Quirky, weird facts I'm learning about English and UK history

In an overabundance of preparation to one day sit the test for British citizenship, I've started studying a good five years or more before I'll even be able to apply for citizenship.

These two facts (presented across two pages of the book I'm reading) will stick out in my memory even in 2024, as I ride my hoverboard to the floating city of New London to take the test, because they're examples of huge things happening for oddball reasons:

Childlessness -> create a new nation: Queen Anne (daughter of William and Mary) had no surviving children. That created a chain reaction which led to the Act of Union with Scotland, creating the Kingdom of Great Britain, the predecessor state to the modern-day UK.

Language barrier -> create the position of Prime Minister: King George I spoke very poor English. So he relied heavily upon his ministers in Parliament. Eventually, his top minister, Robert Walpole, would be recognized as the very first Prime Minister.

I'm sure other members here have more quirky facts like these, and I'd love to hear them.

True but the union had been attempted since her great grandfather James VI inherited the English throne on the death of Elizabeth I, already being in possession of Scotland.

In a nutshell it really wasn’t the lack of her heirs but rather political motivation to stop a monarch from using one Parliament against the other. It just happened in her reign when the two countries finally agreed to it, although it took a lot longer for the Scots to sign up.

As to George and Walpole correct. I’m just about to start a book on George’s mistress Melusine. I believe that they contracted a morganatic marriage like Louis XIV and Madame de Maintenon.

Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

eddie wrote:Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

Yeah, fam! Like how Winston Churchill gave a speech on our high street, not too far from the M&S!

Or how one of the groups of Germanic raiders that conquered England around the year 500 or so used a knife called a seax, a word that survives in the place names Essex, Sussex, Wessex and Middlesex, along with the name of the tribe, the Saxons (as in "Anglo-Saxons").

Ben Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

Yeah, fam! Like how Winston Churchill gave a speech on our high street, not too far from the M&S!

Or how one of the groups of Germanic raiders that conquered England around the year 500 or so used a knife called a seax, a word that survives in the place names Essex, Sussex, Wessex and Middlesex, along with the name of the tribe, the Saxons (as in "Anglo-Saxons").

Place name history is fascinating. You may already know that anywhere with 'borough' or 'burgh' refers to the old Anglo-Saxon word for a fortified town.

On a much smaller scale, a cool story I found out when working in Warrington years ago (near Manchester) was about 'Scotland Road' there. It gets its name from an event after the Battle of Preston near the end of the Civil War, in which Oliver Cromwell rounded up and addressed the defeated Scots Royalists.

Amazing how such a footnote in history (though part of. a much bigger event) can leave a stamp in such a way - even if only minor

eddie wrote:Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

I know more British and Scottish history than Mr. C but he doesn’t care like you. It’s why I will always rule at Trivial Pursuit.

Ben Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

Yeah, fam! Like how Winston Churchill gave a speech on our high street, not too far from the M&S!

Or how one of the groups of Germanic raiders that conquered England around the year 500 or so used a knife called a seax, a word that survives in the place names Essex, Sussex, Wessex and Middlesex, along with the name of the tribe, the Saxons (as in "Anglo-Saxons").

A great book for you to read is Rutherfurd, Edward, London (1997).  True, it's technically a history of the City, but so much happened in that convenient river crossing that much of the English language originated there.

The City was situated between two hills, which are now known as Ludgate and Cornhill.  The River Thames at the point of London was really a tidal estuary.  Indeed, the location came about because it was a convenient place to ford the river at low tide.  As such there were a great many islands, now land filled.  Indeed, it was a kind of 'wetlands'.

There were so many islands, that the Saxons identified them as landing places for their longboats.  Any location that ends with the suffix "sea" was one such landing place...usually an island.  Thus, Chelsea and Battersea were originally islands.  Chelsea, in Saxon, means Chalk Island.

The city of Westminster was once an island, known as Thorney Island.  On it, was built the church of one of the two ministers that served the community of London.  Because his church was situated upstream, and the river runs toward the east, he was called the 'west' minister...hence, the City of Westminster.

There are tons of such factual data in London, together with a great narrative about the history of England from primitive days to the present...and lots about the monarchy, because the City was the principle place of residence.  If your tests are comprised of such factual detail, you might pick of a copy at a used book store.

Got a 75 on a practice test this morning! Not flying colors but a solid passing score.

I've been looking into the Normans and the influence of William the Conqueror on England, and I'm astounded that this French bastard (seriously, his parents weren't married) made England so much of what it is today.

The French bastard not only introduced the castle to England, he built the Tower of London and his language had such a huge influence on English that today, a third of English comes from French, and another third comes from Latin via French.

I used to wonder why English wasn't classified as a Romance language, actually, until I learned that even though the vocabulary is two-thirds Romance, it's considered Germanic because it still follows Germanic grammar.

Eilzel wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

Yeah, fam! Like how Winston Churchill gave a speech on our high street, not too far from the M&S!

Or how one of the groups of Germanic raiders that conquered England around the year 500 or so used a knife called a seax, a word that survives in the place names Essex, Sussex, Wessex and Middlesex, along with the name of the tribe, the Saxons (as in "Anglo-Saxons").

Place name history is fascinating. You may already know that anywhere with 'borough' or 'burgh' refers to the old Anglo-Saxon word for a fortified town.

On a much smaller scale, a cool story I found out when working in Warrington years ago (near Manchester) was about 'Scotland Road' there. It gets its name from an event after the Battle of Preston near the end of the Civil War, in which Oliver Cromwell rounded up and addressed the defeated Scots Royalists.

Amazing how such a footnote in history (though part of. a much bigger event) can leave a stamp in such a way - even if only minor

Wow, we have a road named Coronation here that I'm very curious about -- I'll have to look into it.

Also found out that a tiny town, basically a glorified roundabout, near where Eddie works was an important spot for Cromwell.

Also, Cromwell was dug up under orders of Charles II, three years after he died, and they cut off his head and displayed it on a pole, while hanging the rest of him in chains at Tyburn. His head then was owned by several people, and finally was buried under the floor of a college at Cambridge.

Ben Reilly wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Ben knows more about English history, the history of the town we live in and all the surrounding towns, more than I do.

I should be ashamed. But I ain’t.

Yeah, fam! Like how Winston Churchill gave a speech on our high street, not too far from the M&S!

Or how one of the groups of Germanic raiders that conquered England around the year 500 or so used a knife called a seax, a word that survives in the place names Essex, Sussex, Wessex and Middlesex, along with the name of the tribe, the Saxons (as in "Anglo-Saxons").

Place name history is fascinating. You may already know that anywhere with 'borough' or 'burgh' refers to the old Anglo-Saxon word for a fortified town.

On a much smaller scale, a cool story I found out when working in Warrington years ago (near Manchester) was about 'Scotland Road' there. It gets its name from an event after the Battle of Preston near the end of the Civil War, in which Oliver Cromwell rounded up and addressed the defeated Scots Royalists.

Amazing how such a footnote in history (though part of. a much bigger event) can leave a stamp in such a way - even if only minor

Wow, we have a road named Coronation here that I'm very curious about -- I'll have to look into it.

Also found out that a tiny town, basically a glorified roundabout, near where Eddie works was an important spot for Cromwell.

Also, Cromwell was dug up under orders of Charles II, three years after he died, and they cut off his head and displayed it on a pole, while hanging the rest of him in chains at Tyburn. His head then was owned by several people, and finally was buried under the floor of a college at Cambridge.

Grim times He is a fascinating figure. The Civil War itself was one of the most bloody on British soil, so he got about a fair bit

Coronation is usually a name given (not unsurprisingly) to a road or street named in the year of a royal coronation. Though which the one near you is will be interesting to find out

I actually grew up on a road named John Kennedy - it was built in 1963.

Ben Reilly wrote:In an overabundance of preparation to one day sit the test for British citizenship, I've started studying a good five years or more before I'll even be able to apply for citizenship.

These two facts (presented across two pages of the book I'm reading) will stick out in my memory even in 2024, as I ride my hoverboard to the floating city of New London to take the test, because they're examples of huge things happening for oddball reasons:

Childlessness -> create a new nation: Queen Anne (daughter of William and Mary) had no surviving children. That created a chain reaction which led to the Act of Union with Scotland, creating the Kingdom of Great Britain, the predecessor state to the modern-day UK.

Language barrier -> create the position of Prime Minister: King George I spoke very poor English. So he relied heavily upon his ministers in Parliament. Eventually, his top minister, Robert Walpole, would be recognized as the very first Prime Minister.

I'm sure other members here have more quirky facts like these, and I'd love to hear them.

I would be interested to know what sort of visa you are using to live in blighty, as If i want to bring the wife over to settle I have to be earning over £20grand a year

It helps to have a bona fide source of income as Ben has, ie, his book, rather than depending on advertising from a dubious forum.

Andy wrote:It helps to have a bona fide source of income as Ben has, ie, his book, rather than depending on advertising from a dubious forum.

you do make I larf. you need an income of £20grand or so to be able to bring dependants in. how many copies of a book would you need to sell to make that each year?
Also its this forum that tired to make money out of suckers like you. I block the adds on my site.

And finally I asked the organ grinder the question, not the village idiots monkey

Fortunately, whether we Brexit or not, it seems unlikely that your MUCH better half will be given permanent residency here. And definatlet not under Farage, who hates immigrants and Muslims.

Flap... under current EU/EEA rules, if you move to another (non UK) EU country and live there with family for 6 months then you can move all of you into UK without having to subscribe to the UK earnings rule...


It's called 'the Singh route' or something very much like that...

Ben, you should visit historical places while you are there.  The distances are so short and you've got plenty of time.

Try Bosworth Market, between Birmingham and Leicester, where Richard III died, promising to trade the kingdom for a horse.

Daily Mail wrote:The Battle of Bosworth Field was fought on the morning of August 22, 1485 and marked the end of the War Of The  Roses, the 30-year civil war between the houses of York and Lancaster. One of the most important clashes in English history, it saw the death of Richard III, ushered in the Tudor dynasty and gave Shakespeare one of his best known quotations.

The battle marked the final confrontation between the Yorkist king Richard III and his challenger Henry Tudor, Earl of Richmond and leader of the House of Lancaster. The seeds of Richard's downfall were sown when he seized the throne from his 12-year-old nephew Edward V in 1483. Support for the monarch was further diminished when Edward and his younger brother disappeared and Richard was involved in the death of his wife. Henry laid claim to the throne from across the Channel. Following an unsuccessful attempt to invade England from his base in France, Henry arrived on the coast of Wales on August 1, 1485. Gathering support as he marched inland, Richard hurriedly mustered troops and intercepted Henry's army south of Market Bosworth in Leicestershire. After Richard's death on the battlefield his rival was crowned King Henry VII and became the first English monarch of the Tudor dynasty, which lasted until 1603.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1252208/Real-location-Richard-IIIs-Battle-Bosworth-500-years.html



I've toured most of the battle sites of Scotland, just by meandering around with my daughter. It's fascinating stuff, and if you have to know the stuff anyway...

The Devil, You Know wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:In an overabundance of preparation to one day sit the test for British citizenship, I've started studying a good five years or more before I'll even be able to apply for citizenship.

These two facts (presented across two pages of the book I'm reading) will stick out in my memory even in 2024, as I ride my hoverboard to the floating city of New London to take the test, because they're examples of huge things happening for oddball reasons:

Childlessness -> create a new nation: Queen Anne (daughter of William and Mary) had no surviving children. That created a chain reaction which led to the Act of Union with Scotland, creating the Kingdom of Great Britain, the predecessor state to the modern-day UK.

Language barrier -> create the position of Prime Minister: King George I spoke very poor English. So he relied heavily upon his ministers in Parliament. Eventually, his top minister, Robert Walpole, would be recognized as the very first Prime Minister.

I'm sure other members here have more quirky facts like these, and I'd love to hear them.

I would be interested to know what sort of visa you are using to live in blighty, as If i want to bring the wife over to settle  I have to be earning over £20grand a year

He isn’t living here yet. He’s here for six months whilst I show that I cam earn (near) the amount you mentioned. So he has to run the home and the kids etc whilst I prove to government officials I’m earning enough.
We have to show that for six months then apply for a spousal visa. If/when we get that he can move here and look for work and actually work. Then we can split that amount up between us ie earn the £20k together.

eddie wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I would be interested to know what sort of visa you are using to live in blighty, as If i want to bring the wife over to settle  I have to be earning over £20grand a year

He isn’t living here yet. He’s here for six months whilst I show that I cam earn (near) the amount you mentioned. So he has to run the home and the kids etc whilst I prove to government officials I’m earning enough.
We have to show that for six months then apply for a spousal visa. If/when we get that he can move here and look for work and actually work.  Then we can split that amount up between us ie earn the £20k together.

You can do it!

Cass wrote:

eddie wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I would be interested to know what sort of visa you are using to live in blighty, as If i want to bring the wife over to settle  I have to be earning over £20grand a year

He isn’t living here yet. He’s here for six months whilst I show that I cam earn (near) the amount you mentioned. So he has to run the home and the kids etc whilst I prove to government officials I’m earning enough.
We have to show that for six months then apply for a spousal visa. If/when we get that he can move here and look for work and actually work.  Then we can split that amount up between us ie earn the £20k together.

You can do it!

Yes we can!

I was just reading that the citizenship test was altered about six years ago to include more questions about British history and heritage. I think that might work to my advantage, actually -- and it does make me wonder what was on the older tests ...

Ben wrote:Childlessness -> create a new nation: Queen Anne (daughter of William and Mary) had no surviving children. That created a chain reaction which led to the Act of Union with Scotland, creating the Kingdom of Great Britain, the predecessor state to the modern-day UK.

Only...just to keep you from making mistakes:

Anne was the younger sister of Mary, not the daughter of Mary and William.  Both Anne and Mary were daughters of James II and his first (Protestant) wife, Anne Hyde.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anne,_Queen_of_Great_Britain

Just the kind of thing that some tricky tester would love to trip you on.

Andy wrote:Fortunately, whether we Brexit or not, it seems unlikely that your MUCH better half will be given permanent residency here. And definatlet not under Farage, who hates immigrants and Muslims.

is that why the BXP has gay/straight, black/white, Muslim/christian, rich/poor, communist/tories, upper class/working class people all elected to the european parliament?
lets not forget the BXP doubled the number of black faces in the euopean parliament. Before them there were 3 non white faces in amongst 749 white ones. Farage is not what stops me bringing my family in, it is the requirement to earn more than £20grand because she happens to be born outside the EU. this is just another example of your racist islamaphobia that I have had to put up with for over a decade now by your and your cohorts.

eddie wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I would be interested to know what sort of visa you are using to live in blighty, as If i want to bring the wife over to settle  I have to be earning over £20grand a year

He isn’t living here yet. He’s here for six months whilst I show that I cam earn (near) the amount you mentioned. So he has to run the home and the kids etc whilst I prove to government officials I’m earning enough.
We have to show that for six months then apply for a spousal visa. If/when we get that he can move here and look for work and actually work.  Then we can split that amount up between us ie earn the £20k together.

hasn't he been there 6 months so far?

Ben Reilly wrote:I was just reading that the citizenship test was altered about six years ago to include more questions about British history and heritage. I think that might work to my advantage, actually -- and it does make me wonder what was on the older tests ...

will you be renouncing your america citizenship if you go for uk citizenship, or will you pay us tax on your earnings as well as uk tax?

The Devil, You Know wrote:

eddie wrote:

He isn’t living here yet. He’s here for six months whilst I show that I cam earn (near) the amount you mentioned. So he has to run the home and the kids etc whilst I prove to government officials I’m earning enough.
We have to show that for six months then apply for a spousal visa. If/when we get that he can move here and look for work and actually work.  Then we can split that amount up between us ie earn the £20k together.

hasn't he been there 6 months so far?

I may be wrong but he would not be able to work without a working visa which is different to a spousal visa. I understood that it would be 3 years before the work route was an option.

The spouse visa includes the right to seek employment.

The Devil, You Know wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
hasn't he been there 6 months so far?

I may be wrong but he would not be able to work without a working visa which is different to a spousal visa. I understood that it would be 3 years before the work route was an option.

I thought you have to have lived together for 2 years though before you can apply for the spousal visa

The Devil, You Know wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
hasn't he been there 6 months so far?

I may be wrong but he would not be able to work without a working visa which is different to a spousal visa. I understood that it would be 3 years before the work route was an option.

I thought you have to have lived together for 2 years though before you can apply for the spousal visa

If you haven't lived together for 2 years, you can still qualify if you're in a marriage recognized as legal by Her Majesty's government.