IF UKIP governed Britain...

Would that mean the chances of Britain leaving the EU would be greater?..

As UKIP would push desperately for that..and if Britain did leave the EU under a UKIP government, wouldn't that mean employees would be fcuked as in how much pay an employer is allowed to pay them?

Wouldn't the average working Joe be poorer under a UKIP government?

Joy Division wrote:Would that mean the chances of Britain leaving the EU would be greater?..

As UKIP would push desperately for that..and if Britain did leave the EU under a UKIP government, wouldn't that mean employees would be fcuked as in how much pay an employer is allowed to pay them?

Wouldn't the average working Joe be poorer under a UKIP government?

No.

Minimum wage is not an EU rule.

Minimum wage workers would no longer be paying tax under UKIP - so would be better off.

Not needing to pay £50 million a day to the EU - what do you think that would do for employees?

sphinx wrote:

Joy Division wrote:Would that mean the chances of Britain leaving the EU would be greater?..

As UKIP would push desperately for that..and if Britain did leave the EU under a UKIP government, wouldn't that mean employees would be fcuked as in how much pay an employer is allowed to pay them?

Wouldn't the average working Joe be poorer under a UKIP government?

No.

Minimum wage is not an EU rule.

Minimum wage workers would no longer be paying tax under UKIP - so would be better off.

Not needing to pay £50 million a day to the EU - what do you think that would do for employees?

But if Britain were independent of the EU, wouldn't that take away some of the rights and or conditions of British workers?..wouldn't they be left sitting ducks for any British government to do as they please?...

Let's not forget the Conservatives many broken promises , what makes you so sure a UKIP government would be any different?

As for this 50 million quid a day...do you think any of that would go into the pockets of a British workers?

If those nutcase ruled Britain, we would be down the drain within a year, they haven't got a full number of brain cells between them.

Joy Division wrote:

sphinx wrote:

No.

Minimum wage is not an EU rule.

Minimum wage workers would no longer be paying tax under UKIP - so would be better off.

Not needing to pay £50 million a day to the EU - what do you think that would do for employees?

But if Britain were independent of the EU, wouldn't that take away some of the rights and or conditions of British workers?..wouldn't they be left sitting ducks for any British government to do as they please?...

Let's not forget the Conservatives many broken promises , what  makes you so sure a UKIP government would be any different?

As for this 50 million quid a day...do you think any of that would go into the pockets of a British workers?

The biggest winner would be the NHS and the working hours directive signed by no other then T bliar. Caused massive reductions in Doctors being available but more importantly many junior Doctors have failed to get placements... and those that have have not been given the tutorials the mentoring the stewardship from the consultants who cannot wor
k the hours required...........

And before anyone comes back and tells me they are spending too much time in private practice.... it is at the end of their contractual hours to the NHS as decreed by Brussels.

Shouldn't be allowed to have a private practice if they work for the NHS.

gerber wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


But if Britain were independent of the EU, wouldn't that take away some of the rights and or conditions of British workers?..wouldn't they be left sitting ducks for any British government to do as they please?...

Let's not forget the Conservatives many broken promises , what  makes you so sure a UKIP government would be any different?

As for this 50 million quid a day...do you think any of that would go into the pockets of a British workers?

The biggest winner would be the NHS and the working hours directive signed by no other then T bliar.  Caused massive reductions in Doctors being available but more importantly many junior Doctors have failed to get placements... and those that have have not been given the tutorials the mentoring the stewardship from the consultants who cannot wor
k the hours required...........

And before anyone comes back and tells me they are spending too much time in private practice.... it is at the end of their contractual hours to the NHS as decreed by Brussels.

But Gerbs, don't you think it's only use wise for doctors and other medical staff not to be allowed to work no more hours than they should for safety reasons?...

Surely it is better to hire extra NHS staff like nurses and junior doctors rather than work them to the bone to the point of exhaustion ...where many mistakes are made...

Of course it costs money hiring extra staff, bit safety first eh?

Sassy wrote:Should be allowed to have a private practice if they work for the NHS.

Yes because they are working outside their contacted hours........

freelancing maybe a more accepted term...... and why not they are providing a much needed service.... imagine the NHS decrees they cannot work due to the Brussels directive, they stop all private practice................. The thousands and that is an under estimation who were being seen privately now have to come under the wing of the can't cope NHS

And do not forget the ones who need to be seen and are out of the time limitations as set by the last government are seen in the private sector.

Joy Division wrote:

gerber wrote:

The biggest winner would be the NHS and the working hours directive signed by no other then T bliar.  Caused massive reductions in Doctors being available but more importantly many junior Doctors have failed to get placements... and those that have have not been given the tutorials the mentoring the stewardship from the consultants who cannot wor
k the hours required...........

And before anyone comes back and tells me they are spending too much time in private practice.... it is at the end of their contractual hours to the NHS as decreed by Brussels.

But  Gerbs, don't you think it's only use wise for doctors and other medical staff not to be allowed to work no more hours than they should for safety reasons?...

Surely it is better to hire extra NHS staff like nurses and junior doctors rather than work them to the bone to the point of exhaustion ...where many mistakes are made...

Of course it costs money hiring extra staff, bit safety first eh?

JD I do not disagree............... But the problem is the junior doctors or the required number are no longer able to be trained nor supervised....... Brussels has decreed the number of hours allowed to work........

The EU has given us the problem...../ We the UK and the NHS are having to cope with it,,,,,,, Bear in mind at the same time GP's contracts were also changed by T Bliar..... they no longer had to work out of hours........

Everything fall on A and E when Doctors now go home..... They are earning thousands more but doing less work......

And guess what A and E are always in the news for under performing.......

They all deserve medals

Joy Division wrote:

gerber wrote:

The biggest winner would be the NHS and the working hours directive signed by no other then T bliar.  Caused massive reductions in Doctors being available but more importantly many junior Doctors have failed to get placements... and those that have have not been given the tutorials the mentoring the stewardship from the consultants who cannot wor
k the hours required...........

And before anyone comes back and tells me they are spending too much time in private practice.... it is at the end of their contractual hours to the NHS as decreed by Brussels.

But  Gerbs, don't you think it's only use wise for doctors and other medical staff not to be allowed to work no more hours than they should for safety reasons?...

Surely it is better to hire extra NHS staff like nurses and junior doctors rather than work them to the bone to the point of exhaustion ...where many mistakes are made...

Of course it costs money hiring extra staff, bit safety first eh?

Unfortunately the world does not work like that and there are a couple of issues with the working directive. There are far more positions for junior doctors than senior registrars and consultants as it is now - which means not every person training as a doctor will make it all the way - which works with current numbers but would be a problem with wanting more juniors as you in effect be saying to people come and work your tits off with a much slimmer chance of reaching seniority.

Also the brutal fact is that becoming a good doctor means an awful lot of learning - not just book learning but real world learning where the body does things differently from how it does in text books, where the spotting of something deadly is almost a highly developed instinct. That sort of learning is just not compatible with the working directive and it is why the quality of younger doctors especially surgeons is not as high as it was before the directives came in. You are absolutely right about the safety aspects of overworking but right now the working directives are way below the danger level.

Joy Division wrote:

sphinx wrote:

No.

Minimum wage is not an EU rule.

Minimum wage workers would no longer be paying tax under UKIP - so would be better off.

Not needing to pay £50 million a day to the EU - what do you think that would do for employees?

But if Britain were independent of the EU, wouldn't that take away some of the rights and or conditions of British workers?..wouldn't they be left sitting ducks for any British government to do as they please?...

Let's not forget the Conservatives many broken promises , what  makes you so sure a UKIP government would be any different?

As for this 50 million quid a day...do you think any of that would go into the pockets of a British workers?

Do you not think that rules requiring cleaning contracts to be advertised continent wide are taking away rights and conditions of british workers JD? Do you not think that expecting workers to compete against more people for each and every job might be holding wages and opportunities down?

I keep telling you - UKIP is not Tory. Right now there is only one party concerning itself with the conditions of ordinary workers and it is not Labour. There is one party wants to lift minimum wage out of taxation. There is one party that really actually wants to get a grip on uncontrolled immigration that is suppressing wages. There is one party that wants to reform the education system to recognize and place vocational qualifications equally alongside academic qualifications and stop forcing all young people to end up with identical certificates of much devalued qualifications. There is one party that wants to stop forcing everyone to pay subsidies on their gas and electric bills just to make a small number of "green" energy individuals extremely wealthy.

Sassy wrote:If those nutcase ruled Britain, we would be down the drain within a year, they haven't got a full number of brain cells between them.

They don't even have one MP at the moment, the bookies and most other people (Not UKIP) suggest that they won't even get one at the next GE, even by a flook, they managed to say, get half a dozen!....That still isn't enough to give them any kind of real say in British politics!

sphinx wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


But if Britain were independent of the EU, wouldn't that take away some of the rights and or conditions of British workers?..wouldn't they be left sitting ducks for any British government to do as they please?...

Let's not forget the Conservatives many broken promises , what  makes you so sure a UKIP government would be any different?

As for this 50 million quid a day...do you think any of that would go into the pockets of a British workers?

Do you not think that rules requiring cleaning contracts to be advertised continent wide are taking away rights and conditions of british workers JD?  Do you not think that expecting workers to compete against more people for each and every job might be holding wages and opportunities down?

I keep telling you - UKIP is not Tory.  Right now there is only one party concerning itself with the conditions of ordinary workers and it is not Labour.  There is one party wants to lift minimum wage out of taxation.  There is one party that really actually wants to get a grip on uncontrolled immigration that is suppressing wages.  There is one party that wants to reform the education system to recognize and place vocational qualifications equally alongside academic qualifications and stop forcing all young people to end up with identical certificates of much devalued qualifications.  There is one party that wants to stop forcing everyone to pay subsidies on their gas and electric bills just to make a small number of "green" energy individuals extremely wealthy.  

Yes a party making plenty of promises, without any viable plans to implement them an you are greatly mistaken if you think they are concerning themselves over as you call it the ordinary worker.
Immigration is not suppressing wages, that really is gobbledygook and by the way wages this year are going up in many firms for the first time in a few years after a hard hitting recession. The only thing suppressing wages is the companies themselves, not the immigrants, so again we see it is UKIP policy to blame immigrants on wages now, when they do not set them, but know doubt UKIP will have some Balderdash claim on this.


Well I think for one if they came to power many Muslims would be fucked







1) 'NAZI' UKIP HAS DONE US A FAVOUR, SAYS TORY MP

Forget the infamous 'fruitcakes, loonies and racists' attack on Ukip by David Cameron from several years ago; yesterday, Tory backbencher Robert Halfon let rip against Nigel Farage's anti-EU party, comparing some of its members to Nazis in an interview with House magazine. My HuffPost colleague Ned Simons reports:

"Robert Halfon, the MP for Harlow, said in many ways he was pleased Nigel Farage's party was doing so well as it had helped draw "sinister" people away from the Conservatives. 'To me there are two kinds of Ukip – the Godfrey Bloom guy who’s like a cross between Sid James and Bernard Manning,' he said. 'And then there's a much more sinister element, like the MEP who said every Muslim has got to sign a declaration of non-violence, which to me is literally akin to the Nazis saying Jews should wear a yellow star. I genuinely find it abhorrent and frightening. I'm amazed that man is still an MEP. How someone could say such a thing and then not apologise for it.' In an interview with The House magazine, Halfon, who is Jewish, said that Nigel Farage's party had actually done the Conservatives a 'huge favour' by 'cleansing people from the Tory party that had these kinds of views'."

Let's be clear: plenty of Tory MPs privately sympathise with Ukip; but plenty of others privately agree with Halfon.

In response, Farage tweeted that Halfon's "hysterical slurs" were due to "Tory terror of Ukip's rising popularity" and said his party planned a national day of action against the Tory backbencher in his Harlow constituency. The Ukip leader didn't however deal with Halfon's specific criticism of Ukip MEP Gerard Batten who did indeed outrageously demand all British Muslims sign a "declaration of non-violence".

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2014/03/07/mehdis-morning-memo_142_n_4916819.html

Headed by Nigel Farage, a Member of the European Parliament, the UK Independence Party (known as “UKIP”) has made huge gains in local government elections in the UK, and may achieve the support of up to 20% of voters during the impending European elections. UKIP has of course also received scrutiny due to the extreme right-wing (and often explicitly Far-Right) views of far too many of its politicians. These views have received publicity via a combination of media exposure and blunders by UKIP politicians themselves.

Such incidents are continuing to occur. For example, during a recent UKIP conference in Torquay, Nigel Farage was caught enthusiastically applauding racist “jokes” about South Asians along with similarly derogatory “humour” at the expense of Muslims. Furthermore, during the same conference, UKIP tried to ban journalists from a meeting ostensibly to discuss sharia law; the very first question at that meeting was “How can you be both a Muslim and an Englishman ?” Farage himself has also become increasingly outspoken about expressing highly offensive views; in fact, even traditionally right-wing British news outlets such as The Telegraph are now publishing articles describing UKIP as “an overtly racist and extremist party”.

http://www.loonwatch.com/2014/03/exposed-muslim-charter-ukip-mep-gerard-batten-directly-linked-to-extremist-anti-muslim-propaganda-network/

gerber wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


But if Britain were independent of the EU, wouldn't that take away some of the rights and or conditions of British workers?..wouldn't they be left sitting ducks for any British government to do as they please?...

Let's not forget the Conservatives many broken promises , what  makes you so sure a UKIP government would be any different?

As for this 50 million quid a day...do you think any of that would go into the pockets of a British workers?

The biggest winner would be the NHS and the working hours directive signed by no other then T bliar.  Caused massive reductions in Doctors being available but more importantly many junior Doctors have failed to get placements... and those that have have not been given the tutorials the mentoring the stewardship from the consultants who cannot wor
k the hours required...........

And before anyone comes back and tells me they are spending too much time in private practice.... it is at the end of their contractual hours to the NHS as decreed by Brussels.

The doctors and their negotiators couldn't believe the pay and work conditions they were OFFERED under Labour - even they thought it totally ridiculous.

But once you have something that good, no matter how ridiculous and unfair, you don't want to give it back.

gerber wrote:

Joy Division wrote:


But  Gerbs, don't you think it's only use wise for doctors and other medical staff not to be allowed to work no more hours than they should for safety reasons?...

Surely it is better to hire extra NHS staff like nurses and junior doctors rather than work them to the bone to the point of exhaustion ...where many mistakes are made...

Of course it costs money hiring extra staff, bit safety first eh?

JD I do not disagree...............  But the problem is the junior doctors or the required number are no longer able to be trained nor supervised.......  Brussels has decreed the number of hours allowed to work........

The EU has given us the problem...../ We the UK and the NHS are having to cope with it,,,,,,, Bear in mind at the same time GP's contracts were also changed by T Bliar..... they no longer had to work out of hours........

Everything fall on A and E when Doctors now go home.....  They are earning thousands more but doing less work......

And guess what A and E are always in the news for under performing.......

They all deserve medals

..a very valid comment regards to A&E staff doing much of the hard work while earning far less than Doctor's Gerbs...I guess that is where being a qualified doctor does get one in life...BT I definitely hear you....it seems unfair.

Not sure what a UKIP led government, especially one that takes us out of the EU, wil do with the 2 million? or so so non UK citizen workers.
Would Bulgarians and Poles etc. have to have work permits?Who will hunt them down to ensure they are entitle to live and work here?
Do they deport all non UK citizens who are or become unemployed? Do they withhold benefits.
Do they make the NHS chargeable for non UK citizens?
One sees a lot of rhetoric and bullshit from Nigel, but in order to secure more than a protest vote against the Eton/Bullingdon boys in power, they will need to answer a few tough questions and have a manifesto that is written on something larger than a sheet of a5. paper.
All this needs to be done within the next 12 months.

Handy Andy wrote:Not sure what a UKIP led government,  especially one that takes us out of the EU, wil do with the 2 million? or so so non UK citizen workers.
Would Bulgarians and Poles etc. have to have work permits?Who will hunt them down to ensure they are entitle to live and work here?
Do they deport all non UK citizens who are or become unemployed? Do they withhold benefits.
Do they make the NHS chargeable for non UK citizens?
One sees a lot of rhetoric and bullshit from Nigel, but in order to secure more than a protest vote against the Eton/Bullingdon boys in power, they will  need to answer a few tough questions and have a manifesto that is written on something larger than a sheet of a5. paper.
All this needs to be done within the next 12 months.

Brilliant points raised Andy, I do wonder if they would try to ou t them out of the country, or as you say...simply give them no benefits if they become unemployed, if we withdrew from the EU, then these people would be very vulnerable.