About Neighbours

A couple of days ago, a British politician confessed in a radio interview that he would be concerned if a group of Romanians moved in next door. I know many Britons were shocked by these outrageous remarks because it is hard to believe that in the 21st Century in London - a metropolis where more than 100 nationalities live in harmony - someone could express such a political credo.

The remarks were condemned by outstanding representatives of the British political class and by the media. Deputy prime mininister Nick Clegg was the most pointed in his criticism, telling the BBC: "The mask is starting to slip and I think what's being revealed behind that sort of beer-swilling bonhomie is a really nasty view of the world." Top politicians considered the comments "inappropriate and wrong and offensive", "the politics of anger, rather than the politics of the answer", "hostility and extremism", "a racial slur". Eloquently, The Sun newspaper on Saturday said the comments were "racism, pure and simple".

Facing a fresh barrage of accusations of racism, the author of the statement was forced to explain himself in a new interview: "Do you know what, in life sometimes people get things wrong. I was completely tired out." But just a few short hours after the "tired out" person made a semi-apology for his comments about undesirable Romanian neighbours, he published in Telegraph a defiant advert called "An open letter", associating Romanians with crime.

In the last 17 months a blaming culture and racist attitude has damaged the lives and reputation of thousands of Romanians in the UK. The British public was continuously served with scaremongering about Romanians who, in their vast majority, are hard working people, honest, committed, pay taxes and contribute to the growth of this country. With respect for my compatriots and for the British people, it is time now for this disgraceful campaign to stop.

The "open letter" says "92% of all ATM crime in London is committed by Romanians". This is false. When this allegation was first presented last year, both the Met and the City of London Police strongly denied the figures and criticised them for being misleading and not substantiated by any statistics or current police intelligence. According to the Dedicated Cheque and Plastic Crime Unit in London, "The annual figures show that in 2012 the top five countries for fraudulent activity on UK issued cards were USA, France, Luxembourg, Italy and Ireland". Romanians are not mentioned on this top list.

Then, the letter claims that "28,000 Romanians were arrested in the last five years". But a simple ID check becomes an "arrest" in statistics if a person is asked to go to the police station. In many cases the same person was "arrested" several times. To compare, only in 2012 more than 5.6million crimes were committed in the UK. If multiplied by five years, one could reach the conclusion that 28million people in Britain have committed crimes in the given period of time.

Data published by the Metropolitan Police show that the number of Romanians charged with an offence in London in January 2014 dropped 3%, compared to the same month last year. In many cases Romanians are victims of crimes, with 543 persons in the first three months of 2014. If we take into account an increase in the size of the Romanian populations in the UK during the course of 2013, it is obvious that crime rates are actually falling rather than growing.

At the national level the figures are even more speaking for themselves: in the first three months of 2014 the number of Romanians convicted in the UK was with 15% lower than in the same period of 2013. This is consistent with the trend in 2013 versus 2012, where the reduction was more than 30%.



http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/dr-ion-jinga/about-neighbours_b_5358986.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

This is seriously starting to piss me off; it seems that people are giving in to fear, indulging irrationality and actively resisting all attempts to clue them in to the truth, instead dismissing it all as elitism or conspiracies or whatever. Because hey, if you feel right you must be right; right? Screw thinking!

When grown adults decide that they are justified and right and somehow more "natural" when they surrender to base emotions and subjective perceptions, and abandon maturity and sophistication, bad decisions are made and people are hurt. And while it is a natural human weakness to become too fearful and reactionary during times of change, I really hoped that the majority of people recognized that tendency and fought against it the same way we do with most of the knee-jerk reactions we're prone to. It's self-centered, unthinking and in a way, arrogant -- really pretty ugly.

If they looked like gypsies, didn't work, and hung around their house all day.....I'd be bothered.
But then I wouldn't care if they were Romanians or men from Mars.

We have a problem with Romanian gypsies round here who have stolen children's bikes and scooters etc right from the front and back gardens.

So no, I wouldn't necessarily trust the gypsies myself either, Romanian, Irish or otherwise.


Either of you two had that problem of theft by gypsies yet???

The point is Eddie, that the view of criminality by gypsies is people promoted as if all Romanians are gypsies, when they represent 3-4% of their population and even all gypsies are not criminals for a start. So it is bad enough many Romanians are being demonized off the back of this point of view with criminal gangs or crimes committed by and large those of the gypsy community who come from Romanian. Even then though as stated not all gypsies are criminals and also face such dissemination also themselves

So the point is many people are being poorly demonized, and off poor stats used by UKIP, that is promoting an unsubstantiated fear, which is also racially wrong. These views were once spouted before in regards to living next door to a black person, was that right to hold such a mistrust based off association to some blacks who commit crime?

I take people at face value and can be right and wrong in my judgements, but here is nothing more than trying to instill fear, because people wrapped up by political rhetoric believe many things claimed, as you will see daily on threads here alone.

So what Nigel is doing is very wrong and do not think people wrongly associate all Romanians as Gypsies either.

Perhaps there is a small minority but then they must all live round here.
Firstly we had a family of them living in one house and they were recenty arrested and charged for fraudulently making credit cards.

Secondly there are another gang as I've said, who are stealing bikes etc from front and back gardens.

I live in highly populated Eastern European community and I actually really like them as people.

I can tell you though, that most of my Bulgarian friends, and the Polish  and Czech people I know, hate the Romanians more than the English seem to.

Must be something in it, as their opinions we're formed before living here.

eddie wrote:Perhaps there is a small minority but then they must all live round here.
Firstly we had a family of them living in one house and they were recenty arrested and charged for fraudulently making credit cards.

Secondly there are another gang as I've said, who are stealing bikes etc from front and back gardens.

I live in highly populated Eastern European community and I actually really like them as people.

I can tell you though, that most of my Bulgarian friends, and the Polish  and Czech people I know, hate the Romanians more than the English.

Must be something in it as their opinions we're formed before living here.

But again Eddie this goes back to my point on blacks, coming from London we had a spate of robberies & burglaries by some black youths going on, it turned out it was the same gang committing crimes, even though there were plenty of whites committing crimes too. The point is people also played off only the blacks that had committed the crimes and some had formed fear views of living next to them just as being promoted today with Romanians, now was that right and is that right to do so today?

No, because it is promoting a view that if one is a criminal it is likely that any Romanian could be a criminal, which the same can be said for any racial group. Thus if you are going off crimes in an area why would you only fear or mistrust one group of people using that logic, surely that logic would mean you would not trust anyone, because anyone is capable of crimes?

This is an example of poor stereotypes and how people do come to form poor views if there has been a higher spate of crimes known to be committed by some from within a group and for all you know the nice other eastern Europeans could have one of them as a serial rapist for all you know, or the Englishman across the road is mugger, who really knows? Thus to make views to fear collective ethnic or religious groups of people are based upon poor stereotypes as seen in my view

I'm just telling you from a personal viewpoint, that I am wary of Romanian gypsies, as are others.

I also forgot to mention that about 12 years ago I lived, briefly, in Ealing
The Romanian gypsies there were beggars and used their babies to beg - they were also pickpockets.


So yes, back to the same old argument: not everyone in a race or group of people is the same but there are stereotypes for a reason.

The more desperate they are to stay, the more dangerous they are.

eddie wrote:I'm just telling you from a personal viewpoint, that I am wary of Romanian gypsies, as are others.

I also forgot to mention that about 12 years ago I lived, briefly, in Ealing
The Romanian gypsies there were beggars and used their babies to beg - they were also pickpockets.


So yes, back to the same old argument: not everyone in a race or group of people is the same but there are stereotypes for a reason.

I understand Eddie that you yourself have worries, but are they substantiated views? No, that view point logically would mean you would be wary of anyone, because anyone is capable of a crime and no again stereotypes are poor as seen because they base poor associations to groups of people that are as seen clearly wrong.
What you are saying is a black couple moves in for example next door to you and you are wary of them because there has been a spate of crimes in the area by some other blacks and that this couple have done nothing to have this form viewed of them other than to have black skin.

Didge - millions across the globe would rather avoid these people.

D'you know why? It's because they commit a ton of crime!

BigAndy9 wrote:Didge - millions across the globe would rather avoid these people.

D'you know why?  It's because they commit a ton of crime!

Please step away from the debate, as adults are talking


Thank you

Nope. That isn't what I'm saying.

If a black couple moved next door I'd be fine: I've never had a problem with black people.
If their son wore a hoodie, smoked skunk weed and hung around in a gang, I'd be wary of HIM.

I wouldn't not speak to him or automatically point the finger if something was stolen etc, but I would be more wary than I would be otherwise.

eddie wrote:Nope. That isn't what I'm saying.

If a black couple moved next door I'd be fine: I've never had a problem with black people.
If their son wore a hoodie, smoked skunk weed and hung around in a gang, I'd be wary of HIM.

I wouldn't not speak to him or automatically point the finger if something was stolen etc, but I would be more wary than I would be otherwise.

Again your logic would place you would be wary of them due to an association as you just did in regards to Gypsies Eddie, the same logic is applied, which means you view things different more do with which racial group the criminal was, who has committed the crime, than why a crime has been committed.
So again an example, if there had been a spate of child abuse cases in your area committed by some white man, would you start being wary of all white men?
All I am doing and am not taking the mick is to show how such poor stereotypes form, when they neglect to take other criminals into account, what is centered on is crime that has a direct connection, to yourself or people you know, with other crime as stated being ignored.


I would only be wary if someone was directly staring at me I did not know or at others the same, what they wore or did would have no place for me to judge, because body language and speech gives away if a group is to been seen as likely trouble, because again your view has been formed that you think such a group of individuals must have bad intention on their mind, negating the fact it is estimated around 1 in 3 of this nation take drugs, but you would of course not hold this view not knowing a well dressed mother is getting high herself also and is stealing to fuel this for you to form this view of her, because she is well dressed.

Didge I appreciate your polite responses which is all I ever wanted from you.

Yes, going by the logic you're stating about a white paedophile etc and would I be wary of all white men, then no of course not (insert any colour there)

But if a paedophile had moved into our area and he had the same kind of "look" (ie say he had grey curly hair and wore yellow shirts - this is a loose example obviously) as a previous paedophile I had known of, then I am sure it would bring a 'flashback' feeling, which is kind of what stereotyping is in it's loosest form.

There isn't a lot you can do about your mind stereotyping people. One tends to do it automatically. It doesn't make one racist per say.

I would still be inclined to judge everyone by their own merit because I'm like that anyway, but there is a tendency to involuntarily stereotype people due to past memories.

eddie wrote:Didge I appreciate your polite responses which is all I ever wanted from you.

Yes, going by the logic you're stating about a white paedophile etc and would I be wary of all white men, then no of course not (insert any colour there)

But if a paedophile had moved into our area and he had the same kind of "look" (ie say he had grey curly hair and wore yellow shirts - this is a loose example obviously) as a previous paedophile I had known of, then I am sure it would bring a 'flashback' feeling, which is kind of what stereotyping is in it's loosest form.

There isn't a lot you can do about your mind stereotyping people. One tends to do it automatically. It doesn't make one racist per say.

I would still be inclined to judge everyone by their own merit because I'm like that anyway, but there is a tendency to involuntarily stereotype people due to past memories.

I can understand a view to be wary of someone looking very similar or a look a like to who had committed a crime, people get wrongly associated also on that but that is a case of mistaken identity or a view that brings back memories of that individual can create this wary view. Though again we are talking about a bigger margin of difference to say when people associate a person who was black that committed a crime and the only similarity used to be wary is just the skin colour, or the religion, or the ethnic group etc.

Eddie if as seen I can look upon many different groups of people without prejudice or stereotype views  then it shows and I know that others do too, then people can see past poor stereotypes also, because that view comes from the individual themselves or from views formed by others with that person themselves. Thus anything badly learned can also have people unlearn, with again not saying what you view is badly learnt, but that I know you get my meaning on this on how things can be badly learnt by some people. .

Anyway have to go and thus have a good day!

Mass brawl erupts between rival groups of youths in area where former Home Secretary David Blunkett warned of rioting due to influx of Roma immigrants

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2634014/Mass-brawl-erupts-rival-groups-youths-area-former-Home-Secretary-David-Blunkett-warned-rioting-influx-Roma-immigrants.html

Well this is how Romanian gypsies were described to me as behaving in Bulgaria by a friend of mine.
They moved in to a a town and bullied the local residents out.

   

IN eddie's demented sense of reality, obviously all Romanians are apparently Romney gypsies ?

BIGOTS like eddie, Tess', L'ilAndy, smelly', BaggsHerHead, Tommy Monk and nicko will always need scapegoats to blame for all of the world's perceived ills, according to their sick agendas..

Romanians, Muslims, "Asians" (particularly Indians and Pakistanis..) are all convenient targets for a British bigot's lies and rumourmongering (each country to their own..) ~ blaming a whole nationality or religion for the sins of a minority.  

Neighbours are one of the most important factors to consider when people are thinking of moving into another property. the house may be fine but I would always ask what the neighbours are like and on the few times I have moved I was always asked that question. All you want is decent people and if their property looks well maintained and the front and back are tidy then it's a good chance they will be fine. Doesn't matter if they are black, brown, white, yellow or what nationality they are, you just want people to have a bit of respect for their neighbours and the community.
It's really easy to stereotype people or be suspicious about them. Just get on the tube in London and if a young Asian man gets on carrying a big backpack and sits beside you I'm sure some thoughts may cross your mind that may make you feel a wee bit uncomfortable. That's because images like that are drilled into our minds and I would think it's difficult not to be a wee bit uncomfortable. There's probably nothing to worry about but..........
I only know a couple of Romanians and both work.

More huff and puff waffle dodge....!?
The argument is about us having completely open door borders to all of EU.
Bulgaria and Romania were just the latest to get the door opened.....!

lone wolf, will you fuck off with bringing me into your posts, you talk an absolute load of bollocks most of the time, talk about a bigot, you fit the description 100%

Irn Bru wrote:Neighbours are one of the most important factors to consider when people are thinking of moving into another property. the house may be fine but I would always ask what the neighbours are like and on the few times I have moved I was always asked that question. All you want is decent people and if their property looks well maintained and the front and back are tidy then it's a good chance they will be fine. Doesn't matter if they are black, brown, white, yellow or what nationality they are, you just want people to have a bit of respect for their neighbours and the community.
It's really easy to stereotype people or be suspicious about them. Just get on the tube in London and if a young Asian man gets on carrying a big backpack and sits beside you I'm sure some thoughts may cross your mind that may make you feel a wee bit uncomfortable. That's because images like that are drilled into our minds and I would think it's difficult not to be a wee bit uncomfortable. There's probably nothing to worry about but..........
I only know a couple of Romanians and both work.

Best thing to do if you're buying a house is, before you commit, park up outside on a Saturday night and listen for the noise!

Lone Wolf wrote:   

IN eddie's demented sense of reality, obviously all Romanians are apparently Romney gypsies ?

BIGOTS like eddie, Tess', L'ilAndy, smelly', BaggsHerHead, Tommy Monk and nicko will always need scapegoats to blame for all of the world's perceived ills, according to their sick agendas..

Romanians, Muslims, "Asians" (particularly Indians and Pakistanis..) are all convenient targets for a British bigot's lies and rumourmongering (each country to their own..) ~ blaming a whole nationality or religion for the sins of a minority.    

Hmmm. Obviously you didn't read my posts properly.
Again.

Tommy Monk wrote:More huff and puff waffle dodge....!?
The argument is about us having completely open door borders to all of EU.
Bulgaria and Romania were just the latest to get the door opened.....!

No its about Nigel Farage making up lies and stereotyping all Romanians off some people mainly Gypsies who commit crime a percentage of crime , who only represent around 3-4% of their population. It shows a poor racial argument from Nigel and why the party plays badly on fear, an unfounded fear that now demonizes all Romanians.
It also shows how gullible you are and how you would also seek to be so utterly selfish that you cannot even share the world you live on, just because you think you have some "God" given right too based off being lucky enough to be born onto a land thinking you only have a say when you do not, others also do.

Huff and puff.....

Tommy Monk wrote:Huff and puff.....

Yes you act like an angry child, spoilt.

Says the man who spits his dummy out and minces off on a regular basis.....!

Tommy Monk wrote:Says the man who spits his dummy out and minces off on a regular basis.....!

Who can easily wipe the floor with your poor arguments and always does.

 ::D:: 

Just shouting down valid views and arguments with SIXHIRB isn't winning anything, but just showing yourself up as a leftie twat!!!!

Tommy Monk wrote:Just shouting down valid views and arguments with SIXHIRB isn't winning anything, but just showing yourself up as a leftie twat!!!!

That is not shouting down but exposing some people for what they are, basically it is like you saying we should not call a criminal a criminal, because it is wrong to call a criminal a criminal, even if they are a criminal, which of course is absurd.
You are a racist and a homophobe plain and simple, the worrying part is that you actually try to deny this!

Man alive that is hilarious ha ha, programs really were bad once, did you play the part of the witch though Tess?

  

Lone Wolf wrote:   

IN eddie's demented sense of reality, obviously all Romanians are apparently Romney gypsies ?

BIGOTS like eddie, Tess', L'ilAndy, smelly', BaggsHerHead, Tommy Monk and nicko will always need scapegoats to blame for all of the world's perceived ills, according to their sick agendas..

Romanians, Muslims, "Asians" (particularly Indians and Pakistanis..) are all convenient targets for a British bigot's lies and rumourmongering (each country to their own..) ~ blaming a whole nationality or religion for the sins of a minority.    

And if you moved near my family i'd have to keep my kids locked up, right?