MURDERED FOR BEING IN A CAR - AND THE PROOF IS NOW THERE.

First topic message reminder :

They are burning our hearts and souls,
The Palestinian youth Malek Talal Eshsharif from Hebron city, was executed by Fascist Zionist occupation forces few hours ago at the junction of the illegal Kfar Ezion colony at road 60...He was on his way back from Jordan, when the service car arrived at this junction the fascist soldiers stopped the car, asked for everyone's IDs, then asked him to get out of the car and just shot him, as simple as that, killing a Palestinian is as simple as that, they will not be asked by their superiors to justify what they did, as a matter of fact they will be promoted, the more you kill the more you will be recognized, these fascist have clear orders to shot and kill at their convenience, 5 November 2015.




I don't give a damn what didge calls it, THIS IS THE TRUTH, THIS IS WHAT THOSE SCUMBAGS ARE DOING, DAY AFTER DAY.

If she wasn't paying attention to the road, how could the soldiers know that? All they knew was that someone drove at them and didn't slow down. The chap filming was gesturing, but it's not clear what he wanted her to do.

They couldn't possibly have known who was in the car, and that she was just a granny on her way to lunch or whatever. They would have just seen a car being driven straight at them.

This is all emotive stuff. 73 isn't even that old really, and being a granny doesn't suddenly make someone a paragon of virtue.

Agreed, as I say from the position of the soldiers, they would have looked to them like an attack and to me it looks very much like an attack. As to me again (apart from poor eyesight), how could she fail not to see them. Its looks like to me he is gesturing her to pull over towards him for a stop check. Also no guns are raised at her and everyone is relaxed until she veers towards the soldiers. So there is no way it could ever be claimed this was murder or even manslaughter, hence the ridiculousness of the article, because from the position of the soldiers, it would have seemed to have been an attack. As I say with near daily attacks, how many others faced with the same situation would not have done the same?

Haaretz now reports that the IDF also claimed that it found a “commando knife” in her vehicle. If they found any such implement it was probably a paring knife she was going to use to peel fruit for lunch!

Peel fruit for lunch? Do people over there habitually take their own paring knives with them when they go somewhere for lunch?

That's clutching at straws a bit isn't it?

Raggamuffin wrote:

Haaretz now reports that the IDF also claimed that it found a “commando knife” in her vehicle.  If they found any such implement it was probably a paring knife she was going to use to peel fruit for lunch!

Peel fruit for lunch? Do people over there habitually take their own paring knives with them when they go somewhere for lunch?

That's clutching at straws a bit isn't it?

lol A commando knife being used for luch?

Indeed clutching at straws is indeed the case.

Sorry but its getting tedious how I see more in defense of those who commit terrorist attacks and that little if nothing is said about the many israeli's civillian who have been attacked. The real victims here. Its appalling to me how some have no due care and place more emphasis on trying to be apologists for terrorists.

Did you see the article I posted on the update of the other incident where the woman was shot at the bus station? She had mental health issues and attempted to kill herself by being shot and she also had a knife, which was how she intended that she would be killed by brandishing this at them?

Look, the issue isn't where she was going, how old she is, or whether she had grandchildren or not. They didn't know any of that at the time, and one's age and family circumstances do not mean that someone is not capable of doing a bad thing.

What matters is what the soldiers thought at the time, and I can see how they would have thought someone was driving straight at them. She might have been distracted, she might have panicked, or whatever, but they had no way of knowing that.

It reminds me of the Private Clegg incident, where he shot at two joyriders who went through a checkpoint in NI. Everyone was very wise after the event, and expected him to know that they were joyriders, not terrorists.

If you live in a country where there are soldiers with guns - rightly or wrongly - you don't just drive at them because ... well because they have guns, and they're there because they're expecting trouble.

This video actually backs up the early reports that the soldiers claimed that she drove at them. They didn't just randomly shoot at her as she was going into the petrol station, which is what was implied before.

Didge wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Peel fruit for lunch? Do people over there habitually take their own paring knives with them when they go somewhere for lunch?

That's clutching at straws a bit isn't it?

lol A commando knife being used for luch?

Indeed clutching at straws is indeed the case.

Sorry but its getting tedious how I see more in defense of those who commit terrorist attacks and that little if nothing is said about the many israeli's civillian who have been attacked. The real victims here. Its appalling to me how some have no due care and place more emphasis on trying to be apologists for terrorists.

Did you see the article I posted on the update of the other incident where the woman was shot at the bus station? She had mental health issues and attempted to kill herself by being shot and she also had a knife, which was how she intended that she would be killed by brandishing this at them?

Yes, I did see that update, and I meant to post about it but got distracted. I'll have a look for it now.

So the video was definitely released by the Palestinian side? I'd be interested in how they got hold of it too. It doesn't actually back up their version of events though, so I'm a bit puzzled as to why they released it.

You two are obviously seeing what you want to see.  She slowed down, didn't speed up as she would have done if she was trying to ram them, they were on the left, she went to the right of them.  What you convince yourself to believe shows everything.

sassy wrote:You two are obviously seeing what you want to see.  She slowed down, didn't speed up as she would have done if she was trying to ram them, they were on the left, she went to the right of them.  What you convince yourself to believe shows everything.

I see what I see. She didn't slow down until she turned into the petrol station. I don't know why you can't see that she didn't slow down. If you wanted to go into a petrol station and there were people standing in the road, would you just carry on regardless, drive right through them and hope they get out of the way?

There were some standing on the pavement, some right by the kerb, and some standing in the road. You say she went to the right. Well she would then have been heading straight for the ones on the pavement. Also, the ones in the road were not on the other side of the road, and they did have to move out of the way. Whichever way you look at it, she was heading towards someone.

sassy wrote:You two are obviously seeing what you want to see.  She slowed down, didn't speed up as she would have done if she was trying to ram them, they were on the left, she went to the right of them.  What you convince yourself to believe shows everything.

Then you need to go to specsavers.

You fail to look at this from the position of the soldiers or take into account the daily attacks.

It is typical apologist nonsense you create in your own mind to invent her out to being a victim. I mean not once have you commented on or shown any due care for any of the Israeli's victims and spend more of your time trying to make excuses for terrorists. Like I say because you hate Israel you alolow yourself to believe anything.
Even here I allow for other possibilities, but there is no escaping the fact from the position of the soldiers, this would have seemed like an attack and no prosecution in the world would be able to make a case for manslaughter let alone murder, based off that video evidence and the current violent climate

Sassy obviously see's what she wants to see,
is no one else full to the top with the biased bull shit she continually posts. The woman is completely obsessed with hate for Israel, it has taken over her entire life. My advice, see a shrink asap.

nicko wrote:Sassy obviously see's what she wants to see,
is no one else full to the top with the biased bull shit she continually posts. The woman is completely obsessed with hate for Israel,  it has taken over her entire life.   My advice,   see a shrink asap.

Morning Nicko

The best way I have found to deal with such extremism from someone is to easily show up how poor their arguments are and how even worse they say nothing or care for israelis that are attacked and show how in fact they are apologsists for terrorists.
They end up exposing themselves.
So let her continue to do so, everyone can see for themselves what she has become.

nicko wrote:Sassy obviously see's what she wants to see,
is no one else full to the top with the biased bull shit she continually posts. The woman is completely obsessed with hate for Israel,  it has taken over her entire life.   My advice,   see a shrink asap.

My advice - stick to what you know, which isn't much and stop flying your islamophobia like a flag to be proud of.

Didge wrote:

nicko wrote:Sassy obviously see's what she wants to see,
is no one else full to the top with the biased bull shit she continually posts. The woman is completely obsessed with hate for Israel,  it has taken over her entire life.   My advice,   see a shrink asap.

Morning Nicko

The best way I have found to deal with such extremism from someone is to easily show up how poor their arguments are and how even worse they say nothing or care for israelis that are attacked and show how in fact they are apologsists for terrorists.
They end up exposing themselves.
So let her continue to do so, everyone can see for themselves what she has become.

In your own little head sunshine, from hasbara site that people all over the world laugh at.

sassy wrote:

nicko wrote:Sassy obviously see's what she wants to see,
is no one else full to the top with the biased bull shit she continually posts. The woman is completely obsessed with hate for Israel,  it has taken over her entire life.   My advice,   see a shrink asap.

My advice - stick to what you know, which isn't much and stop flying your islamophobia like a flag to be proud of.

Well being as he has served and faced such a situation when active on duty in Northern Ireland, I would say he is far better placed than you will ever be advising what it is like to face such a situation. He has actually been shot whilst serving in Northern ireland in a hostile environment. This out of many here, Nicko is going to be best placed out of many to say, what it is like to face such a situation.

So people are going to listen to someone with experince than someone who is an apologists for terrorists as you are.

These dramatic thread titles do encourage me to have a look, and I generally find that they're not very accurate. I mean, look at this one - "murdered for being in a car". Of course I'm going to question that, and it's clear that nobody was murdered just because they were in a car.

Exactly Rags, and to me this is the issue, it is such articles that filter down onto the ground where word of mouth is spread with such falsifications, that lead then to incitement and then further attacks. The media is very much irresponsible for what they post on their wedsites and clearly have no due care for how they are inciting violence. Again its as a clear as day, with thiose facing this situation that many people in the same position facing daily attacks would have done the same.

The title should really include the word "allegedly" because there's no evidence that the woman was murdered as such.

Palestinian media claimed that the suspect was shot because she drove into a street that was closed to traffic.

"My mother went to eat lunch at Ras-al-Jura and she stopped to fill her car with gas. The soldiers shot her in cold blood and executed her for no reason," her son Ayoub said.

So was the road closed to traffic? There is one other car approaching, but very little traffic generally. Someone driving down a road which was closed would of course make the soldiers suspicious straight away.

You see here again this claim that she stopped for petrol. There is no evidence that her intention was to pull into the petrol station.

http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Palestinian-media-Video-of-alleged-car-ramming-attack-shows-IDF-executed-suspect-432323

Agreed and to me it is completely unjustified that headline and again even worse is irresponsible as it will lead to more incitement. I really do think that some of the media need to be held accountable if a link is found that an unsubstanciated article led to a violent attack.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Palestinian media claimed that the suspect was shot because she drove into a street that was closed to traffic.

"My mother went to eat lunch at Ras-al-Jura and she stopped to fill her car with gas. The soldiers shot her in cold blood and executed her for no reason," her son Ayoub said.  

So was the road closed to traffic? There is one other car approaching, but very little traffic generally. Someone driving down a road which was closed would of course make the soldiers suspicious straight away.

You see here again this claim that she stopped for petrol. There is no evidence that her intention was to pull into the petrol station.

http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Palestinian-media-Video-of-alleged-car-ramming-attack-shows-IDF-executed-suspect-432323

This is why the Video evidence clearly refutes many of the claims

Well done the IDF soldier who saw the injustice in what really happened and handed the video over so the truth could be known. Murder in anyone's book -shoot first to kill when they clearly could have just shot out tyres to stop the vehicle. No swerve nothing. Another planted knife obviously. Shocking.

Irn Bru wrote:Well done the IDF soldier who saw the injustice in what really happened and handed the video over so the truth could be known. Murder in anyone's book -shoot first to kill when they clearly could have just shot out tyres to stop the vehicle. No swerve nothing. Another planted knife obviously. Shocking.

Is that what happened? He handed it over?

The thing is that it doesn't back up what the other side are saying, does it?

sassy wrote:As I said, who said it is the only entrance?  Why would you have one entrance/exit to a petrol station with alll those stands, it would be chaos.  And the link confirms she was driving into it when then shot her.  She could have carried on for a few yard after being shot, unable to control the car properly.   So she was in a gas station, in her car, and they shot her.

The video refutes this. She was not driving into the petrol station when they shot at the car, and they certainly shot at it before she was in the petrol station.

At least we know there was no other entrance involved though.

Raggamuffin wrote:

sassy wrote:As I said, who said it is the only entrance?  Why would you have one entrance/exit to a petrol station with alll those stands, it would be chaos.  And the link confirms she was driving into it when then shot her.  She could have carried on for a few yard after being shot, unable to control the car properly.   So she was in a gas station, in her car, and they shot her.

The video refutes this. She was not driving into the petrol station when they shot at the car, and they certainly shot at it before she was in the petrol station.

At least we know there was no other entrance involved though.

Your right - she did not drive into the petrol station - she was already dead. Or maybe she was just wounded and thought she'd better fill up but passed away at the last minute lol

She clearly drove at the soldiers.

Why is it Irn and Sassy continue to say nothing of the attacks on israel's and continue to be apologists to terrorists? I mean if either of them had made the same claims to the killers of lee Rigby, they would have both been lynched by now, but for some reason they think as they hate Jews, its acceptable to make victims out of terrorists.

Didge wrote:She clearly drove at the soldiers.

Why is it Irn and Sassy continue to say nothing of the attacks on israel's and continue to be apologists to terrorists? I mean if either of them had made the same claims to the killers of lee Rigby, they would have both been lynched by now, but for some reason they think as they hate Jews, its acceptable to make victims out of terrorists.

She clearly did not drive at the Soldiers. If she wanted to kill them she could easily have done so by swerving into the main body of them. She didn't but the murdered her anyway.

This is shocking.

Irn Bru wrote:

Didge wrote:She clearly drove at the soldiers.

Why is it Irn and Sassy continue to say nothing of the attacks on israel's and continue to be apologists to terrorists? I mean if either of them had made the same claims to the killers of lee Rigby, they would have both been lynched by now, but for some reason they think as they hate Jews, its acceptable to make victims out of terrorists.

She clearly did not drive at the Soldiers. If she wanted to kill them she could easily have done so by swerving into the main body of them. She didn't but the murdered her anyway.

This is shocking.

Then you need to go to specsavers as how do you then explain the soldiers getting out of the way. Like i say you constantly prove you are a terrorist apologist and I have little to do with you exposing yourself to this Irn
So its not murder in any shape or form. They wave for her to pull over, she ignores this and then heads straight for the soldiers. Who in the current climate of violence, anyone would have done what they did, being in fear of their lives. You though because of the fact you  are indoctrinated and brainwashed with hate, cannot place yourself in the shoes of the soldiers.

The only thing shocking is your continued attempts to claim terrorists are victims

Irn Bru wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

The video refutes this. She was not driving into the petrol station when they shot at the car, and they certainly shot at it before she was in the petrol station.

At least we know there was no other entrance involved though.

Your right - she did not drive into the petrol station - she was already dead. Or maybe she was just wounded and thought she'd better fill up but passed away at the last minute lol

She wasn't already dead. The car was shot at before she turned into the petrol station but she was able to make that turn into it and drive a little way. The point is that she may well have turned into the petrol station to escape from the shooting, not to get petrol.

Irn Bru wrote:

Didge wrote:She clearly drove at the soldiers.

Why is it Irn and Sassy continue to say nothing of the attacks on israel's and continue to be apologists to terrorists? I mean if either of them had made the same claims to the killers of lee Rigby, they would have both been lynched by now, but for some reason they think as they hate Jews, its acceptable to make victims out of terrorists.

She clearly did not drive at the Soldiers. If she wanted to kill them she could easily have done so by swerving into the main body of them. She didn't but the murdered her anyway.

This is shocking.

She did drive at them. Whether she intended to or not is up for discussion. She made no attempt to stop, slow down, or even move to the left to avoid them. She was close to the kerb where some soldiers were standing, and she must have clearly seen that there were a few further out in the road too. If she did do it intentionally, they managed to get out of the way. Try slowing the video down to have a look.

All people there are well aware of the security situation and well used to check points etc, and know to slow down and/or stop as required...


If there wasn't such a threat from the Muslims there then there would not be the high security and checkpoints.


Did she drive at the soldiers?


If they had not reacted in response to being driven at, would she have actually driven into them?


Given the recent spate of Palestinians intentionally driving into people at bus sstops and carrying out random savage attacks on other members of the public etc, is it not understandable that security is at a high level of defence?