US Government kills another immigrant child

First topic message reminder :

Last time it was a 7-year old girl who died in the care of the US Border Patrol (management has removed story).  This time, it is an 8-year old Guatemalan boy., with equally grim details.

Border Patrol officials were advised of the boy's illness, but dismissed his symptoms as a common cold.  No special care, nor notice was given to him.  Through the night his symptoms worsened, but still no help.  In the morning he was declared dead.

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:You're not going to wriggle out of it that easily.

You're the one who is "wriggling", sweet cheeks.  Mine is to be indignant.  Get to the point!  How do you justify releasing a boy from the hospital when he has a 103° temperature?

Most healthy children and adults can tolerate a fever as high as 39.4°C (103°F) to 40°C (104°F) for short periods of time without problems.

What should you do if you have a fever of 103?
To treat a fever at home:
Drink plenty of fluids to stay hydrated.
Dress in lightweight clothing.
Use a light blanket if you feel chilled, until the chills end.
Take acetaminophen (Tylenol, others) or ibuprofen (Advil, Motrin IB, others). Follow the directions on the label.

>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:

nicko wrote:Bullshit Quill,   your always trying to put your Government down.   Don't you like being an American,or is just because Trump is in charge ?

Trump is the most profoundly un-American president America has had in decades, maybe even ever.

That's not really a condemnation, is it?

HoratioTarr wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Who releases a child from a hospital while he is exhibiting a 103° temperature?  Please don't tell me that wasn't intentional.  It's like a blaring siren going off.  It would be patent malpractice in any other situation.

So, what was the purpose behind intentionally giving a child such substandard medical care?  Riddle me that!  

Sadly, this kind of thing isn't unique to the US

I recognize that there are lots of third-world countries in which this, and much more goes on. This is a part of the startling impact of what we are seeing here.

The US has prided itself in being a first-world country--it invented the mold--and to see its standards deteriorate so much under Trump is painful for most Americans. Trump has brought to the fore three things about the US: it is a racist nation, it is not a democracy, and it is not a nation of laws. That aptly categorizes the US as a third-world country.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

You're the one who is "wriggling", sweet cheeks.  Mine is to be indignant.  Get to the point!  How do you justify releasing a boy from the hospital when he has a 103° temperature?

Most healthy children and adults can tolerate a fever as high as 39.4°C (103°F) to 40°C (104°F) for short periods of time without problems.

What should you do if you have a fever of 103?
To treat a fever at home:
Drink plenty of fluids to stay hydrated.
Dress in lightweight clothing.
Use a light blanket if you feel chilled, until the chills end.
Take acetaminophen (Tylenol, others) or ibuprofen (Advil, Motrin IB, others). Follow the directions on the label.

And if you are in a hospital, don't let them kick you out!!!

They didn't "kick him out", his Father took him out !

Lurker wrote:Raggamuffin, why are you just trying to put lipstick on a pig? This boy died because of donald trump's inhumane treatment of human beings. This is the second child he has killed. Trump is directly responsible. The man is a filthy piece of shit.

The boy wasn't treated inhumanely. He was taken to hospital when he became ill. Trump didn't kill the kid - I presume he died of natural causes.

HoratioTarr wrote:

>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:

nicko wrote:Bullshit Quill,   your always trying to put your Government down.   Don't you like being an American,or is just because Trump is in charge ?

Trump is the most profoundly un-American president America has had in decades, maybe even ever.

That's not really a condemnation, is it?

It is, you just don't understand America.

America is about the balance of powers between different branches in the government, about the rights enshrined in the Constitution, about welcoming people from all corners of the world and about making one nation out of people from many different cultures.

Trump doesn't understand most of that and hates the rest of it.

Lurker wrote:Trump worshipers seem to believe that Hispanics aren't human beings. That is good Nazi brain washing.

You mean because they're not white? That's strange because when Zimmerman was on trial, he was referred to as white.

nicko wrote:They didn't "kick him out", his Father took him out !

He was in custody. Regardless of who accompanied him, he was effectively in bondage and under arrest. He was under the aegis and captivity of Border Patrol officers who have large and intimidating sidearms. They bring no attorneys to help the man make decisions.

I know that agencies love to say they consulted the parent, or make it appear that the parent was in charge, but that largely means that they told the father to do as they said or they would kick the shit out of him as soon as they were out of sight. Or, more likely, that he would never see the boy again. The shortest way from point A to point B is a straight line. Cops don't waste time on rights or consent issues.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Lurker wrote:Trump worshipers seem to believe that Hispanics aren't human beings. That is good Nazi brain washing.

You mean because they're not white? That's strange because when Zimmerman was on trial, he was referred to  as white.

Racism in the US is a bit more complex in the western states. Instead of a bi-ethnic society, it is a tri-ethnic society. Florida has joined Texas, New Mexico, Arizona and California in this situation, because of the influx of Cubans in the 50's and 60's. Zimmerman is Cuban.

The racial status of the black is still, and inevitably on the bottom. The Hispanic is both the recipient and the perp of racism, depending on who is confronted. Regardless, white supremacists, including Trump, sit on top of the heap and regard all people of color as beneath them.

It is called white-nationalism because they would like to see America as a pure white race and no one else. We'll deal with Native Americans after we expel the Blacks, Jews and Hispanics, they say.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Lurker wrote:Raggamuffin, why are you just trying to put lipstick on a pig? This boy died because of donald trump's inhumane treatment of human beings. This is the second child he has killed. Trump is directly responsible. The man is a filthy piece of shit.

The boy wasn't treated inhumanely. He was taken to hospital when he became ill. Trump didn't kill the kid - I presume he died of natural causes.

He was removed from life-saving care when he had a 103° temperature, and he died as a result. I, along with most Americans throughout America, would consider that inhumane.

Raggamuffin wrote:Well they shouldn't prescribe antibiotics just in case. That's how bacteria is becoming drug resistant.

I agree.  We have ruined the original program of antibiotics by over-utilizing the drugs, allowing the organisms to develop a resistance.  By attacking them we have eventually built up their capacity to resist.

Incidentally, we've done the same to Muslim terrorist forces in the Lavant, in much the same way.  But we can discuss that elsewhere.

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

The boy wasn't treated inhumanely. He was taken to hospital when he became ill. Trump didn't kill the kid - I presume he died of natural causes.

He was removed from life-saving care when he had a 103° temperature, and he died as a result.  I, along with most Americans throughout America, would consider that inhumane.

He was released from hospital, like many children and adults are. You don't know what he died of. I doubt he died just because he had a high temperature. Many people who are at home with high temperatures don't die, and they don't go to hospital. Clearly, he had something more serious than suspected, but he was diagnosed with a common cold, like millions of other people who are not in custody. What about all the others who have been released from hospital and then died of meningitis, flu complications, sepsis, etc? Do you only care about immigrants?

>THE Ben Reilly< wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

That's not really a condemnation, is it?

It is, you just don't understand America.

America is about the balance of powers between different branches in the government, about the rights enshrined in the Constitution, about welcoming people from all corners of the world and about making one nation out of people from many different cultures.

Trump doesn't understand most of that and hates the rest of it.

You mean past American presidents uphold all that? They must be pretty thin on the ground?

James Buchanan – Didn’t believe black people should be allowed citizenship.

Franklin Pierce – Remembered for 1.) trying to expand slavery into Kansas and Nebraska; 2.) nothing else.

Andrew Jackson – Slave trader. Slaughterer of Native Americans.

Millard Fillmore - Signed the Fugitive Slave Act, which required that escaped slaves be returned to their masters.

William Henry Harrison – Tried to officially legalise slavery in Indiana when he served as governor of the territory.

Richard Nixon – obliterated any chance of anyone ever trusting the federal government again

Bill Clinton – Walking personal disaster with a shady political legacy.

Dwight D. Eisenhower – When people say “Make America Great Again,” they’re talking about returning to the Eisenhower administration of the 1950s. It was positively utopic – unless you were black, Hispanic, LGBT or a woman.

Gerald Ford - General public speculation Ford and Nixon struck some kind of corrupt agreement behind closed doors.

Chester Arthur - His administration enacted the first immigration law, which excluded Chinese people as well as paupers, criminals, and lunatics.

George W Bush - Invaded Iraq like the buffoon he was.

Ronald Reagan - His administration prepared a plan to sell arms to Iran and invest money in the activities of the Contras in Nicaragua. Failed miserably, and tainted Reagan for a lifetime.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

He was removed from life-saving care when he had a 103° temperature, and he died as a result.  I, along with most Americans throughout America, would consider that inhumane.

He was released from hospital, like many children and adults are. You don't know what he died of. I doubt he died just because he had a high temperature. Many people who are at home with high temperatures don't die, and they don't go to hospital. Clearly, he had something more serious than suspected, but he was diagnosed with a common cold, like millions of other people who are not in custody. What about all the others who have been released from hospital and then died of meningitis, flu complications, sepsis, etc? Do you only care about immigrants?

This is probably closest to the truth. The poor kid probably had some underlying disease or condition.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

He was removed from life-saving care when he had a 103° temperature, and he died as a result.  I, along with most Americans throughout America, would consider that inhumane.

He was released from hospital, like many children and adults are. You don't know what he died of. I doubt he died just because he had a high temperature. Many people who are at home with high temperatures don't die, and they don't go to hospital. Clearly, he had something more serious than suspected, but he was diagnosed with a common cold, like millions of other people who are not in custody. What about all the others who have been released from hospital and then died of meningitis, flu complications, sepsis, etc? Do you only care about immigrants?

You have completely missed the point...no doubt deliberately.  It always amazes me how conservative will sacrifice the lives of children rather than lose a political point.  These deaths are the result of Trump and his politics.

The boy had a 103° temperature.  A medical professional would never, never, never, never, never, never, release a patient with a 103° temperature, unless from high orders from a law enforcement official pertaining to a prisoner.

We have had many, many more migrants processes across the border than in 2018...in 2014 and 2016, under Obama, for example, thousands upon thousands more were processed.  In between, for decades, there have been as many as this year.

Yet, never, never have we had a child die in the custody of the Border Patrol.  Now, suddenly, we have two children in a couple of weeks.  The Trump administration, and the US Border Patrol, have been doing everything they can to physically harm children--separating families and putting children in cages.  I have no doubt they are doing something to cause these deaths.  In law we have a doctrine of res ipsa loquitur, which means "the thing speaks for itself".  It infers wrongdoing from the very nature of an accident or injury, in the absence of direct evidence on how any defendant behaved.  These guys have some answers to give.

When Congress finds out the specifics next year, when the Democrats take control, I have no doubt some officials will be going to prison for their deliberate actions.  Trump is already 3/4's there, but I would like to see child abuse added to charges against him. Perhaps criminal charges for child rape. https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-rape-case_us_581a31a5e4b0c43e6c1d9834

For fucks sake, the Father took him out of Hospital and refused further treatment, instead of talking down your Government ALL the time, try reporting the truth for once !

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

He was released from hospital, like many children and adults are. You don't know what he died of. I doubt he died just because he had a high temperature. Many people who are at home with high temperatures don't die, and they don't go to hospital. Clearly, he had something more serious than suspected, but he was diagnosed with a common cold, like millions of other people who are not in custody. What about all the others who have been released from hospital and then died of meningitis, flu complications, sepsis, etc? Do you only care about immigrants?

You have completely missed the point...no doubt deliberately.  It always amazes me how conservative will sacrifice the lives of children rather than lose a political point.  These deaths are the result of Trump and his politics.

The boy had a 103° temperature.  A medical professional would never, never, never, never, never, never, release a patient with a 103° temperature, unless from high orders from a law enforcement official pertaining to a prisoner.

We have had many, many more migrants processes across the border than in 2018...in 2014 and 2016, under Obama, for example, thousands upon thousands more were processed.  In between, for decades, there have been as many as this year.

Yet, never, never have we had a child die in the custody of the Border Patrol.  Now, suddenly, we have two children in a couple of weeks.  The Trump administration, and the US Border Patrol, have been doing everything they can to physically harm children--separating families and putting children in cages.  I have no doubt they are doing something to cause these deaths.  In law we have a doctrine of res ipsa loquitur, which means "the thing speaks for itself".  It infers wrongdoing from the very nature of an accident or injury, in the absence of direct evidence on how any defendant behaved.  These guys have some answers to give.

When Congress finds out the specifics next year, when the Democrats take control, I have no doubt some officials will be going to prison for their deliberate actions.  Trump is already 3/4's there, but I would like to see child abuse added to charges against him.  Perhaps criminal charges for child rape.  https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-rape-case_us_581a31a5e4b0c43e6c1d9834

It's you who's missing the point Quill - because you're so obsessed with this.

Can you prove they're causing these deaths? If they want to kill children, it's a bit vague to say - oh here's a kid with a cold, if we neglect him/her maybe he/she will die. Come on Quill, people get released from hospital and then die - either because something was missed or they developed something afterwards.

How are you going to send a border official to prison for sending a kid to hospital Quill? Good luck with that.

+1

Raggamuffin wrote:Can you prove they're causing these deaths? If they want to kill children, it's a bit vague to say - oh here's a kid with a cold, if we neglect him/her maybe he/she will die. Come on Quill, people get released from hospital and then die - either because something was missed or they developed something afterwards.

Learn to recognize an incident in a greater movement or trend.  To Trump, the lives of these children are inconsequential…they are little morsels of brown-skinned trash that he’d rather not have around.  For him, that’s the agent of death.

But what is really being extinguished is the idea that their lives matter.  At some point in the progression of all genocides, there occurs the transition from caring to robotic killing.  If you don’t recognize and catch that point at the beginning, by the time you do come to grips with it it’s too overwhelming.

“Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak…”  — Martin Niemöller

Whether these children are being murdered or merely allowed to die is merely a matter of degree.  What is more important is the growing mold that permits this acceptance of death.  The demise of caring is, at some point, a form of murder.  This is really racism versus Christian charity.  Bigotry versus humanity.  

Raggamuffin wrote:How are you going to send a border official to prison for sending a kid to hospital Quill? Good luck with that.

I hope there is some evidence around that exemplifies how these children died.  Then a jury will pass judgment, not only on the act, but the callousness that caused the deaths.

Your off your nut, your hate of him clouds your judgment !

nicko wrote:Your off your nut, your hate of him clouds your judgment !

To the contrary, my judgement of Trump leads to my criticism of him. The facts have led to my judgment...and yes, it's not very flattering.

I really don't see how Trump can be blamed for children falling ill. Children do die you know. You probably don't hear about most of them because they're not immigrants.

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

He was released from hospital, like many children and adults are. You don't know what he died of. I doubt he died just because he had a high temperature. Many people who are at home with high temperatures don't die, and they don't go to hospital. Clearly, he had something more serious than suspected, but he was diagnosed with a common cold, like millions of other people who are not in custody. What about all the others who have been released from hospital and then died of meningitis, flu complications, sepsis, etc? Do you only care about immigrants?

You have completely missed the point...no doubt deliberately.  It always amazes me how conservative will sacrifice the lives of children rather than lose a political point.  These deaths are the result of Trump and his politics.

The boy had a 103° temperature.  A medical professional would never, never, never, never, never, never, release a patient with a 103° temperature, unless from high orders from a law enforcement official pertaining to a prisoner.

We have had many, many more migrants processes across the border than in 2018...in 2014 and 2016, under Obama, for example, thousands upon thousands more were processed.  In between, for decades, there have been as many as this year.

Yet, never, never have we had a child die in the custody of the Border Patrol.  Now, suddenly, we have two children in a couple of weeks.  The Trump administration, and the US Border Patrol, have been doing everything they can to physically harm children--separating families and putting children in cages.  I have no doubt they are doing something to cause these deaths.  In law we have a doctrine of res ipsa loquitur, which means "the thing speaks for itself".  It infers wrongdoing from the very nature of an accident or injury, in the absence of direct evidence on how any defendant behaved.  These guys have some answers to give.

When Congress finds out the specifics next year, when the Democrats take control, I have no doubt some officials will be going to prison for their deliberate actions.  Trump is already 3/4's there, but I would like to see child abuse added to charges against him.  Perhaps criminal charges for child rape.  https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/donald-trump-rape-case_us_581a31a5e4b0c43e6c1d9834

A simple cold or other viral infection can sometimes cause a rather high fever (in the 102°–104°F/38.9°–40°C range), but this doesn't usually mean there's a serious problem.

https://m.kidshealth.org/CHW/en/parents/fever.html

If the father refused further help, what can the hospital do? From what I've read, it wasn't the father who took the child to the hospital.

According to reports, the boy had the influenza B virus - ie, flu. I don't think the officials or Trump gave him flu.

Raggamuffin wrote:According to reports, the boy had the influenza B virus - ie, flu. I don't think the officials or Trump gave him flu.

No, they just didn't care that he was dying with a 103° temperature.  I know you don't think that is the government's fault, but could the child walk away?  No, he was in custody.  Who else is going to care for him?

Under the circumstances, they killed that child and the one before.  Two children, in a two month period.  They have no right taking people into custody when they cannot care for them...that means giving them decent healthcare.  The Border Patrol has never before had a detainee die in custody, and they have had a much greater influx of asylum seekers that in 2018.  Clearly, they fooked up this time, and it is attributable to the attitude of this administration.

They need to be disbanded as a quasi-criminal enterprise.

Original Quill wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:According to reports, the boy had the influenza B virus - ie, flu. I don't think the officials or Trump gave him flu.

No, they just didn't care that he was dying with a 103° temperature.  I know you don't think that is the government's fault, but could the child walk away?  No, he was in custody.  Who else is going to care for him?

Under the circumstances, they killed that child and the one before.  Two children, in a two month period.  They have no right taking people into custody when they cannot care for them...that means giving them decent healthcare.  The Border Patrol has never before had a detainee die in custody, and they have had a much greater influx of asylum seekers that in 2018.  Clearly, they fooked up this time, and it is attributable to the attitude of this administration.

They need to be disbanded as a quasi-criminal enterprise.

I doubt that Trump knew that a kid in hospital had a temperature.

If two children elsewhere in the country died within months of each other, would you blame that on Trump too?

It was the hospital who missed the signs of flu, and that's not uncommon. Doctors are human too you know. Also, most children who get flu don't die of it, and some do, whether they're in hospital or not. We still don't know the cause of death, we only know that he had a virus which many other people get.

I simply don't get why you're blaming people for a child getting a virus. Are you actually going to suggest that they injected him with it or something?

The Father was offered treatment for the child, he refused and took the child away . Couldn't be any clearer. Fathers to blame , end of !

nicko wrote:The Father was offered treatment for the child, he refused and took the child away .   Couldn't be any clearer.   Fathers to blame , end of !

The father did not take the child away.  The father was under arrest and in custody, same as the child.  Do you think America allows prisoners to roam free?

No, especially not Trump with people of color. America believes all people of color belong in prison...and is attempting to achieve that goal!

That's a little over the top Quill !

Original Quill wrote:

nicko wrote:The Father was offered treatment for the child, he refused and took the child away .   Couldn't be any clearer.   Fathers to blame , end of !

The father did not take the child away.  The father was under arrest and in custody, same as the child.  Do you think America allows prisoners to roam free?

No, especially not Trump with people of color.  America believes all people of color belong in prison...and is attempting to achieve that goal!

I guess that's why America had a black President for 8 years

HoratioTarr wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

The father did not take the child away.  The father was under arrest and in custody, same as the child.  Do you think America allows prisoners to roam free?

No, especially not Trump with people of color.  America believes all people of color belong in prison...and is attempting to achieve that goal!

I guess that's why America had a black President for 8 years

Dr. Obama is a very popular individual.  And, he is half-white, making him still more acceptable to the race conscious.  Still, look at the hostility he engendered merely because of his race.  Birtherism?  Muslim?  Terrorist?  So many lies; so little time.  That didn't come from nowhere.

America has always fixated, and had a problem with race.  Even many who voted for Obama did so as a counter-reaction to America's issue with race.  It was only after he was in office that people realized what a brilliant, self-assured leader he was.

Nonetheless, reaction set in.  The divisiveness we see today with Trump and Republican Mitch McConnell, originated as disappointment that a black man was elected to lead OUR white nation.  McConnell started the Boehner/McConnell doctrine, whereby America would shut down as long as a black was president; as a result, he refused to allow Obama his constitutional right to appoint Merritt Garland to the Supreme Court.  Trump's slogan, Make America Great Again, started out as Make America White Again. And of course, we saw the culmination of it in Charlottesville.

For six years, Dr. Obama had to govern with a hostile Congress, that was obsessed with repealing his signature legislation, the ACA, and otherwise shut down America.  Obama's greatness had to overcome all of that bigoted opposition.

We still see vestiges of subliminal racism reminiscent of Jim Crow laws, with modern voter suppression laws.  We witness sustained segregation in companies like Starbucks and Doubletree Inn, calling police to boot out black, well paying guests.  Yes, America has a problem with black skin.  Not all of America, of course--California and the northeast are wonderful exceptions--but enough to provoke a double-take (no pun intended).

The filthy "right" vilified President Obama at every turn.  No, he is NOT a Muslim. YES, he was born in the US. The low-life lies from Fox Propaganda keep republicans brainwashed 24 hours a day. A republican evidently isn't intelligent enough to think for him or herself. Every word out of Donald Trump's mouth is ether a bald-faced lie or a gross embellishment of the truth. Obama was the best President in my lifetime. Republicans are idiots.

Horatio Troll, Ragamuffin-top and Gelli-belli-co have all been so overly keen to demonstrate that their ignorantly rancid, self-entitled white-supremacist inherent racism is still just as entrenched and rampant at the end of this year as it was at tthe beginning...

How dare a trio of upstart colonial Yankees attempt to set them straight with some actual real world hometruths in place of the Eurocentric neo-nazi claptrap they keep on parroting in return..

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Horatio Troll, Ragamuffin-top and Gelli-belli-co have all been so overly keen to demonstrate that their ignorantly rancid, self-entitled white-supremacist inherent racism is still just as entrenched and rampant at the end of this year as it was at tthe beginning...

How dare a trio of upstart colonial Yankees attempt to set them straight with some actual real world hometruths in place of the Eurocentric neo-nazi claptrap they keep on parroting in return..

Apologies in advance but I have to say:
Oh do shut up, you reactionary old fool!
You sound like Citizen Smith on a bad day.

Vintage wrote:

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Horatio Troll, Ragamuffin-top and Gelli-belli-co have all been so overly keen to demonstrate that their ignorantly rancid, self-entitled white-supremacist inherent racism is still just as entrenched and rampant at the end of this year as it was at tthe beginning...

How dare a trio of upstart colonial Yankees attempt to set them straight with some actual real world hometruths in place of the Eurocentric neo-nazi claptrap they keep on parroting in return..

Apologies in advance but I have to say:
Oh do shut up, you reactionary old fool!
You sound like Citizen Smith on a bad day.

""Reactionary"...

I'm not the "reactionary" here, you dirt-ignorant turd..

Your xenophobic chums are the true "reactionaries" on this forum  --   you show a poor understanding of the English language for a Brit'.

And you seem to be a decade or so older than me, to boot..

Still, I s'pose one-out-of-three isn't too bad for your puny illiterate efforts at insulting me...    

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Horatio Troll, Ragamuffin-top and Gelli-belli-co have all been so overly keen to demonstrate that their ignorantly rancid, self-entitled white-supremacist inherent racism is still just as entrenched and rampant at the end of this year as it was at tthe beginning...

How dare a trio of upstart colonial Yankees attempt to set them straight with some actual real world hometruths in place of the Eurocentric neo-nazi claptrap they keep on parroting in return..

I see you having to nothing to say as usual. Do you think that Trump made the child ill? Come on, let's hear your wild theories.

No Wolf you are the epitome of reactionary, you react every time with the same predictive nastiness if anyone dares to have a different view.
As for old there's old in years and there's old in attitude, I may have the edge in years -------

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Vintage wrote:

Apologies in advance but I have to say:
Oh do shut up, you reactionary old fool!
You sound like Citizen Smith on a bad day.

""Reactionary"...

I'm not that the "reactionary" here, you dirt-ignorant turd..

Your xenophobic chums are the true "reactionaries" on this forum  --   you show a poor understanding of the English language for a Brit'.

And you seem to be a decade or so older than me, to boot..

Still, I s'pose one-out-of-three isn't too bad for your puny illiterate efforts at insulting me...    

It's not our fault you're a wimp in RL, a weak kneed wallflower with confidence/assertive issues. Acting the big hard man on here compensates for your lack, I suppose. Perhaps you should just learn to be more 'forum' in real life, then you'll feel better about yourself.

So yet again Quill uses the death of a child to score political points

The child died of flu.

Now, I know for a fact, that not only does Quill not understand a single thing about medical conditions. But again he is using the death of this child, to attempt to bring down Trump. I mean that is his intent, judged by the lunancy of his replies.

So in the hopsital, the child was diagnosed with a cold. In all likely hood the same would have been diagnosed in Guatemala. If of course they had access to health care. If not, then sadly the boy would again still have died. There is a high 10% death rate with influenza in Guatemala.  

Which no doubt sadly effects more children and elderly. Placing them at further risk of complications. The chances are also as high. That on the first examination. No medical tests were done for flu. Which would be the case with many US citizens. Where though US children, would have a far higher survival rate. This boy, based on the number of deaths with influnenza. Means parents are yet again placing unecessarily placing children at risk. With the complications of medical conditions like Flu. So even if diagnosed with a cold. Medical staff would advise to seek further medical assistance. If the systmptoms did not improve or got worse. This would have been the same with also US citizens. The only difference being that many of these migrants will be in many cases suffering from Malnutrition. So unless the US is willining to spend hundreds of Millions building more hospitals and paying for more doctors. In these areas. Then based again on the massive influx of migrants. Then of course sadly the risk will remain high. That some will sadly die, from medical conditions. As there is not enough facilities or trained people to cope. Where many are already at higher risk, based on their weaker immune systems, based on a poor diet, due to poverty.

There is very little that could have been done for this boy. If he had not have been taken into custody, he would have sadly died from the Flu. The view to automatically cast blame. When the US border Patrols are inundated with migrants. Where even more so they are not going to clearly be in as good health as American citizens. Means also this places an unworkable burden on the Hospital facilities. To cope with such a high number of immigrants.

Vintage wrote:No Wolf you are the epitome of reactionary, you react every time with the same predictive nastiness if anyone dares to have a different view.
As for old there's old in years and there's old in attitude, I may have the edge in years -------

Do fuck off, you pathetic old troll...

You are far, far more "reactionary" than I have ever been..

You, gelico, Ragga', Horatio, Tommy and co. are the ones who always react in the same conservative, self-centered, cruel-hearted, materialistic and inhumane manner on these topics..

At least I am concer ed over what is happeni g to our planet --  something I have yet to witness with you motley little lot..

Just ask any fair-minded and genuine human being on here.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Vintage wrote:No Wolf you are the epitome of reactionary, you react every time with the same predictive nastiness if anyone dares to have a different view.
As for old there's old in years and there's old in attitude, I may have the edge in years -------

Do fuck off, you pathetic old troll...

You are far, far more "reactionary" than I have ever been..

You, gelico, Ragga', Horatio, Tommy and co. are the ones who always react in the same conservative, self-centered, cruel-hearted, materialistic and inhumane manner on these topics..

Just ask any fair-minded and genuine human being on here.

You attacked Horatio, Vintage, Rags and Gelico with nothing more that pure rancid hate

It seems, that because they have an opinion, which leaves you flapping like a child. Where given the opportunity. You could instead respond by countering them. You fail to do so and offer up, some of the worst paranoia and unfounded accusations. Claiming they are "white supremacists"

If you for one second stopped looking at any reasonable criticism of Quills quite poor and underhanded views on Here. Which of course have a clear and stated agenda. To attempt to bring down a Presidency, based off the unfortunate deaths of two immigrants. You would see, it is you blatantly spouting hate and ignorance here.

At no point did you actually tackle any of their views. 

Instead you again chose to invoke the victimology strategy

What exactly has been white supremacy here or xenophobic in any of the views expressed by Horatio, Vintage Gelico and Rags?

You continually do, as you always do. Offer no substance and reason, but attempt to deligitimize posters.

So there was nothing fair minded or genuine about your replies

They were in fact bog standard

So here is again my views, which rubbish the lunacy that Quill claims. Mainly as he is so badly biased and filled with hate. He is incapable of looking at any of these cases with impartiality. Again his intent is very clear. He again cares nothing for the deaths, but only to use their deaths. In order to stoke up hate and lies. In the view to hope this brings down trump

The very fact about 11 million children die each year. Without a passing thought by Quill. Proves that the safety and well being of children, is certainly not at the for front of his thinking

Now here is my points again. Stop with the trash talk and actually try answering them

So yet again Quill uses the death of a child to score political points

The child died of flu.

Now, I know for a fact, that not only does Quill not understand a single thing about medical conditions. But again he is using the death of this child, to attempt to bring down Trump. I mean that is his intent, judged by the lunancy of his replies.

So in the hopsital, the child was diagnosed with a cold. In all likely hood the same would have been diagnosed in Guatemala. If of course they had access to health care. If not, then sadly the boy would again still have died. There is a high 10% death rate with influenza in Guatemala.  

Which no doubt sadly effects more children and elderly. Placing them at further risk of complications. The chances are also as high. That on the first examination. No medical tests were done for flu. Which would be the case with many US citizens. Where though US children, would have a far higher survival rate. This boy, based on the number of deaths with influnenza. Means parents are yet again placing unecessarily placing children at risk. With the complications of medical conditions like Flu. So even if diagnosed with a cold. Medical staff would advise to seek further medical assistance. If the systmptoms did not improve or got worse. This would have been the same with also US citizens. The only difference being that many of these migrants will be in many cases suffering from Malnutrition. So unless the US is willining to spend hundreds of Millions building more hospitals and paying for more doctors. In these areas. Then based again on the massive influx of migrants. Then of course sadly the risk will remain high. That some will sadly die, from medical conditions. As there is not enough facilities or trained people to cope. Where many are already at higher risk, based on their weaker immune systems, based on a poor diet, due to poverty.

There is very little that could have been done for this boy. If he had not have been taken into custody, he would have sadly died from the Flu. The view to automatically cast blame. When the US border Patrols are inundated with migrants. Where even more so they are not going to clearly be in as good health as American citizens. Means also this places an unworkable burden on the Hospital facilities. To cope with such a high number of immigrants.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

Vintage wrote:No Wolf you are the epitome of reactionary, you react every time with the same predictive nastiness if anyone dares to have a different view.
As for old there's old in years and there's old in attitude, I may have the edge in years -------

Do fuck off, you pathetic old troll...

You are far, far more "reactionary" than I have ever been..

You, gelico, Ragga', Horatio, Tommy and co. are the ones who always react in the same conservative, self-centered, cruel-hearted, materialistic and inhumane manner on these topics..

At least I am concer ed over what is happeni g to our planet --  something I have yet to witness with you motley little lot..

Just ask any fair-minded and genuine human being on here.

What happened to your "n"?

At least I am concer ed over what is happeni g to our planet -- something I have yet to witness with you motley little lot..

Oh dear, you really haven't been paying attention have you, too much anger to take notice of what others say?

Didge wrote:So here is again my views, which rubbish the lunacy that Quill claims. Mainly as he is so badly biased and filled with hate. He is incapable of looking at any of these cases with impartiality. Again his intent is very clear. He again cares nothing for the deaths, but only to use their deaths. In order to stoke up hate and lies. In the view to hope this brings down trump

Didge, you are self-projecting again.

Original Quill wrote:

Didge wrote:So here is again my views, which rubbish the lunacy that Quill claims. Mainly as he is so badly biased and filled with hate. He is incapable of looking at any of these cases with impartiality. Again his intent is very clear. He again cares nothing for the deaths, but only to use their deaths. In order to stoke up hate and lies. In the view to hope this brings down trump

Didge, you are self-projecting again.

Self-projecting?

I thought, it was very much, educating on basic medical understanding for you.

Considering, you evaded everything I reasoned. I will simple have to view that. As confirmation to my points and your lack of medical understanding mate.

Didge wrote:The very fact about 11 million children die each year. Without a passing thought by Quill. Proves that the safety and well being of children, is certainly not at the for front of his thinking

The 11-million children, or however many there are, are not in my government's care and custody.

You may have your carelessness. For me, when my government takes someone--particularly a child--into custody, there exists an implicit contract that everything that can be done will be done for the well-being of that child.

The callousness that led to the death of these children means that those in charge are, at the very least, incompetent...and perhaps much more.

Thor wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

Didge, you are self-projecting again.

Self-projecting?

I thought, it was very much, educating on basic medical understanding for you [sic].

Considering, you evaded everything I reasoned. I will simple [sic] have to view that [sic]. As confirmation to my points [sic] and your lack of medical understanding mate [sic].

You reasoned?     You can't even construct a sentence or paragraph, let alone a cogent thought.  

Original Quill wrote:

Didge wrote:The very fact about 11 million children die each year. Without a passing thought by Quill. Proves that the safety and well being of children, is certainly not at the for front of his thinking

The 11-million children, or however many there are, are not in my government's care and custody.

You may have your carelessness.  For me, when my government takes someone--particularly a child--into custody, there exists an implicit contract that everything that can be done will be done for the well-being of that child.

The callousness that led to the death of these children means that those in charge are, at the very least, incompetent...and perhaps much more.

Which your first point shows how illiberal you are. Surely, every living being on this planet. Is within the grasp of care of every nation?

As why as have climate change coordination with nations?

The contract was fulffilled. This child was cared for. What you failed to factor, was so many things.

For one, most children released after being given anti-biotics and neurofen. To counter the cold and fever. Would have been placed in the very same situation as this child. Some may have had further tests. Dependent on their health insurance. This child, would have never even seen inside a hospital, if not for the fact. His parent placed him at unecessary risk. Without being placed in custody. This child, never would have seen any such medical care in his home country. 

There was no way to prodict, even more so based offf yet again. The childs rapid deterioration. Which had nothing to do with any US procedures. It had everything to do with the fact this child. Like so many in Guatemala and living in poverty. Are malnourished, which vastly effects their immune system. Hence sadly this child was already a walking time bomb.

Your issue should not be on what the US could have done medically. It should be what on the US being able to do for Guatemala. Yet, you fail to look past your nose, to what is the most obvious answer to this problem. To empower and make the lives of many people in Guatemala bettter. Yet no Repbulican or Democrat President has actually. Ever truely done that

The only thing calllous, is your need to invent and make up gibberish, to fit a warped and hateful agenda you have.

Its like I say, you care nothing for the millions of children that die yearly. They are all and should be in the care of all nations. Its all our responsibility. Unless you live by imaginary walls, to seperate us?

Original Quill wrote:

Thor wrote:


Self-projecting?

I thought, it was very much, educating on basic medical understanding for you [sic].

Considering, you evaded everything I reasoned. I will simple [sic] have to view that [sic]. As confirmation to my points [sic] and your lack of medical understanding mate [sic].

You reasoned?     You can't even construct a sentence or paragraph, let alone a cogent thought.  

Is that why you have avoided all my points like the plague?

Seriously, stop wasting my time.

If you cannot answer my points. Then stop making poor excuses.