Ex-Nat. Security Chief Flynn pleads guilty

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:26 pm

ABC News wrote:Flynn pleads guilty, reaches deal on charge of lying to FBI

MATTHEW MOSK, ADAM KELSEY and VERONICA STRACQUALURSI
December 1, 2017

Retired Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn, once a member of President Trump’s inner circle of advisers, has pleaded guilty in a deal with the Special Counsel investigating foreign meddling in the 2016 elections in which he admits to lying to the FBI about his back-channel conversations with the Russian ambassador.

Flynn’s plea signals the former top adviser to President Trump is now cooperating with Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s team. A brief statement released by Mueller’s team Friday morning does not say what information Flynn has provided the government as part of the deal, but people familiar with the agreement told ABC News Friday he has made a decision to assist investigators.

The general told confidants about his decision to plead guilty in the last 24 hours, according to people close to Flynn, who say the former adviser feels President Trump has abandoned him and has agreed to answer questions about the president or anyone else.

Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI about the nature of his conversations with then-Russian ambassador to the United States Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition. Those conversations led Russian officials to temper their response to increased U.S. sanctions, according to the charging documents. The charge means Flynn could face up to 5 years in prison.

Flynn becomes the latest and most-senior Trump associate to face charges in Mueller's probe and is scheduled to appear in court at 10:30 a.m. He has already been processed at the FBI Washington Field Office, according to FBI officials, where he was fingerprinted and photographed.

Flynn's lawyer meets with members of special counsel's team, raising specter of plea deal

Kushner met with special counsel earlier this month, conversation focused on Flynn

Flynn had initially resisted cooperating with the investigation, according to people close to the retired general, but he has been facing mounting legal debts and plans to sell his house to help defray costs.

He only recently learned the full scope of the charges he could potentially face. Last week, Trump lawyers received calls from Flynn’s lawyer Robert Kelner, alerting them that he could no longer participate in information exchanges with other possible Mueller targets, the first public indication that a plea deal was in the works.

On Monday, Kelner was spotted exiting a meeting at Mueller’s offices in Washington, ABC News reported.

Flynn is a decorated military officer who once headed the Defense Intelligence Agency and, after leaving government, spoke frequently at Trump campaign rallies. He began facing scrutiny after it was learned he took payment to attend a Russian television event, at which he appeared seated next to Russian President Vladimir Putin.

That scrutiny only increased after he took over as Trump’s national security adviser. He was ultimately forced to resign after just a few weeks on the job after it was revealed that he misled Vice President Mike Pence and other administration officials about his meeting with the Russian ambassador.

Flynn initially denied that he discussed U.S. sanctions placed on Russia with Kislyak, but transcripts of Flynn and Kislyak’s phone calls reviewed by Justice Department lawyers showed otherwise.

Flynn was paid over $500,000 by foreign clients for consulting work and speaking fees – including contracts he allegedly failed to list on applications for security clearances and financial disclosure forms. He also only belatedly disclosed lobbying work his firm engaged in on behalf of the Turkish government.

Trump reportedly attempted to persuade the FBI to drop its investigation into Flynn’s conduct. In a Feb. 14 meeting at the White House, Trump reportedly told then-FBI Director James Comey to “let this go.”

“I hope you can see your way clear to letting this go, to letting Flynn go,” Trump told Comey, according to a memo Comey wrote afterwards, which was later described by the New York Times. “He is a good guy. I hope you can let this go.”

On Oct. 30, two members of Trump's campaign staff, former campaign chair Paul Manafort and his longtime associate Rick Gates, were indicted on 12 counts brought by Mueller's team related to work done prior to joining the Trump campaign, including conspiracy against the U.S., conspiracy to launder money and serving as an unregistered agent of a foreign principal.

That same day, it was also revealed that a third Trump campaign adviser, George Papadopoulos, pleaded guilty earlier in the month to making false statements to FBI agents probing his attempts to arrange a meeting between Russian officials and the campaign.

ABC News' Jack Date, Geneva Sands, Mike Levine, and Trish Turner contributed to this report.

First, Papadopoulos pleads guilty and admits he was colluding with Russians for the Trump Campaign. Then Manafort and his aide are indicted. Now, Flynn tips and goes state's evidence. Who is he giving evidence on? There ain't many above him...Trump Jr., son-in-law Kushner, AG Jeff Sessions...or the fat enchilada himself.

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:35 pm

A man got arrested in India for murder this week Quill.

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:37 pm

Good grief that's desperate lol

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:41 pm

sassy wrote:Good grief that's desperate lol

I know right??

But Quill IS desperate for impeaching trump.

Ain't gonna happen but Quill is clutching any old straw

by Andy Fri Dec 01, 2017 4:59 pm

Flynn faces 5 years or a plea bargain to take down Trump and his cohorts. Bit of a no brainer.

by 'Wolfie Fri Dec 01, 2017 5:08 pm

Anyone up for a game of dominoes ???

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 5:15 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:
sassy wrote:Good grief that's desperate lol

I know right??

But Quill IS desperate for impeaching trump.

Ain't gonna happen but Quill is clutching any old straw

The ropes tighten. I particularly lov watching the response. Trump is going apoplectic, and it ain't all senility. It's what you do when they've got you dangling in the breeze.

It's enjoyable to speculate at the outcome. The president can pardon others, but he can't pardon himself. Besides, if he pardons others, it won't matter: the New York Attorney General, Eric Schneiderman, swoops in and indicts them for the same thing. The president cannot pardon for state crimes....and New York State has a mini-RICO law that is almost the duplicate of the Federal law. The also have a parallel law to the Computer Fraud and Abuse Act (CFAA), called the Computer Trespass Act, with universal jurisdiction....these should frame predicate acts for a grand conspiracy with Wikileaks and the Russian IRA.

So it's a Federal prison, or Sing Sing Correctional Institution. on the shores of the Hudson River. Gives new meaning to up a river without a paddle.

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 5:20 pm

Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:

I know right??

But Quill IS desperate for impeaching trump.

Ain't gonna happen but Quill is clutching any old straw

The ropes tighten. I particularly lov watching the response. Trump is going apoplectic, and it ain't all senility. It's what you do when they've got you dangling in the breeze.

It's enjoyable to speculate at the outcome. The president can pardon others, but he can't pardon himself. Besides, if he pardons others, it won't matter: the New York Attorney General, Eric Schneiderman, swoops in and indicts them for the same thing. The president cannot pardon for state crimes....and New York State has a mini-RICO law that is almost the duplicate of the Federal law. So it's a Federal prison, or Sing Sing Correctional Institution.

How do you know what trumps doing?? You're just projecting as usual.

You've got more chance of California going it alone than you have of Trump going down, you will still be banging your gums in 7 years about impeaching trump.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 5:29 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

The ropes tighten. I particularly lov watching the response. Trump is going apoplectic, and it ain't all senility. It's what you do when they've got you dangling in the breeze.

It's enjoyable to speculate at the outcome. The president can pardon others, but he can't pardon himself. Besides, if he pardons others, it won't matter: the New York Attorney General, Eric Schneiderman, swoops in and indicts them for the same thing. The president cannot pardon for state crimes....and New York State has a mini-RICO law that is almost the duplicate of the Federal law. So it's a Federal prison, or Sing Sing Correctional Institution.

How do you know what trumps doing?? You're just projecting as usual.

I'm watching, fool. So are you. Pussy-grabber is retreating into his fantasy world: Obama was born in Kenya; he got more votes; Roy Moore is innocent; the Russia collusion investigation will be over this year. He's babbling away like a New York bag lady. It's more comfortable in his cocoon of fabrication.

sb wrote:You've got more chance of California going it alone than you have of Trump going down, you will still be banging your gums in 7 years about impeaching trump.

Two separate issues. We won't need a separate California if we get rid of Trump and prosecute the Neo-Nazis and white-supremacists.

by Lurker Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:11 pm

Smelly sounds just like the one-tooth tobacco-chewin' imbecile that voted for the orange-faced piece of shit pussy grabbin' moron.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:13 pm

Flynn tells the Court that a "very senior Trump official directed him to contact the Russians". There's not many higher level than Flynn himself...except Trump.

The two phone conversations in December 2016 between Flynn and the Russian Ambassador, involved UN votes and lifting the sanctions on Russians. That would also involve Logan Act violations.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 6:36 pm

New York Times reports that the "very senior official" that Flynn will identify in Court (see above) is Trump himself.

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:09 pm

Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:

How do you know what trumps doing?? You're just projecting as usual.

I'm watching, fool. So are you. Pussy-grabber is retreating into his fantasy world: Obama was born in Kenya; he got more votes; Roy Moore is innocent; the Russia collusion investigation will be over this year. He's babbling away like a New York bag lady. It's more comfortable in his cocoon of fabrication.

sb wrote:You've got more chance of California going it alone than you have of Trump going down, you will still be banging your gums in 7 years about impeaching trump.

Two separate issues. We won't need a separate California if we get rid of Trump and prosecute the Neo-Nazis and white-supremacists.

im also watching and i dont see trump breaking a sweat

i think youre going to be rather sad and disappointed

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:23 pm

heres the thing quill

you initially ranted and raged about this Russian collusion story citing CNN as the source of it.

CNN were caught on covert camera openly admitting that the Russian collusion story was fake news, so from day one you have held onto a fairy tale, lies told by a left wing propaganda fake news outlet.

so far the investigation hasn't got so much as speck on dirt on the trump clan, it may have bagged some of his close advisors and such but NOT for "Russian collusion"

you are living on a prayer, a prayer that some collusion actually exists, you're desperate for it to exist, no matter how desperate you get, you cannot fake evidence into existence, if it doesn't exist or if trump is too cunning to be caught holding the bag, you wont be getting what you want.

personally i seriously doubt there was any collusion between trump and the "Russians" i mean there arent even any Russians named by name, just a vague reference to "the Russians"

Flynn is being charged for lying to the FBI, he will accept a plea in return for details about what went down in the meeting he had with "the Russians"

this is what your theory hinges on though isn't it??

what is Flynn going to say.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:34 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:heres the thing quill

you initially ranted and raged about this Russian collusion story citing CNN as the source of it.

CNN were caught on covert camera openly admitting that the Russian collusion story was fake news, so from day one you have held onto a fairy tale, lies told by a left wing propaganda fake news outlet.

so far the investigation hasn't got so much as speck on dirt on the trump clan, it may have bagged some of his close advisors and such but NOT for "Russian collusion"

you are living on a prayer, a prayer that some collusion actually exists, you're desperate for it to exist, no matter how desperate you get, you cannot fake evidence into existence, if it doesn't exist or if trump is too cunning to be caught holding the bag, you wont be getting what you want.

personally i seriously doubt there was any collusion between trump and the "Russians" i mean there arent even any Russians named by name, just a vague reference to "the Russians"

Flynn is being charged for lying to the FBI, he will accept a plea in return for details about what went down in the meeting he had with "the Russians"

this is what your theory hinges on though isn't it??

what is Flynn going to say.

All that you have said above is an illusion, a false hope. CNN never said the Russia collusion story was fake news. And indeed, it wasn't. The turning of Flynn reaches right up into the Trump clan. MSNBC is right now asking Katy Tur who is the "very, very senior Trump" person, mentioned by Flynn in Court documents, who was directing Flynn. This is the bleakest day for the White House.

The real question is, why did he lie to the FBI? What motivated him to expose himself and his son to felony charges and a potential 5-years in prison? Even you, Russ, place de minimus significance on the charges; so, what is there in his story that is de maximus? Stay tuned...more to come.

Ex-Nat. Security Chief Flynn pleads guilty Amos-5-24-2

Ex-Nat. Security Chief Flynn pleads guilty Amos-5-24-2

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:38 pm

Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:heres the thing quill

you initially ranted and raged about this Russian collusion story citing CNN as the source of it.

CNN were caught on covert camera openly admitting that the Russian collusion story was fake news, so from day one you have held onto a fairy tale, lies told by a left wing propaganda fake news outlet.

so far the investigation hasn't got so much as speck on dirt on the trump clan, it may have bagged some of his close advisors and such but NOT for "Russian collusion"

you are living on a prayer, a prayer that some collusion actually exists, you're desperate for it to exist, no matter how desperate you get, you cannot fake evidence into existence, if it doesn't exist or if trump is too cunning to be caught holding the bag, you wont be getting what you want.

personally i seriously doubt there was any collusion between trump and the "Russians" i mean there arent even any Russians named by name, just a vague reference to "the Russians"

Flynn is being charged for lying to the FBI, he will accept a plea in return for details about what went down in the meeting he had with "the Russians"

this is what your theory hinges on though isn't it??

what is Flynn going to say.

All that you have said above is an illusion, a false hope. CNN never said the Russia collusion story was fake news. And indeed, it wasn't. The turning of Flynn reaches right up into the Trump clan. MSNBC is right now asking Katy Tur who is the "very, very senior Trump" person, mentioned by Flynn in Court documents, who was directing Flynn. This is the bleakest day for the White House.

The real question is, why did he lie to the FBI? What motivated him to expose himself and his son to felony charges and a potential 5-years in prison? Even you, Russ, place de minimus significance on the charges; so, what is there in his story that is de maximus? Stay tuned...more to come.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 7:44 pm

sb wrote:you are living on a prayer, a prayer that some collusion actually exists, you're desperate for it to exist, no matter how desperate you get, you cannot fake evidence into existence, if it doesn't exist or if trump is too cunning to be caught holding the bag, you wont be getting what you want.

personally i seriously doubt there was any collusion between trump and the "Russians" i mean there arent even any Russians named by name, just a vague reference to "the Russians"

The collusion has already been proven. It was in the written testimony of Papadopoulos, on his pleading guilty. Now the question is, does it reach up to the pussy-grabber?

The charge of lying to the FBI is merely a way to hook the accused; if he was not cooperating with the Feds, he would be charged with much more. They undercharge a cooperating witness so as to be lenient with him as long as his cooperation holds out. Standard practice. Look at how far off the sentencing date is...that will tell you he is being debriefed, and when it will be finished.

If you need to connect the dots, read a recently published book by Luke Harding, foreign correspondent for The Guardian, titled Collusion: Secret Meetings, Dirty Money, and how Russia Helped Donald Trump Win (2017). Other than the recent indictments, it will bring you right up to date. Luke Harding also wrote The Snowden Files, so you may have already heard of him

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:10 pm

We now know that the "senior figure" in the Trump Campaign who instructed Flynn to contact the Russians, was Trump son-in-law Jared Kushner.

Next question: who was the "very senior" individual who instructed Flynn in the collusion? Who is higher than Kushner? Perhaps the pussy-grabber, himself?

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:36 pm

Flynn has promised special counsel 'full cooperation' in Russia probe: Source

Retired Lt. Gen Michael Flynn has promised “full cooperation” in the special counsel’s Russia investigation and, according to a confidant, is prepared to testify that Donald Trump directed him to make contact with the Russians, initially as a way to work together to fight ISIS in Syria.

The stunning turn comes as Flynn, who is cooperating with investigators in Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s probe, pleaded guilty to one count of lying to the FBI about his back-channel negotiations with the Russian ambassador – talks that occurred before Trump took office. The Special Counsel made the plea agreement public Friday morning.

A close confidant told ABC News that Flynn felt abandoned by Trump in recent weeks, and told friends about the decision to make the plea deal within the last 24 hours as he grew increasingly concerned about crippling legal costs he would face if he continued to contest the charges.

“It has been extraordinarily painful to endure these many months of false accusations of ‘treason’ and other outrageous acts,” Flynn said in a statement. “Such false accusations are contrary to everything I have ever done and stood for. But I recognize that the actions I acknowledged in court today were wrong, and, through my faith in God, I am working to set things right.”

Richard Frankel, a former senior aide to Flynn and an ABC News contributor, said Flynn made his decision to cooperate under immense pressure, but he believes it is the right move for the country.

“I don't know how much General Flynn knows about any criminal activity that took place during the campaign or in the White House,” said Frankel, who also served in a senior role at the FBI. “However, General Flynn was a top adviser to President Trump in the campaign and a top adviser to him when he entered into the WH so if there are bodies buried so to speak, General Flynn would know about them in my opinion.”

Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI about the nature of his conversations with then-Russian ambassador to the United States Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition. Those conversations led Russian officials to temper their response to increased U.S. sanctions, according to the charging documents.

The charge means Flynn could face up to five years in prison.

Flynn became the latest and most-senior Trump associate to face charges in Mueller's probe and arrived at the U.S. District courthouse accompanied by his wife and attorney Robert Kelner after having been processed at the FBI Washington Field Office, where he was fingerprinted and photographed, according to FBI officials.

In court, the retired lieutenant general was asked by Federal Judge Rudolph Contreras if he had ever been a part of similar proceedings, to which Flynn replied that he had not. Contreras then asked Kelner whether he was correct in assuming that Flynn was pleading guilty.

"Yes, your honor," said Kelner.

After the hearing, Flynn was free to go, but has to check in with authorities each week. Sentencing has been put off for now — and the judge noted that Flynn is agreeing to cooperate with authorities in other matters.

Flynn had initially resisted cooperating with the investigation, according to people close to the retired general, but he has been facing mounting legal debts and plans to sell his house to help defray costs.

He only recently learned the full scope of the charges he could potentially face. Last week, Trump lawyers received calls from Kelner, alerting them that he could no longer participate in information exchanges with other possible Mueller targets, the first public indication that a plea deal was in the works.

“My guilty plea and agreement to cooperate with the Special Counsel's Office reflect a decision I made in the best interests of my family and of our country,” Flynn said. “I accept full responsibility for my actions.”

Trump and his legal team have learned of Flynn's decision via news reports Friday morning, according to sources with knowledge of the situation.

On Monday, Kelner was spotted exiting a meeting at Mueller’s offices in Washington, ABC News reported.

More at: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michael-flynn-charged-making-false-statements-fbi-documents/story?id=50849354

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:56 pm

There is more to the story to be seen in the fact that Flynn was told to contact Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak. You don't just get such an envoy on the phone on a whim. Obviously, there was an on-going conversation, of which this was merely one link.

Keep digging boys. This all goes back to the Golden Shower incident in the Moscow Ritz Carlton, in 2013.

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:00 pm

What is wrong Quill??

No comment on CNN caught lying??

You're always asking for facts and when I provide them you shy away like an arachnophobe who just had a tarantula thrown on his faces

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:05 pm

Oh no.

Trump wanted to work with the Russians to smash ISIS???

WHAT A MONSTER!!!!!!

No wonder you fucking liberals want him impeached, how dare he attack your beloved Muslim jihadis

by Andy Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:39 pm

Hope Flynn has close protection, body armour and a bullet proof car.
Trump has the potential to pull out all the stops to get Flynn to discontinue his whistleblowing.
He has both the motive and means to do so.

by Guest Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:55 pm

Angry Andy wrote:Hope Flynn has close protection, body armour and a bullet proof car.
Trump has the potential to pull out all the stops to get Flynn to discontinue his whistleblowing.
He has both the motive and means to do so.

So you're happy for trump to be murdered by not flynn

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:25 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:What is wrong Quill??

No comment on CNN caught lying??

You're always asking for facts and when I provide them you shy away like an arachnophobe who just had a tarantula thrown on his faces

No, CNN didn't say that. I believe the operative term used was "nothing burger". I've never heard of that term, so I can't say what it means. Does the term mean the Russia collusion operation, as a story, it is insubstantial, or does it mean that it is boring and something people find to be uninteresting?

More importantly, CNN is a news consumer, not a producer. So, it is not a source, but at best, a transmitter of news. Again, you don't understand how facts and conclusions work. You should have gone to school, Russ.

I know you are just trying to be rhetorical, but this is too big a news day for me to play such games with you. Flynn's testimony blows the lid off of the Trump/Russia story. Flynn stands at the nexus of the two biggest allegations regarding Trump: 1) the Russian connection; and 2) the obstruction of justice allegation. Flynn is convicted of lying about his contacts with the Russians, and the whole panoply Russian interactions by the Trump team. And protection of Flynn is the object of the firing of James Comey, the FBI Director. So the questions I asked earlier will lead to the bottom of the whole story.

First, what was the on-going relationship between Trump and the Russians, that Flynn had to be involved, and lied (a felony) about later? Second, what does Flynn know that is so important as to fire the FBI Director and the Attorney General Sally Yeats, to protect him? Pretty big questions, eh? We are now getting somewhere with this investigation.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 10:35 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:Oh no.

Trump wanted to work with the Russians to smash ISIS???

WHAT A MONSTER!!!!!!

No wonder you fucking liberals want him impeached, how dare he attack your beloved Muslim jihadis

It has nothing to do with ISIS. Trump was a subject of Kompromat, and is being blackmailed. What crimes has he committed, such that Putin has such a hold over him?

Is this where the 19.5% share of Rosneft Oil comes into the story, or did he kill one of the Golden Shower girls? I don't know, but it's big enough for him to fire the FBI Director, and tell approximately 5-lies a day for nearly a year.

by Maddog Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:18 pm

It's getting interesting no doubt. Jared Kushner worked very closely with Flynn. He is the grandson of holocaust victims, and is big supporter of Israel. Israeli settlements were one of the topics that Flynn was talking to the Russians about. On another note, Kushner's dad has already done time for illegal contributions to the Democratic party. The man that put him in prison was none other than Chris Christie, yeah, that Chris Christie.

by Original Quill Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:28 pm

Maddog wrote:It's getting interesting no doubt. Jared Kushner worked very closely with Flynn. He is the grandson of holocaust victims, and is big supporter of Israel. Israeli settlements were one of the topics that Flynn was talking to the Russians about. On another note, Kushner's dad has already done time for illegal contributions to the Democratic party. The man that put him in prison was none other than Chris Christie, yeah, that Chris Christie.

Yeah, the Kushners are no strangers to crime.

That Chris Christie prosecuted Jared's father is the reason why Christie should have known he was going nowhere in this administration. But Jared will get his, and soon, by the look of things.

by Guest Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:13 am

Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:What is wrong Quill??

No comment on CNN caught lying??

You're always asking for facts and when I provide them you shy away like an arachnophobe who just had a tarantula thrown on his faces

No, CNN didn't say that. I believe the operative term used was "nothing burger". I've never heard of that term, so I can't say what it means. Does the term mean the Russia collusion operation, as a story, it is insubstantial, or does it mean that it is boring and something people find to be uninteresting?

More importantly, CNN is a news consumer, not a producer. So, it is not a source, but at best, a transmitter of news. Again, you don't understand how facts and conclusions work. You should have gone to school, Russ.

I know you are just trying to be rhetorical, but this is too big a news day for me to play such games with you. Flynn's testimony blows the lid off of the Trump/Russia story. Flynn stands at the nexus of the two biggest allegations regarding Trump: 1) the Russian connection; and 2) the obstruction of justice allegation. Flynn is convicted of lying about his contacts with the Russians, and the whole panoply Russian interactions by the Trump team. And protection of Flynn is the object of the firing of James Comey, the FBI Director. So the questions I asked earlier will lead to the bottom of the whole story.

First, what was the on-going relationship between Trump and the Russians, that Flynn had to be involved, and lied (a felony) about later? Second, what does Flynn know that is so important as to fire the FBI Director and the Attorney General Sally Yeats, to protect him? Pretty big questions, eh? We are now getting somewhere with this investigation.

What do you think "a big nothing burger" means??

lol!

by Guest Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:18 am

Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:Oh no.

Trump wanted to work with the Russians to smash ISIS???

WHAT A MONSTER!!!!!!

No wonder you fucking liberals want him impeached, how dare he attack your beloved Muslim jihadis

It has nothing to do with ISIS. Trump was a subject of Kompromat, and is being blackmailed. What crimes has he committed, such that Putin has such a hold over him?

Is this where the 19.5% share of Rosneft Oil comes into the story, or did he kill one of the Golden Shower girls? I don't know, but it's big enough for him to fire the FBI Director, and tell approximately 5-lies a day for nearly a year.

I think you are barking up the wrong tree.

I think muller has diddly squat, I think he is trying to ensnare the trump administration in non crimes.

Get as many people as possible for lying to the FBI with no underlying crime to answer for, get trump to pardon them and then the Democrats can put him up for impeachment.

As far as collusion goes it will depending entirely on what Flynn knows and whether there has been any collusion.

If Jared didn't lie to the FBI and the only contact was about Israel ISIS Syria etc then that is perfectly legal and the case dies a death.

You don't really care about collusion do you?? All you care about is getting trump out at any cost, you don't care how dirty you have to play do you??

by Original Quill Sat Dec 02, 2017 5:20 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:
Original Quill wrote:

It has nothing to do with ISIS. Trump was a subject of Kompromat, and is being blackmailed. What crimes has he committed, such that Putin has such a hold over him?

Is this where the 19.5% share of Rosneft Oil comes into the story, or did he kill one of the Golden Shower girls? I don't know, but it's big enough for him to fire the FBI Director, and tell approximately 5-lies a day for nearly a year.

I think you are barking up the wrong tree.

I think muller has diddly squat, I think he is trying to ensnare the trump administration in non crimes.

Get as many people as possible for lying to the FBI with no underlying crime to answer for, get trump to pardon them and then the Democrats can put him up for impeachment.

Unfortunately, you are not a lawyer, Russ. You have no idea how prosecution works. Let's take a market analogy: if you want to buy something you keep giving more until the other party says 'yes'. Mueller wants Trump and family. Flynn is exposed to counts of treason, fraud, attempted rendition, racketeering and computer trespass violations. So is Flynn's son. Flynn can give Mueller, Trump, Trump Jr., Sessions and Kushner. So a trade is in the offing.

As is often the case in trading, it's what you do not see that is the core of the deal. You put merchandise out for display, but the deal is made in the back room: we'll let the son go, and only charge you for lying to the FBI, if you give us Trump, Trump Jr., Sessions, and Kushner. We'll keep quiet about the other stuff. BUT...the deal waits until you give us Trump, Trump Jr., Sessions, and Kushner, and, if you don't the deal is off, and your kid goes down with you. So, we won't sentence you for 8-months, to see give you time to perform. Meanwhile, we'll go ahead with the others.

sb wrote:As far as collusion goes it will depending entirely on what Flynn knows and whether there has been any collusion.

Now, prior to the deal, Flynn would have had to show Mueller his wares...what he was trading. He would have given what is called a proffer...ie, what he will testify to. So, rest assured, the case for collusion is already known and made. It's just yet to be revealed. We have to wait until Flynn testifies in the trials of the others. Now you see the significance of those many months between pleading and sentencing.

sb wrote:If Jared didn't lie to the FBI and the only contact was about Israel ISIS Syria etc then that is perfectly legal and the case dies a death.

On the other hand, if Jared has lied about the subject of the contacts, he's caught in the same trap. He will have to give up his father-in-law.

Now, Flynn has said to the Court that he had to get permission from higher up in order to negotiate with the Russian Ambassador. He says that the "very high official" instructed him to negotiate with the Russians to (1) withhold the UN vote on Israel, and in a second phone call (2) to inform the Russians that sanctions will be lifted, a violation of the Logan Act. That "very high official" was Jared Kushner, proving already that Kushner is guilty of lying to the FBI.

sb wrote:You don't really care about collusion do you?? All you care about is getting trump out at any cost, you don't care how dirty you have to play do you??

What I care about is following the law and preventing the US from becoming just another crime syndicate. If Trump can use the Russian Mafia to get elected to the highest office in the land, and then pardon everyone of all Federal crimes, then the next guy can use Colombian drug traffickers to do the same thing. You see the problem...the US turns into a Prosti-Narco State.

The Russians specialize in human trafficking; the Colombians specialize in cocaine trafficking. Narcotics and prostitutes...the next two political parties to run the US. Who will be the lefty party? The Prostitution Party? Or the Narco Party? Who will all those tax cuts trickle down to...or should I say, who will get the Golden Shower?

by Tommy Monk Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:23 pm

sassy wrote:Flynn has promised special counsel 'full cooperation' in Russia probe: Source

Retired Lt. Gen Michael Flynn has promised “full cooperation” in the special counsel’s Russia investigation and, according to a confidant, is prepared to testify that Donald Trump directed him to make contact with the Russians, initially as a way to work together to fight ISIS in Syria.

The stunning turn comes as Flynn, who is cooperating with investigators in Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s probe, pleaded guilty to one count of lying to the FBI about his back-channel negotiations with the Russian ambassador – talks that occurred before Trump took office. The Special Counsel made the plea agreement public Friday morning.

A close confidant told ABC News that Flynn felt abandoned by Trump in recent weeks, and told friends about the decision to make the plea deal within the last 24 hours as he grew increasingly concerned about crippling legal costs he would face if he continued to contest the charges.

“It has been extraordinarily painful to endure these many months of false accusations of ‘treason’ and other outrageous acts,” Flynn said in a statement. “Such false accusations are contrary to everything I have ever done and stood for. But I recognize that the actions I acknowledged in court today were wrong, and, through my faith in God, I am working to set things right.”

Richard Frankel, a former senior aide to Flynn and an ABC News contributor, said Flynn made his decision to cooperate under immense pressure, but he believes it is the right move for the country.

“I don't know how much General Flynn knows about any criminal activity that took place during the campaign or in the White House,” said Frankel, who also served in a senior role at the FBI. “However, General Flynn was a top adviser to President Trump in the campaign and a top adviser to him when he entered into the WH so if there are bodies buried so to speak, General Flynn would know about them in my opinion.”

Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI about the nature of his conversations with then-Russian ambassador to the United States Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition. Those conversations led Russian officials to temper their response to increased U.S. sanctions, according to the charging documents.

The charge means Flynn could face up to five years in prison.

Flynn became the latest and most-senior Trump associate to face charges in Mueller's probe and arrived at the U.S. District courthouse accompanied by his wife and attorney Robert Kelner after having been processed at the FBI Washington Field Office, where he was fingerprinted and photographed, according to FBI officials.

In court, the retired lieutenant general was asked by Federal Judge Rudolph Contreras if he had ever been a part of similar proceedings, to which Flynn replied that he had not. Contreras then asked Kelner whether he was correct in assuming that Flynn was pleading guilty.

"Yes, your honor," said Kelner.

After the hearing, Flynn was free to go, but has to check in with authorities each week. Sentencing has been put off for now — and the judge noted that Flynn is agreeing to cooperate with authorities in other matters.

Flynn had initially resisted cooperating with the investigation, according to people close to the retired general, but he has been facing mounting legal debts and plans to sell his house to help defray costs.

He only recently learned the full scope of the charges he could potentially face. Last week, Trump lawyers received calls from Kelner, alerting them that he could no longer participate in information exchanges with other possible Mueller targets, the first public indication that a plea deal was in the works.

“My guilty plea and agreement to cooperate with the Special Counsel's Office reflect a decision I made in the best interests of my family and of our country,” Flynn said. “I accept full responsibility for my actions.”

Trump and his legal team have learned of Flynn's decision via news reports Friday morning, according to sources with knowledge of the situation.

On Monday, Kelner was spotted exiting a meeting at Mueller’s offices in Washington, ABC News reported.

More at: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michael-flynn-charged-making-false-statements-fbi-documents/story?id=50849354

Then Quill said...

'...There is more to the story to be seen in the fact that Flynn was told to contact Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak. You don't just get such an envoy on the phone on a whim. Obviously, there was an on-going conversation, of which this was merely one link...'

From sassy's article...

'...Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI about the nature of his conversations with then-Russian ambassador to the United States Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition. Those conversations led Russian officials to temper their response to increased U.S. sanctions, according to the charging documents...'

I don't see what all the fuss is about here... an incoming president and his/her top level staff will be talking to all sorts of other high level people on a diplomatic level about all manner of things...

Just as a sitting president and top level staff would routinely be doing...

What has this got to do with accusations that 'the Russians' fixed the US elections for Trump to win...?

by Guest Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:11 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:
sassy wrote:Flynn has promised special counsel 'full cooperation' in Russia probe: Source

Retired Lt. Gen Michael Flynn has promised “full cooperation” in the special counsel’s Russia investigation and, according to a confidant, is prepared to testify that Donald Trump directed him to make contact with the Russians, initially as a way to work together to fight ISIS in Syria.

The stunning turn comes as Flynn, who is cooperating with investigators in Special Counsel Robert Mueller’s probe, pleaded guilty to one count of lying to the FBI about his back-channel negotiations with the Russian ambassador – talks that occurred before Trump took office. The Special Counsel made the plea agreement public Friday morning.

A close confidant told ABC News that Flynn felt abandoned by Trump in recent weeks, and told friends about the decision to make the plea deal within the last 24 hours as he grew increasingly concerned about crippling legal costs he would face if he continued to contest the charges.

“It has been extraordinarily painful to endure these many months of false accusations of ‘treason’ and other outrageous acts,” Flynn said in a statement. “Such false accusations are contrary to everything I have ever done and stood for. But I recognize that the actions I acknowledged in court today were wrong, and, through my faith in God, I am working to set things right.”

Richard Frankel, a former senior aide to Flynn and an ABC News contributor, said Flynn made his decision to cooperate under immense pressure, but he believes it is the right move for the country.

“I don't know how much General Flynn knows about any criminal activity that took place during the campaign or in the White House,” said Frankel, who also served in a senior role at the FBI. “However, General Flynn was a top adviser to President Trump in the campaign and a top adviser to him when he entered into the WH so if there are bodies buried so to speak, General Flynn would know about them in my opinion.”

Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI about the nature of his conversations with then-Russian ambassador to the United States Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition. Those conversations led Russian officials to temper their response to increased U.S. sanctions, according to the charging documents.

The charge means Flynn could face up to five years in prison.

Flynn became the latest and most-senior Trump associate to face charges in Mueller's probe and arrived at the U.S. District courthouse accompanied by his wife and attorney Robert Kelner after having been processed at the FBI Washington Field Office, where he was fingerprinted and photographed, according to FBI officials.

In court, the retired lieutenant general was asked by Federal Judge Rudolph Contreras if he had ever been a part of similar proceedings, to which Flynn replied that he had not. Contreras then asked Kelner whether he was correct in assuming that Flynn was pleading guilty.

"Yes, your honor," said Kelner.

After the hearing, Flynn was free to go, but has to check in with authorities each week. Sentencing has been put off for now — and the judge noted that Flynn is agreeing to cooperate with authorities in other matters.

Flynn had initially resisted cooperating with the investigation, according to people close to the retired general, but he has been facing mounting legal debts and plans to sell his house to help defray costs.

He only recently learned the full scope of the charges he could potentially face. Last week, Trump lawyers received calls from Kelner, alerting them that he could no longer participate in information exchanges with other possible Mueller targets, the first public indication that a plea deal was in the works.

“My guilty plea and agreement to cooperate with the Special Counsel's Office reflect a decision I made in the best interests of my family and of our country,” Flynn said. “I accept full responsibility for my actions.”

Trump and his legal team have learned of Flynn's decision via news reports Friday morning, according to sources with knowledge of the situation.

On Monday, Kelner was spotted exiting a meeting at Mueller’s offices in Washington, ABC News reported.

More at: http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/michael-flynn-charged-making-false-statements-fbi-documents/story?id=50849354

Then Quill said...

'...There is more to the story to be seen in the fact that Flynn was told to contact Russian Ambassador Sergey Kislyak. You don't just get such an envoy on the phone on a whim. Obviously, there was an on-going conversation, of which this was merely one link...'

From sassy's article...

'...Flynn was charged with lying to the FBI about the nature of his conversations with then-Russian ambassador to the United States Sergey Kislyak during the presidential transition. Those conversations led Russian officials to temper their response to increased U.S. sanctions, according to the charging documents...'

I don't see what all the fuss is about here... an incoming president and his/her top level staff will be talking to all sorts of other high level people on a diplomatic level about all manner of things...

Just as a sitting president and top level staff would routinely be doing...

What has this got to do with accusations that 'the Russians' fixed the US elections for Trump to win...?

it has nothing to do with the Russian collusion, you have it exactly right, trumps administration will be talking to the russians about all sorts of things, obamas administration would have been doing the exact same thing.

quill has lost his mind

he seems to think that you can impeach a president because you don't like him.

by Guest Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:20 pm

bloody hell

they have gone from "colluding with Russians" to "something!!!!!! errrrr something????" to "obstruction of justice"

this is what desperation looks like

by Original Quill Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:39 pm

Tommy Monk wrote:I don't see what all the fuss is about here... an incoming president and his/her top level staff will be talking to all sorts of other high level people on a diplomatic level about all manner of things...

It's illegal to purport to represent the US, when you have no official capacity. It's a violation of the Logan Act, 1 Stat. 613, 18 U.S.C. § 953, enacted January 30, 1799, amended 1994, for a person having no official capacity to presume to act on behalf of the US. Flynn was negotiating on behalf of the US over Israel and lifting sanctions.

A violation of the Logan Act is a felony. With knowledge that he had broken the law, Flynn lied to the FBI to cover up his illegal behavior. If the violation is elevated to a conspiracy because Flynn conspired to break the law with Kushner and others, it will be a cover up of the conspiracy to violate the law.

Now as to the content of the phone call after sanctions were imposed, it was about the pay-back to the Russians for tampering in the US elections. Kislyak was calling Flynn to ask if the new Obama sanctions would be included in the bargain. The bargain, of course, was the collusion: Russia helping Trump win, in return for Trump lifting sanctions. That's collusion. Right up the alley of the special counsel.

by Original Quill Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:03 pm

sb wrote:it has nothing to do with the Russian collusion, you have it exactly right, trumps administration will be talking to the russians about all sorts of things, obamas administration would have been doing the exact same thing.

quill has lost his mind

he seems to think that you can impeach a president because you don't like him.

The mandate of a special counsel extends beyond the specific acts giving rise to his charging authority. The legislative mandate includes "...and any other violations of law found in the course of such investigation."

For example, the special counsel for President Clinton was instructed to look into a real estate deal (in Whitewater, Arkansas), and the president was ultimately found to have lied under oath over a dalliance with a woman. It has nothing to do with the original charges, but the mandate is there for anything uncovered.

That said, the phone call from Sergey Kislyak, in which the topic of lifting new Obama sanctions was discussed, was probably highly relevant to the original charges. Kislyak was asking whether the new sanctions were included in the deal, originally struck as 'pay-back' to the Russians for their election tampering favoring Trump. An agreement to conspire to break several laws in the process, would amount to the collusion.

by Original Quill Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:12 pm

smelly-bandit wrote:bloody hell

they have gone from "colluding with Russians" to "something!!!!!! errrrr something????" to "obstruction of justice"

this is what desperation looks like

Haha...that was the response of the Clinton people back in the 1990's, over the Whitewater special investigation. 'Bloody hell, they've gone from a real estate deal in Arkansas, to a blow job in the Oval Office!!!' The Clinton people were as incredulous, just as you are now. Unfortunately, that's how the law reads.

The discussion over lifting Russian sanctions is not so far afield, as that was the quid pro quo for the election tampering. That deal was the collusion...the agreement between the Trump campaign and the IRA of the Russian government: Russians tamper and get Trump elected, in return for which Trump lifts the sanctions on Russia. That deal was at the very heart of the Russian tampering with the elections.

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 6:24 am

Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:bloody hell

they have gone from "colluding with Russians" to "something!!!!!! errrrr something????" to "obstruction of justice"

this is what desperation looks like

Haha...that was the response of the Clinton people back in the 1990's, over the Whitewater special investigation. 'Bloody hell, they've gone from a real estate deal in Arkansas, to a blow job in the Oval Office!!!' The Clinton people were as incredulous, just as you are now. Unfortunately, that's how the law reads.

The discussion over lifting Russian sanctions is not so far afield, as that was the quid pro quo for the election tampering. That deal was the collusion...the agreement between the Trump campaign and the IRA of the Russian government: Russians tamper and get Trump elected, in return for which Trump lifts the sanctions on Russia. That deal was at the very heart of the Russian tampering with the elections.

Difference is that there WAS a blow job in the office.

That's how reality works

by Ben Reilly Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:36 am

smelly-bandit wrote:
Original Quill wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:bloody hell

they have gone from "colluding with Russians" to "something!!!!!! errrrr something????" to "obstruction of justice"

this is what desperation looks like

Haha...that was the response of the Clinton people back in the 1990's, over the Whitewater special investigation. 'Bloody hell, they've gone from a real estate deal in Arkansas, to a blow job in the Oval Office!!!' The Clinton people were as incredulous, just as you are now. Unfortunately, that's how the law reads.

The discussion over lifting Russian sanctions is not so far afield, as that was the quid pro quo for the election tampering. That deal was the collusion...the agreement between the Trump campaign and the IRA of the Russian government: Russians tamper and get Trump elected, in return for which Trump lifts the sanctions on Russia. That deal was at the very heart of the Russian tampering with the elections.

Difference is that there WAS a blow job in the office.

That's how reality works

Reality is about to wash over your man crush like warm piss fresh from a Russian hooker.

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:38 am

Donald Trump has opened himself up to obstruction of justice claims by revealing he knew his former national security adviser had lied to the FBI.

In a tweet playing down the Russian links controversy, Mr Trump said he knew Michael Flynn lied to agents before he left the administration in February.

But the comment was immediately jumped on because Mr Trump allegedly encouraged the FBI to drop an investigation into Mr Flynn that same month.

Knowing Mr Flynn had lied to the FBI - a criminal offence - but still telling investigators to stop their case would amount to obstruction of justice, critics said.

Obstruction of justice is one of the reasons a US president can be impeached and was what Richard Nixon was eventually brought down over.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/12/02/donald-trump-faces-obstruction-justice-claims-admitting-knew/

by Ben Reilly Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:42 am

Yeah, it's like some of us have been saying - just keep him talking and he'll eventually incriminate himself. He's too stupid to avoid it.

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:58 am

Ben Reilly wrote:
smelly-bandit wrote:

Difference is that there WAS a blow job in the office.

That's how reality works

Reality is about to wash over your man crush like warm piss fresh from a Russian hooker.

Uh huh

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:00 am

Ben Reilly wrote:Yeah, it's like some of us have been saying - just keep him talking and he'll eventually incriminate himself. He's too stupid to avoid it.

He's clever enough to have won the election against the odds.

I'm not sure trump will be going anywhere soon

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:31 am

Ben Reilly wrote:Yeah, it's like some of us have been saying - just keep him talking and he'll eventually incriminate himself. He's too stupid to avoid it.

Was it not me that advised to you, that its best to allow Trump to dig his own grave?

I could be mistaken of course. Cool

by eddie Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:59 am

Didge wrote:
Ben Reilly wrote:Yeah, it's like some of us have been saying - just keep him talking and he'll eventually incriminate himself. He's too stupid to avoid it.

Was it not me that advised to you, that its best to allow Trump to dig his own grave?

I could be mistaken of course.

I said exactly the same thing.

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:01 am

eddie wrote:
Didge wrote:

Was it not me that advised to you, that its best to allow Trump to dig his own grave?

I could be mistaken of course.

I said exactly the same thing.

You did indeed Eddie

I reckon Trump will resign by Feb, in order to get out of being charged.

by nicko Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:12 am

I wish he'd just fuck off so we could talk about something else...............What's the weather like in Texas Ben?

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:16 am

nicko wrote:I wish he'd just fuck off so we could talk about something else...............What's the weather like in Texas Ben?

Now that gets my vote for best post of the day.

How to render a thread redundent in one stroke with brilliance.

Thumbs up Nicko

Cool

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:17 am

I love you guys

You're so desperate.

We saw the same hysterical desperation during Brexit and it's aftermath

Then we saw even higher levels of mass hysteria when trump chose to run and then full blown meltdown when he got elected.

You "never trump" heretics had better get used to trump being your beloved god emperor

He has another 7 years to go

by Guest Sun Dec 03, 2017 11:20 am

smelly-bandit wrote:I love you guys

You're so desperate.

We saw the same hysterical desperation during Brexit and it's aftermath

Then we saw even higher levels of mass hysteria when trump chose to run and then full blown meltdown when he got elected.

You "never trump" heretics had better get used to trump being your beloved god emperor

He has another 7 years to go

And that was a Party Political broadcast by the UKIP party

Love your dress sense smelly Laughing

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