Are large families such a bad thing?

veya_victaous wrote:we don't need more 'workers'
it's not some 1800's steam factory.

the issue is the indigenous european doesn't want to work in the service jobs that are needed to support and aging population. and it just makes it worse for all future generations to support this one freckless and wasteful generation.  



the current lot of 60 pluses just need to be cut lose. they have spent far more than the generated already.  spending any more on them is just throwing good money after bad.

Lord Foul wrote:your generation...the one that couldnt be arsed to get out of its stoned/drunken stupor to vote in the most important vote for years .......and the cried because the result wasnt to their liking...

Lord Foul wrote:unlike your "we want it all pshoved up our arses and dont want to actually WORK for anything generation

I mean ...look at yourself....never done a days real work in your life...

your very occupation, by definition is relaxation and hobby...

8 hrs? spent poking a key board  pffft.....

Jules wrote:Are they?
Do you come from a large family of siblings and if so, do you consider it a positive thing?

There were 7 of us but one younger brother died when I was just a kid myself and one died in hospital when he was about 30 odd so 5 of us left
but I only speak to my sisters now and not my brother so only 4 as far as i'm concerned LOL!



Following on from the thread about this mother who was being criticised ....  I thought, "there's another way of looking at this: -

surely these kids are the workers of tomorrow!" ( Provided of course their mum brings them up to be honest and hardworking, and allows them to get the full benefit of the universal free education avaiable to them,  oh and not too many unhealthy eating habits.)


The birthrate in the indigenous population is dwindling here in Britain  and indeed all over Europe.  If there are gripes about importing the workforce from abroad to support an ageing population, surely the odd large UK family which bucks the trend is to be welcomed?


With those sturdy legs and childbearing hips, she has "earth mother" written all over her, so let her get on with it and have however many she wants.  I mean, she cannot make a career in any glamour work, which is very lucrative for those with the right physical attributes,  neither has she gone down the path of getting good post qualifications in order to secure a good career.  

The Devil, You Know wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:we don't need more 'workers'
it's not some 1800's steam factory.

the issue is the indigenous european doesn't want to work in the service jobs that are needed to support and aging population. and it just makes it worse for all future generations to support this one freckless and wasteful generation.  



the current lot of 60 pluses just need to be cut lose. they have spent far more than the generated already.  spending any more on them is just throwing good money after bad.

I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

veya_victaous wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

UMM what do you think self-funded retirement is? The ONLY sort of retirement my generation is offered

NO my generation is not as selfish as the current retirement to expect BOTH past and future generations to fund our spoilt lives.

I mean fuck we couldn't rely on the past, and the current generation has not left much hope for the future...
even as you demand to more after not only spending everything but borrowing against every as well, You then Go a fuck the future economy because your geriatric minds can't handle change.

blackie333 wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:



UMM what do you think self-funded retirement is? The ONLY sort of retirement my generation is offered

NO my generation is not as selfish as the current retirement to expect BOTH past and future generations to fund our spoilt lives.

I mean fuck we couldn't rely on the past, and the current generation has not left much hope for the future...
even as you demand to more after not only spending everything but borrowing against every as well, You then Go a fuck the future economy because your geriatric minds can't handle change.

veya_victaous wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

UMM what do you think self-funded retirement is? The ONLY sort of retirement my generation is offered

NO my generation is not as selfish as the current retirement to expect BOTH past and future generations to fund our spoilt lives.

I mean fuck we couldn't rely on the past, and the current generation has not left much hope for the future...
even as you demand to more after not only spending everything but borrowing against every as well, You then Go a fuck the future economy because your geriatric minds can't handle change.

• As a teenager I was told to opt out of SERPS and I arranged a private pension
  At 19 I started work for a global company and had a non-contributory final pension salary scheme.  My company opted out of SERPS
  After about 10 years I was asked to contribute to that scheme and starting at around 3% it gradually increased to 7%
  It then reduced to the amount of their monthly contributions and they opted back into SERPS
  Final Salary was then banked for the years served and average salary adopted
  Now they are removing our Defined Benefits Scheme and we are being asked to contribute to a defined contribution scheme with no guarantees
  

feelthelove wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:



UMM what do you think self-funded retirement is? The ONLY sort of retirement my generation is offered

NO my generation is not as selfish as the current retirement to expect BOTH past and future generations to fund our spoilt lives.

I mean fuck we couldn't rely on the past, and the current generation has not left much hope for the future...
even as you demand to more after not only spending everything but borrowing against every as well, You then Go a fuck the future economy because your geriatric minds can't handle change.

Hi Veya, hope you're well x

My experience of self funded retirement has been a constant change of goal posts.......

• As a teenager I was told to opt out of SERPS and I arranged a private pension
  At 19 I started work for a global company and had a non-contributory final pension salary scheme.  My company opted out of SERPS
  After about 10 years I was asked to contribute to that scheme and starting at around 3% it gradually increased to 7%
  It then reduced to the amount of their monthly contributions and they opted back into SERPS
  Final Salary was then banked for the years served and average salary adopted
  Now they are removing our Defined Benefits Scheme and we are being asked to contribute to a defined contribution scheme with no guarantees
  

Over nearly 30 years the goal posts have been constantly changed.  I was due to have my old age pension at 60, it's now 67 and who knows what it will be when I eventually retire if ever????

It is impossible to plan when things change so regularly, the choices I made when I was 20 should have adequately kept me in retirement, at 30, at 35, at 40, at 45 but at no fault of my own that those choices made in good faith have left me in a vulnerable position.

You can make all the provision and plans you like but there are so many factors you are unable to control

blackie333 wrote:

blackie333 wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:



UMM what do you think self-funded retirement is? The ONLY sort of retirement my generation is offered

NO my generation is not as selfish as the current retirement to expect BOTH past and future generations to fund our spoilt lives.

I mean fuck we couldn't rely on the past, and the current generation has not left much hope for the future...
even as you demand to more after not only spending everything but borrowing against every as well, You then Go a fuck the future economy because your geriatric minds can't handle change.

I'm 53 and started work three days after leaving school.
You kids dont have a clue nowadays, if we didn't work we'd have nowt.
The wages were crap but at at least you had a few bob in your pocket lol.

feelthelove wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

UMM what do you think self-funded retirement is? The ONLY sort of retirement my generation is offered

NO my generation is not as selfish as the current retirement to expect BOTH past and future generations to fund our spoilt lives.

I mean fuck we couldn't rely on the past, and the current generation has not left much hope for the future...
even as you demand to more after not only spending everything but borrowing against every as well, You then Go a fuck the future economy because your geriatric minds can't handle change.

Hi Veya, hope you're well x

My experience of self funded retirement has been a constant change of goal posts.......

• As a teenager I was told to opt out of SERPS and I arranged a private pension
  At 19 I started work for a global company and had a non-contributory final pension salary scheme.  My company opted out of SERPS
  After about 10 years I was asked to contribute to that scheme and starting at around 3% it gradually increased to 7%
  It then reduced to the amount of their monthly contributions and they opted back into SERPS
  Final Salary was then banked for the years served and average salary adopted
  Now they are removing our Defined Benefits Scheme and we are being asked to contribute to a defined contribution scheme with no guarantees
  

Over nearly 30 years the goal posts have been constantly changed.  I was due to have my old age pension at 60, it's now 67 and who knows what it will be when I eventually retire if ever????

It is impossible to plan when things change so regularly, the choices I made when I was 20 should have adequately kept me in retirement, decisions made at 30, at 35, at 40, at 45 should have made provision but at no fault of my own that those choices made in good faith have left me in a vulnerable position.

You can make all the provision and plans you like but there are so many factors you are unable to control

veya_victaous wrote:

blackie333 wrote:

I'm 53 and started work three days after leaving school.
You kids dont have a clue nowadays, if we didn't work we'd have nowt.
The wages were crap but at at least you had a few bob in your pocket lol.

lazy prick
you DIDN'T work and go to school at the same time?          

I worked 20-30 hours a week while at school (the last 3 1/2 years of it anyway)
and worked all the way through uni too

You lazy old buggers
No idea
wait till ya finish school to get a job PFFTT

blackie333 wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

blackie333 wrote:

I'm 53 and started work three days after leaving school.
You kids dont have a clue nowadays, if we didn't work we'd have nowt.
The wages were crap but at at least you had a few bob in your pocket lol.

lazy prick
you DIDN'T work and go to school at the same time?          

I worked 20-30 hours a week while at school (the last 3 1/2 years of it anyway)
and worked all the way through uni too

You lazy old buggers
No idea
wait till ya finish school to get a job PFFTT

We could all sit at a school desk reading a few books and call it study but basically it's laziness.
Go out and get a real job you idle gits!

The Devil, You Know wrote:please dont whine about 4x4's if you decide to have a large family. a child is far more carbon heavy than a gas guzzler.

if you can support a large family then that is your choice, it should not be the responsibility for the state to support them.
I would suggest instead of child benefits for each kid, taxes are raised for each one after the first 2.

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

HoratioTarr wrote:

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

Me too.  I've worked all my life, and I'm still at it.  I don't think I want to retire at the moment, as I feel work keeps you active and fit.    I had a brief period of being on benefits way back in the 70's when my waste of space spouse decided being a father was just too much for him.  Trust me, you got fuck all back then.   I was lucky to have free child care so that I could go back to work.   Sadly, they don't offer that anymore.  

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

another lazy one
to spoilt to do both

I mean the Older generation had it so easy
a home was only like 5 time the average yearly wage, not 12 times the average yearly wage
Plus they didn't have SO MANY pensioners draining the system.

really they had it all so cheap the fact that they could even afford to live on labourers wage, I mean how privledged a generation to think that with only 40 hours manual labour they could buy homes.

Syl wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

another lazy one
to spoilt to do both

I mean the Older generation had it so easy
a home was only like 5 time the average yearly wage, not 12 times the average yearly wage
Plus they didn't have SO MANY pensioners draining the system.

really they had it all so cheap the fact that they could even afford to live on labourers wage, I mean how privledged a generation to think that with only 40 hours manual labour they could buy homes.

True there were not so many pensioners, the two WW's saw to that....men gave their lives for their countries in those days, so spoilt brats of the future could live in comfort.  
I worked a 40 plus hour week for £4 when I first started work.....no minimum wage back then.
Few people of the working classes had cars, probably why so few were fat.

Oddly people were happy, then as now we lived life to the full without complaint....even though many died prematurely through hard graft and poor working conditions.....and even if there had been benefits people had pride back then and preferred to work for their money rather than take handouts.

The Devil, You Know wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:we don't need more 'workers'
it's not some 1800's steam factory.

the issue is the indigenous european doesn't want to work in the service jobs that are needed to support and aging population. and it just makes it worse for all future generations to support this one freckless and wasteful generation.  



the current lot of 60 pluses just need to be cut lose. they have spent far more than the generated already.  spending any more on them is just throwing good money after bad.

I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

Ben Reilly wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

Cut the threats of violence.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

The Devil, You Know wrote:
I cant wait for you to be cut loose when you hit retirement age. assuming that someone doesn't flatten you with a hammer before that.

Cut the threats of violence.

Where was the threat of violence?

Ben Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Where was the threat of violence?

If you have to ask you'll never know.

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:

True there were not so many pensioners, the two WW's saw to that....men gave their lives for their countries in those days, so spoilt brats of the future could live in comfort.  
I worked a 40 plus hour week for £4 when I first started work.....no minimum wage back then.
Few people of the working classes had cars, probably why so few were fat.

Oddly people were happy, then as now we lived life to the full without complaint....even though many died prematurely through hard graft and poor working conditions.....and even if there had been benefits people had pride back then and preferred to work for their money rather than take handouts.

LOL they got heaps of handouts in the form of subsidies instead of direct payments and lack of fee/regulation

Victor, Who started this, even whinges that Now there is so much regulation it is immposible to earn an honest living.. well WHO made the world that way? the baby boomer once established sort to increase the 'requirement of entry' in the market to prevent young up and comers taking over their businesses.


Typical trying to classify the benefits your generation received as something other than a hand out.
and even with no minimum wage it was still higer in comparison to cost of living.

Raggamuffin wrote:

Ben Reilly wrote:

Raggamuffin wrote:

Where was the threat of violence?

If you have to ask you'll never know.

There wasn't a threat, except in your imagination ...

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:

True there were not so many pensioners, the two WW's saw to that....men gave their lives for their countries in those days, so spoilt brats of the future could live in comfort.  
I worked a 40 plus hour week for £4 when I first started work.....no minimum wage back then.
Few people of the working classes had cars, probably why so few were fat.

Oddly people were happy, then as now we lived life to the full without complaint....even though many died prematurely through hard graft and poor working conditions.....and even if there had been benefits people had pride back then and preferred to work for their money rather than take handouts.

LOL they got heaps of handouts in the form of subsidies instead of direct payments and lack of fee/regulation

Victor, Who started this, even whinges that Now there is so much regulation it is immposible to earn an honest living.. well WHO made the world that way? the baby boomer once established sort to increase the 'requirement of entry' in the market to prevent young up and comers taking over their businesses.


Typical trying to classify the benefits your generation received as something other than a hand out.
and even with no minimum wage it was still higer in comparison to cost of living.

Syl wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

LOL they got heaps of handouts in the form of subsidies instead of direct payments and lack of fee/regulation

Victor, Who started this, even whinges that Now there is so much regulation it is immposible to earn an honest living.. well WHO made the world that way? the baby boomer once established sort to increase the 'requirement of entry' in the market to prevent young up and comers taking over their businesses.


Typical trying to classify the benefits your generation received as something other than a hand out.
and even with no minimum wage it was still higer in comparison to cost of living.

Depends which generation you are talking about...my generation, ( the after the war babies born in the late 40's to the late 50's) had some advantages it's true...there were plenty jobs because the population had been diminished thanks to the war. But rationing was still going on, and the poverty of those days could not be compared to the poverty of today.


Just to highlight the difference between past and present...my grandson is away from home at uni, he is slumming it in a shared house as most students do.
The houses they live in are palaces compared to where many hard working, working class people lived in in the 40's to the 70's. If students were offered houses with no electric, no hot water, outside loos, tin baths.....there would be uproar.

That however was the reality for many of my generation.

veya_victaous wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

another lazy one
to spoilt to do both

I mean the Older generation had it so easy
a home was only like 5 time the average yearly wage, not 12 times the average yearly wage
Plus they didn't have SO MANY pensioners draining the system.

really they had it all so cheap the fact that they could even afford to live on labourers wage, I mean how privledged a generation to think that with only 40 hours manual labour they could buy homes.

WhoseYourWolfie wrote:

veya_victaous wrote:

Syl wrote:I had a full time  job a few days after my 15th birthday.... no being pampered at college and uni for my working class generation, you had to bring in a wage.

another lazy one
to spoilt to do both

I mean the Older generation had it so easy
a home was only like 5 time the average yearly wage, not 12 times the average yearly wage
Plus they didn't have SO MANY pensioners draining the system.

really they had it all so cheap the fact that they could even afford to live on labourers wage, I mean how privledged a generation to think that with only 40 hours manual labour they could buy homes.

Your figures are basically bullshit, veya...

"Median" prices for Houses in greater Sydney are 11->> 12 times the average national wage, (not the average Sydney wage -- which is about $20k higher..).

Melbourne median house prices about 10 times the median national wage..
Out in the regions, about 6->>7 times, get out in rural areas, it drops to 3-->>5 times.
Just a pity there aren't any real fulltime jobs out there any more..      

And there's simply no way that "40 hours" of labourer's wages would build a house !
That nonsense is pure dreaming..        


AS FOR Baby Boomer property investors and speculators -- less than 20% have investment properties..
And there's still a sizeable proportion don't own their own homes, for one reason or another...

The main greed-fuelled source of property investors driving up house prices around the Hunter Valley and Central Coast regions over the past couple of decades haven't been Baby Boomers, per se, but rather highly paid workers in the coal mining, building and technology sectors -- including many X and Y gen'..

Indeed, three of the house sales around here over the last couple of years have been to men aged in their 20s and early 30s.


        As for "free" university education, Gough Whitlam introduced that in 1973 -- halfway through the Baby Boomer generation, and HECS fees were imposed in the late 80s...

Lord Foul wrote:hmmm...I cant reacall anyone giving ME any "hand outs"

and I have always paid the going rate of tax(and then some considering VAT etc....)

oh and I do beleive that most of the tax fraudsters and avoiders are of the generation below me....

the 40-50 yo lot.....

oh and its folks like YOU that are facilitating the loss of jobs...ever thought of THAT..

YOU provide the "computerisation of industry" that destroys jobs.......(ok its inevitable)  but you have no idea of how to handle the equally inevitable result....

dont blame ME for that....

(hint....there is ONLY one REAL answer)