9 ways the Bible condones torture

The first half of December 2014 was painful to many moderate American Christians who see their God as a God of love. A Senate inquiry revealed that the CIA tortured men, some innocent, to the point of unconsciousness and even death; evidence suggested that this torture extracted no lifesaving information. A majority of Americans responded by giving torture the thumbs-up, with the strongest approval coming from Christians, both Catholic and Protestant. Faced with moral outrage, including from within their own ranks, Christian torture apologists took to the airwaves and the Internet, weaving righteous justifications for the practice of inflicting pain on incapacitated enemies.
As morally repugnant as this may be, anyone familiar with either past survey data or Christian history shouldn’t find it surprising. One of the CIA’s favored leave-no-marks torture techniques, waterboarding, was refined by Inquisition authorities during the interrogation of heathens and heretics.
There’s a reason devout Christians past and present can turn to torture when it suits their ends and then blithely maintain that they are on the side of God and goodness. The Bible itself—Old Testament and New—endorses torture regularly, through stories, laws, prophesies and sermons, including from the mouth of Jesus himself.

Don’t take it from me. The following passages are a sample of those available, but I encourage you to pick up the Bible, starting at the book of Genesis. I include in this category the act of deliberately inflicting prolonged and intense suffering in the process of killing a person or animal, when the killer has the option to end the life quickly and painlessly.


http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2015/01/9-ways-the-bible-condones-torture/

It's all rubbish though didge, isn't it?

nicko wrote:It's all rubbish though didge,  isn't it?

Agreed, but some people take this rubbish literally Nicko

M y Grandsons in trouble at his School, he will not go to the RE lessons because he says "I think it's daft,how can there be a man in the sky" I feel responsible because he's got it from me.

nicko wrote:M y Grandsons in trouble at his School,   he will not go to the RE lessons because he says   "I think it's daft,how can there be a man in the sky"   I feel responsible because he's got it from me.

I see both sides here, that it is kind of is pointless for an individual to learn something he is not going to believe, but it is also good to understand those who do have faith and what they believe in.
A difficult one, but I do not blame your Grandson for not wanting too, its like state sanction fairy tales being taught as the curriculum.

Now here is where it gets interesting

god is recorded as condoning, indeed inciting and comissioning acts of unbeleivable cruelty
rape,
murder
genocide
child abuse
spousal abuse
slavery,

The list of "crimes against humanity" of this "god" is endless


ON THE OTHER HAND

what has the so called "satan" done

he encouraged us to gain knowlege (via the old apple tree)
(actually ""the knowlege of good and evil") in other words gave us the ability to "think for ourselves, rather than remain as little more than "pets" for "god"

his recorded instructions for us amount to little more than ..."get laid, get drunk and get stoned now and again"

nowher has satan ever threatened anyone with infinite punishment for finite transgressions, in fact i dont think satan has actually even threatened any punishment....since he set no "rules" yet god has been recorded as saying that basically break any of the rules and I'll fry your ass for all eternity (and probably then some)


I recon these christians worship the wrong guy.....

That makes you think.

It makes even more sense Nicko, if you look to where some of these stories originate within the pantheon of Sumarian deities. With the deities or as the Sumarians viewed them as Flesh and Blood living Gods, Enlil and Enki.

It is Enki who creates mankind and saves man from the flood that is brought about by Enlil. The representation of Enki is the serpent and he is meant to represent wisdom. Now in their myths man was meant to be created as a slave to these flesh and blood ling Gods, to carry out the work for them, except Enki,  went against Enlil and created humans from the blood from these Gods, to make Humans intelligent.

If you read the stories you can see how they have been absorbed into the Bible, and I certainly concur with Darkness on the views that Satan only seeks to help humans and even tries to intercede on their behalf, where Yahweh at every point is barbaric to humans.

@posters above

http://www.godlessgeeks.com/LINKS/CSAforBush.htm

darknessss wrote:Now here is where it gets interesting

god is recorded as condoning, indeed inciting and comissioning acts of unbeleivable cruelty
rape,
murder
genocide
child abuse
spousal abuse
slavery,

The list of "crimes against humanity" of this "god" is endless


ON THE OTHER HAND

what has the so called "satan" done

he encouraged us to gain knowlege (via the old apple tree)
(actually ""the knowlege of good and evil") in other words gave us the ability to "think for ourselves, rather than remain as little more than "pets" for "god"

his recorded instructions for us amount to little more than ..."get laid, get drunk and get stoned now and again"

nowher has satan ever threatened anyone with infinite punishment for finite transgressions, in fact i dont think satan has actually even threatened any punishment....since he set no "rules" yet god has been recorded as saying that basically break any of the rules and I'll fry your ass for all eternity (and probably then some)


I recon these christians worship the wrong guy.....

Recorded????

eddie wrote:

darknessss wrote:Now here is where it gets interesting

god is recorded as condoning, indeed inciting and comissioning acts of unbeleivable cruelty
rape,
murder
genocide
child abuse
spousal abuse
slavery,

The list of "crimes against humanity" of this "god" is endless


ON THE OTHER HAND

what has the so called "satan" done

he encouraged us to gain knowlege (via the old apple tree)
(actually ""the knowlege of good and evil") in other words gave us the ability to "think for ourselves, rather than remain as little more than "pets" for "god"

his recorded instructions for us amount to little more than ..."get laid, get drunk and get stoned now and again"

nowher has satan ever threatened anyone with infinite punishment for finite transgressions, in fact i dont think satan has actually even threatened any punishment....since he set no "rules" yet god has been recorded as saying that basically break any of the rules and I'll fry your ass for all eternity (and probably then some)


I recon these christians worship the wrong guy.....

Recorded????

read the bible....after all if you are a believer it is a literally absolutely true and accurate record.....

I dint believe in the bible per se.
I think they may be stories that are based on a bit of truth here and there, but I dint think they are the gospel according to well, the gospel people lol

eddie wrote:I dint believe in the bible per se.
I think they may be stories that are based on a bit of truth here and there, but I dint think they are the gospel according to well, the gospel people lol

Well exactly...but according to the godly its all, every last word perfectly true .....So god is recorded as saying this encouraging that....

satan sounds a much nicer guy y'know....

darknessss wrote:

eddie wrote:I dint believe in the bible per se.
I think they may be stories that are based on a bit of truth here and there, but I dint think they are the gospel according to well, the gospel people lol

Well exactly...but according to the godly its all, every last word perfectly true .....So god is recorded as saying this encouraging that....

satan sounds a much nicer guy y'know....

You need to understand the bible, in the Old Testament Satans are just angels, it was Zoroastrianism that brought about the concept of the devil not Judaism, it was adapted by later Jews and then even later Chritsians.

Brasidas wrote:

darknessss wrote:

Well exactly...but according to the godly its all, every last word perfectly true .....So god is recorded as saying this encouraging that....

satan sounds a much nicer guy y'know....

You need to understand the bible, in the Old Testament Satans are just angels, it was Zoroastrianism that brought about the concept of the devil not Judaism, it was adapted by later Jews and then even later Chritsians.

yeah, because satan is a "fallen angel"

read about the "war in heaven"

apparantly 100's of thousands of angels died....


now if "god" is so powerful, and heaven is his kingdom......why did he allow such carnage??

why didnt he just "erase" the bad guys

in fact one has to ask...why didnt he see it comming...and just not allow it to happen???

dont forget ...by any account the victory of the angels in heaven was actually quite a narrow one....
wonder if the almighty's ass was twitching that day???

OMG what a dummy, wher did they get these views?
You do know these views came from other myths?
What war in heaven, there was none until invented in the second century BC with the advent with the Book of Enoch.
\please do not even attempt to ask me about religion as I will embarrass you

Brasidas wrote:OMG what a dummy, wher did they get these views?
You do know these views came from other myths?
What war in heaven, there was none until invented in the second century BC with the advent with the Book of Enoch.
\please do not even attempt to ask me about religion as I will embarrass you

oh dear super brain goes into overdrive with manic assumptions of grandeur...


I dont give a fook where they came from...though i am quite aware of the "prehistory" behind the abrahamic religions...son....

and yes the war in heaven is not quite the same vintage....that much is obvious

however the point is ...from a "belief " point of view.....

if god is soo good...why was there a war (supposedly) AT ALL

the question raised is a question of his supposed omnipotence
and omniscience.....

and really has nothing to do with the reality of the sources....(as you would expect with a religion)
though it might be interesting to consider the tennuous but non the less visible similarities between that story and the war between the gods as espoused in the rig veda and in particular the mahabharata.

It might also be of interest to consider if there is any co-incidence in time between the events in the mahabharata which seem (and I use the word carefully) to indicate the use of atomic weapons and the events told around the story of sodom and gomorrah the destruction of which sound (and again i use the word carefully) to indicate something similar...

I have not been able to find a reliable estimate for the supposed time of either event with any degree of success but interesting to speculate dont you think...if only because of the implications if it were to be true..........

I Have no reason to discuss anything or a coincidence with such an immature child who needs to learn some manners and when you do then you will have a debate.

Best you think how you react first otherwise your vies and post are going to fall flat and the thread will become dead, so best you grow up son. Some friendly advise for you. It matters greatly where such an idea does come from and how it forms as most of the  Old Testament biblical stories and views are Plagiarized

Brasidas wrote:It makes even more sense Nicko, if you look to where some of these stories originate within the pantheon of Sumarian deities. With the deities or as the Sumarians viewed them as Flesh and Blood living Gods, Enlil and Enki.

It is Enki who creates mankind and saves man from the flood that is brought about by Enlil. The representation of Enki is the serpent and he is meant to represent wisdom. Now in their myths man was meant to be created as a slave to these flesh and blood ling Gods, to carry out the work for them, except Enki,  went against Enlil and created humans from the blood from these Gods, to make Humans intelligent.

If you read the stories you can see how they have been absorbed into the Bible, and I certainly concur with Darkness on the views that Satan only seeks to help humans and even tries to intercede on their behalf, where Yahweh at every point is barbaric to humans.

This is what I posted earlier which helps explain for you darkness and where a view of Angels fighting comes from Flesh and Blood Goods where it is written of a civil war between them.


http://www.halexandria.org/dward184.htm

Brasidas wrote:I Have no reason to discuss anything or a coincidence with such an immature child who needs to learn some manners and when you do then you will have a debate.

Best you think how you react first otherwise your vies and post are going to fall flat and the thread will become dead, so best you grow up son. Some friendly advise for you. It matters greatly where such an idea does come from and how it forms as most of the  Old Testament biblical stories and views are Plagiarized

and who do you think you are you arrogant prat...
you are the one withthe condescending attitude and "airs and graces"
you dont impress me..

you are a rude and ignorant little man who thinks that winning is so important you can actually get away with twisting the meanings of english words to suit yourself.
you think that the views you hold are the ONLY possible "right ones"...then admit you are a tory
whether you debate with me or not I care not ....

I came here to debate...not be the victim of some pin heads vainglorious quest for debating victory
and certainly NOT to argue over exactly which shade of grey black and white belong to.

when you become sufficiently mature to at least consider that others may validly hold views that differ markedly from your own then you may be worthy...

as it is its like trying to talk to a stroppy 4 year old.....

you will get my views...whether you like it or not

I dont ask you to share them.....

I dont even ask you to consider the the reason I hold those views ...if that gives you a brainstorm and requires you to become all ignorant.....

but one day...I will...without doubt...be able to say I told you so......and if/ when that day comes.....I will not be graceful.....or considerate....

so basically ..like it or lump it......

darknessss wrote:

Brasidas wrote:I Have no reason to discuss anything or a coincidence with such an immature child who needs to learn some manners and when you do then you will have a debate.

Best you think how you react first otherwise your vies and post are going to fall flat and the thread will become dead, so best you grow up son. Some friendly advise for you. It matters greatly where such an idea does come from and how it forms as most of the  Old Testament biblical stories and views are Plagiarized

and who do you think you are you arrogant prat...
you are the one withthe condescending attitude and "airs and graces"
you dont impress me..
Please grow up and stop acting like a child it really is pathetic

you are a rude and ignorant little man who thinks that winning is so important you can actually get away with twisting the meanings of english words to suit yourself.
you think that the views you hold are the ONLY possible "right ones"...then admit you are a tory
whether you debate with me or not I care not ....
Rant rant rant

I came here to debate...not be the victim of some pin heads vainglorious quest for debating victory
and certainly NOT to argue over exactly which shade of grey black and white belong to.
Rant rant rant

when you become sufficiently mature to at least consider that others may validly hold views that differ markedly from your own then you may be worthy...
Interesting as you are in fact acting like a child with incredible immaturity

as it is its like trying to talk to a stroppy 4 year old.....
Rant Rant rant

you will get my views...whether you like it or not
And people will ignore you if you act like a child and then you will be denied any debate, it is quite simple, so show some common decency, it is not much to ask of people, which seems physiclly impossible for such a child as yourself

I dont ask you to share them.....

I dont even ask you to consider the the reason I hold those views ...if that gives you a brainstorm and requires you to become all ignorant.....

but one day...I will...without doubt...be able to say I told you so......and if/ when that day comes.....I will not be graceful.....or considerate....

so basically ..like it or lump it......

So thanks for that wonderful little rant, and did not even address any points.
If you want to debate, then act with some maturity

On that I wish you luck

oi BRA......

Brasidas wrote:It makes even more sense Nicko, if you look to where some of these stories originate within the pantheon of Sumarian deities. With the deities or as the Sumarians viewed them as Flesh and Blood living Gods, Enlil and Enki.

It is Enki who creates mankind and saves man from the flood that is brought about by Enlil. The representation of Enki is the serpent and he is meant to represent wisdom. Now in their myths man was meant to be created as a slave to these flesh and blood ling Gods, to carry out the work for them, except Enki,  went against Enlil and created humans from the blood from these Gods, to make Humans intelligent.

If you read the stories you can see how they have been absorbed into the Bible, and I certainly concur with Darkness on the views that Satan only seeks to help humans and even tries to intercede on their behalf, where Yahweh at every point is barbaric to humans.

This is what I posted earlier which helps explain for you darkness and where a view of Angels fighting comes from Flesh and Blood Goods where it is written of a civil war between them.


http://www.halexandria.org/dward184.htm

So back to the debate, as seen most of the biblical stories can be found within older myths, it is very clear that Enki is a a representation of Satan within the Bible, and the tyrannical Enlil is what we see is Yahweh.
This explains the weird refernces of plurals like man made in "our" image.

So I hope you wish to move on Darkness and act with maturity and debate these points.
The war in heaven is nothing more than derived from an earlier myth of a civil war between the Sumerian Flesh and Blood deities

if you are going to be civil then we mat continue....


I find this guy's site, whilst hell to read through is very very interesting.

I dont know how well he is regarded as an authority on this but his work is certainly thought provoking

and indeed what you are saying actually registers well with his ideas....

http://www.bibleorigins.net/

I find his idea that moses pinched the sumarian pantheon and myths and "turned them upside down" to give himself political kudos and unite the tribes interesting and shows that even all that time ago there were some very politcally savvy folk about....

have a look.....your thoughts might be interesting.....

Civil, after your last few posts.

When you show some humility, then we will continue

Brasidas wrote:Civil, after your last few posts.

When you show some humility, then we will continue

read your last line ...then ask yourself "why does darknessss think I'm an arrogant prat"

I show NO-one "humility" I bend my knee to no one......LEAST of all pixels on a screen....

Good for you, as you will have little debate then if you have no humility.

Enjoy, as this could have been a good debate.

Okay Darkness if you start to be more polite, then I will read your link and give my views tomorrow, but the ball is in your court.
I have nothing against you, I just would prefer civility.

So over to you if you so wish of course and then expand on your views

Until tomorrow