Will the Israeli Right Finally Come to Its Senses?

The terrifying burning of the baby in Duma is a symptom of a much deeper illness: It signals to us Israelis how very serious our situation is, and indicates – in letters writ in fire – that the path to a better future is closing before us.

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Settler terror underground seeks to overthrow Israeli government, say investigators

I cannot get this baby, Ali Dawabsheh, out of my mind. Nor can I stop thinking of that image: the hand of a human being opening a window in the middle of the night, and throwing a Molotov cocktail into a room where parents and their children are sleeping.

These thoughts and images tear my heart in two. Who is the person or persons capable of doing this? They, or their friends, continue to walk among us this morning. Will the act that they committed leave any mark on them? What did they have to expunge within themselves to be capable of wiping out an entire family in this way?

Benjamin Netanyahu, and several ministers from the right wing, rushed to harshly condemn the murder. Netanyahu also paid a visit to the hospital where the rest of the family is still hospitalized, and expressed his shock at the act. His response was human and genuine, and it was also the right thing to do.

What is difficult to understand is how the prime minister and his cabinet ministers are able to distinguish between a fire that they have been stoking for decades and this most recent conflagration. It is hard to conceive how they are capable of not seeing the connection between the occupation regime that has been continuing for 48 years, and the dark, fanatic reality that has been forged at the frontiers of the Israeli consciousness – a reality whose agents and disseminators grow more numerous each day, a reality that is now growing closer and closer to the mainstream, and is becoming increasingly more acceptable and legitimate in the Israeli street, in the Knesset and at the cabinet table.

In a reality-denying obstinacy, the prime minister and his supporters refuse to comprehend in a profound way the worldview that has been forming in the consciousness of an occupying people, after nearly 50 years of occupation: The idea according to which there are two kinds of people, and the fact that one is apparently subordinate to another mean that it is naturally also inferior to the other. That, how shall we put it, the occupied is less of a human being than the occupier, all of which helps to explain – for people of a certain constitution – the unbearable ease with which the other’s life can be taken, even if he is a year-and-a-half old.

In this sense, both acts of violence that took place a few days ago – the murder and stabbings at the Pride event in Jerusalem and the murder of the baby – are interrelated, and derive from a similar worldview. In both, hatred itself – bared and primal – constitutes among certain people a legitimate, ample reason to commit murder, to annihilate the hated human being.

The person who burned down the Dawabsheh family home knew nothing about the family, about their desires or aspirations. Only that they were Palestinians. And this was adequate reason in his eyes – and in the eyes of those who sent him and their supporters – to kill them. In his opinion, their mere existence justified their murder and their removal from this world.

For over a century now Israelis and Palestinians have been going around and around in circles of murder and vengeance. In the course of their struggle against us, the Palestinians have murdered hundreds of Israeli babies and children, wiped out entire families, and committed crimes against humanity. In its struggle against the Palestinians, the State of Israel has committed these same sorts of acts, with the help of aircraft and tanks and sniper’s rifles. We certainly remember what took place one year ago during Operation Protective Edge in the Gaza Strip.

However, the process that has been underway in recent years within Israel, its malevolent intensity and its malignant branches, are dangerous and destructive in a new and deceptive manner. There is a sense that even now, Israel’s leadership doesn’t yet understand – or perhaps refuses to admit to itself a fact that it finds intolerable – that the Jewish terror faction within Israel has declared war on the state. Either our leaders are not capable, or they fear, or they are wholly ambivalent to the necessity of translating this declaration into explicit words.

With each passing day, dark, fanatically savage forces are being released, inflaming themselves in a fire of religious and nationalist faith. They flout the limits of reality and the limits of morality and the rules of simple logic. Their spirit is associated with an extremist and at times thoroughly lunatic nature of the human psyche. The more dangerous and fragile the general situation becomes, the more they flourish.

No compromise is possible with these people. The government of Israel must fight them just as it fights Palestinian terror. They are no less dangerous to the wellbeing of the country. They are no less determined. They are "total" people, "all or nothing" people, and total people, as we know, are liable to make total mistakes, as well – for example, launching an attack on the Temple Mount mosques, an attack whose outcome is liable to bring tragedy to Israel and the entire Middle East.

Could the horror of burning a baby provoke leaders of the right to come to their senses and finally understand something that reality has been shouting in their ears for years now? That the prolongation of the occupation and the avoidance of a dialogue with the Palestinians are liable to expedite the end of the State of Israel as the land of the Jewish people? As a democratic state? As a place with which young people can identify and in which they would want to live and raise their children?

Does Netanyahu really and profoundly understand that, during these past years, in which he has invested all his energies in torpedoing the agreement with Iran, a no-less-dangerous reality than the Iranian threat has festered here? In the face of the domestic existential threat, he seems to be acting as if he has no idea of what to do.

It’s hard to see how this complex situation can be untangled and restored to a state of sanity. The reality forged by Netanyahu and his friends (as well as most of his predecessors in the Prime Minister’s Office), their vacillation in the face of settler activism, their deep identification with it – this reality has ultimately snared them in its vortex, paralyzing them and rendering them helpless.

For decades now, Israel has turned its dark side toward the Palestinians, but that darkness has infiltrated into its own internal organs. This process has been greatly accelerated since Netanyahu’s victory in the last election; all this time, there has been no force standing up to the right’s recklessness.

Terrifying acts like the burning of a baby are ultimately a symptom of a much more profound illness. They signal to us Israelis how very serious our situation is. They tell us, with letters writ in fire, that the path to a better future is closing before us.

read more: http://www.haaretz.com/beta/.premium-1.669326?utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=dlvr.it

Settler violence has been out of control for year and they have acted with impunity, the IDF at their side and the Government behind them. This is the point where the people of Israel stand up and stop it, or Isreal will destroy itself.

Sassy, your wasting your time posting all this anti- Israel stuff, it appears apart from KD and Zack no one gives a fcuk about it, obvious from the amount of posters that comment on it.

Nicko, you post what you want, I'll post what I want. And you have obviously missed Quill, Veya, Irn and Eddie to name but a few, who often reply.

Anti-Israel 'shit' - you obviously think burning a baby alive doesn't matter because he's Palestinian.

I'm willing to talk about it, nicko.  Netanyahu and the Israeli RW has turned into the same monsters as the Republicans in the States...xenophobic, racist and selfish.

Right is right, and these guys are inexorably wrong.  They get away with it only when people are too tired or too lazy to speak up.

Martin Niemöller wrote:First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

"The quotation stems from Niemöller's lectures during the early postwar period. Different versions of the quotation exist. These can be attributed to the fact that Niemöller spoke extemporaneously and in a number of settings. Much controversy surrounds the content of the poem as it has been printed in varying forms, referring to diverse groups such as Catholics, Jehovah's Witnesses, Jews, Trade Unionists, or Communists depending upon the version. Nonetheless his point was that Germans—in particular, he believed, the leaders of the Protestant churches—had been complicit through their silence in the Nazi imprisonment, persecution, and murder of millions of people.

Only in 1963, in a West German television interview, did Niemöller acknowledge and make a statement of regret about his own antisemitism (see Gerlach, 2000, p. 47). Nonetheless, Martin Niemöller was one of the earliest Germans to talk publicly about broader complicity in the Holocaust and guilt for what had happened to the Jews. In his book Über die deutsche Schuld, Not und Hoffnung (published in English as Of Guilt and Hope)—which appeared in January 1946—Niemöller wrote: "Thus, whenever I chance to meet a Jew known to me before, then, as a Christian, I cannot but tell him: 'Dear Friend, I stand in front of you, but we can not get together, for there is guilt between us. I have sinned and my people has sinned against thy people and against thyself.'""

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007392

When you suddenly get a crowd of them given land illegally next to you, they are given all the facilities that the government refuses to give you, then they burn your crops, stone your children and you don't know if you are going to be burnt alive when you go to bed, it must be bloody terrifying.

Original Quill wrote:I'm willing to talk about it, nicko.  Netanyahu and the Israeli RW has turned into the same monsters as the Republicans in the States...xenophobic, racist and selfish.

Right is right, and these guys are inexorably wrong.  They get away with it only when people are too tired or too lazy to speak up.

Martin Niemöller wrote:First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

"The quotation stems from Niemöller's lectures during the early postwar period. Different versions of the quotation exist. These can be attributed to the fact that Niemöller spoke extemporaneously and in a number of settings. Much controversy surrounds the content of the poem as it has been printed in varying forms, referring to diverse groups such as Catholics, Jehovah's Witnesses, Jews, Trade Unionists, or Communists depending upon the version. Nonetheless his point was that Germans—in particular, he believed, the leaders of the Protestant churches—had been complicit through their silence in the Nazi imprisonment, persecution, and murder of millions of people.

Only in 1963, in a West German television interview, did Niemöller acknowledge and make a statement of regret about his own antisemitism (see Gerlach, 2000, p. 47). Nonetheless, Martin Niemöller was one of the earliest Germans to talk publicly about broader complicity in the Holocaust and guilt for what had happened to the Jews. In his book Über die deutsche Schuld, Not und Hoffnung (published in English as Of Guilt and Hope)—which appeared in January 1946—Niemöller wrote: "Thus, whenever I chance to meet a Jew known to me before, then, as a Christian, I cannot but tell him: 'Dear Friend, I stand in front of you, but we can not get together, for there is guilt between us. I have sinned and my people has sinned against thy people and against thyself.'""

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10007392

What a poor sterotype of Republicans, so before even going forward there is no point in debating any such poor beliefs held from the start in such a post. Your views are as intolerant of those you claim to stand against.
When you post something worthy, then I will respond, but claims of racism and xenophobia in regards to Israel is nothing short of daft when you just have to look at their secular laws. Yes there is extremism, but to even paint this like the US is so far removed from reality

Didge wrote:What a poor sterotype of Republicans, so before even going forward there is no point in debating any such poor beliefs held from the start in such a post. Your views are as intolerant of those you claim to stand against.

It is what it is, didge. Yes, Republicans have a severe image problem. If I decline to comment, does that improve things? No, of course not. Is Israel above reproach. Equally: No.

In truth, there is ‘wrong’ in the world. And it is our responsibility to mention it. The Israeli RW presently exemplifies that. You can’t deny the facts. And ignoring the facts is no better.

Didge wrote:When you post something worthy, then I will respond, but claims of racism and xenophobia in regards to Israel is nothing short of daft when you just have to look at their secular laws. Yes there is extremism, but to even paint this like the US is so far removed from reality

Laws that steal property from others? As I said, there is right and there is wrong in the real world. I don’t need to delve into the deeper meanings of their ‘secular laws’.

Never claimed Israel is not beyond critical views, but to claim its Goverment is wholly racist and xenophobic is absurd. Their secular laws by and large dismiss ytour poor claims, those are the facts. You are after all just a lefty American with little knowledge of Israel itself.
Have you even been there?

Oh and I will add, if we are looking towards a road of peace is no good just looking at Israel all the time and failing to look at the discrminating laws found in both the West bank and Gaza. In Gaza it is under theocratic rule which goes against every Liberal principle that you have. So its time to question what you truely believe or do you excuse poor Goverments like Hamas that openly discrminate against people?

nicko wrote:Sassy,   your wasting your time posting all this anti- Israel stuff,    it appears apart from KD and Zack  no one gives a fcuk about it, obvious from the amount of posters that comment on it.

It's counter-productive really because it's just a wall of threads, and within each thread it's a wall of text. Then someone generally starts a thread about atrocities towards Israelis to counter it all.

Tough shit frankly, if you don't like it, don't look!

sassy wrote:Tough shit frankly, if you don't like it, don't look!

OK. If you want to highlight the problem though, I would have thought you'd want people to read it. It seems you just want to spam the forum.

Cuchulain wrote:Never claimed Israel is not beyond critical views, but to claim its Goverment is wholly racist and xenophobic is absurd. Their secular laws by and large dismiss ytour poor claims, those are the facts. You are after all just a lefty American with little knowledge of Israel itself.
Have you even been there?

Well, you are the one who raises "it's Government".  What do you mean?  I specifically spoke of Netanyahu and the RW of Israel.

And it doesn't matter who or what I am.  Stick to the facts and argument, or admit that I am right.  The Israelis are stealing land from the Palestinians, and Netanyahu is backing them.  You keep mentioning "their secular laws" but you make no point.  Apparently, the "secular laws" of Israel do not prevent the RW land grab.

Cuchulain wrote:Oh and I will add, if we are looking towards a road of peace is no good just looking at Israel all the time and failing to look at the discrminating laws found in both the West bank and Gaza. In Gaza it is under theocratic rule which goes against every Liberal principle that you have. So its time to question what you truely believe or do you excuse poor Goverments like Hamas that openly discrminate against people?

I have questioned the organization of Gaza. More specifically, I have questioned the relationship of Hamas with Gaza.

But here I am specifically criticizing settlers in occupied territories. Blatant land grab.

Didge wrote:Have you even been there?

Yes. It means nothing.

Original Quill wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:Never claimed Israel is not beyond critical views, but to claim its Goverment is wholly racist and xenophobic is absurd. Their secular laws by and large dismiss ytour poor claims, those are the facts. You are after all just a lefty American with little knowledge of Israel itself.
Have you even been there?

Well, you are the one who raises "it's Government".  What do you mean?  I specifically spoke of Netanyahu and the RW of Israel.

And it doesn't matter who or what I am.  Stick to the facts and argument, or admit that I am right.  The Israelis are stealing land from the Palestinians, and Netanyahu is backing them.  You keep mentioning "their secular laws" but you make no point.  Apparently, the "secular laws" of Israel do not prevent the RW land grab.

There lies the problem, your inability to admit when you are wrong Quill.
What facts have you presented?
You have presented opinions on Netanyahu and the RW of Israel.
They are not facts.
I am against the settlements and always have been, but you look at the issue from one side.
That is why your views fall apart, there are utterly one side and fail to look at the problems from also within the palestinian leaderships
Its a very unbalanced debate when you centre on one side ignoring the other.
The secular laws prove against your claims of racism.
You are yet to make any valid points other than your opinions of Netanyahu.

Original Quill wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:Oh and I will add, if we are looking towards a road of peace is no good just looking at Israel all the time and failing to look at the discrminating laws found in both the West bank and Gaza. In Gaza it is under theocratic rule which goes against every Liberal principle that you have. So its time to question what you truely believe or do you excuse poor Goverments like Hamas that openly discrminate against people?

I have questioned the organization of Gaza.  More specifically, I have questioned the relationship of Hamas with Gaza.

But here I am specifically criticizing settlers in occupied territories.  Blatant land grab.

In other words you only want to discuss part of the problem.
That fails to take everything into context.

Original Quill wrote:

Didge wrote:Have you even been there?

Yes.  It means nothing.

It certainly does because if you had, you would know your claims to racism are unfounded

Cuchulain wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Yes.  It means nothing.

It certainly does because if you had, you would know your claims to racism are unfounded

I said 'yes'.  It is hardly relevant to this discussion.

How exactly would my claims be determined to be unfounded?  Merely visiting Israel would add nothing.  You are not thinking critically, didge.  

Think in terms of a 'cause and effect' model.  Now, here's your argument: 'visit to Israel'  →  'unfounded claims'.  How?  Are you saying that if I visit Israel again, the settlers will go away and they will not steal land from others?  Are you saying that they will be less xenophobic?  Would they be less selfish? Give me one clear argument, please!

Original Quill wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:

It certainly does because if you had, you would know your claims to racism are unfounded

I said 'yes'.  It is hardly relevant to this discussion.

How exactly would my claims be determined to be unfounded?  Merely visiting Israel would add nothing.  You are not thinking critically, didge.  

Think in terms of a 'cause and effect' model.  Now, here's your argument: 'visit to Israel'  →  'unfounded claims'.  How?  Are you saying that if I visit Israel again, the settlers will go away and they will not steal land from others?  Are you saying that they will be less xenophobic?  Would they be less selfish?  Give me one clear argument, please!

Yes cause and effect by seeing israel first hand puts paid to claims of racism, as you would see this racism first hand if it was endemic as you claim. Hence your point and answer prove to me you have never been.
You have still failed to make any decent point yet more of your way over the top views on racismn, which you have little comprehension of or understanding.

Cuchulain wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

I said 'yes'.  It is hardly relevant to this discussion.

How exactly would my claims be determined to be unfounded?  Merely visiting Israel would add nothing.  You are not thinking critically, didge.  

Think in terms of a 'cause and effect' model.  Now, here's your argument: 'visit to Israel'  →  'unfounded claims'.  How?  Are you saying that if I visit Israel again, the settlers will go away and they will not steal land from others?  Are you saying that they will be less xenophobic?  Would they be less selfish?  Give me one clear argument, please!

Yes cause and effect by seeing israel first hand puts paid to claims of racism, as you would see this racism first hand if it was endemic as you claim. Hence your point and answer prove to me you have never been.

I said "xenophobic, racist and selfish." You can take your pick, and concede the other two.

I see it 'first hand' in the land grab that Israel is making of Palestinian lands. You waste your time on silly little side-bar issues about your adversary, that go nowhere. You fear your opponent more than the issue. That's why you lose so often.

The basic question of the thread is: "Will the Israeli Right Finally Come to Its Senses?" Since the question is about the "Right" my answer is, I don't think so. The Right is the old, the passing and the past. The ideals of xenophobia, racism and selfishness, are the ideals of the past all over the world. My point is, I think the Right in Israel is dedicated to the same principles as in America...and they will never see the light. They will simply pass.

Cuchulain wrote:You have still failed to make any decent point yet more of your way over the top views on racismn, which you have little comprehension of or understanding.

You've been fussing over the point for the whole day, yet you completely miss it? The answer is: No, the Right in Israel will never come to its senses.

Before you start another pissing match with your adversary, I suggest we move on to a discussion of why the Right never learns.

Original Quill wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:

Yes cause and effect by seeing israel first hand puts paid to claims of racism, as you would see this racism first hand if it was endemic as you claim. Hence your point and answer prove to me you have never been.

I said "xenophobic, racist and selfish."  You can take your pick, and concede the other two.

I see it 'first hand' in the land grab that Israel is making of Palestinian lands.  You waste your time on silly little side-bar issues about your adversary, that go nowhere.  You fear your opponent more than the issue.  That's why you lose so often.

The basic question of the thread is: "Will the Israeli Right Finally Come to Its Senses?"  Since the question is about the "Right" my answer is, I don't think so.  The Right is the old, the passing and the past.  The ideals of xenophobia, racism and selfishness, are the ideals of the past all over the world.  My point is, I think the Right in Israel is dedicated to the same principles as in America...and they will never see the light.  They will simply pass.

Cuchulain wrote:You have still failed to make any decent point yet more of your way over the top views on racismn, which you have little comprehension of or understanding.

You've been fussing over the point for the whole day, yet you completely miss it?  The answer is: No, the Right in Israel will never come to its senses.

Before you start another pissing match with your adversary, I suggest we move on to a discussion of why the Right never learns.

Argument failed

Israel has withdrawn from lands it previously held through conflict.

It has nothing to do with racism and xemophobia, that is nothing short of bollocks

Didge wrote:Argument failed

Israel has withdrawn from lands it previously held through conflict.

It has nothing to do with racism and xemophobia, that is nothing short of bollocks

Shucks. Well, if there's no problem, all's the better.

We'll just stop payment on those checks to Israel they don't need.

Original Quill wrote:

Didge wrote:Argument failed

Israel has withdrawn from lands it previously held through conflict.

It has nothing to do with racism and xemophobia, that is nothing short of bollocks

Shucks.  Well, if there's no problem, all's the better.

We'll just stop payment on those checks to Israel they don't need.

Well most rational Americans do not listen to you and that is all that matters.

Cuchulain wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Shucks.  Well, if there's no problem, all's the better.

We'll just stop payment on those checks to Israel they don't need.

Well most rational Americans do not listen to you and that is all that matters.

Well, you are certainly a realist there.  But perhaps that is changing.

America has learned, through the antics of Netanyaho, that Israel is not the vestal virgin they once thought it was.  The divorce of Israel from the left of America, and from the upcoming generation, will be telling.  

Netanyahu has clearly aligned himself with the crazies of the Republican Party, having courted the Republican Congress and even addressed it during his recent campaign,  The effect of this in America is to realize that Israel is not above politics.  In fact, she is right down there at street level.

Secondary to that realization, is the questioning of what Israel does.  There are usually rationales offered for political things done.  Then there is the pretextual case, in which those rationales are shown to actually be a pretext for a more nefarious reason.  America used to accept the first rationale proffered by Israel; now America--and most importantly, the American left, the former support for Israel--is taking a closer look.

Netanyahu messed with the chemestry and so there is no there, there any longer. Israel was the final mental instability for American Jews--normally extreme critical thinkers--and shedding that craziness in them might spell some huge shifts in geopolitical America.

Original Quill wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:


Well most rational Americans do not listen to you and that is all that matters.

Well, you are certainly a realist there.  But perhaps that is changing.

America has learned, through the antics of Netanyaho, that Israel is not the vestal virgin they once thought it was.  The divorce of Israel from the left of America, and from the upcoming generation, will be telling.  

Netanyahu has clearly aligned himself with the crazies of the Republican Party, having courted the Republican Congress and even addressed it during his recent campaign,  The effect of this in America is to realize that Israel is not above politics.  In fact, she is right down there at street level.

Secondary to that realization, is the questioning of what Israel does.  There are usually rationales offered for political things done.  Then there is the pretextual case, in which those rationales are shown to actually be a pretext for a more nefarious reason.  America used to accept the first rationale proffered by Israel; now America--and most importantly, the American left, the former support for Israel--is taking a closer look.

Netanyahu messed with the chemestry and now there is no there, there.

You are talking Gibberish because Obama increased military support for Israel.

Cuchulain wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Well, you are certainly a realist there.  But perhaps that is changing.

America has learned, through the antics of Netanyaho, that Israel is not the vestal virgin they once thought it was.  The divorce of Israel from the left of America, and from the upcoming generation, will be telling.  

Netanyahu has clearly aligned himself with the crazies of the Republican Party, having courted the Republican Congress and even addressed it during his recent campaign,  The effect of this in America is to realize that Israel is not above politics.  In fact, she is right down there at street level.

Secondary to that realization, is the questioning of what Israel does.  There are usually rationales offered for political things done.  Then there is the pretextual case, in which those rationales are shown to actually be a pretext for a more nefarious reason.  America used to accept the first rationale proffered by Israel; now America--and most importantly, the American left, the former support for Israel--is taking a closer look.

Netanyahu messed with the chemestry and now there is no there, there.

You are talking Gibberish because Obama increased military support for Israel.

Everybody did.  It's in the loop, as dedicated funds.  The last change in the program, however, was when the Congress was not inseparably divorced from the Administration.  When Congress is once again reunited with the Democrats, you will see the changes happening.

Original Quill wrote:

Cuchulain wrote:

You are talking Gibberish because Obama increased military support for Israel.

Everybody did.  It's in the loop, as dedicated funds.  The last change in the program, however, was when the Congress was not inseparably divorced from the Administration.  When Congress is once again reunited with the Democrats, you will see the changes reflected.

You are speculating on the one major ally the US has in the region and is not likley to lose or want to lose, no matter how strained.
You forget the relationship has been far more strained in the past and it continued.
That is the biggest point you miss.

Cuchulain wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Everybody did.  It's in the loop, as dedicated funds.  The last change in the program, however, was when the Congress was not inseparably divorced from the Administration.  When Congress is once again reunited with the Democrats, you will see the changes reflected.

You are speculating on the one major ally the US has in the region and is not likley to lose or want to lose, no matter how strained.

Well, that's a double-edged sword.  Israel has also cost us.  When I was an employee of the US State Department, I couldn't even permit Israel to stamp my passport, lest I be forbidden from entering Middle Eastern and North African countries.  We have to play games around the General Assembly and we spend a lot of money on them.

Cuchulain wrote:You forget the relationship has been far more strained in the past and it continued.
That is the biggest point you miss.

I think once Israel let it be know that it is Republican in persuasion, it entered the realm of domestic political identification.  The bubble burst and it was no longer the Great Hope for Judaism.  It became just another political action committee.

Bad timing...since the Republicans will soon be no more.

OMG what nonsense which I am not going to entertain everytime you come out with Republicans. It has no bearing.

Cuchulain wrote:OMG what nonsense which I am not going to entertain everytime you come out with Republicans. It has no bearing.

It was a Republican Congress Netanyaho spoke to, during his election no less. Did the news not reach the UK? He was meddling in American politics in the worst way.

Now they want to 'put back' Israel's virginity?? That's not the way it works.