Texas government makes every Texan a qualified plumber

Plumbers in Texas will no longer be subject to state regulations after lawmakers this week flushed the state plumbing code and the Texas State Board of Plumbing Examiners, a state agency that employed dozens and generated $5.2 million in revenue in 2017.

Soon, anyone can call themselves a plumber without completing the agency-required education and tests, said Roger Wakefield, master plumber and owner of Texas Green Plumbing in Richardson. Wakefield, who has been a plumber for 40 years, said the industry is now "completely unregulated," and will lead to more unqualified workers entering the workforce.

"We're going to put the safety of the homeowners and the public of Texas in jeopardy," he said. "Plumbers install medical gas, they install the potable drinking water that we have every day. If they're not doing it right, people's safety is at risk."

Wakefield said he and other plumbers are calling Texas Gov. Greg Abbott and asking him to order lawmakers back to Austin for a special legislative session to remedy the situation. Abbott's press office did not respond to requests for comment, but the governor indicated on Twitter on Monday that he has no plans to reconvene legislators before the next regular session in 2021.

The state plumbing code will cease to exist on Sept. 1 while the state plumbing agency, which had 28 employees as of March, will have a “wind down” period to wrap up operations by September 2020. Several requests for comment left with the state board were not returned.

https://www.texastribune.org/2019/05/28/texas-plumbers-future-laws-board-abolished/

I feel like right-wing politicians just do these things reflexively, without ever looking into why leaders who came before them decided not to just let anyone call himself a professional plumber.

It’s ridiculous is what it is, is what it is.

It's the RW anti-regulatory movement. They want 'everybody' plumbers, just as they want 'everybody' off-shore drilling. No regulatory oversight. This is what you get with minimal government. Close down all public protections and leave the people to fend for themselves.

Wait until it hits the Clean Water Act.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Plumbers in Texas will no longer be subject to state regulations after lawmakers this week flushed the state plumbing code and the Texas State Board of Plumbing Examiners, a state agency that employed dozens and generated $5.2 million in revenue in 2017.

Soon, anyone can call themselves a plumber without completing the agency-required education and tests, said Roger Wakefield, master plumber and owner of Texas Green Plumbing in Richardson. Wakefield, who has been a plumber for 40 years, said the industry is now "completely unregulated," and will lead to more unqualified workers entering the workforce.

"We're going to put the safety of the homeowners and the public of Texas in jeopardy," he said. "Plumbers install medical gas, they install the potable drinking water that we have every day. If they're not doing it right, people's safety is at risk."

Wakefield said he and other plumbers are calling Texas Gov. Greg Abbott and asking him to order lawmakers back to Austin for a special legislative session to remedy the situation. Abbott's press office did not respond to requests for comment, but the governor indicated on Twitter on Monday that he has no plans to reconvene legislators before the next regular session in 2021.

The state plumbing code will cease to exist on Sept. 1 while the state plumbing agency, which had 28 employees as of March, will have a “wind down” period to wrap up operations by September 2020. Several requests for comment left with the state board were not returned.

https://www.texastribune.org/2019/05/28/texas-plumbers-future-laws-board-abolished/

I feel like right-wing politicians just do these things reflexively, without ever looking into why leaders who came before them decided not to just let anyone call himself a professional plumber.

Do you really think most people doing plumbing were licensed?

One guy in a shop carried a license, and everyone else worked under that license.

Unless, they were a "handyman". In that case they just learned it on their own. The license was just another fee charged by the state that protected no one from anything.


Are you afraid of unregulated and unlicensed tamale ladies too? They could kill you, ya know.

Maddog wrote:Do you really think most people doing plumbing were licensed?

One guy in a shop carried a license, and everyone else worked under that license.

Unless, they were "handyman". The license was just another fee charged by the state that protected no one from anything.

How would you feel if the medical profession were handled that way?

Did you know that the Constitution contains no provision that appointed judges be attorneys? Frankly, I would like to see more ordinary people appointed to the Supreme Court.

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:Do you really think most people doing plumbing were licensed?

One guy in a shop carried a license, and everyone else worked under that license.

Unless, they were "handyman". The license was just another fee charged by the state that protected no one from anything.

How would you feel if the medical profession were handled that way?

Did you know that the Constitution contains no provision that appointed judges be attorneys?  Frankly, I would like to see more ordinary people appointed to the Supreme Court.

Doctors pass a test once, then pay a fee forever to keep that license. They still manage to kill people.


Yes.

Maddog wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

Plumbers in Texas will no longer be subject to state regulations after lawmakers this week flushed the state plumbing code and the Texas State Board of Plumbing Examiners, a state agency that employed dozens and generated $5.2 million in revenue in 2017.

Soon, anyone can call themselves a plumber without completing the agency-required education and tests, said Roger Wakefield, master plumber and owner of Texas Green Plumbing in Richardson. Wakefield, who has been a plumber for 40 years, said the industry is now "completely unregulated," and will lead to more unqualified workers entering the workforce.

"We're going to put the safety of the homeowners and the public of Texas in jeopardy," he said. "Plumbers install medical gas, they install the potable drinking water that we have every day. If they're not doing it right, people's safety is at risk."

Wakefield said he and other plumbers are calling Texas Gov. Greg Abbott and asking him to order lawmakers back to Austin for a special legislative session to remedy the situation. Abbott's press office did not respond to requests for comment, but the governor indicated on Twitter on Monday that he has no plans to reconvene legislators before the next regular session in 2021.

The state plumbing code will cease to exist on Sept. 1 while the state plumbing agency, which had 28 employees as of March, will have a “wind down” period to wrap up operations by September 2020. Several requests for comment left with the state board were not returned.

https://www.texastribune.org/2019/05/28/texas-plumbers-future-laws-board-abolished/

I feel like right-wing politicians just do these things reflexively, without ever looking into why leaders who came before them decided not to just let anyone call himself a professional plumber.

Do you really think most people doing plumbing were licensed?

One guy in a shop carried a license, and everyone else worked under that license.

Unless, they were a "handyman". In that case they just learned it on their own.  The license was just another fee charged by the state that protected no one from anything.


Are you afraid of unregulated and unlicensed tamale ladies too? They could kill you, ya know.  

We'll see, won't we? At least unregulated tamale ladies don't have me over a barrel; if my plumbing blows up, I'm going to contract the first guy who can come and stop my house from flooding.

You have to consider how essential services are in the process of deciding whether they should be regulated. The more essential the service, the more regulated it is in general, until finally the government just decides it better do it itself (military, police, justice, education, and hopefully health care someday).

Capitalists are best at getting people to buy things that distract them from the pressing issues of our day and should just stick to their strengths.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Do you really think most people doing plumbing were licensed?

One guy in a shop carried a license, and everyone else worked under that license.

Unless, they were a "handyman". In that case they just learned it on their own.  The license was just another fee charged by the state that protected no one from anything.


Are you afraid of unregulated and unlicensed tamale ladies too? They could kill you, ya know.  

We'll see, won't we? At least unregulated tamale ladies don't have me over a barrel; if my plumbing blows up, I'm going to contract the first guy who can come and stop my house from flooding.

You have to consider how essential services are in the process of deciding whether they should be regulated. The more essential the service, the more regulated it is in general, until finally the government just decides it better do it itself (military, police, justice, education, and hopefully health care someday).

Capitalists are best at getting people to buy things that distract them from the pressing issues of our day and should just stick to their strengths.

And the guy that shows up won't have a license, even now.

Just like the guy that roofed your house, and the guy that poured your slab, and the guy that framed your house.

Maybe all plumbers should work for the state?

Maddog wrote:Maybe all plumbers should work for the state?  

Why is that such a ridiculous idea? Perhaps everyone who does work essential to our lives should work for the government.

Maddog wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

How would you feel if the medical profession were handled that way?

Did you know that the Constitution contains no provision that appointed judges be attorneys?  Frankly, I would like to see more ordinary people appointed to the Supreme Court.

Doctors pass a test once, then pay a fee forever to keep that license.  They still manage to kill people.

Yes.

I'd rather have a cardiothoracic surgeon who has gone through 4-years of college, 4-more years of medical school, 2-years of internship, 4-years of residency, and post-doctoral education, fussing around with my heart, than a plumber.

You're forgetting about CE, or continuing educational requirements. Physicians, attorneys, engineers and other professionals must comply with annual continuing educational requirements.

Texas doesn't require a license for plumbers? Figgers.

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Doctors pass a test once, then pay a fee forever to keep that license.  They still manage to kill people.

Yes.

I'd rather have a cardiothoracic surgeon who has gone through 4-years of college, 4-more years of medical school, 2-years of internship, 4-years  of residency, and post-doctoral education, fussing around with my heart, than a plumber.

You're forgetting about CE, or continuing educational requirements.  Physicians, attorneys, engineers and other professionals must comply with annual continuing educational requirements.

Texas doesn't require a license for plumbers?  Figgers.  

Yeah, I take CE too.

1000 bucks every two years that does nothing.

Well, it enriches course providers and the government.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Maddog wrote:Maybe all plumbers should work for the state?  

Why is that such a ridiculous idea? Perhaps everyone who does work essential to our lives should work for the government.

Sure comrade.

Like the post office. Let them take over UPS and Fed Ex.

People should be trained for their job. That is all.

Maddog wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

Maddog wrote:Maybe all plumbers should work for the state?  

Why is that such a ridiculous idea? Perhaps everyone who does work essential to our lives should work for the government.

Sure comrade.

Like the post office. Let them take over UPS and Fed Ex.  

Why not?

You implying that I'm a communist doesn't make my idea wrong.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Sure comrade.

Like the post office. Let them take over UPS and Fed Ex.  

Why not?

You implying that I'm a communist doesn't make my idea wrong.

Because the post office loses money and provides shitty service. UPS and Fed Ex make a profit and provide better service.

The utter failure of government run programs makes your idea wrong. It's why sick veterans try to stay the fuck out of a VA hospital.

eddie wrote:People should be trained for their job. That is all.

Can you learn a job, while on the job? Are you saying only those that can pass a government test know what the hell they are doing?

These license are to protect those already in the industry from new competition. It's the same in my business.

Maddog wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

Why not?

You implying that I'm a communist doesn't make my idea wrong.

Because the post office loses money and provides shitty service. UPS and Fed Ex make a profit and provide better service.

Totally wrong.  The Post Office only loses money because Congress requires that it fund retirement programs up front, rather than waiting until, and if, they are due.  To have to build and keep such a fund, is a heavy burden that UPS and Fed Ex do not have.

And...I can think of no other company that is as reliable as the US Postal Service, certainly not UPS or Fed Ex.

Maddog wrote:The utter failure of government run programs makes your idea wrong. It's why sick veterans try to stay the fuck out of a VA hospital.

Assumptions are not arguments.  You assume the government fails, but all facts are to the contrary.  The Postal Service is reliable and dependable.  Compare the cost of UPS and Fed Ex, and you will find the very efficient Postal Service performs the same service at a far less cost.

This is because the "government run programs" don't have an extra mouth to feed: return on capital, or simply, profit.  This is one of the many cases that proves the socialist point.  When government funds an enterprise, there are no greedy mercantilists hovering over the pot, ready to take the lion’s share.  Compare prescription drugs, and the size of profits involved.  Other examples are the Military, the Police and Fire Departments, and Ambulance services.  The government doesn't require profit, while profit is the first mouth to be fed in private enterprise.

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Because the post office loses money and provides shitty service. UPS and Fed Ex make a profit and provide better service.

Totally wrong.  The Post Office only loses money because Congress requires that it fund retirement programs up front, rather than waiting until, and if, they are due.  To have to build and keep such a fund, is a heavy burden that UPS and Fed Ex do not have.

And...I can think of no other company that is as reliable as the US Postal Service, certainly not UPS or Fed Ex.

Maddog wrote:The utter failure of government run programs makes your idea wrong. It's why sick veterans try to stay the fuck out of a VA hospital.

Assumptions are not arguments.  You assume the government fails, but all facts are to the contrary.  The Postal Service is reliable and dependable.  Compare the cost of UPS and Fed Ex, and you will find the very efficient Postal Service performs the same service at a far less cost.

This is because the "government run programs" don't have an extra mouth to feed: return on capital, or simply, profit.  This is one of the many cases that proves the socialist point.  When government funds an enterprise, there are no greedy mercantilists hovering over the pot, ready to take the lion’s share.  Compare prescription drugs, and the size of profits involved.  Other examples are the Military, the Police and Fire Departments, and Ambulance services.  The government doesn't require profit, while profit is the first mouth to be fed in private enterprise.

The post office money because it's inefficient.

It stays in business because it's propped up by the taxpayer.

You have to figure those costs into the cost of the post office.

Amtrack is another good example.

I can go on for days with failed government programs. Failure is what they do.

Re: those pesky Railways...

Isn't it amazing how India, China and even Russia, can run more efficient and "on time" railway systems than the bureaucracy-heavy 'corporatist' American system...

Follow Maddog's big-business-oriented agenda of 'privatising' all essential services,  and watch what happens   ==

Those corporations that buy the railroads will always put their shareholders' dividends first and foremost --  concentrating on the most profitable and cost-efficient services first, and either close underperforming routes, or jack up prices to unaffordable levels.

In the USA's case, that could mean half of todays' rail commuters would be left stranded in Maddog's "Libertarian" paradise, where all services are on a "user pays" basis and community and environmental needs aren't factored in --  only profits ever seem to rule in Maddog's proffered alternatives..

Having worked at a municipal justice court and seen too many people ripped off by unlicensed contractors, no thank you.

This is like asking Eddie to do my job with no training or education just because she worked in a school (no offense Eds) or me hers. It’s ridiculous and in some instances, like plumbing, could be a hazard to life. Stupid idea. Very very stupid.

Maddog wrote:The post office [lost] money because it's inefficient.

Prove it.

Maddog wrote:

eddie wrote:People should be trained for their job. That is all.

Can you learn a job, while on the job? Are you saying only those that can pass a government test know what the hell they are doing?

These license are to protect those already in the industry from new competition. It's the same in my business.  

Yes, you can learn a job whilst on the job as long as you get the proper and adequate training.

Maddog wrote:

eddie wrote:People should be trained for their job. That is all.

Can you learn a job, while on the job? Are you saying only those that can pass a government test know what the hell they are doing?

These license are to protect those already in the industry from new competition. It's the same in my business.  

These licenses are there to protect the consumer from charlatans. The consumer is every bit as important as the entrepreneur, which could not exist without the consumer, after.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Can you learn a job, while on the job? Are you saying only those that can pass a government test know what the hell they are doing?

These license are to protect those already in the industry from new competition. It's the same in my business.  

These licenses are there to protect the consumer from charlatans. The consumer is every bit as important as the entrepreneur, which could not exist without the consumer, after.

Horse shit.

And many of those prices drive up prices for a consumer..

That's why folks will call a handyman to replace their toilet instead of a licensed plumber.

Most of the trades in Texas are not licensed.

Maybe they should have had a license for journalists.

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:The post office [lost] money because it's inefficient.

Prove it.

Try this dumbass.

Put "post office losing money" in a search engine.

Or have Chuck Norris do it next time y'all workout together.

Maddog wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Prove it.

Try this dumbass.

Put "post office losing money" in a search engine.

In other words, you don't want to look because you are afraid of what you will find. Uh-huh, moving on...

Maddog wrote:Or have Chuck Norris do it next time y'all workout together.

What an unfulfilled, fragmentary life you must live. Any post more than 42 characters you need explained to you. Any polysyllabic word must be defined for you. You have not had any real education, and you've never met a person who is famous.

Apparently, you believe these things are not possible … testimony to your inconsequential life in the south. If I cared to look, no doubt I would find an unaccomplished, spineless adventurer, consumed by fits of jealousy.

But I refuse to dumb down my conversations just for you. How about you striving to keep up?

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:

Try this dumbass.

Put "post office losing money" in a search engine.  

In other words, you don't want to look because you are afraid of what you will find.  Uh-huh, moving on...

Maddog wrote:Or have Chuck Norris do it next time y'all workout together.  

What an unfulfilled, fragmentary life you must live.  Any post more than 42 characters you need explained to you.  Any polysyllabic word must be defined for you.   You have not had any real education, and you've never met a person who is famous.

Apparently, you believe these things are not possible … testimony to your inconsequential life in the south.  If I cared to look, no doubt I would find an unaccomplished, spineless adventurer, consumed by fits of jealousy.

But I refuse to dumb down my conversations just for you.  How about you striving to keep up?

I don't need to look, I know the dismal state of affairs at the post office.

And yes, I have the ability to say a great deal with few words. It's called an economy of words. Give it a try Mr Mitty.

Maddog wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

In other words, you don't want to look because you are afraid of what you will find.  Uh-huh, moving on...



What an unfulfilled, fragmentary life you must live.  Any post more than 42 characters you need explained to you.  Any polysyllabic word must be defined for you.   You have not had any real education, and you've never met a person who is famous.

Apparently, you believe these things are not possible … testimony to your inconsequential life in the south.  If I cared to look, no doubt I would find an unaccomplished, spineless adventurer, consumed by fits of jealousy.

But I refuse to dumb down my conversations just for you.  How about you striving to keep up?

I don't need to look, I know the dismal state of affairs at the post office.

As I thought.  You're just guessing...or worse, making up alternate facts.

Maddog wrote:And yes, I have the ability to say a great deal with few words. It's called an economy of words. Give it a try Mr Mitty.

Kinda like Trump, eh?  I'm sure you speak with few words, you have little to say.

Anyway, the issue isn't that you have a limited vocabulary.  Where you get into trouble is you must have complex ideas explained to you.

this "tradesman licencing is a crock of shit, but i can see why its needed too...

its a crock of shit because it prevents me from doing my own work for myself
(which I am quite capable of, indeed the test for sparkys I could pass whilst pissed out of my brains ...I'm a time served electronics engineer for gods sake, used to dealing with voltages and currents FAR in excess of what domestic requirements use....and I cant afford (in order to do so) the £2000 pounds every couple of years to pass yet another pointless test which only makes the "training organisation" rich.)they are not known as "shit for brains sparkys" for nothing. Holding that piece of paper DOES NOT make you "competent" .)

the gas act of 1995 (which is still law however, is another matter since whilst it requires the work be done by a "competent person" it significantly fails to define what is a "competent person" and as such the only definition that can apply is "a person that does the job competently" So in fact as long as I (as an individual, do it right theres no problem....) (this only applies of course to doing my OWN work on MY property)

as a gas engineer said to me ..."do you know the difference between you and me" "well if I do the job and get it wrong and it blows up I get 10 years.....If you do it and it goes wrong YOU get ten years....."

as for shit for brains plumbers and their lego plumbing ...pffffft.........

THAT said, there are people out there that just cant be let loose with a pair of pliers or a screwdriver....they are
1)too bloody stupid to be let loose
and
2) too stupid to know they are too stupid

aka fractally stupid.......,.,.,.

Maddog wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

In other words, you don't want to look because you are afraid of what you will find.  Uh-huh, moving on...



What an unfulfilled, fragmentary life you must live.  Any post more than 42 characters you need explained to you.  Any polysyllabic word must be defined for you.   You have not had any real education, and you've never met a person who is famous.

Apparently, you believe these things are not possible … testimony to your inconsequential life in the south.  If I cared to look, no doubt I would find an unaccomplished, spineless adventurer, consumed by fits of jealousy.

But I refuse to dumb down my conversations just for you.  How about you striving to keep up?

I don't need to look, I know the dismal state of affairs at the post office.

And yes, I have the ability to say a great deal with few words. It's called an economy of words. Give it a try Mr Mitty.

And no matter how few words you use, Maddog, it still sounds like the same old load of garbage...

Original Quill wrote:

Maddog wrote:

I don't need to look, I know the dismal state of affairs at the post office.

As I thought.  You're just guessing...or worse, making up alternate facts.

Maddog wrote:And yes, I have the ability to say a great deal with few words. It's called an economy of words. Give it a try Mr Mitty.

Kinda like Trump, eh?  I'm sure you speak with few words, you have little to say.

Anyway, the issue isn't that you have a limited vocabulary.  Where you get into trouble is you must have complex ideas explained to you.

Not guessing, just informed on the topic.


Trump should follow my advice and stop blabbering like you. Both of you make little sense.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Maddog wrote:

I don't need to look, I know the dismal state of affairs at the post office.

And yes, I have the ability to say a great deal with few words. It's called an economy of words. Give it a try Mr Mitty.

And no matter how few words you use, Maddog, it still sounds like the same old load of garbage...

I'll never be homeless as you let me live rent free in your head.

Maddog wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

As I thought.  You're just guessing...or worse, making up alternate facts.



Kinda like Trump, eh?  I'm sure you speak with few words, you have little to say.

Anyway, the issue isn't that you have a limited vocabulary.  Where you get into trouble is you must have complex ideas explained to you.

Not guessing, just informed on the topic.

Trump should follow my advice and stop blabbering like you.  Both of you make little sense.  

To respond would be gratuitous.

Maddog wrote:

Out of curiosity, do you think there should be no driver's license?

what does holding a drivers licence do?
does it make one a competent driver?
does it improve ones driving skills?
does it even show you are a fit and proper person to be let loose witha 1 ton+ guided missile?

unlike a gun permit here which at least goes part way to showing you are fit and proper in as much as extensive background and medical checks are done?

no all it shows is that you should know what you are doing, and that if you fail to do it properly that you have no excuse not to know.
and is a convenient way to control who drives though it also fails significantly in that too.