Some English seem to want to ...

...break away from themselves, is this correct?, as there is much uproar on Scottish independence, and with the blackmail of the pound used against Alex Salmond and Scots voting yes in general, I would say it's poor tactics..

I've always said that I'm. It really for leaving the UK, but with threats like the non use of the pound, it really makes me think again, as well as some comments I read on the matter...despite other English posters providing excellent points on Scotttish independence and how we would if penance out own affairs should the vote be yes.

Now, I have heard some of the English posters on here say they want their own independence, so just who is it those few would like independence from?

The entire UK is run from London, finances, military, welfare spending etc....

Just who is it you so seek independence from?, from here it would seem that some English folk want independence from England, but I think this has only come about because of the Scottish referendum...

As I said, I e never been one for going it alone, unless under constant RW governments, but regardless of the country in question, I believe it is only fair and right to let any country have a referendum, regardless of the result.

But this blackmail of the pound is a very low blow IMO.

I would like scotland to remain part of Britain purely because of tradition, I also worry that once England has been separated from all the other parts it will just be absorbed as part of europe which I think would be a sad loss.

heavenly father wrote:I would like scotland to remain part of Britain purely because of tradition, I also worry that once England has been separated from all the other parts it will just be absorbed as part of europe which I think would be a sad loss.

..thank you for your opinion Favva, I share the same beliefs for both countries as well, a sensible view from you there...

Some see that the very fact Scotland has a referendum on independence that it is wrong in itself , I don't ..I think any country seeking independence from other united countries has that right...but it doesn't always mean independence is the best move, I just believe in a country having the right to poll it's people.

Joy Division wrote:

heavenly father wrote:I would like scotland to remain part of Britain purely because of tradition, I also worry that once England has been separated from all the other parts it will just be absorbed as part of europe which I think would be a sad loss.

..thank you for your opinion Favva, I share the same beliefs for both countries as well, a sensible view from you there...

Some see that the very fact Scotland has a referendum on independence that it is wrong in itself , I don't ..I think any country seeking independence from other united countries has that right...but it doesn't always mean independence is the best move, I just believe in a country having the right to poll it's people.

I completely agree any country should have the right to decide to govern itself or to unite with another nation as it sees fit, often only time will tell if it was a good decision or not, perhaps even if the vote is in favour of independence not all bridges back should be burnt..

Joy Division wrote:...break away from themselves, is this correct?, as there is much uproar on Scottish independence, and with the blackmail of the pound used against Alex Salmond and Scots voting yes in general, I would say it's poor tactics..

I've always said that I'm. It really for leaving the UK, but with threats like the non use of the pound, it really makes me think again, as well as some comments I read on the matter...despite other English posters providing excellent points on Scotttish independence and how we would if penance out own affairs should the vote be yes.

Now, I have heard some of the English posters on here say they want their own independence, so just who is it those few would like independence from?

The entire UK is run from London, finances, military, welfare spending etc....

Just who is it you so seek independence from?, from here it would seem that some English folk want independence from England, but I think this has only come about because of the Scottish referendum...

As I said, I e never been one for going it alone, unless under constant RW governments, but regardless of the country in question, I believe it is only fair and right to let any country have a referendum, regardless of the result.

But this blackmail of the pound is a very low blow IMO.

Why do you see it as blackmail to refuse use of currency?

England (and Scotland as it stands) are not run from London they are run from Brussels - and some of us want independence from Brussels.

It may help you understand the concept if you think about somewhere like Greece becoming independent from the EU - they would have to stop using the Euro and reintroduce their own currency.

I do not particularly want Scotland to leave the UK - however I am of the opinion that if it does want to go independent then it must do so properly and that means having its own currency. If it keeps the pound it will tied to the rest of the UK the way Greece is tied to the EU and that is very very bad for Greece because it cannot set its own monetary policy - it cannot devalue currency to get out of the mess it is in. Scotland using the pound would end up in the same situation - the control of the pound would remain in London and decisions that were good for England and Wales could be very bad for Scotland. It is not threats or blackmail it is long sighted understanding that having different economies on the same currency is in the long term very bad for one of those economies. Greece had it great when it first joined the EU - borrowing funding etc, but that ran out and now Greece is stuck and will be for a long long time - the decisions on how its economy is run are made in Germany to ensure the best outcome for Germany regardless of whether that outcome is worse for Greece itself. Scotland keeping the pound would be going down that road - and there are luckily people who dont want that for Scotland.

They just like to play the victims Sphinx it is as simple as that.

Pitiful really. Everybody knows that they won't vote yes I'd put my shirt on it.

56kevins wrote:They just like to play the victims Sphinx it is as simple as that.

Pitiful really. Everybody knows that they won't vote yes I'd put my shirt on it.

Who is playing

the victim and why?

If you're referring to the Scots then your display of a 'little Englander' is far more pitiful.

sphinx wrote:

Joy Division wrote:...break away from themselves, is this correct?, as there is much uproar on Scottish independence, and with the blackmail of the pound used against Alex Salmond and Scots voting yes in general, I would say it's poor tactics..

I've always said that I'm. It really for leaving the UK, but with threats like the non use of the pound, it really makes me think again, as well as some comments I read on the matter...despite other English posters providing excellent points on Scotttish independence and how we would if penance out own affairs should the vote be yes.

Now, I have heard some of the English posters on here say they want their own independence, so just who is it those few would like independence from?

The entire UK is run from London, finances, military, welfare spending etc....

Just who is it you so seek independence from?, from here it would seem that some English folk want independence from England, but I think this has only come about because of the Scottish referendum...

As I said, I e never been one for going it alone, unless under constant RW governments, but regardless of the country in question, I believe it is only fair and right to let any country have a referendum, regardless of the result.

But this blackmail of the pound is a very low blow IMO.

Why do you see it as blackmail to refuse use of currency?

England (and Scotland as it stands) are not run from London they are run from Brussels - and some of us want independence from Brussels.

It may help you understand the concept if you think about somewhere like Greece becoming independent from the EU - they would have to stop using the Euro and reintroduce their own currency.  

I do not particularly want Scotland to leave the UK - however I am of the opinion that if it does want to go independent then it must do so properly and that means having its own currency.  If it keeps the pound it will tied to the rest of the UK the way Greece is tied to the EU and that is very very bad for Greece because it cannot set its own monetary policy - it cannot devalue currency to get out of the mess it is in.  Scotland using the pound would end up in the same situation - the control of the pound would remain in London and decisions that were good for England and Wales could be very bad for Scotland.  It is not threats or blackmail it is long sighted understanding that having different economies on the same currency is in the long term very bad for one of those economies.  Greece had it great when it first joined the EU - borrowing funding etc, but that ran out and now Greece is stuck and will be for a long long time - the decisions on how its economy is run are made in Germany to ensure the best outcome for Germany regardless of whether that outcome is worse for Greece itself.  Scotland keeping the pound would be going down that road - and there are luckily people who dont want that for Scotland.

Brussels may call the shots, but not all of them, for UK affairs, that comes from London.

Our welfare system, taxes and defences are called form London

Which country do you solely speak of who are in such a mess Sphinx?

Joy Division wrote:

sphinx wrote:

Why do you see it as blackmail to refuse use of currency?

England (and Scotland as it stands) are not run from London they are run from Brussels - and some of us want independence from Brussels.

It may help you understand the concept if you think about somewhere like Greece becoming independent from the EU - they would have to stop using the Euro and reintroduce their own currency.  

I do not particularly want Scotland to leave the UK - however I am of the opinion that if it does want to go independent then it must do so properly and that means having its own currency.  If it keeps the pound it will tied to the rest of the UK the way Greece is tied to the EU and that is very very bad for Greece because it cannot set its own monetary policy - it cannot devalue currency to get out of the mess it is in.  Scotland using the pound would end up in the same situation - the control of the pound would remain in London and decisions that were good for England and Wales could be very bad for Scotland.  It is not threats or blackmail it is long sighted understanding that having different economies on the same currency is in the long term very bad for one of those economies.  Greece had it great when it first joined the EU - borrowing funding etc, but that ran out and now Greece is stuck and will be for a long long time - the decisions on how its economy is run are made in Germany to ensure the best outcome for Germany regardless of whether that outcome is worse for Greece itself.  Scotland keeping the pound would be going down that road - and there are luckily people who dont want that for Scotland.

Brussels may call the shots, but  not all of them, for UK affairs, that comes from London.

Our welfare system, taxes and defences are called form London

Which country do you solely speak of who are in such a mess Sphinx?

Yeah and its Brussels trying to tell London how to call them.

My point JD is that the example of Greece and the EU (or several other countries could replace Greece in this example) is that although Greece could claim it is an independent sovereign country in its own right because it uses the Euro as currency it is suffering horrendously because the Euro is run by other more powerful countries with completely different shaped economies and what suits them is seriously bad for Greece (or any of the countries in a similar position). If Greece had its own currency it could devalue it - which would drive some sort of recovery for the country. I mean people complain about the benefits in this country but in Greece now there are no benefits - people are homeless and starving, and there are no food banks. People are being forced to put their children into care because they cannot feed them because there is no money. The conditions in Greece make the conditions here look like paradise and there is nothing the Greek government can do to improve them because they do no have their own currency.

The fact of the matter is that an Independent Scotland would have a very different shaped economy from the UK left behind. The pound will be managed from the UK - and it will be managed for the benefit of the UK economy. That would result in Scotland being in the same position Greece is now as regards control of its currency - it would not have any. It is practically certain that due to differing economies decisions that are good for a UK economy will be bad for a Scottish economy - and there will not be anything Scotland could do about it except pull out of the pound and launch its own currency. In stopping Scotland from having the pound in the first place it will prevent the grief Greece is going through and avoiding the very nasty decision facing Greece - of to suffer decades of economic destitution if it stays with the joint currency or to suffer a short term even worse economic disaster to be able to manage its own recovery in the long term.

That is the reality JD - Scotland will have to face up to it some when if it chooses independence, this way it is simply a case of having to face up to it at the start before accumulating a load of crap to be dealt with if facing up to it is put off.