Trump - Poll

I do not know how to do a proper poll, please excuse me.

Will Donald Trump in your own opinion ever become President of the USA

Please answer YES or NO only

No

although given the fact that the yanks are iredeemeably barmey, I wouldnt put a whole wad of cash on it

No chance, is there?

You can now add a vote at the top.

A definitive no. While all the talk is about how he's doing among Republicans, you can't compare Republicans to the rest of the nation. Among the general U.S. public, Trump is viewed quite negatively even when you include the support he gets among Republicans: http://elections.huffingtonpost.com/pollster/donald-trump-favorable-rating

Absoluely no, don't think even the Americans are that stupid.  Sorry Ben lol

No but only becasue America (or rather, those who control America), will never let him
It's fixed to go a certain way obviously.

What!   He's a screaming nut case, if he ever got in you could wave goodbye to the world Eddie.

eddie wrote:No but only becasue America (or rather, those who control America),  will never let him
It's fixed to go a certain way obviously.

The only recent evidence of election tampering has been to help George W. Bush.

sassy wrote:What!   He's a screaming nut case, if he ever got in you could wave goodbye to the world Eddie.

Yes or No please

Ben_Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:No but only becasue America (or rather, those who control America),  will never let him
It's fixed to go a certain way obviously.

The only recent evidence of election tampering has been to help George W. Bush.

Hahahahahahahaha yes Ben, that's right Ben, keep believing.

sassy wrote:What!   He's a screaming nut case, if he ever got in you could wave goodbye to the world Eddie.

I didn't say I think he should, I said he won't, because "America" (not the people), don't want a free-thinker, do they?

I'll say no, but I could be wrong.

eddie wrote:

sassy wrote:What!   He's a screaming nut case, if he ever got in you could wave goodbye to the world Eddie.

I didn't  say I think he should, I said he won't, because "America" (not the people), don't want a free-thinker, do they?

I take offense to the notion that someone who is racist and xenophobic is a free thinker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freethought

Anyone who thinks for himself is a free-thinker, even if he has views that are alien to mine.

eddie wrote:Anyone who thinks for himself is a free-thinker, even if he has views that are alien to mine.

Again, I must take offense:









To call this "thinking" is an insult to the time-honored institution of human thought.

Huh? Are you for real?

Now I know why you posted that IRA video - and I defended you because I know at heart how you meant it - but that was rather a "Trump" moment for you - wasn't it?

Should we have said you had no right to say it and because you did, you're not a "free-thinker"?
That makes no sense.

You really need to think before replying Ben, you've created a double standard for yourself.

eddie wrote:No but only becasue America (or rather, those who control America),  will never let him
It's fixed to go a certain way obviously.

I say Yes (maybe) but for the same reason

Trump is the opposite of a freethinker he is a purpose built distraction
the free thinker is Bernie Sanders,
The Hilary and Trump Combo will stop him getting up.



Besides we all know Trump being elected president is one of the portents of the Apocalypse

eddie wrote:Huh? Are you for real?

Now I know why you posted that IRA video - and I defended you because I know at heart how you meant it - but that was rather a "Trump" moment for you - wasn't it?

Should we have said you had no right to say it and because you did, you're not a "free-thinker"?
That makes no sense.

You really need to think before replying Ben, you've created a double standard for yourself.

You'll notice I'm not running for president.

Ben_Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Huh? Are you for real?

Now I know why you posted that IRA video - and I defended you because I know at heart how you meant it - but that was rather a "Trump" moment for you - wasn't it?

Should we have said you had no right to say it and because you did, you're not a "free-thinker"?
That makes no sense.

You really need to think before replying Ben, you've created a double standard for yourself.

You'll notice I'm not running for president.

Lol cop out answer

No.

And Eds you make no sense.

Trump is no really anti-establishment. He IS establishment, he is just really anti-foreign (inc Muslim).

This is a multi billionaire who wines and dines with the rich and powerful around the world. He is exactly the man you would normally put as the controlling 1%!

Yet because he is un-PC you hold him up as a free thinking hero. Apparently for you free thinking means being racist in a world where racism is frowned upon.

Trump is a nasty piece of work who is only interested in preserving the wealth of the richest. Along with his 'heroic' hate speech that is what will stop him ever becoming President. Not some balmy conspiracy to keep a mega rich establishment businessman out of office.

Eilzel wrote:No.

And Eds you make no sense.

Trump is no really anti-establishment. He IS establishment, he is just really anti-foreign (inc Muslim).

This is a multi billionaire who wines and dines with the rich and powerful around the world. He is exactly the man you would normally put as the controlling 1%!

Yet because he is un-PC you hold him up as a free thinking hero. Apparently for you free thinking means being racist in a world where racism is frowned upon.

Trump is a nasty piece of work who is only interested in preserving the wealth of the richest. Along with his 'heroic' hate speech that is what will stop him ever becoming President. Not some balmy conspiracy to keep a mega rich establishment businessman out of office.

I've already said I don't like him Les, I'm not singing his praises!
He is a free-thinker in today's world yes, he says what he thinks and feels free to say it.

I have no idea what you and Ben call free-thinking?

Actually I think quill is bang on the money: perhaps  he's there to stop the other guy In The running?

Who isn't a free thinker then? Are only free thinkers if we are offensive now?

My point is he is as establishment as its possible to be and yet you seem to think there's a conspiracy against him. Wtf?

Eilzel wrote:Who isn't a free thinker then? Are only free thinkers if we are offensive now?

My point is he is as establishment as its possible to be and yet you seem to think there's a conspiracy against him. Wtf?

I said that I think quill may be on to something - it's his notion - ask him

And why is it so hard for you to think that it's IMPOSSIBLE that higher powers fix things?
You think if "they" didn't want someone in office then they'd leave it up to the pubic?
Really?

You may think I am mistrusting, I think you're too trusting.

I just don't see how you can think Trump is a likely candidate they'd fix things against. You seem to be avoiding that. He is an ultra powerful man with limitless resources. It is also staggering that you really think Trump isn't such an idiot that he couldn't lose an election by anything other than it being fixed against him.

Maybe he does know? Maybe he'll get rich from it or something else?
Use your imagination Les. Anything you can imagine, or a writer of the big screen can....well.....

Don't just simply accept. Quill's notion was interesting and plausible and possible.
That's all I'm saying.

I feel like thesedays any story that appears in the news has one angle, an alternative angle, an oppositionist angle, and a hapoy clappy fairy tale version of events...

Trump knows if he loses at least he will have had a moment in the spotlight- that's it.

But if he loses, you no doubt will interpret that as proving it was a fix all along, and not in fact proof that most Americans aren't racist idiots.

I don't think anything is impossible. Santa's exist isn't impossible- but for you- everything is a conspiracy and nothing can be discussed without one being brought into it.

No  I don't believe everything is a conspiracy - that's ridiculous. There are tons of things I don't question - simply because they make sense - and when I google them, no one else seems to think it's a conspiracy either, becaeue the story makes sense.

I don't even believe this trump thing is a conspiracy - I was merely open to suggestion that it might be, why wouldn't I? I'll never find out one way or the other will I? We will never know one way or the other will we?

See the difference is, I don't 100% believe anything. Les, as I've said countless times, I can only believe something I witness.
What can you know for sure about anything? You take a stranger's word (media being a stranger for example) for something and don't question it???

How can you take a stranger's word as an absolute?

I think eds is referring to my hypothesis that Trump might be a plant, set amid the pack of crazies to see how much turmoil he can stir up before he throws up his arms and says, Just kidding, folks!

I mean, it's all so absurd.  He's absurd.  What he is saying is outlandish.  How he's going about it is unreal.  The nation's reaction is absurd.  Why not?

Set the stage: Les is right, Trump's rich and powerful.  But he doesn't fit the mold of the Koch Brothers.  He's urban, from liberal New York.  He's not gray flannel.  He's not unassuming and quiet, with huge mansions on Long Island.  He has this strange, enigmatic ego, that might put him up to strange doings.  He's actually good friends with the Clintons (they were invited to his wedding), and Hillary is running on the other side.  He used to be pro-abortion, now he's anti...what's up with that?  He's actually a newcomer...his past dalliances cannot be taken seriously.  He's part of this antipodean element that is against the establishment.  He almost deliberately says things that are outrageous.  What if he's playing a game?  

All of this against the background of Republicans who say ridiculous things, who are surreptitiously racist, who take the ridiculous position of shutting down the government, who lie, who start wars, who rape, kidnap, torture and murder--all for ego reasons--and care not a wit for the people...I mean, is it so outlandish to speculate that he is playing one HUGE joke on the American public?  On the world, in fact?

Now, I don't really believe this.  But to play out the theory, he might be doing all this to actually see how much he can get away with....to be as outlandish as possible, only to say (sometime after he wins one or two of the primaries) Just kidding, folks...just pointing out how ridiculous Republicans are.  Hahaha.  Oh, and um, vote for my friend Hillary.

I mean...C'mon, how outlandish are Republican anyway???  Is this really so off-the-board?

Trump is quite vile, but amazingly he has some support.

The only grace in his favour is he openly says what he would do if he ever became president. How much worse would it be if he hid his motives and managed to get in.

Syl wrote:Trump is quite vile, but amazingly he has some support.

The only grace in his favour is he openly says what he would do if he ever became president. How much worse would it be if he hid his motives and managed to get in...

...as do all the other Republican candidates.  The Republican counterculture that is supporting Trump is that same element that supported lies and wars, kidnapping, rape, false imprisonment, torture, and murder under the Bush administration.  I have been doing a prolonged double-take for over a decade now...so I'm actually numb to the likes of Donald Trump. I have built up an immunity to this kind of stuff, but it's still quite real.

We don't have anybody vying for power as openly mad as Trump here....but we have enough liars, bullies and self serving sycophants to contend with.

Who can be trusted?....imo none of them.

Nothing is so off the board. Nothing.

Syl wrote:We don't have anybody vying for power as openly mad as Trump here....but we have enough liars, bullies and self serving sycophants to contend with.

Who can be trusted?....imo none of them.

Yes, Brits are more reserved, aren't they?  You haven't had anybody like this guy since Churchill...and Churchill was one of the good-guys.

Actually, its odd that this happens over on the Republican bench.  Republicans were always the staid, old, business-like, patriotic side of American politics.  The man in the gray-flannel suit.  Who knew they had this side to them?  

I think the trauma of 9-11, plus the Iraq War atrocities of the Republicans George W. Bush/Richard Cheney, brought this out in them.  They always had nationalistic views, but that war brought out the turbulent, raucous side of them.  

Then on the heels of all that trauma, Republicans were horrified to witness a black man become president of the United State, and, despite all the lip-service paid to freedom and equality, racists that they really are...all hell breaks loose.  It is certain that some sort of derangement took place to move them from their suburban 2.5-children and white picket fence, to such unsettled disorderliness.

Nigel Farage was looked upon as a bit "out there" and outlandish and mad.
He did quite well in the election; he came second in a lot of constituents.

eddie wrote:Nigel Farage was looked upon as a bit "out there" and outlandish and mad.
He did quite well in the election; he came second in a lot of constituents.

True. But his UKIP is such a single issue platform. Where would it go if the EU disappeared tomorrow.

Trump was originally only a single issue guy: Obama was not born in the US. But now he has expanded to hatred for Hispanics, women, government, Muslims...all sorts of demagoguery.

His bro-romance with former Communist boss, Vladimir Putin, is a bit strange. It's part of the enigma that leads me to suggest that he is playing a role and may not be serious.

It's not an impossibility.

What?  I mean...what is not an impossibility?  I want to continue the conversation.

Original Quill wrote:What?

That's he's role playing and not serious.
Anything is a possibility these days.

I want to stress that I don't necessarily believe the theory that Trump is being the pettifogger here.  It's a theory.  I'm a theory-builder.

But the more that I look for things to support it, the more I find.  The biggest enticer is the fact that he is a New York urbanite.  This doesn't fit with the profile of most of his supporters in this Republican primary: that of outlander Neanderthals, from Iowa or Kansas...or god forbid, the south.  Rich?  Glitzy?  Privileged?  Good friends with Clinton?  Once in favor of abortion?  Not exactly a family man.  This guy is the antithesis of the incredible hulk, whom you'd expect to believe the things he is espousing.  

I grant you that he's going to reflect the ideology of the rich and privileged, but that is not in keeping with Republicanism.  Remember what John Stuart Mill said about stupid people and conservatives.  Republicans are fat, sweaty and prone to drooling.  Middle America Republicans believe in predestination, and the idea that while they don't have money...at least they have Sunday school!  Jeeezuz Keeerist!  That is sooo NOT Trump.

i like that; theory-builder.
I think I am too.

I take it you don't just believe what you read - and that includes both sides of a story?

eddie wrote:i like that; theory-builder.
I think I am too.

I take it you don't just believe what you read - and that includes both sides of a story?

Well, they are theory-builders, too. The difference is, I don't have to necessarily believe what I am building. I can sculpt and carve, and then stand back and look it over...make my decision later.

Original Quill wrote:

eddie wrote:i like that; theory-builder.
I think I am too.

I take it you don't just believe what you read - and that includes both sides of a story?

Well, they are theory-builders, too.  The difference is, I don't have to necessarily believe what I am building.  I can sculpt and carve, and then stand back and look it over...make my decision later.

Well that's exactly how informed opinions are made; from your own views and the reading of diferent perspectives, and that means not just accepting the first thing you read.

Original Quill wrote:

eddie wrote:Nigel Farage was looked upon as a bit "out there" and outlandish and mad.
He did quite well in the election; he came second in a lot of constituents.

True.  But his UKIP is such a single issue platform.  Where would it go if the EU disappeared tomorrow.

Trump was originally only a single issue guy: Obama was not born in the US.  But now he has expanded to hatred for Hispanics, women, government, Muslims...all sorts of demagoguery.  

His bro-romance with former Communist boss, Vladimir Putin, is a bit strange.  It's part of the enigma that leads me to suggest that he is playing a role and may not be serious.

Ukip are representing the biggest issue in politics that affects everything else... the return of control over our country to our national parliament so as to be able to restore our right to democracy and self governance and self rule!

Tommy Monk wrote:

Original Quill wrote:

True.  But his UKIP is such a single issue platform.  Where would it go if the EU disappeared tomorrow.

Trump was originally only a single issue guy: Obama was not born in the US.  But now he has expanded to hatred for Hispanics, women, government, Muslims...all sorts of demagoguery.  

His bro-romance with former Communist boss, Vladimir Putin, is a bit strange.  It's part of the enigma that leads me to suggest that he is playing a role and may not be serious.

Ukip are representing the biggest issue in politics that affects everything else... the return of control over our country to our national parliament so as to be able to restore our right to democracy and self governance and self rule!

I know what they represent. How significant it is is each person's decision.

eddie wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Huh? Are you for real?

Now I know why you posted that IRA video - and I defended you because I know at heart how you meant it - but that was rather a "Trump" moment for you - wasn't it?

Should we have said you had no right to say it and because you did, you're not a "free-thinker"?
That makes no sense.

You really need to think before replying Ben, you've created a double standard for yourself.

You'll notice I'm not running for president.

Lol cop out answer

Not a cop-out answer; I hold the president to a higher standard than I hold myself. She (or, I guess, he) is going to be the "leader of the free world." I'm a high-school sports editor.

Syl wrote:Trump is quite vile, but amazingly he has some support.

The only grace in his favour is he openly says what he would do if he ever became president. How much worse would it be if he hid his motives and managed to get in.

The problem with him saying what he'd do is that it reveals he doesn't understand what he'd be able to do. To just name the worst example, he claims that if a company insists on offshoring its jobs, he would unilaterally and selectively raise taxes on the company. The president doesn't and never has had that power -- no governmental entity can selectively tax, and it would be extravagantly illegal.

Ben_Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:

Ben_Reilly wrote:

eddie wrote:Huh? Are you for real?

Now I know why you posted that IRA video - and I defended you because I know at heart how you meant it - but that was rather a "Trump" moment for you - wasn't it?

Should we have said you had no right to say it and because you did, you're not a "free-thinker"?
That makes no sense.

You really need to think before replying Ben, you've created a double standard for yourself.

You'll notice I'm not running for president.

Lol cop out answer

Not a cop-out answer; I hold the president to a higher standard than I hold myself. She (or, I guess, he) is going to be the "leader of the free world." I'm a high-school sports editor.

Ben you've answered a question I never asked? Not sure what your answer had to do with what we were discussing but anyway....

Why would you hold the president, or that matter, anyone, in higher regard than yourself?????