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That Muslim Christmas double bind again

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That Muslim Christmas double bind again Empty That Muslim Christmas double bind again

Post by Guest on Sat Jan 05, 2019 8:14 am

Last year I described the problems faced by popular TV chef Nadiya Hussain when she revealed her enthusiasm for Christmas baking. The kind of people who (one suspects) moan that Muslims fail to integrate moaned at Nadiya for doing just that – meanwhile, on the other end of the spectrum, you get hardline Muslims accusing people like Nadiya of selling out, or of ‘shirk’. Two recent stories highlight similar problems. Another TV chef, Swedish Camilla Hamid, faced great hostility when she described how she enjoyed joining in some elements of the Christmas festivities despite being a practising Muslim. Cue much pearl clutching from the various shades of alt-right –the Blazing Cat Fur blog filed the story under the foreboding heading ‘Sweden – a nation commits suicide’ and introduced it with a picture of the Swedish flag captioned ‘Dear Sweden, Just kill yourself already’. The post’s central revelation of Julbak Jihad struck, almost inevitably, a note of bathos:
No”, Hamid replied, pointing out that she nevertheless appreciates the Christmastide atmosphere. “One can choose what one can relate to, what one likes. I love everything that has to do with Christmas baking”

Meanwhile in France a Muslim woman’s attempts to join in Christmas baking met with more than social media opprobrium.  The Mayor of Saint-Gratien himself intervened to prevent Zekiye Yildirim from running a stall selling cakes and sweets at a Christmas market.  Yildrim, who was at the market with one of her children, was distressed to be told she had to pack up if she didn’t remove her scarf. The reasoning was that, because the market was a municipal organisation, all the stallholders had to uphold strict laïcité. However a legal opinion quoted at the end of this report asserts stall holders don’t meet the threshold of public service which would warrant such a ban.
Yildrim articulated her own sense of a double bind at work here.
The Muslim community is told to fit in with other cultural traditions – so, I joined in the Christmas market and was thrown out!

As Rim Sarah-Alouane pointed out on Twitter there’s a real irony in the way Yildrim was banned on grounds of strict religious neutrality from an explicitly Christmas market – and a further irony in the fact that one of the key characters in the Christmas story is routinely depicted wearing a headscarf. Back in the UK Miqdaad Versi, from the Muslim Council of Britain, has been facing criticism for attending Midnight Mass. This time the complaints (or the ones I spotted at least) were directed at him by fellow Muslims.  He was warned sternly about ‘potential acts of kufr’ by one zealot, although it’s good to see that such critics were outnumbered by supportive messages from Muslims – many of whom dismissed the hardliners in derisory terms.


http://hurryupharry.org/2018/12/28/that-Muslim-christmas-double-bind-again/

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Post by HoratioTarr on Sat Jan 05, 2019 3:40 pm

At least Christians don't object to Muslims attending Mass. Can you imagine the almighty stink if a non Muslim woman fetched up at the local mosque for prayers?
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Post by Vintage on Sat Jan 05, 2019 8:06 pm

If you have a religion it has to be Anglican or Zoroastrian or Baha'i, every body welcome from conservative to hardly bothered.
The problem with most religions they are so caught up in what is to be worn or not worn, believed or not believed, who is worthy or not worthy they forget about the spiritual side which is the important thing. If you have to have a religion that has a label I think everyone of every persuasion should be able to go to your local temple, mosque, church or chapel to pray in a 'holy' place even if you aren't of that persuasion. The rules and regulations are largely redundant if you think about how you would like to be treated in all situations in life and reciprocate to others.

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Post by eddie on Sat Jan 05, 2019 8:14 pm

I don’t personally know of any Muslims who are against Christmas.

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Post by nicko on Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:59 am

You should get out more Laughing
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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:03 pm

nicko wrote:You should get out more Laughing

I'm sure she gets out quite a bit more than you do.

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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:08 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:At least Christians don't object to Muslims attending Mass.   Can you imagine the almighty stink if a non Muslim woman fetched up at the local mosque for prayers?

I'm going to be in England soon. I might spend some time calling mosques, telling them I'm not a Muslim and seeing if they would let me visit. I could report my results on NewsFix.

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Post by nicko on Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:13 pm

Do that, they will let you in[most times] with smiles and hand shakes. But watch their Eyes !
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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:15 pm

nicko wrote:Do that,   they will let you in[most times]  with smiles and hand shakes.  But watch their Eyes !

Big deal!

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Post by nicko on Sun Jan 06, 2019 4:41 pm

When you get here, don't spend all your time in Bed, go to Rotherham , Alum rock or Sparkhill ect. Have a wonder around, at night would be better. Have a talk with the local Whites,[if you can find one after dark] Your so nice you will be welcomed !
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Post by HoratioTarr on Sun Jan 06, 2019 6:40 pm

eddie wrote:I don’t personally know of any Muslims who are against Christmas.

Why would they be? I get mightily pissed off though by leftie Christians who think our decs and trees might be 'offensive' to them, though.
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Post by nicko on Sun Jan 06, 2019 6:43 pm

+1
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Post by HoratioTarr on Sun Jan 06, 2019 6:47 pm

>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:At least Christians don't object to Muslims attending Mass.   Can you imagine the almighty stink if a non Muslim woman fetched up at the local mosque for prayers?

I'm going to be in England soon. I might spend some time calling mosques, telling them I'm not a Muslim and seeing if they would let me visit. I could report my results on NewsFix.

You're a bloke, so why would there be a problem.

They have open days where you can go in as a non-Muslim woman with no head covering.   But for a woman to walk into a mosque with your head uncovered to pray?   I don't think so.
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Post by Ben Reilly on Sun Jan 06, 2019 6:54 pm

HoratioTarr wrote:
>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:At least Christians don't object to Muslims attending Mass.   Can you imagine the almighty stink if a non Muslim woman fetched up at the local mosque for prayers?

I'm going to be in England soon. I might spend some time calling mosques, telling them I'm not a Muslim and seeing if they would let me visit. I could report my results on NewsFix.

You're a bloke, so why would there be a problem.

They have open days where you can go in as a non-Muslim woman with no head covering.   But for a woman to walk into a mosque with your head uncovered to pray?   I don't think so.

Would that be a respectful thing to do, though; i.e., would you barge into a wat or a synagogue and expect to be allowed to do what you wanted?

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Post by HoratioTarr on Sun Jan 06, 2019 7:21 pm

>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:
HoratioTarr wrote:

You're a bloke, so why would there be a problem.

They have open days where you can go in as a non-Muslim woman with no head covering.   But for a woman to walk into a mosque with your head uncovered to pray?   I don't think so.

Would that be a respectful thing to do, though; i.e., would you barge into a wat or a synagogue and expect to be allowed to do what you wanted?

That's my point exactly.   You can't just go into these places as you are.     You can't show any Christian symbols either, so you'd be expected to remove your crucifix if you wore one.   I doubt very much a Muslim woman would be expected to remove her head covering if she chose to visit a church.    So, as a woman going into a mosque you'd have to conform.  But a man wouldn't because men don't.   They never have because they invented the religion in the first place.

Just as an aside...the clip below is the Golden age of Egyptian Dance.  Muslim women all of them.  

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