NHS Trust Tells Parents To Stop Calling Children’s Body Parts ‘Willy’ And ‘Front Bottom’ And To ‘Tell It Like It Is’

magica wrote:Lol Quill.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying willy or privates to a boy or front bottom, underneath, privates to girls either.  Much nicer than adult names, which they learn soon enough.

magica wrote:Lol Quill.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying willy or privates to a boy or front bottom, underneath, privates to girls either.  Much nicer than adult names, which they learn soon enough.

Syl wrote:

magica wrote:Lol Quill.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying willy or privates to a boy or front bottom, underneath, privates to girls either.  Much nicer than adult names, which they learn soon enough.

I think if the parent feels more comfortable using words like willy (I did with my son) there is no harm in that whatsoever.
My young son used to say he wanted to wee....would the so called 'experts' say the correct term to teach him is 'urinate'?

It wouldn't surprise me if the people who make these sweeping statements (they know it all cos they have read all the textbooks ) are still wet behind the ears themselves.  

magica wrote:Lol Quill.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying willy or privates to a boy or front bottom, underneath, privates to girls either.  Much nicer than adult names, which they learn soon enough.

Original Quill wrote:

magica wrote:Lol Quill.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying willy or privates to a boy or front bottom, underneath, privates to girls either.  Much nicer than adult names, which they learn soon enough.

I dislike some of the formal English names, too.  I always associate penis with urinating, and vulva with a Swedish automobile.  I prefer mentula and cunus, Latin words for the same.  Classy, and just as easy to pronounce.

Thorin wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

I dislike some of the formal English names, too.  I always associate penis with urinating, and vulva with a Swedish automobile.  I prefer mentula and cunus, Latin words for the same.  Classy, and just as easy to pronounce.

We are not talking about your nicknames at school here

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:

I think if the parent feels more comfortable using words like willy (I did with my son) there is no harm in that whatsoever.
My young son used to say he wanted to wee....would the so called 'experts' say the correct term to teach him is 'urinate'?

It wouldn't surprise me if the people who make these sweeping statements (they know it all cos they have read all the textbooks ) are still wet behind the ears themselves.  

Well maybe as the so called experts can see that this confuses many children and that there is no need for parents to use such silly names, when they can use the correct terms for this. As has happened before in the past when this was never a problem. You may not see a problem, but clearly there is issue's around children being confused.

What you have to do is think outside the world of Syl and actually the far bigger picture of many children here.

Original Quill wrote:

magica wrote:Lol Quill.

I don't think there's anything wrong with saying willy or privates to a boy or front bottom, underneath, privates to girls either.  Much nicer than adult names, which they learn soon enough.

I dislike some of the formal English names, too.  I always associate penis with urinating (pee-ing), and vulva with a Swedish automobile.  I prefer mentula and cunus, Latin words for the same.  Classy, and just as easy to pronounce.

Syl wrote:

Thorin wrote:


Well maybe as the so called experts can see that this confuses many children and that there is no need for parents to use such silly names, when they can use the correct terms for this. As has happened before in the past when this was never a problem. You may not see a problem, but clearly there is issue's around children being confused.

What you have to do is think outside the world of Syl and actually the far bigger picture of many children here.

Try not to make every post you now make to me personal ...ta.

As long as parents talk openly about EVERYTHING connected with their kids, I see no problem whatsoever in using words that a small child can easily grasp, and that the parent feels comfortable with.

The nanny state has a big enough hand in attempting to tell people how to bring their families up...telling parents what words to use for certain body parts is imo petty and pointless.

Thorin wrote:Again this is not based on what you think but on how children are constantly confused and even more so if the correct words are being used at school, at the surgery or hospitals.

Original Quill wrote:

Thorin wrote:Again this is not based on what you think but on how children are constantly confused and even more so if the correct words are being used at school, at the surgery or hospitals.

What is so correct about those words?  I think kids learning vernacular terms and expressions promotes imagination and valuable humor as well as creativity.  And the concept of synonyms is a valuable lesson in grammar, the sooner learned, the better.

I think we ought to be cautious about pouring kids into little molds, to be made into chocolate sheep later on.

Original Quill wrote:You are obsessed with doom and catastrophe in the world.  I remember the first Take Back the Night march in Tucson so many years ago.  The speakers emphasized that the worst thing you can do is give into the rapists and terrorists by teaching children fear and loathing.

And here you are, a one-trick pony, preaching that sexual predation is or should be a child's overwhelming preoccupation.  Subordinating childhood education and development to fear is the wrong way.

Thorin wrote:I am not obsessed with doom and gloom but properly educating children and see the sense here in doing so and hence back the points raised by someone who is an expert over that of you.

Original Quill wrote:

Thorin wrote:I am not obsessed with doom and gloom but properly educating children and see the sense here in doing so and hence back the points raised by someone who is an expert over that of you.

The concept you are espousing is, at early childhood development--the learning of language skills--we ought to bend childhood development to fear and loathing, and organize our vocabulary lessons around awareness of the evil all around us..  The message is that because there are rapists and terrorists out there, we should alter language skills we give our babies.

I wonder, if Shakespeare or Dickens had first learned to fear rapists and muggers, if we would even have such works as As You Like It or Oliver Twist.  The young men would be so possessed with proper words for body parts, there would be no room of a plot.

“Jayneen Sanders’ books do a wonderful job of helping parents to teach their children body safety and confidence in their own intuition. It’s sometimes not easy to talk about or teach these things, but it is very necessary living in the world we do. This is where Jay comes in… with sensitivity, lightness and wisdom she opens up these important conversations and helps children better understand their feelings, their bodies, their boundaries and what being safe feels like. Jayneen is an excellent writer.”

Thorin wrote:We live in a day and age where children are molested and sexually assaulted, where even worse it tends to happen more so by family members. To ignore this is to ignore the problem of child abuse itself and its basically ignorant on every level.

Thorin wrote:Educate2Empower Publishing is an international award winning niché children's book publisher who specializes in children's books on BODY SAFETY, CONSENT, GENDER EQUALITY and RESPECTFUL RELATIONSHIPS. Our books combine beautiful illustrations with key educational concepts capturing both the child's imagination as well as teaching them messages crucial to their development and safety. Educate2Empower Publishing also provides free resources for parents, carers and educators on these important topics.

“Jayneen Sanders’ books do a wonderful job of helping parents to teach their children body safety and confidence in their own intuition. It’s sometimes not easy to talk about or teach these things, but it is very necessary living in the world we do. This is where Jay comes in… with sensitivity, lightness and wisdom she opens up these important conversations and helps children better understand their feelings, their bodies, their boundaries and what being safe feels like. Jayneen is an excellent writer.”

— Maggie Dent, Parent Educato

https://e2epublishing.info/

Original Quill wrote:

Thorin wrote:We live in a day and age where children are molested and sexually assaulted, where even worse it tends to happen more so by family members. To ignore this is to ignore the problem of child abuse itself and its basically ignorant on every level.

But to make this so important that you shape your child's language development around fear of it, sends the wrong message.  It tells your child that the world is an evil place and life is only about constantly having your guard up.  Life is also about sunny days, dandelions,warm puppies and parakeets, too.

Having good defensive awareness skills is important, but not to the extend that you bend all other aspects of early childhood development to a preoccupation over it.  Jeeze...making early childhood vocabulary lessons about sexual predators is a bit much.

6. Using the correct anatomical terms helps explain to children the changes to their body as puberty kicks in. The topic can be discussed without making it into a joke or belittling its importance. Body parts such as the penis or vagina should be as “everyday” to your child as any other body part, for example, an elbow or nose.

7. If your child’s genitals are hurt or there is a medical problem, it is easier for your child to tell you and/or a health-care professional with more accuracy. For example, just recently a 7-year-old boy told both myself and the class I was teaching that he was unable to play sport because he had hurt his testicles. Not one child giggled and I was able to say with genuine concern, “No problem. I hope you feel better soon.”

Original Quill wrote:

Thorin wrote:Educate2Empower Publishing is an international award winning niché children's book publisher who specializes in children's books on BODY SAFETY, CONSENT, GENDER EQUALITY and RESPECTFUL RELATIONSHIPS. Our books combine beautiful illustrations with key educational concepts capturing both the child's imagination as well as teaching them messages crucial to their development and safety. Educate2Empower Publishing also provides free resources for parents, carers and educators on these important topics.

— Maggie Dent, Parent Educato

https://e2epublishing.info/

Sounds like Scientology indoctrination.

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:

Try not to make every post you now make to me personal ...ta.

As long as parents talk openly about EVERYTHING connected with their kids, I see no problem whatsoever in using words that a small child can easily grasp, and that the parent feels comfortable with.

The nanny state has a big enough hand in attempting to tell people how to bring their families up...telling parents what words to use for certain body parts is imo petty and pointless.

That is not being personal but trying to show that you are looking at this only from your perception.

So stop taking any criticism as personal, when its not

The point is you are not using empathic intelligence.

Again this is not based on what you think but on how children are constantly confused and even more so if the correct words are being used at school, at the surgery or hospitals. 

This is the point you failed to grasp, this is about helping educate children through the best ways possible and making up names just confuses the matter

So how you deem to use the correct terms for the body parts a nanny state, is just plain absurd.

Syl wrote:

Thorin wrote:


That is not being personal but trying to show that you are looking at this only from your perception.

So stop taking any criticism as personal, when its not

The point is you are not using empathic intelligence.

Again this is not based on what you think but on how children are constantly confused and even more so if the correct words are being used at school, at the surgery or hospitals. 

This is the point you failed to grasp, this is about helping educate children through the best ways possible and making up names just confuses the matter

So how you deem to use the correct terms for the body parts a nanny state, is just plain absurd.

Of course its a nanny state when parents are told how to bring their kids up in trivial matters that are personal to each individual family.
For generations kids have been taught pet names for certain things....it has done them no harm whatsoever.

I remember years ago parents were told it was ridiculous to call cows 'moo cows', or sheep 'baa sheep'....that was supposed to confuse the kids too.  
Every parent knows at a certain age kids will drop the moo and the baa....but when they are small it helps them.
Just as willy and wee will be dropped as they get a bit older and start to use the more grown up terms.

Thorin wrote:HERE ARE 8 VERY IMPORTANT REASONS WHY!

1. If a child is touched inappropriately, the child can tell a trusted adult on their Safety Network accurately, i.e. “XXXX touched me on my penis.” This has a lot more weight if the child’s accusations were to go to court.

2. If a child says to a parent or teacher, for example, “XXXX touched my cookie,” this may be discounted. If the child says, “XXXX touched my vagina,” the child will be much more likely to be listened to and taken seriously.

3. If a child says to the perpetrator, “Stop! Don’t touch my vagina!” the potential abuser knows this child is empowered with Body Safety knowledge. This child is less likely to be targeted. Also, pedophiles will be wary of the child who uses the correct names for the genitals because these are adult terms; and if the child does tell, adults will not easily dismiss the touch as “harmless fun.”

4. If your child’s starts to use “pet names,” you might question where they are hearing these, as your family uses the correct anatomical terms. This can be a red flag to grooming and abuse.

5. Using pet names with your child makes it easier for a pedophile to “off load” any complaints of inappropriate touch made by the child as just a “bit of fun” and easily dismissed by adults uneducated in Body Safety.

6. Using the correct anatomical terms helps explain to children the changes to their body as puberty kicks in. The topic can be discussed without making it into a joke or belittling its importance. Body parts such as the penis or vagina should be as “everyday” to your child as any other body part, for example, an elbow or nose.

7. If your child’s genitals are hurt or there is a medical problem, it is easier for your child to tell you and/or a health-care professional with more accuracy. For example, just recently a 7-year-old boy told both myself and the class I was teaching that he was unable to play sport because he had hurt his testicles. Not one child giggled and I was able to say with genuine concern, “No problem. I hope you feel better soon.”

8. Having pet names for your child’s private parts could inadvertently teach them that their private parts are places we shouldn’t speak about, and/or that they are “rude places.” This could, potentially, lead your child to believe that they must keep any inappropriate touch a secret.

In summary, what parents, care-givers, teachers and health-care professionals all want is to empower kids! Teaching them the correct anatomical names for the genitals is a closer step toward this outcome. There is no downside!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/8-reasons-not-to-call-your-childs-genitals-pet-names_us_58743186e4b0eb9e49bfbec3?section=us_parents

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:

Of course its a nanny state when parents are told how to bring their kids up in trivial matters that are personal to each individual family.
For generations kids have been taught pet names for certain things....it has done them no harm whatsoever.

I remember years ago parents were told it was ridiculous to call cows 'moo cows', or sheep 'baa sheep'....that was supposed to confuse the kids too.  
Every parent knows at a certain age kids will drop the moo and the baa....but when they are small it helps them.
Just as willy and wee will be dropped as they get a bit older and start to use the more grown up terms.

So child sex abuse is a trivial matter to you then?

Not worth responding to.

Again what this boils down to is embarrassment for parents, that they are afraid to call something what it really is. That they fear that their child might correctly use the term in public. So to claim this about how parents raise their children, when the reasoning behind the names, is based on their own embarrassment is why your reasoning falls apart. That is the only reason parents change the name, embarrassment, over something that should not even be embarrassed at all. If you normalize the correct terminology, then it ceases to be embarrassing.

Nothing to do with embarrassment ...it simply makes it easy for a very young child to use and remember the word...a pet name is friendlier than a formal name when kids are small.
Next you will be saying that no pet name must be used for anything or anyone....cos its confusing.

What generations?

The reality is as seen there is more to this, than just your perceptions and this is empowering children which can help protect children. I suggest you take your blinkers off and see the reasons that have been put forth on this and start placing the needs of the child first here and not the embarrassed views of some parents

Fred Moletrousers wrote:Since when has it been the prerogative of an NHS Trust - or the Huffington Post, for that matter - to presume that it has the right to instruct parents on how to bring up their children?

Syl wrote:

Not worth responding to.

Nothing to do with embarrassment ...it simply makes it easy for a very young child to use and remember the word...a pet name is friendlier than a formal name when kids are small.
Next you will be saying that no pet name must be used for anything or anyone....cos its confusing.  


Its not protecting children at all....that's a load of mumbo jumbo....do you really think a paedophile will run for the hills because a child uses the correct terminology and says "get off my vagina?"....ye Gods.....Ive heard it all now.

HERE ARE 8 VERY IMPORTANT REASONS WHY!

1. If a child is touched inappropriately, the child can tell a trusted adult on their Safety Network accurately, i.e. “XXXX touched me on my penis.” This has a lot more weight if the child’s accusations were to go to court.

2. If a child says to a parent or teacher, for example, “XXXX touched my cookie,” this may be discounted. If the child says, “XXXX touched my vagina,” the child will be much more likely to be listened to and taken seriously.

3. If a child says to the perpetrator, “Stop! Don’t touch my vagina!” the potential abuser knows this child is empowered with Body Safety knowledge. This child is less likely to be targeted. Also, pedophiles will be wary of the child who uses the correct names for the genitals because these are adult terms; and if the child does tell, adults will not easily dismiss the touch as “harmless fun.”

4. If your child’s starts to use “pet names,” you might question where they are hearing these, as your family uses the correct anatomical terms. This can be a red flag to grooming and abuse.

5. Using pet names with your child makes it easier for a pedophile to “off load” any complaints of inappropriate touch made by the child as just a “bit of fun” and easily dismissed by adults uneducated in Body Safety.

6. Using the correct anatomical terms helps explain to children the changes to their body as puberty kicks in. The topic can be discussed without making it into a joke or belittling its importance. Body parts such as the penis or vagina should be as “everyday” to your child as any other body part, for example, an elbow or nose.

7. If your child’s genitals are hurt or there is a medical problem, it is easier for your child to tell you and/or a health-care professional with more accuracy. For example, just recently a 7-year-old boy told both myself and the class I was teaching that he was unable to play sport because he had hurt his testicles. Not one child giggled and I was able to say with genuine concern, “No problem. I hope you feel better soon.”

8. Having pet names for your child’s private parts could inadvertently teach them that their private parts are places we shouldn’t speak about, and/or that they are “rude places.” This could, potentially, lead your child to believe that they must keep any inappropriate touch a secret.

In summary, what parents, care-givers, teachers and health-care professionals all want is to empower kids! Teaching them the correct anatomical names for the genitals is a closer step toward this outcome. There is no downside!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/8-reasons-not-to-call-your-childs-genitals-pet-names_us_58743186e4b0eb9e49bfbec3?section=us_parents

HoratioTarr wrote:Surely 'winkie' and 'tuppence' are much cuter for little uns and completely harmless.   I don't know what all the fuss is about.  

Syl wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

I dislike some of the formal English names, too.  I always associate penis with urinating (pee-ing), and vulva with a Swedish automobile.  I prefer mentula and cunus, Latin words for the same.  Classy, and just as easy to pronounce.

Mentula and Cunis sounds like a posh shop I bought a marble table from once.

magica wrote:These kids are 2 or 3 and older,  I don't think they need to know vagina at that age.

They know names as soon as they get older. Let them be kids for as long as they can.

magica wrote:These kids are 2 or 3 and older,  I don't think they need to know vagina at that age.

They know names as soon as they get older. Let them be kids for as long as they can.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Syl wrote:

Mentula and Cunis sounds like a posh shop I bought a marble table from once.

I had a friend who actually thought Fellatio was a  pizza topping.

HoratioTarr wrote:

magica wrote:These kids are 2 or 3 and older,  I don't think they need to know vagina at that age.

They know names as soon as they get older. Let them be kids for as long as they can.

Are there any kids harmed by not using the 'correct' terminology?    I doubt it.   Let kids be kids, I say, too.  Soon enough they learn otherwise.  It's entirely up to the parents what terminology they use.

Thorin wrote:

magica wrote:These kids are 2 or 3 and older,  I don't think they need to know vagina at that age.

They know names as soon as they get older. Let them be kids for as long as they can.

What stops them still being kids, by knowing that their arm is an arm, that their leg is a leg, and their penis, is a penis?

magica wrote:

Thorin wrote:

What stops them still being kids, by knowing that their arm is an arm, that their leg is a leg, and their penis, is a penis?

Why should they need to know that at such a young age. It's not for me. Parents should say what they want about sexual parts.

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:

Not worth responding to.

Nothing to do with embarrassment ...it simply makes it easy for a very young child to use and remember the word...a pet name is friendlier than a formal name when kids are small.
Next you will be saying that no pet name must be used for anything or anyone....cos its confusing.  


Its not protecting children at all....that's a load of mumbo jumbo....do you really think a paedophile will run for the hills because a child uses the correct terminology and says "get off my vagina?"....ye Gods.....Ive heard it all now.

1) Yes it is worth responding to

HERE ARE 8 VERY IMPORTANT REASONS WHY!

1. If a child is touched inappropriately, the child can tell a trusted adult on their Safety Network accurately, i.e. “XXXX touched me on my penis.” This has a lot more weight if the child’s accusations were to go to court.

2. If a child says to a parent or teacher, for example, “XXXX touched my cookie,” this may be discounted. If the child says, “XXXX touched my vagina,” the child will be much more likely to be listened to and taken seriously.

3. If a child says to the perpetrator, “Stop! Don’t touch my vagina!” the potential abuser knows this child is empowered with Body Safety knowledge. This child is less likely to be targeted. Also, pedophiles will be wary of the child who uses the correct names for the genitals because these are adult terms; and if the child does tell, adults will not easily dismiss the touch as “harmless fun.”

4. If your child’s starts to use “pet names,” you might question where they are hearing these, as your family uses the correct anatomical terms. This can be a red flag to grooming and abuse.

5. Using pet names with your child makes it easier for a pedophile to “off load” any complaints of inappropriate touch made by the child as just a “bit of fun” and easily dismissed by adults uneducated in Body Safety.

6. Using the correct anatomical terms helps explain to children the changes to their body as puberty kicks in. The topic can be discussed without making it into a joke or belittling its importance. Body parts such as the penis or vagina should be as “everyday” to your child as any other body part, for example, an elbow or nose.

7. If your child’s genitals are hurt or there is a medical problem, it is easier for your child to tell you and/or a health-care professional with more accuracy. For example, just recently a 7-year-old boy told both myself and the class I was teaching that he was unable to play sport because he had hurt his testicles. Not one child giggled and I was able to say with genuine concern, “No problem. I hope you feel better soon.”

8. Having pet names for your child’s private parts could inadvertently teach them that their private parts are places we shouldn’t speak about, and/or that they are “rude places.” This could, potentially, lead your child to believe that they must keep any inappropriate touch a secret.

In summary, what parents, care-givers, teachers and health-care professionals all want is to empower kids! Teaching them the correct anatomical names for the genitals is a closer step toward this outcome. There is no downside!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/8-reasons-not-to-call-your-childs-genitals-pet-names_us_58743186e4b0eb9e49bfbec3?section=us_parents

2) Really, how is any easier to remember cookie over the correct names?
That is just plain absurd on every level and again this does boil down to embarrassment.
Again why else change the name?
Because parents are embarrassed to use the correct terminology

3) So mumbo jumbo, based on you not actually discounting the points raised

wow

So far not one person has offered up a valid reason to use pet names for sexual parts at all.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Syl wrote:

Mentula and Cunis sounds like a posh shop I bought a marble table from once.

I had a friend who actually thought Fellatio was a  pizza topping.

Syl wrote:

Thorin wrote:

1) Yes it is worth responding to



2) Really, how is any easier to remember cookie over the correct names?
That is just plain absurd on every level and again this does boil down to embarrassment.
Again why else change the name?
Because parents are embarrassed to use the correct terminology

3) So mumbo jumbo, based on you not actually discounting the points raised

wow

So far not one person has offered up a valid reason to use pet names for sexual parts at all.

Yes they have, you just don't listen...and the simple fact is they obviously don't agree with the OP...and all the brow beating and the continuous posting of the same list (four times so far) doesn't seem to be changing anyone opinion Thor.

magica wrote:

Thorin wrote:

What stops them still being kids, by knowing that their arm is an arm, that their leg is a leg, and their penis, is a penis?

Why should they need to know that at such a young age. It's not for me. Parents should say what they want about sexual parts.

Syl wrote:

HoratioTarr wrote:

I had a friend who actually thought Fellatio was a  pizza topping.

How stupid....surely everyone knows its best on toast.

HoratioTarr wrote:

magica wrote:

Why should they need to know that at such a young age. It's not for me. Parents should say what they want about sexual parts.

It's all about personal choice.   I don't think there's anything wrong with very young kids having their parents use either medical terminology or cute euphemisms.   It's my bet the majority of parents use the euphemisms though.   Some are handed down through generation after generation.

Thorin wrote:

Syl wrote:

Yes they have, you just don't listen...and the simple fact is they obviously don't agree with the OP...and all the brow beating and the continuous posting of the same list (four times so far) doesn't seem to be changing anyone opinion Thor.

So its all a joke to you, wow there is a surprise, not.

I am all for different opinions and have taken them on board, but as seen none are valid reasons.

Not trying to change anyone's opinion, but reason my points

If you cannot take my criticism of poor arguments, that is your problem not mine.

Syl wrote:

Thorin wrote:

So its all a joke to you, wow there is a surprise, not.

I am all for different opinions and have taken them on board, but as seen none are valid reasons.

Not trying to change anyone's opinion, but reason my points

If you cannot take my criticism of poor arguments, that is your problem not mine.

I do think its a bit amusing yes, because I don't think it matters.
Far more serious is the way some people think they can tell other parents how best to bring up their children...when certain things (like what names of body parts  to teach a young child) are personal choice.

There is no right or wrong, to bring in a load of rubbish about paedophiles being scared off if a child uses the more adult terminology is a load of crap imo.
If there was any evidence of this I would be interested, till then, I suggest the so called 'expert' thinks of something more worthwhile to try to belittle parents with.