos who may not have acted in the way they did without each other.

Help them...?

How...?

Won't they be getting plenty of 'help' in prison...?

Or by 'help' do you mean not going to prison...?

Therapy and schooling, talking, psychiatric help....any sort of help that might one day ensure they could live productive lives.
Of course they should be locked up, and I don't know whether either of them would ever be able to fit back into society.....but the likelihood is the more help they get the more likely they will......hopefully anyway.

What would be your solution...throw away the key for ever?

by Ben Reilly Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:16 pm

eddie wrote:Are you calling me a psychopath?

Nah, I was just doing this thing yesterday where I tried to participate here without actually typing any words Smile

I think you could say that psychopaths are "born evil," in that their brains actually lack an empathy center and they really are not like the rest of us.

by eddie Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:18 pm

Ben_Reilly wrote:
eddie wrote:Are you calling me a psychopath?

Nah, I was just doing this thing yesterday where I tried to participate here without actually typing any words I think you could say that psychopaths are "born evil," in that their brains actually lack an empathy center and they really are not like the rest of us.

Typing without words.
How the fuck did you log on then? Suspect

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:33 pm

Syl wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:

Help them...?

How...?

Won't they be getting plenty of 'help' in prison...?

Or by 'help' do you mean not going to prison...?

Therapy and schooling, talking, psychiatric help....any sort of help that might one day ensure they could live productive lives.
Of course they should be locked up, and I don't know whether either of them would ever be able to fit back into society.....but the likelihood is the more help they get the more likely they will......hopefully anyway.

What would be your solution...throw away the key for ever?

So where does the actual punishment and the justice for Angela come in? If they're getting all that, with people being nice to them, the only difference is that they can't go out in the streets. What is a "productive life" anyway? You mean that they should be helped to be happy? They didn't need any help with that when they spent all those hours giggling away whilst beating a defenceless woman to death, so why should they need it now?

by Syl Sat Apr 09, 2016 6:55 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Syl wrote:

Therapy and schooling, talking, psychiatric help....any sort of help that might one day ensure they could live productive lives.
Of course they should be locked up, and I don't know whether either of them would ever be able to fit back into society.....but the likelihood is the more help they get the more likely they will......hopefully anyway.

What would be your solution...throw away the key for ever?

So where does the actual punishment and the justice for Angela come in? If they're getting all that, with people being nice to them, the only difference is that they can't go out in the streets. What is a "productive life" anyway? You mean that they should be helped to be happy? They didn't need any help with that when they spent all those hours giggling away whilst beating a defenceless woman to death, so why should they need it now?

The punishment is that their freedom has been taken away, I cant think if anything worse can you?

These are young girls, if you treat them like lepers for their time inside they will never ever grow into worthwhile human beings. So unless they are assessed as being totally insane they will be released one day.
Would you rather them come out as bad as they were when they went in, or taught how to be decent human beings, which can only be done through care?

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:10 pm

Syl wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

So where does the actual punishment and the justice for Angela come in? If they're getting all that, with people being nice to them, the only difference is that they can't go out in the streets. What is a "productive life" anyway? You mean that they should be helped to be happy? They didn't need any help with that when they spent all those hours giggling away whilst beating a defenceless woman to death, so why should they need it now?

The punishment is that their freedom has been taken away, I cant think if anything worse can you?

These are young girls, if you treat them like lepers for their time inside they will never ever grow into worthwhile human beings. So unless they are assessed as being totally insane they will be released one day.
Would you rather them come out as bad as they were when they went in, or taught how to be decent human beings, which can only be done through care?

So they're supposed to be unhappy in prison, right? That's the punishment for what they did. I would rather they came out and decided that it was so awful in prison that they wouldn't risk going back there by putting one foot wrong. I'm not sure that happens though.

by Syl Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:28 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Syl wrote:

The punishment is that their freedom has been taken away, I cant think if anything worse can you?

These are young girls, if you treat them like lepers for their time inside they will never ever grow into worthwhile human beings. So unless they are assessed as being totally insane they will be released one day.
Would you rather them come out as bad as they were when they went in, or taught how to be decent human beings, which can only be done through care?

So they're supposed to be unhappy in prison, right? That's the punishment for what they did. I would rather they came out and decided that it was so awful in prison that they wouldn't risk going back there by putting one foot wrong. I'm not sure that happens though.

They may not be unhappy once they get used to it, some people become institutionalised, and they are so young by the time they have served their 15 years they wont know anything else.
There have been so few child killers in the UK that it's hard to know how these two girls will turn out.

The Bulger killers didn't fare so well...at least one of them didn't...the other one has stayed out of the public eye.
Mary Bell seemed to fit back into society, she became a mother and then a grandmother and seems to have lived a quiet life since.

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:45 pm

Syl wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

So they're supposed to be unhappy in prison, right? That's the punishment for what they did. I would rather they came out and decided that it was so awful in prison that they wouldn't risk going back there by putting one foot wrong. I'm not sure that happens though.

They may not be unhappy once they get used to it, some people become institutionalised, and they are so young by the time they have served their 15 years they wont know anything else.
There have been so few child killers in the UK that it's hard to know how these two girls will turn out.

The Bulger killers didn't fare so well...at least one of them didn't...the other one has stayed out of the public eye.
Mary Bell seemed to fit back into society, she became a mother and then a grandmother and seems to have lived a quiet life since.

I don't get where the punishment fits in if they're not unhappy in prison. I don't think the idea should be just that they "fit into" society, I think they're supposed be punished - ie, feel pissed off rather a lot. I don't think it's enough that they don't offend again - a person died at their hands in a really horrible manner, so why they should have a nice life?

by Syl Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:52 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
Syl wrote:

They may not be unhappy once they get used to it, some people become institutionalised, and they are so young by the time they have served their 15 years they wont know anything else.
There have been so few child killers in the UK that it's hard to know how these two girls will turn out.

The Bulger killers didn't fare so well...at least one of them didn't...the other one has stayed out of the public eye.
Mary Bell seemed to fit back into society, she became a mother and then a grandmother and seems to have lived a quiet life since.

I don't get where the punishment fits in if they're not unhappy in prison. I don't think the idea should be just that they "fit into" society, I think they're supposed be punished - ie, feel pissed off rather a lot. I don't think it's enough that they don't offend again - a person died at their hands in a really horrible manner, so why they should have a nice life?

What would you suggest then Rags?
My point is if you treat them like human beings they may one day start to act like human beings.

And they are being punished by having their freedom taken away.

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:56 pm

What I'm thinking is that all murders of that type are not the same. If they had bashed her a couple of times in a temper, then felt dreadful and confessed straightaway, that would be a completely different matter. One of the main issues for me is their awful callousness afterwards - no shame whatsoever. They were delighted they'd done it, they loved it, they giggled about it.

I think that the way someone behaves after committing such a crime is very relevant. Look at Jodie Arias, for example. She just carried on as normal, denied everything, and even went to Travis Alexander's funeral to pay her respects. Then she made up a load of nonsense about armed men killing him. Then there was Jane Andrews, who killed her boyfriend, and then claimed it was self defence.

The difference is that if someone was immediately sorry they'd done it, their own conscience would be a punishment, but if they were happy, indifferent, or if they blamed the victim, their conscience isn't going to bother them, so where is the punishment, other than not being able to pop down the shop or to a pub when they want to?

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 7:58 pm

Syl wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

I don't get where the punishment fits in if they're not unhappy in prison. I don't think the idea should be just that they "fit into" society, I think they're supposed be punished - ie, feel pissed off rather a lot. I don't think it's enough that they don't offend again - a person died at their hands in a really horrible manner, so why they should have a nice life?

What would you suggest then Rags?
My point is if you treat them like human beings they may one day start to act like human beings.

And they are being punished by having their freedom taken away.

I don't think it's enough Syl. As you said, they'd probably get used to being in prison. I think that they need to be treated a bit more harshly than getting a nice lot of counselling from a sympathetic person so they can be happy when they come out. Angela didn't get that chance to be happy did she?

by Syl Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:05 pm

No she didn't.
But no matter how these girls are treated in prison Angela is dead....and just maybe, by treating these girls with kindness, showing them empathy, something they obviously lack, they wont hurt anyone else when they are released.

I just think if you treat people badly they react by treating others badly.

by Syl Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:08 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:What I'm thinking is that all murders of that type are not the same. If they had bashed her a couple of times in a temper, then felt dreadful and confessed straightaway, that would be a completely different matter. One of the main issues for me is their awful callousness afterwards - no shame whatsoever. They were delighted they'd done it, they loved it, they giggled about it.

I think that the way someone behaves after committing such a crime is very relevant. Look at Jodie Arias, for example. She just carried on as normal, denied everything, and even went to Travis Alexander's funeral to pay her respects. Then she made up a load of nonsense about armed men killing him. Then there was Jane Andrews, who killed her boyfriend, and then claimed it was self defence.

The difference is that if someone was immediately sorry they'd done it, their own conscience would be a punishment, but if they were happy, indifferent, or if they blamed the victim, their conscience isn't going to bother them, so where is the punishment, other than not being able to pop down the shop or to a pub when they want to?

These were adults though. I think children have to be treated differently.

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:10 pm

Syl wrote:No she didn't.
But no matter how these girls are treated in prison Angela is dead....and just maybe, by treating these girls with kindness, showing them empathy, something they obviously lack, they wont hurt anyone else when they are released.

I just think if you treat people badly they react by treating others badly.

I don't think it's enough that they don't hurt anyone else, I think they need to be punished properly re the person they did hurt - so badly that she died. She suffered greatly, so I don't think it's enough for them to be "helped" to be happy enough not to want to hurt someone else. They took a life and they were very happy to do so - they didn't care at all that she suffered, or they were pleased that she suffered.

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:11 pm

Syl wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:What I'm thinking is that all murders of that type are not the same. If they had bashed her a couple of times in a temper, then felt dreadful and confessed straightaway, that would be a completely different matter. One of the main issues for me is their awful callousness afterwards - no shame whatsoever. They were delighted they'd done it, they loved it, they giggled about it.

I think that the way someone behaves after committing such a crime is very relevant. Look at Jodie Arias, for example. She just carried on as normal, denied everything, and even went to Travis Alexander's funeral to pay her respects. Then she made up a load of nonsense about armed men killing him. Then there was Jane Andrews, who killed her boyfriend, and then claimed it was self defence.

The difference is that if someone was immediately sorry they'd done it, their own conscience would be a punishment, but if they were happy, indifferent, or if they blamed the victim, their conscience isn't going to bother them, so where is the punishment, other than not being able to pop down the shop or to a pub when they want to?

These were adults though. I think children have to be treated differently.

I don't really make that distinction. They weren't babies, they knew what they were doing, and they enjoyed it.

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:14 pm

I just feel so badly for this poor lady who was killed. I don't know if she had a happy life until then. She was an alcoholic, so she probably didn't. She never had a chance to improve her life, but they will get every chance - at a younger age than she was when they murdered her and took away any chance she might have had. I don't see why someone under the age of 18 is more important than a woman of 39.

by Guest Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:20 pm

Syl wrote:No she didn't.
But no matter how these girls are treated in prison Angela is dead....and just maybe, by treating these girls with kindness, showing them empathy, something they obviously lack, they wont hurt anyone else when they are released.

I just think if you treat people badly they react by treating others badly.

Yipper, dead is dead and no matter the method or how long it took to obtain that for the victim...becoming OCD about the adjudicated punishment handed down by your judicial system isn't going to change that issue, Raggs!

Seems you have more greater concerns with the method of your penal/incarceration system then you have about the limited laws that are on your books for the judges to use when awarding the sentence? Granted, IMO - incarceration doesn't change much for the worst of the mentally deranged that end up in there - but unless England wants to up the anti and put those heinous butt-wipes to death; Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 2190311264

Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 2190311264

it is what it is. And the faint at heart were the ones that did away with capitol punishment: torture - treating humans to the dungeon - all sorts of really wicked methods for punishment and several methods for death: hanging/beheading/shooting/bonfires/electrocution/poisoning/gas chambers and finally - medical injections. Not that jolly-ole' England had all of those 'death options' but England had some of the worst of the worst for dealing out punishments.

So now your country - much like several states over here; allow the heinous as much a 3 square meals, A/C and heated beds, medical & mental health benefits, clothing, entertainment, access to educational material, exercise and relatively clean & safe habitat.

It is what it is...I too have my soapbox

issues regarding heinous crimes against children and animals --- but I'm in the minority about the method of punishment for those high crimes and heinous acts. And I'm still a firm believer in the Death Penalty and the need for it.

BTW - being 'HAPPY' or finding 'HAPPINESS' is just subjective; what you deem that they shouldn't have access to and what the laws of your country have established for their mental well being...well the one doesn't always suit our desires for proper punishment. But what's a girl to do?

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:25 pm

Dead is dead? Oh well, why bother to send anyone to prison then? They don't get sent to prison just to stop them killing anyone else - it's supposed to be a punishment for what they already did. The best way for these girls to finally understand what they put Angela through is to suffer themselves, not be mollycoddled and live happily ever after. Angela's mother isn't dead is she? She's suffering isn't she?

You know what? When Jon Venables was arrested again, Denise Fergus said she was outraged that he'd offended again. I think she was also probably happy to find out that he wasn't living a happy and productive life

by Guest Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:39 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:Dead is dead? Oh well, why bother to send anyone to prison then? They don't get sent to prison just to stop them killing anyone else - it's supposed to be a punishment for what they already did. The best way for these girls to finally understand what they put Angela through is to suffer themselves, not be mollycoddled and live happily ever after. Angela's mother isn't dead is she? She's suffering isn't she?

You know what? When Jon Venables was arrested again, Denise Fergus said she was outraged that he'd offended again. I think she was also probably happy to find out that he wasn't living a happy and productive life

Then your angst and persistence about the 'MOLLYCODDLED' method of your incarceration/penal system will be hearing from you confused

You'll put that energy towards becoming an activist for REFORM & CHANGE instead of just barking about it on community forum rooms?
Seriously, have you ever phoned any representative and started a push for change...you are the exact type of human that can get something started and if there's already a group/committee/agency working toward changes within the prison system --- you'd be highly beneficial for that agenda.
People far to often stand along the sidelines and maintain a high degree of frustration...when there are groups that need YOUR assistance and would benefit from your caring and energy.

Put all of that angst to work Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 2418298

Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 2418298

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:45 pm

I don't actually know how they treat prisoners, I'm just a bit .. you know .. at the idea that these girls should be perceived as victims who need to be helped to have a happy life. I just don't think that some people have any conception of what they did, how they did it, and how much they enjoyed doing it. Then they actually denied it instead of showing any kind of shame or remorse.

by Guest Sat Apr 09, 2016 8:54 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:I don't actually know how they treat prisoners, I'm just a bit .. you know .. at the idea that these girls should be perceived as victims who need to be helped to have a happy life. I just don't think that some people have any conception of what they did, how they did it, and how much they enjoyed doing it. Then they actually denied it instead of showing any kind of shame or remorse.

Ya, I completely understand...my big WTF are those pedophiles/child rapists/sexual abusive humans that just keep getting kick back out onto society---dip them in glow in the dark paint/brand their foreheads with some identifier mark so that no child will be subjected to their BS and attacks.

But mental - anti social humans are always going to pop up in every culture; and as with these two horrid cretins --- they seem predestined to find someone exactly like their own twisted/sick - lacking a conscience thought process and do someone IN. Evil or Very Mad

And I still believe in the death penalty; certain humans just can't be FIXED and will never be safe to be released back out here to prey upon hapless humans.

by Raggamuffin Sat Apr 09, 2016 9:18 pm

I don't support the death penalty myself because I don't think the State has the right to take someone's life in revenge for what they did to someone else. As a punishment, I guess it's the lead up to it which is the real killer - if someone just snuck into their cell while they were asleep and injected them, it wouldn't be the same thing.

I think what's bothering me is the idea that these girls will never be sorry for what they did because they might be told it's not their fault - it was their upbringing, lack of care, lack of guidance, etc. None of that will ever explain why they took so much pleasure in what they did, and teaching them that they're victims too will just reinforce their idea that they're not responsible and that it was "understandable" that they did what they did and laughed about it.

by Tommy Monk Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:16 pm

Syl wrote:
Tommy Monk wrote:

Help them...?

How...?

Won't they be getting plenty of 'help' in prison...?

Or by 'help' do you mean not going to prison...?

Therapy and schooling, talking, psychiatric help....any sort of help that might one day ensure they could live productive lives.
Of course they should be locked up, and I don't know whether either of them would ever be able to fit back into society.....but the likelihood is the more help they get the more likely they will......hopefully anyway.

What would be your solution...throw away the key for ever?

So you think that they should go to prison and the type of prison that gives them plenty of 'help'...?

Which is exactly what IS going to be happening!

Why did you and others think anything else was in store for them...?

by Tommy Monk Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:25 pm

Ben_Reilly wrote:
eddie wrote:Are you calling me a psychopath?

Nah, I was just doing this thing yesterday where I tried to participate here without actually typing any words I think you could say that psychopaths are "born evil," in that their brains actually lack an empathy center and they really are not like the rest of us.

Nobody is saying either of these two girls were actual psychopaths or not... but besides that... there are plenty of them about who never do any crime, let alone go on to commit a brutal/sadistic murder!

I remember seeing a programme/documentary on it where a usa police officer was pursuing the story and looking into it... he was saying there was a characteristic difference in brain structure/activity that was found throughout known psychopath murderers that could be seen in a scan...

But then he had a scan of his own only to find HE HAD THE SAME DIFFERENCE IN HIS OWN BRAIN!!!

Then after further tests and assessments it was confirmed that he had this trait... but never had any criminal or murderous inclinations... HE WAS A POLICE OFFICER!!!

by Guest Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:38 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
Ben_Reilly wrote:
Nah, I was just doing this thing yesterday where I tried to participate here without actually typing any words I think you could say that psychopaths are "born evil," in that their brains actually lack an empathy center and they really are not like the rest of us.
Nobody is saying either of these two girls were actual psychopaths or not... but besides that... there are plenty of them about who never do any crime, let alone go on to commit a brutal/sadistic murder!

I remember seeing a programme/documentary on it where a usa police officer was pursuing the story and looking into it... he was saying there was a characteristic difference in brain structure/activity that was found throughout known psychopath murderers that could be seen in a scan...
But then he had a scan of his own only to find HE HAD THE SAME DIFFERENCE IN HIS OWN BRAIN!!!
Then after further tests and assessments it was confirmed that he had this trait... but never had any criminal or murderous inclinations... HE WAS A POLICE OFFICER!!!

Interesting...but hasn't that been shown with our latest studies/grant research for Alzheimer's ...that we all share some specific brain pattern/traits but it's how we were raised from birth!
Those ever so important informative years, when our human brains are learning at such a rapid pace; parental guidance from baby to 5th grade years. Repeated corrective social training and firm - yet loving guidance; we just don't drop out of the womb knowing how to enter act - knowing that the pot is 'HOT' - that NO, really means 'NO DON'T DO THAT'...it's all a cohesive/evolving process...that some humans just don't GET IT or are never exposed TO IT?

See, I can only speak from my own experience; mom's 'NO', was iffy...until she gritted her teeth and spoke through her clinched jaw --- but dad...his 'NO' was a FIRM 'NO', unless you wanted a FIRM SWAT ON THE ARSE! Shocked

But I was taught some serious social skills/social graces/and with 5 siblings...I learned the Pecking Order real quickly Rolling Eyes

by Tommy Monk Sat Apr 09, 2016 10:54 pm

Plenty of people have shitty upbringings but never do crime or murder... while some of those with great upbringings sometimes do...!

by Guest Sat Apr 09, 2016 11:07 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:Plenty of people have shitty upbringings but never do crime or murder... while some of those with great upbringings sometimes do...!

And as you've stated that empathically numerous time before; EXACTLY and by your very own example --- {police officer's brain scan} proves that while we all have a lot in common ---

You do get 'IT'; that there's still a lot about our brain functions/emotional reactions and what will set someone off and the same stimuli won't phase another human exposed to that same scenario scratch

by Tommy Monk Sat Apr 09, 2016 11:21 pm

But the lefties say 'we're all the same'...

by Guest Sat Apr 09, 2016 11:40 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:But the lefties say 'we're all the same'...

WHAT??? More generalizations... Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 1094176690

Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 1094176690

STOP IT~~~ Teenage Girls Found Guilty Of ‘Sustained And Brutal’ Murder Of Alcoholic Angela Wrightson In Her Own Home - Page 4 2728977919

by Sponsored content