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HUMAN AGEING REVERSED IN ‘HOLY GRAIL’ STUDY, SCIENTISTS SAY

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HUMAN AGEING REVERSED IN ‘HOLY GRAIL’ STUDY, SCIENTISTS SAY Empty HUMAN AGEING REVERSED IN ‘HOLY GRAIL’ STUDY, SCIENTISTS SAY

Post by Didgee on Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:59 am

Scientists claim to have successfully reversed the biological aging process in a group of elderly adults.

In a first of a kind study, researchers from Tel Aviv University and the Shamir Medical Center used a form of oxygen therapy to reverse two key indicators of biological aging: Telomere length and senescent cells accumulation.

As the human body gets older, it experiences the shortening of telomeres – the protective caps found at the end of chromosomes – and an increase in old, malfunctioning senescent cells.

A clinical trial involving 35 adults over the age of 64 sought to understand whether a method called Hyperbaric Oxygen Therapy could prevent the deterioration of these two hallmarks of the aging process.

The subjects were placed in a pressurised chamber and given pure oxygen for 90 minutes a day, five days a week for three months.

At the end of the trial, the scientists reported that the participants’ telomeres had increased in length by an average of 20 per cent, while their senescent cells had been reduced by up to 37 per cent.

This is the equivalent to how their bodies were at a cellular level 25 years earlier, the researchers reported.

“Since telomere shortening is considered the ‘Holy Grail’ of the biology of aging, many pharmacological and environmental interventions are being extensively explored in the hopes of enabling telomere elongation,” said Shai Efrati, a professor at the Faculty of Medicine and Sagol School of Neuroscience at Tel Aviv University, and co-author of the study.


https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/anti-ageing-reverse-treatment-telomeres-b1748067.html

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Post by Syl on Sun Nov 22, 2020 1:05 pm

People are born, grow old and die....sometimes nature has it right.

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Post by Maddog on Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:26 pm

Syl wrote:People are born, grow old and die....sometimes nature has it right.

I think they will still die, they may just live longer and be healthier while still alive.

I'd give it a whirl if I could feel a bit younger.

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Post by Vintage on Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:07 pm

Sounds good to be healthier but something has to give for a being to die unless there's a fatal accident. It may take that much longer with this I suppose, who would have access though, those that could afford it? Living longer already causes problems to others, apparently, I'm forever hearing about the aging population causing this that or the other, blocking jobs/housing for the young. There's an awful lot of human beings around already, do we need to keep more around for longer, what will they do, how do they afford to live, the pension scheme is already stretched so we are told. Maybe if its only the elite and rich it'll work the plebs get to go anyway, as usual.

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Post by Maddog on Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:20 pm

Vintage wrote:Sounds good to be healthier but something has to give for a being to die unless there's a fatal accident. It may take that much longer with this I suppose, who would have access though, those that could afford it? Living longer already causes problems to others, apparently, I'm forever hearing about the aging population causing this that or the other, blocking jobs/housing for the young. There's an awful lot of human beings around already, do we need to keep more around for longer,  what will they do, how do they afford to live, the pension scheme is already stretched so we are told. Maybe if its only the elite and rich it'll work the plebs get to go anyway, as usual.

No doubt the ever expanding number of older people with the contracting number of younger people is putting a strain on things. That's got to be offset by people working longer if they are living longer. Cant have half the population living 50 years after retirement.

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Post by Syl on Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:46 pm

It's messing about with nature.
Obviously no one wants to be ill in later life, but delaying the ageing process by 25 years isn't the answer imo.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Nov 23, 2020 2:04 am

Syl wrote:It's messing about with nature.
Obviously no one wants to be ill in later life, but delaying the ageing process by 25 years isn't the answer imo.

Isn't all medicine messing about with nature?

Cancer is part of nature, but we are fighting like hell to defeat it. If we do, that's going to prolong a lot of lives.,

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Post by Syl on Mon Nov 23, 2020 12:16 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:It's messing about with nature.
Obviously no one wants to be ill in later life, but delaying the ageing process by 25 years isn't the answer imo.

Isn't all medicine messing about with nature?  

Cancer is part of nature, but we are fighting like hell to defeat it.  If we do, that's going to prolong a lot of lives.,

Yes I see your point, but curing cancer, or easing pain and suffering in a persons lifetime isn't the same as extending it after the natural human cycle.

Having millions of people live till they are way past 100 is totally unbalancing  nature, the world is over populated enough without adding to it in an unnatural way like this.


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Post by Original Quill on Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:00 pm

Syl wrote:It's messing about with nature.
Obviously no one wants to be ill in later life, but delaying the ageing process by 25 years isn't the answer imo.

That is what is known as the naturalistic fallacy: that what is nature is good. Nature is trusted as tried and true—ie, it works—and that has led us to confuse nature with good.

As Red says, lots of things we have created are good. Imagine life without clothes; carts without wheels; rivers without bridges; or boats without sails or oars. Even the modern-day horse was bred by human’s out of the common ass, or donkey (in Mesopotamia) for our purposes.

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Post by Original Quill on Mon Nov 23, 2020 4:50 pm

Syl wrote:...curing cancer, or easing pain and suffering in a persons lifetime isn't the same as extending it after the natural human cycle.

Having millions  of people live till they are way past 100 is totally unbalancing  nature, the world is over populated enough without adding to it in an unnatural way like this.


What is wrong with "unbalancing nature"?  Nature is changed every time we shoot a rabbit or eat an apple.  Nature is a metaphysical concept that interprets, roughly, as the way it is, or the way we found it.  Nature, itself, changes all the time.  What one is unbalancing is simply what was going on when we came along.

What you are pointing out are negative byproducts, or unintended consequences--ie, over-population is an unintended consequence of the success of medical science, and extension of life.  Which is the better?  Death or medicine, sometimes referred to as the healing art?  I can see a choice being made--eg, choosing climate stability over use of petroleum energy.  But there is no religiosity about such a choice…it is just what you prefer.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:00 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Isn't all medicine messing about with nature?  

Cancer is part of nature, but we are fighting like hell to defeat it.  If we do, that's going to prolong a lot of lives.,

Yes I see your point, but curing cancer, or easing pain and suffering in a persons lifetime isn't the same as extending it after the natural human cycle.

Having millions  of people live till they are way past 100 is totally unbalancing  nature, the world is over populated enough without adding to it in an unnatural way like this.

I dont know. I still think most medicine is about cheating death. That's why life expectancy has risen so much in the last 100 years. We try to extend life.

The world isn't really over populated either. That's a myth from our childhood. As I said before, we have issues with age distribution because of an expanding elderly population with a decreasing worker population. And that can be easily (in theory, the politics are a different story) addressed by not providing retirement benefits until a later age. If you will soon feel and perform like 45 when you are 65 and live to 105 you can work until your 80.

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Post by Vintage on Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:17 pm

The world is over populated if it wasn't we wouldn't have problems with species extinction, we wouldn't have housing problems, areas wouldn't be experiencing shortages of water. Maybe people are gathered in the wrong places but if we gathered in places where everyone had easy access to water especially it would soon get to us having problems.
Humans are increasingly moving into areas they have never been before and displacing other species, we are using aquafers that have taken centuries to fill it won't take anywhere near that long to empty them. What jobs are all these increasing numbers of people going to do when we are automating so much?

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Post by Original Quill on Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:33 pm

We have plenty of room over here.  The real problem is human waste, in places of high density.  Disease transmits and spreads amid the same species, and in high density there are other hosts to provide that same hospitable environment.

There seems to be a priority on saving species from extinction.  I'm for it up to an extent; if we brought back T-Rex, or the smallpox (variola) virus, as examples, I would draw the line.

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Post by Maddog on Mon Nov 23, 2020 5:55 pm

Vintage wrote:The world is over populated if it wasn't we wouldn't have problems with species extinction, we wouldn't have housing problems, areas wouldn't be experiencing shortages of water. Maybe people are gathered in the wrong places but if we gathered in places where everyone had easy access to water especially it would soon get to us having problems.
Humans are increasingly moving into areas they have never been before and displacing other species, we are using aquafers that have taken centuries to fill it won't take anywhere near that long to empty them. What jobs are all these increasing numbers of people going to do when we are automating so much?
We have problems with resource allocation in some areas. The increase in population however continues to slow and will soon reverse.

Japan and Western Europe are facing a crisis of population loss. That's why immigration is so important. Someone has to work to support those who no longer do because of age.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 12:27 am

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:

Yes I see your point, but curing cancer, or easing pain and suffering in a persons lifetime isn't the same as extending it after the natural human cycle.

Having millions  of people live till they are way past 100 is totally unbalancing  nature, the world is over populated enough without adding to it in an unnatural way like this.

I dont know. I still think most medicine is about cheating death. That's why life expectancy has risen so much in the last 100 years. We try to extend life.

The world isn't really over populated either. That's a myth from our childhood. As I said before, we have issues with age distribution because of an expanding elderly population with a decreasing worker population. And that can be easily (in theory, the politics are a different story) addressed by not providing retirement benefits until a later age.  If you will soon feel and perform like 45 when you are 65 and live to 105 you can work until your 80.  
I just dont feel right about artificially altering the life cycle of human beings so drastically.
It's just my personal opinion.

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Post by Maddog on Tue Nov 24, 2020 12:32 am

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:
I dont know. I still think most medicine is about cheating death. That's why life expectancy has risen so much in the last 100 years. We try to extend life.

The world isn't really over populated either. That's a myth from our childhood. As I said before, we have issues with age distribution because of an expanding elderly population with a decreasing worker population. And that can be easily (in theory, the politics are a different story) addressed by not providing retirement benefits until a later age.  If you will soon feel and perform like 45 when you are 65 and live to 105 you can work until your 80.  
I just dont feel right about artificially altering the life cycle of human beings so drastically.
It's just my personal opinion.

Is that anymore drastic than placing electronic devices inside of humans to give them more life?

Science is going to continue to extend life through medical breakthroughs. People will avail themselves to things that improve the quality and quantity of life. We better have a plan to deal with it.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 11:34 am

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:
I just dont feel right about artificially altering the life cycle of human beings so drastically.
It's just my personal opinion.

Is that anymore drastic than placing electronic devices inside of humans to give them more life?  

Science is going to continue to extend life through medical breakthroughs.  People will avail themselves to things that improve the quality and quantity of life.  We better have a plan to deal with it.  

Yes it is more drastic imo.
There is a big difference between advancing science to cure illness and disease to advancing science to cure ageing.

Ageing isn't an illness, it's a natural progression....we are born, we live, we age, we die.

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Post by Maddog on Tue Nov 24, 2020 3:44 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Is that anymore drastic than placing electronic devices inside of humans to give them more life?  

Science is going to continue to extend life through medical breakthroughs.  People will avail themselves to things that improve the quality and quantity of life.  We better have a plan to deal with it.  

Yes it is more drastic imo.
There is a big difference between advancing science to cure illness and disease to advancing science to cure ageing.

Ageing isn't an illness, it's a natural progression....we are born, we live, we age, we die.

True. But much of that illness and disease is a result of aging. I take pretty good care of myself, yet still have high blood pressure. Not very high, but I take meds. That condition is part of aging. If I could spend some time getting exposed to oxygen every week and reverse the aging that causes that, I see nothing wrong with that.

Aging and disease go hand in hand. Even with the current Covid crisis, the disease has much different effects on people based on their age. Age weakens you.

The greatest prevention for many things that kill us, is to be young and healthy. Anything that makes a population "younger and healthier" will reduce illness and diseases. It's one reason I stay so damn active. I'm trying to keep myself young. I just wish I had started earlier.

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Post by Vintage on Tue Nov 24, 2020 4:33 pm

So what will we die of then - boredom?.
We already have a non specific cause of death on certificates - old age.

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Post by Original Quill on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:12 pm

Vintage wrote:So what will we die of then - boredom?.
We already have a non specific cause of death on certificates - old age.

What's the hurry to die, Vint? Especially if one is a huge contributor, in science, philosophy or invention, to the species. It's my understanding that Abraham lived to age 175-years. Genesis 25:7-10.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:13 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:

Yes it is more drastic imo.
There is a big difference between advancing science to cure illness and disease to advancing science to cure ageing.

Ageing isn't an illness, it's a natural progression....we are born, we live, we age, we die.

True. But much of that illness and disease is a result of aging. I take pretty good care of myself, yet still have high blood pressure. Not very high, but I take meds.  That condition is part of aging. If I could spend some time getting exposed to oxygen every week and reverse the aging that causes that, I see nothing wrong with that.  

Aging and disease go hand in hand. Even with the current Covid crisis, the disease has much different effects on people based on their age.  Age weakens you.

The greatest prevention for many things that kill us, is to be young and healthy. Anything that makes a population "younger and healthier" will reduce illness and diseases.  It's one reason I stay so damn active. I'm trying to keep myself young.  I just wish I had started earlier.  

The body like the mind winds down.
I would be all for spending fortunes to try to combat dementia, cancer, heart disease etc that can occur with age, but old age itself is natural and normal....if we are lucky that is.

Over eating, smoking, drinking, not exercising is the cause of many illnesses in later life, obviously not all,

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Post by Maddog on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:14 pm

Vintage wrote:So what will we die of then - boredom?.
We already have a non specific cause of death on certificates - old age.

People will still die. They will just have a little more quality and quantity.

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Post by Original Quill on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:18 pm

Syl wrote:The body like the mind winds down.

But there is no hurry. Time is relative. If we can live longer, we'll get used to it like anything else.

We already have...we used to croak in our 40's and 50's, now we go on into our 80's and 90's.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:21 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Syl wrote:The body like the mind winds down.

But there is no hurry.  Time is relative.  If we can live longer, we'll get used to it like anything else.

We already have...we used to croak in our 40's and 50's, now we go on into our 80's and 90's.

True, but that's natural progression, which fits in with the world around us.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:27 pm

Maddog wrote:
Vintage wrote:So what will we die of then - boredom?.
We already have a non specific cause of death on certificates - old age.

People will still die. They will just have a little more quality and quantity.  

Quality is good....quantity, as in artificially adding an extra 25 years onto the normal lifespan is messing around with nature.....imo. Cool

And will there be a lottery as to who may eventually get this treatment? Will it be offered to all..or will one have to be part of the elite and favoured...a perk for the well heeled and powerful?

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Post by Original Quill on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:31 pm

Syl wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

But there is no hurry.  Time is relative.  If we can live longer, we'll get used to it like anything else.

We already have...we used to croak in our 40's and 50's, now we go on into our 80's and 90's.

True, but that's natural progression, which  fits in with the world around us.

What do you mean by "natural progression"? According to Darwin, Nature is a system of adaptive features, that together constitute the way it is. Nature changed in the past, and it will change in the future...sometimes by habitat changes, sometimes by human hand (which, by participation, are a part of nature). There's nothing wrong with change...just determine what world you want and go for it...if we have control.

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Post by Maddog on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:36 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:

People will still die. They will just have a little more quality and quantity.  

Quality is good....quantity, as in artificially adding an extra 25 years onto the normal lifespan is messing around with nature.....imo. Cool

And will there be a lottery as to who may eventually get this treatment? Will it be offered to all..or will one have to be part of the elite and favoured...a perk for the well heeled and powerful?

Without quality there will be no quantity. It will be the better health that adds years to your life. Less broken hips, lower blood pressure, better metabolism with more energy.

I'm sure it will cost money out of pocket. Like a lot of medical procedures. Brits will probably fly off to India or Thailand for medical holidays like they do now for certain non necessary procedures.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 5:44 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:

Quality is good....quantity, as in artificially adding an extra 25 years onto the normal lifespan is messing around with nature.....imo. Cool

And will there be a lottery as to who may eventually get this treatment? Will it be offered to all..or will one have to be part of the elite and favoured...a perk for the well heeled and powerful?

Without quality there will be no quantity.  It will be the better health that adds years to your life. Less broken hips, lower blood pressure, better metabolism with more energy.  

I'm sure it will cost money out of pocket. Like a lot of medical procedures.  Brits will probably fly off to India or Thailand for medical holidays like they do now for certain non necessary procedures.  

Have you been watching TOWIE?

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Post by Maddog on Tue Nov 24, 2020 6:24 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Without quality there will be no quantity.  It will be the better health that adds years to your life. Less broken hips, lower blood pressure, better metabolism with more energy.  

I'm sure it will cost money out of pocket. Like a lot of medical procedures.  Brits will probably fly off to India or Thailand for medical holidays like they do now for certain non necessary procedures.  

Have you been watching TOWIE?

Never heard of it. I really dont watch TV. I'm weird.

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Post by Syl on Tue Nov 24, 2020 6:31 pm

Maddog wrote:
Syl wrote:

Have you been watching TOWIE?

Never heard of it.  I really dont watch TV.  I'm weird.  

OK, and I don't watch it either....but I know it's full of airheads with plastic surgery and botox, who no doubt nip off somewhere cheaper to have their procedures done. Laughing

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Post by Vintage on Wed Nov 25, 2020 9:03 am

I'm not in any hurry of course but given the majority of the billions on the planet are not scientists, doctors etc. and in reality only take resources and don't contribute anything, except more mouths to feed, it could be a nightmare if everyone gets the treatment, while being totally unfair if they don't. .

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Post by Syl on Wed Nov 25, 2020 12:27 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Syl wrote:

True, but that's natural progression, which  fits in with the world around us.

What do you mean by "natural progression"?  According to Darwin, Nature is a system of adaptive features, that together constitute the way it is.  Nature changed in the past, and it will change in the future...sometimes by habitat changes, sometimes by human hand (which, by participation, are a part of nature).  There's nothing wrong with change...just determine what world you want and go for it...if we have control.

Natural progression = evolution.

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Post by Original Quill on Wed Nov 25, 2020 4:16 pm

Syl wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

What do you mean by "natural progression"?  According to Darwin, Nature is a system of adaptive features, that together constitute the way it is.  Nature changed in the past, and it will change in the future...sometimes by habitat changes, sometimes by human hand (which, by participation, are a part of nature).  There's nothing wrong with change...just determine what world you want and go for it...if we have control.

Natural progression = evolution.

Ahah...the difficulty with that is one cannot foreordain evolution…only natural selection can do that.  Evolution looks to the past to determine what was naturally selected.  One cannot say something is or is not evolved, until it's past.

The very term you use is future-oriented (progression = advancing).  What Darwin was saying is: that which is = what in hindsight became successful.  Simply put, you cannot say what is to be successful until after it succeeds.

Here, we are talking about longevity of life, which you say is contrary to “natural progression”.  How can you say that, when you haven’t gone through living it?  In scientific terms, it’s a hypothesis that hasn’t been tested.

The very essence of Darwinism is that it is chance and necessity before the fact, and it becomes evolved after the fact.  See, Jacques Monod, Chance and Necessity: Essay on the Natural Philosophy of Modern Biology (1970).  If longevity of life comes to be, it will be considered normal…or, as I was saying: “we’ll get used to it like anything else.”

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Post by Maddog on Wed Nov 25, 2020 5:13 pm

I hate agreeing with Quill, but I will.

Species survive by adapting and innovating. Humans have more or less been doing that since year dot to extend our time on this planet.

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Post by Syl on Wed Nov 25, 2020 5:41 pm

Maddog wrote:I hate agreeing with Quill, but I will.  

 

My work here is done. lol!

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Post by Original Quill on Wed Nov 25, 2020 5:56 pm

Syl wrote:
Maddog wrote:I hate agreeing with Quill, but I will. 

My work here is done. lol!

lol! Wha...??  He's just being objective.  Laughing

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"I don't stand by anything."  ― Donald Trump, interview with John Dickerson, 5.1.17...

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