You're all a bit Gay

YOU may think you’re only attracted to the opposite sex, but strictly straight people don’t exist, according to a psychologist.

It turns out we’re all bisexual, getting turned on by both men and women, regardless of what we say.

Researchers from Cornell University asked volunteers to watch a series of porn videos to test what turned them on and what didn’t.

Their research questions society’s strict definitions of sexuality and warns that we still struggle with the idea of bisexuality, especially when it comes to men.

Lead author Rich Savin-Williams suggests that sexuality exists on a spectrum and that younger generations are more open to the idea of fluid sexuality than older adults.

Both male and female volunteers were asked to watch porn involving men or women as part of the research.

Experts measured how much their pupils dilated — a sign of sexual arousal.

Women’s eyes dilated watching both men with women and women with women.

And men’s pupils dilated watching both men and women masturbate, regardless of how they identified sexually.


Dr Savin-Williams warned that cultural expectations of sexuality need to change in order for people to be more comfortable with who they are attracted to.

“We’ve always recognised mostly straight women, that is, women who mostly are straight but if the right woman comes along, well maybe she’ll try it out. We used to think that was only a female phenomenon,” Dr Savin-Williams told Broadly.

“There are aspects [of male sexuality] along a continuum, just as we have always recognised with women.

“Men have gotten so much cultural c**p put on them that even if a man does have some sexual attraction to guys, they would never say it.”

Previous research has suggested that women’s sexuality can change throughout their life.

Psychologist Dr Lisa Diamond of the University of Utah said it was not always the case that “once a lesbian, always a lesbian”.

She added: “Historically, sexual orientation models assumed only two categories, exclusively homosexual and exclusively heterosexual.

“Anything else is ‘transitional’, ‘confusion’, ‘experimental’. As a result, researchers routinely eliminated bisexual individuals from research samples. Big mistake.”

Surveys show more people identify themselves as “mostly-but-not completely heterosexual” than exclusively heterosexual. The smallest group is those that are exclusively attracted to the same sex.

But other research has found that being gay is written in your DNA.

US researchers from NorthShore University in Illinois found sections of genes that may influence whether a man is gay or straight.

They scanned the DNA of 1,100 gay and 1,200 straight men and found two distinct areas of genes they believe play a part in male sexual orientation.

Rich Savin-Williams has written a book, Mostly Straight: Sexual Fluidity Among Men that follows on from the research.

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/relationships/sex/according-to-a-new-study-straight-people-dont-exist/news-story/02721771c94ea0937bb2e4e3da36cfd4

Eilzel wrote:

Didge wrote:

Behave, now you are backtracking



Its very clear that a proportion of men who class themselves as gay have been attracted to women. The above shows this even more so. Where you were trying to claim they constantly faked this day in and day out. To me that is bullshit mate and that they clearly were sexually attracted to their wives. Where again and like I say, they simple and heavily prefer sex with the same sex

No one is backtracking, you seem to be confused.

Didge wrote:Lol so now I am confused? Really?

Find me one post where I denied the existence of bisexuality or suggested many people were not bisexual. Of course they are.

Didge wrote:How very defensive of you, when you argued constantly these men were gay and faking this with their wives

Nothing you have shown proves sexual attraction toward women from GAY men, even if married to them. The only evidence of that would be a gay man saying he was sexually attracted to his wife on whatever level. Yet you have shown nothing to suggest otherwise, and linked to a source which links to another page which does no show the data let alone where it was collected.

Didge wrote:Just having long term relationships and having sex with their female partners is not evidence for you?

Come again?

You think I need to have the opinion of someone who has lied throughout his relationship to his wife on this to be honest?

When its blatantly clear within dating them and asking them to marry, they certainly in some form were attracted to them phhsycially and sexually.

You can keep denying this all you want, but the evidence is there, that they have had sexual relationships with women. Now we can argue over whether it should be classed as bisexual and granted I will conceede, that there is many avenues on the spetrum of sexuality, but its very clear. Thorughout, that you have argued that these men were in the main faking this. I simple was never going to buy such a bullshit answer and no experince stories would change that

Does bisexuality exist? Yes, of course.
Do some bisexual people marry people of the opposite gender? Yes, obviously.
Are most gay men who married or marry women really bisexuals in denial? You have done nothing to show this to be the case for most, or even your mysterious '25%', so until you can, I won't reply further, or we'll just be going round it circles.

Eilzel wrote:

nicko wrote:Eilzel,  Imay have missed your reply on this, but have you ever had intercourse with a Woman ?

I mentioned by experience in a longer post above, nicko. I did, once. I hated it and wouldn't consider it again. It was before I came out and I just imagined she was someone else. Not a pleasant experience

Syl wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

nicko wrote:Eilzel,  Imay have missed your reply on this, but have you ever had intercourse with a Woman ?

I mentioned by experience in a longer post above, nicko. I did, once. I hated it and wouldn't consider it again. It was before I came out and I just imagined she was someone else. Not a pleasant experience

Your posts have been really interesting throughout this thread, so thanks.

I agree with everything you have said, speaking honestly from your own experiences and also giving your thoughtful  opinion on others.

I think people can come out with as many statistics as they like, maybe a good % of gay men have had relationships with women, that doesn't mean they were attracted to them sexually, as has been said, there are many ways men (and women) can do the motions without the feelings, and only they know whether they are gay, bi or straight.

If I was gay I would be a bit insulted to be called bi-sexual if I wasn't.
I am straight and no one has ever implied differently......so whats the difference?

Eilzel wrote:

Syl wrote:

Your posts have been really interesting throughout this thread, so thanks.

I agree with everything you have said, speaking honestly from your own experiences and also giving your thoughtful  opinion on others.

I think people can come out with as many statistics as they like, maybe a good % of gay men have had relationships with women, that doesn't mean they were attracted to them sexually, as has been said, there are many ways men (and women) can do the motions without the feelings, and only they know whether they are gay, bi or straight.

If I was gay I would be a bit insulted to be called bi-sexual if I wasn't.
I am straight and no one has ever implied differently......so whats the difference?

Exactly, it is so bizarre to have someone saying they know better than the people themselves what their sexuality is. All the more so since there is little reason to insist one is gay! Lol

Glad you've found it interesting, it isn't something I've talked much about.

Didge wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

Syl wrote:

Your posts have been really interesting throughout this thread, so thanks.

I agree with everything you have said, speaking honestly from your own experiences and also giving your thoughtful  opinion on others.

I think people can come out with as many statistics as they like, maybe a good % of gay men have had relationships with women, that doesn't mean they were attracted to them sexually, as has been said, there are many ways men (and women) can do the motions without the feelings, and only they know whether they are gay, bi or straight.

If I was gay I would be a bit insulted to be called bi-sexual if I wasn't.
I am straight and no one has ever implied differently......so whats the difference?

Exactly, it is so bizarre to have someone saying they know better than the people themselves what their sexuality is. All the more so since there is little reason to insist one is gay! Lol

Glad you've found it interesting, it isn't something I've talked much about.

I am sure many gay people have tantrums when its stated they are not 100% gay, because they used and absued women to lie. Of course nobody thinks about the women used here being victims here and sadly think of the men that lied to them as victims,. Which really is a warped and fucked up mentality

So nobody stated they know someones sexuality better. Which you being the little hurt victim here, think you are

Its about the realty men fucking women and being turned on to the point marrying them, clearly are not 100% gay

Hence why most of this lying men who fucked and abused women, are not 100% gay and quite frankly dickless

As in the west today and with gay rights, why are these twats still doing this to women?

Eilzel wrote:

Didge wrote:

I am sure many gay people have tantrums when its stated they are not 100% gay, because they used and absued women to lie. Of course nobody thinks about the women used here being victims here and sadly think of the men that lied to them as victims,. Which really is a warped and fucked up mentality

So nobody stated they know someones sexuality better. Which you being the little hurt victim here, think you are

Its about the realty men fucking women and being turned on to the point marrying them, clearly are not 100% gay

Hence why most of this lying men who fucked and abused women, are not 100% gay and quite frankly dickless

As in the west today and with gay rights, why are these twats still doing this to women?

I don't think it is happening all that much today, in the west at least. When it did happen, it is hardly rocket science working out why they did it. It isn't right, but nor is the situation which forced them in to it.

Didge wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

I don't think it is happening all that much today, in the west at least. When it did happen, it is hardly rocket science working out why they did it. It isn't right, but nor is the situation which forced them in to it.

Well tell my sister that, being as her life has been turned upside down, by the fact her husband has left her stating he has always been gay. Nobody forced him into this and that view is shockingingly ignorant to claim. When we have had gay rights for decades. Those doing this are gutless cowards in my book who live within the west. He certainly was attracted to my sister. Hence why I knew you were talking shit on this.

With the above you show how badly you are an apologist for this and say its not rocket science why they did. This is what disgusts me when people make piss poor excuses. There is no reason in this day and age to marry someone of the opposite sex in the west and maitain a lie, when they are gay. So dont give me bullshit about being forced. That is 100% a utter lie.

As seen you care more for the lying gay person here and not the real victim, the wife, my sister with her world torn apart

gelico wrote:

Didge wrote:

Well tell my sister that, being as her life has been turned upside down, by the fact her husband has left her stating he has always been gay. Nobody forced him into this and that view is shockingingly ignorant to claim. When we have had gay rights for decades. Those doing this are gutless cowards in my book who live within the west. He certainly was attracted to my sister. Hence why I knew you were talking shit on this.

With the above you show how badly you are an apologist for this and say its not rocket science why they did. This is what disgusts me when people make piss poor excuses. There is no reason in this day and age to marry someone of the opposite sex in the west and maitain a lie, when they are gay. So dont give me bullshit about being forced. That is 100% a utter lie.

As seen you care more for the lying gay person here and not the real victim, the wife, my sister with her world torn apart

OMG!  I'm so sorry for your sister, didge.  What a terrible thing to go through for a woman.  Had they been married long?  and did they have any children?  you didn't mention that

Didge wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

Didge wrote:

I am sure many gay people have tantrums when its stated they are not 100% gay, because they used and absued women to lie. Of course nobody thinks about the women used here being victims here and sadly think of the men that lied to them as victims,. Which really is a warped and fucked up mentality

So nobody stated they know someones sexuality better. Which you being the little hurt victim here, think you are

Its about the realty men fucking women and being turned on to the point marrying them, clearly are not 100% gay

Hence why most of this lying men who fucked and abused women, are not 100% gay and quite frankly dickless

As in the west today and with gay rights, why are these twats still doing this to women?

I don't think it is happening all that much today, in the west at least. When it did happen, it is hardly rocket science working out why they did it. It isn't right, but nor is the situation which forced them in to it.

Well tell my sister that, being as her life has been turned upside down, by the fact her husband has left her stating he has always been gay. Nobody forced him into this and that view is shockingingly ignorant to claim. When we have had gay rights for decades. Those doing this are gutless cowards in my book who live within the west. He certainly was attracted to my sister. Hence why I knew you were talking shit on this.

With the above you show how badly you are an apologist for this and say its not rocket science why they did. This is what disgusts me when people make piss poor excuses. There is no reason in this day and age to marry someone of the opposite sex in the west and maitain a lie, when they are gay. So dont give me bullshit about being forced. That is 100% a utter lie.

As seen you care more for the lying gay person here and not the real victim, the wife, my sister with her world torn apart

Eilzel wrote:

Didge wrote:

Well tell my sister that, being as her life has been turned upside down, by the fact her husband has left her stating he has always been gay. Nobody forced him into this and that view is shockingingly ignorant to claim. When we have had gay rights for decades. Those doing this are gutless cowards in my book who live within the west. He certainly was attracted to my sister. Hence why I knew you were talking shit on this.

With the above you show how badly you are an apologist for this and say its not rocket science why they did. This is what disgusts me when people make piss poor excuses. There is no reason in this day and age to marry someone of the opposite sex in the west and maitain a lie, when they are gay. So dont give me bullshit about being forced. That is 100% a utter lie.

As seen you care more for the lying gay person here and not the real victim, the wife, my sister with her world torn apart

I'm sorry for your sister.

It is still very uncommon thesedays though didge, for a gay man to cover his sexuality by marrying a woman (in the west). It obviously did happen in the past for reasons I've stated.

Why your brother-in-law did it I don't know. Whether he was ever sexually attracted to your sister only he knows.

Maybe he is bi, maybe not; that doesn't mean he is an example for all though. And as you said to me earlier, it is pretty clear, and totally understable, that you may be emotionally biased here.

Again, very sorry for her.

Didge wrote:

Eilzel wrote:

I'm sorry for your sister.

It is still very uncommon thesedays though didge, for a gay man to cover his sexuality by marrying a woman (in the west). It obviously did happen in the past for reasons I've stated.

Why your brother-in-law did it I don't know. Whether he was ever sexually attracted to your sister only he knows.

Maybe he is bi, maybe not; that doesn't mean he is an example for all though. And as you said to me earlier, it is pretty clear, and totally understable, that you may be emotionally biased here.

Again, very sorry for her.

I dont need your apologist bullshit, period

I watched them together and he was very effectionate around her. One thing I have been cursed in life with is understanding people and he never ever gave any indication he was gay, To me, I think its simple sexual experimentation. Hence I do not think he is gay. Hence i think its a bullshit excuse. He is now living with another man

gelico wrote:

Didge wrote:

I dont need your apologist bullshit, period

I watched them together and he was very effectionate around her. One thing I have been cursed in life with is understanding people and he never ever gave any indication he was gay, To me, I think its simple sexual experimentation. Hence I do not think he is gay. Hence i think its a bullshit excuse. He is now living with another man

well, he wouldn't would he?  not if he was denying it to himself all these years.

I am sure he was affectionate towards her.  I'm sure he felt a great deal of affection for her also, but eventually chose to be true to himself.  It must have been the most difficult thing he's ever done but the alternative is to continue living a lie and I guess he couldn't do that.

I remember watching a film about this years ago, can't remember what it was called though.

There's no denying that the partner of many years in this situation is devastated but ultimately people have to be honest about who and what they are.  Would it have made a difference if he'd run off with another woman?

not sure taking it out on les is fair though

Syl wrote:I feel sorry for your sister too, knowing your married life has been based on a lie must be horrible.
I also knew a married mum with 2 kids who was devastated when her OH of many years left her for a man, claiming he was gay and always had been. Only the men concerned know if they are bi-sexual, gay or straight...the odd case doesn't count for the many.

I dont think anyone is applauding these men, just understanding why they acted the way they did....a couple of decades ago the world was very different to how it is now.

Women have also married and had children to cover up the fact they are lesbians.....it's not just men who use others to cover their real sexuality.

Didge wrote:

Syl wrote:I feel sorry for your sister too, knowing your married life has been based on a lie must be horrible.
I also knew a married mum with 2 kids who was devastated when her OH of many years left her for a man, claiming he was gay and always had been. Only the men concerned know if they are bi-sexual, gay or straight...the odd case doesn't count for the many.

I dont think anyone is applauding these men, just understanding why they acted the way they did....a couple of decades ago the world was very different to how it is now.

Women have also married and had children to cover up the fact they are lesbians.....it's not just men who use others to cover their real sexuality.

Syl, I have loads of respect for Eilzel and would defend his rights to be gay for all time. It is frustration at all of this that is coming out. I respect Eilzel more than most, but here I am at odds with some of his views, not him as a person

I am simple taking issue over how and I guess being that he is gay. That there is an immediate view to look at the person coming out. As iff they are some sort of hero. Where people continually neglect the fact there is an actual injured party within all of this.

So I agree with all your points, but do not see those, where in the west there is no real reason to hide being gay (maybe within an Muslim/orthodox Jewish community granted). To then live a lie with someone. The reality is though Syl, many within the gay community would appluad him for coming out. Where in this case I have very little respect now for this person, who I saw as very much part of the family. I think he was very selfish.

And its doubtful my opinion will change on that

Syl wrote:

Didge wrote:

Syl, I have loads of respect for Eilzel and would defend his rights to be gay for all time. It is frustration at all of this that is coming out. I respect Eilzel more than most, but here I am at odds with some of his views, not him as a person

I am simple taking issue over how and I guess being that he is gay. That there is an immediate view to look at the person coming out. As iff they are some sort of hero. Where people continually neglect the fact there is an actual injured party within all of this.

So I agree with all your points, but do not see those, where in the west there is no real reason to hide being gay (maybe within an Muslim/orthodox Jewish community granted). To then live a lie with someone. The reality is though Syl, many within the gay community would appluad him for coming out. Where in this case I have very little respect now for this person, who I saw as very much part of the family. I think he was very selfish.

And its doubtful my opinion will change on that

I'm sure most people would feel the same as you re your brother in law, if someone hurts someone you love, it's very hard to forgive them, probably harder than if it's you yourself who has been betrayed.

I'm not speaking for Eilzel because he has spoken brilliantly himself in this thread, but I dont think anyone was applauding men who marry to cover up their sexuality, just pointing out that indeed that is one reason why gay men have married in the past.
And just because they have married, had sex, had children, that doesn't necessarily make then bi-sexual.....which was how this debate started.

Syl wrote:But no one was talking about your sisters ex  Didge, we were speaking generally.
He may indeed be bi-sexual, some people are some are not.

I can understand why you got upset, to hear your niece question whether she was born from love must be really hard.
I seriously hope your sis and her family can move on.

I doubt many people gay or straight would encourage anyone to marry and live a lie.
I remember when Michael Barrymore came out...(pre all the business with the lad being drowned at his home) his popularity with the public diminished overnight, not because he had come out, but because of the way he had deceived his wife.

gelico wrote:

it must be heartbreaking for the whole family, didge.

how long ago did this happen? does the brother in law still see his kids? they must be confused as hell over all this

Didge wrote:

gelico wrote:

it must be heartbreaking for the whole family, didge.

how long ago did this happen? does the brother in law still see his kids? they must be confused as hell over all this

Two months ago

Yes he does still see them. Its the youngest more than anything that is confused

I will send you a private messsage sometime this week Gelico, if okay with you? Not in the mood or right frame of mind to do so today, as want to be fair and rational on this

I dont want to bore the forum with details on this also and think it would be unfair to do so, espcially with such a debate going on.

Syl wrote:Oh sorry, I inadvertantly posted between Didge and Gel....didn't mean to be flippant.
I appreciate how both Eilzel and Didge have spoken openly in this thread. x

eddie wrote:I think some of us can have sexual pleasures / fantasies (carried out alone or with a partner) that can include members of the same sex.

I’m not sure that makes someone gay.


Re the OP and pupils, I think that’s simply because they were being shown photos of arousal which can make the person looking at the photo aroused.
Simple.

Ben Mothafuckin' Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:I think some of us can have sexual pleasures / fantasies (carried out alone or with a partner) that can include members of the same sex.

I’m not sure that makes someone gay.


Re the OP and pupils, I think that’s simply because they were being shown photos of arousal which can make the person looking at the photo aroused.
Simple.

Okay, I never fantasize about dudes, fam.

However, I could see a guy watching a video of a guy masturbating and his pupils dilating because he's thinking, "Oh that looks like fun, I'm going to go jump in bed with myself."