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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Ben Reilly on Fri May 22, 2020 11:41 pm

In the last few weeks a spate of American stores have made headlines after putting up signs telling customers who wear masks they will be denied entry. On Thursday, Vice reported on a Kentucky convenience store that put up a sign reading: “NO Face Masks allowed in store. Lower your mask or go somewhere else. Stop listening to [Kentucky governor Andy] Beshear, he’s a dumbass.”

Another sign was posted by a Californian construction store earlier this month encouraging hugs but not masks. In Illinois, a gas station employee who put up a similar sign has since defended herself, arguing that mask-wearing made it hard to differentiate between adults and children when selling booze and cigarettes.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump finally caved and wore a face mask yesterday – something he didn’t want to “give the press the pleasure of seeing”. But while it is gratifying to see the emperor finally forced to wear clothes, you’ve got to wonder to what extent the virus will spread thanks to the actions of citizens insisting on protecting their “freedom” over the right of others not to get sick.

Anti-lockdown protesters have argued that it is anti-American for the government to curtail people’s freedoms in order to reduce deaths as a result of Covid-19. Meanwhile, store owners tell customers what they can and cannot wear before entering, and customers cough in the faces of workers in the name of freedom.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/may/22/us-stores-against-face-masks

I'm really not surprised that some Americans would risk death rather than be seen as anything other than completely loyal to Trump.

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Post by eddie on Fri May 22, 2020 11:45 pm

Some people are just so stupid. They’d rather lose cash than change their political views.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sat May 23, 2020 12:14 am

Also, if they believe in freedom so much, why don't they support the freedom of people to wear face masks?

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Post by eddie on Sat May 23, 2020 12:16 am

Ben Reilly wrote:Also, if they believe in freedom so much, why don't they support the freedom of people to wear face masks?

Double standards. This happens when people have their feet so firmly in one camp that they can’t see how limited they are.

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Post by Cass on Sat May 23, 2020 12:52 am

It’s pathetic. But let them make their own rules. Then they can take their money with them when they die. Oh wait...

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Post by eddie on Sat May 23, 2020 12:57 am

Cass wrote:It’s pathetic. But let them make their own rules. Then they can take their money with them when they die. Oh wait...

Exactly that.

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Post by Maddog on Sat May 23, 2020 12:59 am

Ben Reilly wrote:
In the last few weeks a spate of American stores have made headlines after putting up signs telling customers who wear masks they will be denied entry. On Thursday, Vice reported on a Kentucky convenience store that put up a sign reading: “NO Face Masks allowed in store. Lower your mask or go somewhere else. Stop listening to [Kentucky governor Andy] Beshear, he’s a dumbass.”

Another sign was posted by a Californian construction store earlier this month encouraging hugs but not masks. In Illinois, a gas station employee who put up a similar sign has since defended herself, arguing that mask-wearing made it hard to differentiate between adults and children when selling booze and cigarettes.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump finally caved and wore a face mask yesterday – something he didn’t want to “give the press the pleasure of seeing”. But while it is gratifying to see the emperor finally forced to wear clothes, you’ve got to wonder to what extent the virus will spread thanks to the actions of citizens insisting on protecting their “freedom” over the right of others not to get sick.

Anti-lockdown protesters have argued that it is anti-American for the government to curtail people’s freedoms in order to reduce deaths as a result of Covid-19. Meanwhile, store owners tell customers what they can and cannot wear before entering, and customers cough in the faces of workers in the name of freedom.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/may/22/us-stores-against-face-masks

I'm really not surprised that some Americans would risk death rather than be seen as anything other than completely loyal to Trump.

Some stores require masks to shop there.

Your house, your rules.

And, people do form ideas outside of what the orange one says.  

I'm sure you have some ideas that you formulated all by yourself without prodding from a candidate.

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Post by Original Quill on Sat May 23, 2020 2:29 am

You can bet the real capitalists are not doing that. Safeway and A&P are right in there pitching for profits.

So it's the so-called "small businesses" who want to express their tribal faith. Someone has got to die in a depression, let it be them. At least it's choice over chance.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun May 24, 2020 12:50 am

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
In the last few weeks a spate of American stores have made headlines after putting up signs telling customers who wear masks they will be denied entry. On Thursday, Vice reported on a Kentucky convenience store that put up a sign reading: “NO Face Masks allowed in store. Lower your mask or go somewhere else. Stop listening to [Kentucky governor Andy] Beshear, he’s a dumbass.”

Another sign was posted by a Californian construction store earlier this month encouraging hugs but not masks. In Illinois, a gas station employee who put up a similar sign has since defended herself, arguing that mask-wearing made it hard to differentiate between adults and children when selling booze and cigarettes.

Meanwhile, Donald Trump finally caved and wore a face mask yesterday – something he didn’t want to “give the press the pleasure of seeing”. But while it is gratifying to see the emperor finally forced to wear clothes, you’ve got to wonder to what extent the virus will spread thanks to the actions of citizens insisting on protecting their “freedom” over the right of others not to get sick.

Anti-lockdown protesters have argued that it is anti-American for the government to curtail people’s freedoms in order to reduce deaths as a result of Covid-19. Meanwhile, store owners tell customers what they can and cannot wear before entering, and customers cough in the faces of workers in the name of freedom.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2020/may/22/us-stores-against-face-masks

I'm really not surprised that some Americans would risk death rather than be seen as anything other than completely loyal to Trump.

Some stores require masks to shop there.

Your house, your rules.

And, people do form ideas outside of what the orange one says.  

I'm sure you have some ideas that you formulated all by yourself without prodding from a candidate.

"Your house, your rules" goes out the window when the head of house threatens someone else's life, does it not?

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Post by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 12:52 am

Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Some stores require masks to shop there.

Your house, your rules.

And, people do form ideas outside of what the orange one says.  

I'm sure you have some ideas that you formulated all by yourself without prodding from a candidate.

"Your house, your rules" goes out the window when the head of house threatens someone else's life, does it not?

Yeah, you cant go around threatening to harm people.

If someone wants you to wear shoes, shirt or a mask, you either comply or move on to the next place.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun May 24, 2020 1:03 am

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Some stores require masks to shop there.

Your house, your rules.

And, people do form ideas outside of what the orange one says.  

I'm sure you have some ideas that you formulated all by yourself without prodding from a candidate.

"Your house, your rules" goes out the window when the head of house threatens someone else's life, does it not?

Yeah, you cant go around threatening to harm people.  

If someone wants you to wear shoes, shirt or a mask, you either comply or move on to the next place.  

Wanting you to wear a mask to protect others and yourself isn't the same thing as demanding that you remove that mask, though, is it?

Don't tell me I can't protect myself -- know what I mean?

It's my right -- know what I mean?

Don't tell me to move along to some other store that accepts "my kind," either. If you're open to the public, you're open to the fucking public.

Owning a shop doesn't give you the right to make life harder for people you disagree with.

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Post by Cass on Sun May 24, 2020 1:12 am

Interesting observation. A lot of the local people screaming about this and their rights are the same ones who supported the bakeries for not being made to make a wedding cake for gay or lesbian couples. Or are pro-life and want to police other people’s bodies or relationships.

Funny that.

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Post by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 1:36 am

Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

Yeah, you cant go around threatening to harm people.  

If someone wants you to wear shoes, shirt or a mask, you either comply or move on to the next place.  

Wanting you to wear a mask to protect others and yourself isn't the same thing as demanding that you remove that mask, though, is it?

Don't tell me I can't protect myself -- know what I mean?

It's my right -- know what I mean?

Don't tell me to move along to some other store that accepts "my kind," either. If you're open to the public, you're open to the fucking public.

Owning a shop doesn't give you the right to make life harder for people you disagree with.

You can wear a Bozo the fucking clown suit for all I care, and I'll let the owner of the business decide if he serves clowns.


Last edited by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 1:39 am; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 1:38 am

Cass wrote:Interesting observation. A lot of the local people screaming about this and their rights are the same ones who supported the bakeries for not being made to make a wedding cake for gay or lesbian couples. Or are pro-life and want to police other people’s bodies or relationships.

Funny that.

And the other way around too.

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

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Post by Cass on Sun May 24, 2020 1:46 am

Maddog wrote:
Cass wrote:Interesting observation. A lot of the local people screaming about this and their rights are the same ones who supported the bakeries for not being made to make a wedding cake for gay or lesbian couples. Or are pro-life and want to police other people’s bodies or relationships.

Funny that.

And the other way around too.  

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

It is. But I’m just sharing my personal observations on what’s happening here locally. And now there’s a fake ADA card floating around just like fake service dog vests.

We are currently seeing if we can require patrons to wear a mask when we eventually allow patrons back in the library. We can get around ADA requirements because we are accommodating them by offering curbside service.

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Post by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 1:54 am

Cass wrote:
Maddog wrote:

And the other way around too.  

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

It is. But I’m just sharing my personal observations on what’s happening here locally. And now there’s a fake ADA card floating around just like fake service dog vests.

We are currently seeing if we can require patrons to wear a mask when we eventually allow patrons back in the library. We can get around ADA requirements because we are accommodating them by offering curbside service.

I doubt you can force people to do anything before entering a library. It's not private property.

Now I have seen signs that require masks. I had one everytime but once and put it on. The other time I just went to the next place.

This really isn't that hard, if your logical and rational about it.

It's like guns, the property owner ultimately decides if you can carry on his property, regardless of your rights as he has property rights too.

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Post by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 2:10 am

And for the record, turning someone away for wearing a surgical type mask is a little silly.

Although there are places around here that will make you remove anything that covers your face fir security reasons. That could be fixed by asking the shopper to pull down their mask and face the camera for a second. Although I'm sure that would offend some people too.

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Post by Cass on Sun May 24, 2020 5:33 pm

Maddog wrote:
Cass wrote:

It is. But I’m just sharing my personal observations on what’s happening here locally. And now there’s a fake ADA card floating around just like fake service dog vests.

We are currently seeing if we can require patrons to wear a mask when we eventually allow patrons back in the library. We can get around ADA requirements because we are accommodating them by offering curbside service.

I doubt you can force people to do anything before entering a library. It's not private property.

Now I have seen signs that require masks. I had one everytime but once and put it on. The other time I just went to the next place.  

This really isn't that hard, if your logical and rational about it.

It's like guns, the property owner ultimately decides if you can carry on his property, regardless of your rights as he has property rights too.  

Depending on state laws you can actually. Just because it’s a public building, there are still rules and policies about patron behavior.

And in my state, people can bring guns into libraries Rolling Eyes Evil or Very Mad

We are waiting on advice from the county attorney, but knowing that other county and city governments in the state have given the ok for masks to be required, I’m hopeful. We will probably have to provide them but I’m fine with it being taken out of my budget.


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Post by Original Quill on Sun May 24, 2020 7:06 pm

Cass wrote:
Maddog wrote:

And the other way around too.  

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

We are currently seeing if we can require patrons to wear a mask when we eventually allow patrons back in the library.

Don't you require them to wear shirts and shoes...or pants or a skirt? I would imagine that question is already settled.

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Post by Cass on Sun May 24, 2020 7:23 pm

Original Quill wrote:
Cass wrote:

We are currently seeing if we can require patrons to wear a mask when we eventually allow patrons back in the library.

Don't you require them to wear shirts and shoes...or pants or a skirt?  I would imagine that question is already settled.

Yup!

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Post by Maddog on Sun May 24, 2020 8:34 pm

Cass wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

Don't you require them to wear shirts and shoes...or pants or a skirt?  I would imagine that question is already settled.

Yup!

Do you require shoes? I'll admit I haven't been in a library since college. I know public decency laws would apply. Obvoulsly, you cant walk in there naked. Not sure if shoes would be required.

And yeah. If you provide masks that will probably solve part of your problem. A lot of folks aren't carrying them on their person. Mine stay in my truck.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun May 24, 2020 10:02 pm

Maddog wrote:
Cass wrote:Interesting observation. A lot of the local people screaming about this and their rights are the same ones who supported the bakeries for not being made to make a wedding cake for gay or lesbian couples. Or are pro-life and want to police other people’s bodies or relationships.

Funny that.

And the other way around too.  

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

Mindless, unthinking, "both-sides-do-it" whataboutism. What a lovely contribution to the debate!

Sorry, that was a bit harsh. Actually, not sorry, I was just being honest.

P.S.: Glad you're protecting your truck against the virus in these unprecedented times.

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Post by Original Quill on Sun May 24, 2020 10:41 pm

"Both-sides-do-it" is a cliché that conservatives use to justify their commonplace lies. Hypocrisy is not represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

If an individual is treating people equally--ie, working honestly and aboveboard for the good of all people--s/he doesn't need an excuse. If s/he is being selfish, s/he does.

Republicans and conservatives rest upon an ideology of selfishness. They praise "private property" as their highest value, regardless how ill-gotten the gains. They invented the phrase "both-sides-do-it" as a cover for their tactics.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun May 24, 2020 11:09 pm

It's an evade-divert tactic, used to avoid having to condemn somebody on the right and shift the debate to the alleged wrongdoings of someone on the left.

Instead of admitting that something Trump et al did was shit, they just say, "Whaddabout Hillary's emails???"

As if there's a rule stating that if one side does something wrong, that justifies the other side doing something wrong as well.

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Post by eddie on Sun May 24, 2020 11:43 pm

I agree with both Quill and Ben. You can’t make someone “justifiably right” by saying someone else is wrong.

But both sides do it on here. It’s always happened...it’s like if you point the finger elsewhere you haven't got to look at where you should be pointing the finger.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Mon May 25, 2020 12:16 am

eddie wrote:I agree with both Quill and Ben. You can’t make someone “justifiably right” by saying someone else is wrong.  

But both sides do it on here. It’s always happened...it’s like if you point the finger elsewhere you haven't got to look at where you should be pointing the finger.

And that tribal mentality -- "pay no attention to anything wrong done by my side" -- is the biggest obstacle of progress.

No political party or politician will improve from being endlessly praised and defended. Honest, fair criticism should be a blessing to anyone, especially someone in politics, someone who's making decisions that affect millions.

I'll just add that if we as in the citizens of our countries could stop ourselves from tribal squabbles, it would probably nudge politicians in the direction of having a bit more respect for our collective intelligence, instead of allowing them to do what they've been doing for centuries -- treating us like we're stupid, offering simplistic solutions, manipulating us on the basis of our fears, and deflecting blame for anything they've done wrong rather than owning up to it.

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Post by eddie on Mon May 25, 2020 12:24 am

Tribal mentality is the killer of all learning, debate, and honest communication.

In my very humble opinion.

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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Maddog on Mon May 25, 2020 4:15 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

And the other way around too.  

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

Mindless, unthinking, "both-sides-do-it" whataboutism. What a lovely contribution to the debate!

Sorry, that was a bit harsh. Actually, not sorry, I was just being honest.

P.S.: Glad you're protecting your truck against the virus in these unprecedented times.

It's not mindless, I'm different than you.  

Are you wearing a mask? Great!

Are you not wearing a mask? Also great!

See, unlike you I don't think either side has more virtue. That lets me point out the hypocrisy of both sides as I'm not one of them.  

As for my masks in my truck, everything I need for work stays in the truck. Since I enter people's homes every day, I need the masks to wear if they request it.  

I don't need a mask at home or an a walk or bike ride.

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pa·ter·nal·ism

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The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Original Quill on Mon May 25, 2020 4:34 pm

Maddog wrote:See, unlike you I don't think either side has more virtue.

Why do you think threatening death by a virus is a question of virtue?

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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Ben Reilly on Mon May 25, 2020 6:37 pm

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

And the other way around too.  

Hypocrisy is well represented on both sides of the political spectrum.

Mindless, unthinking, "both-sides-do-it" whataboutism. What a lovely contribution to the debate!

Sorry, that was a bit harsh. Actually, not sorry, I was just being honest.

P.S.: Glad you're protecting your truck against the virus in these unprecedented times.

It's not mindless, I'm different than you.  

Are you wearing a mask? Great!

Are you not wearing a mask? Also great!

See, unlike you I don't think either side has more virtue. That lets me point out the hypocrisy of both sides as I'm not one of them.  

As for my masks in my truck, everything I need for work stays in the truck. Since I enter people's homes every day, I need the masks to wear if they request it.  

I don't need a mask at home or an a walk or bike ride.

The mindlessness is in saying "bothsidesdoit" and acting like you've made a contribution.

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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Maddog on Mon May 25, 2020 7:06 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

It's not mindless, I'm different than you.  

Are you wearing a mask? Great!

Are you not wearing a mask? Also great!

See, unlike you I don't think either side has more virtue. That lets me point out the hypocrisy of both sides as I'm not one of them.  

As for my masks in my truck, everything I need for work stays in the truck. Since I enter people's homes every day, I need the masks to wear if they request it.  

I don't need a mask at home or an a walk or bike ride.

The mindlessness is in saying "bothsidesdoit" and acting like you've made a contribution.

I've made as much contribution as those who ignore that fact. More so I would say.

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pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Ben Reilly on Mon May 25, 2020 7:24 pm

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

It's not mindless, I'm different than you.  

Are you wearing a mask? Great!

Are you not wearing a mask? Also great!

See, unlike you I don't think either side has more virtue. That lets me point out the hypocrisy of both sides as I'm not one of them.  

As for my masks in my truck, everything I need for work stays in the truck. Since I enter people's homes every day, I need the masks to wear if they request it.  

I don't need a mask at home or an a walk or bike ride.

The mindlessness is in saying "bothsidesdoit" and acting like you've made a contribution.

I've made as much contribution as those who ignore that fact.  More so I would say.  

You would have if the debate topic was "which side is better?" But that's not the topic.

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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Maddog on Mon May 25, 2020 7:37 pm

Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

I've made as much contribution as those who ignore that fact.  More so I would say.  

You would have if the debate topic was "which side is better?" But that's not the topic.
What is the topic? Both sides are the same?

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pa·ter·nal·ism

noun

The policy or practice on the part of people in positions of authority of restricting the freedom and responsibilities of those subordinate to them in the subordinates' supposed best interest.
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Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks Empty Re: Why some American shop owners are turning away customers wearing face masks

Post by Ben Reilly on Tue May 26, 2020 11:29 pm

Maddog wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:
Maddog wrote:

I've made as much contribution as those who ignore that fact.  More so I would say.  

You would have if the debate topic was "which side is better?" But that's not the topic.
What is the topic?  Both sides are the same?


Top tip: If you've forgotten what the topic of discussion is, simply scroll up and read the original post!

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