Sack Atos now rather than dithering, Labour urges the government

Atos's work with Iain Duncan Smith's DWP has been under fire

The Labour party last night called on the Government to sack Atos immediately as it emerged the controversial benefits firm had been trying to back out of its £500million contract .

It was revealed yesterday that the French IT firm had been in talks for months to get out of performing the fit-for-work tests that have seen thousands of sick people lose benefits.

Labour urged the Government to stop dithering and said people had been "badly let down" by Atos, as charities warned the uncertainty would leave vulnerable claimants worrying about the future.

Shadow minister for disabled people Kate Green said: "Labour has called on the Government to sack them with immediate effect. But changing the contract isn't enough.

"It's time for the Government to reform Work Capability Assessments so that disabled people who can work are given the support they need to find a job."

Atos, which has a contract with the Department for Work and Pensions, has come under fire for its handling of the fit-to-work assessments, with several claimants committing suicide when their benefits were stopped.

This week it was revealed 158,300 people who were classed as "fit to work" had their decisions reversed by the DWP.

Claire Nurden, of the Disability Benefits Consortium, said: "Too many disabled people have undergone inexcusably poor assessments resulting in wrong decisions, in many cases at a detriment to their health.

"But the performance of Atos isn't the whole problem.

Disabled people won't be able to rest easy until we see a substantial overhaul of the way they are assessed."

And Scope's Richard Hawkes said it was a chance for the Government to ensure when they appoint a new provider there is a move away from a flawed system.

Labour added that the Government should also look into why disabled people earned less and were less likely to be given jobs and promotions.
The death toll

It is estimated there have been dozens of deaths of claimants who have had their benefits slashed, many as a result of Atos assessments.

Stephen Hill, 53, needed heart bypass surgery but was told he was fit to work and would be withdrawn from Incapacity Benefit in November 2011. One month later he died from a heart attack.

At the end of last year an inquest heard how blind Tim Salter killed himself after being left penniless when his benefits were stopped. He struggled to even feed himself when Atos ruled he was fit for work, despite his failing eyesight.

The 53-year-old was about to be kicked out of his housing association home when he hanged himself in the hall. A coroner ruled the Government's decision to axe Tim's meagre incapacity benefit contributed to his death.

David Barr, 28, believed to be a schizophrenic, jumped off the Forth Bridge last August when his employment and support allowance was withdrawn.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/sack-atos-now-dithering-labour-3176333#ixzz2uHRZLsqz
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Well done Labour!

You have to put some clear water between the Cons and the Liberals.

      

Many people die of heart attacks.

I knew quite a few who were working when they had them - good servicemen they were too!

Did I blame Labour? Nah.

BigAndy9 wrote:Many people die of heart attacks.

I knew quite a few who were working when they had them - good servicemen they were too!

Did I blame Labour?  Nah.

Well, ATOS want to get out of the contract, so give them what they wish!

Catman wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:Many people die of heart attacks.

I knew quite a few who were working when they had them - good servicemen they were too!

Did I blame Labour?  Nah.

Well, ATOS want to get out of the contract, so give them what they wish!

I honestly don't know what those Labour b4st4rds saw in ATO$.

Yes because its not like Labour were the ones who employed ATOS in the first place is it?


Oh wait

wikipedia wrote:Work capability assessments were introduced in 2008 to determine who should receive Employment and Support Allowance (ESA), although Atos' involvement in government benefit contracts dates back to 1998. Decisions are taken by officials at the DWP using evidence from the assessments, carried out by Atos Healthcare subsidiary

Barry Dobbin

1:11 PM on 24/2/2014

labour is right. it was not atos it was only doing what the government told them to do.
Report Abuse

27
Richard McTaggart

9:42 AM on 24/2/2014

how right you are Labour!
this company are a disgrace*
I read somewhere that Atos wanted out because of death threat's to it's staff!
oh-dear a disabled-man said "I'll kill-you!!
perhaps he was upset*
Lie-DS* take heed*
Report Abuse

32
Lorraine Rankin

2:08 AM on 24/2/2014

Get rid of the tories they do not care about the sick and disabled people. Atos are being paid for declaring people fit to work even if they're on their death beds as instructed by IDS and the rest of the tories. They have blood on their hands but I'm sure they sleep well at night.
Report Abuse

35
Anthony Linford

1:55 AM on 24/2/2014

Ineed, sack the Tory Scum who want to cull disabled and sick people to give the 'savings' to their rich chums who run the banks!
Report Abuse

57
Diane Baker

8:19 PM on 23/2/2014

sack the tory scum too they started it atos were the fall guys
Report Abuse

69
Jackie Day

6:27 PM on 23/2/2014

Also people with mental health problems are ignored by atos. They don't take mental health issues into consideration
Report Abuse

95
Dion Fitzgerald

5:32 PM on 23/2/2014

it isnt 'just' the disabled, it is also the sick who are being abused by the dwp and atos. we all want IDS sacked with imidiate effect along with atos, they both go hand in hand and should go out hand in hand. if ya cant do the job then bye bye, we will get someone who can. sick dont need help finding work, they need help with their health so that they can go back to work when they are back in good health.
Report Abuse

49
Gary Haslam

3:51 PM on 23/2/2014

Atos are doing exactly what the government have told them to do. If they don't do what Cameron, IDS and the rest of the shower of $hite tell them to do then they don't get paid.

So if you're looking for people to blame then the government are prime candidate number one, not Atos.

Atos are the messengers. But having said that what Doctor or Nurse worth their salt would want to work for Atos?
Report Abuse

58
Joseph Noon

1:34 PM on 23/2/2014

About time . ATOS has been a shambles from the word go .while they are at it . get rid of IDS ..

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/sack-atos-now-dithering-labour-3176333#ixzz2uHUnHSR8
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Get these Tory fuckers out now!

sphinx wrote:Yes because its not like Labour were the ones who employed ATOS in the first place is it?  


Oh wait

wikipedia wrote:Work capability assessments were introduced in 2008 to determine who should receive Employment and Support Allowance (ESA), although Atos' involvement in government benefit contracts dates back to 1998. Decisions are taken by officials at the DWP using evidence from the assessments, carried out by Atos Healthcare subsidiary

Are the WCA that were in place in 2008 the same as the WCA in place now or have they changed since then?

Irn Bru wrote:

sphinx wrote:Yes because its not like Labour were the ones who employed ATOS in the first place is it?  


Oh wait

Are the WCA that were in place in 2008 the same as the WCA in place now or have they changed since then?

What difference does that make? Labour employed ATOS to do their bidding in 1998. They gave them the WCA contract in 2008. Now they are doing the next governments bidding exactly the same way they did Labours they are screaming for ATOS to be sacked.

Hypocrisy is not the word.

sphinx wrote:

Irn Bru wrote:

sphinx wrote:Yes because its not like Labour were the ones who employed ATOS in the first place is it?  


Oh wait

Are the WCA that were in place in 2008 the same as the WCA in place now or have they changed since then?

What difference does that make?  Labour employed ATOS to do their bidding in 1998.  They gave them the WCA contract in 2008.  Now they are doing the next governments bidding exactly the same way they did Labours they are screaming for ATOS to be sacked.

Hypocrisy is not the word.

You didn't answer the question. Are they different now from what they were in 2008?

BigAndy9 wrote:

Catman wrote:

Well, ATOS want to get out of the contract, so give them what they wish!

I honestly don't know what those Labour b4st4rds saw in ATO$.

The Tories changed the original rules, to make it easy for this awful firm to kick people onto the streets.

Disgusting state of affairs, but bodes well for the people that are just about to come up for appeals, just puts more strengh behind their arguments!

Of course it makes a difference!   Good god woman, if the work assessment tests were fair in  2008 and they have been changed and are not fair now, they are the problem, and if ATOS is having to do tests that are putting them under fire and make them want to pull out, then it is the changing of the tests that should be looked at, otherwise the next company will have the same problem.

These people still get JSA don't they?

Irn Bru wrote:

sphinx wrote:

What difference does that make?  Labour employed ATOS to do their bidding in 1998.  They gave them the WCA contract in 2008.  Now they are doing the next governments bidding exactly the same way they did Labours they are screaming for ATOS to be sacked.

Hypocrisy is not the word.

You didn't answer the question. Are they different now from what they were in 2008?

Oh I did answer it - I told you it was irrelevant. I dont give a shit what this government has got ATOS doing - they could have them lining up to shoot people for all the relevance it has.

The point is Labour bought them in. They worked for Labour (and it was not nice work either - I suffered their incompetence in 2006) and did what labour asked and lo Labour were so happy with them they gave them the WCA contract alone. Then the government changed and ATOS continued doing what the new government instructed just as well as it had done what the Labour government wanted - and now Labour is screaming for them to be fired.

My advice to any company is for christ sakes done accept work for a Labour government because if power changes they will stab you in the back by calling for you to be sacked for working for the new lot the way you worked for them.

Sassy wrote:Of course it makes a difference!   Good god woman, if the work assessment tests were fair in  2008 and they have been changed and are not fair now, they are the problem, and if ATOS is having to do tests that are putting them under fire and make them want to pull out, then it is the changing of the tests that should be looked at, otherwise the next company will have the same problem.

WCA fair in 2008 ROTFLMAO

Christ sometimes I wish I had not deleted all the old stuff because the people squawking about the WCA now were squawking about how terrible and unfair it was in 2008 moving from the incapacity test.

Repeat:

Of course it makes a difference! Good god woman, if the work assessment tests were fair in 2008 and they have been changed and are not fair now, they are the problem, and if ATOS is having to do tests that are putting them under fire and make them want to pull out, then it is the changing of the tests that should be looked at, otherwise the next company will have the same problem.



Analogy:

Chef does menu in top restaurant, writes out the menu with the recipes. Restaurant does well, people like the food.

Restaurant changes hands, new chef uses same menu, changes recipes, people don't like food, restaurant bombs.

Problem with the menu? NO, problem with the recipes.

Something had to be done. There were people on sick benefits when there was nothing wrong with them - I knew such a person myself.

Perhaps they should stop having all these variable rate benefits and have a flat rate, and then DLA on top for those who really need it.

Raggamuffin wrote:Something had to be done. There were people on sick benefits when there was nothing wrong with them - I knew such a person myself.

Perhaps they should stop having all these variable rate benefits and have a flat rate, and then DLA on top for those who really need it.

I don't think there is a person in the country who didn't know somebody fraudulently taking sick benefits.

The government are doing something millions asked them to and it makes perfect sense - if there are teething issues let them sort them out - tests should be a permanent thing - let them get on with it.

BigAndy9 wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:Something had to be done. There were people on sick benefits when there was nothing wrong with them - I knew such a person myself.

Perhaps they should stop having all these variable rate benefits and have a flat rate, and then DLA on top for those who really need it.

I don't think there is a person in the country who didn't know somebody fraudulently taking sick benefits.

The government are doing something millions asked them to and it makes perfect sense - if there are teething issues let them sort them out - tests should be a permanent thing - let them get on with it.

I wouldn't say it was fraudulent exactly - she did have something wrong with her at one stage, but then she was fine and still got the benefits. She actually gave them up herself in the end. That's the other issue - people not declaring changes in their condition.

Raggamuffin wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:

I don't think there is a person in the country who didn't know somebody fraudulently taking sick benefits.

The government are doing something millions asked them to and it makes perfect sense - if there are teething issues let them sort them out - tests should be a permanent thing - let them get on with it.

I wouldn't say it was fraudulent exactly - she did have something wrong with her at one stage, but then she was fine and still got the benefits. She actually gave them up herself in the end. That's the other issue - people not declaring changes in their condition.

Errrrm, that is fraudulent... if they don't inform deliberately.

Or are there just so many forgetful people around?

Yea, like the person walking down the street getting sick pay with a nice healthy glow in his face. Except the redness in his cheeks is caused by a bad heart, but those morons pointing and saying he is sciving don't know that. You presume to know one, you don't know their medical history.

BigAndy9 wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I wouldn't say it was fraudulent exactly - she did have something wrong with her at one stage, but then she was fine and still got the benefits. She actually gave them up herself in the end. That's the other issue - people not declaring changes in their condition.

Errrrm, that is fraudulent... if they don't inform deliberately.

Or are there just so many forgetful people around?

I suppose it was, but there was a chance that she could be affected by her one-time condition. She hadn't been for ages though.

Sassy wrote:Yea, like the person walking down the street getting sick pay with a nice healthy glow in his face.   Except the redness in his cheeks is caused by a bad heart, but those morons pointing and saying he is sciving don't know that.   You presume to know one, you don't know their medical history.

What? Who says someone is skiving just because they have a red face?

Not so long ago there was an admission that Atos were set targets by this coalition government was there not?

Or was it still denied all along?

Sassy wrote:Yea, like the person walking down the street getting sick pay with a nice healthy glow in his face.   Except the redness in his cheeks is caused by a bad heart, but those morons pointing and saying he is sciving don't know that.   You presume to know one, you don't know their medical history.

Oh god.

lol

BigAndy9 wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

I wouldn't say it was fraudulent exactly - she did have something wrong with her at one stage, but then she was fine and still got the benefits. She actually gave them up herself in the end. That's the other issue - people not declaring changes in their condition.

Errrrm, that is fraudulent... if they don't inform deliberately.

Or are there just so many forgetful people around?

The other thing was that it was holding her back IMO. If you get disability benefit, you think of yourself as disabled and are afraid to lose those benefits. She was much happier when she ditched them.

Raggamuffin wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:

Errrrm, that is fraudulent... if they don't inform deliberately.

Or are there just so many forgetful people around?

The other thing was that it was holding her back IMO. If you get disability benefit, you think of yourself as disabled and are afraid to lose those benefits. She was much happier when she ditched them.

Very true - some want to work.

It's just that once you're off and the government start giving you plenty of money and well it's nice and cosy in your house and well you don't have to have a horrible shave at 7:30 in the morning...

BigAndy9 wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

The other thing was that it was holding her back IMO. If you get disability benefit, you think of yourself as disabled and are afraid to lose those benefits. She was much happier when she ditched them.

Very true - some want to work.

It's just that once you're off and the government start giving you plenty of money and well it's nice and cosy in your house and well you don't have to have a horrible shave at 7:30 in the morning...

Exactly. Well not everyone shaves obviously, but I know what you mean.   

A gentle kick up the arse is needed for some, a bit of financial persuasion may be necessary for others.

What didn't work was throwing more and more money at them.

Yea, it works when they die doesn't it Andy.

Sassy wrote:Yea, it works when they die doesn't it Andy.  

How many have been tested?

How many have died?

How many have died because of ATOS?

You did read my post about people in the forces dying of "natural causes" didn't you?

sphinx wrote:

Irn Bru wrote:

sphinx wrote:

What difference does that make?  Labour employed ATOS to do their bidding in 1998.  They gave them the WCA contract in 2008.  Now they are doing the next governments bidding exactly the same way they did Labours they are screaming for ATOS to be sacked.

Hypocrisy is not the word.

You didn't answer the question. Are they different now from what they were in 2008?

Oh I did answer it - I told you it was irrelevant.  I dont give a shit what this government has got ATOS doing - they could have them lining up to shoot people for all the relevance it has.

The point is Labour bought them in.  They worked for Labour (and it was not nice work either - I suffered their incompetence in 2006) and did what labour asked and lo Labour were so happy with them they gave them the WCA contract alone.  Then the government changed and ATOS continued doing what the new government instructed just as well as it had done what the Labour government wanted - and now Labour is screaming for them to be fired.

My advice to any company is for christ sakes done accept work for a Labour government because if power changes they will stab you in the back by calling for you to be sacked for working for the new lot the way you worked for them.

No, you didn't answer the specific question which was; have the WCA tests been changed since 2008?

People on Employment and Support Allowance will not be automatically retested until another firm can be brought into help, a leaked memo has revealed



Ministers have been forced to halt medical checks on sick and disabled people because of the shambles engulfing hated firm Atos.

People on Employment and Support Allowance (ESA) will not be automatically retested until another firm can be brought into help, a leaked memo has revealed.

Only new claimants, those who say their circumstances have changed or people being moved over from Incapacity Benefit will have to undergo Work Capability Assessments.

Campaigners said that would mean thousands of people being spared the stressful and humiliating tests every week.

The revelation comes after Disability minister Mike Penning today admitted that the scheme was a “mess”.

Atos have announced that they want to end their £500million contract with the Department for Work and Pensions (DWP) a year early, blaming death threats.

Mr Penning claimed it was all the fault of the last government when he was grilled in the Commons.

“It is important we get the procurement right unlike the previous administration which is why we are in this mess today,” he said.

But Labour’s Tom Greatrex said that the Government had failed to act on warnings.

The whole scheme should be scrapped and reconsidered before another company is brought in to take over, the shadow minister said.

“The government ignored all the warnings and went ahead with the scheme anyway.

“The result is chaos, and not just an administrative mess, but also the misery it has caused for thousands of disabled people.

“This is why the system has to be reset before it is re-tendered.”

And fellow Labour MP Sheila Gilmour added: “The employment and Support Allowance was renewed by the government in 2011.”

People who are on ESA have been retested as often as every few months to see if they still qualify for the benefit.

The leaked memo to DWP staff, obtained through a Freedom of Information request, reveals that automatic checks on existing claimants were halted on January 20 to tackle a mounting backlog.

“The number of cases currently with Atos Healthcare has grown,” it states.

“A decision has therefore been taken to control the referral of repeat work capability assessments.

“Therefore, with effect from 20 January 2014, further routine repeat assessments referrals to Atos will be deferred until further notice.

“Controlling the volume of repeat Work Capability Assessments should help us to reduce delays for new claimants and those that have already been referred.”

The numbers coming off of ESA will fall as a result of the decision, the memo suggests.

“The Work Capability Assessment is the main trigger for off-flows form the Employment and Support Allowance load,” it states.

However, because it is an “operation decision” rather than a policy change there is no need to inform “external stakeholders such as claimants, claimant representative groups, Members of Parliament etc”.

Tonight a Department for Work and Pensions spokesman said: “We’re committed to ensuring that people have their claim assessed as quickly as possible and to a high standard.

“As we announced in the summer we will be bringing in additional provision to deliver Work Capability Assessments with the aim of increasing delivery capacity and reducing waiting times.”

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/atos-crisis-fit-to-work-checks-shelved-3180876#ixzz2uLjpJo80
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Now get rid of that RW scum Duncan Smith.

Apologies if this has already been said..............

haven't read the thread


DC and co wanted to remove ATOS froma day one...................... couldn't due to contract.

Now they seem able to. Even the chair of the Work and Pensions comm want them out and she is labour.

gerber wrote:Apologies if this has already been said..............  

haven't read the thread


DC and co wanted to remove ATOS froma day one...................... couldn't due to contract.

Now they seem able to.  Even the chair of the Work and Pensions comm want them out and she is labour.

DC and co didn't want to remove ATOS from day one at all, since they have been awarded new contracts since they came to power.

http://www.mssociety.org.uk/ms-news/2012/08/atos-awarded-new-benefit-assessment-contract

Catman wrote:

BigAndy9 wrote:

I honestly don't know what those Labour b4st4rds saw in ATO$.

The Tories changed the original rules, to make it easy for this awful firm to kick people onto the streets.

Disgusting state of affairs, but bodes well for the people that are just about to come up for appeals, just puts more strengh  behind their arguments!

Good evening Catman. Are you worried that they may call to see you?

Mistakes happen there are many who abuse the system. Many!

This place is starting to get full of RW scum multi ID, trolls.  ::zomb:: 

Catman wrote:This place is starting to get full of RW scum multi ID, trolls.  ::zomb:: 

Haven't you missed me? we were such good friends.

Didn't you have half a dozen IDs going at once on ADO. Of course you did. Were you LW scum then?

Doug has to go to the job center, this Thursday...We only just found out yesterday, coincides with a visit to the hospital, to see his consultant   ..There is a small time frame...My best mate has a car, he will break the speed limit!

  

If he suffers a fine!

It will be sorted out!

I'm calling in a friendship debt though!

You must be in a state of panic Catman. They are getting closer daily.