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Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds

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Post by Guest Sat Aug 09, 2014 12:03 pm

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Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Cat-letter_3000960b

An Oxford University educated research chemist has issued his cat-owning neighbours with leaflets warning them of "drastic action" if they continue to let their animals roam free and kill the birds in his garden.

Dr Clive Mowforth claims he has received arson threats in response to the leaflets after he told owners they should control their cats and stop letting them roam free to "murder" dozens of birds in his specially redeveloped garden.  He sent out the angry leaflets, complete with photos of the two "leading killers" and three dates detailing when the latest birds were killed. The leaflet is addressed to "cat menace" and has been posted to more than 100 homes.

Neighbours living in the street said they are concerned for their cats' safety and have been upset by the leaflet.

“In the last week alone, cats have killed a jackdaw, a blackbird and a house sparrow,” said Dr Mowforth. “I was watching the sparrow whilst eating my dinner. She was sat quietly enjoying the food in the evening sun when a cat leapt right onto the shoulder-height table, grabbed the bird and ran off. This was the final straw.”

The 57-year-old said he has spent more than 10 years converting the garden at his Gloucestershire home into a “paradise for birds” and set up video surveillance when he noticed how numbers had fallen and how many were being killed.  He has sent local households in the village of Dursley pictures from video footage of the worst offenders and said he has identified 10 'killer cats' in the area.  Dr Mowforth claimed complaints had been made to the police and RSPCA about him, adding "the extreme elements within the pro-cat brigade have threatened arson."

"The bird table has been put away until the first set of deterrents is in place.  I don't see why I should have to pay to protect the birds in my garden from cat-owners who simply let their pets roam free. If a dog went into a neighbour's garden, dug holes, left excrement and killed wildlife, all hell would be let loose.  I expect to have to spend hundreds of pounds over the coming months."

Dr Mowforth, who has a BSc in Chemistry from Exeter and a DPhil from Oxford University, claims he used to see lots of birds in his garden but the numbers have decreased as the local cat population has risen.  He said up to ten different cats visit his garden day and night, and estimated the bird murder-rate at about one per month.

He added: "I have spent over a decade converting my garden into a paradise for birds. But despite being close to woodland I see few birds these days and those that do venture to my lawn, pond and bird table run the risk of being killed by cats.  Changes in agriculture and habitat loss have had a dramatic effect on bird numbers but locally cats can also have a big influence." He added: “In the longer term there needs to be a widespread neutering campaign to bring down the size of the enormous cat population."

The "final straw," Dr Mowforth, said was when he was sitting in his garden eating dinner and a cat jumped on to his bird table and killed a goldfinch. He now says he could be forced to move if the killing does not stop.  He said: "This could now push me out of my house. I'm about to retire and I want to be able to enjoy my garden."

Amanda Woods, 39, who has two cats in the street, said: "There is nothing you can do to stop your cats going in other people's gardens - unless you have house cats. One of the cats is my nine year old son's cat and he got really upset when he saw the letter. We all got leaflets through the door, it's all over Facebook. If he doesn't like cats in his garden there are things he could do about it. He could just spray them, or set up sprinklers. It's harmless and it means they won't come back.  My neighbour thought about taking the leaflet to the local police station, I'm not sure if he has yet.  If they don't take it to the police I'd happily do it myself."

As well as the 26 neighbouring houses on Dr Mowforth's street, the letters have also been put though the doors of adjoining streets.  One neighbour, who wished to remain anonymous, was shocked when she noticed her cat was one of those pictured. She said: "Everyone in the street got one of these letters through the door.  I was actually quite shocked when I saw it. My cat is actually pictured on the front of the leaflet. I think the whole thing is a bit like Crime Watch for cats, it all seems very petty. I was actually really concerned when I read the bit about him taking 'drastic action' against the cats.  I don't know what it could be but it certainly sounds very worrying - I'm sure the RSPCA would be interested to hear about it.  I haven't bothered confronting him because I don't want to cause a big argument but I know he has upset a lot of people."

The RSPCA declined to confirm if any complaints had been made but said they were not investigating any claims in the area. Gloucestershire Police said there did not appear to be any instances of arson threats recorded.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/11021590/Oxford-scientist-warns-of-drastic-action-if-neighbours-allow-cats-to-roam-and-kill-birds.html

How on earth do you stop this unless you keep your cat inside?!  I guess if you really do care about the declining bird population you wouldn't encourage them to come to your garden to face the attack of the kitty cats Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Cat_810

As a cat owner previously it used to break my heart when they caught birds but you can't stop them, it's in their nature.  

Perhaps Dr Mowforth should consider getting a dog Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Dog13

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Post by Raggamuffin Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:58 pm

veya_victaous wrote:Honestly Cats are a real pest species, and should require a licence and be mandatory to keep in an enclosed yard, indoors or on a leash. JUST LIKE A DOG.

If a dog was to come into my yard and attack my pets I would have every legal right to demand it got put down and the council probably would with out my asking.

Bloody Murdering cats come into my yard can expect a rock hurled with sufficient force.

You could be prosecuted here for hurling a rock at a cat if you harmed it. Quite right too - there's no need for violence.
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Post by captain Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:24 pm

nicko wrote:I'v never heard of a cat mauling a child to death,   where as a dog~~~~~~~~

What about people that have mauled, maimed and murdered kids? Why do they do it? Drugs, booze, chemicals?

If a dog has been fed foods with chemicals and live with people feeding off the same junk and erratic, then yes we now have a possible lethal weapon on our hands.

Back to the cats. I thought I left a comment here but now I cannot seem to find it.  Rolling Eyes Not writing it again.
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Post by Raggamuffin Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:44 pm

captainJane wrote:We have a real bad cat around these parts and I am afraid it will be teaching a couple more cats to do the same. It has been offered several homes, and it is fed a few times every day. It is not killing for hunger and sometimes it just wants to make a creature suffer.. I am hoping to get chickens by next year and if this prat of a cat remains I do not fancy my chances. The foxes does the odd killing but they at least eat their occasional prey and the various people in the neighbourhood help out. In a real dilemma and thinking of catching this cat and dropping it into a local shelter. Or over the cliff if it keeps on crossing my path.   Twisted Evil 

This post?
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Post by Guest Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:45 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:Honestly Cats are a real pest species, and should require a licence and be mandatory to keep in an enclosed yard, indoors or on a leash. JUST LIKE A DOG.

If a dog was to come into my yard and attack my pets I would have every legal right to demand it got put down and the council probably would with out my asking.

Bloody Murdering cats come into my yard can expect a rock hurled with sufficient force.

You could be prosecuted here for hurling a rock at a cat if you harmed it. Quite right too - there's no need for violence.

Absolutely Raggs, I hate any kind of cruelty to animals  Evil or Very Mad

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Post by Guest Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:54 pm

people who dislike cats are not humans..... alien 

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Post by Guest Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:59 pm

victorisnotamused wrote:people who dislike cats are not humans..... alien 

What's not to love, cute Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Cat_wi11

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Post by eddie Mon Aug 11, 2014 10:00 pm

I have to agree with Veya: cats are a nuisance.
They just shit and shit in peoples gardens and it's not right.

They kill wildlife and like Veya says, keep,them enclosed within their own gardens etc so that their owners can ensure they don't kill stuff and they can clear up the stinking mess they leave!!

Also they have no freakin loyalty to their owners. They'll go where they get fed.
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Post by veya_victaous Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:05 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:Honestly Cats are a real pest species, and should require a licence and be mandatory to keep in an enclosed yard, indoors or on a leash. JUST LIKE A DOG.

If a dog was to come into my yard and attack my pets I would have every legal right to demand it got put down and the council probably would with out my asking.

Bloody Murdering cats come into my yard can expect a rock hurled with sufficient force.

You could be prosecuted here for hurling a rock at a cat if you harmed it. Quite right too - there's no need for violence.

Nope, if it's in my property and a threat to my own pets or livestock or a NATIVE animal I have every right to kill the dangerous potentially Feral animal. In fact as I have had a cat Kill one of my pet lizards that is a Protected species (I am a Licensed keeper) I could have had the owners of the Cat up on a $20,000 fine.

I have Lost enough pets IN MY OWN YARD to other peoples cats because the Owners Cannot keep them responsibly on THEIR OWN PROPERTY. No Sympathy for the Cats, the First few times I'll throw it near the cat but If it is one I have seen a few time I will try and Hit it.
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Post by veya_victaous Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:08 am

victorisnotamused wrote:people who dislike cats are not humans..... alien 

You Know Victor You are welcome to Come down here and HUNT them.  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil  Twisted Evil 

Literally they are a PEST Species and legally allowed to be Shot on Sight in the Bush.
Even the Greenies Agree to the Hunting of Cats.  Wink 
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Post by nicko Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:37 am

Cats will dig a hole and bury it! dogs will crap anywhere and people will tread in it . My Granddaughter came on a visit with dog crap all over the wheels of her pushchair.When did you last step in cat shit?
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Post by veya_victaous Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:11 am

Lone Wolf wrote:Cool 

HUNTING of cats out "in the bush" in Oz means 5 km (3.2 miles) out of town ("built up areas"..). NOT simply on the town's urban_fringes..

Shooting or poisoning cats or dogs within town limits is still an indictable offence down here. As is killing someone else's pet out of spite or malice (self defence against savage dogs is always a possible legal defence..), especially if it's known to be someone's pet.     cat  ::-3::  pig 

your allowed to defend your property and pets are property. I'm not gonna let more of my pets with more financial/ecological value than a cat become food/toy for a murdering Moggie Mad  (and more emotional too since I would never dream of letting them run lose around the neighborhood AND INTO OTHER PEOPLES YARDS No )

cats are murders owning cats is essentially aiding and abetting a murderer tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue 

 Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes Jesus  should have made specific exception for casting stones at cats  :asboredas: 
 ::troll:: ::troll:: ::troll:: ::troll::
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Post by Raggamuffin Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:16 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Lone Wolf wrote:Cool 

HUNTING of cats out "in the bush" in Oz means 5 km (3.2 miles) out of town ("built up areas"..). NOT simply on the town's urban_fringes..

Shooting or poisoning cats or dogs within town limits is still an indictable offence down here. As is killing someone else's pet out of spite or malice (self defence against savage dogs is always a possible legal defence..), especially if it's known to be someone's pet.     cat  ::-3::  pig 

your allowed to defend your property and pets are property. I'm not gonna let more of my pets with more financial/ecological value than a cat become food/toy for a murdering Moggie Mad  (and more emotional too since I would never dream of letting them run lose around the neighborhood AND INTO OTHER PEOPLES YARDS No )

cats are murders owning cats is essentially aiding and abetting a murderer tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue 

 Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes  Rolling Eyes Jesus  should have made specific exception for casting stones at cats  :asboredas: 
 ::troll:: ::troll:: ::troll:: ::troll::

Is animal abuse not illegal where you are then? Harming a cat is animal abuse.
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Post by HoratioTarr Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:35 am

I don't hate cats. They are lovely creatures. But people should be just as responsible for their well being, safety and the damage they can do as dog lovers. The argument that a cat is feral is an empty one. In that case, don't whine if someone takes a gun to it. Fouling gardens, killing wildlife, destroying plants. I'd take umbrage to cat doing all those things in my garden, and it would see the sharp end of my boot if I got near it.
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Post by HoratioTarr Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:36 am

nicko wrote:Cats will dig a hole and bury it!  dogs will crap anywhere and people will tread in it .  My Granddaughter came on a visit with dog crap all over the wheels of her pushchair.When did you last step in cat shit?

No they don't necessarily. I've had flowerbeds totally smothered in cat shit.
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Post by veya_victaous Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:43 am

Not if it THE CAT is about to harm something and as they have enough times when trespassing in my yard that I assume they will  tongue tongue tongue tongue 

MURDERERS, I TELL YOU  tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue


.....
Not that I have to much any more, since i got a 2nd dog she is a Jack Russell and I have specifically trained her; she is ONLY allowed to bark, chase, try and catch CATS.

it took a bit to get her to not chase the birds (the first dog never was interested) and she got a smack the first time I caught her catch a skink (2-7cm lizards, very common where there are no cats and only well trained dogs) and I think the first dog told her they supposed to protect lizards, he's a Maltese cross and a very calm dog so I have introduced him to my larger lizards that I try and breed for release back in the wild. Cats are one of the main issues driving the native lizards to endangerment/extinction  Sad  there are other things like roads that are not a help either  Sad Sad Sad 

I hope that puts my opinion in Context after losing Several Lizards to cats over the years. plus losing Birds and Fish...... Murdering Bastards Goldie never hurt anyone  Sad Sad Sad Sad 
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Post by Raggamuffin Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:00 pm

veya_victaous wrote:Not if it THE CAT is about to harm something and as they have enough times when trespassing in my yard that I assume they will  tongue tongue tongue tongue 

MURDERERS, I TELL YOU  tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue


.....
Not that I have to much any more, since i got a 2nd dog she is a Jack Russell and I have specifically trained her; she is ONLY allowed to bark, chase, try and catch CATS.

it took a bit to get her to not chase the birds (the first dog never was interested) and she got a smack the first time I caught her catch a skink  (2-7cm lizards, very common where there are no cats and only well trained dogs) and I think the first dog told her they supposed to protect lizards, he's a Maltese cross and a very calm dog so I have introduced him to my larger lizards that I try and breed for release back in the wild. Cats are one of the main issues driving the native lizards to endangerment/extinction  Sad  there are other things like roads that are not a help either  Sad Sad Sad 

I hope that puts my opinion in Context after losing Several Lizards to cats over the years. plus losing Birds and Fish......  Murdering Bastards Goldie never hurt anyone  Sad Sad Sad Sad 

If someone's dog got hold of my cat, I might be forced to harm the dog in order to protect my cat.
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Post by veya_victaous Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:03 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:Not if it THE CAT is about to harm something and as they have enough times when trespassing in my yard that I assume they will  tongue tongue tongue tongue 

MURDERERS, I TELL YOU  tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue tongue


.....
Not that I have to much any more, since i got a 2nd dog she is a Jack Russell and I have specifically trained her; she is ONLY allowed to bark, chase, try and catch CATS.

it took a bit to get her to not chase the birds (the first dog never was interested) and she got a smack the first time I caught her catch a skink  (2-7cm lizards, very common where there are no cats and only well trained dogs) and I think the first dog told her they supposed to protect lizards, he's a Maltese cross and a very calm dog so I have introduced him to my larger lizards that I try and breed for release back in the wild. Cats are one of the main issues driving the native lizards to endangerment/extinction  Sad  there are other things like roads that are not a help either  Sad Sad Sad 

I hope that puts my opinion in Context after losing Several Lizards to cats over the years. plus losing Birds and Fish......  Murdering Bastards Goldie never hurt anyone  Sad Sad Sad Sad 

If someone's dog got hold of my cat, I might be forced to harm the dog in order to protect my cat.

And if someone's dog was in YOUR yard you'd be perfectly entitled to, I'll do you the courtesy of doing my best o keep my dog out of your yard... and in a perfect world cat owners would do the same  Wink 
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Post by Raggamuffin Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:04 pm

veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

If someone's dog got hold of my cat, I might be forced to harm the dog in order to protect my cat.

And if someone's dog was in YOUR yard you'd be perfectly entitled to, I'll do you the courtesy of doing my best o keep my dog out of your yard... and in a perfect world cat owners would do the same  Wink 

It wouldn't matter where the dog was. If it was in someone else's garden, I'd still protect my cat. They should keep their dog under control at all times.
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Post by Guest Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:15 pm

None of the cats that live near me bury their shit. Mind the problem is abating, I live in a cul de sac of 14 houses and there are 10 dogs  cheers 

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Post by Raggamuffin Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:18 pm

Dogs can be a nuisance with all that barking they do - it's noise pollution.
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Post by Guest Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:21 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:Dogs can be a nuisance with all that barking they do - it's noise pollution.

Have you heard the noise cats make when fighting !?

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Post by Raggamuffin Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:57 pm

Nems wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:Dogs can be a nuisance with all that barking they do - it's noise pollution.

Have you heard the noise cats make when fighting !?

They don't do that for long though. Some dogs just go on and on barking all day. The owners should be prosecuted for that IMO.
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Post by veya_victaous Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:13 pm

Raggamuffin wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

If someone's dog got hold of my cat, I might be forced to harm the dog in order to protect my cat.

And if someone's dog was in YOUR yard you'd be perfectly entitled to, I'll do you the courtesy of doing my best o keep my dog out of your yard... and in a perfect world cat owners would do the same  Wink 

It wouldn't matter where the dog was. If it was in someone else's garden, I'd still protect my cat. They should keep their dog under control at all times.

no doesn't work that way at all

Your cat belongs on your property otherwise it is in the wrong , and it is VERY selfish to suggest otherwise Why should anyone else have to deal with your pet on their property...

and a dog is fully with in it's rights to keep murdering cats out of it's territory.

And most councils will do something about dogs that bark all day... or dog owners that lets their dogs run loose around the neighbourhood... they should apply the Same to Cat owners.. It is discrimination plain and simple

EQUAL RIGHTS FOR PETS OWNERS... DOWN WITH FELINE APARTHEID
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Post by Guest Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:04 am

If you want to stop cats crapping in your garden.....get your own cat....
not only will this keep other cats away, but YOUR cat will go and crap in somebody elses garden Laughing 

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Post by Guest Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:12 am

TBF though veya has a point

In Australia, cats of the moggyius domesticus variety, are a foreign invasive pest species, much like the rabbit and cane toad and need to be controlled

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Post by veya_victaous Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:36 am

victorisnotamused wrote:TBF though veya has a point

In Australia, cats of the moggyius domesticus variety, are a foreign invasive pest species, much like the rabbit and cane toad and need to be controlled

Quite right Victor,
it is a bit different in Europe where any little native animal has either adapted or already been wiped out by the presence of felines.

Plus Humans have breed cats to hunt when they are not hungry (to control rats etc) so now that cats are living in suburbia with no barn of farm produce to protect from rats they are epically destructive to the natural environment. There are some good cat owners that do build cat runs and mainly keep their cat indoors.
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Post by harvesmom Wed Aug 13, 2014 12:42 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

It wouldn't matter where the dog was. If it was in someone else's garden, I'd still protect my cat. They should keep their dog under control at all times.

no doesn't work that way at all

Your cat belongs on your property otherwise it is in the wrong , and it is VERY selfish to suggest otherwise Why should anyone else have to deal with your pet on their property...  

and a dog is fully with in it's rights to keep murdering cats out of it's territory.

And most councils will do something about dogs that bark all day... or dog owners that lets their dogs run loose around the neighbourhood... they should apply the Same to Cat owners.. It is discrimination plain and simple

EQUAL RIGHTS FOR PETS OWNERS... DOWN WITH FELINE APARTHEID

Too right!! If my dog got out and caused damage or poo'd where he shouldn't then I can expect a fine, why should it be different for cats???



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Post by veya_victaous Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:05 am

harvesmom wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

It wouldn't matter where the dog was. If it was in someone else's garden, I'd still protect my cat. They should keep their dog under control at all times.

no doesn't work that way at all

Your cat belongs on your property otherwise it is in the wrong , and it is VERY selfish to suggest otherwise Why should anyone else have to deal with your pet on their property...  

and a dog is fully with in it's rights to keep murdering cats out of it's territory.

And most councils will do something about dogs that bark all day... or dog owners that lets their dogs run loose around the neighbourhood... they should apply the Same to Cat owners.. It is discrimination plain and simple

EQUAL RIGHTS FOR PETS OWNERS... DOWN WITH FELINE APARTHEID

Too right!! If my dog got out and caused damage or poo'd where he shouldn't then  I can expect a fine, why should it be different for cats???




Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Keep-calm-and-stop-the-apartheid-1

I think we need Bono or something  scratch  scratch  scratch  scratch  scratch 

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Post by harvesmom Wed Aug 13, 2014 1:27 am



Yes! Or maybe ... erm... Scooby Doo!

He'd teach those cats a thing or two  Cool
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:16 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

It wouldn't matter where the dog was. If it was in someone else's garden, I'd still protect my cat. They should keep their dog under control at all times.

no doesn't work that way at all

Your cat belongs on your property otherwise it is in the wrong , and it is VERY selfish to suggest otherwise Why should anyone else have to deal with your pet on their property...  

and a dog is fully with in it's rights to keep murdering cats out of it's territory.

And most councils will do something about dogs that bark all day... or dog owners that lets their dogs run loose around the neighbourhood... they should apply the Same to Cat owners.. It is discrimination plain and simple

EQUAL RIGHTS FOR PETS OWNERS... DOWN WITH FELINE APARTHEID

It works that way for me. I don't care where the dog is - if it attacks my cat, I'll protect my cat.
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Post by veya_victaous Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:29 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

It wouldn't matter where the dog was. If it was in someone else's garden, I'd still protect my cat. They should keep their dog under control at all times.

no doesn't work that way at all

Your cat belongs on your property otherwise it is in the wrong , and it is VERY selfish to suggest otherwise Why should anyone else have to deal with your pet on their property...  

and a dog is fully with in it's rights to keep murdering cats out of it's territory.

And most councils will do something about dogs that bark all day... or dog owners that lets their dogs run loose around the neighbourhood... they should apply the Same to Cat owners.. It is discrimination plain and simple

EQUAL RIGHTS FOR PETS OWNERS... DOWN WITH FELINE APARTHEID

It works that way for me. I don't care where the dog is - if it attacks my cat, I'll protect my cat.

And you will be in the wrong, Particularly if Your cat is in someone else yard.. you will probably go to jail.
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:31 am

veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

It works that way for me. I don't care where the dog is - if it attacks my cat, I'll protect my cat.

And you will be in the wrong, Particularly if Your cat is in someone else yard..  you will probably go to jail.

No I wouldn't - you would be prosecuted for setting your dog onto a cat or throwing stones at one though.
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Post by veya_victaous Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:51 am

No raggs PROPERTY makes a HUGE difference. Your cat is not special you let if off your property it has NO real rights. People are free to run it over with their car or let their dogs kill it (pretty silly to think there is anything wrong with that, considering CATS kill other people pets all the time and Even trespass onto other peoples property to murder their pets).... IF you cared for it, it would not be off your property unrestrained.

Your not even Allowed into Someone else's yard , so at a minimum you are trespassing and as soon as you touch their property (i.e the dog) you are trespassing with wilful intent to cause damage.

You sound like a Horrible cat owner that lets the Murdering Moggie run Lose and Murdering away all day then it come home and You call your little murdering environmental vandal a 'Cute liddle Puddy'....

Yes Raggs Cat people like you are already responsible for 1000's species extinction because YOU cant take any care of a pet and keep it in your own yard.
you are selfish and for some reason think other people should just accept you have a VERY VERY destructive animal that you take no control of and make no effort to prevent it's destructive nature.

LETS face it VERY few cat owners are responsible enough to keep a dog, they would have the council on them straight away because the Selfish Shit cat owners think they have a right to get away with Like letting them out with out a lead WTF is that.... But a dog Owner would never dream of inflicting that on their neighbours because it is hugely irresponsible to let a predatory animal prowl the streets.
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:56 am

Veya, you are clearly mad, and you sound like an animal abuser. It's a good job we have laws in the UK to prevent people causing unnecessary suffering to animals.
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Post by Ben Reilly Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:16 am

Raggamuffin wrote:Veya, you are clearly mad, and you sound like an animal abuser. It's a good job we have laws in the UK to prevent people causing unnecessary suffering to animals.

That sounds to me like a very radical interpretation of what he said.
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:20 am

Ben_Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:Veya, you are clearly mad, and you sound like an animal abuser. It's a good job we have laws in the UK to prevent people causing unnecessary suffering to animals.

That sounds to me like a very radical interpretation of what he said.

He already said he would throw stones at a cat, and his last post was clearly the ramblings of a mad person.
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Post by Ben Reilly Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:21 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Ben_Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:Veya, you are clearly mad, and you sound like an animal abuser. It's a good job we have laws in the UK to prevent people causing unnecessary suffering to animals.

That sounds to me like a very radical interpretation of what he said.

He already said he would throw stones at a cat, and his last post was clearly the ramblings of a mad person.

You read the whole thing, in non-combat mode?
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:23 am

Ben_Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

He already said he would throw stones at a cat, and his last post was clearly the ramblings of a mad person.

You read the whole thing, in non-combat mode?

Look, if you want to support an animal abuser it's up to you, but don't start on me.
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Post by Ben Reilly Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:26 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Ben_Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

He already said he would throw stones at a cat, and his last post was clearly the ramblings of a mad person.

You read the whole thing, in non-combat mode?

Look, if you want to support an animal abuser it's up to you, but don't start on me.

Where did Veya advocate abusing animals?
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:29 am

Ben_Reilly wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:

Look, if you want to support an animal abuser it's up to you, but don't start on me.

Where did Veya advocate abusing animals?

Try reading his posts.
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Post by Ben Reilly Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:31 am

I have, I see him saying that if a cat comes onto someone's property and starts wreaking havoc, that person has the right to protect their property. I don't see him saying anything that comes even close to advocating animal abuse.
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Post by Raggamuffin Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:43 am

Ben_Reilly wrote:I have, I see him saying that if a cat comes onto someone's property and starts wreaking havoc, that person has the right to protect their property. I don't see him saying anything that comes even close to advocating animal abuse.

You don't think that throwing a rock at a cat with the intention of hitting it is animal abuse?
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Post by Ben Reilly Wed Aug 13, 2014 7:54 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Ben_Reilly wrote:I have, I see him saying that if a cat comes onto someone's property and starts wreaking havoc, that person has the right to protect their property. I don't see him saying anything that comes even close to advocating animal abuse.

You don't think that throwing a rock at a cat with the intention of hitting it is animal abuse?

Depends on why, right?
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Post by Original Quill Wed Aug 13, 2014 5:23 pm

In Tucson, used to have Manx cats. This breed in known, not just for the square face and absence of a tail, but for the huge hind legs.

Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRktxPzUeTUEayF2CLZPR_I8cCZw3WqXlydmTHge3L1sG2i7RdlnQ Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Manx-cat-Man-Sur Oxford scientist warns of 'drastic action' if neighbours allow cats to roam and kill birds - Page 2 Manx-cat

They are magnificant jumpers. One of mine used to sit beneath the retaining wall (3-foot) hiding from the doves who would eat the grass seed. Just when one came close enough, he would jump straight up, about 10-12-feet in the air, and snatch 'em down. Most of the time he missed, but what a magnificent leap.

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Post by veya_victaous Thu Aug 14, 2014 12:12 am

Lone Wolf wrote:
veya_victaous wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:
It works that way for me. I don't care where the dog is - if it attacks my cat, I'll protect my cat.


And you will be in the wrong, Particularly if Your cat is in someone else yard..  you will probably go to jail.

clown   Rubbish, veya'...

1. You need a body to prove that your dog is dead.
2. You need evidence that a particular person attacked your dog.
3. If you get past that point, then it's up to you to prove that your dog wasn't attacking others ~ especially if those others happen to have bite marks to help claim that your dog was attacking them (and, if they still have their wits about them, they will remove said dog from your yard ~ and then claim that it had escaped !   tongue ).

THE only time that you're likely to see someone end up in jail, is when they have entered your yard with the intention of killing your dog ~ AND you have witnesses and/or evidence to such an act..

ON THE other hand, if you killed a savage or rogue cat in your yard, the smart thing to do is either bury the evidence in your back garden, or dispose of it elsewhere. And the cat's owner would then be left thinking that it's either been run over, met some other untimely end..

LEAVE the body laying around or allow others to see you kill that cat unnecessarily, though ~ and you may find the Animal cruelty laws trumping any ol' Trespass laws !    ::resmahauth::

I'm NPWS licensed Reptile Breeder, If a Cat is Near my enclosures I am allowed to Kill it to Protect my Animals Which are ALL Protected species. If one of my Reptiles is Killed by a Cat(or anything else) I have to Fill in a official report and send it to the NPWS. I have to Submit annual Record keeping on the exact number of Reptiles and the fates of those reptiles if they are no longer in my care.
I can take the Collar/Identification to the NPWS and they can decide to issue an up to $20,000 fine to the Owner of the cat (or 6 months jail but highly unlikely for murder by cat). I have never killed a cat but I know other keepers that do (particular as you get closer to the bush).

That is not Opinion that is the Law.
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