Hull Council invents way round benefit fraud

Hull City Council is creating its own Bitcoin-like digital currency called HullCoin which it will donate to people in return for carrying out voluntary work.

The unprecedented move is a bid to “tackle poverty” and boost the local economy. Struggling residents will carry out "voluntary work" and receive HullCoins as payment. These digital coins could then be used to pay rent or council tax, or buy other goods and services such as fruit and vegetables. Council workers are currently investigating whether deals could be signed that would even allow them to be used at highstreet shops such as Asda.

Those virtual earnings would not be taxable or affect any existing benefits claims because digital money is not yet treated as traditional currency by HMRC or the Department for Work and Pensions, the council said.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/news/10734073/Hull-Council-printing-its-own-money-by-paying-digital-cash-for-voluntary-work.html

I can't believe this! That's fraud pure and simple. The people are being paid with credit that can be used to pay rent etc and buy shopping - how is that not earning money just because it isn't paid in cash? If they get away with this it'll set a legal precedent - everyone can pay their employees in bitcoin type currency, not deduct any tax, and they can all claim benefits at the same time! I'm just amazed they've got away with this. I thought it was an April Fool article, but that's not till tomorrow, and it contains links to other places that have created their own currencies.

" Shepherdson estimated that it would take between ten and 12 weeks for the council to mine enough coins to pay for the hardware it had bought to power the project. "


Have reread at least four times before posting to check I had read it correctly....    " Mine "    


From th Jam Butty mines........ ::dunno:: 


Maybe the DT has printed the article one day to early....... ::ftlcheer:: 

gerber wrote:" Shepherdson estimated that it would take between ten and 12 weeks for the council to mine enough coins to pay for the hardware it had bought to power the project. "


Have reread at least four times before posting to check I had read it correctly....    " Mine "    


From th Jam Butty mines........ ::dunno:: 


Maybe the DT has printed the article one day to early....... ::ftlcheer:: 

Yeah I thought it was an April Fool, but it ain't April - that's cheating.

They must have had their legal people looking into it. It can't be counted as cash as it can only be spent with the council or particular suppliers, therefore I should think it was come under the same rules as vouchers.

Bloody brilliant idea to help out people who need it.

gerber wrote:" Shepherdson estimated that it would take between ten and 12 weeks for the council to mine enough coins to pay for the hardware it had bought to power the project. "


Have reread at least four times before posting to check I had read it correctly....    " Mine "    


From th Jam Butty mines........ ::dunno:: 


Maybe the DT has printed the article one day to early....... ::ftlcheer:: 

I've read it again. "Mining" is a computer term for bitcoin currencies I think?

"Digital currency is "mined" into existence by a computer carrying out complex and specific calculations. Cryptographic systems then track who owns which coins and enable them to be transferred from person to person. Coins are kept in a "wallet" which takes the form of a small computer file. "

Sassy wrote:They must have had their legal people looking into it.   It can't be counted as cash as it can only be spent with the council or particular suppliers, therefore I should think it was come under the same rules as vouchers.

Bloody brilliant idea to help out people who need it.

I don't want to go on about it in case it is an April Fool joke and I look like a plonker, but Sassy am I the only one that's seen the legal precedent this'll set? If everyone paid their employees in virtual wages, deducting no tax and those employees could claim benefits too, well that'd just crash the whole economy. Total anarchy! And it's no good saying the council can get round it, they can't - once you set a legal precedent it's set - for everyone.

People wouldn't accept their wages in virtual currency because there would only be certain places they could spend it, it just wouldn't work. Seems to me this is exactly the same as lunch vouchers used to be.

Sassy wrote:People wouldn't accept their wages in virtual currency because there would only be certain places they could spend it, it just wouldn't work.   Seems to me this is exactly the same as lunch vouchers used to be.

No. Nothing like. You just don't get it.

Where's Quill?

Tesstacious wrote:

Sassy wrote:They must have had their legal people looking into it.   It can't be counted as cash as it can only be spent with the council or particular suppliers, therefore I should think it was come under the same rules as vouchers.

Bloody brilliant idea to help out people who need it.

I don't want to go on about it in case it is an April Fool joke and I look like a plonker, but Sassy am I the only one that's seen the legal precedent this'll set?  If everyone paid their employees in virtual wages, deducting no tax and those employees could claim benefits too, well that'd just crash the whole economy.  Total anarchy!  And it's no good saying the council can get round it, they can't - once you set a legal precedent it's set - for everyone.

You are not alone Tess......

And a very clever bunny as well  " Mining "...................  Learnt something new I think  ::D::

Seems genuine......  On Radio 2 money news now

Tesstacious wrote:

Sassy wrote:They must have had their legal people looking into it.   It can't be counted as cash as it can only be spent with the council or particular suppliers, therefore I should think it was come under the same rules as vouchers.

Bloody brilliant idea to help out people who need it.

I don't want to go on about it in case it is an April Fool joke and I look like a plonker, but Sassy am I the only one that's seen the legal precedent this'll set?  If everyone paid their employees in virtual wages, deducting no tax and those employees could claim benefits too, well that'd just crash the whole economy.  Total anarchy!  And it's no good saying the council can get round it, they can't - once you set a legal precedent it's set - for everyone.

'Mining' Digital currency is just automating(usually through scripts) the process that rewards you some 'gold', the term originates in the World of War craft where people were literally setting up scripts that would just repeat the mining action for hours while they were at work or whatever else in the real world. Most of the practical examples earn in game money(but often that is worth real money or at least time).

Bitcoins are more difficult to mine but it is still possible, creating a script to create a Virtual machine connect to the website issuing bit coins then close virtual and make a new one (each time it will generate new details and look like a new machine)

Oddly when they predicted that Bitcoin could revolutionise money they suggested big companies might try this, Surprised to see a local council destroying nationalised currencies.