WHY DOES ISLAM ISSUE THE DEATH SENTENCE FOR LEAVING ISLAM ?

If people have to be threatened with execution if they leave this religion does that show a fear on the part of islam that they feel they must terrorize their own believers ?

usually the basis of any religion is faith, that is what keeps you, so you could argue that the death threats for apostasy is a way of negating faith...
they must be very scared of loosing followers, it does smack of desperation...

It's something which I find appalling too, but what can we do about it when it's happening miles from our shores ?...

Unequivocal condemnation is what we can do for a start.

David wrote:Unequivocal condemnation is what we can do for a start.

agreed..

David wrote:Unequivocal condemnation is what we can do for a start.

yes indeed David

And if you're not a Christian, you're supposedly sentenced to eternal torture after death -- another scare tactic. Reincarnation as a lower being would be a scare tactic as well -- religion is full of them.

Why is this in UK NEWS????
What's with the spamming of Islam?

Tut tut tut.

Anyway for the uneducated on here.
Apostasy in Islam is permissible.

Ben_Reilly wrote:And if you're not a Christian, you're supposedly sentenced to eternal torture after death -- another scare tactic. Reincarnation as a lower being would be a scare tactic as well -- religion is full of them.

Sentencing a person to death is a little different to the idea of not going to heaven after you die.

For example, the Qur’an says: “Let him who wishes to believe, do so; and let him who wishes to disbelieve, do so.” (Al-Kahf: 29)

The Qur’an has referred to the issue of apostasy at more than one place (for example see Al-Baqarah 2: 217, Al-Baqarah 2: 108, A?l Imra?n 3: 90, Al-Nisa? 4: 137 and Al-Nahl 16: 106). But at none of these places does the Qur’an mention the punishment of death for such people who change their religion. The Qur’an does mention that such people shall face a terrible punishment in the hereafter but no worldly punishment is mentioned at any of these instances in the Qur’an. This situation obviously raises a question mark in the mind of the reader that if Allah had wanted to give the punishment of an apostate a permanent position in the Shari`ah, the punishment should have been mentioned, at least at one of the above mentioned places.

Furthermore, the Qur’an has strictly disallowed the imposition of the death penalty except in two specific cases. One of them is where the person is guilty of murdering another person and the other is where a person is guilty of creating unrest in the country (fasa’d fil-ardh) like being involved in activities that create unrest in a society, for example activities like terrorism etc. The Qur’an says: Whoever kills a person without his being guilty of murder or of creating unrest in the land, is as though he kills the whole of mankind. (Al-Ma?idah, 5: 32)

Anyway got to go have fun with the hatred

Ben_Reilly wrote:And if you're not a Christian, you're supposedly sentenced to eternal torture after death -- another scare tactic. Reincarnation as a lower being would be a scare tactic as well -- religion is full of them.

yep islam does that too...but that's not really the topic is it...

we aren't talking about eternal damnation we are talking about killing people who stop believing , that's quite different...

SEXY MAMA wrote:For example, the Qur’an says: “Let him who wishes to believe, do so; and let him who wishes to disbelieve, do so.” (Al-Kahf: 29)

The Qur’an has referred to the issue of apostasy at more than one place (for example see Al-Baqarah 2: 217, Al-Baqarah 2: 108, A?l Imra?n 3: 90, Al-Nisa? 4: 137 and Al-Nahl 16: 106). But at none of these places does the Qur’an mention the punishment of death for such people who change their religion. The Qur’an does mention that such people shall face a terrible punishment in the hereafter but no worldly punishment is mentioned at any of these instances in the Qur’an. This situation obviously raises a question mark in the mind of the reader that if Allah had wanted to give the punishment of an apostate a permanent position in the Shari`ah, the punishment should have been mentioned, at least at one of the above mentioned places.

Furthermore, the Qur’an has strictly disallowed the imposition of the death penalty except in two specific cases. One of them is where the person is guilty of murdering another person and the other is where a person is guilty of creating unrest in the country (fasa’d fil-ardh) like being involved in activities that create unrest in a society, for example activities like terrorism etc. The Qur’an says:  Whoever kills a person without his being guilty of murder or of creating unrest in the land, is as though he kills the whole of mankind. (Al-Ma?idah, 5: 32)

that's very interesting but can you explain by what law they did find the woman guilty of apostasy and by what law they would sentence her to death for it..

perhaps her lawyers over looked the fact it was against sharia law..lol... 

SEXY MAMA wrote:Anyway got to go have fun with the hatred

your the one in the religion of peace which sentences pregnant women to hanging for marrying a christian , and your the one who cannot back your own religion up on issues like this , you can't back it up because it is evil  , and just to add to your religion of peace you are also in favour of 100 lashes for adultery , you should remember that from ado when sassy disagreed with you on this issue .

Nobody wants to think every muslim is in agreement with this death sentence but you are trying to silence people on here questioning why such barbaric rules exist in the koran and the religion of peace.

I wouldn't be very proud of being part of such a barbaric religion , scaring its followers using terrorism .

have a fun evening

ps the only hatred is your religion , if you want people to understand it then at least have the decency to be polite when they ask questions.

Nems wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:And if you're not a Christian, you're supposedly sentenced to eternal torture after death -- another scare tactic. Reincarnation as a lower being would be a scare tactic as well -- religion is full of them.

Sentencing a person to death is a little different to the idea of not going to heaven after you die.

agree nems

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:And if you're not a Christian, you're supposedly sentenced to eternal torture after death -- another scare tactic. Reincarnation as a lower being would be a scare tactic as well -- religion is full of them.

yep islam does that too...but that's not really the topic is it...

we aren't talking about eternal damnation we are talking about  killing people who stop believing , that's quite different...

good points

SEXY MAMA wrote:Why is this in UK NEWS????
What's with the spamming of Islam?

Tut tut tut.

Anyway for the uneducated on here.
Apostasy in Islam is permissible.

shut up and answer the question without being totally ignorant , its a valid question because people are appalled by your religion giving out a death sentence to a pregnant woman ,

apostasy is condemned  in islam obviously  or this woman wouldn't be waiting to be hanged would she .

your call  

They're obviously quite similar in that they each offer a horrific outcome if you don't believe them.

Ben_Reilly wrote:They're obviously quite similar in that they each offer a horrific outcome if you don't believe them.

they have no similarities at all, one affects this life one affects eternity...  

://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: ://?roflmao?/: 

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:They're obviously quite similar in that they each offer a horrific outcome if you don't believe them.

they have no similarities at all, one affects this life one affects eternity...  

I'm wondering if you actually thought that one through before you wrote it ...   

http://islam.about.com/od/heavenhell/tp/Hell-In-The-Quran.htm

Ben_Reilly wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

they have no similarities at all, one affects this life one affects eternity...  

I'm wondering if you actually thought that one through before you wrote it ...   

http://islam.about.com/od/heavenhell/tp/Hell-In-The-Quran.htm

it is quite obvious even to you, do you believe in the God of the bible, i think your answer will be no, do you think you will burn in hell , no I don't think you do...

now if i said in an islamic country do you believe in allah and you said no, i would have to kill you....

perhaps now you will see the difference..  

best i can do to make it simple i am saving my crayons for didge and sassy...  

Ben_Reilly wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

they have no similarities at all, one affects this life one affects eternity...  

I'm wondering if you actually thought that one through before you wrote it ...   

http://islam.about.com/od/heavenhell/tp/Hell-In-The-Quran.htm

funny how you appear Ben as soon as there is a thread about how bad islam is lol.

anyway i actually believe that muslims all of them will be going to paradise and not heaven

Well it seems are Christian friends are missing the point, as in both faiths, you will suffer eternally for not believing.

lol dodger didge, we are not talking about suffering in eternity we are talking about being killed for simply not accepting islam..

Islamophobes insist that Islam says that apostates must be killed. These ardent critics of the faith are of the view that Islam is for this reason simply incompatible with the Western Judeo-Christian tradition. Their view–which they try to propagate–is that Islam is somehow so inherently different from all other religions that it should be singled out as the one faith that we just absolutely cannot tolerate.

The issue of course is that “Islam” doesn’t “say” anything, since it is not a person. Islam is in fact polyvalent: it has within it different understandings and interpretations of the religion. On this particular issue, Islam itself doesn’t “say” anything. Valerie Hoffman, a professor of Islamic studies at the University of Illinois, commented on the issue of apostasy in Islam: “You can’t say Islam says this or Islam says that.” The question of course is “whose Islam” and “which Islam?”

Yes, the majority “classical” and “traditional” opinion codified hundreds of years ago was indeed that apostates from Islam should be killed. However, such views are abundantly present in the Judeo-Christian tradition as well, yet Jews and Christians have over the course of time reanalyzed their canonical texts and come to different understandings today.

http://www.loonwatch.com/apostasy/

Apostasy and Freedom of Faith in Islam

by Sheila Musaji

updates at bottom of page

Hisham Hellyer published an important article on apostasy in Islam - “Apostasy: Tradition and Truths”. Dr. Hisham A. Hellyer is Fellow of the Oxford Centre for Islamic Studies at the University of Oxford. As founder-director of the Visionary Consultants Group, a Muslim world-West relations consultancy, his advice and commentary has been sought by the Home Office & Foreign Office (UK) as well as the Brookings Institution (US) and the Washington Post (US). He is also one of the initiating signatories to the Common Word Letter. This article clearly lays out the historical precedents and current issues involved in the debate on apostasy.

I was particularly struck by one sentence in which he said: “When it comes to interpreting between Islamic teachings regarding apostasy and historical practice, change, if it is to be sustainable, comes from within, or not at all.” The emphasis is mine. This is important on this and many other issues involving ijtihad and interpretations of shariah. As he also points out: “It used to be that the media (whether Muslim or non-Muslim) would cover Islam in reference to the well-known ‘three H’s’: hijab, halal and haram. It has now changed somewhat such that the focus is on hijab, apostasy, shari’ah and hate (preachers of). Doubtlessly from the point of view of a religion that abjures intoxicants, this creates a rather unfortunate acronym.”

If we are going to be able to deal with these very real issues facing Muslim communities, then we will need to deal with them within our communities. We need for ordinary Muslims to be much more aware and demanding of their scholars and leaders. We need dialogue within our communities, and we need to struggle for the soul of Islam.

This issue of apostasy and freedom of faith is an important one in this discussion. We live in a country where such freedom is a foundational principle and must be defended. We must continue to insist on the Islamic principle that there is “no compulsion in religion.”

http://theamericanmuslim.org/tam.php/features/articles/apostasy_and_freedom_of_faith_in_islam

so by what law are they sentencing her for apostasy from islam does the same law apply to apostasy from Christianity...

by what law are they sentencing her to hang for apostasy from islam, would they hang a Christian for giving up their religion???

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:so by what law are they sentencing her for apostasy from islam does the same law apply to apostasy from Christianity...

by what law are they sentencing her to hang for apostasy from islam, would they hang a Christian for giving up their religion???

Hang a hristian?

Odd never heard of that before.

What law were people executed for heresy?

If you know that then you will have the answer you seek

Didge wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:so by what law are they sentencing her for apostasy from islam does the same law apply to apostasy from Christianity...

by what law are they sentencing her to hang for apostasy from islam, would they hang a Christian for giving up their religion???

Hang a hristian?

Odd never heard of that before.

What law were people executed for heresy?

If you know that then you will have the answer you seek

lol dodge ball...lol

is she been sentenced according to sharia law of course she is, is she being sentenced to death according to sharia law of course she is, thats kinda all we need to know ...

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Didge wrote:


Hang a hristian?

Odd never heard of that before.

What law were people executed for heresy?

If you know that then you will have the answer you seek

lol dodge ball...lol

is she been sentenced according to sharia law of course she is, is she being sentenced to death according to sharia law of course she is, thats kinda all we need to know ...

Sharia law is an interpretation by Muslims, different in many Muslim countries, the same you find in history with the West with Heresy laws.
So if the west changed these laws, why can it not happen in Muslim countries that have the death penalty for this law?

obviously sudan follows sharia law and quite obviously sharia law says you should be killed for leaving islam, the fact she claims never to have accepted islam is perhaps even more worrying as this would mean that if Britain took on sharia in all it's wonderful loving and cuddly, peaceful ways anyone who did not accept islam could and would be killed...

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:obviously sudan follows sharia law and quite obviously sharia law says you should be killed for leaving islam, the fact she claims  never to have accepted islam is perhaps even more worrying as this would mean that if Britain took on sharia in all it's wonderful loving and cuddly, peaceful ways anyone who did not accept islam could and would be killed...

It follows its own interpretation, as that is all sharia is, an interpretation of the Quran and hadiths, the later creating most of the problems, just as you find has happened throughout the history of Christianity with religious works.
So again you fail to answer the point whether these laws can change?

The answer is shown even in history that they can

Didge wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:obviously sudan follows sharia law and quite obviously sharia law says you should be killed for leaving islam, the fact she claims  never to have accepted islam is perhaps even more worrying as this would mean that if Britain took on sharia in all it's wonderful loving and cuddly, peaceful ways anyone who did not accept islam could and would be killed...

It follows its own interpretation, as that is all sharia is, an interpretation of the Quran and hadiths, the later creating most of the problems, just as you find has happened throughout the history of Christianity with religious works.
So again you fail to answer the point whether these laws can change?

The answer is shown even in history that they can

they still stone people to death, they remove hands and heads they still hang gays, i do not see any change..

so it is now back to the hide behind interpretation, they have sentenced her clearly according to sharia law and again if this is what Britain has to look forward to God help us...

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Didge wrote:


It follows its own interpretation, as that is all sharia is, an interpretation of the Quran and hadiths, the later creating most of the problems, just as you find has happened throughout the history of Christianity with religious works.
So again you fail to answer the point whether these laws can change?

The answer is shown even in history that they can

they still stone people to death, they remove hands and heads they still hang gays, i do not see any change..

so it is now back to the hide behind interpretation, they have sentenced her clearly according to sharia law and again if this is what Britain has to look forward to God help us...

That is because you only look at the countries that still practice this, where are other Muslim countries do not stone people to death, showing and proving again your view is very wrong!
You avoid always the point because your view is one of hate, ignoring the history of abuse found within the history of Christianity, showing it is people that do wrongs in faith

Didge wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

they still stone people to death, they remove hands and heads they still hang gays, i do not see any change..

so it is now back to the hide behind interpretation, they have sentenced her clearly according to sharia law and again if this is what Britain has to look forward to God help us...

That is because you only look at the countries that still practice this, where are other Muslim countries do not stone people to death, showing and proving again your view is very wrong!
You avoid always the point because your view is one of hate, ignoring the history of abuse found within the history of Christianity, showing it is people that do wrongs in faith

do they practice it according to sharia law, do they cut off hands according to sharia law, do they hang gays according to sharia laws, yes they do, so sharia law does condone their barbaric actions, so according to you and the interpretation cop out any islamic country could, kill apostates or those who do not want to believe , cut off hands or heads and hang gays if they decided too, as i said very dangerous and barbaric...

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Didge wrote:

That is because you only look at the countries that still practice this, where are other Muslim countries do not stone people to death, showing and proving again your view is very wrong!
You avoid always the point because your view is one of hate, ignoring the history of abuse found within the history of Christianity, showing it is people that do wrongs in faith

do they practice it according to sharia law, do they cut off hands according to sharia law, do they hang gays according to sharia laws, yes they do, so sharia law does condone their barbaric actions, so according to you and the interpretation cop out any islamic country could, kill apostates or those who do not want to believe , cut off hands or heads and hang gays if they decided too, as i said very dangerous and barbaric...

Not even a debate now and again repeating, sorry you ignore the Muslim countries that do not have such punishments, ignoring that those countries that still practice such barbaric laws can also change.

You ignore your own religious history showing how it is people that interpret religions that are the problem and even worse your own religious book believes in genocide, God sanction genocide, it is called Herem.

I shall leave you to keep repeating yourself.

Later

Didge wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

do they practice it according to sharia law, do they cut off hands according to sharia law, do they hang gays according to sharia laws, yes they do, so sharia law does condone their barbaric actions, so according to you and the interpretation cop out any islamic country could, kill apostates or those who do not want to believe , cut off hands or heads and hang gays if they decided too, as i said very dangerous and barbaric...

Not even a debate now and again repeating, sorry you ignore the Muslim countries that do not have such punishments, ignoring that those countries that still practice such barbaric laws can also change.

You ignore your own religious history showing how it is people that interpret religions that are the problem and even worse your own religious book believes in genocide, God sanction genocide, it is called Herem.

I shall leave you to keep repeating yourself.

Later

I don't ignore them as they are just as much a potential danger as the islamic countries that do as they could start killing non believers if they decide to interpret it that way..

SEXY MAMA wrote:Anyway got to go have fun with the hatred

Flap mark 2   

The entire board is spammed with these anti Islam threads,,,any yet, NOBODY here agrees with the way some Muslims treat people, we know some of them oppress women and kill people..do we want that ?-NO!!!

We can't do anything from here,and even if our government did intervene, they would be called all the bastards under the sun...just like Labour were for joining the US and ridding the world of Hussein and taking out many of the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

Joy Division wrote:The entire board is spammed with these anti Islam threads,,,any yet, NOBODY here agrees with the way some Muslims treat people, we know some of them oppress women and kill people..do we want that ?-NO!!!

We can't do anything from here,and  even if our government did intervene, they would be called all the bastards under the sun...just like Labour were for joining the US  and ridding the world of  Hussein and taking out many of the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

it is not spamming, they are valid news points, which people should be aware of...

this is the problem with a pc world like we have, the minorities always have the loudest vice and the most control..  

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Didge wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

do they practice it according to sharia law, do they cut off hands according to sharia law, do they hang gays according to sharia laws, yes they do, so sharia law does condone their barbaric actions, so according to you and the interpretation cop out any islamic country could, kill apostates or those who do not want to believe , cut off hands or heads and hang gays if they decided too, as i said very dangerous and barbaric...

Not even a debate now and again repeating, sorry you ignore the Muslim countries that do not have such punishments, ignoring that those countries that still practice such barbaric laws can also change.

You ignore your own religious history showing how it is people that interpret religions that are the problem and even worse your own religious book believes in genocide, God sanction genocide, it is called Herem.

I shall leave you to keep repeating yourself.

Later

I don't ignore them as they are just as much a potential danger as the islamic countries that do as they could start killing non believers if they decide to interpret it that way..

Sudan is worse than sharia law...
It is a brutal place of civil war, there are multiple fucked up groups on all sides that commit atrocities like the use of child soldiers

https://www.dosomething.org/facts/11-facts-about-child-soldiers

veya_victaous wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

I don't ignore them as they are just as much a potential danger as the islamic countries that do as they could start killing non believers if they decide to interpret it that way..

Sudan is worse than sharia law...
It is a brutal place of civil war, there are multiple fucked up groups on all sides that commit atrocities like the use of child soldiers

https://www.dosomething.org/facts/11-facts-about-child-soldiers

we recently went to eden camp again and every time it reminds me just how brutal people can be to other people, the nazi death camps, the japanese concentration camps, the way we put so much effort in to finding new and better ways to kill each other, its all very sad really..

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Joy Division wrote:The entire board is spammed with these anti Islam threads,,,any yet, NOBODY here agrees with the way some Muslims treat people, we know some of them oppress women and kill people..do we want that ?-NO!!!

We can't do anything from here,and  even if our government did intervene, they would be called all the bastards under the sun...just like Labour were for joining the US  and ridding the world of  Hussein and taking out many of the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

it is not spamming, they are valid news points, which people should be aware of...

this is the problem with a pc world like we have, the minorities always have the loudest vice and the most control..  

..but you would be one of the first of many to greet if our government intervened and took action against this Favva, probably an impossible task anyway...

But nobody on here agrees with executing people because of faith changing, adultery etc..

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

Joy Division wrote:The entire board is spammed with these anti Islam threads,,,any yet, NOBODY here agrees with the way some Muslims treat people, we know some of them oppress women and kill people..do we want that ?-NO!!!

We can't do anything from here,and  even if our government did intervene, they would be called all the bastards under the sun...just like Labour were for joining the US  and ridding the world of  Hussein and taking out many of the Taliban and Al Qaeda.

it is not spamming, they are valid news points, which people should be aware of...

this is the problem with a pc world like we have, the minorities always have the loudest vice and the most control..  

It is Simplification of complex issues, being thrown around by the ignorant to try and justify their racist fear driven point of view.
It has nothing to do with being PC, you are getting shouted down because of the ignorance. You try and make it about Muslims and try and use Sudan as an example even though the Current Fundamentalist gov't is being opposed by a combined Christian/Muslims rebel force (the South Sudanese).
The current gov't has come to power on terror and violence, it does not represent any group other than their own interests.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-27220244

More than 9,000 child soldiers have been fighting in South Sudan's brutal civil war, UN human rights chief Navi Pillay has said.

Both the army and rebel forces had recruited the children, she said.

Ms Pillay said South Sudan faced the threat of a famine, but there was an "apparent lack of concern" on the part of its leaders.

She was speaking at the end of a visit to South Sudan, where the conflict has displaced about a million people.

veya_victaous wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:

it is not spamming, they are valid news points, which people should be aware of...

this is the problem with a pc world like we have, the minorities always have the loudest vice and the most control..  

It is Simplification of complex issues, being thrown around by the ignorant to try and justify their racist fear driven point of view.
It has nothing to do with being PC, you are getting shouted down because of the ignorance. You try and make it about Muslims and try and use Sudan as an example even though the Current Fundamentalist gov't is being opposed by a combined Christian/Muslims rebel force (the South Sudanese).
The current gov't has come to power on terror and violence, it does not represent any group other than their own interests.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-27220244

More than 9,000 child soldiers have been fighting in South Sudan's brutal civil war, UN human rights chief Navi Pillay has said.

Both the army and rebel forces had recruited the children, she said.

Ms Pillay said South Sudan faced the threat of a famine, but there was an "apparent lack of concern" on the part of its leaders.

She was speaking at the end of a visit to South Sudan, where the conflict has displaced about a million people.

..that sounds about right to me Veya...News stories being used as an excuse for some to further their hatred of Muslims. But as I said..of our government tried to intervene in the violent aspects of some Muslim rulers who hand down death sentences for a person changing their faith, then we would see the same ones on here whinging about that , who have a hate for Muslims.

what a load of bollocks, islam doesn't need help from anyone to show the world its true nature...

so how oppressive is islam...

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:what a load of bollocks, islam doesn't need help from anyone to show the world its true nature...

you sir  :::grouch::  are a racist idiot

Just like Hitler showed the world the true nature of White people?????  ::hdintowll:: ::hdintowll:: ::hdintowll:: ::hdintowll:: 


So what the Muslims Fighting Against them are????? Seriously your logic is so dumb!!! look at this group that other Muslims are fighting against, this group that has other Muslims fighting against it represents all Muslims      

veya_victaous wrote:

heavenlyfatheragain wrote:what a load of bollocks, islam doesn't need help from anyone to show the world its true nature...

you sir  :::grouch::  are a racist idiot

Just like Hitler showed the world the true nature of White people?????  ::hdintowll:: ::hdintowll:: ::hdintowll:: ::hdintowll:: 


So what the Muslims Fighting Against them are????? Seriously your logic is so dumb!!! look at this group that other Muslims are fighting against, this group that has other Muslims fighting against it represents all Muslims      

if it was a single incident, i would probably agree with your idiotic outburst, racist is islam a race....

you just have to open the papers every day, innocents people blown up by muslims, people beheaded by muslims, gays hung by muslims, white girls groomed by muslims, honour murder by muslims, acid thrown in the face of women by muslims, banners calling for the death of none muslims, death sentence for a pregnant woman for not following islam..

not quite isolated incidents, more like day to day affirmation of the true face of the religion of peace...